Contrary to opinion that it doesn't matter could anyone willing who reads this if u have large samples of preferable real spins but rng is fine also. Find for me in all situations with 18 spins unique ( no repeaters ).after that trigger occurs and after another 19 spins ( so 37 total spins).how many total numbers are drawn. .. eg ( usually around 24 but varies between 18-30 roughly. I only want results after the 18 uniques have already occured...I'm getting different stats than when starting from spin 1.. thanks.
I could try if you accept Excel's rng, which I think is ok.
Yes, definately accept rng. If not too hard for u cause its annoying waiting for 18 uniques to happen... So 18 uniques. . (18 numbers drawn ) then after 19 more spins .how many total have come out...I need to know if 24.is still most common like my tests from spin 1. I'm getting different stats..I do it by hand.so its a annoyin... I accept any rng except roulettesim.info .thanks .just do as much as u have time .
Quote from: Bigbroben on Jun 23, 12:48 PM 2018
I could try if you accept Excel's rng, which I think is ok.
Be very careful with Excel´s RNG it is misleading very often. Simply: It doesn´t work correctly.
U can start the 18 count from anywhere in the line of stats so of its .1.4.3.11.36.0.4(4 repeated) just go back to the 3 and start again instead of starting the line again.( if that makes sense )
Quote from: winkel on Jun 23, 06:25 PM 2018
Be very careful with Excel´s RNG it is misleading very often. Simply: It doesn´t work correctly.
Ah?
Would you say it creates more, or less, repeating nrs, or how would it differ?
Some test results show the hit-nrs countdown very closely follows the downward GUT curve, for example.
Can you tell how it would differ so I'd take note?
Thanks!
Quote from: Bigbroben on Jun 23, 07:33 PM 2018
Ah?
Would you say it creates more, or less, repeating nrs, or how would it differ?
Some test results show the hit-nrs countdown very closely follows the downward GUT curve, for example.
Can you tell how it would differ so I'd take note?
Thanks!
It is simply known that this RNG is not working properly. Many many people warn to use this RNG because it doesnt produce random results.
Older versions of Excel had some problems. Newer versions are supposed to be ok.
A good place for random numbers is random.org. :thumbsup:
Mr general I need to find lots of 18 uniques... I'm convinced from the few stats I have that if u start from spin one u will get mostly 24 numbers drawn... Then 80% in the 20.21.22.23. Range and if u have a set of 37 spins where the first 18 no repeats u end with mainly 24 s and 80% in the 25.26.27.28 range..... I want it to be all the same though so I can chase what's hitting I have a plan but need to compaare 18 uniques vs ( from spin one).it should be same but I dunno
Mr general I need to find lots of 18 uniques... I'm convinced from the few stats I have that if u start from spin one u will get mostly 24 numbers drawn... Then 80% in the 20.21.22.23. Range and if u have a set of 37 spins where the first 18 no repeats u end with mainly 24 s and 80% in the 25.26.27.28 range..... I want it to be all the same though so I can chase what's hitting I have a plan but need to compaare 18 uniques vs ( from spin one).it should be same but I dunno
Unfortunately you have no way of knowing if a unique number will hit or if another number will repeat since each spin is an independent trial.
Quote from: Anastasius on Jun 23, 06:18 PM 2018
Yes, definately accept rng. If not too hard for u cause its annoying waiting for 18 uniques to happen... So 18 uniques. . (18 numbers drawn ) then after 19 more spins .how many total have come out...I need to know if 24.is still most common like my tests from spin 1. I'm getting different stats..I do it by hand.so its a annoyin... I accept any rng except roulettesim.info .thanks .just do as much as u have time .
Anastasius,
I'll post your request in the Excel help thread.
Quote from: The General on Jun 24, 11:47 PM 2018Unfortunately you have no way of knowing if a unique number will hit or if another number will repeat since each spin is an independent trial.
But, is it always?
Quote from: Blueprint on Jun 26, 09:52 AM 2018
But, is it always?
It certainly seems that way. I tested billions of spins with bets on uniques and repeats in different situations, and it's never tilted either side of break even. That's when I decided to do a heat map based on repeat cycles only to visually prove what The General stated:
"Unfortunately you have no way of knowing if a unique number will hit or if another number will repeat since each spin is an independent trial."
I then realised that repeats and uniques are just labels. They don't occur due to probability per se and can't even be predicted in a way that could gain profit - they simply fall in line with any sequence that you put it front of it, and form patterns.
For example:
1... next spin has 33% chance of 1,2 or 3 (dozen repeats)
Since there is more chance of getting 2+3 (66%) compared to 1 (33%) the next spin has less chance of repeating (12 or 13).
1... more chance repeat will end on 1, i.e 121 or 11.
This simply means the same thing as the previous example, but over the course of 3 spins instead of 1 spin.
1.... 123 or 213 or 321
If you take away the past spin then the repeats and uniques mean nothing.
Quote from: Anastasius on Jun 24, 09:25 AM 2018
if u have a set of 37 spins where the first 18 no repeats u end ....
100 000 trials with the above idea (first 18 no repeats):
{{19, 4}, {20, 57}, {21, 418}, {22, 2142}, {23, 6484},
{24, 14305}, {25, 21684},
{26, 23349}, {27, 17450},
{28, 9378}, {29, 3603}, {30, 917}, {31, 189}, {32, 19}, {33, 1}}
example: 23349 times 26 different numbers in 37 spins
Interesting:
comparing normal distribution with the above numbers:
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/26/temp_291737.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/2ehj1)
BBB
i'll accept spins 11-40; 15 non-hit +/- and 60 spins 30 non-hit+/-
From the recommended site the general quoted
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/26/temp_916373.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/2eczK)
Don't matter if random.org or Mort's ef-bet or even J247.com it's still usually 15 and 30
Quote from: falkor2k15 on Jun 26, 11:16 AM 2018
It certainly seems that way. I tested billions of spins with bets on uniques and repeats in different situations, and it's never tilted either side of break even. That's when I decided to do a heat map based on repeat cycles only to visually prove what The General stated:
"Unfortunately you have no way of knowing if a unique number will hit or if another number will repeat since each spin is an independent trial."
I then realised that repeats and uniques are just labels. They don't occur due to probability per se and can't even be predicted in a way that could gain profit - they simply fall in line with any sequence that you put it front of it, and form patterns.
For example:
1... next spin has 33% chance of 1,2 or 3 (dozen repeats)
Since there is more chance of getting 2+3 (66%) compared to 1 (33%) the next spin has less chance of repeating (12 or 13).
1... more chance repeat will end on 1, i.e 121 or 11.
This simply means the same thing as the previous example, but over the course of 3 spins instead of 1 spin.
1.... 123 or 213 or 321
If you take away the past spin then the repeats and uniques mean nothing.
Same, same.
Different, different.
Same, different.
Different, same.
I don't know. Rambling on. Kind of looks like a Haiku. Ha.
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/26/temp_254199.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/2eHxB)
24.25 - 8.767857= 15.482143 so you see on average there's 15 non-hit at 60 it's 29.83
It's all you need to know, well almost, it helps to know average to hit and max to hit.
October i'll give you the non-hit time table
Quote from: Blueprint on Jun 26, 06:24 PM 2018
Same, same.
Different, different.
Same, different.
Different, same.
I don't know. Rambling on. Kind of looks like a Haiku. Ha.
Same/Different are just a series of 1-3 independent spins (for dozens) from the previous 1-3 independent spins.
You can take these independent spins and mark the relationships between them:
SS: 121 123
1 12
1DD: 122 12
2 21
1SD: 121 1
1 12
2DS: 121 12
2 12
2All that does is create a regular interval on when your independent equally-likely static bet should change based on a template. So instead of betting the same single or double dozen, you are changing them periodically based on keyframes where you can apply stats. Essentially, it's a break even game with added keyframes like an AVI/MP4 video that has been given structure so you can cut out scenes more efficiently. It has nothing to do with prediction and cannot gain edge. As reddwarf said "no mechanical method leads to profit".
I'll prove that you cannot predict a repeat:
Each dozen is equally-likely:
1
2
3
Now I can take any 2 unique dozens and put them in front of the above, and I will end up with more chance of a repeat:
1
122
3
1
312
3
So I didn't predict anything - patterns form independent of my prediction.
No predicting. That’s a guessing game.
Quote from: Blueprint on Jun 26, 08:46 PM 2018
No predicting. That’s a guessing game.
Right, so going back to your original question: we cannot predict repeats/uniques. The wheel doesn't make any distinctions - it's us that places the labels depending on our viewpoint. And then we continue to play a random game, and patterns continue to form regardless of what we think we are predicting: SS happens more than DD, and it may feel like we are trying to predict SS when we are simply continuing a series of independent static bets @ 33% chance, resulting in a break even game with added house advantage.
When are you NOT playing a guessing game?
Quote from: Blueprint on Jun 26, 09:04 PM 2018
When are you NOT playing a guessing game?
You are either randomly guessing or trying to follow a previous set of random past spins, so the result is the same.
12... I guess dozen 1+3 and I have a 66% chance of winning.
12... I guess a 1+2 repeat and I have a 66% chance of winning.
I never won the repeat. I won the 66% chance bet. The repeat formed by itself as a natural pattern based on the "unique" labels I chose for 1 and 2. Another player at the table who played the 2 spins before I arrived could have labelled them as a repeat instead of uniques:
1212
When else are you NOT playing a guessing game?
Quote from: Blueprint on Jun 26, 09:16 PM 2018
When else are you NOT playing a guessing game?
It's always a guessing game. We don't bet to prove a repeat will happen. We choose a unit size and how much of the board to cover. Repeats will form as natural patterns independent of our bet selection. We didn't magically choose the right dozens for the repeat. The repeat happens on any 2/3 dozen outcome when you put 2 unique dozens in front of it.
Ok, if it's always a guessing game then you're playing against the HE. Sorry, I tried.
Quote from: Blueprint on Jun 26, 09:29 PM 2018
Ok, if it's always a guessing game then you're playing against the HE. Sorry, I tried.
Yep - it's a always a guessing game. The only difference is that one break even game has no consistent stats applied to it and generally repeats the same bet all the time, whereas the other break even game has keyframes applied to it and involves betting double dozens that change on a regular basis. And then the house eats away at your break even.
Therefore, it's not a Random vs. Non-Random game. It's 2 different types of break even games.
Big bro Ben ......is the graph u posted could u please explain it ? Was my assumption correct that if u wait the 18 uniques then the most common finishing amount of numbers is 27 instead of 24.... Where as if u go from spin one the most common 24))) if that's the case its shame cause my tests show wayyyyy ahead if the most common was still 24.( after the 18) I'm amazed u got that info for me....... I'm grateful.....ill try to work around this new knowledge....I was close close......... 27.....is the most common after 18?? Fuk....Craxy
If anyone wants to do a likely pointless test and post ere or inbox me the results....do a flat bet test after 18 uniques. On all 18 then add any new numbers up to 37 spins then stop at spin 37. (U will catch every repeater possible within 37 spins for all 18 unique minimum sets ) all flat bet ..... Possibly won't come out + ( big bro Ben if those two graphs lines up I was thousands ahead ) it must have to do mathematically with if u have twenty uniue then for it to finish with 20 it needs to hit those 20 for 17 spins ect) I dunno the actual math I only had a suspicion....
For the 19 spins after the 18 unique the most common game should be 10 wins vs 9 losses....worst case it all 9 in a row at start ...super unlikely.....this could come out + if someone test? Because in hindsite it skips over all the ones that won't hit even once and goes straight to the definate repeats ...
Hi,
yes, the datas Herby posted are consistent with the ones I had.
I posted you a tracking file in the Excel Help tread, you play with it and see.
The normal distribution datas, I got them from Winkel's LOTT file, and compared the proportions with Herby's nrs.
So, yeah, if 18 in 18, most likely it will be 26 in 37;
but there are more chances there will be 25 nrs than 27 (21% vs 17%).
See:
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/28/temp_400714.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/2wSia)
Quote from: Anastasius on Jun 28, 09:58 AM 2018
For the 19 spins after the 18 unique the most common game should be 10 wins vs 9 losses....worst case it all 9 in a row at start ...super unlikely.....this could come out + if someone test? Because in hindsite it skips over all the ones that won't hit even once and goes straight to the definate repeats ...
Will test soon.
PS:
don't forget to find Waldo in the tracker!
I saw that 24 wasn't most common after a few real life games...if it was in four situations of 200 cycles from my test I could have parlayed the wins up to like +50;000 off one unit ( almost worthy to wait for ) but I knew quickly the end results would be around 26 total numbers its actually not too far off 24==== I could do sumfin wit dis maybe...