am heading for a short adventure trip. Life always springs surprises and long wanted to do bungee jumping. Heading to NZ to do some crazy things. Planned for a week out there. Hope I come back in one piece J
But thought, will share an interesting progression idea that I was working on. You all can have a chat (laugh ??) about it while am away J If an EC progression is able to sustain 24 steps, without getting anywhere closer to table maximum is it good enough? May be, May be not.
But here it goes. Again it is conceptual and after running a number of tests through various types of progressions, this is as close a more successful mechanical progression can get to. It is very effective because this is how close a progression can get to flat betting.
I will try explaining this in EC context, but the same can be adopted to other positions as well, very effectively. Can someone be kind enough to post 100 spins. 2-3 sets will be good.
Bet selection â€" Use what one is comfortable with. OTL, FTL, 3SD whatever pleases you. To me it’s a simple bet on black always J
Level 1 â€" Flat bet on 1 unit. Until you reach 10 spins or you are up by 1 unit. Whichever is earlier. If you reach a point where you are up by 1 unit, restart the progression from level 1 again.
Level 2 â€" You will reach this stage if you have bet for 10 spins are you in negative territory. Now lets say you won 3 spins, lost 7 spins. You are in negative of -4u. Add the unit that you are in negative and 1 u. In this example you get 5u. Flat bet 5 units until you reach 10 spins or you are up by 5 units. Whichever is earlier. If you reach a point where you are up 5u, restart from level 1.
Level 3 â€" You will reach this if you have bet for 20 spins and you are still in negative territory. Now lets say you are combined in negative of -4u from first set and -10u from second set, add those and 1u. You will get 15u. Flat bet 15 units until you reach 10 spins or you are up by 15 units.
You can go on and on. But so far, I have stopped at Level 3, cursing my luck and started all over again. And to quote ignatus “This worksâ€
Let me be the first to say that this is indeed a novel idea.
The unit increase may be a little steep if you have a really bad set of spins which happens too often, I'm afraid.
I suppose if you had say 3 wins and 7 losses for a difference of 4 and you only added half of the difference to 1 unit for the next bet size, that would slow things down a bit and might still be enough to recover quick enough.
I know that the difference between your idea and my suggestion is that with your way, it only takes a short streak of high win to loss ratio to pull out to plus. With my suggestion, it will take a longer streak to pull out to plus.
With yours a really bad stretch can bury you pretty quick. With mine, it will take a longer really bad streak to do equal damage.
I do like the concept though.
Thanks for the post and have a safe and refreshing vacation.
GLC
George....
While she's gone, let's talk about her!!
I think we should elect her our leader.
Should I start a poll?
TwoCat
By the by.........I'm going to use the new software and study your idea.
Ok, here is the graph of 1000 sessions.. No zero roulette...
Ec..Betting on one color 10 times, if we lose that sesion, change to the opposite color, if win stay on the same color..
Maybe some tweaking can make it even better..
Quote from: GLC on Aug 22, 10:01 PM 2013
I do like the concept though.
Thanks for the post and have a safe and refreshing vacation.
GLC
@GLC, being the master of progressions, I thought it will catch ur eye first and it did. Although I know based on my results that it is a long time winner, it needs some tweaks from experts like you. But as you rightly said the concept is based on the fact of getting as close to flat betting and ensuring that variances don't bite you hard. As I said at the moment am stopping after losing 3 levels and that happens once in about 1500 spins. But am sure all your expert tweaks can make it better. Who knows when am back you might have a grail progression based on this. :)
Quote from: TwoCatSam on Aug 22, 11:12 PM 2013
George....
While she's gone, let's talk about her!!
I think we should elect her our leader.
Should I start a poll?
TwoCat
By the by.........I'm going to use the new software and study your idea.
Sam. Thanks. You made my day. There is nothing that makes one happy but hearing good words from a person you admire most.
I must say you are very honest, very passionate on the game, do care abt what's happening around you, and a gem of a person. I only wish i can share half of those qualities. By the way, I think this forum does not need a leader, but strong and healthy discussions and someone challenging status quo and make us think. To me you have triggered that thought process multiple times.
Cheers until we meet after my holidays.
Yanks
Sadly this is too scary, I tested it yesterday over 10000 spins the highest progression was 3876 I know you stop after 3 raises but I like to know where it could go, it's mechanical which is its downfall, concept is good but doesn't cover every eventuality which is where all mechanical progressions find themselves eventually.
Side note: as I said a week ago I am fidling with my AI bot and the raise and drop of the bet size is the key to everything working nicely, over the 10000 spins (I know I'm fitting it to one set of spins currently) I have managed to keep the bet sizes at a max of 36 units.
Now, there seems to be a lot of people here who quote max progressions, what I want to know is how high is still ok, in your minds, to me a 100 units is too high to risk, maybe I'm too cautious, I don't think so I think others who think 2000 units isn't too risky are too foolish to see it, I wont hijack this thread I will make a poll so we can see what people think is acceptable as risk/reward.
Quote from: superman on Aug 23, 02:51 AM 2013
mechanical which is its downfall, concept is good
I said it is as close it can get to mechanical, not requesting to play mechanically. But as you rightly said Superman, the concept is what it is about. It needs an expert like you who has seens 1000s of bot of many many spins to tweak it for better. Say for example am playing only for 3 levels to keep the bet size to a max of 15-20 units, because that's the sensible bet size. But are there any other tweaks we can do. How can we make it mechanical but yet fluid like your 1% MM thing (I am happy to report I have now completed 260 sessions of 5 units base based on your concept without losing a single session).can we build on George's suggestion on 50% increase? Dalembert, fibo, marty all have grown old. They don't have the firepower like they had when they were young. We need young ones embedded with all your experience to keep fighting.
Thanks for sharing this great novel idea Priyanka and for everyone participating
in the topic; I tested the progression on real Wheel and so far great results, I
never had to go beyond level 2 to reach new high.
I agree with GLC that the progression may seem at first a bit steep; However with
very good bet selection for Ec's and a bit of luck of course......this progression should
be a long term winner.
If after 10 spins on leve3 we are in minus-we take the loss and start over?
Before starting over again, It may be an idea to review the bet selection......,or find better ones.....;
Priyanka mentioned above it happened once in about 1,500 spins. I tested several hundereds spins
and it works, and never went beyond level 2......
I'm not losing progreesion, I just ask :) thanks
playing this In BEtVoyager Nozero-always playing last-its good for now
I don't see how this can lose if the player has a bankroll of say 10grand and play at a table that offers 0.10 unit bets and high table limits.....or am I missing something? (Yes it would probably take all day to make any worth while money at that level...but better than sitting at a desk job right?)
I played this all yesterday evening and never went beyond level 3 but even if I went up and few more levels....even a lot more levels (which would have to be extremely rare) it wouldn't be the end of the world and would always work out?
Great system. My new favourite!
Where you play?
Roulette can't be beaten with low BR.. Let's assume we have 100 000 chips - this system would possible be a holy grail.. 100 000 * $0.1 = $10.000.. Invest $10.000 and you will have holy grail..
Yes I agree, best way to win at the game is to simply play EC's; I've tried plenty other methods
in the forums and nothing beats Ec's......with the correct progressions.
It seems that the hg is just around the corner.....
Sheki, I was Under the impression u were loosing, apologies.
No problem.Yeah playin EC with light progression may be is the key
Quote from: Priyanka on Aug 22, 10:16 AM 2013
am heading for a short adventure trip. Life always springs surprises and long wanted to do bungee jumping. Heading to NZ to do some crazy things. Planned for a week out there. Hope I come back in one piece J
But thought, will share an interesting progression idea that I was working on. You all can have a chat (laugh ??) about it while am away J If an EC progression is able to sustain 24 steps, without getting anywhere closer to table maximum is it good enough? May be, May be not.
But here it goes. Again it is conceptual and after running a number of tests through various types of progressions, this is as close a more successful mechanical progression can get to. It is very effective because this is how close a progression can get to flat betting.
I will try explaining this in EC context, but the same can be adopted to other positions as well, very effectively. Can someone be kind enough to post 100 spins. 2-3 sets will be good.
Bet selection â€" Use what one is comfortable with. OTL, FTL, 3SD whatever pleases you. To me it’s a simple bet on black always J
Level 1 â€" Flat bet on 1 unit. Until you reach 10 spins or you are up by 1 unit. Whichever is earlier. If you reach a point where you are up by 1 unit, restart the progression from level 1 again.
Level 2 â€" You will reach this stage if you have bet for 10 spins are you in negative territory. Now lets say you won 3 spins, lost 7 spins. You are in negative of -4u. Add the unit that you are in negative and 1 u. In this example you get 5u. Flat bet 5 units until you reach 10 spins or you are up by 5 units. Whichever is earlier. If you reach a point where you are up 5u, restart from level 1.
Level 3 â€" You will reach this if you have bet for 20 spins and you are still in negative territory. Now lets say you are combined in negative of -4u from first set and -10u from second set, add those and 1u. You will get 15u. Flat bet 15 units until you reach 10 spins or you are up by 15 units.
You can go on and on. But so far, I have stopped at Level 3, cursing my luck and started all over again. And to quote ignatus “This worksâ€
Very interesting idea.
But why playing series of 10 spins ? As I understand it you need one more winning spin in a serie to recover, so if you lose the first 6 spins in a serie of 10 it makes no sense to continue.
So why not playing shorter series of 3 instead of 10 spins? It also slows down the progression.
I'm still liking this method a lot. Is there a way to modify it for single or double dozens/columns?
I just tried this progression on double dozens and it seems to work.
I played it like this :
Level 1 â€" Flat bet 1 unit on 2 dozens. Until you reach 10 spins, you break even or you are up by 1 unit. Whichever is earlier. If you reach a point where you are up by 1 unit or break even, restart the progression from level 1 again.
Level 2 â€" You will reach this stage if you have bet for 10 spins are you in negative territory. Calculate the amount you need to reach positive territory again and devide that by 2. So if you are 5 units down you need 6 to reach a new high, play 3 units on 2 dozens. No need to recover in 1 spin, with double dozens you will have more winning spins.
Level 3.....................etc.......
Here is a small impression from the session I played, you see it went very smoothly. I think highest bet was 9 units.
@eddy35 thanks for modifying the system to double dozens. I had small play with this for the last couple of hours and I've found the drawdown can get into the thousands very quickly so i guess it's a lot safer to stick with EC afterall.
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Aug 26, 04:05 PM 2013
@eddy35 thanks for modifying the system to double dozens. I had small play with this for the last couple of hours and I've found the drawdown can get into the thousands very quickly so i guess it's a lot safer to stick with EC afterall.
Are you sure Le_Chiffre, I have tried this 2 dozen system for 6 hours on different casino and and it worked for me.
Quote from: buju on Aug 26, 07:36 PM 2013
Are you sure Le_Chiffre, I have tried this 2 dozen system for 6 hours on different casino and and it worked for me.
I'm afraid so. I'm usually a big double dozens fan but for some reason the drawdown got that big quite quickly on some occasions as it can get to putting hundreds down on each dozen really fast during some bad luck and then more bad luck at that level gets into the thousands. Of course it worked out and got back into profit but I was just surprised how big the drawdown was and how quick. If I were to try this i would be playing with a bankroll of 5-10grand and 0.10 chips so that would make the drawdown in the hundreds so nothing really serious compared to the bankroll.
I will try it again today just in case....but is anyone able to run a test of this double dozen version for 10000 spins or more just so we can see?
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Aug 27, 02:28 AM 2013
I'm afraid so. I'm usually a big double dozens fan but for some reason the drawdown got that big quite quickly on some occasions as it can get to putting hundreds down on each dozen really fast during some bad luck and then more bad luck at that level gets into the thousands. Of course it worked out and got back into profit but I was just surprised how big the drawdown was and how quick. If I were to try this i would be playing with a bankroll of 5-10grand and 0.10 chips so that would make the drawdown in the hundreds so nothing really serious compared to the bankroll.
I will try it again today just in case....but is anyone able to run a test of this double dozen version for 10000 spins or more just so we can see?
Did you divide the bet by 2? So if you need 10 units to recover , play 2 X 5 chips , no need to recover in 1 spin when playing double dozens.
Quote from: eddy35 on Aug 27, 05:19 AM 2013
Did you divide the bet by 2? So if you need 10 units to recover , play 2 X 5 chips , no need to recover in 1 spin when playing double dozens.
Yes that is the main key. Divide the bet by 2.
Quote from: eddy35 on Aug 27, 05:19 AM 2013
Did you divide the bet by 2? So if you need 10 units to recover , play 2 X 5 chips , no need to recover in 1 spin when playing double dozens.
yes i did divide by 2. My bet selection was betting the last dozen and the nearest one to the side of the number last hit. I was playing RNG.
I have also tested this today on EC again at 0.20 stakes and the drawdown got to -200, which would be in the thousands again if playing at 1 or 2 unit bets.
I like this system. I think there just needs to be a few modifications to it. but i think it will always work in the end with enough bankroll and starting small.
I'm thinking with 10k bankroll, and with 0.20 unit stakes it took me just over an hour to make 10 units, so if someone was prepared it's possible to make 60 units for 6 hours work.....or 100 units for 10 hours work etc.... taking the 100 units a day example it works out at 700 per week, 2,800 per month and 33,600 per year. Obviously it wouldn't really be much of a life working 10 hours per day 7 days per week, but not really much of a life in the rat race and sitting at a desk all day long for someone else right?
anyone else think this could always work at 0.20 stakes with 10k bankroll? would it actually be possible to lose 10k with stakes that low on EC?
May be the Rng was locked at the time so any method u play at the time, u will go south mate.....
as rng is not real roulette; May be try playing same but at real Wheel with live dealer....
yes maybe...but that's why I like testing systems on RNG as if it can perform well against a computer trying it's best to make you lose then it's a keeper. However, sometimes real wheel 'true random' can be even more fatal than RNG as RNG usually chops around-gives a run of losers-gives a run of winners.....but true random can just be a continuous chop or continuous losing streak for a whole session.
Could somebody write a script for Roulette Xtreme so it would be easier to test different options?
I will test it later and send you the results :) Just tell me what do you want, maybe ten tests with 1000 spins and to send you the graph and results, or maybe some big bilion spin test?
Quote from: boshkodj on Aug 27, 04:17 PM 2013
I will test it later and send you the results :) Just tell me what do you want, maybe ten tests with 1000 spins and to send you the graph and results, or maybe some big bilion spin test?
I also would like to test it myself, maybe with different number of spins....... 20 instead of 10, what will happen if you calculate the result after 20 spins instead of 10. Just play a little with this progression.
If you could help me with a script you would make me very happy.
Sure I am also interested in your test results.
I am not using any script / roulette extreme, I code the system in C++..
I too am interested in seeing the test results of as many spins as you can do. thanks
Quote from: boshkodj on Aug 27, 05:27 PM 2013
I am not using any script / roulette extreme, I code the system in C++..
what is C++.. ?
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Aug 27, 05:31 PM 2013
I too am interested in seeing the test results of as many spins as you can do. thanks
It makes no sense to have test results for 100.000 spins..................... I would prefer 1000 sessions of 100 spins, that's more realistic!
Quote from: eddy35 on Aug 27, 06:02 PM 2013
It makes no sense to have test results for 100.000 spins..................... I would prefer 1000 sessions of 100 spins, that's more realistic!
yes that probably would be better and more true to life and how it'll be played if it were for real........but whatever can be done will be appreciated.
Quote from: eddy35 on Aug 27, 06:02 PM 2013
It makes no sense to have test results for 100.000 spins..................... I would prefer 1000 sessions of 100 spins, that's more realistic!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
O0
Quote from: eddy35 on Aug 27, 06:02 PM 2013
It makes no sense to have test results for 100.000 spins..................... I would prefer 1000 sessions of 100 spins, that's more realistic!
--------------------
it will make no real difference mate.....
vundarosa
Ok, I will made few tests of 1000 sessions.. Just tell me what is the stop loss in a session? Or to test until hit the win and then to see the biggest DD?
Quote from: eddy35 on Aug 27, 06:00 PM 2013
what is C++.. ?
link:://lmgtfy.com/?q=c%2B%2B
Quote from: boshkodj on Aug 27, 08:34 PM 2013
Ok, I will made few tests of 1000 sessions.. Just tell me what is the stop-loss in a session? Or to test until hit the win and then to see the biggest DD?
Please test until hit the win. Stop loss is bust basically. Please can you test the original EC system betting on the last colour.....and test the double dozens system betting on the last dozen spun and nearest one next to it. Many thanks.
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Aug 28, 02:48 AM 2013
Please test until hit the win. stop-loss is bust basically. Please can you test the original EC system betting on the last colour.....and test the double dozens system betting on the last dozen spun and nearest one next to it. Many thanks.
I tested few days ago the original method with last colour on a bilion spins ( no zero ).. If you have milion chips you would have holy grail, hehe, that's much.. I cannot find the results now, but few times it made tremendous DD..
I will test it with dozens too, and will post the results :)
thanks for the reply. how deep was the DD exactly (if you can remember)?
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Aug 28, 04:09 AM 2013
thanks for the reply. how deep was the DD exactly (if you can remember)?
-----------------
an equally good question would be how often :thumbsup:
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Aug 28, 04:43 AM 2013
-----------------
an equally good question would be how often :thumbsup:
vundarosa
absolutely
Here a small session of 208 spins, double dozen. I played 1st en 2nd dozens all the time, no change in bet selection.
Highest bet was 5 units. Profit about 50 units.
I always start at level 1 again when I am break even, so not at a new high.
Quote from: eddy35 on Aug 28, 11:28 AM 2013
Here a small session of 208 spins, double dozen. I played 1st en 2nd dozens all the time, no change in bet selection.
Highest bet was 5 units. Profit about 50 units.
I always start at level 1 again when I am break even, so not at a new high.
nice. i don't understand why when i try it on double dozens the DD gets crazily high very quickly....and often. i play like you said and am re-setting on break even. I will download roulette extreme and try it on there.
Here an other 200 spins session. Highest bet was 50 here, but only 2 times.
Also about 50 units profit. Maybe we can controle the progression if we divide by 3 instead of 2 after the 2nd level ?
Quote from: eddy35 on Aug 28, 12:16 PM 2013
Here an other 200 spins session. Highest bet was 50 here, but only 2 times.
Also about 50 units profit. Maybe we can controle the progression if we divide by 3 instead of 2 after the 2nd level ?
I have downloaded roulette xtreme and played a 200 spin session and the DD wasn't too bad here. I think when i tested it the other day I may have only been resetting on break even on the first level instead of every level.
Just to be clear say the high of the session was 526 the i ended the first level of 10 spins at 515, i now obviously need 12 spins to get to new profit so I divide in 2 and put 6 on each dozen. Do i write down the current 515 and reset if the current level of betting goes down and then comes back up to 515?
Here again a 200 spins session.
Highest bet was 10 units here.
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Aug 28, 12:31 PM 2013
I have downloaded roulette xtreme and played a 200 spin session and the DD wasn't too bad here. I think when i tested it the other day I may have only been resetting on break even on the first level instead of every level.
Just to be clear say the high of the session was 526 the i ended the first level of 10 spins at 515, i now obviously need 12 spins to get to new profit so I divide in 2 and put 6 on each dozen. Do i write down the current 515 and reset if the current level of betting goes down and then comes back up to 515?
I always calculate from the high, so 526.
Eddy, Would it be possible to do similar exercise for ecs as well, may be using same or different data......? Thanks.
Quote from: eddy35 on Aug 28, 12:44 PM 2013
I always calculate from the high, so 526.
But it wont get back to exactly 526 on the next level, if it goes up from 515 with 6 units on each it'll either be 521 then 527-the new high (using my example)?
Quote from: Chris555p on Aug 28, 12:54 PM 2013
Eddy, Would it be possible to do similar exercise for ecs as well, may be using same or different data......? Thanks.
Sure!
200 spins played, only on red.
About 47 units profit, so about the same as the double dozens.
Highest bet here was 25 units.
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Aug 28, 01:04 PM 2013
But it won't get back to exactly 526 on the next level, if it goes up from 515 with 6 units on each it'll either be 521 then 527-the new high (using my example)?
Sometimes break even, sometimes new high................... for the system it doesn't really matter.
Quote from: eddy35 on Aug 28, 01:09 PM 2013
Sometimes break even, sometimes new high................... for the system it doesn't really matter.
but it'll always be a multiple of 6/12 as it moves up or down 10 spin level wont it?....
anyway, might be worth testing it with what i said to see if it makes a difference. so when you get to the end of a level write down your balance and treat that as the current break even high (ignore if the 1st spin goes above it, just when its starts going down then comes back up).
Hi Eddy
Thanks for the info; Was the data from real Wheel, autowheel or rng....??
Quote from: Chris555p on Aug 29, 09:16 AM 2013
Hi Eddy
Thanks for the info; Was the data from real Wheel, autowheel or rng....??
Roulette Xtreme testing tool.
anyone managed to complete any tests on this system yet?.....seems to have gone quiet over the past couple of days.
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Sep 01, 06:23 AM 2013
anyone managed to complete any tests on this system yet?.....seems to have gone quiet over the past couple of days.
I did a few 200 spins tests and the results are not bad at all. A bit like the ones I posted before. If you play this with a stop loss of 50 units it could work.
I am still stuck on my tracker, just cant figure out some points.....
As soon as I have it solved I will post it.
Have a Nice Day,
Ray
It sure has a potential, i used it also successful with baccarat.
Quote from: Spin4Fun on Sep 01, 04:23 PM 2013
It sure has a potential, i used it also successful with baccarat.
Were you playing Banker or Player?
Use the life time progression is one, but the system you play is still important.
Follow last, or hottest seams to best.
Yes I agree, bet selection is extremely important; Can u give please details as to how u play hottest
for ec's......? Thanks
I had a free afternoon so i manually tested the double dozens system on roulette xtreme. I played until i doubled my bankroll (which started at 500) which took just under 2,700 spins. The chart seems to be rising nicely but with a few dips. The maximum drawdown was 234 which isn't bad at all compared to some systems I've played over this many spins. My eyes hurt now though from staring at the screen so much. I wish I knew how to code a bot for this....but at least we know this is manually tested (so no error in the code).
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Sep 03, 11:51 AM 2013
I had a free afternoon so i manually tested the double dozens system on roulette xtreme. I played until i doubled my bankroll (which started at 500) which took just under 2,700 spins. The chart seems to be rising nicely but with a few dips. The maximum drawdown was 234 which isn't bad at all compared to some systems I've played over this many spins. My eyes hurt now though from staring at the screen so much. I wish I knew how to code a bot for this....but at least we know this is manually tested (so no error in the code).
If you know somebosy who could bot this we can split the cost ;)
i'll chip in too(pun intended)Paypal. 8)
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Sep 03, 11:51 AM 2013
I had a free afternoon so i manually tested the double dozens system on roulette xtreme. I played until i doubled my bankroll (which started at 500) which took just under 2,700 spins. The chart seems to be rising nicely but with a few dips. The maximum drawdown was 234 which isn't bad at all compared to some systems I've played over this many spins. My eyes hurt now though from staring at the screen so much. I wish I knew how to code a bot for this....but at least we know this is manually tested (so no error in the code).
can you please make a summary how your are playing
Quote from: biagle on Sep 03, 03:04 PM 2013
can you please make a summary how your are playing
I just tried this progression on double dozens and it seems to work.
I played it like this :
Level 1 â€" Flat bet 1 unit on 2 dozens. Until you reach 10 spins, you break even or you are up by 1 unit. Whichever is earlier. If you reach a point where you are up by 1 unit or break even, restart the progression from level 1 again.
Level 2 â€" You will reach this stage if you have bet for 10 spins are you in negative territory. Calculate the amount you need to reach positive territory again and divide that by 2. So if you are 5 units down you need 6 to reach a new high, play 3 units on 2 dozens. No need to recover in 1 spin, with double dozens you will have more winning spins.
Level 3.....................etc.......
Unfortunately I don't know anyone who can make a bot for this but I would be happy to chip in too if someone could do it.
The way I played for this test.
I played the 1st and 2nd dozen only the whole time.
1 chip on each
Play for 10 spins
If + 1 during the spins reset
If goes down then comes back up to break even...reset and start again
If it goes 10 and still down work out how much is needed to get to +1 profit and divide by 2....then put that on both dozens.
At this point write down the current bankroll level and treat it as a temporary high
You need 2 wins at the start to be +1. If you get it great, reset. If you get one win ignore it until you get the 2 or keep the temporary high you just marked down in mind then if it starts to go down and come back up to there reset that level.
THAT'S IT
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Sep 03, 03:52 PM 2013
Unfortunately I don't know anyone who can make a bot for this but I would be happy to chip in too if someone could do it.
The way I played for this test.
I played the 1st and 2nd dozen only the whole time.
1 chip on each
Play for 10 spins
If + 1 during the spins reset
If goes down then comes back up to break even...reset and start again
If it goes 10 and still down work out how much is needed to get to +1 profit and divide by 2....then put that on both dozens.
At this point write down the current bankroll level and treat it as a temporary high
You need 2 wins at the start to be +1. If you get it great, reset. If you get one win ignore it until you get the 2 or keep the temporary high you just marked down in mind then if it starts to go down and come back up to there reset that level.
THAT'S IT
If you use Roulette Xtreme you can just open the Bankroll balande trend window next to your roulette window, no need to write it down.
Quote from: eddy35 on Sep 03, 04:20 PM 2013
If you use Roulette Xtreme you can just open the Bankroll balande trend window next to your roulette window, no need to write it down.
I was playing it the way I would if I was doing it for real on an online casino by using notepad....
But I'll look into what you've suggested eddy.
We finished today the life time progression for my bot.
Gone run now loads of test to see with what strategy it will work best.
Quote from: Spin4Fun on Sep 03, 05:39 PM 2013
We finished today the life time progression for my bot.
Gone run now loads of test to see with what strategy it will work best.
Great news :) please try it with my slight addition as the equity curve I posted is surely worth testing further.
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Sep 03, 03:52 PM 2013
Unfortunately I don't know anyone who can make a bot for this but I would be happy to chip in too if someone could do it.
The way I played for this test.
I played the 1st and 2nd dozen only the whole time.
1 chip on each
Play for 10 spins
If + 1 during the spins reset
If goes down then comes back up to break even...reset and start again
If it goes 10 and still down work out how much is needed to get to +1 profit and divide by 2....then put that on both dozens.
At this point write down the current bankroll level and treat it as a temporary high
You need 2 wins at the start to be +1. If you get it great, reset. If you get one win ignore it until you get the 2 or keep the temporary high you just marked down in mind then if it starts to go down and come back up to there reset that level.
THAT'S IT
It is maybe interesting not to divide the bet the first 2 levels of this system. The bet size is still low and you recover almost every time. I just played 200 spins and never had to play the 3rd level.
Statistically you will win 2 out 3 bets and you only need 1 win to recover.
i thought i would record a quick video of how i was playing and unfortunately during the video i encountered the biggest drawdown i'd faced in over 3,000 spins which was unbelievable as i'd chosen to record at that point :) . The max drawdown was over 500 units. It recovered and I guess 500 isn't THAT much but i was putting down over 100 units on each dozen at that level and if a big losing streak had have occurred at that point it would have been into the 1,000s very quickly.
Let me know if you want me to put up the video somewhere so you can see how it go so high.
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Sep 04, 07:00 AM 2013
i thought i would record a quick video of how i was playing and unfortunately during the video i encountered the biggest drawdown i'd faced in over 3,000 spins which was unbelievable as i'd chosen to record at that point :) . The max drawdown was over 500 units. It recovered and I guess 500 isn't THAT much but i was putting down over 100 units on each dozen at that level and if a big losing streak had have occurred at that point it would have been into the 1,000s very quickly.
Let me know if you want me to put up the video somewhere so you can see how it go so high.
I am always interested !! :thumbsup:
Quote from: eddy35 on Sep 04, 07:06 AM 2013
I am always interested !! :thumbsup:
here's the link to the video.
link:://youtu.be/2vaj22WzcPU
OK, test with standard lifetime progression, playing RRB.
2 graphs, one with lifetime, the other with marti, same DB live recent nbrs, same RRB.
Dont aks me why RRB it was the only bet selection that did give with lifetime a nice graph
Quote from: Spin4Fun on Sep 04, 09:36 AM 2013
OK, test with standard lifetime progression, playing RRB.
2 graphs, one with lifetime, the other with marti, same DB live recent nbrs, same RRB.
don't aks me why RRB it was the only bet selection that did give with lifetime a nice graph
the lifetime progression is certainly a nice graph indeed. i think EC is probably the best way to play this. Double dozens is too dangerous on a losing streak.
Is there any specific reason you choose a 10 bet window to readjust the bet amount?
Have you tried either extending the window to say 20 bets or shortening it to say 6 bets?
Or does this all subjective depending upon the variance of your strike rate?
Quote from: Big EZ on Sep 04, 05:22 PM 2013
Is there any specific reason you choose a 10 bet window to readjust the bet amount?
Have you tried either extending the window to say 20 bets or shortening it to say 6 bets?
Or does this all subjective depending upon the variance of your strike rate?
I was thinking the same, but we can only find out by testing.
Quote from: Big EZ on Sep 04, 05:22 PM 2013
Is there any specific reason you choose a 10 bet window to readjust the bet amount?
Have you tried either extending the window to say 20 bets or shortening it to say 6 bets?
Or does this all subjective depending upon the variance of your strike rate?
10 was the number of the orginal design.
In my bot i have made the option, i can vary the amounts of bets per level, the amount of + to a new level, and the reset value, default its on 1, but it can be more, i can also set the amount of levels, and the max amount 1 bet can be, which is the table limit.
So that are many parameters to be tested
Hi Guys,
there are so many variations on the original betting method. Including my own (Block of 10)
Made a excel sheet which gives you the answers to all the methods spoken of.
Have a look at the graphs, intresting to see what each method does.
I think there is something to it, since there are so many options to add to the betting sequences.
Just like BIG EZ wrote, what if we use 5 , 6 , 15 blocks.
Have a great Day,
Ray
Here is the are the graphs for betting on red instead of black
Ray
Quote from: rayhd63 on Sep 04, 06:18 PM 2013
Hi Guys,
there are so many variations on the original betting method. Including my own (Block of 10)
Made a excel sheet which gives you the answers to all the methods spoken of.
Have a look at the graphs, intresting to see what each method does.
I think there is something to it, since there are so many options to add to the betting sequences.
Just like BIG EZ wrote, what if we use 5 , 6 , 15 blocks.
Have a great Day,
Ray
How exactly do you play blocks of 10?
Quote from: Spin4Fun on Sep 04, 09:36 AM 2013
OK, test with standard lifetime progression, playing RRB.
2 graphs, one with lifetime, the other with marti, same DB live recent nbrs, same RRB.
don't aks me why RRB it was the only bet selection that did give with lifetime a nice graph
got any further with this? It seems to me the top graph is fantastic. Could it be tested over 100,000 spins and could you let us know the exact way to play.
QuoteHow exactly do you play blocks of 10?
....here is my tweak to the original, maybe useful to some of you.
I allways play for blocks of 10.
After the first block is over I look at the result.
1 - Should I have a new high or even, I stick with 1 unit for the next block of 10 spins.
2 - should I have a minus on my high , I add the add amount missing to my high +1
And play those units till I have reached a new high, then reset to 1 unit till 1 reach the end of my block
I allways check the outcome of the 10 spin (end of block) an decide how many units I have to bet for a new high...
Hope that helps....
Ray
@eddy35, thanks for your tips. could you please please share your excel file for us?
What I noticed in 200 spins games is that you win about 20% of the number of spins you play. So 200 spins will give a profit of 40 units.
Never go further then the 3th level of the progression, if you go down you go very deep.
My suggestion is to have a stop loss of 75 units and play 200 spin sessions. So for every session you lose, you have to win 2............... My experience is that you will win most of the sessions.
On the picture you see a very typical 200 spin session. I played the classic red/black system, so nothing special.
isn't it better to concentrate on Spin4funs results for EC as double dozens can just get too high.
The graph that was posted last week was borderline grail material.
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Sep 11, 02:07 AM 2013
isn't it better to concentrate on Spin4funs results for EC as double dozens can just get too high.
The graph that was posted last week was borderline grail material.
I also played the EC ( red/black) , so not double dozens. And the graph is almost the same, only spin4fun played a longer session ( 10.000 spins ) so the fluctuations high and low are less visible.
Do you know what kind of bot spin4fun is using?
Yes I know what bot... my Own 8)
The recent 10K spin test was a bad batch in the sense, using 10K older spins had a negative result...
Short term, Speedy gonzales + lifetime progression seams to work ok.
Quote from: Spin4Fun on Sep 11, 05:48 AM 2013
Yes I know what bot... my Own 8)
The recent 10K spin test was a bad batch in the sense, using 10K older spins had a negative result...
Short term, Speedy gonzales + lifetime progression seams to work ok.
That's my idea..................... short sessions of 200 spins, stop loss of 75. 200 spins will give you about 40 units profit.
@Rayhd
In relation to your post at no. 88 above, do u bet continiously the block of ten,
or do u bet waiting specific trigger to come and then only bet ....may be one
at a time.....?; If no win, wait for next trigger to come and so on....? Thanks
Quote from: eddy35 on Sep 10, 06:17 PM 2013
What I noticed in 200 spins games is that you win about 20% of the number of spins you play. So 200 spins will give a profit of 40 units.
Never go further then the 3th level of the progression, if you go down you go very deep.
My suggestion is to have a stop-loss of 75 units and play 200 spin sessions. So for every session you lose, you have to win 2............... My experience is that you will win most of the sessions.
On the picture you see a very typical 200 spin session. I played the classic red/black system, so nothing special.
When you have a 75 unit stop loss, do you move that up when you win? In other words, let's say you start with 500 bankroll, At the start your stop loss of 75 would mean that if got down to 425 you would stop. However, if after playing you got to plus 50 units, and would your stop loss be 475 (425 + 50) or would it remain 425?
@Chris555p
The way I programed the tracker, it continues on. Checks every Block and then decides the betting units.
As soon as it gets to a new high, resets to 1 unit.
Ray
Is there a tracker?
Quote from: doubledime on Sep 13, 05:42 PM 2013
When you have a 75 unit stop-loss, do you move that up when you win? In other words, let's say you start with 500 bankroll, At the start your stop-loss of 75 would mean that if got down to 425 you would stop. However, if after playing you got to plus 50 units, and would your stop-loss be 475 (425 + 50) or would it remain 425?
I calculate the stop loss from the Original bankroll, but you cab change that if you want.
@Rayhd63
Oki thanks mate.
Chris
Which all comes to the Ibobas staking plan/thread posted earlier,but in cycle of 9 spins/....
Compare those 2 bets,you may come to the same conclusion.........
Did some 1000 spin test. Played 2 dozens en 2 colums at the same time. Using the lifetime progression.
Played it the same way as playing only double dozens.
Made 386 units profit.
Quote from: eddy35 on Sep 19, 11:32 AM 2013
Did some 1000 spin test. Played 2 dozens en 2 columns at the same time. Using the lifetime progression.
Played it the same way as playing only double dozens.
Made 386 units profit.
hi eddy35, can you tell us how you played in detail?...
thanks
Hi eddy35,
could I get those 1000 numbers you made the test on ?!?
Do you still have them ?!?
Thanks
Ray
Quote from: Spin4Fun on Sep 04, 05:48 PM 2013
10 was the number of the orginal design.
In my bot i have made the option, i can vary the amounts of bets per level, the amount of + to a new level, and the reset value, default its on 1, but it can be more, i can also set the amount of levels, and the max amount 1 bet can be, which is the table limit.
So that are many parameters to be tested
S4F
What program do you use to test the different options? Is it possible to get a copy?
Thanks
i've been away for a few weeks and I see this thread seems to be dying down....but have we reached a decision as to which is the best way to play this method?......or have people given up on it?
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Oct 04, 06:02 AM 2013
i've been away for a few weeks and I see this thread seems to be dying down....but have we reached a decision as to which is the best way to play this method?......or have people given up on it?
I am waiting for the TS, she came up with the idea but didn't response anymore.
I prefer to play it the classic way....... EC's, 10 times, ................... go for 50 units profit, stop loss 100 For every losing session you have to win 2, and that happens most of the time.
I am testing this with play money. At first it was good, then yesterday it failed big time.
I was winning for about 250 spins, never reached Level 3, then suddenly an extremely bad series of numbers came. I lost every time I raised the bet, couldn't turn it around, so from $0.15 bets I went to $45 bet in about 50 spins.
Beats me where Pryianka has gone. She disappeared as suddenly as she came here.
Quote from: ati on Oct 04, 11:11 AM 2013
I am testing this with play money. At first it was good, then yesterday it failed big time.
I was winning for about 250 spins, never reached Level 3, then suddenly an extremely bad series of numbers came. I lost every time I raised the bet, couldn't turn it around, so from $0.15 bets I went to $45 bet in about 50 spins.
Use a stop loss................ This system is perfect for that.
Ig - I recall some weeks ago Pryianka said she would be off forum for a while due to some holiday to New zealand.
Priyanka is GreatGrampa......she is a he
Quote from: Turner on Oct 05, 02:40 PM 2013
Priyanka is GreatGrampa......she is a he
So they're both dead?...sheesh, how's that for bad luck.
The concept of this method on even chances is perfect.
This concept is very old,many old books illustrate it and this progression has been tested with a lot of modifications.
The conclusions are:
-it must be played in "group of seven spins" and not ten
-when you have to bet 50 units or more,you must divide your loss by 3 and go ahead with "group of seven spins" for each third ,until complete ricovery
-win goal obtained in 80/100 spins played on the three even chances at the same time and in "differentiel",total bkr 1500 units,win goal 20 units
-the strong point of this progression is that for every group of seven,you have 72% probability of W,28% of L.
Let this % work for you in middle/long term
This is one of the best progression so far.
With this outcomes:RRRRRRRRRRRRRRB,playing Black,you win 1 unit.
The deviation is not a problem for this progression.
Suppose we were down 51 and divided by 3 and got 17. Now, we must clear 17 three times. What if, during the attempt to win 17, things so south and we loose another 50. Do the same thing over again?
Yes!
This progression can be boring,but is not very frequent.
Usually one or two even chances go like honey,may be more difficult the last even chance.
Very often it happens that after 30 spins ,for instance,the first even chance is + 8,the second + 3 and the third - 12.
You must to stick to 20 units win goal(not greedy!) and if you have to play 15 units on the third chance,just an exemple,you can partially offset this last number of units(15) with 3 units of the first even chance and 1 unit of the second.
In this way you play only 11 units on the third chance.
I think that in English is mutuality(?):mutualitè in French!
In that way is very rare to reach a bet of 50 units.
Berretta, how is it that for every group of seven,you have 72% probability of W,28% of L ?
Thanks DD
Seven spins have 128 patterns(93 W,35 L).
64 patterns win at the 1st spin,16 win at the 3rd spin,8 at the 5th,5 at the 7th= 93 units
14 lose 1 unit,14 lose 3 units,6 lose 5 units,1 lose seven units= 35 units
93/128 x 100 = 72,656%
It means that at each group of seven spins your probability of winning 1 unit(this is the goal for every group of seven) is 72,656%
Clear?
hi,
beretta28, can you look at my excel, this is correct? i was fallowing last
I'm afraid that you are mistaken.
You must not play all seven spins,if you are + after the first,the third or the fifth spin and of course the 7th.
If you play Black and the outcome is RRBBB(+1),you stop and start again a groupe of seven spins.
In other words you play 7 spins only if your balance is negative.
The principle is the same of the first message of this topic.
ATTENTION!!
All members out there. Let`s stop for a second all of our "methods" and "systems" and focus for a while on this Progression.
Maybe we can come to a common resolution and solve this mystery once and for all.
What the OP says is that you bet always B or R and through progression you come to plus.
Using stop loss.
Using series of 10 or any other number.
We are all here. Lets use our brains together and figure out some common points.
I`m not saying this is a Holy Grail. What the hell is that, anyway?
All good players take their time and have patience.
Please test this method and show your results.
If you found your way and dont want to share, thats ok too. Just say: EVRIKA! and we all understand.
I am losing no more time and am putting this baby in an excel tracker. Will post it FREE for all, of course, at the end.
Bayes, iggiv, George, Winkel, Mr J, teo (Flatino) and all the other old members on this forum, come in and help us out. If you found something
worth while, and dont want to share it with us, its ok also. Just say : YES or NO. por favor, gracias!
Cheers,
Alex
I have pointed out this kind of progression several times in my posts....except as a Ibobas one.....not +1-1....but 1,3,5,7 up/down...always restart from 1 at any new high any stage of the cycle.
Sorry, but i am saying NO, progression can't be a solution. Sorry again.
Neither progressions nor bet selections are the solution.
The negative mathemathical expectation of roulette,makes this game unbeatable.
Because bet selection doesn't exist(at each spin the ball doesn't remember what it has done the previous spins),the only method for surviving as long as possible, with a small wingoal,is a progression well studied with a very very low probability of ruin.
That's why we need an huge bankroll.
Casinos know very well all that and the table limit protect them from this kind of progressions.
But as I said before,if you have a 18000 â,¬ bkr (5 times the max allowed on even chances) and a 100 â,¬ wingoal,you can easily win for a few years,entering a casino twice a week.
To be more precise about bet selection ,it' impossible to forecast next spin or next 50/100 spins.
But it's true that after thousands spins you will notice that singles are double than two consecutive spins,that are the double of three consecutive spins and so on(Marigny law).
Because of that, we must admit that in a very large number of spins(a few thousands)certain laws are fulfilled.
Standard deviation,equilibrium,Marigny law,Gauss courbe,but no scientist or player has found sofar the way to exploit these last points.
And it's very well known that a random generator like roulette is unbeatable.
Unless someone can demonstrate that in certain situations roulette is NOT a perfect random generateur.
But this is a different issue.
so are we saying it's mathematically better to play up to 7 instead of 10..... then move to the next level if down?
is there really need for a stop loss, especially one so low as 50.
the way I'm hoping to play is-
10k bankroll playing a table with as high limits as possible.
start with 1 unit bets
EC (always betting on the last colour spun)
reset at +1
if I have to start going down the 7 spins and it comes back up and bankroll is where i started on that level, reset that level again.
if i get all 7 spins and negative work out how much is need to be at +1 overall
start a new level of 7 spins with that amount.....if it goes down into the 7 but comes back up to the start of that level, reset that level.
So the hope here is that each time a new higher level of 7 spins is started the 1st bet wins and resets.
So what's my odd/chances that this will happen before i go bust not using a stop loss
LE CHIFFRE
If I have well understood your post,I like your comments and way of playing.
The stop loss could be an optional.
You can play as you suggest but:you need a bkr equivalent at 5 times the table limit(in Europe almost in every Casino 3600 x 5=18000 â,¬) and I'm sure you guess why.
As I told at the beginning a lot of tests have been done in the past and even recently on groupes of 3,5,7,9,11,13.
7 is the best compromise.
The probability of losing 5 groupes of seven in a row is 0,13%!
This is a raison why a stop loss,may be higher than 50,could be interesting.
More you play "groupes of 7",more 72% of winning works for you,but also 1,35% of VIG works against you.
My first systeme is, as far my experience is concerned, the best way of playing this progression.
And don't forget to play it "in differentiel" for reducing the amount of bets.
Quote from: beretta28 on Oct 13, 10:30 AM 2013
And don't forget to play it "in differentiel" for reducing the amount of bets.
can you explain this more, how to do this
If you know "in differentiel" technique is quite simple.
If you don't know it,it's too long to explain.
Search in this Forum:for sure you'll find this technique
The following is copied from another topic in the forum:
I like the cancellation method at lot but a modified Oscar's Grind is my favorite bet progression method. I can't say I've found the perfect mix of when to increase the bet sizes by a little or a lot, but I've found a way that works for me most of the time.
I am leaning toward increasing bets after wins and decreasing bets after losses, sometimes. My reasoning is this: If we can keep our bets minimized during periods of high losses and maximize our bet sizes during periods of high wins, we can win. I know that a D'Alembert or Pluscoup won't work well enough. What we need to come up with is a bet method that decreases bet sizes when we're having too many losses close together and raises our bets when we start having a lot of wins close together. This is because we need to have a cluster of wins of large bets of such a size that they recover previous losses before we reach the table limit or our personal bank limit.
Said another way, we need to figure out how to not go too far into the hole during high loss periods and still have plenty of ammo to get out of the hole during high win periods.
I'm talking about something like decrease bet size by 1 unit after a certain number of losses vs wins. Decrease by 2 units if that ratio increases and by 3 units if it increases even more. On the other side, we increase our units when we start getting a higher wins to losses ratio and if it goes even higher we increase more. The dilemma is when and how much. This may include finding ourselves still in the hole when we get back to 1 unit bets.
I'm getting closer all the time. Maybe there's no method that will work under all possibilities, but the search is very interesting for me. I can't ask for much more than that!
GLC
Hi all,
Alex here!
Check the tracker i made.
-1 attack= Groups of 5 bets
-bet the last spun color
-once new max, reset progression to 1
-after 2 failed attacks, stop betting until 1 win
I used random numbers (0,36), you can add your spins in the green left column
each sheet= 3844 numbers
Problem:
huge DD`s sometimes -300k(extreme conditions), huge BR needed
PRESS F9 for refreshing the numbers
Feel free to open the sheet/modify formulas/progression as you wish.
Comments. ideas welcomed/recommended
Regards,
ALex
Bank roll random 3844 random numbers.
Attached below.
Regards,
Alex
Quote from: probasah on Oct 14, 03:14 AM 2013
Hi all,
Alex here!
Check the tracker i made.
-1 attack= Groups of 5 bets
-bet the last spun color
-once new max, reset progression to 1
-after 2 failed attacks, stop betting until 1 win
I used random numbers (0,36), you can add your spins in the green left column
each sheet= 3844 numbers
Problem:
huge DD`s sometimes -300k(extreme conditions), huge BR needed
PRESS F9 for refreshing the numbers
Feel free to open the sheet/modify formulas/progression as you wish.
Comments. ideas welcomed/recommended
Regards,
ALex
if you have time and wish try to create tracker by beretta28 rules
Quote from: probasah on Oct 14, 03:14 AM 2013
Problem:
huge DD`s sometimes -300k(extreme conditions), huge BR needed
300k drawdown?! i would have thought that was impossible using this system?
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Oct 14, 07:35 AM 2013
300k drawdown?! i would have thought that was impossible using this system?
yes, le chiffre, around 300k minus. playing the previous color of the spin.
The graphic looked like the fist diagram i had posted in the post with images.
there are TERRIFIC DD, not only with this system. Tried to switch colors after 2 loses (series of 5), then coming back to the initial color.
trust me, you need to be millionaire to play this system :))))
that leaves me to the question: WHY DO most of the casinos have table limits? To stop progressions!:)
seriously, its lie dropping your hard earned money on the street for some idiot casino managers.
ANd remember this 300k dd on a 3844 spins:)
No limits.
If i put a limit to the progression (ie maximum high reset to 1 after bet= 50 units) the graphs become NEGATIVE. (wow, what a surprise)
Cheers
Quote from: probasah on Oct 14, 09:20 AM 2013
yes, le chiffre, around 300k minus. playing the previous color of the spin.
The graphic looked like the fist diagram i had posted in the post with images.
there are TERRIFIC DD, not only with this system. Tried to switch colors after 2 loses (series of 5), then coming back to the initial color.
trust me, you need to be millionaire to play this system :))))
that leaves me to the question: WHY DO most of the casinos have table limits? To stop progressions!:)
seriously, its lie dropping your hard earned money on the street for some unintelligent casino managers.
ANd remember this 300k dd on a 3844 spins:)
No limits.
If i put a limit to the progression (ie maximum high reset to 1 after bet= 50 units) the graphs become NEGATIVE. (wow, what a surprise)
Cheers
wow that is severe drawdown. do you have a graph of that session? u sure there's not an error in your code? btw the different pictures you've posted are they all the same rules with different sessions....or did you change something on each. What were you doing on picture 8....that looks the best?
thanks
i'm going to spend a couple of days manually testing this on roulette extreme as i never know when to trust trackers/bots as sometimes they show amazing results due to error in the code so i guess the same could be said about bad results too. i will try and do 20k spins manually using the groups of 7 method i mentioned a few posts up. will post the results when i've done.
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Oct 14, 10:01 AM 2013
wow that is severe drawdown. do you have a graph of that session? u sure there's not an error in your code? by the way the different pictures you've posted are they all the same rules with different sessions....or did you change something on each. What were you doing on picture 8....that looks the best?
thanks
Hi le Chiffre,
The diagrams are for Different spins, batches of 3844 spins. Same rules, Different numbers. You can press f9 in the tracker i made and see the same type of diagrams.
They are not for the same numbers.
Cheers,
Alex
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Oct 14, 12:31 PM 2013
i'm going to spend a couple of days manually testing this on roulette extreme as i never know when to trust trackers/bots as sometimes they show amazing results due to error in the code so i guess the same could be said about bad results too. i will try and do 20k spins manually using the groups of 7 method i mentioned a few posts up. will post the results when i've done.
Le Chiffre,
I am in the process of making a tracker for bereta 28 method, but i need to see if i got the rules straight. Maybe you can explain with a couple of Numbers to get the idea.
Regards,
Alex
Quote from: probasah on Oct 14, 02:28 PM 2013
Le Chiffre,
I am in the process of making a tracker for bereta 28 method, but i need to see if i got the rules straight. Maybe you can explain with a couple of Numbers to get the idea.
Regards,
Alex
Hi alex, yes sorry, didn't quite understand for a minute there. ok so I've downloaded the excel sheet and I see what you mean about the drawdown. I just had one that was 400k.
It is possible to make one of these/edit this for the rules that i mentioned a few posts earlier that i want to play?
many thanks
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Oct 14, 02:38 PM 2013
Hi alex, yes sorry, didn't quite understand for a minute there. ok so I've downloaded the excel sheet and I see what you mean about the drawdown. I just had one that was 400k.
It is possible to make one of these/edit this for the rules that i mentioned a few posts earlier that i want to play?
many thanks
Hi le chiffre, sure thing it can be made. Let me have a look at it.
Regards,
Alex
Quote from: probasah on Oct 14, 02:41 PM 2013
Hi le chiffre, sure thing it can be made. Let me have a look at it.
Regards,
Alex
Many thanks
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Oct 14, 03:47 PM 2013
Many thanks
Hey Lechifre,
Sorry for the delay, i have been out. I took a look at your method, and made the tracker for you.
I hope it is what you had in mind, if not, please let me know:
i understood it as follows:
7 spins for an attack, after reset
no bet limit
if during the attack an equal amount to the total bankroll at the beginning, restart the attack
if after 7 spins, negative trend, next attack starts with a bet that gives you a +1 to the overall highest bankroll
Bet selection: EC betting on last spined color
f9 for random numbers or place your spins on the green column.
i got a record DD 37 millions and some pennies:)
Let me know if you need other tweaks,
Regards,
Alex
Quote from: probasah on Oct 14, 05:26 PM 2013
Hey Lechifre,
Sorry for the delay, i have been out. I took a look at your method, and made the tracker for you.
I hope it is what you had in mind, if not, please let me know:
i understood it as follows:
7 spins for an attack, after reset
no bet limit
if during the attack an equal amount to the total bankroll at the beginning, restart the attack
if after 7 spins, negative trend, next attack starts with a bet that gives you a +1 to the overall highest bankroll
Bet selection: EC betting on last spined color
f9 for random numbers or place your spins on the green column.
i got a record DD 37 millions and some pennies:)
Let me know if you need other tweaks,
Regards,
Alex
Wow :) 37 million DD. I guess you'd definitely have the gambler's butterfly stomach during that session.
I don't mean to doubt you but are you sure you're not doing something wrong with your creation of this spreadsheet. Your understanding of my bet method is correct but the DD is just soooo high and I think it would be impossible to reach that kind of DD even with standard Marty?
Quote from: Le_Chiffre on Oct 14, 05:39 PM 2013
Wow :) 37 million DD. I guess you'd definitely have the gambler's butterfly stomach during that session.
I don't mean to doubt you but are you sure you're not doing something wrong with your creation of this spreadsheet. Your understanding of my bet method is correct but the DD is just soooo high and I think it would be impossible to reach that kind of DD even with standard Marty?
Hi Le Chifre,
I don't think the spreadsheet is wrong(although nothing is impossible), the progression might be what created this :) once you get into the hole, you cant get out :) the loss grows exponential.
Cheers,
Alex
Just play this with a stop loss of 100 units and with a 50 units win target. For every losing session you have to win 2.
DD can be very deep with this system but not very frequent. If you check the bankrol curves you can see that.
Quote from: eddy35 on Oct 15, 04:47 AM 2013
Just play this with a stop-loss of 100 units and with a 50 units win target. For every losing session you have to win 2.
DD can be very deep with this system but not very frequent. If you check the bankrol curves you can see that.
are you actively playing this was eddy? just seems what if you stop at 100 loss. then you start again and another 100 loss....and same again etc....
Stop losses where the loss is twice as much as the win, will never work in my opinion. After a loss, you have to win two....for breaking even. You win 3 out of 5 sessions, and you're still in the red.
I tested this system a couple times, and it can make a very slow profit, but I reached a point several times, where I had to bet 200+ units.
Hi eddy35,
NOT Working the -100/+50 reset sessions
see attached file
f9 for new spins
Cheers,
Alex
In my opinion (which you can take it or leave it) this progression is very good.
If it is not working for you then it is not the progression, it is your bet selection.
Find the variance in your BS and then mold this progression around it and you will get fantastic results
Is this dead or alive? Anyone?
Lifetime progression is one of the best i came a cross, it will not for all bet selection, and you do need to try to varia the steps, by default its 10, but you need to try a value between 6 and 10 with the bet selection you want to play.
Thanks. In theory, it looks good.
I guess this is officially dead.
I managed to finish my initial testing against million RNG spins.
Is anyone keen in knowing the results?
Yes, I would love to know the results!
of course im curious?
It should be a disaster, in long run. My opinion.
QuoteIs anyone keen in knowing the results?
I'm interested!
I would love to do some more testing but I need somebody who could code this for RouletteXtreme. Testing by hand takes too much time.
On the first run, It has survived the RNG table limit's of Bet -Voyager. The only online casino, that I know of that has a 0.01c minimum bet limit with a high maximum bet limit.
Once again, I'm not associated with them or any other online casino.
I was playing odd only.
I am now going into details to find out the unit bet at each level and how high and how often did the levels go in a million spins.
If I saw correctly, when my current version was running. It had at some point reached a unit bet of 18600 units that was at
level 6 or 7. I had it stop after a million and the last win. So when it stopped all losses were recovered if it had been betting when it reached a million spins.
Anyways, that's the first observation I have had.
Bottom line: It did however make a nice return on my initial bankroll.
Quoteunit bet of 18600 units
;D Funny enough.
Bet a simple Marty will also give you same results.
I am currently playing this most days live on E.C betting the last colour spun. I am betting 0.10 stakes with a 3k bankroll (so equivalent 30k).
I'm playing William Hill live casino, slingshot in the UK if anyone's interested. My table name is Le_Chiffre.
So far good results. Nothing scary, hardly much drawdown at all. But it is taking a long time to make any worthwhile money. All day playing results in about 40 full size units. But like I said its fairly stress free so far. Just stick a few films on in the background and play this along side throughout the day.
Quote from: kingsroulette on Dec 30, 12:06 AM 2013
;D Funny enough.
I have always said i only invest 60.00 in my account.. Even if you take 60.00 for a unit value of 0.01 is 6000.. If I was able to bet 18600 unit's imagine the profit I made.
btw, I now remember doing this as a bot for someone.
Yes, I'm interested! lets try this progression
link:://:.vlsroulette.com/index.php?action=downloads;sa=view;down=101
Here is the RouletteX code for the same way of playing, only with 5 spin frequences instead of 10.. It really has potential!!
I've tested it on 1 million spins on RX with starting BR of 2500 units and a base bet of 2 units. I tested this in mind with a low BR on a low limit table with no zero, but applies to a bigger BR as well. In my case the BR was 25 Euro with 0.02 Euro base bet. But you can start with 2500 Euro with 2 euro base bet.
I did more than 10 1 million spin tests and from them only 2 were busted but at the very start because of the low BR, but once the BR kept growing it was unstoppable.
The way I had my system is block of 7, bet only on red and a table with no zero, to limit the house edge.
Starting BR: 2500 units. Ending BR after 1.000.014 spins: 405668 units
Interesting fact from the statistics: max consecutive reds was 18 and max consecutive blacks was 19. So with martingale starting from 2 unit bet the size of the bet would be: 524288 with 1048576 total invested ( assuming that there was no table limit ). This is for the guys that say that martingale is a good system.
Marty can be made viable with stop losses. Can your RX tester accomodate stop losses say starting at around 40% along your progression line ? A no bet win is the trigger for the next level money bet. Stop losses continue the same up to the 2nd last level. The limit last level bet is either sink or swim. Switch back losses on stop loss bets are the danger. 40% SL,WLWLWLWL etc. kills the BR.
Stop losses take care of long strings of losses. 1,048,576 total invested would therefore not occur.
This is nothing else but cyclic super martingale where in cycles of 10 spins, if u r not lucky enough to get more and faster wins than losses, you will lose a fortune. This is based upon a presumption that in any cycle, if we get ahead with wins (be it first attempt or 10th), we will get +1.
Let's see cycles, for instance
LLLLL LLWWW -2
LWLWLLWWLL -6
W WE GET A NET PROFIT OF +1 IN THE THIRD CYCLE HERE, WITH MAX BET 7 UNITS ONLY. I have read a similar method somewhere but it was suggested to go with the winner EC of a 10 spins tracking cycle. I mean we track 10 spins and say want to go with Red/Black, check which one has hit more. Go for the highest hitter EC for two cycles of 10 spins. Bet higher hitting EC in every cycle with your losses+1. Go with the winners than losers.
If we have a sticky EC and first two cycle fails badly, like
LLLLL LLWLW =-6, we will bet 7 units per bet in next cycle
LLWLL LWLLW=-28, we need to bet 29 units per bet in next cycle
LLLLW WLLWL NOW IT WILL GET TOO UGLY TO TRY FURTHER.
NOT BETTER THAN PLAYING MARTINGALE AFTER 10 VIRTUAL LOSSES OF AN EC
Quotenteresting fact from the statistics: max consecutive reds was 18 and max consecutive blacks was 19. So with martingale starting from 2 unit bet the size of the bet would be: 524288 with 1048576 total invested ( assuming that there was no table limit ). This is for the guys that say that martingale is a good system.
WITH JUST 2500 CHIPS IN HAND AND PLAYING 10 STEPS MARTY AFTER 10 VIRTUAL LOSSES, MARTINGALE WOULD KILL YOUR 10 MILIONS SPINS. MAX BET 1024.
SIMULATE THIS IN THE SAME DATA AND LET US KNOW.
Quote from: shaquille3 on Feb 03, 10:38 AM 2014
I've tested it on 1 million spins on RX with starting BR of 2500 units and a base bet of 2 units. I tested this in mind with a low BR on a low limit table with no zero, but applies to a bigger BR as well. In my case the BR was 25 Euro with 0.02 Euro base bet. But you can start with 2500 Euro with 2 euro base bet.
I did more than 10 1 million spin tests and from them only 2 were busted but at the very start because of the low BR, but once the BR kept growing it was unstoppable.
The way I had my system is block of 7, bet only on red and a table with no zero, to limit the house edge.
Starting BR: 2500 units. Ending BR after 1.000.014 spins: 405668 units
Interesting fact from the statistics: max consecutive reds was 18 and max consecutive blacks was 19. So with martingale starting from 2 unit bet the size of the bet would be: 524288 with 1048576 total invested ( assuming that there was no table limit ). This is for the guys that say that martingale is a good system.
Since most tables have at least a "0", can you run this with a "0" table? Thank you
Quote from: shaquille3 on Feb 03, 10:38 AM 2014
I've tested it on 1 million spins on RX with starting BR of 2500 units and a base bet of 2 units. I tested this in mind with a low BR on a low limit table with no zero, but applies to a bigger BR as well. In my case the BR was 25 Euro with 0.02 Euro base bet. But you can start with 2500 Euro with 2 euro base bet.
I did more than 10 1 million spin tests and from them only 2 were busted but at the very start because of the low BR, but once the BR kept growing it was unstoppable.
The way I had my system is block of 7, bet only on red and a table with no zero, to limit the house edge.
Starting BR: 2500 units. Ending BR after 1.000.014 spins: 405668 units
Interesting fact from the statistics: max consecutive reds was 18 and max consecutive blacks was 19. So with martingale starting from 2 unit bet the size of the bet would be: 524288 with 1048576 total invested ( assuming that there was no table limit ). This is for the guys that say that martingale is a good system.
The numbers look to good to be true.
If you don't mind, can you share the rx code?
The RX code is above my first post. I just changed the way it bets to only on red and block of 7. I will do a test with a european roulette. This system is very slow and if played with cents its not worth the time. But if played with 1 euro and with a bigger BR its a very good system on the long run.
Risking 1 million spins to earn 1 unit is the craziest example of money management. This progression is a failure.
Thanks for the the scoop!
I am curious about how it works with Baccarat.... i guess it depends on the how closely lost bets can cluster, right?
what do we find here... something for the bot?
Quote from: denzie on Apr 09, 10:51 AM 2015
what do we find here... something for the bot?
I guess the thread is dead.. I'm still using this progression from time to time though. It really has something