Vdw does not help with roulette because the next spin can still do whatever it wants
That being said
Someone explain to me HOW vdw or AP helps choose bets.
Exactly. It hasn't canged anyhing.
What's even more irritating is that everyone ignores the fact that there also is 0/00, which totally changes everything in an AP.
All people need to see is this:
(link:s://i.imgur.com/wPviveW.png)
It is only for non-zero roulette or baccarat
Quote from: celescliff on Sep 07, 02:15 AM 2017
It is only for non-zero roulette or baccarat
No it's not because you can use AP to bet on just single numbers if you like. (or any location for that matter)
So many guys get caught up on the first step of AP when in reality it is just like teaching a kid to count to 5 and don't bother to look at the wider picture. :-[
Hi wiggy,
Quote from: wiggy on Sep 07, 03:27 AM 2017
you can use AP to bet on just single numbers if you like. (or any location for that matter)
Maybe you call this above a second step.
The wider picture contains a huge amount of possible steps.
Most interesting would be of coarse one with just as even little advantage against the HE.
So maybe you show us a direction to go.
Quote from: celescliff on Sep 07, 02:15 AM 2017
What's even more irritating is that everyone ignores the fact that there also is 0/00, which totally changes everything in an AP.
Just one kind of logic of
theoretical view:
First find something with a little advantage.
Only when this is found then surely it's necessary to consider the zero('s).
From this view it makes a lot of sense first to omit the zero's.
Herby
Did you ever download the cycles chart from Pryanka's 'random thoughts' thread. She showed how the cycles repeat roughly 63% of the time.
example....
24=doz 2
36=doz 3
15=doz 2 (2)
19=doz 2 (1)......so a repeat on the doz 2 cycle.
Think about how you can improve this 63% percentage? How could you get it happening more to improve your chances of an AP happening.
wiggy,
Thanks for the answer.
I programmed this cycle examples and can use it for any kind of cycles (dozen,quads, H/l,..).
Just remembering: the higher hitrate is payed with the longer cycle length.
I'll have a look at it again
Quote from: wiggy on Sep 07, 03:27 AM 2017
No it's not because you can use AP to bet on just single numbers if you like. (or any location for that matter)
So many guys get caught up on the first step of AP when in reality it is just like teaching a kid to count to 5 and don't bother to look at the wider picture. :-[
For you to support that claim, how much have you tested your way of playing this theorem?
Quote from: Herby on Sep 07, 04:00 AM 2017
Just one kind of logic of theoretical view:
First find something with a little advantage.
Only when this is found then surely it's necessary to consider the zero('s).
From this view it makes a lot of sense first to omit the zero's.
But it doesent.
Why not include the zero(s) right from the beginning? Its a waste otherwise.
Quote from: celescliff on Sep 07, 02:15 AM 2017
It is only for non-zero roulette or baccarat
I agree with you.
My own testing of applying standard VDW to EC bets (using my own data sets of actual dealer-spun wheels and also airball wheels) leads me to the same conclusion (at least as of now).
Quote from: celescliff on Sep 07, 05:22 AM 2017
For you to support that claim, how much have you tested your way of playing this theorem?
celescliff
Without really knowing what I was doing, I was already kind of using AP on the EC's around 18/24 months ago because of my interest in the pairs...(RR,RB,BB,BR) Then I advanced to breaking them down and betting them as 9 numbers (pretty similar really to what MONEYT101 is suggesting now) Then I studied the 'Random Thoughts' thread and couldn't get all the cycle stuff at first. But I did work out a unique way to use the PHP principle and incorporate it with multiple streams. Having spent a lot of time going over everything again, I finally got the cycle idea. I can bet whatever location takes my fancy, however I prefer the streets because I think the 11/1 payout is a nice balance and not too greedy. win-max has a lot of good stats for the different locations and as Nicksmi rightly says....'use the maths AND the stats'.
You didn't ask for my life story :xd: However I hope anybody reading what I just wrote understands it isn't just coming overnight and takes a lot of work and re-visiting of ideas as you move along. I am fortunate in a way that I have had plenty of time to study, think and test all the ideas/concepts that are getting discussed. It could take someone else a lot longer and they could get frustrated and give up.
Wiggy
You know i'm FOBT player, where you see Woodpeckers, i like that term, as good as plasterers, but can you use the FOBT or do you not trust in them.
I believe in them to be fair as like Winkel said the LOTT should be there and it is
Hello Notto,
I remember years ago that if two separate players pressed the spin button at the same time on a FOBT terminal, the same number would appear because it comes from an external server. That supposedly doesn't happen anymore. Not sure why they would have changed it......but it makes you wonder. If I am in the bookies, I will sometimes put a couple of quid into the 100/1 roulette and just play the 9 or 10 numbers that are already on the screen. The woodpeckers and plasterers are still bang at it...lol.
Great avi/pic wiggy.
Yeah they just bash away.
Even on baccarat I don't see it working
Can someone explain?
Legitimately looking for an explanation
Quote from: RouletteGhost on Sep 07, 07:51 AM 2017
Even on baccarat I don't see it working
Can someone explain?
Legitimately looking for an explanation
Rich,
Go over to betselection.cc (don't see your name there nowadays !) and read ADulay's posts. He has a dozen of them spread all over their VDW thread.
He has had success in applying VDW to baccarat (he made some minor modifications of his own in applying it).
Here is the thread in question -- specifically focus on ADulay's posts:
link:://betselection.cc/roulette-forum/use-math-to-beat-roulettebaccarat/
If you really want to be able to beat roulette, you have to investigate if you can create a bet that depends on the RESULT of a previous bet. Please note: this might just as well be a virtual bet.
Will read this after work today
Aren't we still in a position where we can bet on multiple AP and still lose?
I'm just missing the puzzle piece that tells me how this helps choosing bets.
Quote from: RouletteGhost on Sep 07, 08:51 AM 2017
Will read this after work today
Aren't we still in a position where we can bet on multiple AP and still lose?
I'm just missing the puzzle piece that tells me how this helps choosing bets.
You face the prospect of mutual bets towards the end of of a 9-spin series (especially on spin 9).
When you face that dilemma, do NOT bet and just accept a loss for that series (assuming you had not won a bet earlier on in that series and were losing that series at that point).
I don't think rigid flat betting will work.
To make it work, you will need to use a mild progression.
link:://betselection.cc/roulette-forum/use-math-to-beat-roulettebaccarat/
link:://betselection.cc/baccarat-forum/g3m1-with-vdwap/
Quote from: DoctorSudoku on Sep 07, 08:58 AM 2017
You face the prospect of mutual bets towards the end of of a 9-spin series (especially on spin 9).
When you face that dilemma, do NOT bet and just accept a loss for that series (assuming you had not won a bet earlier on in that series and were losing that series at that point).
So is it that we only bet on the 9th spin
Sorry just want a little foundation knowledge before I dive in
Quote from: RouletteGhost on Sep 07, 09:05 AM 2017
So is it that we only bet on the 9th spin
Sorry just want a little foundation knowledge before I dive in
No, you do your betting on earlier spins of that series -- as long as VDW tells you to bet
on one specific side only -- either Banker or Player.
Any time you face the prospect of mutual bets (usually on spin 9, but occasionally on 7 and 8 as well), just skip that bet and accept a loss for that series (if you were indeed losing that series at that point).
Quote from: RouletteGhost on Sep 07, 09:05 AM 2017
So is it that we only bet on the 9th spin
Sorry just want a little foundation knowledge before I dive in
AP's that form on spins 3-6 have only one bet option, spins 7-9 might have one or mutual bet options.
Ok I'm beginning to structure this in my head
What is this about a guaranteed win?
Quote from: RouletteGhost on Sep 07, 09:25 AM 2017
Ok I'm beginning to structure this in my head
What is this about a guaranteed win?
There is no guaranteed win in roulette.
In life, there are only two things that are guaranteed: income tax and death.
Quote from: wiggy on Sep 07, 05:58 AM 2017
celescliff
Without really knowing what I was doing, I was already kind of using AP on the EC's around 18/24 months ago because of my interest in the pairs...(RR,RB,BB,BR) Then I advanced to breaking them down and betting them as 9 numbers (pretty similar really to what MONEYT101 is suggesting now) Then I studied the 'Random Thoughts' thread and couldn't get all the cycle stuff at first. But I did work out a unique way to use the PHP principle and incorporate it with multiple streams. Having spent a lot of time going over everything again, I finally got the cycle idea. I can bet whatever location takes my fancy, however I prefer the streets because I think the 11/1 payout is a nice balance and not too greedy. win-max has a lot of good stats for the different locations and as Nicksmi rightly says....'use the maths AND the stats'.
You didn't ask for my life story :xd: However I hope anybody reading what I just wrote understands it isn't just coming overnight and takes a lot of work and re-visiting of ideas as you move along. I am fortunate in a way that I have had plenty of time to study, think and test all the ideas/concepts that are getting discussed. It could take someone else a lot longer and they could get frustrated and give up.
Congratulations my friend!
I agree only those that read and go back to the information will find it. There is a way to beat the GAME, you just have to want it bad enough to search.
Quote from: celescliff on Sep 07, 05:22 AM 2017
But it doesent.
Why not include the zero(s) right from the beginning? Its a waste otherwise.
The zero will not let you see the information properly. Once you understand the data then add the zero. The solution to the zero is very easy!
Think about this, if you found a way to win more then you lose each spin, with more then 1 unit. Would you mind putting a unit on zero?
I'm sure you wont! So stop worrying about zero and worry about winning
So with baccarat we will have several AP opportunities in 9 tries but we can miss them all because it's still a guess
??
Quote from: MoneyT101 on Sep 07, 11:11 AM 2017
Congratulations my friend!
I agree only those that read and go back to the information will find it. There is a way to beat the GAME, you just have to want it bad enough to search.
The ONLY way to beat casino games consistently is to use probability together with situational statistics in a unique way to force PhP work in favour of the bets, it can be overwhelming. I don't know of any other way.
Note: VdW theorem is not necessary.
On the surface it looks to me that VDW is as good as saying "in 3 spins a color must repeat" or "in 4 spins a dozen must repeat"
So I will form further opinions after I read the bet selection thread
It seems to me that the next spin follows no math at all
Here's the basic tool I use to test out VdW theorem. Not perfect(does not handle the zero well) but workable. Play around this MultiTracker with the F9 key. Paste real spins in column A instead of random numbers. If you do find something interesting, share it with me.
I've spent a lot of time on this reading about arithmetic progression and my conclusion and opinion is that doesn't increase accuracy of bets.
There's no difference saying red will come up 50% over the long run... It's just a ilusion...
After reading almost all the content on arithmetic progression, and almost all the posts, I came to a conclusion: There is no system that will win long term.
The game has been around for centuries and I believe all tests have been done over the years by mathematicians around the world. So it seems like we're trying to reinvent the wheel.
Yes, efficient systems exist in wich we can take advantage of that, but we will never be able to challenge math.
The best thing to do is to use the combination of an efficient system together with an efficient strategy as well.
Everything I learned leads me to think that way.
If there was an unbeatable system, we would be at that moment enjoying life with expansive cars, beautiful women and a big mansion... If there was an infallible system, we would not have been in this forum for years searching for the golden pot.
Quote from: Andre Chass on Sep 07, 01:29 PM 2017
Everything I learned leads me to think that way.
If there was an unbeatable system, we would be at that moment enjoying life with expansive cars, beautiful women and a big mansion... If there was an infallible system, we would not have been in this forum for years searching for the golden pot.
It's funny how certain ppl are saying there is a way to win and sharing information to investigate and you come and post this and then saying you are reading the forum.
More like skimming... I said it more then once vdw won't help unless you apply it different.
Wiggy shared some solid info, 3nine shared some solid info, cht shared some solid info
But everyone still asking about vdw and talking about something that has nothing to do with what should be of interest
F**king 🤡 'S
😂😂😂😂😂
Quote from: MoneyT101 on Sep 07, 01:54 PM 2017
It's funny how certain ppl are saying there is a way to win and sharing information to investigate and you come and post this and then saying you are reading the forum.
More like skimming... I said it more then once vdw won't help unless you apply it different.
Wiggy shared some solid info, 3nine shared some solid info, cht shared some solid info
But everyone still asking about vdw and talking about something that has nothing to do with what should be of interest
F**king 🤡 'S
😂😂😂😂😂u
"Yes, efficient systems exist in wich we can take advantage of that"
Did you read that?
Calm down man. You have to respect different opinions...
Quote from: RouletteGhost on Sep 07, 12:42 PM 2017
On the surface it looks to me that VDW is as good as saying "in 3 spins a color must repeat" or "in 4 spins a dozen must repeat"
RouletteGhost, I think you are confusing VdW and Pigeonhole Principle, each is a separate idea.
link:s://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pigeonhole_principle
link:s://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_der_Waerden's_theorem
to quote from wikipedia
"the pigeonhole principle states that if n items are put into m containers, with n > m, then at least one container must contain more than one item"
this pigeonhole principle is what you are showing in your statement "in 3 spins a color must repeat" or "in 4 spins a dozen must repeat"
Hope this helps you
That's the best non random system these days...
You are parlaying these steps and looking for a double win before you revert back to the 1st step.
1=4 +3
1=4 +2
2=8 +4
2=8 +2
3=12 +3
4=16 +3
5=20 +2
7=28 +3
9=36 +2
12=48 +2
16=64 +2
22=88 +4
29=116 +3
39=156 +4
52=208 +4
69=276 +3
92=368 +3
123=492 +4
BANKROLL = 488.
Take the 4 different e.c's.
RR RB BB BR, OO OE EE EO, LL LH HH HL.
Wait for 14 (28 spins) times to see one of these groups not appear and then attack it.
Let me ask something!
We don't no where the AP will form.
It will form on the 3rd spin, 4th spin, 5th spin, 6th spin, 7th spin, 8th, spin or 9th spin.
If you play RB, then it absolutely has to form on one of those spins.
So a 7 step martingale should never lose?
Quote from: Andre Chass on Sep 07, 08:36 PM 2017So a 7 step martingale should never lose?
You will have 3 or 4 LLLL in a row to wipe your bankroll.
Quote from: praline on Sep 07, 08:49 PM 2017
You will have 3 or 4 LLLL in a row to wipe your bankroll.
So I don't know how to play and win using this system.
I have read a lot about it and I can not understand what advantage it brings.
It seems I'm not the only one.
Could you explain it to me?
Quote from: DoctorSudoku on Sep 07, 08:58 AM 2017
You face the prospect of mutual bets towards the end of of a 9-spin series (especially on spin 9).
When you face that dilemma, do NOT bet and just accept a loss for that series (assuming you had not won a bet earlier on in that series and were losing that series at that point).
What I'm understanding is that I'll not use martingale and stop after some losses? What's mutual bets?
Quote from: Andre Chass on Sep 07, 09:07 PM 2017Could you explain it to me?
I wish i could...
One priyanka's post is always in my mind, something like:
"If you observed, in case of ec, vdw is nothing but bet the dominant, if your selection is not dominant you will have a dead lock"
Quote from: praline on Sep 07, 10:19 PM 2017
if your selection is not dominant you will have a dead lock"
This is what winkel posted in his system. He showed how to pick a side.
The deadlock just makes the game back to random, it can be either or.
But if you look at the information with another view then you just pick a side!
This is where the parallel game comes in; to help with the decision on which side to bet.
The only way to win at casino games is to remove the gamble in the gambling.
If you gamble, you're a loser 100%.
To me there're 5 critical conditions that must be adhered to that might take the gamble out of gambling for a low risk, consistent winnable play -
1. Flatbet : I have said this from day1. If your method can't win flatbet you don't have a winnable method.
2. Risk : The risk has to be defined for every bet opportunity. It must be quantified against br, it must be exact.
3. Bankroll : It has to be small. If your method can't survive whatever drawdowns you don't have a winnable method.
4. Mechanical : If you are guessing, you're gambling.
5. "It is the nature of roulette to provide short cycles of opportunity with which, if we are alert and well prepared, we can take advantage of with a small short term edge, and step aside before the inexorable correction takes place."
esoito said a very reputable, professional player posted that many years ago. People can't imagine how small that window of opportunity is. Very, very, very small.
See that bolded red, it tells us this window of opportunity comes unannounced for a couple of spins then normal chaos returns. This is not the typical 'hit and run' or 'short term' play.
You want to have this proper mindset that you can't beat casino games KO/TKO style, not possible. You win small bites at a time. The small wins add up to the target you pursue itlr.
When you read people say they made 100+k in one killing session, know that they got lucky. They might lose this amount just the same. I've seen this whale bet 20-30k per hand, won 1.5million. The crowd followed him and his bets, he's the gambling god for a while. Then the tables turned, he lost back 2.2million all this in 3 weeks - this guy can afford the loss, it's play money to him.
If you gamble, gamble with small change that you'll lose to the casino for the cost of fun and entertainment the casino provides you.
If you play to win, don't gamble. Play with casino money always.
cht
Quote from: Andre Chass on Sep 07, 09:22 PM 2017
What's mutual bets?
A mutual bet is a situation where for the next spin, you can get 2 separate APs forming -- but one can be formed by B and the other by R.
Ignoring the 0/00, you know with absolute certainty that one of the 2 APs will form, but you don't for sure which one.
Here is an example -- let's say for the first seven spins you get:
1 B
2 B
3 R
4 R
5 B
6 R
7 B
8
Now, ignoring the 0/00, you will for sure get one of the following two APs completed on the eighth (next) spin:
The 2 5 8 if B shows up.
Or
The 4 6 8 if R shows up.
That is a mutual bet situation -- either the B or the R will definitely complete an AP.
So which one will you bet?
There is no clear SINGLE choice for the next spin.
One other point: the mutual bet situation in general shows up on either spins 7, 8, or 9.
Quote from: DoctorSudoku on Sep 07, 11:32 PM 2017
A mutual bet is a situation where for the next spin, you can get 2 separate APs forming -- but one can be formed by B and the other by R.
Ignoring the 0/00, you know with absolute certainty that one of the 2 APs will form, but you don't for sure which one.
Here is an example -- let's say for the first seven spins you get:
1 B
2 B
3 R
4 R
5 B
6 R
7 B
8
Now, ignoring the 0/00, you will for sure get one of the following two APs completed on the eighth (next) spin:
The 2 5 8 if B shows up.
Or
The 4 6 8 if R shows up.
That is a mutual bet situation -- either the B or the R will definitely complete an AP.
So which one will you bet?
There is no clear SINGLE choice for the next spin.
So doc, as its mutual for spin 8, you sit it out, is that correct, and still have B for spin 9.
Not that bothered Doc as i've better chance just watching, the you know what.
Quote from: DoctorSudoku on Sep 07, 11:32 PM 2017
A mutual bet is a situation where for the next spin, you can get 2 separate APs forming -- but one can be formed by B and the other by R.
Ignoring the 0/00, you know with absolute certainty that one of the 2 APs will form, but you don't for sure which one.
Here is an example -- let's say for the first seven spins you get:
1 B
2 B
3 R
4 R
5 B
6 R
7 B
8
Now, ignoring the 0/00, you will for sure get one of the following two APs completed on the eighth (next) spin:
The 2 5 8 if B shows up.
Or
The 4 6 8 if R shows up.
That is a mutual bet situation -- either the B or the R will definitely complete an AP.
So which one will you bet?
There is no clear SINGLE choice for the next spin.
Oh, now I understand!
This factor makes the game random
But what if we use the martingale from the beginning and do not bet this time. Just wait the B or R (the mutual bet) show up and after it come back to the game
Quote from: nottophammer on Sep 08, 02:11 AM 2017
So doc, as its mutual for spin 8, you sit it out, is that correct, and still have B for spin 9.
Nottop,
What happens for the 9th spin (since that was your question) ?
Well, surprisingly, the situation will remain muddled. We will still have a
mutual bet scenario for spin 9 regardless of what happens at spin 8 ! Let's analyze:
Scenario 1: If spin 8 was B, then we have1 B
2 B
3 R
4 R
5 B
6 R
7 B
8 B
9
In which case, you will think of betting B for spin 9 in order to complete the three APs of 7 8 9, 5 7 9, and 1 5 9.
However, the AP of 3 6 9 can also be completed by betting instead on R !!
So you have a mutual bet situation at spin 9 if spin 8 was B.
Scenario 2: If spin 8 was R, then we have1 B
2 B
3 R
4 R
5 B
6 R
7 B
8 R
9
In which case, you will think of betting R for spin 9 in order to complete the AP of 3 6 9.
But you can also complete both the APs of 1 5 9 and 5 7 9 by betting instead on B !!
So again you have a mutual bet situation for spin 9 if spin 8 was R.
To summarize:
Regardless of what you get for spin 8 -- B or R -- it is inevitable that spin 9 will be a mutual bet for the above
specific example ! There is no way to avoid it !
Thanks for that doc, but there is one way for me to avoid it, like i had done up till now, that is dont use it.
So from all that I have read and seen so far it remains essentially a guessing game.
There's nothing about non random game.
And the winkel system doesn't change nothing. He only put the 9th to 4th.
Quote from: nottophammer on Sep 08, 03:21 AM 2017
Thanks for that doc, but there is one way for me to avoid it, like i had done up till now, that is dont use it.
I'm out of it too!!!
Van der Waerden's Theorem will not convert the random casino games to non-random, that's a ludicrous suggestion. The next guy who mentions supposed non-random play must have gone nuts!
I gave it a try and i think it doesn't work long term. The mutual bets killed me...
I tested winkel method too in more than 200 spins....
Needed more tests to be done
Hi Andre
"The mutual bets killed me..."
Here's a suggestion, don't play your VDW system if it has a Mutual Bet, then they will never kill you. Design your bet selection to never have a Mutual Bet, that should improve your results.
Cheers
Nick
Quote from: Nickmsi on Sep 08, 02:10 PM 2017
Hi Andre
"The mutual bets killed me..."
Here's a suggestion, don't play your VDW system if it has a Mutual Bet, then they will never kill you. Design your bet selection to never have a Mutual Bet, that should improve your results.
Cheers
Nick
Now you have my interest
How is this done
Have a look at this RG
An AP can form as long as you have two opposites. So for example: RED/BLACK, ODD/EVEN, LOW/HIGH.
Now suppose next to the EC that appears, we mark down if it is the same as the previous EC which appeared or different.
Let's use SAME for a repeat EC and DIFFERENT if it changes to the opposite EC. After all, SAME/DIFFERENT are opposites and an AP will form every 9 spins using these two just the same as if you were using RED/BLACK etc.
What you will also notice is how it handles the 'terrible two's' nicely. Instead of losing 4 units before the mutual win on the 9th spin, a win was achieved on spin 6 with an AP of 135 on the DIFFERENT. So the advice is when marking like this, just play for the DIFFERENT and not the SAME. Of course there is nothing to stop you running a few different streams.
Sounds smart, but doesn't effect that other AP's?
Quote from: wiggy on Sep 08, 04:53 PM 2017
Of course there is nothing to stop you running a few different streams.
Wiggy, thanks for your input. One aspect that confuses me is "stream". What do you mean by the word stream.
Stringbean, by other streams, I just mean you could run the original version alongside this variant.
RayManZ, in my testing of this way, I noticed the variance was less severe although admittedly there are fewer bets. Maybe someone could run some long tests and compare the two ways of play.
Quote from: RouletteGhost on Sep 08, 04:23 PM 2017
Now you have my interest
How is this done
Two ways I can think of -
1. Last bet at spin six restart next spin, or
2. Last bet b4 mutual bet restart after mutual bet
What about betting against an AP. Everytime
Is there a way to simulate thousands of spins to see if this system is really reliable?
I've tested about 200 rounds but it's not enough. I get practically 50/50 using winkel system.
Someone could simulate in a Excel spreadsheet several spins and after that analyze how many wins and how many losses there would be using the winkel system. I do not know how to do it...
And I don't know if there's a software to do it.
Hi RG, CHT
There are 256 patterns starting with R and 256 starting with B.
To avoid the mutual bet, try playing only one side.
Cheers
Nick
Quote from: Nickmsi on Sep 08, 09:18 PM 2017
try playing only one side.
Thank you for your attention but I do not understand.
Quote from: Nickmsi on Sep 08, 09:18 PM 2017
Hi RG, CHT
There are 256 patterns starting with R and 256 starting with B.
To avoid the mutual bet, try playing only one side.
Cheers
Nick
So let's say you decide to play high low
Choose only one and play for the AP?
I got it
That's good idea!
Only B or only R
Quote from: Nickmsi on Sep 08, 09:18 PM 2017
Hi RG, CHT
There are 256 patterns starting with R and 256 starting with B.
To avoid the mutual bet, try playing only one side.
Cheers
Nick
Mr Nick
Did you already tested it?
Quote from: nottophammer on Sep 08, 03:21 AM 2017
Thanks for that doc, but there is one way for me to avoid it, like i had done up till now, that is dont use it.
Quote from: Andre Chass on Sep 08, 03:31 AM 2017
I'm out of it too!!!
didn't last long, then
Quote from: wiggy on Sep 08, 04:53 PM 2017
Have a look at this RG
An AP can form as long as you have two opposites. So for example: RED/BLACK, ODD/EVEN, LOW/HIGH.
Now suppose next to the EC that appears, we mark down if it is the same as the previous EC which appeared or different.
Let's use SAME for a repeat EC and DIFFERENT if it changes to the opposite EC. After all, SAME/DIFFERENT are opposites and an AP will form every 9 spins using these two just the same as if you were using RED/BLACK etc.
What you will also notice is how it handles the 'terrible two's' nicely. Instead of losing 4 units before the mutual win on the 9th spin, a win was achieved on spin 6 with an AP of 135 on the DIFFERENT. So the advice is when marking like this, just play for the DIFFERENT and not the SAME. Of course there is nothing to stop you running a few different streams.
Option1 - separate, option2 - link
Quote from: Nickmsi on Sep 08, 09:18 PM 2017
Hi RG, CHT
There are 256 patterns starting with R and 256 starting with B.
To avoid the mutual bet, try playing only one side.
Cheers
Nick
It does not work. Let's say you're only going to bet on red.
R B R B B B B B B B B
no way
An AP will not form in 9 spins playing only one side.
Quote from: cht on Sep 08, 05:53 PM 2017
Two ways I can think of -
1. Last bet at spin six restart next spin, or
2. Last bet b4 mutual bet restart after mutual bet
I think it's the best way
Thanks
Quote from: Andre Chass on Sep 09, 03:12 PM 2017
It does not work. Let's say you're only going to bet on red.
R B R B B B B B B B B
no way
Good counterexample.
Unless you want to convert the VDW into a standard but trivial follow-the-last (FTL) bet selection strategy. ::) ::)
I realize that most of you don’t have the tools to test thoroughly so kindly allow me to test the theory of never betting the mutual bets which is to bet only one side. Is it better to just bet B or both RB in a VDW system.
I tested both B and RB with the same 3170 actual money spins from BV NZ tables.
The graphic results are shown below in pic #1 betting just the B and pic #2 betting the RB.
Now, this is only one test, the next test may be the opposite.
So I again tested both B and RB with 3,000 RNG spins.
Both RNG results are shown below in pic # 3.
Hope this helps.
Cheers
Nick
ooops, I got only 1/2 the picture for the RNG.
Will test again, at my age eyesight not that good. :D
Nick
OK, here is the graph of 5,000 spins.
The one on left is betting just B and the one on right betting R & B.
Cheers
Nick
Quote from: Nickmsi on Sep 09, 05:52 PM 2017
OK, here is the graph of 5,000 spins.
The one on left is betting just B and the one on right betting R & B.
Cheers
Nick
Hello Mr. Nick,
You did a good job. I'm anxious to give it a try.
Could you post an example how to play this system betting one side? I'm still a bit confused.
Should I stop in which spin after a loss? Should I use martingale?
Thanks in advance!
35
32
30
5
24
22
32
10
26
admit that I play black
the "35" and the "24" form the first and the fifth spin
At the ninth spin I play black ( 1-5-9 )
But anyway it loses .
Quote from: plolp on Sep 09, 08:18 PM 2017
35
32
30
5
24
22
32
10
26
admit that I play black
the "35" and the "24" form the first and the fifth spin
At the ninth spin I play black ( 1-5-9 )
But anyway it loses .
Thank you very much, but I already know that. My question is how to play only one side, should I stop in which spin after a loss an if I should use martingale.
Yet it is just like that that one plays one side.
An other exemple ;
35
32
30
5
24
30
32
10
26
we play the same thing
Quote from: plolp on Sep 09, 08:55 PM 2017
An other exemple ;
35
32
30
5
24
30
32
10
26
we play the same thing
Sorry but I think you are not understanding my questions...
if you played both colors
you could not play black .
We have a communication problem here.
it does not matter
do not waste your time with the EC
Quote from: plolp on Sep 09, 09:09 PM 2017
it does not matter
do not waste your time with the EC
Man, I'm waiting for Nick or anyone explain it to me...
Please, stop bothering me.
Up
Quote from: Andre Chass on Sep 09, 07:14 PM 2017
Should I use martingale?
Martingale has been around since 18th century, you honestly think it hasnt been tested in every way with EC already?
Quote from: celescliff on Sep 10, 02:14 PM 2017
Martingale has been around since 18th century, you honestly think it hasnt been tested in every way with EC already?
I know that...
That's not my question...
I mean to use in that situation... (VDW)
Quote from: Andre Chass on Sep 09, 07:14 PM 2017
Hello Mr. Nick,
You did a good job. I'm anxious to give it a try.
Could you post an example how to play this system betting one side? I'm still a bit confused.
Should I stop in which spin after a loss? Should I use martingale?
Thanks in advance!
Mr Nick,
I'm waiting for your help.
I will appreciate it!
Does anyone here know how to bet only one side?
Mr. Nick is gone ...