The Pyramid System ( or TriangleMatrix)
Inspired from JL matrix , this is *another matrix* to test.........
Can be used for EC s, Dozens, Columns, 4 streets groups .....
Wait trigger 3 verticals(diagonals) and bet once, if lose wait new trigger 3 vert/diag.
and bet again once, if lose....same... progression steps ( 1/1, 3/3, 9/9....or 2/2, 6/6, 18/18).
The only valid triggers are at the exterior of the Pyramid (right side or left side).
If lose or win start new pyramide, wait new trigger , bet once....if lose....same...
If trigger not shows in the first 6 diagonals, start new Pyramide. For Dozens:
2
12
211
1223
23122
132211 no triggers , start new P
Example with trigger:
2
12
212 trigger 222 right side
1223 no bet, no bet, no bet, bet and W hit doz 3
start new Pyramide from the next number
But if trigger appear at the end of the 6 diagonals, make another line( 7 doz)
2
12
211
1223
23123
132213 trigger 333
2231332 W hit doz 2 (if lose start new Pyramide)
For EC s wait 3 triggers and use 5 or 6 progression steps.
Example pyramide for EC s (R/B):
R
RB
RBB trigger RRR left side, no bet, no bet, bet B
RR.... L1 hit R, wait
wait new trigger ( make the new pyramide from next number)
R
BR
BRR trigger
RBBB W hit B, start new pyramide
......................................................................................
More info:
The safer method could be PyramideX for Doz/Col, in this case wait 4 diagonals
and bet 3 or 4 progression steps, if lose wait new trigger and bet again once....etc..
And for ECs:
The PyramideXECs , wait 4 diagonals and use 5 progression steps (Marty).
........................................................................................
Example live spins , P for Doz.:
17
23
34
32
22
5
22
18
1
7
9
16
21
26
22
34
9
13
23
9
29
14
23
8
7
15
30
31
6
35
15
29
10.....
Now put this numbers (dozens) in the Pyramid
(in this Example I use trigger only two diagonals and 4 progression steps)
2
23 trigger 22, bet doz. 1 and 3
321 W hit doz.3
now make the new pyramid from the dozen next to the winner
2
12 trigger 22 right side
211 W hit doz.1
start new P from the next number
1
22
323
1221
32211 trigger 11
233132 W hit doz 2, start new P
cheers
Test 1 (dozens)
Trigger 3 vertical/diagonals
2
32
323
2322
33121
202231 no trigger , start new pyramid
3
33
133 trigger 333
1112 W hit doz 2, start new P
3
33
113 trigger 333
2122 W hit doz 2, start new P
3
33
121
1312
23132
332212 trigger 222
1333222 L1 , start new P, wait trigger
2
22
333
2223
13313 trigger 333
311121 W hit doz 1, start new P
1
21
233
2232 trigger 222 (left side)
1....... W hit doz 1, start new P
1
31
321 trigger 111
1323 W hit doz 3, start new P
1
31
212
3211
32113
221311 no trigger , start new P
1
11
323
3212
12111
233122 no trigger , start new P
2
32
212 trigger 222
1233 W hit doz 3 , start new P
1
22
123
3132
31311
313111 trigger 333
2........... W hit doz 2, start new P
End session
Kattila, I have never been able to understand why we limit bets on these matrices.
2
32
323
2322
33121
202231 no trigger , start new pyramid
Here's one of your examples. Why couldn't we use the three 2's I have in red as a trigger?
I don't see why 3 in a row on the outer lines is any safer a bet than any 3 in a row.
Also what if we made our pyramid into a diamond like this:
2
22
333
2223
13313 trigger 333
311121 W hit doz 1, start new P
12131
2331 right here we have a win because the 3 blocked four 1's
213 and right here we have a win because the 3 blocked four 1's
11
2
What do you think? More bets without compromising risks.
My last thought is why stop at 6 wide? We could go all the way to 7 or 8 or or even 12. Save having to rebuild the matrix so often.
George
You right G,
we should use the others triggers too,
and I like the Diamond .... :)
now ....test...test...test...and find the right wide
cheers
Quote from: Kattila on Apr 08, 07:49 AM 2011
You right G,
we should use the others triggers too,
and I like the Diamond .... :)
now ....test...test...test...and find the right wide
cheers
Kat, I don't think there is a "right wide". How can the width of the pyramid make any difference to whether or not trips, quads or 5 pointers form. Unless we think there's some mysterious mathematical formula in operation that can't be determined except by trial and error.
The reason I suggested a wider base-line is to limit the tracking time needed for triggers to develop.
I know that some of our members think there's something unique about organizing spins in matrices, but all I know is that when it comes time to bet that a quad won't become a 5 pointer, the wheel doesn't know that the last 3 quads became 5 pointers. All the wheel knows is that it has 37 possible spaces to land in and to the best of the casino's ability this is a random event and the table has been divided into 3 each 12 number sections and if we played this spin over and over and over, about 2 thirds of the time no 5 pointer would form and about 1 third of the time a 5 pointer would form!
Just because you string your bets out over 100's of spins between bets doesn't mean that inevitable losers won't happen. This is a martingale. Martingale's are notorious for stringing long series of small wins together making us think we are beating the game only to finally show up with a payment due notice.
Holy moly, I'm starting to sound like a math guy.
I'm not saying that we can't win playing these matrices. I'm saying that we are finally starting to get enough small wins under our belts for the losses to start showing up and the losses are showing up.
We make a tweak which starts the series of small wins over again, but eventually the losses will show up here also. So, we make another tweak, even a tiny tweak like changing the size of our matrix, but that's enough to restart the process.
Maybe the way we should play is to play on a 4X matrix for 40 units, then switch to a 5X matrix for 40 units, then switch to a 6X matrix for 40 units, then a 7X etc...
Where am I? What topic am I posting this under?
I'm sorry for this tirade under your topic Kattila. Feel free to dump this in the recycle bin if you want.
George
You right again George,
Diamond down after my first test (L1L2L3L4)
maybe if wait 4 diagonals and use 3 or 4 progr. steps.
Anyway I will keep testing the Pyramid idea (max. 6 wide)and keep my eye
on the JL Matrix s.
Test Diamond 7 wide
Trigger 3 diagonals(any not only exterior), 4 progression steps
1
11
332
3332
33113 two triggers 333
221121 W and W
3212321 trigger 111
122222 W hit doz 2, trigger 222
31210 W hit doz 1
1103
322
22
1 start new Diamond 7
1
11
232
2313
32331
222113
3121121 trigger 111
131112 L1 hit 1, new trigger 111
11213 L2 hit 1, new trigger 111
3033 W hit 3 (the doz 3 after 03)
331
13
1 start new Dyamond
1
33
312
3311 trigger 333
33311 L1 hit 3,new triggers 333 and 111
121121 W hit 1, W hit 2, new trigger 111
1233320 L1 hit 0, wait
113321 wait
12313 triggers 111 and 333
3113 W hit 3, W hit 1, wait
232 no triggers
31
2 start new D
2
12
221
2311
32123 trigger 111
103221 W hit 3, wait
0122332 trigger 222
312121 L1 hit 2, new triggers 111
33232 W hit 3, wait
2232
231 trigger 333
32 L1 hit 3, wait next trigger(next D)
1
2
32
222 trigger 222
1313 W hit 3
11233
330133 trigger 333
3231133 L1 hit 3, new trigger 333
222213 L2 hit 3, new trigger 111
12131 L3 hit 1, new trigger 222
1232 L4 hit 2
Back to the Pyramid method
another test, this time any trigger is ok
(exterior or inside) and don t stop at 6 wide
go until W or bust , then reset Pyramid.
If there is any trigger after W bet again, if
no trigger after W start new P.
1
21
212
3131 trigger 111
30211 L1 hit 0
312223 trigger 333
1........... W hit 1, no triggers, start new P
3
32
012
1231
21231
311233 triggers 111,222,333
1133232 W hit 3, L1 hit 2, L2 hit 3, new trigger 111
32........... W hit 2, no triggers, reset to new P
3
22
113
1312
33223
232223 Trigger 333
3323121 L1 hit 3, new triggers 222, 222
11331213 W hit 3, W hit 1, reset
2
21
231 trigger 222
1..... W hit 1, no triggers, reset
1
22
112
1333
33221
133111
3212332
12232332
122132321 triggers 222,222,333
3211113112 L1 hit 2, W hit 3, W hit 1 , reset
1
13
222
2323
33321 trigger 222
121231 W hit 3, no triggers, reset
Quote from: Kattila on Apr 09, 07:36 PM 2011
Back to the Pyramid method
another test, this time any trigger is ok
(exterior or inside) and don't stop at 6 wide
go until W or bust , then reset Pyramid.
If there is any trigger after W bet again, if
no trigger after W start new P.
1
21
212
3131 trigger 111
30211 L1 hit 0
312223 trigger 333
1........... W hit 1, no triggers, start new P
3
32
012
1231
21231
311233 triggers 111,222,333
1133232 W hit 3, L1 hit 2, L2 hit 3, new trigger 111
32........... W hit 2, no triggers, reset to new P
3
22
113
1312
33223
232223 Trigger 333
3323121 L1 hit 3, new triggers 222, 222
11331213 W hit 3, W hit 1, reset
2
21
231 trigger 222
1..... W hit 1, no triggers, reset
1
22
112
1333
33221
133111
3212332
12232332
122132321 triggers 222,222,333
3211113112 L1 hit 2, W hit 3, W hit 1 , reset
1
13
222
2323
33321 trigger 222
121231 W hit 3, no triggers, reset
Kat,
The results are about random. 4 losses vs 9 wins.
Flat betting = +1
I keep looking at these matrices and what I see is we think we are betting against a quad forming, but another way of looking at it is that we are just deciding to bet on 2 of the 3 dozens.
Maybe arranging them in patterns has some bearing on what will spin next, but I haven't seen a strong win vs loss ratio on any of these systems.
Since I don't seem to be able to see anything positive to contribute to any of these topics, I think I'll just sit back and see what develops.
If an obvious winning method develops, I'll be very happy.
This is my first post so I want to say hi to everybody. . Hy :)
I tried your pyramide system and it seems it works great when betting doubles not to become trips with progression 1-1 3-3 9-9 27-27.
I only went to step 3 two times and won both. Other times first or second step win.
Also I only play 5 rows then start a new one (except when im on a loss then i go on till win)
Will do more testing and try it for real money and see how it goes
Thanks Soggett for your help to test this.
keep testing that way, two doubles not become trips( 4 progr. steps)
and 5 or 6 rows( wide).
I also will keep testing with trips not become quads ( 3 or 4 progr. steps)
and until 6 wide , but the other way too....no limit on rows, bet until W or L.
Additional info:
Pyramid system applied to splits( 16 numbers groups)
I prefer 16 number groups because can generate more units/hour,
but also more risky.
Progression(s):
1. 1 x 8splits -8 +10
2. 2 x 8 -24 +12
3. 4 x 8 -56 +16
4. 7 x 8 -112 +14
5. 12 x 8 -208 +8
or 0,50/ 1/ 2/ 4/ 8
or 0,20/ 0,40/ 1/ 2/ 4/ 8
GROUPS
1. 1/4, 7/10 (A)
2. 2/5, 8/11 (C)
3. 3/6, 9/12 (B)
4. 13/16, 19/22 (B)
5. 14/17, 20/23 (A)
6. 15/18, 21/24 (A)
7. 25/28, 31/34 (A)
8. 26/29, 32/35 (B)
9. 27/30, 33/36 (B)
Group A (4 sectors/ 16 numbers)
groups 1,5,6,7
Group B ( 4 sectors/ 16 numbers)
groups 3,4,8,9
Group C is sector 2 + the 0 ( 5 numbers).
Trigger CCC... not valid, only AAA or BBB inside or outside.
Example live spins(only at win start new Pyramide):
b
c b
b b c
a b a c b trigger bbb
a b a a a b L1 hit b, wait
a b a c b c a triggers aaa, aaa
b.................. W +12 hit b
a
a a
b a b
b 0 b c
b a a b c trigger bbb
a............. W +10 hit a
a
a b
a a b trigger aaa
a a c b L1 hit a, trigger bbb
b b c b a W +12 hit a
safer way could be wait trigger 4 verticals/diagonals and
bet once, if lose wait new trigger bet again once...etc....5 steps.
It s not the same like bet 24 numbers , is more risky, but can win
faster and stop at target ( ex: +150) or stop lose -208.
cheers
No problem, thanks to you for posting the system and sharing it with us
I found that in 5 rows you can win 3-5 units per pyramide.
But after row 5 it becomes more difficult to win, don't know why?
So if this works. . . its gonna be cha-ching time $$$ ;D
Looks good Kattilla :thumbsup:
Cheers
Jon
Ok, a little update
Testing so far going very well, started testing with real money yesterday (0.01 euro to be safe)
Been using 1-1, 3-3, 9-9, 27-27 only dozens.
And system busted on 4 level of progression the first time so far ever. (it would have won on a 5 level though).
I have given it a lot of thought and will be doing some modification to the system, i think i can make it work with just 3 levels of progression and it should almost never fail (let's hope).
Will keep you updated. After I do more testing I will post results here so we can discuss some more.
How are you doing Kattilla? ^-^
how are your results?
Quote from: soggett on Apr 15, 05:09 AM 2011
Ok, a little update
Testing so far going very well, started testing with real money yesterday (0.01 euro to be safe)
Been using 1-1, 3-3, 9-9, 27-27 only dozens.
And system busted on 4 level of progression the first time so far ever. (it would have won on a 5 level though).
I have given it a lot of thought and will be doing some modification to the system, I think I can make it work with just 3 levels of progression and it should almost never fail (let's hope).
Will keep you updated. After I do more testing I will post results here so we can discuss some more.
How are you doing Kattilla? ^-^
how are your results?
Cant wait to see your modifications :)
Cheers
Jon
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 15, 05:12 AM 2011
can't wait to see your modifications :)
Cheers
Jon
Thanks Jon
Are you using the pyramide system? how are your results?
I'll try to do it over the weekend now, just hope I'll have enough time to do proper testing
Quote from: soggett on Apr 15, 06:05 AM 2011
Thanks Jon
Are you using the pyramide system? how are your results?
I'll try to do it over the weekend now, just hope I'll have enough time to do proper testing
Hi.
No but follow it with great intrest :)
Cheers
Jon
Quote from: soggett on Apr 15, 05:09 AM 2011
Ok, a little update
Testing so far going very well, started testing with real money yesterday (0.01 euro to be safe)
Been using 1-1, 3-3, 9-9, 27-27 only dozens.
And system busted on 4 level of progression the first time so far ever. (it would have won on a 5 level though).
I have given it a lot of thought and will be doing some modification to the system, I think I can make it work with just 3 levels of progression and it should almost never fail (let's hope).
Will keep you updated. After I do more testing I will post results here so we can discuss some more.
How are you doing Kattilla? ^-^
how are your results?
Of course will bust if use only 2 vert./diagonals trigger, also could occure if
use trigger 3 vert./diagonals and 4 progression steps, not yet in my tests,
but possible. Anyway i prefer test for the moment on splits (16 numbers) groups.
Will update after i finish my tests (wait 3 or 4 verticals and bet 5 progression
steps).
Pyramid system applied to Double streets
...........................................................................
Take the first two Ds =A, next two Ds = B, last to DS =C
Triggers AAA, BBB, CCC vertical/diagonals.
Progression 4 steps for 4 DSs.
After win start again ...first two Ds = A....next two Ds =B....last two=C .
so every time we have new game = new A,B,C
EX:
DS
3
3
5 DS3, DS5 =A
4
1 DS1, DS4 =B, so DS2, DS6 =C
Now put the next DSs into the P matrix. Ex:
1 A
2 CA
3 BAC
4 CACA trigger(AAA)
5 BACBA L1, new trigger CCC
6 CAACBC W hit A
Maximum 6 verticals, only if lose stay until win ,
when win and no more triggers start new Pyramid an new A,B,C.
Example live spins:
NR/DS
11 2
24 4 DS2 and DS4 = A
1 1
21 4
21 4
23 4
22 4
5 1
34 6 DS6 and DS1 = B, so DS3 and DS5 =C
22 here start to make the P matrix
28
.....etc.........
a
b c
b b c
a a c c trigger ccc
b c b c a W hit a, no new triggers, start new P
NR/Ds
28 5
17 3 A= DS5 and DS 3
6 1
9 2 B= DS1 and DS2, so C=DS4 and DS6
25 start Pyramide matrix
12...............
a
b c
c a c
a c a c trigger ccc
b b a a b W hit b, new trigger aaa
b c a b c c W hit c, start new P and new A,B,C
^-^
ok, as promissed here are the results so far:
PLAYED GAMES: 50
GAMES WON: 50
GAMES LOST: 0
WON ON STEP 1: 79
WON ON STEP 2: 23
WON ON STEP 3: 11
WON ON STEP 4: 3
TOTAL: + 116 UNITS
Lowest win per session : 0 (no bets)
Highest win per session : 5 (5 bets)
average : 2,32 units per session
With permission from Kattila I will post the modified system so everyone can try it for themself (it is Kattila's thread and idea after all)
Soqqett of course you have the permission.... ;)
Nice results, soggett :thumbsup:
A.
Thank you both :)
Ok, here we go
First I'll explain the system and then give you the rules by which I play.
Ok, we track dozens and write them down in a pyramide manner:
1
2 3
3 2 1...
We do this for a max of 5 rows per pyramide.
We then bet every double not to become a trip, every trip not to become a quad, every quad not to become a 5...etc.
Progression is: 1-1, 3-3, 9-9, 27-27
Example:
1
1 1
now we bet dozen 2 and 3 with 1-1-> 1 2 3 <-because lost now bet dozen 2 and 3 with 3-3
now we bet dozen 2 and 3 with 1-1-> 2 3 2 3...
etc..
we bet every opportunity as they come.
Ok now for the rules:
1. Play till 4.5 row. - That is the safety stop. I found it harder to win after row 5, more losses, so if in plus play till 5 row 3 spins and stop. If on a losing streak, example progression step 2 and you get to safety stop keep playing till win.
2. If no bet till row 5 stop. - If you spin and don't get a chance to bet until you are in row 5 just don't bet.
3. If you get to a poin say: 1
2 2
3 3 3
1 3 3 2
3 1
You have two times a signal to bet (any dozen, you will have two different dozens do that, in this case two times dozen 3)- just skip it, it will lose more times then it will win.
4. Do not play continually- it will bust. My results are from starting over after each pyramide is done. I can do that in BV, don't know how in other casinos.
5. Have fun ;D
This is in its early tests so be carefull not to gamble away all your money. My results so far are promissing, but they are from an RNG.
Please report here how it goes for you and your winnings and losses (hopefully none of those)
Thats it
If you have any questions ask and I'll answear as soon as I can
Happy earnings :thumbsup:
Very creative Katilla. Im not sure about the rules but this is STARGATE THINKING INDEED. Taking things to another dimension. And Glc you are quite wrong.
You may aswell dust off your bust of Albert Einstein. Look we know theres 37 places for the ball to land 2.7% house edge. And the ball has no memory. BUT STILL, THE MATRICES whatever shape. Give us a playground to study just what limits RANDOM may or may not have.
New possibilities, that make our bet selection more precise and less unpredictable. THE FOUR WIDE MATRIX. Is taming random like nothing ive ever seen. For the DOZENS, COLUMNS and HIGH and LOW.
Fresh ideas are required to conquer this old game, we have them at hand.
Kattila how is the DS going?
And what progression are you using for Double streets?
Quote from: atlantis on Apr 17, 11:00 AM 2011
Nice results, soggett :thumbsup:
A.
Atlantis I really like this pyramid idea of Kattilla's hope he gets it fully finished and posts it up in the full systems section. I dont fully understand its rules, but the idea is right on my wavelength. Also are you still testing your MOVEMENTS concept ATLANTIS? Id like to take a closer look at that, ;D ;D very groundbreaking thinking going on here WHAT A FORUM. Best in the universe...
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 09:11 AM 2011
Atlantis I really like this pyramid idea of Kattilla's hope he gets it fully finished and posts it up in the full systems section. I don't fully understand its rules, but the idea is right on my wavelength. Also are you still testing your MOVEMENTS concept ATLANTIS? Id like to take a closer look at that, ;D ;D very groundbreaking thinking going on here WHAT A FORUM. Best in the universe...
Hmmmm I did hear there was a better one at WOLF 359, maybe they lied :wink:
Kattila is finally getting his due. :thumbsup:
u
Quote from: Proofreaders2000 on Apr 18, 10:38 AM 2011
Kattila is finally getting his due. :thumbsup:
He has some very interesting and futuristic ideas. I need the rules on this simplified for my ancient cranky mind to grasp. ANYONE?
Quote from: soggett on Apr 18, 02:29 AM 2011
Kattila how is the DS going?
And what progression are you using for Double streets?
my tests shows good results until now for Pyramide for double streets,
wait trigger three verticals,if lose wait new 3 vert. .... progression 4 steps:
1. 0,50 x 4DS -2 +1
2. 1,50 x 4DS -8 +1
3. 4,50 x 4DS -26 +1
4. 14 x 4DS -82 +2 stop lose or.........
.......................................................................................
5. 42 x 4DS -250 +2
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 02:16 PM 2011
UHe has some very interesting and futuristic ideas. I need the rules on this simplified for my ancient cranky mind to grasp. ANYONE?
Hi JL,
This is still on testing stage and no very strict rules until now (see first post),
you and anyone can participate to find the best way , trips to not become quads,
or quads to not become 5...., then after various tests can post this on Full systems.
The idea is put the doz or col in the P matrix like this
Rows Doz
1. 2
2. 32
3. 131
4. 1233 trigger 333
5. 13231 L1 hit doz 3, new trigger 111
6. 233211 W hit doz 2 , new trigger 222
7. 1132113 W hit doz 1, start new P matrix
3
12
122
3112 trigger 222
22313 W hit doz 3 ,not new triggers, start new P
Try to keep the P matrix in 6 rows (maximum 7 if trigger on row 6),
then W or L start new P matrix ,wait new triggers and bet next progression
step...
If win in the first rows after trigger , and don't have new triggers, start new P matrix.
Progression 3 or 4 steps ( 1/1, 3/3, 9/9, 27/27).
...
On reply 22 can find Soqqett version (please read) he use 5 rows P matrix
and bet any oportunity, double to not become trips, trips to not become quads
and so on....
...
Also the P matrix can be applyed to DS groups, 4 streets groups, Splits groups (16 nmbrs), EC s.....
more about the pyramide matrix for ECs
take any ECs and wait to form exactly this pyramides
(rbrbbrbbbr...... or oeoeeoeeeo....or.....etc....)
use only 5 marty steps
r
br
bbr
bbbr now bet against the next row, so bet rrrrb
bbbbr
another example
b
rb
rrb
rrrb now bet bbbbr
another one
e
oe
ooe
oooe now bet eeeeo
....................................................................
Safer way can be ( but more wait)
r
br
bbr
bbbr
bbbbr now bet rrrrrb, so 6 marty steps
cheers