First thing is first, systems don't work so don't use them! This is my opinion! - below is just an idea I wanted to share. it would be great if others can try it and give me their opinions.
So, I have been looking into gizmotrons reading randomness and at some of his students experiences. While I have not fully studied his approach I have been impressed by his software and how it visualises the random results thrown up by the wheel/rng. When I initially tried his approach, purely by using logical deduction I found it hard as there seems to be many parameters to consider, but as he and some of his students have achieved good win ratios, it is important to give credit where it is due.
My precog practice involves understanding as much about random as I can, from both an esoteric and mathematical viewpoints so I decided to create my own version for visualising random in excel and added some other parameters inspired by vortex math. I have spent many years thinking about random and once I saw the 'fingerprint of random' it felt intuitively right.
It would be nice if others could try the method below and let me know their results.
So in the spirit of sharing ideas, as that is the only way we can all grow....
Here is what I found.
Plot the following two parameters for each number in 37 spins.
1. The digit root of the number. This is when each digit of the number is summed to produce a single digit. i.e 32=5, 12=3, 5=5, 10=1, 29=2
2. The final digit of the number. This is the last digit of the number. i.e 12=2, 23=3, 18=8, 10=0
If you plot these numbers on a scatter chart, you will notice an interesting pattern. What I call the Fingerprint of Random.
Now contrast this to what the same scatter graph looks like when 37 spins gives us 37 unique numbers. As we know 37 unique numbers do not appear in 37 spins. If this were to ever happen, this would not be 'random' it would lose it's inherent nature of randomness.
Now that we have this chart, the question is how do we use it. What becomes apparent is that when you run the chart over many times is the following interesting phenomena.
1) Between 30 and 37 spins, either all finals would have occured or all digit roots would have occoured. This happens almost 80-90% of the time.
Knowing this I used the the following method;
1. After 10 unique spins. I plot these results on the chart. I then look for which finals or digit roots are yet to hit. I place 1 unit on these numbers. This will usually be about 10 to 12 numbers
2. I keep ploting after every spin.
3. I use a basic negative progression.
That is the purely mechanical method, and the fact I had to use a progression tells me something is not right. But it does give a slight edge.
If however we look at it from a deeper level. I see the fingerprint of random being similar to lighting or electricity. It wants to take the shortest route possible to connect the points on the chart. It almost seems like random does not want to group items together.
So the second method combines the deeper understanding of random and the facts about the finals and digits stated above. This is a more intuitive method but should be simple to understand when you see the chart. If you view the chart as a lightening bolt you will begin to visualise the path that the scatter plot will take before the 37 spins are complete.
Having said all this, I still believe and know the only way to win is precognition, this post is just an idea, it would be great if others could try and see if my hunch is correct.
If you want to see examples of this method checkout my RS games like link:s://roulette-simulator.info/en/game/63edd0a50d23710133010004d6b90ec6
Note that not all of the games follow the intuitive method they are mostly the mechinical approach.
Brilliant.
If you try to see a flow of stages where it works great and stages where it does not then you can use that information to target flat betting. I use a non bet or a virtual bet in my software charting system. So a virtual bet is like making a guess and seeing if it is working without placing money on the selection. You still get the charted result and you get a win or a loss. But if you no bet you just don't know if your guess is working at the time. I can see this as a kind of mechanical choice in your method, if you know what I mean. You can virtual bet or real bet as a flat value. So it comes down to seeing if you can see good effectiveness patches.
One of my versions of the practice software has finales. It's the 1.5 version offered in the downloads for software.
Can't wait to see what you discover.
You say systems don't work, but this idea will only ever end in a system.
It's not a bad idea, actually it's a decent idea, but I doubt it will ever really transition over to precog or similar.
So, if you are looking for system ideas then I would suggest not waiting around for 10 spins if you don't have to. This type of root/finale trigger accumulation works quite well with a GUT type strategy. Combining root & finale there are 10 possibilities, obviously. The moment 5 of these possibilities have appeared you can commence betting on the remaining 5 for a crossover. Also, systems such as this will always perform better with a well tuned progression so don't be to put off by them.
My own observations with random have concluded me to the opinion that it doesn't "want" to do anything, let alone take a shortest route. Due to this unwanting nature, there is no force or desire at work to prevent all 10 root/finale possibilities from occurring over a cycle of spins such as you have suggested, 30-37. This suits a GUT type strategy. However, 30-37 spins is a lot to get through once betting commences, hence the possible need for progression and safety brakes.
Always be mindful that random does not have an agenda, and more importantly it has no obligation to your agenda.
Here's what I would contribute as a raw system or food for thought...
(1) Wait for 5 combined root/finale appearances (shouldn't take long and if it goes 6, bump 1 off and keep waiting for the 5th one)
Bet 1 unit on the remaining 5. If win go to (2) If lose add 1 unit. If win got to (2) if lose add 1 unit. If win go to (2) if lose add 1 unit. If win go to (2) if lose add 1 unit. If win go to (2) if lose double the bet. From here keep doubling the bet until win then go to (2) or run out of money.
(2) Remove only the numbers of whichever finale appeared and repeat the above progression with the 4 remaining root/finale groups.
After a hit with stage (2) and disregarding any profit or loss, the game is now at 7 groups hit / 3 groups unhit. I would not advise pushing random any further as you will be asserting your agenda for completion of all groups.
Time to backtrack the marque for a new round and restart betting on the next 5 unhit combined root/finale groups.
On a side note and regarding Gizmo's methodology, my personal preference is to only focus on the EC chops. I tend to ignore any runs and focus my attention on how the choppy each EC group is performing. These chopping EC's create trends in themselves that suit my style of play. When no index cards are in use for the purpose of moving between tables, they are a little harder to decipher using visual dexterity, but I find their behaviour to be more stable and worth the extra effort.
Thanks for the inspiration, Gizmotron.
Quote from: Taotie on Dec 06, 06:06 AM 2019
On a side note and regarding Gizmo's methodology, my personal preference is to only focus on the EC chops. I tend to ignore any runs and focus my attention on how the choppy each EC group is performing. These chopping EC's create trends in themselves that suit my style of play. When no index cards are in use for the purpose of moving between tables, they are a little harder to decipher using visual dexterity, but I find their behaviour to be more stable and worth the extra effort.
Thanks for the inspiration, Gizmotron.
You are welcome. I love the chops too. I spent a lot of effort helping people see singles on the weak side or on one side. Perfect chop is single on one side. I can hardly ever get randomness to show me what I would like to see. It often shows me a pattern though. People can see patterns in my index card method real fast. I discovered the Specials when I wasn't even looking for them. They just happen to be 18 numbers on the double zero wheels. When I play I look for the finales and the hottest numbers while also looking at my 12 groups for anything that sticks out. But I have not bothered to teach many of my advanced skills because just getting started is hard enough for people. All I do is add each spin to my index card charts. I look for patterns in the finales and for any hottest number or two.
Here is the thing about using trends. When they work, and while they are working, they give me a map of the semblance of prediction working. I know it is not really predicting anything. It just looks like it is out of coincidence. So that gives me a relation or capacity to find working trends somewhere in my charts. Not all trends end when I bet on them. That's the trick to all this. You find a time when more trends continue at least one more spin than when there is a swarm of next spin endings. That's all there is to this. Because my primary goal is to whittle away at these chances one step at a time a progression is not useful to me. Yet, even by best looking steps in swarms a progression could be used. My goal is three net wins. That's hard enough.
Good luck tweaking anything that you can use from this. It's to be expected. It's out there in the public domain. It will be fun to see what comes from it all.
Quote from: gizmotron2 on Dec 06, 04:57 AM 2019
Brilliant.
If you try to see a flow of stages where it works great and stages where it does not then you can use that information to target flat betting. I use a non bet or a virtual bet in my software charting system. So a virtual bet is like making a guess and seeing if it is working without placing money on the selection. You still get the charted result and you get a win or a loss. But if you no bet you just don't know if your guess is working at the time. I can see this as a kind of mechanical choice in your method, if you know what I mean. You can virtual bet or real bet as a flat value. So it comes down to seeing if you can see good effectiveness patches.
One of my versions of the practice software has finales. It's the 1.5 version offered in the downloads for software.
Can't wait to see what you discover.
Yes that is the version of the software I used.
I like your idea about finding the bigger stages, so I applied a moving average to indicate whether the product of finales and digit roots would be higher or lower. This actually proved helpful to decide which areas to focus on.
I also experimented with the limits of the progression I could use. I think the mechanical approach definitely needs some boundaries (stop loss) otherwise as with all progression you will always find that nasty senario where all your bankroll is used.
I am still not sure how to use virtual bets effectively, will the virtual bet give me any new information? any ideas?
Quote from: Taotie on Dec 06, 05:48 AM 2019
You say systems don't work, but this idea will only ever end in a system.
It's not a bad idea, actually it's a decent idea, but I doubt it will ever really transition over to precog or similar.
So, if you are looking for system ideas then I would suggest not waiting around for 10 spins if you don't have to. This type of root/finale trigger accumulation works quite well with a GUT type strategy. Combining root & finale there are 10 possibilities, obviously. The moment 5 of these possibilities have appeared you can commence betting on the remaining 5 for a crossover. Also, systems such as this will always perform better with a well tuned progression so don't be to put off by them.
My own observations with random have concluded me to the opinion that it doesn't "want" to do anything, let alone take a shortest route. Due to this unwanting nature, there is no force or desire at work to prevent all 10 root/finale possibilities from occurring over a cycle of spins such as you have suggested, 30-37. This suits a GUT type strategy. However, 30-37 spins is a lot to get through once betting commences, hence the possible need for progression and safety brakes.
Always be mindful that random does not have an agenda, and more importantly it has no obligation to your agenda.
Here's what I would contribute as a raw system or food for thought...
(1) Wait for 5 combined root/finale appearances (shouldn't take long and if it goes 6, bump 1 off and keep waiting for the 5th one)
Bet 1 unit on the remaining 5. If win go to (2) If lose add 1 unit. If win got to (2) if lose add 1 unit. If win go to (2) if lose add 1 unit. If win go to (2) if lose add 1 unit. If win go to (2) if lose double the bet. From here keep doubling the bet until win then go to (2) or run out of money.
(2) Remove only the numbers of whichever finale appeared and repeat the above progression with the 4 remaining root/finale groups.
After a hit with stage (2) and disregarding any profit or loss, the game is now at 7 groups hit / 3 groups unhit. I would not advise pushing random any further as you will be asserting your agenda for completion of all groups.
Time to backtrack the marque for a new round and restart betting on the next 5 unhit combined root/finale groups.
Some interesting ideas. What I do not like is the idea of using progression as I see this as a crutch. But you maybe right that it is unavoidable in these situations.
I've tried to follow your instructions; have a look at the game link:s://roulette-simulator.info/en/game/303055230808c56376be28a2d4da3ee0 is this roughly correct?
Quote from: precogmiles on Dec 06, 01:06 PM 2019I am still not sure how to use virtual bets effectively, will the virtual bet give me any new information? any ideas?
Just enter 0 into the times box where you see 5 at the top. Then go ahead and make selections. This will report the results on the left column with a "X-" for a virtual win or " -" for a virtual loss. Then you go back to your flat bet or your progression bet. You can then see swarms of lost guesses versus swarms of wins. You can also see chaos. When you look at the graph you will see flat, horizontal, lines for virtual bets.
Quote from: Taotie on Dec 06, 05:48 AM 2019
...
Always be mindful that random does not have an agenda, and more importantly it has no obligation to your agenda.
...
Random May have an agenda.
Quote from: Kali49 on Dec 06, 04:27 PM 2019
Random May have an agenda.
It does. It's always out to get you. It specifically targets you because of the dark side forces. You must use the Force grasshopper.
Quote from: gizmotron2 on Dec 06, 02:22 PM 2019
Just enter 0 into the times box where you see 5 at the top. Then go ahead and make selections. This will report the results on the left column with a "X-" for a virtual win or " -" for a virtual loss. Then you go back to your flat bet or your progression bet. You can then see swarms of lost guesses versus swarms of wins. You can also see chaos. When you look at the graph you will see flat, horizontal, lines for virtual bets.
Thanks, I think I understand why virtual bets would be useful.
Quote from: precogmiles on Dec 06, 01:21 PM 2019What I do not like is the idea of using progression as I see this as a crutch. But you maybe right that it is unavoidable in these situations.
What I posted was an off the cuff idea, and only supposed to help with brainstorming your thread. I would agree progressions are not well liked, and probably it is best not to double up in martingale fashion under any circumstances.
I've been doing some more research and as with all systems it fails over longer runs, using the mechanical approach. You have to use a progression to win using it. But again using a progression is a recipe for disaster.
However there is something interesting about the chart.
Stick with precog. I should develop myself as well. That is the only way to win other than AP.
I had a lucky run with reading randomness and believed it is good stuff, but eventually with more testing I found out it is just not what I thought.
I believe gambling to work long term should be positive and fun and not a chore.
Any bet selection that relies on past patterns to win in the future are just nonsense created by the rational mind.
Quote from: Kairomancer on Dec 07, 04:21 PM 2019
Stick with precog. I should develop myself as well. That is the only way to win other than AP.
I had a lucky run with reading randomness and believed it is good stuff, but eventually with more testing I found out it is just not what I thought.
I believe gambling to work long term should be positive and fun and not a chore.
Any bet selection that relies on past patterns to win in the future are just nonsense created by the rational mind.
I agree, using past results to predict future outcomes with something as random as roulette is delusional.
My next aim is to compare the results from the chart with my precognition, as I believe there is something interesting in the way the plot appears on the chart.
Quote from: Kairomancer on Dec 07, 04:21 PM 2019
Stick with precog. I should develop myself as well. That is the only way to win other than AP.
I had a lucky run with reading randomness and believed it is good stuff, but eventually with more testing I found out it is just not what I thought.
I believe gambling to work long term should be positive and fun and not a chore.
Any bet selection that relies on past patterns to win in the future are just nonsense created by the rational mind.
Have you been practicing regularly lately?
Of course gizmotron would argue that RR is based on present coincidences as it happens and effectiveness states.
The problem with his method that very often it seems like a pattern is forming, but when you bet on it it fails to continue or shift into something else. It happens just enough times to balance out the winning patterns in the long run, but the house edge clearly not helps.
Also there is no such thing as universal effectiveness states, because he plays different patterns on different data streams, so it is useless.
The only thing you can track is your luck with patterns. You are either lucky and winning or losing, but because he cut his losses at only 7 units there is not enough data to be useful. There are spikes all over in the sections of the graphs, they could move anywhere at any point.
Also global effect is just common caracteristic of data streams of random and as useless as any past patterns or the Law of the third.
Quote from: precogmiles on Dec 07, 06:34 PM 2019
Have you been practicing regularly lately?
Nope. My life is full of stress negativity and mess up at the moment.
I have to amend the sources of stress first.
That is why I experimenting with systems.
On the good side I saved up a healthy bankroll.
Quote from: Kairomancer on Dec 07, 06:52 PM 2019
Nope. My life is full of stress negativity and mess up at the moment.
I have to amend the sources of stress first.
That is why I experimenting with systems.
On the good side I saved up a healthy bankroll.
Well good luck, I wish you all the best.
I definitely believe precog is the only way. I just did a practice run of my precog skills and I was more succuessful in terms of win ratio than I was wasting my time on this system. Precog is without a doubt the best approach.
Thanks. Good luck. More success awaiting you as well.
It was not a waste of time. Sometimes it takes effort to clear the distractions, so we can refocus and secure our main course.
Quote from: Kairomancer on Dec 07, 06:43 PM 2019Also global effect is just common caracteristic of data streams of random and as useless as any past patterns or the Law of the third.
Every Global Effect I ever saw I massacred the casino while it continued. It's like a green light comes on and the same characteristic lasts for hours.
Thanks for trying it out. That was a lot of work.
(link:://%5B/url)
Quote from: precogmiles on Dec 06, 01:21 PM 2019I've tried to follow your instructions; have a look at the game link:s://roulette-simulator.info/en/game/303055230808c56376be28a2d4da3ee0 is this roughly correct?
Not correct, way off actually.
I have created an account on rsim and played an example session so anyone interested can dissect the game and see how to play what I suggested.
Only difference being that instead of pushing on with a double up, I increase the stakes by 1 unit after any lost round until back in profit with a new bankroll high.
Ignore my other game, I made a blunder so cashed out of that one.
link:s://roulette-simulator.info/en/game/5790326f367fd5038a489a11dea2372a (link:s://roulette-simulator.info/en/game/5790326f367fd5038a489a11dea2372a)
Quote from: Taotie on Dec 07, 09:14 PM 2019
Not correct, way off actually.
I have created an account on rsim and played an example session so anyone interested can dissect the game and see how to play what I suggested.
Only difference being that instead of pushing on with a double up, I increase the stakes by 1 unit after any lost round until back in profit with a new bankroll high.
Ignore my other game, I made a blunder so cashed out of that one.
Interesting, Would be good to see it tested over more spins.
I played another game and will try to play a few more out of curiosity, but I don't have time to do exhaustive testing on this.
Maybe I should pay ignatus to code it in RX just to see?
Here's a twist, I've been doing this a long time so I'm pretty good at churning out systems to the point where I don't have to think too much into it at all. They usually turn out just as good and strong as methods created over extended time and input.
It is feasible that for me, a level of intuition is involved in blurting out these playable systems.
Out of curiosity, next time I go to the casino I might try getting in the zone (cactus juice works well for me) then blurting out a system to play for the night or a few spins with low stakes. A whole other level of precognition... could be fun.
Quote from: Taotie on Dec 07, 11:46 PM 2019I've been doing this a long time so I'm pretty good at churning out systems to the point where I don't have to think too much into it at all. They usually turn out just as good and strong as methods created over extended time and input.
Taotie, so what in your opinion and experience separates a good system from a mediocre or bad one? What advice would you give to any aspiring system designer?
Quote from: Taotie on Dec 07, 11:46 PM 2019
Out of curiosity, next time I go to the casino I might try getting in the zone (cactus juice works well for me) then blurting out a system to play for the night or a few spins with low stakes. A whole other level of precognition... could be fun.
You never know you might have a natural talent.
Following intuition has a better chance to win than treating random numbers like horses in a race. One might work, the other definitely doesn't work.
Quote from: Steve on Dec 08, 04:30 PM 2019
Following intuition has a better chance to win than treating random numbers like horses in a race. One might work, the other definitely doesn't work.
Yes this is very true. It is that logical mind that wants to create patterns and apply logic to everything.
I think the whole point of random is being chaotic and unpredictable by logic.
If you can apply logic to successfully predict better than random guesses then it fails to be random anymore.
Random do not adheres to any theories.