Hi guys, thought I would take this in here, as it is slightly different, and didn't want it to get in the way of the main thread
Basically I have been using matrixes of 30 like this, just for quicker bets and keeps things rolling over nicely.
XXX
XXX
XXX
XXX
XXX
XXX
XXX
XXX
XXX
XXX
Whenever a vertical double appears, then next time round, you are betting for it to turn into a triple.
I have done 4 tests so far. Here are the Triple to Double ratios. All looking good so far.
session1 2 trips/2 doubles
session2 2 trips/4 doubles
session3 1 trip/ 4 doubles
session4 1 trip/ 4 doubles
Even with a very mild progression this can be used to our advantage.
I will continue on. Make your own contributions. I hope this goes some way to using this technique the best way it can be.
3 more tests.
session5 1 trip/ 5 doubles
session6 0 trips/ 5 doubles
session7 2 trips/ 5 doubles
Seems like 5 doubles every 30 spins is the averge right now!
Can we see actual results buddie?
either the numbers, or the Dozen landed?
Please.
And in the new button would be awesome!!
three more sets of 30
I will sit down and think of staking but these results continue to show the solid nature of this method of play. Only session 9 may have been a small loss, depending on how you progress it.
session8 4 trips/ 7 doubles (great result)
session9 1 trip/ 8 doubles
session10 2 trips/ 8 doubles
sure chris.
Heres that nice 4 trips/ 7 double session just so you get a picture of what i'm doing
[reveal=]
[113
311 d
321 dx2
221 d,t
332
113
133 dx2
123 tx2
123 d
321 t]
[/reveal]
I'm thinking of applying the following stake rule to this.
It seems that we get a triple hit on average at least for every 5 doubles,
So maybe implement a 5 step progression. If lost, then another 5 step progression aimed at mild recovery.
1 1 2 3 4 first step
2 3 4 5 6 second step
This is just a thought and I will go back and calculate the win/loss of each session using this progression
A quick run through of the above session, will do more later using the new prog
113
311 d
321 dx2 +2
221 d,t +3
332
113
133 dx2
123 tx2 +7
123 d
321 t] +9
Now here's the tough session -9
223
323 dx2
211 -2
123
130 d
223 -4
323 dx2
312 d -12
212 dx2 -14
132 -9
So there's a good session and a bad session and they cancel each other out. Here's an average session, which is where you will be picking up all the profits in between!
213
301
121
223 -1
131 -2
222
212
232 +2
131
122 +1
Ok maybe I'm being too cautious.
I'm going to test this using standard prog for 12 numbers
1, 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 9, 14, 21, 31, 47, 70,
Only 12 doubles without a triple will lose you 209 units.
Only testing will show how rare this is.
Playing this way, all my posted sessions would end in profit
BW
On review, you can still go into negative in sessions even using long progression because you can hit an early triple and be +2 and then encounter 3 doubles taking you into negative. Now, I will aim for +1/+2 in each session. Whenever you get to +1, you stop and start a new session.
113 213 311 313 123
100 301 332 112 112
131 121 131 232 232
223 223 112 112
131 331
222 102
212 321
232 032
222
232
+2 +2 +2 +1 +1
Few more sessions here, aiming for one win before moving on. Unit size could be as big as you want!
113
311
321
221 +1
332
113
133
123 +2
223
323
211
123
130
223
323
312
212
132 +2
122
133
230
323
312
311 +2
Nice system buffalowizard :thumbsup:
I coded it in RX, see script and some graphs attached.
first two pictures are the settings and result of the dozens-only test with max progression set at 70
third picture is the result of the test with dozens and columns together with max progression set at 105
both tests with 6000 dublinbet spins from esoito
Nice results ataru!
Maybe I should revisit this one
Thanks for your efforts
BW
Quote from: ataru on Feb 08, 04:16 PM 2011
Nice system buffalowizard :thumbsup:
I coded it in RX, see script and some graphs attached.
first two pictures are the settings and result of the dozens-only test with max progression set at 70
third picture is the result of the test with dozens and columns together with max progression set at 105
both tests with 6000 dublinbet spins from esoito
nice work .
I'm gonna carry on with this one, due to positive 6000 spins and my own tests.
Here is quite a long stream of results. Obviously you could snipe it and go for one win and leave. I'm not sure how rare 12 without a triple would be, and as to whether the 12 long progression would be wise, if not, then break it down into milder prog.
113
331
132
122
133 <win on 2nd attempt
211
311
331 <win on 2nd
231
233 <win on 1st
212 <win on 1st
233
232
111
231
302
233
233
122
121
321 <win on 7th
221 <win on 1st
332
303
233
123 <win on 2nd
110
113 <win on 1st
232
232
111
113
212 <win on 6th
More testing:
111
332
312
132 <win on 2nd
210
203
321
113
322
131
111
133 <win on 2nd
323
121
310
133
111
112 <win on 4th
223
311
333
332 <win on 2nd
213
333
112
211
222
122
223 <win on 5th
333
321
331 <win on 3rd
311 <win on 1st
233
133
233 <win on 1st, win on 1st
Not getting near 12 yet
Could 12 be the incredibly rare, possible limit to random in these set of consequences?
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 09:00 AM 2011
I'm gonna carry on with this one, due to positive 6000 spins and my own tests.
Here is quite a long stream of results. Obviously you could snipe it and go for one win and leave. I'm not sure how rare 12 without a triple would be, and as to whether the 12 long progression would be wise, if not, then break it down into milder prog.
113
331
132
122
133 <win on 2nd attempt
211
311
331 <win on 2nd
231
233 <win on 1st
212 <win on 1st
233
232
111
231
302
233
233
122
121
321 <win on 7th
221 <win on 1st
332
303
233
123 <win on 2nd
110
113 <win on 1st
232
232
111
113
212 <win on 6th
Nice work mate :thumbsup:
What progression did you use upto the win on 7th
Also what would be the overall Profit for this ^^^ Session using that said progression ?
Hi Twister,
Here's the 12 step progression
1, 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 9, 14, 21, 31, 47, 70
It's +1 on the 7th step.
Afew are +2 though, such as the 1st, 3rd and 4th steps, where you will get many hits, therefore hopefully making your profits faster and in turn, reducing the deficit of a potential loss.
Another session
[reveal=]
231
113
231
031
132
311
211
332
331
313
331
103
311
232
111
213
312
221
213
111
211
031
313
213
311
311
132
233
233
133
133
311
[/reveal]
1 win on 5th
3 wins on 3rd
2 wins on 2nd
1 win on 1st
+11
Another. Still not gone past 7th
[reveal=]
121
221
122
121
231
123
133
131
322
312
321
233
232
221
332
113
112
233
231
301
231
121
212
122
311
332
231
113
023
021
331
323
323
311
233
311
233
223
100
111
321
333
322
[/reveal]
2 wins on 2nd
2 wins on 3rd
1 win on 6th
2 wins at 7th
+9
By the way Twister, that particular session as you asked for is +13
BW
What RNG are you using mate ?
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 11:13 AM 2011
By the way Twister, that particular session as you asked for is +13
BW
Nice one, thanx :thumbsup:
I'm testing the numerous actuals I have from past visits to casino
I will carry on testing to see how rare an event this could be.
209 unit loss, but remember you are winning a lot of +2's a long the way
I'm gonna run some Numbers on BV RNG
I wont type out the numbers put I will post the longest streak in each set of 99 spins
Update later :thumbsup:
That would be great thanks mate
Good luck
Ok first 99 numbers
Column 1 hit on the 7th attempt
Column 2 hit on the 6th attempt
Column 3 hit on the 1st,2nd,2nd attempts
5 Bets in 99 Spins
Ok 2nd set of 99 numbers
Column 1 hit on the 3rd attempt
Column 2 hit on the 1st,2nd,1st attempts
Column 3 hit on the 3rd,1st,3rd attempts
7 Bets in 99 Spins
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 13, 11:39 AM 2011
Ok first 99 numbers
Column 1 hit on the 7th attempt
Column 2 hit on the 6th attempt
Column 3 hit on the 1st,2nd,2nd attempts
5 Bets in 99 Spins
Sounds about right mate, averaging around the +10 mark every 100 spins.
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 13, 11:52 AM 2011
Ok 2nd set of 99 numbers
Column 1 hit on the 3rd attempt
Column 2 hit on the 1st,2nd,1st attempts
Column 3 hit on the 3rd,1st,3rd attempts
7 Bets in 99 Spins
This is a nice session, none past the 3rd step...would have been +13
Ok 3rd set of 99 numbers
Column 1 hit on the 2nd,2nd,1st attempts
Column 2 hit on the 3rd,1st,1st attempts
Column 3 hit on the 3rd,2nd,3rd attempts
9 Bets in 99 Spins
Okk I will post some more numbers later
My eyes hurt lol !
Thanks mate
Hopefully going some way to prove this system's worth. Those last 2 sessions were beauty's.
I think you'll agree a run of 12 would not happen often
BW
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 10:54 AM 2011
Hi Twister,
Here's the 12 step progression
1, 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 9, 14, 21, 31, 47, 70
It's +1 on the 7th step.
Afew are +2 though, such as the 1st, 3rd and 4th steps, where you will get many hits, therefore hopefully making your profits faster and in turn, reducing the deficit of a potential loss.
Is this the optimum progression do you think ?
It's the standard 12 number progression, which gives you +1 or +2 on each win.
Looking back at Ataru's coded results, it looks like it does encounter a couple of losses in the 6000 spins, but makes up for those losses with the many winners.
Any fresh ideas welcome of course
BW
4 hits@1st
1@2nd
1@4th
1@8th
7 hits in 99
A.
Thanks A.
Still holding up
course we could use 11 22 33 44 etc
Or:
Wait for one or two doubles on the trot, cautious but would take us further. Miss out on wins though.
BW
99 spins random.org
4 @1
1 @2
1 @8
+11
Another 99 spins
3 @ 4
1 @ 2
1 @ 3
+9
99 spins
Triples all over the place in this one
6 @ 1st
2 @ 2nd
2 @ 4th
Just played a Real Cash Game
Started with 800 Unit Bank
Profit +41 (was my own progression LoL)
Highest level was 5
Spins 162
Bank 841
Excellent, I take it you just carry on - not 3 x 10 matrix as in first post? or are you stopping every 30 and re starting?
Regards,
Alf
Quote from: POUNDMAKER on Feb 13, 02:08 PM 2011
Excellent, I take it you just carry on - not 3 x 10 matrix as in first post? or are you stopping every 30 and re starting?
Regards,
Alf
Thats right mate, just carrying on to whenever you reach a target when you want to quit.
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 13, 02:02 PM 2011
Just played a Real Cash Game
Started with 800 Unit Bank
Profit +41 (was my own progression LoL)
Highest level was 5
Spins 162
Bank 841
Well done Twister, you're on a roll
2 questions:
What progression are you using, and are you betting on each individual column or using all three within your bets?
Thanks
BW
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 02:17 PM 2011
Well done Twister, you're on a roll
2 questions:
What progression are you using, and are you betting on each individual column or using all three within your bets?
Thanks
BW
My progression is as follows
(it wont suit all tastes, but I didnt wanna be at the final leg trying to win just 1 or 2 units)
1
2
3
6
10
15
23
35
55
85
125
190
It looks high but if ure playing penny bets thats only 1.90
Yes I play each column Vertical. Thats the Method, right ?
Woohoo! Great result Twister on real units. R u playing at BV or smartlive?
Some good systems are emerging out of this MATRIX idea...
Matrix 49, Matrix Vertical, BW's Vertical Matrix Triples not forgetting my Heaven Seven and
Flat's Matrix7x7
and all seem doing well right now :)
A.
Another 99 spin session
1 @ 1st
1 @ 3rd
1 @ 4th
1 @ 5th
1 @ 6th
+8
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 13, 02:35 PM 2011
Woohoo! Great result Twister on real units. are you playing at BV or smartlive?
Some good systems are emerging out of this MATRIX idea...
Matrix 49, Matrix Vertical, BW's Vertical Matrix Triples not forgetting my Heaven Seven and
Flat's Matrix7x7
and all seem doing well right now :)
A.
I know !
My god I havent even got to your thread yet lol :-[
Flats 7x7 is very good too, played it a bit yesterday
I only got here today lol :D
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 13, 02:33 PM 2011
My progression is as follows
(it wont suit all tastes, but I didn't wanna be at the final leg trying to win just 1 or 2 units)
1
2
3
6
10
15
23
35
55
85
125
190
It looks high but if your playing penny bets that's only 1.90
Yes I play each column Vertical. that's the Method, right ?
Yeah I play it vertical, but move across each column horizontally in search of a trigger, if you get what I mean
131
111 < So here, there's 2 triggers
321 < And a win on the 2nd
131
132
312
211
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 13, 02:35 PM 2011
Woohoo! Great result Twister on real units. are you playing at BV or smartlive?
Some good systems are emerging out of this MATRIX idea...
Matrix 49, Matrix Vertical, BW's Vertical Matrix Triples not forgetting my Heaven Seven and
Flat's Matrix7x7
and all seem doing well right now :)
A.
That's right, we're spoilt for choice at the moment, too much going on!!
Gotta admit it's exciting times though.
By the way twister, your'e right, playing 10p's would be good with your prog and build it up
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 02:40 PM 2011
Yeah I play it vertical, but move across each column horizontally in search of a trigger, if you get what I mean
131
111 < So here, there's 2 triggers
321 < And a win on the 2nd
131
132
312
211
Thanks. That is the exact same way I played in my session too.
A.
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 02:40 PM 2011
Yeah I play it vertical, but move across each column horizontally in search of a trigger, if you get what I mean
131
111 < So here, there's 2 triggers
321 < And a win on the 2nd
131
132
312
211
Ah, I dont do that.
All my Triggers are Vertical
I think this needs nailing down, otherwise results will be meaningless if we're all playing it differently :-\
Do you have seperate progression for each column too Twister or use just the one for all 3 columns?
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 13, 02:43 PM 2011
Ah, I don't do that.
All my Triggers are Vertical
I think this needs nailing down, otherwise results will be meaningless if we're all playing it differently :-\
I think you're right, twister. I am playing only Vertical also.
A.
I play it so my level 12 will always come after 12 misses Vertically
So, in theory I could have 3 level 12's at once
(bad run needed but could happen)
Am I doin it wrong ?
I feel I am :-[
BW,
Do you just ignore the 0 and not record it - or do you mark it as a result in the lines?
A.
Thats cool, I'll play your way too, so we're all singing from the same hymnbook as they say.
can you give me a little run down of numbers just so I'm sure how you playing it.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 13, 02:49 PM 2011
BW,
Do you just ignore the 0 and not record it - or do you mark it as a result in the lines?
A.
I have been marking it as a result, and a possible losing bet on some doubles.
I like your way Twister, it's quicker and more aggressive.
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 02:50 PM 2011
That's cool, I'll play your way too, so we're all singing from the same hymnbook as they say.
can you give me a little run down of numbers just so I'm sure how you playing it.
I just play for the TRIPLE to form on each vertical column DOUBLET e.g.:
123
113 - Here Col1 and Col3 have formed doubles so I will bet them to treble using prog
121 - Won 1st(col1) +2; Lost 2nd(col3) -1
A.
Just see each column as a different data stream
A B C
So spin 5 would be in Column B Spin 18 would be in Column C etc etc
Play Vertical
Are we all playing like this ?
Ok, I have been playing like Atlantis.
Twister, so here column A and B have lost but C has won. That would be the third stage of your progression right?
123
123
213
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 02:59 PM 2011
Ok, I have been playing like Atlantis.
Twister, so here column A and B have lost but C has won. That would be the third stage of your progression right?
123
123
213
Errrmm no lol
That would be Level 1 loss, Level 1 loss, Level 1 Win
Opinions !?!?
I suppose both have their merits. Your's gets to the profits faster. Do you wait until each column has a win before closing it down?
Twister,
From your example it looks like you have a separate progression for each DOZ and you are recording them independently
DOZ1 DOZ2 DOZ 3
====================
Level1 L ; Level 1 L ; Level 1 W
Is that right?
A.
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 03:05 PM 2011
I suppose both have their merits. Your's gets to the profits faster. Do you wait until each column has a win before closing it down?
I play like this, looking at just one column for ease
A
1
1
2 Loss level 1
3
3
2 Loss level 2
1
1
3 Loss level 3
3
3 Win level 4
Either close column down or continue for another attack. I think either is good.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 13, 03:08 PM 2011
Twister,
From your example it looks like you have a separate progression for each DOZ and you are recording them independently
DOZ1 DOZ2 DOZ 3
====================
Level1 L ; Level 1 L ; Level 1 W
Is that right?
A.
No, not each Doz but each Column
I like Twisters way actually, because it may just reduce the longer runs, that you find when hunting horizontally as it were.
So, 3 seperate progressions then
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 13, 03:09 PM 2011
I play like this, looking at just one column for ease
A
1
1
2 Loss level 1
3
3
2 Loss level 2
1
1
3 Loss level 3
3
3 Win level 4
Either close column down or continue for another attack. I think either is good.
Personally wouldn't play it that way as you are betting the layout and not the matrix.
A.
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 03:11 PM 2011
I like Twisters way actually, because it may just reduce the longer runs, that you find when hunting horizontally as it were.
So, 3 separate progressions then
Thats how I play it, but only because I thought that was the correct way :D
So far so good !
Just quickie run
ABC
113
311
321
221
332
113
133
123
223
323
211
123
130
223
323
312
212
132
122
133
230
323
312
311
A wins 1@1 1@2 1@3
B wins 1@3
C wins 2@1 1@2
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 13, 03:12 PM 2011
Personally wouldn't play it that way as you are betting the layout and not the matrix.
A.
I dont understand :-\
The layout is in the Matrix
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 03:14 PM 2011
Just quickie run
ABC
113
311
321
221
332
113
133
123
223
323
211
123
130
223
323
312
212
132
122
133
230
323
312
311
A wins 1@1 1@2 1@3
B wins 1@3
C wins 2@1 1@2
Confirmed. Same result.
A.
To be honest, the results probably will be the same in the long run either way...I reckon we got another winner on our hands.
Great! So we all know how it works now and can play it the same way too?
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 03:21 PM 2011
Great! So we all know how it works now and can play it the same way too?
Yep, looks good mate :thumbsup:
Cool. The more I think of it, the more I think it is unlikely you will see a run of 12 consecutive doubles in a single column.
I will test this tonight and tomorrow and report back
99 spins
A - 3@1 1@2
B - 1@1 1@2 1@3
C - 1@7 1@1
+30
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 03:31 PM 2011
Cool. The more I think of it, the more I think it is unlikely you will see a run of 12 consecutive doubles in a single column.
I will test this tonight and tomorrow and report back
Yep agreed !
And you do have Vertical in the Subject Header ;)
Real Cash Game No2
Starting Bank 841
Profit +39
Highest level was 6
Spins 135
Bank 880
Total Profit +80
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 13, 04:02 PM 2011
Real Cash Game No2
Starting Bank 841
Profit +39
Highest level was 6
Spins 135
Bank 880
Total Profit +80
For short haired plebs like me, can U give us all, a brief explanation of what game U are playing now, how Ur betting and what tracking Ur doing? Please?
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 13, 04:33 PM 2011
For short haired plebs like me, can you give us all, a brief explanation of what game you are playing now, how your betting and what tracking your doing? Please?
Hi Chris
Here we go:
Note down dozens as in 7xmatrix but this time only 3xmatrix for example
123
321
123 etc
We are betting each column individually. We call them A B and C
ABC
123
321
123
Like so.
Now we bet a double to become a triple
A
1
1 Column A has a double, so next time it comes round to column A, we will bet dozen 1
2 Loss, carry on tracking
3
3 Another double...bet dozen 3 next
3 Win
Repeat this for each column. Each column has it's own progression
Let me know if any queries
@ BW. Thanks for that.
Real easy to understand that one.
Cheers!
:twisted:
99 spins
A 2@1 1@3
B 2@1
C 3@1 1@2
Easy session there
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 03:31 PM 2011
Cool. The more I think of it, the more I think it is unlikely you will see a run of 12 consecutive doubles in a single column.
I will test this tonight and tomorrow and report back
BW,
You guys are right to test, test, test. I just checked some column historical live spins and only had one 12 loss without a repeat in 1500 spins. That's just betting for a dozen to repeat so you may be right, playing for a dozen to repeat a 3rd time may not happen very often, but on the other hand it could happen more often because it's all alone. In my test, if any dozen repeated, that ended the losing streak. The way you're playing it, it has to be the same dozen.
This may not really represent the way you're playing it, but it does show that you can get a lot of wins with just straight up playing for repeats and we know that that's a losing bet in the long run with a martingale.
G
Hi B.W
I had this today
113
333
231
022
021
212
<---------Here I ignore the zeros and bet the 2 to become a treble
This ok?
Quote from: ZigZag on Feb 13, 08:56 PM 2011
Hi B.W
I had this today
113
333
231
022
021
212
<---------Here I ignore the zeros and bet the 2 to become a treble
This ok?
I wouldn't, in your example
For
me a Zero voids all previous results and you start over in that column for Triggers
If your in play then it counts as a loss
BW may have a different take on it :)
On reflection I think Atlantis is correct
I just played a Session where the progression goes from column to column
I ***think*** I prefer that way
Will play some more Sessions that way and get a feel for it ;D
Real Cash Game No3
Starting Bank 841
Profit +30
Highest level was 3
Spins 90
Bank 910
Total Profit +110
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 09:06 AM 2011
Could 12 be the incredibly rare, possible limit to random in these set of consequences?
These 12 will come I assure you,as it was tested couple years
ago on old VLS/secret section/from 3 to 10 vertical,in all sort of combinations,and the 7th.
showed best results....why nobody had an unswer.mY 2 cents is to bet flat bet in triples,
either lose 3 or 1 or win same......if lose rise your flat from 1 to 2....if lose again rise to 3,
and so on,same reducing on the win.Re check your post numbers and you will see results.
Real Cash Game No4
Starting Bank 910
Profit +23
Highest level was 6
Spins 93
Bank 933
Total Profit +133
Nice results Paul. ;D
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 14, 06:53 AM 2011
Nice results Paul. ;D
Cheers Mate 8)
So far, so good !
Real Cash Game No5
Starting Bank 933
Profit +28
Highest level was 7
Spins 110
Bank 961
Total Profit +161
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 02:48 AM 2011
On reflection I think Atlantis is correct
I just played a Session where the progression goes from column to column
I ***think*** I prefer that way
EDIT: I ****Do**** prefer that way
Will play some more Sessions that way and get a feel for it ;D
BW can we amend the rules slightly ?
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 07:13 AM 2011
Cheers Mate 8)
So far, so good !
This all at BV?
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 14, 07:24 AM 2011
This all at BV?
Yes, some. And Smartlive Casino too
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 07:25 AM 2011
Yes, some. And Smartlive Casino too
Works at both?
U think ready for a bot now on this one?
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 14, 07:26 AM 2011
Works at both?
U think ready for a bot now on this one?
Once we have the final rules nailed then I would say yes, give it a try.
I think BV NZ is best. Its faster ;D
[attachthumb=#]
Nice Results Marivo !
RNG or Real Wheel ?
BV european
Real Cash Game No6
Starting Bank 961
Profit +41
Highest level was 5
Spins 151
Bank 1002
Total Profit +202
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 12:57 AM 2011
I wouldn't, in your example
For me a Zero voids all previous results and you start over in that column for Triggers
If your in play then it counts as a loss
BW may have a different take on it :)
Thanks Twister.
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 07:20 AM 2011
BW can we amend the rules slightly ?
Are we playing a different way now?
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 10:30 AM 2011
I play that way now, like this
123
333
333 Triggers
111 loss level 1 and level 2 and level 3
122 Trigger
1 Win level 4
Thats how i been playing.
At first i was waiting for 2 virtual losses before starting the progression as only had a bankroll for 10 stages, but have got a full 12 stage bank now :thumbsup:
Quote from: ZigZag on Feb 14, 10:44 AM 2011
that's how I been playing.
At first I was waiting for 2 virtual losses before starting the progression as only had a bankroll for 10 stages, but have got a full 12 stage bank now :thumbsup:
Nice one :thumbsup:
Real Cash Game No7 (Increased Stake)
Starting Bank 1002
Profit +50
Highest level was 5
Spins 106
Bank 1052
Total Profit +252
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 10:30 AM 2011
I was playing all my Progression in one Column, IE having a progression for each column
I've since seen the light of day, and agree with Atlantis.
I play that way now, like this
123
333
333 Triggers
111 loss level 1 and level 2 and level 3
122 Trigger
1 Win level 4
Hi Twister,
I play that way too except in your example I do not get a loss in column 3 on the 4th line because I would have already won on the previous line when the double 3's turned into a triple. I would not play an existing vertical triple to turn into a quad so I would wait for a new number to break in column 3 first before searching for a new qualifier in that column...
So my take on the chart is:
123
333
333 Win level 1 (col3)
111 loss level 1 (col1) and level 2 (col2)
122 Trigger
1 Win level 3 (col1)
Thanks,
A.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 14, 12:01 PM 2011
Hi Twister,
I play that way too except in your example I do not get a loss in column 3 on the 4th line because I would have already won on the previous line when the double 3's turned into a triple. I would not play an existing vertical triple to turn into a quad so I would wait for a new number to break in column 3 first before searching for a new qualifier in that column...
So my take on the chart is:
123
333
333 Win level 1 (col3)
111 loss level 1 (col1) and level 2 (col2)
122 Trigger
1 Win level 3 (col1)
Thanks,
A.
Urrrrrggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhh !
I can always count on you to point out my errors lol :D
I can hardly see lol Ive been lookin at my screen so much !
I will re do it :o
This is what I meant !!
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 10:30 AM 2011
Not sure.
I was playing all my Progression in one Column, IE having a progression for each column
I've since seen the light of day, and agree with Atlantis.
I play that way now, like this
121
333
333 Triggers
111 loss level 1 and level 2 and level 3
122 Trigger
1 Win level 4
Sorted, sorry about that :thumbsup:
Are we all on the same page now ?
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 12:03 PM 2011
I can hardly see LoL I've been looking at my screen so much !
Same here. I've started using the eyedrops again!
Since my "Heaven 7" system idea has come crashing down I'm going to spend more time with the Vertical MATRIX family :)
Liking your real money results!
A.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 14, 12:11 PM 2011
Same here. I've started using the eyedrops again!
Since my "Heaven 7" system idea has come crashing down I'm going to spend more time with the Vertical MATRIX family :)
Liking your real money results!
A.
Yeah I just read ure post over there. I never got time to get there I was so distracted with these others. Sorry it didnt work out for you. But there is plenty to smile about over here !
It works really well on BV NZ RNG
Fast too ;D
Look forward to reading your test results mate :thumbsup:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 12:14 PM 2011
Yeah....................
........
It works really well on BV NZ RNG
Hi Paul.
Do U have a link for BV NZ please?
Real Cash Game No8
Starting Bank 1052
Profit +42
Highest level was 7
Spins 124
Bank 1094
Total Profit +294
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 14, 12:51 PM 2011
Hi Paul.
Do you have a link for BV NZ please?
Its on the Front Page mate :thumbsup:
link:s://:.betvoyager.com (link:s://:.betvoyager.com)
@BW
When you check out the latest and we finalise the rules I can move this baby to Full Systems if ure ready ;D
Hi guys, been at work today, but managed to crunch many numbers on random.org
I know it has no zero, but then neither does BV, and I think that is what gives us a winning system here.
I have based these findings on Twisters way of using 3 individual progressions on each column.
In total, 12,276 spins/numbers
What I did here is I stopped after a loss on the 7th, using the progression 1,1,2,3,4,6,9. If lost, then a 26 unit loss, but this was reduced by other columns winning at the same time. Only bigger losses were if 2 or even 3 columns lost. A 3 loss only happened once.
Findings were interesting
+717
I got 5 runs of 10
3 runs of 11
And only 1 run of 13+ (I didnt find out when it ended as I had come to the end of the number list)
Would be interested to see what you guys think. Even with the one 12+ loss, it would be well over +500 in profit. I was looking at a cheaper more economical way to bet with larger units.
BW
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 01:57 PM 2011
Hi guys, been at work today, but managed to crunch many numbers on random.org
I know it has no zero, but then neither does BV, and I think that is what gives us a winning system here.
I have based these findings on Twisters way of using 3 individual progressions on each column.
In total, 12,276 spins/numbers
What I did here is I stopped after a loss on the 7th, using the progression 1,1,2,3,4,6,9. If lost, then a 26 unit loss, but this was reduced by other columns winning at the same time. Only bigger losses were if 2 or even 3 columns lost. A 3 loss only happened once.
Findings were interesting
+717
I got 5 runs of 10
3 runs of 11
And only 1 run of 13+ (I didn't find out when it ended as I had come to the end of the number list)
Would be interested to see what you guys think. Even with the one 12+ loss, it would be well over +500 in profit. I was looking at a cheaper more economical way to bet with larger units.
BW
Thats very interesting mate
Would loved to of known where that +13 ended !!!
Looks really good :thumbsup:
I must say I havent been playing that way though ;D
I know it puts a new spin on everything, which makes it tough for concrete rules.
To be honest in over 12,000 numbers, I only came across a 12+ once (without zero), so maybe carry on playing the original way.
I was testing having each column seperate, do you still play this way Twister?
BW
I suppose the best way to test this (even though I have done quite a few thousand myself) is to code in the two or three variants we have here, and find which one the most profitable.
It's down to how you prefer to play. If you only want to risk a small loss then play the stop at 7 rule. If you dont mind carrying on to more dizzy heights and rake in more winners then play the longer progression run.
To be honest,, either way wins healthily that's for sure. Hope we can get more testers on board
BW
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 02:22 PM 2011
I know it puts a new spin on everything, which makes it tough for concrete rules.
To be honest in over 12,000 numbers, I only came across a 12+ once (without zero), so maybe carry on playing the original way.
I was testing having each column separate, do you still play this way Twister?
BW
I play with the progression going from one column to another NOT 3 separate progressions for each column
All Triggers are Vertical
I play on BV NZ RNG with a 12 step progression ;D
Current Profit is +294 Units
Ok, that's the way I started playing this from the very beginning so we'll go with it. Can we get this moved to the systems section where it may get larger audience? i think the name Vertical matrix triples is rather cumbersome. How about Matrix Turbo? With Twisters turbo injected progression?!
Cheers
Buffalo
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 02:36 PM 2011
Ok, that's the way I started playing this from the very beginning so we'll go with it. Can we get this moved to the systems section where it may get larger audience? I think the name Vertical matrix triples is rather cumbersome. How about Matrix Turbo? With Twisters turbo injected progression?!
Cheers
Buffalo
Name change and move to Full Systems :thumbsup:
Quote from: F_LAT_INO on Feb 14, 04:21 AM 2011
These 12 will come I assure you,as it was tested couple years
ago on old VLS/secret section/from 3 to 10 vertical,in all sort of combinations,and the 7th.
showed best results....why nobody had an answer.mY 2 cents is to bet flat bet in triples,
either lose 3 or 1 or win same......if lose rise your flat from 1 to 2....if lose again rise to 3,
and so on,same reducing on the win.Re check your post numbers and you will see results.
I'm interested to know if F lat was playing/testing this exactly as we are, way back then. If he was, for how long and if it didn't hold up, then maybe we should rethink?
Hope he can answer us
Like this:
ABC
123
213 <here a double, bet for it to become a triple
112 <loss, but another double formed in column B, bet for it to become triple
312 <win in column B, plus another double formed in column C etc
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 02:44 PM 2011
Like this:
ABC
123
213 <here a double, bet for it to become a triple
112 <loss, but another double formed in column B, bet for it to become triple
312 <win in column B, plus another double formed in column C etc
Yep, just like that mate ;D
How much would a loss be using your progression Twister? You must have almost covered 1 loss so far?
.................and just how do U progress the loss stages? ???
I need know exactly, just in case a bot comes out of this, or even a Tracker of some description.
The coder(s) need exact rules please lads!! :thumbsup:
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 02:40 PM 2011
I'm interested to know if F lat was playing/testing this exactly as we are, way back then. If he was, for how long and if it didn't hold up, then maybe we should rethink?
Hope he can answer us
Buf. T o be quite honest can't remember now,but know we were working on it for quite long,then somebody comes with a new idea/same as here/then the previous ideas goes forgoten.I also think testing something on 1000000 spins is ridiculous.No logic in that my friend,any B&M player will tell you same.If the method wins in regular night session,6 out of 10 it is a winner.
Quote from: F_LAT_INO on Feb 14, 02:53 PM 2011
Buf. T o be quite honest can't remember now,but know we were working on it for quite long,then somebody comes with a new idea/same as here/then the previous ideas goes forgoten.I also think testing something on 1000000 spins is ridiculous.No logic in that my friend,any B&M player will tell you same.If the method wins in regular night session,6 out of 10 it is a winner.
Thanks F lat, it gives me more confidence we are on the right path here. I know how it is when lots of ideas float around and some can get lost in the clouds. Hopefully we can keep tight grip on this.
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 14, 02:50 PM 2011
.................and just how do you progress the loss stages? ???
I need know exactly, just in case a bot comes out of this, or even a Tracker of some description.
The coder(s) need exact rules please lads!! :thumbsup:
Chris, on a loss, you just wait for another double to form and then bet that that will turn into a triple. If that loses, then you move up the progression and track for another double and bet for that to become a triple etc
ABC
123
132 <double formed, bet on trip to form under it
132 <win. Bet next under column's B and C
111 <loss, loss. So now we're on 3rd leg of progression and wait for another double
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 02:48 PM 2011
How much would a loss be using your progression Twister? You must have almost covered 1 loss so far?
Here is the progression I use
(thanx Kattila for your help!)2u wins 4u
3u wins 4u
6u wins 7u
9u wins 7u
14u wins 8u
21u wins 8u
32u wins 9u
50u wins 13u
80u wins 23u
120u wins 23u
185u wins 33u
285u wins 48u
That may look high towards the end but if ure betting penny/cent bets the last leg is 2.85
It wont suit all tastes ;)
How would you bet a continuing repeat, example
B | B | C
C | C | C <-----3rd column formed, bet for a repeat
B | A | C <------repeat, win, is now a trigger in effect again
B | C | C <------repeat again
I think single dozens are a much better bet than 2 dozens, chrisbs has asked me to look into this thread, that's my first question, there may be more
Quote from: superman on Feb 14, 03:09 PM 2011
How would you bet a continuing repeat, example
B | B | C
C | C | C <-----3rd column formed, bet for a repeat
B | A | C <------repeat, win, is now a trigger in effect again
B | C | C <------repeat again
I think single dozens are a much better bet than 2 dozens, chrisbs has asked me to look into this thread, that's my forst question, there may be more
Hi superman, yes I prefer the single dozen bet also, and for one to very rarely pass 12 is exciting news. The vast majority of wins come before 7. In your example, I leave it until A or B break the sequence and another 'pure' double comes along
Example:
C
C <bet for triple
C <win
C <no bet
B
A
A <bet again here
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 03:11 PM 2011
Hi superman, yes I prefer the single dozen bet also, and for one to very rarely pass 12 is exciting news. The vast majority of wins come before 7. In your example, I leave it until A or B break the sequence and another 'pure' double comes along
Hey Buff,
I know that you know this, I just want to remind us that when we're betting a martingale of 12 steps on the single dozens or columns we get over 80% maybe 90% of our wins within the first 7 steps. The killer is how often do we get that 13th step that wipes out a ton of wins. Sounds like so far this one stays ahead of the 13th step enough to make it a worthy system to continue to pursue.
Good one, :thumbsup:
George
what are the 12 steps of progression, TwisterUK how are you using the progression
2u wins 4u
3u wins 4u
6u wins 7u
9u wins 7u
14u wins 8u
21u wins 8u
32u wins 9u
50u wins 13u
80u wins 23u
120u wins 23u
185u wins 33u
285u wins 48u
Thanks
Quote from: superman on Feb 14, 03:27 PM 2011
What are the 12 steps of progression, TwisterUK how are you using the progression
2u wins 4u
3u wins 4u
6u wins 7u
9u wins 7u
14u wins 8u
21u wins 8u
32u wins 9u
50u wins 13u
80u wins 23u
120u wins 23u
185u wins 33u
285u wins 48u
Thanks
On a loss move up one step
On a win back to step one
Look forward to any tests you do mate :thumbsup:
Ok its setup to bet anything that has the same below it currently, I know you said you skip if you lose and the run continues but I like to test without any limitations, if its a match
a
a
I bet it, if continued I would bet it again, thats how its setup at the moment, you might like the results so far using Twisters provided progression, I will give it a longer test tomorrow before adding the break clauses etc, would like to see it break first at standard
[reveal]W Cash 4 Peak 0 Prog 2
L Cash 2 Peak 4 Prog 2
L Cash -1 Peak 4 Prog 3
W Cash 11 Peak 4 Prog 6
W Cash 15 Peak 11 Prog 2
L Cash 13 Peak 15 Prog 2
L Cash 10 Peak 15 Prog 3
W Cash 22 Peak 15 Prog 6
L Cash 20 Peak 22 Prog 2
W Cash 26 Peak 22 Prog 3
L Cash 24 Peak 26 Prog 2
L Cash 21 Peak 26 Prog 3
W Cash 33 Peak 26 Prog 6
W Cash 37 Peak 33 Prog 2
W Cash 41 Peak 37 Prog 2
L Cash 39 Peak 41 Prog 2
L Cash 36 Peak 41 Prog 3
L Cash 30 Peak 41 Prog 6
L Cash 21 Peak 41 Prog 9
W Cash 49 Peak 41 Prog 14
L Cash 47 Peak 49 Prog 2
L Cash 44 Peak 49 Prog 3
L Cash 38 Peak 49 Prog 6
W Cash 56 Peak 49 Prog 9
W Cash 60 Peak 56 Prog 2
L Cash 58 Peak 60 Prog 2
L Cash 55 Peak 60 Prog 3
L Cash 49 Peak 60 Prog 6
L Cash 40 Peak 60 Prog 9
W Cash 68 Peak 60 Prog 14
L Cash 66 Peak 68 Prog 2
L Cash 63 Peak 68 Prog 3
W Cash 75 Peak 68 Prog 6
W Cash 79 Peak 75 Prog 2
L Cash 77 Peak 79 Prog 2
L Cash 74 Peak 79 Prog 3
L Cash 68 Peak 79 Prog 6
L Cash 59 Peak 79 Prog 9
L Cash 45 Peak 79 Prog 14
L Cash 24 Peak 79 Prog 21
L Cash -8 Peak 79 Prog 32
L Cash -58 Peak 79 Prog 50
L Cash -138 Peak 79 Prog 80
L Cash -258 Peak 79 Prog 120
W Cash 112 Peak 79 Prog 185
W Cash 116 Peak 112 Prog 2
L Cash 114 Peak 116 Prog 2
W Cash 120 Peak 116 Prog 3
L Cash 118 Peak 120 Prog 2
L Cash 115 Peak 120 Prog 3
L Cash 109 Peak 120 Prog 6
W Cash 127 Peak 120 Prog 9
L Cash 125 Peak 127 Prog 2
W Cash 131 Peak 127 Prog 3
W Cash 135 Peak 131 Prog 2
L Cash 133 Peak 135 Prog 2
W Cash 139 Peak 135 Prog 3
L Cash 137 Peak 139 Prog 2
L Cash 134 Peak 139 Prog 3
L Cash 128 Peak 139 Prog 6
W Cash 146 Peak 139 Prog 9
L Cash 144 Peak 146 Prog 2
L Cash 141 Peak 146 Prog 3
L Cash 135 Peak 146 Prog 6
L Cash 126 Peak 146 Prog 9
L Cash 112 Peak 146 Prog 14
L Cash 91 Peak 146 Prog 21
W Cash 155 Peak 146 Prog 32
L Cash 153 Peak 155 Prog 2
L Cash 150 Peak 155 Prog 3
W Cash 162 Peak 155 Prog 6
W Cash 166 Peak 162 Prog 2
L Cash 164 Peak 166 Prog 2
W Cash 170 Peak 166 Prog 3
L Cash 168 Peak 170 Prog 2
L Cash 165 Peak 170 Prog 3
W Cash 177 Peak 170 Prog 6
W Cash 181 Peak 177 Prog 2
L Cash 179 Peak 181 Prog 2
W Cash 185 Peak 181 Prog 3
L Cash 183 Peak 185 Prog 2
W Cash 189 Peak 185 Prog 3
L Cash 187 Peak 189 Prog 2
W Cash 193 Peak 189 Prog 3
L Cash 191 Peak 193 Prog 2
L Cash 188 Peak 193 Prog 3
W Cash 200 Peak 193 Prog 6
L Cash 198 Peak 200 Prog 2
L Cash 195 Peak 200 Prog 3
W Cash 207 Peak 200 Prog 6
W Cash 211 Peak 207 Prog 2
L Cash 209 Peak 211 Prog 2
L Cash 206 Peak 211 Prog 3
W Cash 218 Peak 211 Prog 6
L Cash 216 Peak 218 Prog 2
W Cash 222 Peak 218 Prog 3
L Cash 220 Peak 222 Prog 2
L Cash 217 Peak 222 Prog 3
L Cash 211 Peak 222 Prog 6
L Cash 202 Peak 222 Prog 9
L Cash 188 Peak 222 Prog 14
L Cash 167 Peak 222 Prog 21
W Cash 231 Peak 222 Prog 32
W Cash 235 Peak 231 Prog 2
W Cash 239 Peak 235 Prog 2
W Cash 243 Peak 239 Prog 2
L Cash 241 Peak 243 Prog 2
L Cash 238 Peak 243 Prog 3
W Cash 250 Peak 243 Prog 6
W Cash 254 Peak 250 Prog 2
W Cash 258 Peak 254 Prog 2
W Cash 262 Peak 258 Prog 2
W Cash 266 Peak 262 Prog 2
W Cash 270 Peak 266 Prog 2
L Cash 268 Peak 270 Prog 2
L Cash 265 Peak 270 Prog 3
W Cash 277 Peak 270 Prog 6
W Cash 281 Peak 277 Prog 2
L Cash 279 Peak 281 Prog 2
L Cash 276 Peak 281 Prog 3
L Cash 270 Peak 281 Prog 6
W Cash 288 Peak 281 Prog 9
L Cash 286 Peak 288 Prog 2
W Cash 292 Peak 288 Prog 3
L Cash 290 Peak 292 Prog 2
W Cash 296 Peak 292 Prog 3
L Cash 294 Peak 296 Prog 2
L Cash 291 Peak 296 Prog 3
L Cash 285 Peak 296 Prog 6
L Cash 276 Peak 296 Prog 9
W Cash 304 Peak 296 Prog 14
L Cash 302 Peak 304 Prog 2
W Cash 308 Peak 304 Prog 3
L Cash 306 Peak 308 Prog 2
L Cash 303 Peak 308 Prog 3
L Cash 297 Peak 308 Prog 6
W Cash 315 Peak 308 Prog 9
L Cash 313 Peak 315 Prog 2
L Cash 310 Peak 315 Prog 3
W Cash 322 Peak 315 Prog 6
L Cash 320 Peak 322 Prog 2
L Cash 317 Peak 322 Prog 3
L Cash 311 Peak 322 Prog 6
W Cash 329 Peak 322 Prog 9
L Cash 327 Peak 329 Prog 2
W Cash 333 Peak 329 Prog 3
L Cash 331 Peak 333 Prog 2
L Cash 328 Peak 333 Prog 3
L Cash 322 Peak 333 Prog 6
L Cash 313 Peak 333 Prog 9
W Cash 341 Peak 333 Prog 14
L Cash 339 Peak 341 Prog 2
W Cash 345 Peak 341 Prog 3[/reveal]
Woah !
Sorry to be a Party Pooper but I just hit a level 13 :-\
It was only because I had a big enough bank that I played it. However that would of been my final bet
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 04:09 PM 2011
Woah !
Sorry to be a Party Pooper but I just hit a level 13 :-\
It was only because I had a big enough bank that I played it. However that would of been my final bet
Are you still in profit twister?
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 04:11 PM 2011
Are you still in profit twister?
Yes, but I took a hit !
Profit is now +130u
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 04:13 PM 2011
Yes, but I took a hit !
Profit is now +130u
Still healthy profit mate, if we took a hit on average every time being left over with 130 units, we're laughing
Superman,
Thanks for joining in with this, shows how quick a large profit can be made, it can quickly crash of course, but it's what's left over that counts
How about having 3 VL's :wink:
Seriously, 15 levels ;D
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 04:26 PM 2011
How about having 3 VL's :wink:
Seriously, 15 levels ;D
It's something I've considered, but then you miss out on so many winners on 1st 2nd and 3rd levels. So you're taking longer to win and longer to lose, but when that freak 15+ hits, you'll be the same down as if you weren't waiting for virtuals.
Just my take.
I think we should seriously consider stopping after 7 also. My tests show big profits even when stopping at that margin.
Also, it means we can play at larger unit size giving the smaller progression.
Imagine Twister if you had stopped at that point, how much you'd still be in profit. How many 8's 9's 10's etc have you encountered
BW
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 04:30 PM 2011
It's something I've considered, but then you miss out on so many winners on 1st 2nd and 3rd levels. So you're taking longer to win and longer to lose, but when that freak 15+ hits, you'll be the same down as if you weren't waiting for virtuals.
Just my take.
Well Im open to ideas !
Ive gotta go, got a 3hr train ride at 6am 2moz ::)
Laters ;D
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 04:31 PM 2011
I think we should seriously consider stopping after 7 also. My tests show big profits even when stopping at that margin.
Also, it means we can play at larger unit size giving the smaller progression.
Imagine Twister if you had stopped at that point, how much you'd still be in profit. How many 8's 9's 10's etc have you encountered
BW
Before that, just one level 7
So maybe stop at 7 and up our stakes in the earlier stages ?
Yeah, maybe. I will crunch some numbers on me laptop 2moz morning :thumbsup:
Well I was up 700+ and that was using the standard progression. Hopefully we can get it coded this way as well.
Virtual's are the "Fools Gold" of Roulette.
That "Virtual World", doesn't protect as U think Paul,
only delay the inevitable outcome, to the progression Wasp, and with a mighty STING in its tail.
What U could do, is delay/defer the bet, till future time.
Who's to say U don't switch to playing the columns with the same gusto, and let the columns pick up the slack
(when conditions are favourable), say after a level 7 hit on the Dozens
Then come back to the Dozen for a level 8 hit, once the Column has exhausted bet opportunities.
So in others words, Not a "Virtual" bet as U would normally use the term, but a "Deferred" bet.
Hopefully, if things line up sweet,
the column would actually cancel out the (Debt on-)dozen requirement altogether-
Superman has used this before, tho not like the 3 vertical Matrix I don't think!
Seeing how well this is performing with manual testing i am willing to make soft for that.
To not make X versions of tracker i want to make it fully configurable so here are few questions.
Is there anything else that you guys want to be able to adjust beside:
- progression levels/length
- progression type (one for all/seperate for each column)
Is progression: RESET on win/+1 step on lose?
Is this constant? Do you want to be able to change it?
If yes then what other options you would like to have? (-1/-2/reset on win etc)
If progression will reach end point should it go back to step 1 or should it stay at max step until hit?
Do you want to be able to adujst matrix width (columns count).
What stats are you interested in summary?
Is there any other mods i am not aware of?
For me (and Probably, me alone I fear!!):-
It has to work simultaneous/switchable, on Columns as well as the Dozens.
Maybe a Flip-Flop/menu switch for user to choose, say:-
Mode 1- Dozens.
Mode 2- Columns.
Mode 3- Dozen & Column (Flip-Flop altn)
Mode 4- Dozen & Column simultaneous
Mode 5- Random Doz/Col.
(But u know how complex I am, so let the other decide by majority)
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 14, 04:46 PM 2011
Virtual's are the "Fools Gold" of Roulette.
That "Virtual World", doesn't protect as you think Paul,
only delay the inevitable outcome, to the progression Wasp, and with a mighty STING in its tail.
What you could do, is delay/defer the bet, till future time.
Who's to say you don't switch to playing the columns with the same gusto, and let the columns pick up the slack
(when conditions are favourable), say after a level 7 hit on the Dozens
Then come back to the Dozen for a level 8 hit, once the Column has exhausted bet opportunities.
So in others words, Not a "Virtual" bet as you would normally use the term, but a "Deferred" bet.
Hopefully, if things line up sweet,
the column would actually cancel out the (Debt on-)dozen requirement altogether-
Superman has used this before, tho not like the 3 vertical Matrix I don't think!
I like your thinking Chris. So after a 7 loss on dozens, move to columns untila win and then revert back to dozens?
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 14, 04:55 PM 2011
For me (and Probably, me alone I fear!!):-
It has to work simultaneous/switchable, on Columns as well as the Dozens.
Maybe a Flip-Flop switch for user to choose, say:-
Mode 1- Dozens.
Mode 2- Columns.
Mode 3- Dozen & Column (Flip-Flop altn)
Mode 4- Dozen & Column simultaneous
Mode 5- Random Doz/Col.
(But you know how complex I am, so let the other decide by majority)
I'm in agreement with this, let's really put it through its paces. If you could have one that stops after progression of 12 and another after 7 and resets on the loss?
Thanks Ophis
@BW
Or even better.
Superman, has a code that watches the net gain, bit like this I guess:-
>If CashTotal is >=+1ColumnCash than CashTotal previous, then reset Dozen bet.
So in other words,
If the bet on the Columns produces a net increase in the CashTotal (for the whole game) then the Dozen bet is reset to level 1.
Simple (tho I have difficulty describing it!!! LoL) :-[
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 14, 05:02 PM 2011
@BW
Or even better.
Superman, has a code that watches the net gain, bit like this I guess:-
>If CashTotal is >=+1ColumnCash than CashTotal previous, then reset Dozen bet.
So in other words,
If the bet on the Columns produces a net increase in the CashTotal (for the whole game) then the Dozen bet is reset to level 1.
Simple (tho I have difficulty describing it!!! LoL) :-[
Sounds good mate, I'll take your word for it!
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 04:09 PM 2011
Woah !
Sorry to be a Party Pooper but I just hit a level 13 :-\
It was only because I had a big enough bank that I played it. However that would of been my final bet
you will soon hit some more Twisty mate.
Quote from: F_LAT_INO on Feb 14, 05:21 PM 2011
you will soon hit some more Twisty mate.
Which is why we will be testing/coding many variants specifically the 7 stop and switch to column rules.
It is a coincidence how my personal tests showed the stop at 7 to be best way
Reverse what you doing and you've got the ULTIMATE LIVE WHEEL MATRIX ;D
U know, for about 43-44 years, number 7 has been my favourite number- ever.
Now I am beginning to see Y?
(Least we forget F LAT INO's 7 x 7 Topic at our peril eh Buff?)
Must be something in the number 7.
Bayes!!!!!!!(Please Shout when U read this word)(It has more effect in the forum)
@ Fender JohnLegend
U mean 7 numbers wide, stop at level 3 John?
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 14, 05:30 PM 2011
U know, for about 43-44 years, number 7 has been my favourite number- ever.
Now I am beginning to see Y?
(Least we forget F LAT INO's 7 x 7 Topic at our peril eh Buff?)
Must be something in the number 7.
Bayes!!!!!!!(Please Shout when you read this word)(It has more effect in the forum)
Yes I think 7 seems to be woven all over these matrix threads. In Turbo, the matrix tries very hard to hit before 7, which is why I did all my testing today
Quote from: Johnlegend on Feb 14, 05:28 PM 2011
Reverse what you doing and you've got the ULTIMATE LIVE WHEEL MATRIX ;D
Hi John, may you elaborate a little?
Thought I would post these, cause I was bloody excited today testing them! Here are the results of every session (no zero) I tested today. Each one accounts for 198 spins, totalling 12,276
I stopped after 7 loss in progression and started again after new trigger arrived. Average win was around the +25 mark. Even when I confronted a single 7 loss, the wins usually made this only a small loss over the 198 cycle. The larger losses are where two or even rarer, three 7+ hit.
Progression used was 1,1,2,3,4,6,9
Hopefully with a tweak or two, or none needed who knows, we can use this somehow.
Cheers
[reveal=]
+24
-9
+31
+31
+16
+28
+24
+10
+19
+25
+17
+22
+22
+31
+27
-11
+36
+14
+30
-36
-31
-37
+34
+26
-30
+26
+28
+27
+31
-21
+22
+23
+21
-69
+21
+23
-60
+21
+21
+26
+30
+30
+28
-10
+25
+25
-6
+25
-9
-1
+8
+18
+27
+34
-11
+31
-5
-2
-4
-10
+21
+20
[/reveal]
How about waiting for a virtual loss to occur before EACH BET MADE?
123
123 - no bet; no bet; no bet
231 - VirtL; L (level1); VirtL
332 - no bet; no bet; no bet
132 - no bet; W (level2); no bet
312 - no bet; VirtL; W(level1)
A.
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 05:35 PM 2011
Hi John, may you elaborate a little?
Okay Matrix vertical is RNG proof but not really practical on a live wheel. Betting against doubles becoming trebles is the anwser. On a live wheel you seldom do worse than 50/50 in. A matrix 49. And tonight while playing my original MATRIX Check this out.
2232123
3311331--TRIGGER
3212321
3132110
0233333
2131233
1212321
2322111
1310233--A TYPICAL LIVE WHEEL RESULT DOUBLES DOMINATE MOST SESSIONS...
I see what Ur getting to here.
Live wheels, do tend to produce spurts of double results,
which of course, means double results on the dozens(&Columns) as well!
So u plan for, and bet for, those types of outcomes,
and bet AGAINST trebles from forming at ALL!
Neat!
Since Twister has seen a win on 13 i have gone back to 2 virtual loss before betting on a 12 step progression. Mine are more hit and run sessions, never done more than 50 spins each session. Highest level is LLL after 2 virtuals :thumbsup:
Quote from: Johnlegend on Feb 14, 06:38 PM 2011
Okay Matrix vertical is RNG proof but not really practical on a live wheel. Betting against doubles becoming trebles is the anwser. On a live wheel you seldom do worse than 50/50 in. A matrix 49. And tonight while playing my original MATRIX Check this out.
2232123
3311331--TRIGGER
3212321
3132110
0233333
2131233
1212321
2322111
1310233--A TYPICAL LIVE WHEEL RESULT DOUBLES DOMINATE MOST SESSIONS...
So we now testing this using double dozens? :-\
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 14, 06:32 PM 2011
How about waiting for a virtual loss to occur before EACH BET MADE?
123
123 - no bet; no bet; no bet
231 - VirtL; L (level1); VirtL
332 - no bet; no bet; no bet
132 - no bet; W (level2); no bet
312 - no bet; VirtL; W(level1)
A.
Sessions would take longer to play but the advantage of this is if you do get the dreaded consecutive long losing run of 12 L-L-L-L-L-L-L-L-L-L-L-'s in a row then you have only bet on six of them and are only at level 6 in the progression...
The only other enemy would be a run of 12 couplets of L's such as in:
LLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLL where you're betting a real L twelve times in succession after a Virtual L.
You could even use a less expensive progression:
1-1-1-2-3-5-7-11-16-25-37-55 (164u)
which would deliver +2, +1, +0, +1, +1,+2, +1, +2, +1, +3, +2, +1
Utilise ZigZag's or JohnLegend's hit 'n' run tactics. :)
A.
@Buff
Did you decide on the best outcome ?
Stop at 7 bets and swich to columns ?
It means more tracking but it may be worth it ;D
EDIT: Im betting Dozens and Columns at the same time. Both have their own progression ;D
For now Im playing just 7 steps. No win by the 7th then take the loss
Also playin Columns at the same time
First bet ?
Doz 1 and Col 3
No12 Hit !
Sweet ;D
Real Cash Game Playing upto 7th step on Dozens and Columns
Starting Bank 1002
Spins 33
Highest Level 3
Profit +34
Bank 1036
Real Cash Game Playing upto 7th step on Dozens and Columns
Starting Bank 1036
Spins 41
Highest Level 4
Profit +34
Bank 1070
Real Cash Game Playing upto 7th step on Dozens and Columns
Starting Bank 1070
Spins 20
Highest Level 2
Profit +22
Bank 1092
Real Cash Game Playing upto 7th step on Dozens and Columns
Starting Bank 1092
Spins 22
Highest Level 3
Profit +30
Bank 1112
Real Cash Game Playing upto 7th step on Dozens and Columns
Starting Bank 1122
Spins 42
Highest Level 7
Profit +29
Bank 1151
Are you making progression continuous or for each vertical separate?
Quote from: marivo on Feb 15, 04:42 AM 2011
Are you making progression continuous or for each vertical separate?
Continuous.
But I do keep the dozen progression seperate from the column progression
Just rebuilt the bot to NOT follow losing streeks, it was worse than yesterdays test of following anything that had 2 verticals in it, it reached the 12 step 2 times and the 13 step once, it won all but its too risky like that.
A few have suggested virtual bets, pointless, you will eventually hit top slot and liss plenty of wins on the way.
Swapping to columns, is probably no different, you will inevitably take your losing run over to another losing run, it may just take longer to lose but lose you will. Since the tests on matrix vertical I have run the test tool on thousands of spins from 2x2 up to 18x18 looking for patterns that go no further, just for fun really, there are many many to choose from but as soon as you choose one to follow and run through with it you eventually get a bad sector, as you have seen twister, both in this method and matrix vertical, it happens.
Quote from: superman on Feb 15, 05:02 AM 2011
Just rebuilt the bot to NOT follow losing streeks, it was worse than yesterdays test of following anything that had 2 verticals in it, it reached the 12 step 2 times and the 13 step once, it won all but its too risky like that.
A few have suggested virtual bets, pointless, you will eventually hit top slot and liss plenty of wins on the way.
Swapping to columns, is probably no different, you will inevitably take your losing run over to another losing run, it may just take longer to lose but lose you will. Since the tests on matrix vertical I have run the test tool on thousands of spins from 2x2 up to 18x18 looking for patterns that go no further, just for fun really, there are many many to choose from but as soon as you choose one to follow and run through with it you eventually get a bad sector, as you have seen twister, both in this method and matrix vertical, it happens.
What results did you get with 18x18 mate ?
QuoteWhat results did you get with 18x18 mate ?
I didnt use it for any bets, just printing it out, the same sort of lengths were formed no matter how many you capture, my personal opinion is theres not a lot of merit to visual formations it boils down to the same as watching the marquee go from red to black, patterns form, will they repeat, probably, will they be reliable, I doubt it. I've just rerun it at 18 for you, see reveal button.
Without a good money management system in place for recovery we will always hit the wall at some point.
[reveal] B | A | C | B | A | z | B | C | A | C | A | C | A | A | A | C | C | A
B | B | C | A | C | B | A | B | B | C | C | z | A | C | A | C | C | A
B | C | B | A | B | B | B | A | C | B | C | B | C | B | B | A | A | B
C | B | C | A | A | C | B | A | A | C | A | B | z | C | B | B | C | C
C | C | B | A | C | A | B | z | C | C | B | B | B | A | A | A | B | A
C | A | B | B | B | A | C | B | C | A | B | B | C | A | C | A | C | A
C | B | B | A | B | A | z | A | B | C | A | B | A | B | A | z | A | B
A | C | C | B | A | C | B | A | A | A | A | B | A | z | C | C | C | A
B | B | B | A | C | B | B | C | B | A | C | B | A | B | C | C | z | C
C | A | A | B | A | A | B | B | B | C | B | C | B | B | C | C | B | B
A | B | C | B | A | B | A | A | A | B | A | C | B | A | C | z | B | C
B | B | A | C | A | B | C | B | A | A | B | A | A | A | B | C | A | A
A | C | A | A | B | B | B | B | B | z | A | A | C | B | B | C | B | C
B | C | B | C | C | A | B | A | B | B | B | A | A | B | A | B | A | C
A | A | B | A | A | C | A | A | C | B | C | C | C | C | B | C | B | C
C | B | A | C | C | C | C | B | B | B | A | A | C | B | z | B | B | C
C | A | B | A | C | B | B | B | C | A | C | C | B | C | C | B | C | B
A | B | B | A | A | A | B | B | C | C | A | B | A | B | B | C | C | B
z | C | B | B | C | B | A | B | B | C | B | C | C | C | A | A | B | B
A | A | B | C | B | A | A | A | A | B | C | C | C | A | B | A | B | A
C | B | C | A | C | B | C | B | C | B | C | C | C | B | B | C | B | A
B | B | A | B | B | A | A | B | A | A | C | C | B | C | B | A | A | A
C | A | A | C | C | C | B | B | A | A | B | B | B | B | C | C | B | A
A | A | C | C | B | A | C | A | C | C | A | B | B | A | B | B | A | C
A | A | C | C | B | B | B | A | C | A | B | B | A | C | A | C | C | C
C | B | A | B | C | B | A | B | B | C | C | B | B | A | A | B | C | B [/reveal]
Thanks superman, for your work
I hope this inspires further examination. I do like the stop at 7 rule, it seems to hold up nicely. Also, Atlantis' ideas are worthy of more testing.
Quote
How about waiting for a virtual loss to occur before EACH BET MADE?
123
123 - no bet; no bet; no bet
231 - VirtL; L (level1); VirtL
332 - no bet; no bet; no bet
132 - no bet; W (level2); no bet
312 - no bet; VirtL; W(level1)
Sessions would take longer to play but the advantage of this is if you do get the dreaded consecutive long losing run of 12 L-L-L-L-L-L-L-L-L-L-L-'s in a row then you have only bet on six of them and are only at level 6 in the progression...
The only other enemy would be a run of 12 couplets of L's such as in:
LLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLLWLL where you're betting a real L twelve times in succession after a Virtual L.
You could even use a less expensive progression:
1-1-1-2-3-5-7-11-16-25-37-55 (164u)
which would deliver +2, +1, +0, +1, +1,+2, +1, +2, +1, +3, +2, +1
Utilise ZigZag's or JohnLegend's hit 'n' run tactics.
Played a session of 213 spins (71 lines in the matrix of 3) as above with above progression.
1 win @ level 1 = +2
1 win @ level 4 = +1
2 wins @ level 5 = +2
1 win @ level 7 = +1
+6 in 213 spins.
A.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 15, 02:26 PM 2011
Played a session of 213 spins (71 lines in the matrix of 3) as above with above progression.
1 win @ level 1 = +2
1 win @ level 4 = +1
2 wins @ level 5 = +2
1 win @ level 7 = +1
+6 in 213 spins.
A.
That is a profit for about 4-5 hours sitting at the table in B&M casino.
Not for me sir.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 15, 02:26 PM 2011
Played a session of 213 spins (71 lines in the matrix of 3) as above with above progression.
1 win @ level 1 = +2
1 win @ level 4 = +1
2 wins @ level 5 = +2
1 win @ level 7 = +1
+6 in 213 spins.
A.
That is a profit for about 4-5 hours sitting at the table in B&M casino.
Not for me sir.
i
link:://rouletteforum.cc/coding-for-roulette/matrix-turbo-tracker/msg37801/#msg37801 (link:://rouletteforum.cc/coding-for-roulette/matrix-turbo-tracker/msg37801/#msg37801)
Hey buffalo what do you mean a vertical double?
like 34 hits then 36?
then you would bet on the line 34 35 36 for the 12 step progression?????
sorry to sound so stupid :-( LoL
Played my first 2 sessions on DB using The Ophis turbo tracker tool.I'm playing both doz and col
1st session table 1 11+ prog 14
2nd session table 2 14+ prog 9
Total prof 125 Euro.
2 more sessions. I'm now playing a 7 step 1 1 2 4 6 9 14 progression.
Tab1 +9
Tab2 +5
Total profit after 4 sessions 195 Euro.
[thumb]link:://img263.imageshack.us/img263/8970/session3h.jpg[/thumb]
[thumb]link:://img710.imageshack.us/img710/7030/session4.jpg[/thumb]
BV no zero.
[attachthumb=#]
Just for fun
Flat betting! :P
marivo, furple, zig zag
Nice work fellows! Are you playing the original way, only stopping after 7th? Glad you are all doing well. Keep it up
BW
can someone explain this to me please lol i dont understand what use are betting on :-(
sounds v good tho :-)
Hi Danny
We use a 3x matrix lke this
123
321
123 etc
Using dozens, 1 2 and 3
We bet for a vertical double to become a triple
for example:
123
132 <here's a vertical double, we bet it will become a triple
1 <that's a win because dozen 1 became a triple. If lost , then you would simply retrack for another double and start over.
Hope its a little clearer
yeah that helps a lot cheers, but about about the progression?
Quote from: xDannyboi23x on Feb 16, 02:00 PM 2011
Yeah that helps a lot cheers, but about about the progression?
It can be what you want it to be.
I use 7 step progression 1 1 2 3 4 6 9
If lost, then retrack and go again. Risk is 26 units
yeah i see so if you had a verticle double but then lost on the first treble bet.
would you go ahead with the progression or wait until you had another double and then
bet the next amount in the progression? cheers for help its a lot clearer nw :-)
live wheel or rng?
Ophis,
There is a false trigger when zero is involved.
Attached is a screenshot, notice the trigger to bet dozen 2,
but there's a 3 and a zero in the matrix.
Quote from: xDannyboi23x on Feb 16, 02:04 PM 2011
Yeah I see so if you had a verticle double but then lost on the first treble bet.
would you go ahead with the progression or wait until you had another double and then
bet the next amount in the progression? cheers for help its a lot clearer nw :-)
live wheel or rng?
Hi Danny, exactly right mate. You go up the progression after each double, hunting the trebles, until you win (or lose 7 times, using my prog)
Quote from: dje1967 on Feb 16, 02:13 PM 2011
Ophis,
There is a false trigger when zero is involved.
Attached is a screenshot, notice the trigger to bet dozen 2,
but there's a 3 and a zero in the matrix.
Fixed:
link:://rouletteforum.cc/coding-for-roulette/matrix-turbo-tracker/msg38041/#msg38041 (link:://rouletteforum.cc/coding-for-roulette/matrix-turbo-tracker/msg38041/#msg38041)
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 16, 12:47 PM 2011
Marivo, furple, zig zag
Nice work fellows! Are you playing the original way, only stopping after 7th? Glad you are all doing well. Keep it up
BW
Yep stopping after 7th progression. I'm playing a 1 1 2 4 6 9 14 progression on Dublin Bet. :thumbsup:
cheers 4 the help buffalo :-)
do u use real wheel or rng to play this?
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 16, 02:00 PM 2011
It can be what you want it to be.
I use 7 step progression 1 1 2 3 4 6 9
If lost, then retrack and go again. Risk is 26 units
I might change to this milder progression.So if I encounter a loss, I could always double the progression.That way I would stay under the table limits on the low stakes table.
I been testing this flat betting
Betting both dozens/coloums
Stop at + 3
If at - 6 stop at evens or - 3
Its not doing too bad actualy but have only tested 4 sessions so far
Early day's :lol:
Still playing well Buff ;D
hi twister i play with the tracker and gives good results and is fun play..wanna ask you have try to change the matrix during game,say you play matrix 7 but starts hitting loses then i go and check matrix 3 and press analyse spins givse you graph and do that for all of them..then i choose one which has graph starting to go up and stick to it for the run...have you try it
Quote from: maestro on Feb 17, 08:00 AM 2011
Hi twister I play with the tracker and gives good results and is fun play..wanna ask you have try to change the matrix during game,say you play matrix 7 but starts hitting loses then I go and check matrix 3 and press analyse spins givse you graph and do that for all of them..then I choose one which has graph starting to go up and stick to it for the run...have you try it
I havent mate. Im just playin Buffs Method ;D
I will check next time I play !
Another good Session ;D !
BV no zero. (prog. 1,1,2,3,4,6,9)
[attachthumb=#]
Oh I should of said also,
All mine are BV NZ RNG and using my own progression ;D
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 14, 03:29 PM 2011
On a loss move up one step
On a win back to step one
Look forward to any tests you do mate :thumbsup:
You still play this way? And your progression is 1,2,3,4,5.....?
Quote from: marivo on Feb 17, 09:16 AM 2011
You still play this way? And your progression is 1,2,3,4,5.....?
I do yes but my progression is very aggressive, it is in that post you quoted from :)
How do you wright it in tracker?
Delete the current one then write in ure new one usin a comma to seperate each step
For example,
2,3,6, etc etc
I know that, but I meant your progression: 1 step forward, 1 step back....
one forward for a loss, back to step one on a win ;D
Tracker would go back to the start of progression on win and not only 1 step back.
Yes, the Tracker goes back to position one when I use my progression
I dont know if its set that way after a win or new high, but all my steps make you a profit hence it goes back to step one
hmm i think i may implement
if in new profit go to step 1
if not in new profit go to prevoius step
but i will do it later.
Quote from: ophis on Feb 17, 10:27 AM 2011
Hmm I think I may implement
if in new profit go to step 1
if not in new profit go to prevoius step
but I will do it later.
Thanx ophis, muchly appreciated :thumbsup:
Can we have an undo button please as sometimes i click and it produces double numbers by mistake. Thanks :)
Matrix Fully Turbo Charged !!!
Another awesome session betting one dozen and/or column at a time
Ophis has done us grand with that beautiful Tracker :thumbsup:
Quote from: ZigZag on Feb 17, 10:50 AM 2011
Can we have an undo button please as sometimes I click and it produces double numbers by mistake. Thanks :)
lol ditto :D
Thanks to ophis this tracker is great..hope there is update,thank you veryyyyyyyyyyyyyyy much...i use this ones as progressions either first,second or third line..happy winnnings
2,3,3,4,3,3,4,4,3,3,5,5,4,4,5,4,5,5,4,6,6,8,7,8,8,9,10
2,4,3,6,4,5,4,6,5,5,6,4,6,6,7,5,5,6,7,8,7,7,8,7,10,10,9,10
3,2,2,3,3,2,3,3,3,4,3,3,4,4,3,4,4,4,5,4,4,5,5,4,5,5,5,6,5,5,6,6,5,6,6,6
p.s twister which of matrix you use 3,4,5,6,or 7 square one,,thanks
3
and end around +100/+150
@maestro
Quote from: maestro on Feb 17, 01:43 PM 2011
Thanks to ophis..........................................................happy winnnings
2,3,3,4,3,3,4,4,3,3,5,5,4,4,5,4,5,5,4,6,6,8,7,8,8,9,10
2,4,3,6,4,5,4,6,5,5,6,4,6,6,7,5,5,6,7,8,7,7,8,7,10,10,9,10
3,2,2,3,3,2,3,3,3,4,3,3,4,4,3,4,4,4,5,4,4,5,5,4,5,5,5,6,5,5,6,6,5,6,6,6
p.s twister which of matrix you use 3,4,5,6,or 7 square one,,thanks
Hello.
can i ask U (I may have missed something here, from earlier)- what do these numbers refer to?
[attachimg=#]
Glad to see you doing so well twister et al. My testings, on no zero wheel in particular showed this to hold up for a long time. You will hit 2 or 3 losing sessions in a row but its remarkable how the winning ones come back. Just have to check out my long old list of test records a few pages back to see that. Keep it up
BW
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 17, 02:05 PM 2011
Glad to see you doing so well twister et al. My testings, on no zero wheel in particular showed this to hold up for a long time. You will hit 2 or 3 losing sessions in a row but its remarkable how the winning ones come back. Just have to check out my long old list of test records a few pages back to see that. Keep it up
BW
Are you playin for Cash also mate ?
Another sound beating of BV NZ RNG !
Also guys I'm doin a side bet. When the Dozen and Column intersect I am betting the 4 numbers that cross
For example Dozen 2 Column 1 the numbers would be 13 16 19 22
You can do 4 singles or 2 splits. I like to do the splits ;D
Wish I was playing cash mate, have neither time nor money at this moment in time. I just like developing systems as a hobby
BW
Quote from: buffalowizard on Feb 17, 03:01 PM 2011
Wish I was playing cash mate, have neither time nor money at this moment in time. I just like developing systems as a hobby
BW
Well Im lovin this one !
Will be playin on the Train 2moz mornin 6am until around 9.30am ;D
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 17, 02:54 PM 2011
Another sound beating of BV NZ RNG !
Also guys .............................................. I like to do the splits ;D
That's what we heard about U Twisteruk .
Soon appearing on Britain's Got Talent!!!!! :D ;D
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 17, 03:23 PM 2011
That's what we heard about you Twisteruk .
Soon appearing on Britain's Got Talent!!!!! :D ;D
HA HA !
I had to give you somethin !!!
Its the gettin up thats Hard lol :P
Hi All
I'm a Newbie on the forum, so please bare with me !!!!! I have been trawling through this awesome site and must say I wish I'd found it ages ago, the Matrix idea's seem to be quite an amazing concept and I decided to download Orphis' Tracker for the Turbo and took the plunge and tried it out on real money this evening (Col & Doz Simultaneoulsly) using 888. com RNG table and hopefully I can upload the Graph with this post.
Spins 108
Bets 37
Wins 15
Losses 22
Minimum -23
Maximum +66
Finished +54
Not bad I thought for the first attempt, I left it on default progression (2,3,6,9,21) I had to go to 5th Progression on Dozens at the end which was a bit nerving but it came in ;D
How do most of you play regarding a stop loss or profit goal ?????
I noticed that it instructed me to bet where the Zero had come up although I thought I downloaded the update ? (I'm using V0. 1)
Would I be better off transferring my money over to BV NZ as TwisterUK is doing ??
Many thanks to you all on here for the excellent posts and I hope I can contribute in a constructive manor if and when I can :thumbsup:
I'm interested in knowing how many progression steps you guys are using with the tracker. Hi Gordon, welcome and I'm glad you had a winning start. You may find quite a few lost progressions using only 5 levels however. I would recommend 7.
Kepp winning!
BW
Hi Buffalo
I think you're right there, as I was at the last progression quite quickly, so I will edit the progression to 7 and give that a try !!!
I have answered my own question and downloaded the Tracker update to correct the Zero problem
Out of interest is there a Tracker for the "Matrix 49" system, or should I ask this question on that thread, as I notuced that on the Turbo version it does do the 7 wide format but follows the betting for a Triple to form instead of a double in the 49 system (Hope this question makes sense) ???
BTW how are you getting on with it ????
Quote from: Gordonline on Feb 17, 06:02 PM 2011
Hi Buffalo
I think you're right there, as I was at the last progression quite quickly, so I will edit the progression to 7 and give that a try !!!
I have answered my own question and downloaded the Tracker update to correct the Zero problem
Out of interest is there a Tracker for the "Matrix 49" system, or should I ask this question on that thread, as I notuced that on the Turbo version it does do the 7 wide format but follows the betting for a Triple to form instead of a double in the 49 system (Hope this question makes sense) ???
by the way how are you getting on with it ????
I have done enough back testing to know this is a very good method, especially if you can get on the NZ wheel. I only used a 3 wide matrix, as it is quicker and simpler to apply, for me anyway.
Always waiting for triples to form. Perhaps ask your question about the matrix 49 over on that thread, they will have a better idea I expect.
Cheers
BW
Hi Gordon
At the moment I'm flat betting AGAINST triple dozens/col forming for +3 per session and stop at -6 if I start betting at wrong time.
If at - 6 I log back in after a short break and do a 1,1,2,3,4,6,9 in the normal way for a few hits FOR a triple as part of recovery then start flat betting double dozens again for + 3
Its not everyones cup of tea and a real grinder but my last few sessions went like this
Session 1 +3 flat betting live wheel
Session 2 +3
Session 3 +3
Session 4 +3
Session 5 +3
Session 6 +1 (recovery)
Session 7 0 (recovery)
Session 8 +3
Session 9 -6 (stop-loss) Log out/in wait for 2 virtual loss then start 1,1,2,3,4,6,9 to win 6 units then start flat betting again.
I don't like staying at wheel for long so if I get off to bad start I just aim to get back to evens or stop at -6
There are a lot of good progressions and ways of playing this. I would say using the defult 2,3,6,9,21 is far too aggressive
Hi ZigZag
Thanks for your post, I agree with the stop loss you're doing, as greed can get the better of us and having a moderate profit slowly builds into a decent BR so we can hopefully play with their money lol
You could say that I was lucky using the default progression, as I said the 5th progression I had at the end would have taken me back to evens so I will edit to the 7 stage or maybe try the flat method and see how I get on (Fortunately I am plus Ã,£100 at the mo on 888. com) at least that gives me a little buffer to use
I will keep you all posted on my progress
Time to knock out some ZZZZZZZZZ's
See you tomoz ;D
Hi Gordon i'm still in testing stage just using small chips and just trying different ways of playing this. Will let you know if it tanks :lol:
Quote from: Gordonline on Feb 17, 05:14 PM 2011
Hi All
I'm a Newbie on the forum, so please bare with me !!!!! I have been trawling through this awesome site and must say I wish I'd found it ages ago, the Matrix idea's seem to be quite an amazing concept and I decided to download Orphis' Tracker for the Turbo and took the plunge and tried it out on real money this evening (Col & Doz Simultaneoulsly) using 888. com RNG table and hopefully I can upload the Graph with this post.
Spins 108
Bets 37
Wins 15
Losses 22
Minimum -23
Maximum +66
Finished +54
Not bad I thought for the first attempt, I left it on default progression (2,3,6,9,21) I had to go to 5th Progression on Dozens at the end which was a bit nerving but it came in ;D
How do most of you play regarding a stop-loss or profit goal ?????
I noticed that it instructed me to bet where the Zero had come up although I thought I downloaded the update ? (I'm using V0. 1)
Would I be better off transferring my money over to BV NZ as TwisterUK is doing ??
Many thanks to you all on here for the excellent posts and I hope I can contribute in a constructive manor if and when I can :thumbsup:
Version 0.1.1 is with fixed zero.
What a Ride ! What a Ride !
Still going Strong ;D
what progression are you using twister. ive had a few go beyond the 12th but im just playing play money on bv nz
Just my own variation mate
Nothing special, but very aggressive
The big dip you see and then the sudden rise is the System hitting on level 10 or 11 for example ;D
Another bashing for BV ;D
My idea is to try betting only after 3 *consecutive* vertical doubles which did NOT form trebles have occurred (TRIGGER)
After the trigger continuously bet on the future vertical doubles to become a treble - until a WIN is obtained at any stage of the progression at which point reset and wait for next trigger. (3 vert doubles in a row that failed to make a triple)
Doing this automatically cuts out 3 losers before staking begins...
A.
EDIT: 3 losers required.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 18, 10:30 AM 2011
My idea is to try betting only after 5 *consecutive* vertical doubles which did NOT form trebles have occurred (TRIGGER)
After the trigger continuously bet on the future vertical doubles to become a treble - until a WIN is obtained at any stage of the progression at which point reset and wait for next trigger. (5 vert doubles in a row that failed to make a triple)
Doing this automatically cuts out 5 losers before staking begins...
A.
Sounds like a Plan we could try out Mate :thumbsup:
Hi Twister,
Well I tried with a 7 matrix with 5 virtual losers - but I only think 3 virtual L's in a row (without any intervening trebles) is necessary for a 3-Grid so I have amended it to 3 in my post.
Example:
112
113
233 -Vloss@1 ; Vloss@2
121 -Vloss@3
123
112 - WIN@1 RESET; VLoss@2
A.
Just done a 107 Spin Real Cash Game with Atlantis Stipulation of 3 LLL's before 1st bet
All I did with the Tracker was make my first 3 bets 0,0,0 ;D
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 18, 11:22 AM 2011
Just done a 107 Spin Real Cash Game with Atlantis Stipulation of 3 LLL's before 1st bet
All I did with the Tracker was make my first 3 bets 0,0,0 ;D
Hi Twister,
When I did a first test this morning I was extremely disappointed to encounter over 12 L's in a row... 12 successive doubles that failed to form trebles. It would have wiped out my bank; also I do not think it an infrequent occurrence either.
My thought to make safer is by waiting for 3 virtual losses (three doubles that fail to make trebles) as a trigger before launching the betting attack for the triple to occur.
That's a nice result - but I do not think the tracker is yet programmed to log 3 failed trebles in a row before advising a bet - unless I'm mistaken that is!
Thanks,
A.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 18, 12:04 PM 2011
Hi Twister,
When I did a first test this morning I was extremely disappointed to encounter over 12 L's in a row... 12 successive doubles that failed to form trebles. It would have wiped out my bank; also I do not think it an infrequent occurrence either.
My thought to make safer is by waiting for 3 virtual losses (three doubles that fail to make trebles) as a trigger before launching the betting attack for the triple to occur.
That's a nice result - but I do not think the tracker is yet programmed to log 3 failed trebles in a row before advising a bet.
Thanks,
A.
Wow ! 12 L's in a row :-\
I had it once and it hit on 13
No the Tracker isn't set for that
So what I did was make the first 3 legs of my progression 0,0,0 so when it gave a bet it would not affect the Profit figure (hence the Flat lines in my Graph)
Another pounding for BV NZ ;D
Hi Ophis
Thanks for the reply, I found the update last night and have downloaded it
(Awesome bit of software thanks)
BTW have you done a tracker for Matrix 49 out of interest ?
Gordon ;D
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 18, 12:11 PM 2011
Wow ! 12 L's in a row :-\
I had it once and it hit on 13
No the Tracker isn't set for that
So what I did was make the first 3 legs of my progression 0,0,0 so when it gave a bet it would not affect the Profit figure (hence the Flat lines in my Graph)
Hi Twister,
I don't understand. How would entering three zeroes make the tracker conclude that the the double failed to treble?
A.
Hi Twister
Hope you don't mind me asking, are you playing Real Money? and looking at your progression I'm assuming your minimum bet is not Ã,£1 ???
I'm thinking of joining BV, as you seem to be doing quite well over there
Gordon ;D
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 18, 11:22 AM 2011
All I did with the Tracker was make my first 3 bets 0,0,0 ;D
Huh why I never think of that? :-[ I always wait for 2 LLs as trigger but never even thought of putting it as 0,0,0 in the tracker. Always had to write the LLs on paper LoL
If i'm betting dozens OR columns only I usually wait for 2 LL's
If i'm betting both dozens and columns at same time I wait for 4 LLLL's
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 18, 12:21 PM 2011
Hi Twister,
I don't understand. How would entering three zeroes make the tracker conclude that the the double failed to treble?
A.
It doesnt in the true sense
When it gives me a bet the first 3 bets it gives are 0 Units on Dozen/Column whatever, which I obviously ignore
So on the 4th bet it gives
me the first leg of
my progression ;D
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 18, 12:27 PM 2011
It doesn't in the true sense
When it gives me a bet the first 3 bets it gives are 0 Units on Dozen/Column whatever, which I obviously ignore
So on the 4th bet it gives me the first leg of my progression ;D
So you are saying that those first three bets *could* have been winning trebles - but you just didn't bet anything on them..? If so, this is not what I meant.
A.
Quote from: ZigZag on Feb 18, 12:24 PM 2011
Huh why I never think of that? :-[ I always wait for 2 LLs as trigger but never even thought of putting it as 0,0,0 in the tracker. Always had to write the LLs on paper LoL
If i'm betting dozens OR columns only I usually wait for 2 LL's
If i'm betting both dozens and columns at same time I wait for 4 LLLL's
Zig do you ever bet the side bet ?
I mentioned it a few pages back
When you get a bet for both dozen and column at the same time I bet the 4 numbers that are at the intersect
Just a little thing I have ;D
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 18, 12:29 PM 2011
So you are saying that those first three bets *could* have been winning trebles - but you just didn't bet anything on them..? If so, this is not what I meant.
A.
No.
The Tracker goes back to step one on a win
So I only get a Unit bet when its missed for 3 times
It gives out bets, but at 0 Units which I ignore
When It says bet 20 Units (for example) I know its already missed 3 times without havin to focus on it
Quote from: Gordonline on Feb 18, 12:23 PM 2011
Hi Twister
Hope you don't mind me asking, are you playing Real Money? and looking at your progression I'm assuming your minimum bet is not Ã,£1 ???
I'm thinking of joining BV, as you seem to be doing quite well over there
Gordon ;D
Yes I am
My units are 10p due to the table limits
I like BV NZ muchly ;D
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 18, 12:21 PM 2011
Hi Twister,
I don't understand. How would entering three zeroes make the tracker conclude that the the double failed to treble?
A.
Maybe I wasnt clear
Its 3 Zero's in the progression setting of the Tracker
So when you get a bet you know its already missed 3 times
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 18, 12:31 PM 2011
Zig do you ever bet the side bet ?
I mentioned it a few pages back
When you get a bet for both dozen and column at the same time I bet the 4 numbers that are at the intersect
Just a little thing I have ;D
LoL i've not tried that yet. I'm only at wheel for short sessions at a time if I can help it. So I never notice these things, but will watch out for it and have a little side bet too :LoL:
Quote from: ZigZag on Feb 18, 12:43 PM 2011
LoL i've not tried that yet. I'm only at wheel for short sessions at a time if I can help it. So I never notice these things, but will watch out for it and have a little side bet too :LoL:
Yeah try it !
Just minimum bet on 2 splits
If it comes up its a nice little Bonus ;D
I will :thumbsup:
Have you give up on matrix vertical and 49 now? :question:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 18, 12:33 PM 2011
No.
The Tracker goes back to step one on a win
So I only get a Unit bet when its missed for 3 times
It gives out bets, but at 0 Units which I ignore
When It says bet 20 Units (for example) I know its already missed 3 times without havin to focus on it
Right. Got it! Very clever, twister. :)
I will try it and see.
Anyhow, what you think of this idea of adding three misses before each bet attack?
A.
Quote from: ZigZag on Feb 18, 12:57 PM 2011
I will :thumbsup:
Have you give up on matrix vertical and 49 now? :question:
Given up would be the wrong word
I'm just more in favour of 1 Dozen/column betting ;D
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 18, 12:59 PM 2011
Right. Got it! Very clever, twister. :)
I will try it and see.
Anyhow, what you think of this idea of adding three misses before each bet attack?
A.
Im up for it :thumbsup:
Im playing that way now and will continue to test with 3 LLL's before betting ;D
OK i entered your progression but I might have found a bug in the tracker...
I entered six doz1's in a row into the tracker (dozens only) on a matrix of 3
like this:
111
111
but it did not tell me to bet 0u on dozen 1 for the next bet!!
Second and third advices came through as normal though.
Other users please confirm.
A.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 18, 01:10 PM 2011
OK I entered your progression but I might have found a bug in the tracker...
I entered six doz1's in a row into the tracker (dozens only) on a matrix of 3
like this:
111
111
but it did not tell me to bet 0u on dozen 1 for the next bet!!
Second and third advices came through as normal though.
Other users please confirm.
A.
Yes your right.
So we are getting 4 VL's as default ! (usin 0,0,0)
Might not be a bad thing LoL
I'm sure ophis will look at it when he has time ;D
Quote from: Twisteruk on Feb 18, 01:04 PM 2011
I'm up for it :thumbsup:
I'm playing that way now and will continue to test with 3 LLL's before betting ;D
U can setup progression 0,0,0,1,4,8.....
It will work as 3 virtual bets since it will bet 0.
Hi Ophis,
There seems something wrong with tracker at the beginning of entering results...
If I enter six dozens like this
111
111
It does not tell me to bet the first leg of the prog on dozen 1.
Could you take a look please?
Thanks,
A.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 18, 01:10 PM 2011
OK I entered your progression but I might have found a bug in the tracker...
I entered six doz1's in a row into the tracker (dozens only) on a matrix of 3
like this:
111
111
but it did not tell me to bet 0u on dozen 1 for the next bet!!
Second and third advices came through as normal though.
Other users please confirm.
A.
Yes I can confirm that same thing happened to me on the first double the tracker ignored it for me too.
Ophis mate,
Since I have a difficulties unzipping my pants,
could you do next tracker/pants/without any zips pls....LOL
Here is a new high !
I was playing around with the Tracker and BV and had 21 L's in a row !
And it hit on level 22
Then it froze so I cudnt print Graph :-\
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 18, 01:10 PM 2011
OK I entered your progression but I might have found a bug in the tracker...
I entered six doz1's in a row into the tracker (dozens only) on a matrix of 3
like this:
111
111
but it did not tell me to bet 0u on dozen 1 for the next bet!!
Second and third advices came through as normal though.
Other users please confirm.
A.
I'm aware of that. It will be corrected in next update.
Quote from: F_LAT_INO on Feb 18, 01:48 PM 2011
Ophis mate,
Since I have a difficulties unzipping my pants,
could you do next tracker/pants/without any zips pls....LoL
FLAT try...
Start Menu -> Run...
and type there:
regsvr32 zipfldr.dll
now you should be able to enter ziped folders and drag drop on desktop.
Hi Twister,
Were you only betting stop on 7 progression? I hope so for the sake of your br!
BW
Quote from: ophis on Feb 18, 02:20 PM 2011
FLAT try...
Start Menu -> Run...
and type there:
regsvr32 zipfldr.dll
now you should be able to enter ziped folders and drag drop on desktop.
Thanks mate.
Quote from: atlantis on Feb 18, 01:41 PM 2011
Hi Ophis,
There seems something wrong with tracker at the beginning of entering results...
If I enter six dozens like this
111
111
It does not tell me to bet the first leg of the prog on dozen 1.
Could you take a look please?
Thanks,
A.
When you first start tracker it shouldn't really give you a bet on 3rd line at the beginning because that 1 dozen could be at end of a treble or even quad. I tend to type in the last 9 different numbers into tracker from the marquee to begin.
Hi All
Just for your info, I entered dozen/column 1 six times and if told me to bet "0" units on both
111
111
Tried it twice and seems ok :o
Gordon
Quote from: ZigZag on Feb 18, 03:12 PM 2011
When you first start tracker it shouldn't really give you a bet on 3rd line at the beginning because that 1 dozen could be at end of a treble or even quad. I tend to type in the last 9 different numbers into tracker from the marquee to begin.
Hi Zigzag,
Good point. And that sounds like a good idea too.
A.
TRACKER UPDATE
link:://rouletteforum.cc/coding-for-roulette/matrix-turbo-tracker/msg38624/#msg38624 (link:://rouletteforum.cc/coding-for-roulette/matrix-turbo-tracker/msg38624/#msg38624)
Thank you!
thank you..you just too goot to be true...thank ophis
Thank you very much Ophis. Very much appreciated :thumbsup:
Hi All
Just thought I would contribute to this system and give you some statistics from the 1000+ spins I have recorded on my Excel Spreadsheet, I have 16 sessions all from live spins of a roulette wheel ranging from 36 spins upto 166 and I have preloaded them all into Ophis' tracker to get an idea how it performs.
Does anyone have any ideas whether the RNG's are more random then the live wheels which should make the Matrix be more effective ? (Just a thought)
I tried some different progressions ranging from 7 step (1,1,2,3,4,6,9,14) and 7 step with 3 virtual losses and also a more aggresive 6 step (2,4,6,9,14,21) and 6 step with 3 VL's and also flat betting and a 11 step etc etc
Using the above I found that the results came out better using the 7 wide format rather than 3 wide format, and strangely using the 3 VL's didn't always produce better results, what I will do is upload an excel chart with the results, hope they make some kind of sense, if not let me know (Out of interest session 4 seemed to be a nightmare but you'll always get one)
Be in touch
Gordon ;D
Quote from: maestro on Feb 19, 05:31 AM 2011
Thank you..you just too good to be true...thank ophis
this system seems very good in early testing havnt gone past the 7th stage in the 12 stage progression :-) Has anyone came even close to losing all 12 yet????
or you guys using the 7th stage progression? suppose it a lot safer
i
Quote from: F_LAT_INO on Feb 20, 08:01 AM 2011
Could anybody/moderator/thread starter//---
TELL ME WHY WAS MY POST REMOVED,WITH 12000 SPINS NEGATIVE GRAPH OF THE
SYSTEM PRESENTED.
You want to see only positive results,but not other.
I don't think like you guys and always appreciate negative results in my threads
which show us whether it works or not.
No further comment.
You have posted those redults in the Tracker thread. I want to keep that Tracker thread clean and I'm removing everything that isint related to funcionality of the tracker. Please post those results here in this thread Iboba.
OK Ophis mate,I thought it was here so my appologies.
i
Quote from: ophis on Feb 20, 08:08 AM 2011
You have posted those redults in the Tracker thread. I want to keep that Tracker thread clean and I'm removing everything that isint related to funcionality of the tracker. Please post those results here in this thread Iboba.
Here's results of F_lat_ino's spins!
200 000 BetVoyager non zero wheel.
progression: 1,2,3,4,5,6,7
matrix size: 7
Confirmed what I always thought. On no zero, this is a winner long term
10 000 live wheel.
progression: 1,2,4,8,16,32,64
matrix size: 3
....it would lose with matrx size 7
170 000 Live wheel
progression: 1,2,3,4,5,6,7
matrix size: 7
no matter what settings you choose it will alway lose on those spins
Hi All
Interesting comparisons between 200,000 Bet Voyager NZ result on 7 wide, and 170,000 Live wheel 7 wide !! (Am I right in assuming the results are based on 3 Virtual Losses before betting ?)
Looks like 3 wide format and 7 step progression is the way forward then, and if we use BV NZ should produce the better results ;D
Look forward to everyones comments :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Quote from: Gordonline on Feb 20, 03:55 PM 2011
Hi All
Interesting comparisons between 200,000 Bet Voyager NZ result on 7 wide, and 170,000 Live wheel 7 wide !! (Am I right in assuming the results are based on 3 Virtual Losses before betting ?)
Looks like 3 wide format and 7 step progression is the way forward then, and if we use BV NZ should produce the better results ;D
Look forward to everyones comments :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
No virtual betting.
1,2,3,4,5,6,7 progression.
Thanks Ophis for the clarification ;D
just a quick question buffalo if you had a line like
132
322
112
32
would we bet on the 2nd dozen to become another double?
beacuse it is alrady a treble?? cheers
Would be interesting to see how it performs with the original 12 step progression over 200 000 spins
then do it. u have those spins over here on forum. Bet voyager spins in actuals section. u can import them into tracker and auto spin them.
Quote from: xDannyboi23x on Feb 20, 05:53 PM 2011
Just a quick question buffalo if you had a line like
132
322
112
32
would we bet on the 2nd dozen to become another double?
beacuse it is alrady a treble?? cheers
we would not bet it.
12 step progresion
Quote from: ZigZag on Feb 20, 06:27 PM 2011
12 step progresion
have you tried with columns?
Columns with 12 step progression
1, 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 9, 14, 21, 31, 47, 70
Quote from: ZigZag on Feb 20, 09:40 PM 2011
Columns with 12 step progression
1, 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 9, 14, 21, 31, 47, 70
Just a TIP.
If you minimize tracker when performing auto spins.... it is doing it like 100x faster.
Cheers Ophis I was waiting forever the first time LoL
This is dozen bet with 12 step progression waiting for 2 LL Virtual loss. I set the tracker to
0, 0, 1, 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 9, 14, 21, 31, 47, 70
are you ppl using the 7 step or the 12 step progression?
@OPHIS
U know I love ALL Ur work.
Its just a thought that I want to toss out there for U and the guys to consider.
I was discussing the same with a friend.
>>>>>>>>>>>
When the tracker/Matrix is not performing well, I feel, (maybe its just me),
thats its because the Matrix is out-of-line with where its needs to be.
In other words, Like has been said before, the Matrix, of what ever size, is not something that actually happens within the Roulette game, its just a complexity that people like us put onto the numbers and results we 'see', to make another game.
A game-within-a-game if U will. (Illusion)
So, and I will not be surprised if others have discussed this, or at least realized it,
when the game-within-a-game is not firing,
it maybe due to the fact that the Matrix is out-of-alignment, with where it needs to be for our Illusion game.
Therefore, could we possibly have a slider adjustment switch under each of the Dozen and Column Matrii, such that when moved left or right, it shoves/slides all the numbers around one notch on the matrix, and re-aligns them for a better performing Matrix?
Something like this>>
[attachimg=#]
What does everyone think?
(Edit.
The slider switch would of course need two(2) positions
of movement for each Left and Right adjustment.)
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 22, 05:06 AM 2011
Therefore, could we possibly have a slider adjustment switch under each of the Dozen and Column Matrii, such that when moved left or right, it shoves/slides all the numbers around one notch on the matrix, and re-aligns them for a better performing Matrix?
(Edit.
The slider switch would of course need two(2) positions
of movement for each Left and Right adjustment.)
I don't quite understand how would this work.
"and re-aligns them for a better performing Matrix" - how would tracker know which is performing better?
"it shoves/slides all the numbers around one notch on the matrix" - only numbers in matrices? what about all the data (lists) on the side? and profit? and progression count?
Do you want tracker to self reset and recalculate everything from beggining with current spins each time you change matrice size?... it can be done... but not sure how fast would something like that work.
Or do you want tracker to play 4 games at once (matrix3-7) and show you 4 different profits so you can change matrix size according to which profit is higher? or maybe even tracker would do this automatic?.... this sound a bit complicated. its not imposible.... but needs a bit of work.
and the question is. from what matrix size should tracker start? 3?
and what if multiple matrices sizes have the same profit? which one to choose? the one with lower progression?
either way I don't think I would do Undo for that kind of tracker. it would be far to complicated. not fancy spending 4 hours just to make undo work :o
uh i dunno. this needs alot of thoughts... it far more complicated than u think.
by the way: why are you using old version with bugs?
If you help me we can work on it together to make Matrix Tracker A.I.
But I need an architect ;)
You are engineer try to engineer it. Think about it deeper and show me plan. I can make anything if its defined properly. Remember programs don't have common sense... or maybe be.... common sense is called "bugs" in software terminology ;)
...yes we could do semi A.I.
Quote from: ophis on Feb 22, 11:43 AM 2011
I................
by the way: why are you using old version with bugs?
Answers in reverse order.
Re tracker -old- ..................I'm not, I just used that tester GUI, to play around with in paint.
So no worries bro.
Yes its complicated.
No, for me U wouldn't have to change the previous outcome of the tracker, either gfraph or history wise, since the results of the tracker TO THAT POINT, would still be needed, and correct.
This is what mean.
This taken from some earlier post by BW>>>>
311
112
131
213
223
133
133
211
Then just because I want to, I silde the results, one '#Notch' to the left, here's the result>>>
(3)this number would be pushed off the Matrix......
111
121
312
132
231
331
332
11
so now U see, a completely different Matrix forms, just as though U started tracking at a different position, just one spun number later!
Quote from: ophis on Feb 22, 11:58 AM 2011
If you help me we can work on it together to make Matrix Tracker A.I.
But I need an architect ;)
You are engineer try to engineer it. Think about it deeper and show me plan. I can make anything if its defined properly. Remember programs don't have common sense... or maybe be.... common sense is called "bugs" in software terminology ;)
...yes we could do semi A.I.
Great. will do after my tea!!! Sausage and mash!
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 22, 01:08 PM 2011
Answers in reverse order.
Re tracker -old- ..................I'm not, I just used that tester GUI, to play around with in paint.
So no worries bro.
Yes its complicated.
No, for me you wouldn't have to change the previous outcome of the tracker, either gfraph or history wise, since the results of the tracker TO THAT POINT, would still be needed, and correct.
This is what mean.
This taken from some earlier post by BW>>>>
311
112
131
213
223
133
133
211
Then just because I want to, I silde the results, one '#Notch' to the left, here's the result>>>
(3)this number would be pushed off the Matrix......
111
121
312
132
231
331
332
11
so now you see, a completely different Matrix forms, just as though you started tracking at a different position, just one spun number later!
ok to the left remove first numner and rewrite matrix.... but then how would you know if this "position" is better? and how about moving to right? matrix cant start with empty slot.
--1
123
321
...
Quote from: ophis on Feb 22, 01:24 PM 2011
ok to the left remove first numner and rewrite matrix.... but then how would you know if this "position" is better? and how about moving to right? matrix cant start with empty slot.
--1
123
321
...
Why can't a Matrix start with an empty slot?
At the beginning of the Matrix, at the top, where the result does not now affect the latest outcome.
Movements.
Four of them.
Think of them as moving the tracker along on a CD in a CD player.
<< >>
like forward and backwards.
1. move one slot to the left.
2. move two slots to the left [reveal=OR]or alternatively, have the movement limited to two moves to the left, as in 'clicking' the left slider/switch << twice.[/reveal]
3. move one slot to the right.
4. move two slots to the right [reveal=OR]or alternatively, have the movement limited to two moves to the right, as in 'clicking' the right slider/switch >> twice.[/reveal]
The whole reason for moving, is because the current (pre-movement) results, are missing there 'possible' targets probably by just one dozen/column.
By
moving, the player will soon know if the tracker is performing better, by the results he/she gets , and the increasing profit figure on the tracker.
Also his BR will be getting larger!
Quote from: ophis on Feb 22, 01:24 PM 2011
ok to the left remove first numner and rewrite matrix.... but then how would you know if this "position" is better? and how about moving to right? matrix cant start with empty slot.
--1
123
321
...
Just as a thought.
When the tracker has been moved to the right, and it leaves an empty 'slot'....
put the letter M in the slot marker box to indicate movement has occurred.
I now see what Ur referring to, re empty space.
Maybe (U'll curse me for this one), make the slots for the matrix a little taller, so move results are on show.
Add one more row to the cell box.
It would be like having the row that is now not 'live'', being there just for historical reasons, since its about to Drop off the top of the cell.
edit.
Suggestion.
This is a visual one which i noticed maybe useful.
When the tracker is showing a bet to be played, ie, U put either 1,,2 or 3 above the Dozen matrix, or above the Column Matrix, could we have the indicator the be>>>>>>>>>>>
D1, D2, D3............C1, C2, C3
Its shows it more clearly which Zones the bet is to be placed, esp when Ur against the clock in getting both bets down on the felt.
Quote from: ophis on Feb 22, 11:58 AM 2011
If you help me we can work on it together to make Matrix Tracker A.I.
But I need an architect ;)
You are engineer try to engineer it. Think about it deeper and show me plan. I can make anything if its defined properly. Remember programs don't have common sense... or maybe be.... common sense is called "bugs" in software terminology ;)
...yes we could do semi A.I.
U can have as much help as U want buddie. :)
the reson that there cant be empty spaces is the same as why betting is done after 3 lines have been filed.
to avoid trebles,quads etc.
if there is empty space... there can be anything.
I now see what Ur referring to, re empty space.
Maybe (U'll curse me for this one),
make the slots for the matrix a little taller, so more results are on show.
Add one more row to the cell box.
Would that solve the problem Ophis? ???
It would be like having the row that is now not 'live'', being there just for historical reasons, since its about to Drop off the top of the cell.
Quote from: chrisbis on Feb 22, 02:20 PM 2011
I now see what your referring to, re empty space.
Maybe (U'll curse me for this one),
make the slots for the matrix a little taller, so more results are on show.
Add one more row to the cell box.
Would that solve the problem Ophis? ???
It would be like having the row that is now not 'live'', being there just for historical reasons, since its about to Drop off the top of the cell.
No.
Matrix is not as high as u can see it. Data are not deleted from matrix on new data. After 300 spins there will be 100 rows (3columns) in matrix. but u only see 5 or so....
empty spaces are only problem if there would be "change" performed before 4 lines are formed.... well mayebe not problem but false data could be. because u could not determine if previous spins "empty spaces" woudnt form triple or quad.
So, if I read U correctly, if we 'move' the data one slot, then its almost as if we created a new start point, and poss reset the tracker.
I can see that working.
The previous data has done its job, so it would only be 'Future' and present data that is required.
The graph could be 'saved' data- automatically on 'Movements'
same with the history of numbers.
what we need is to agree a position in the cells to make that change.
How about 5 rows above the current 'Live' input line?
That puts it clear of triple & Quads.
The numbers would 'slide around, and the player would not see the end of the slide.
Its obvious we would have to reset the tracker in the same way U used t reset the CWB Tracker if U changed Modes.
Can we have a consensus (if this is a mod that everyone wants) that data held sfter 5-6 rows above the current input line is where we could have the tracker reset to?
Everyone?
What do ppl think please fellows?
chris do not you think might be better if at any given time we can see dozen and colunms for all matrix and more important lose win registry,so after certain run of L we can make human decision where we can bet..the way tracker is now is very good,thanks to ophis,but my opinion if could :thumbsup: be done to se LWregistry for all matrix at the same time that would be help..
Quote from: maestro on Feb 22, 04:04 PM 2011
chris do not you think might be better if at any given time we can see dozen and colunms for all matrix and more important lose win registry,so after certain run of L we can make human decision where we can bet..the way tracker is now is very good,thanks to ophis,but my opinion if could :thumbsup: be done to se LWregistry for all matrix at the same time that would be help..
Interesting point there Maestro.
Well, being the purest engineer that I am, I
could say, we always have the human decision to take at anytime anyhow!
But of course I'm not going to say that......................cause its obvious!! ha!
So, yes I agree. But I bet that's a shed load of work for ophis.
What I'm trying to get at here is this..................
Say Player A starts the tracker at 9.00am in the morning, and his first number out of the Marquee is say #36.
His second number out is #14
His third number out is #2
That is player A starting point for the tracker= Doz 3/Col3
His matrix starts thus;-
Dozens...........Columns
3 2 1...............3 2 2
But just 30 seconds later player B starts his tracker up over the other side of the country, using the same exact on-line wheel, and because he wants to start a-fresh, his first number out of the Marquee, is #14
His second number out is #2
His third number out is #16
Player B will have a Matrix that starts like thus:-
Dozens...........Columns
2 1 2...............2 2 1
And, as U can see, the Matrix formation, is going to be completely different, even both players are playing the same casino results, and the same tracker!
Both players will have completely (or most prob completely) different outcomes, and one player, (it could be A or B) will win more than another.
As each player goes through their motions, inputting numbers into the tracker, one should notice a distinct lack of hitting results.
That player (in my opinion)
should be able to move the tracker results along one or two slots within the Matrix, to 're-align' his matrix into a more favorable position, and therefore obtain better than previous results!
if is too much work then do not do it...we still can play this way to track L for dozen and colums by pressing auto spin and flicking in between matrix...by the way chris your idea makes sence but you cannot alwaya hit wining matrix,no matter how you flick it :thumbsup:
True.
Even the best Illusion doesn't always come -off!!
i am thinking about making tracker play 4 modes at once in background.
and auto adjusting matrix size according to z-score of each mode.
Auto eh!
Have U passed Ur test for that particular powered device mate?
"Excuse me Sir, Do u have a License for this Turbo Tracker Vehicle?"
that is going to be hell of a tracker...thank you very much
Crazy game at BV NZ. :P
The tracker was out of line so many times!!
[reveal][attachimg=#][/reveal]
Because my laptop blew up and i have no access to any source codes any work on trackers is being halted until i get some spare money for new hardware. :(
Hi All,
It has gone very quite in this thread, everyone seems to be just playing/testing the other Matrix variations.
I have been getting very good results using the tracker tool.
I keep the grid set the 3 for both dozens and columns.
I use the following progressions:
1111122222333334444455555
Sure you do not recover all your losses at once but I average +5 to +15 a winning session, and I have made over +40 units so far today.
I commit no more that 20-30 units per session.
If dozens or columns get to a 2 unit bet I use this as an indicator that I should be exiting the session with a positive if possible.
The more you play Turbo Matrix the more you get a feel for when you can push on our when it is time to exit the session.
Anyway it is a shame people are not trying this out, especially since we have a very nice tracker tool for it to make on-line play a breeze!
Thanks
malcop
This system in now coded in to Multi System Tracker.
for further details please visit:
link:://rouletteforum.cc/mst-project/ (link:://rouletteforum.cc/mst-project/)
Anyone still playing this, here is my latest live session.
[attachimg=1]
Hey Malcop
Are you playing it as laid out in original post or with any tweaks?
I am currently testing similar thing but with double streets turning to trips. Seems to work good also
BW
Quote from: buffalowizard on Nov 23, 03:25 AM 2012
Hey Malcop
Are you playing it as laid out in original post or with any tweaks?
I am currently testing similar thing but with double streets turning to trips. Seems to work good also
BW
I use MST to play it, Dozens only and use this progression: 1,2,2,2,2,3,3,3,3,4,4
Out of all the systems in MST I still think MT3 is the most consistent method in their, sure it is slow to play, but if you have the p
atience it is worth while.Edit: forgot to say I ignore the zero, and if I lose to a zero I just put the same bet back up.
Quote from: malcop on Nov 23, 03:29 AM 2012
...forgot to say I ignore the zero, and if I lose to a zero I just put the same bet back up
MST v1.6.9 (link:://rmst.forumer.com/download/file.php?id=60535)
What's NEW?- Option in MT3 to Ignore Zero
:thumbsup:
Quote from: ophis on Nov 23, 04:47 AM 2012
MST v1.6.9 (link:://rmst.forumer.com/download/file.php?id=60535)
What's NEW?
- Option in MT3 to Ignore Zero
:thumbsup:
No ophis, that's just what I do, please don't change anything :)
Quote from: malcop on Nov 23, 04:49 AM 2012
No ophis, that's just what I do, please don't change anything :)
This is as an option. Leave it off and it will act the same as before.
Quote from: ophis on Nov 23, 04:50 AM 2012
This is as an option. Leave it off and it will act the same as before.
OK great I was going to ask you what the new update was :thumbsup:
If you lose to a zero, will it be recorded in the accounting as a loss?
Quote from: malcop on Nov 23, 04:52 AM 2012
OK great I was going to ask you what the new update was :thumbsup:
If you lose to a zero, will it be recorded in the accounting as a loss?
yes. it only ignores it in tracking and bet selection... you still lose if it hit tho.
Quote from: ophis on Nov 23, 04:55 AM 2012
yes. it only ignores it in tracking and bet selection... you still lose if it hit though.
That is great, saves me having to make a mental note of zero losses.
Thank you very much.
Ophis,
Do you think it could be possible to have an option, something like a tick box, that allows you to link the progression if you want to play both dozens & columns.
At the moment each one has their own progression, but would be nice to play one progression for both.
Thanks
malcop
So is everyone winning with so far?
Quote from: Amazin on Nov 24, 07:32 AM 2012
So is everyone winning with so far?
yep...just use this progression and your good to go. 1,1,2,3,4,6,9,14,21,31,47,70,105,158,237 (709 chips) :thumbsup:
What's the link to the latest tracker for this please guys
Quote from: buffalowizard on Nov 24, 08:34 AM 2012
What's the link to the latest tracker for this please guys
link:s://dl.dropbox.com/u/12200022/mst_v169.zip
Thanks furple
Have you just revisited this or been playing for long time?
Instead of triplets why not bet for vertical doublets?
Use matrix x3 for recording dozens
Track for 3 *consecutive * vertical non-match doublets then commence to bet for a MATCH to occur...
(ZERO voids tracking)
Maybe use buffalowizards suggested progression:
Quote
So maybe implement a 5 step progression. If lost, then another 5 step progression aimed at mild recovery.
1 1 2 3 4 first level = 11u
2 3 4 5 6 second level = 20u
Total risk=31u
113
311
321
221
332 - trigger col3 (3 non-matches)
113
133 - win step 4 col1
123
123
321
223
323
211 - trigger col3 (3 non-matches)
123
130 - win step 4 col 1
223
323
312
212 - trigger col1 (3 non-matches) ; won step 1 col 2
132
113
311
321
221
332 - trigger col3 (3 non-matches)
113
133 - win step 4 col1
123
223
323
211 - trigger col3 (3 non-matches)
123
130 - win step 4 col1
223
323
312
212 - trigger col1 (3 non-matches) ; win step 1 col2
132
122
133
230 - trigger col1 (3 non-matches); win step 1 col2
323
312
311
113
331 - trigger col3
132 - win step 2 col2
122
133
211 - trigger col1
311 - win step 4 col2
331
231
233
212
233
232
111 - trigger col 2
231 - win step 4 col3
302
233
233
122 - trigger col 3
121 - win step 1 col1
321
221
332 - trigger col 3
303 - win step 1 col1
233
123
110
113
232 - trigger col 3
232 - win step 1 col1
111 - trigger col 3
113 - win step 1 col1
212
111
332 - trigger col1
312 - win step 1 col1
132
210
203
321
113 - trigger col3
322
131
111 - win step 7 col 1
133
323 - trigger col1 ; win step 2 col3
121
310 - trigger col2
133
111 - win step 4 col1
112
223 - trigger col 2
311
333 - win step 5 col1
332
213 - trigger col2
333 - win step 4 col3
112 - trigger col 3
211 - win step 2 col2
222
122 - trigger col1; win step 1 col2
223
333 - trigger col2; win step 1 col3
321
331
311
233 - trigger col3
133 - win step 2 col2
233
A.
I think it works fine as it is, here is a session I played this morning playing both Dozens & Columns.
Progression used: 1,1,1,1,2,2,2,2,3,3,3,3,4,4,4,4
[attach=1]
Matrix Turbo! LIVE or RNG? ???
Quote from: Face on Nov 24, 04:10 PM 2012
Matrix Turbo! LIVE or RNG? ???
I never play RNG :)
Has anyone tried to play Matrix Turbo using EC's?
Quote from: malcop on Nov 24, 04:15 PM 2012
Has anyone tried to play Matrix Turbo using ECs?
I did look into it Malcop but found that you become too often restricted and there are fewer progressions that can pull you put of a hole
Quote from: malcop on Nov 24, 04:11 PM 2012
I never play RNG :)
"I always learn something"
Quote from: buffalowizard on Nov 24, 08:55 AM 2012
Thanks furple
Have you just revisited this or been playing for long time?
I play it now and then. I prefer playing inside bets though (2-6 numbers preferably) When I do play this I like to hit it hard with an aggressive progression.
HELLO EVERYONE!
small error :)