If you’re just starting out on your journey of Roulette, you’re going to read many articles of methods to win, articles like how to win with outside bets, (my opinion on these bets is forget them, but that’s my choice), there’s also methods for inside bets.
So here you’ll only see how Random has an average. The distribution of the 37 numbers produces roughly 23, 24 or 25 of the starting non-hit numbers. The non-hit that have not hit will, let’s say 12, would mean there’s 12 repeats of those that have hit.
Now that’s the math way using a cycle of 37 spins, but the author is not a math person, so you’re going to see How 40 spins and up to 60 spins give an average, an average that works with the distribution of the 37 non-hit numbers.
The 37 numbers I was told, could all hit within 155 spins, he showed this with some math formula, that I don’t know, but this did not stop me from finding an average to use with the 37 numbers on the wheel.
So how do you see this average, well in a method called GUT; the great universal theory; the author shows this thing called the TROT, which a few experts ridicule, but don’t worry they know what this mysterious trot is.
These so called experts will try time and time again to persuade you no methods work, but then promote their own methods, I’m not giving them any publicity here, you’ll soon know of their methods once they see this.
Okay so what is this trot that has an average, well if you collect groups of spins and record how many spins each non-hit takes to hit, slowly as you record more and more games you get to see how many spins on average each non-hit takes to hit.
So if you have a sheet like I use that has 6 boxes of 10, you’ll be able to see in these blocks of 10’s there’s an average of how many non-hit, could or should hit in these 10 spins.
Now a member of this forum gave me a tester, to see these miraculous averages, that I managed to produce from pen and paper, the old school way.
back later, superbikes on
Can't wait for the next post! I was thinking along the lines of 60 spins split into 6 sets myself, so I'm eager to understand this...
So what’s this average? The answer is 15; 15 non-hit should/could show in spins 11-40.
Now this is not about KTF betting for non-hits, nor betting for repeats, it’s to show the TROT, showing how there’s options for betting both, if you can read the trot?
How do we know these averages are true? Well on here I use Mortagon’s daily supplied spins (that some idiot on this forum wants him to persist in supplying) there’s over 250 games I’ve used, well sufficient to show this average. Now the famous two will say not enough spins, but believe me that is plenty of spins, and it’s not million’s like they promote.
How are these 15 non-hit distributed over the 30 spins from 11-40? Well as we are looking at 30 spins, 15 is half the 30; so should it not be
11-20; 5
21-30; 5
31-40; 5
15 non-hits, 15 repeats for the 30 spins.
So the tester will show how the average is progressing. So you’ll see 1-10; 11-20; 21-30; 31-40 and last 60; in the checkpoint box.
Quote from: nottophammer on May 26, 07:56 AM 2018
So if you have a sheet like I use that has 6 boxes of 10, you’ll be able to see in these blocks of 10’s there’s an average of how many hit <-corrected
1 Mio. trials, 60 numbers from 0-36:
{8.87, 15.6, 20.7, 24.6, 27.6, 29.8}
So in this checkpoint box is the perfect trot.
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/26/temp_761168.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sJT5t)
spins
11-20; +0
21-30; +0
31-40; +0
The 25 is showing +10, this is the only part not to show properly, Pri forwarded how to correct, but i no coder and can't get it right.
But there is the 15 non-hit and must mean 15 have repeated.
Now you have seen a perfect 5, 5, 5; but the trot is not always the 5, 5, 5; it shows more like 7, 5, 3
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/26/temp_221499.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sJFxf)
If spins 1-10 is 9/10 the most common for these 10 spins, if the average for next 30 spins is 15 non-hit, should you not see 24 non-hit.
The above shows just that, the 7, 5, 3
another checkpoint
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/26/temp_308660.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sJOI1)
10+15=25; spin 40, 25 non hit, so 15 came. But not the even 5, 5, 5,
another
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/26/temp_248103.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sJUo5)
9+15=24 and there's the 24 at spin 40
Now one of many that come close to the 15
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/26/temp_941339.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sJl0r)
23 non-hit at spin 40 of the checkpoint, just 1 non-hit short of the 15 average
Mort's for today :thumbsup:
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/26/temp_586565.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sJwCx)
So you see the average of spin 11-40 is 15 non-hit.
You need to work with the 15 expected.
Mort's average
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/26/temp_973128.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sJ0jK)
Not mention spin 60 but todays checkpoint speaks for it's self
Not millions of spins to find such a constant average
Quote from: nottophammer on May 26, 09:53 AM 2018
Mort's for today :thumbsup:
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/26/temp_586565.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sJwCx)
So you see the average of spin 11-40 is 15 non-hit.
You need to work with the 15 expected.
Again, you Will profit on spin 13!
If you only play First profit, you wouldn't lose many session, but People on here don't realise that. Don't aim for +50 profit, the chances that you Will dig yourself into a whole is far greater, then bet only for First profit.
Hell, Most of the Times spin 11 is First profit. If you lose First spin, Just take the loss and retrack 10 spins Without repeat. If you lose First spin you only need 3 wins to be in profit again. But you Will win far More then you lose. Just my opinion :thumbsup:
Thats good Ed
But its about the trot.
You start with all 37 #'s
After 10 spins if you agree with mort's shown average of 15 non-hit in spins 11-40
in spins 11-20 watch how the non-hit come, if it's a straight 5 thats the expected, if it was 9/10 in 1-10 you'd now have 14 non-hit in 15 spins, aren't repeats due?
or see if 7 non-hit come before spin 20 in spins 11-20, 7;+2 is the norm, if you was at spin 18 and 7 non-hit have come, are 2 repeats coming in the last 2 spins.
You have to make dicisions when to bet you've seen 5, 5, 5 is the even distribution, but the normal distribution is 7, 5, 3; why 7 it still favours non-hit as the larger group
spins 21-30 it's 50/50 non-hit to the 1x's
spins 31-40 it's more to repeat as the non-hit have depleted
roulettefan
Hope you can see the trot from 11-40 using the expected 15 non-hit.
To all who know todays Morts game is where we'd need a big bank, betting for the repeat, but it wins +490
If just KTF that wins the units.
Now it's no fluke that 15 non-hit is the average, you've seen, now build your own data base, and you'll see 15 point something is the average for 11-40.
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/27/temp_686361.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/shUbx)
Remember the score of 1-10 today the common 9/10; so 9+15=24
Now the best thing i ever found for watching the trot, "countback"
It shows where the 15 non-hit should/could hit
So whats the Mort avg for spins 11-20; answer 6
Jackpot 247 11-20; answer 7
We get the usual for spins 1-10; 9/10 so the expected start.
Now this is about the trot, so it's just watch, 10th is on time, so if you was Ktf win, so Eddy would reset, but it's just watch 11th is on time to countback, now you should remember Winkel's reference point spin 13; 2 repeats; so game is perfect.
12th; 13th and 14th are early, so thats the even 5 non-hit met at spin 16; now it's decision time, remember the Mort and jackpot averages, do you bet for repeat or wait, if you are really looking for saftey wait to see where 7,+2 hits, you see spin 19 the expected 14th non-hit, but the 16th has hit, so now bet for repeat.
Now to please General Dickhead, you could bet for repeat after spin18 Morts average 6, so bet all 15,1x's; lose, so now bet all 16 the jackpot avaerage 7, win 15+16=31; +5
For Mr J and the above mentioned dickhead THAT'S HOW TO USE THE TROT game over man
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/27/temp_346269.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/shePK)
6TH sense and co, this shows why the win came betting 8 R1's, if we'd carried on with the reset to units of 1, we'd be betting to many R1's, all okay with this
Quote from: daveylibra on May 26, 08:48 AM 2018
Can't wait for the next post! I was thinking along the lines of 60 spins split into 6 sets myself, so I'm eager to understand this...
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/27/temp_593476.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/shLAU)
Can use in B+M
Thanks for this Notto!
Now I have just been studying your green charts and I get it!
It seems though that they show betting on the non-hits, after spin 10, with up 1 on a lose, down 1 on a win.
But I thought it depends on the Trot? The charts seem to show betting on non-hits come-what-may. No decisions to be made.
(By the way, I know from my charts we get more and more repeats after about 30 spins.Maybe good to stop around the 25 mark?)
Just trying to understand...
Cheers
Dave
Quote from: daveylibra on May 28, 11:26 AM 2018
Thanks for this Notto!
Now I have just been studying your green charts and I get it!
It seems though that they show betting on the non-hits, after spin 10, with up 1 on a lose, down 1 on a win.
But I thought it depends on the Trot? The charts seem to show betting on non-hits come-what-may. No decisions to be made.
(By the way, I know from my charts we get more and more repeats after about 30 spins.Maybe good to stop around the 25 mark?)
Just trying to understand...
Cheers
Dave
The ktf thread is a great start..also go throughout nottys post...there very helpful..nottys sheet and ayks tracker are probably the only two things worth there weight in gold on here
Notty gets a lot of stick ...even though he explained what he’s doing..I suggest listen to him look at his stuff..and see what else you can learn from that green sheet..👍
Quote from: 6th-sense on May 28, 01:18 PM 2018
The ktf thread is a great start..also go throughout nottys post...there very helpful..nottys sheet and ayks tracker are probably the only two things worth there weight in gold on here
Notty gets a lot of stick ...even though he explained what he’s doing..I suggest listen to him look at his stuff..and see what else you can learn from that green sheet..👍
Yes, you are so Right! If everyone would Just stop and bashing on everyone. And instead of that, try to look it at a possitive way, so that we can Help eachother and learn from eachother. But i guess, for some members that would be a too hard thing to do. Pitty
Any chance of posting a link to the original KTF thread? I've been searching for it with no success.
Quote from: daveylibra on May 28, 02:56 PM 2018
Any chance of posting a link to the original KTF thread? I've been searching for it with no success.
Here you go my friend.
:.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=16512.0
Cheers Jek! I'm reading through it, then I shall look at as many of those green charts as possible.
here are some pics of how your check points dancing hope it helps
M, all look good to me.
Maestro remember i said leaving #27 well here's the spins, just using averages for 11-40.
+201 betting for repeats.
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/29/temp_159959.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/siSfU)
Even (link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/29/temp_948412.gif) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/six5g)could do it on MPR :lol:
With returns like that I have no doubt that you and JEKH must be at the top of the leader board on the MPR...right? ::)
Daft head what if we are, we are there because we take no notice of idiots like you and your best buddy :lol:
Top man to Notto for KTF! (I assume it stands for keep the faith?)
a) You've posted the exact system b) No crazy progressions c) No hundreds of spins
d) Stood the test of time (?)
Now compare this to the vagaries of Turbo's repeats. I must say that any system that has us bet 25 units on one spin must be dangerous, because obviously any spin can lose. And we cannot test because we don't know exactly what it is...
Now has anyone coded KTF? I ask not because I want to see 10000000s of spins, but because with code I could quickly trial, say 200 chunks of 60 spins, and see how best we could manage maximum spins/ repeats/ drawdown before we stop.
As with a lot of good ideas on here, I think if they show potential then this would be the best way to find their worth. Would save 100s of pages of debate. If only I could code it myself...
To Davey or anybody,
I just modified my KTF excel sheet to enable different parameter modifications for testing.
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/30/temp_361042.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sPxXi)
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/30/temp_940507.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sPMiA)
Here you can modify in the blue cells (shown with default values):
base unit;
goal, stop-loss;
progression value up AND down;
Starting spin;
Option ''profit lock'': stop at xx units below maximum reached;
Option to stop when the chosen progression level failed.
Some results are extracted and copied into other columns:
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/30/temp_196375.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sPY2s)
2 graphs, at spin60 and spin100.
I created a macro that, only with ctrl+k, copies excel rng values in the right column, extracts results and adds them to the board. Unfortunately, I tried to attach it but it does not accepts .xlsm files, only .xlsx. So I share the file without macro. It is easy to create one, though.
A hundred times ctrl+k and a hundred tests done...
Enjoy! And tell if there are any bugs...
I
Little tweak:
version with ''Reset progression at new high''.
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/05/31/temp_886387.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sPu1U)
Utterly brilliant! I shall try this out....
Davey
Look at this
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_347654.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgwtH)
Today 1st of June, hows it going to change 15.6/7
So lets do some curve fitting knowing 15.6/7 is coming in 11-40.
Seen this earlier (link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_998940.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sg03d)
So you either just KTF or watch, ROTT
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_927520.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sg67U)
For the bloke who hasn't read KTF win spin 15 so stop,
OOh look (link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_295799.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sg9yg)But if he'd read he'd know when to stop, definitely shit for brains
Now the curve fitting in spins 11-20
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_595864.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgSWV)
Yes there's the most common for spins 1-10 the old 9/10.
So this is ROTT, just watch using average.
Above we see the distribution of Morts spins for 11-40; 6, 6, 3; so you're waiting to see how many non-hits are coming in spins 11-20; expected is 6, here you see 1st 5 are non-hit, this is where KTF stops, so these 5 non-hit have given the 1st even 5; of the 5, 5, 5 =15
So now you're getting excited, 1 more non-hit and Mort's average is in, but its repeat, next spin is a non-hit, thats the 6 expected, so now you could bet for repeats and look repeat win.
Now you could be +50 with KTF or using averages be +21;
Look to checkpoint box (link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_997237.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgWBt)spin 30 theres 12 of the 15 and at 40 theres showing the 15 expected non-hits have come
Spin 60 i've not mentioned much, so what's Morts expected 29.4; so here it's 1 short, it gave 4 more non-hit in 20 spins, you're telling me you couldn't get a win after spin 40, you'd better get studying
Quote from: nottophammer on Jun 01, 05:18 AM 2018
So lets do some curve fitting knowing 15.6/7 is coming in 11-40.
:xd:
Quote from: nottophammer on Jun 01, 05:38 AM 2018
Now the curve fitting in spins 11-20
:xd: :xd:
Good to have you back Notto, hope you`re feeling better! :thumbsup:
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_943627.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgYd5)
Ross
You have to have Faith, here it is 9/10 the most common, so an easy +10 from spin 4
If you're nice Nimo will tell you more :thumbsup:
Thank you Zero
Lets see if I can get you thinking along the spins/ TROT
I've shown you Morts 6, 6, 3; i;ve told of Jackpot247 avg: 7, 5 , 3, so two different sources
So here would be decision time(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_839660.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sg1gr)
This is how you have to be thinking, like chess 3 or 4 moves in front.
You've got to spin 20 and see fast for non-hit 8; +3 so this next 10 spins is what? 12, +2 for spin 30, so if you're at 8 non-hits then you'd expect 4 more, spin 21 non-hit, its fast for non-hit, the larger group is depleteing, so these called 1 hits need to repeat.
Spin 26 it's 12; +2, 12 of the 15 have come, what would you chose?
Remember its 1/37 LMAO
These spins are from jackpot247, last 6 days, i'm actually a month behind, but these 6 days had to be taken out of the sky planner.
The avg for J247 in spins 11-40 is 7, 5, 3
See how you get on, even i don't know what happens yet
So good luck
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_165717.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgPdo)
here's 1st
look at checkpoint
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_760553.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sggjp)
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_608613.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgcF0)
average shit hot here, +0; +0; +1
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_342463.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgqAH)
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_500876.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgZ5U)
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_813737.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgkxg)
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_484005.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgoIV)
So remember these 6 games are J247, its avg for 11-40 is 7, 5, 3
Work with these and you're reading the TROT,
now this is an old RNG for bookies, never kept up, look at the spins 11-40 it's 15.7; the avg 7,5,3 is good for this
So with averages 7, 5, 3 and Morts 6, 6, 3 and Nimos' old drinking vessel, piece of !! even on R-sim where we don't have any collected data for average, but average worked
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_294157.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgn0f)
Here Ross just the ordinary game not the rated so no snipped chart haha, haha
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_672366.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgyC1)
Spin 45; 29 non-hit at 63, 30th non-hit
Do you want the green chart :thumbsup:
Hi bigbroben !
I downloaded the file above and Excel popped up, with the random numbers and graphs. But control+k just gives me "insert hyperlink". Is it supposed to show me a new set of random spins? And how do I find the 100 runs you did?
Sorry to be thick but Excel is not my forte.
Meanwhile a have made a couple of Basic programs that simulate spins, after x runs show the max. no. of repeats between 11-Input number, etc. I shall put them on this forum later today...
I know. I was not allowed to attach a .xlsm doc, the one with the macro. Only .xlsx without macro.
Found a few errors in my sheet: will correct and add new values and maybe remove some that are not that relevant.
Working also on a "anti-ktf" where nrs are added instead of removed.
Yes, please show your stuff!
Notto
Amazed by your output (or is it input) and
you seem to be much into the "average"
however I've not been able to grasp the
relevance of it.
Can you explain in a few words what the
"average" is the average of and what you
do with it?
Using this till MPR roll out,
Just used known averages and the required prog to get the win
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/04/temp_927096.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sqPCl)
Quote from: nottophammer on Jun 01, 05:12 AM 2018
Davey
Look at this
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/06/01/temp_347654.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/sgwtH)
Today 1st of June, hows it going to change 15.6/7
The above was for Mortagon spins, which for some reason stopped being posted.
So here is that average of 15 non-hit in spins 11-40; 30 spins. R.org 580 checkpoints of 148 spins.
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/09/04/source.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/tVULQ)
Now for the purists who have to have real live spins, these checkpoints are from spins from Westspiel Casino Bremen
(link:://:.pichost.org/images/2018/09/04/sourcec8752.png) (link:://:.pichost.org/image/tVeoy)
Only 60 sets of 185 spins done from 20775 spins, but the 15 non-hit is there.
In around 40 days i'll show some great data