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Roulette-focused => Testing zone => Topic started by: Winner on Jan 23, 10:45 AM 2019

Title: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 23, 10:45 AM 2019
Ok you have 36 spin cycle .
We look at what happens after the first spin and if it chops or becomes a 🏃
Ex. 20 10. 36 25 .5 10.
      3 6 .5 12. 27 23.
      1 18, 34 20 .1 32
      5 24. 35 2 . 6 28.
     1, 5 . 10 30.4 10
     2.31.2 23.1 19.
 So here we have total of  9 runs and 9chops using High and lows this is done in pairs.
I have only done short test on this around 10000 spins .
But notice that the runs have never gone below 5 in a 36 spin cycle and at most 14 .i have a few ways to bet this but like to have opinions on how you would approach this.
You will see that when testing this there will be a lot of the same results within 36 spin cycles.
Ex 36 spins I’ll get 9 chops an 9 runs and it will at times repeat the same result 3 and sometimes 4 in a row   Sessions.need testing don’t have simulation or RX.
And so easy to play I have a few ways to get profit .evey time I play.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 23, 11:16 AM 2019
I’m going to use 1s and 2s to demo my results this is using my favourite bet high  and lows  on a double zero wheel  because these number are  paired up on the wheel .i ingnore the zeros.for now deal with the later. Some of my session 36 spin cycle betting every second spin.to get the results. And I will show the results only in the runs which is the 2 the ones are chops.


121221221122121211= 9 runs
222111212111121212=8 runs
122212122211112222=11
22212211212122112=10
112222111222112221=10 here u see repeat of 10 this happens at times 4 times in row.
222211122122122122=12
212221222222211121=12 here’s another repeat of result.
And so on  this happens quite a bit and in my  test haven’t seen yet the 2 s go below 5 and more then  14.





Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 23, 11:23 AM 2019
Here are 4 sessions where the 1s beat the 2s 4 in row
111212112221212112=8
112221211111221221=8
122211121121212211=8
121112112222121211=8
Same results
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 23, 12:02 PM 2019
If I can beat the double zero wheel the single zero and no zero will be a piece of 🧁 the first way to bet this is simple i bet for a sum of 5 2s within the 36 spins of coarse progression is needed no way around thAt there is a more profitable bet selection but there’s the first way to bet?
If your make +4 units in one hr, playing on even money your doing well. And -10 on the flip side
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 23, 12:10 PM 2019
Ideas are welcome :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 23, 12:18 PM 2019
Here is a couple OF session where a +10 in one hr or less depending on what wheel you play
112212211211111111=5 here I made 5 units before the run of 8 1s
111211111211122121=5
Here is a back to back result of 5 
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 10:54 AM 2019
The key here are The results how to bet and keep it close to 50%
Here are more session test
121122112121111211= 6 2s = 🏃
212212211121121212=9
121222212112221111=9
212121222112121211=9. 3sessions of the same results  in a row
2122222211122122212= 12
111212212212211122=9

There has to be a way to bet this to keep it close to 50%
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 02:36 PM 2019
What I’m seeing here with 2s every 100 bets this does not go below 33 thats close to 3 std.
Still working on how to  best play this.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 02:58 PM 2019
Just figured it out my profit Has  to be 20units my bet selection is complete.
Man that was a lot of work .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Jan 24, 03:07 PM 2019
You can't beat any game where the house pays you even money for a bet you will win only 47.36 % of the time.

It doesn't make any difference how much you try to twist and turn trying to predict future sequences or how you vary your bet sizes, you will lose about 5.26% of the amount you bet on a 00 wheel in the long haul on even chances. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 03:17 PM 2019
You can't beat any game where the house pays you even money for a bet you will win only 47.36 % of the time.

It doesn't make any difference how much you try to twist and turn trying to predict future sequences or how you vary your bet sizes, you will lose about 5.26% of the amount you bet on a 00 wheel in the long haul on even chances. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.
Been at this very long time  . But thanks  for the bad news.
I might of graduated to buying my self Dinner .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Jan 24, 03:30 PM 2019
Put it another way.

You and I toss a fair coin. You get the chance to predict if it will land heads or tails.

If you predict right I pay you $95. If you predict wrong, you pay me $100.

Would you be prepared to play this game with me over a long period?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 03:35 PM 2019
Put it another way.

You and I toss a fair coin. You get the chance to predict if it will land heads or tails.

If you predict right I pay you $95. If you predict wrong, you pay me $100.

Would you be prepared to play this game with me over a long period?
[/quot
How about I’ll give you a$1000 if you predictheads or tails but I’ll flip the coin
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Jan 24, 03:37 PM 2019
You didn't answer if you would play my game or not.  Casinos don't give you a choice of rules ;)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 03:47 PM 2019
You didn't answer if you would play my game or not.  Casinos don't give you a choice of rules ;)
I answered you I will flip the coin and I will win.leave casino out of it.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 03:49 PM 2019
You always have  choice to bet or to not bet in the casinos . But I’m not sure where you play
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Jan 24, 03:55 PM 2019
I would never agree to play your game.

But my game is exactly the same one you are trying to beat at a casino. You would have a choice if you didn't want to bet on the next toss if you wanted.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 03:59 PM 2019
I would never agree to play your game.

But my game is exactly the same one you are trying to beat at a casino. You would have a choice if you didn't want to bet on the next toss if you wanted.
If you don’t agree to play my way then you must move on grasshopper .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 04:01 PM 2019
The only way gamblers lose  is they over stay ther welcome and  they get burnt.idiots
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Jan 24, 04:07 PM 2019
In fact, the coin could come up heads ten times in a row without you betting and I'd still offer $95  to your $100 on the next spin.

And you'd still lose in the long run.

Better find a 36 pocket wheel where they pay even money and you'll break even.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 04:14 PM 2019
In fact, the coin could come up heads ten times in a row without you betting and I'd still offer $95  to your $100 on the next spin.

And you'd still lose in the long run.

Better find a 36 pocket wheel where they pay even money and you'll break even.
Ok grasshopper
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 04:23 PM 2019
212221111112212122. +3
211122121221112112 +5
212111112112212121+2
211222121212222211+3
112211211211222211+6
Profit+19      1 hr 1/2 of play bye bye  casino see you tomorrow.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 24, 04:32 PM 2019
212221111112212122. +3
211122121221112112 +5
212111112112212121+2
211222121212222211+3
112211211211222211+6
Profit+19      1 hr 1/2 of play bye bye  casino see you tomorrow.

What Do the 1s and 2s represent Mr Winner?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 04:42 PM 2019
What Do the 1s and 2s represent Mr Winner?
It’s on the first page Bw
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 24, 04:43 PM 2019
Ok you have 36 spin cycle .
We look at what happens after the first spin and if it chops or becomes a 🏃
Ex. 20 10. 36 25 .5 10.
      3 6 .5 12. 27 23.
      1 18, 34 20 .1 32
      5 24. 35 2 . 6 28.
     1, 5 . 10 30.4 10
     2.31.2 23.1 19.
 So here we have total of  9 runs and 9chops using High and lows this is done in pairs.
I have only done short test on this around 10000 spins .
But notice that the runs have never gone below 5 in a 36 spin cycle and at most 14 .i have a few ways to bet this but like to have opinions on how you would approach this.
You will see that when testing this there will be a lot of the same results within 36 spin cycles.
Ex 36 spins I’ll get 9 chops an 9 runs and it will at times repeat the same result 3 and sometimes 4 in a row   Sessions.need testing don’t have simulation or RX.
And so easy to play I have a few ways to get profit .evey time I play.

Oops, thanks!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 24, 04:55 PM 2019
Very good work Winner. I love the concept , like you say, the key is how to take advantage?
Do you find the best average range of 1s and 2s (around the 9ish mark) and then back one of them to reach it ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 05:08 PM 2019
Very good work Winner. I love the concept , like you say, the key is how to take advantage?
Do you find the best average range of 1s and 2s (around the 9ish mark) and then back one of them to reach it ?
I’ve tried that but sometime you can get caught in a opposite long run or chops.
Of course the 9ish is the break even mark but there’s more imbalance then balance.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 24, 05:56 PM 2019
These intervals of 9s 120000 spins zeros are the repeat of 9 back to back

662060040858700272 ,10 ,2450230510,13,228202200306210052104638,16 ,432522 ,16,220,11,5424,16,2001303,10,76
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 25, 11:52 AM 2019
How are you playing the 2s Winner? Surely the randomness of 1s and 2s becomes little more than guess work on Even Chances or something similar?
Anyway I hope your tests continue to prove positive
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 25, 01:46 PM 2019
How are you playing the 2s Winner? Surely the randomness of 1s and 2s becomes little more than guess work on Even Chances or something similar?
Anyway I hope your tests continue to prove positive
Just coming up with a great statagie that everyone can use for years to come.
 blackjack players count cards to get an edge well I’m finding a way to do the same .just polishing it right now .
I played with Vb even computer but there is still a way to win consistently win even chances.you beat the the outsid you beat the inside old SPIKe used to say
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Jan 25, 01:55 PM 2019
Just coming up with a great statagie that everyone can use for years to come.
 blackjack players count cards to get an edge well I’m finding a way to do the same .just polishing it right now .
I played with Vb even computer but there is still a way to win consistently win even chances.you beat the the outsid you beat the inside old SPIKe used to say

Nice Winner, keep it up.  I'd imagine your best bet would be a no zero or la partage wheel...what you're working on wouldn't be an option for 00 wheels correct?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 25, 03:21 PM 2019
Nice Winner, keep it up.  I'd imagine your best bet would be a no zero or la partage wheel...what you're working on wouldn't be an option for 00 wheels correct?
[/quote
I wish we had a no zero or la partage here in Canada brick mortar .
The only reason I play 00 wheel is because it’s air ball and it’s fast.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Bigbroben on Jan 25, 05:20 PM 2019
Result of 10k games, 200 spins each, so 2 millions spin, using Excel random.

With a defined goal/stoploss:
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F01%2F25%2Fsourcef3235.png&hash=215c28184886d6e3b179334f0f3924eb) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OXfVf)

If played until the 200 spins are done (truly 2million spins):
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F01%2F25%2Fsource23803.png&hash=b9a276486506838ed1e164fc369792a3) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OXhh1)

Edge: 0.36%
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: daveylibra on Jan 25, 05:54 PM 2019
212221111112212122. +3
211122121221112112 +5
212111112112212121+2
211222121212222211+3
112211211211222211+6
Profit+19      1 hr 1/2 of play bye bye  casino see you tomorrow.

Hi Winner! Interesting variation of how to play roulette...Now, if 0 comes up, do you put that down as a loss, or wait for the next number?
eg,  25, 0, 30,   would that be a run, or have you started again on the 25?
Also, in your example above, taking the 1st line, how many wins (runs) are you going for? You obviously are not stopping at the 1st win.
Now, the problems begin when we have a lot of 1111s at the start.
Why not wait until we see, say, three 1s (chops) and then we will be betting for 5 wins from 15. ( 5 being the lowest number of 2s you have seen, right?) We could find the best progression to cover this.
Am I understanding all this correctly?

Cheers
Dave
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 25, 05:57 PM 2019
Result of 10k games, 200 spins each, so 2 millions spin, using Excel random.

With a defined goal/stoploss:
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F01%2F25%2Fsourcef3235.png&hash=215c28184886d6e3b179334f0f3924eb) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OXfVf)

If played until the 200 spins are done (truly 2million spins):
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F01%2F25%2Fsource23803.png&hash=b9a276486506838ed1e164fc369792a3) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OXhh1)

Edge: 0.36%

Which system is this??
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Bigbroben on Jan 25, 06:02 PM 2019
It's not the one described here.  This I can tell you.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 25, 06:21 PM 2019
If it is as awesome as the chart suggests, you should be down casino raking it in my friend, and buying drinks on the house!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Bigbroben on Jan 25, 06:36 PM 2019
Unless I just finished it yesterday...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Jan 25, 06:41 PM 2019
Nice job Ben, wow!  :love:

Now...did you have on the red socks or the blue socks for the testing, I am taking notes... :twisted:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 25, 06:45 PM 2019
Unless I just finished it yesterday...

In that case, get some rest, because the rest of your life is going to be like wolf on wall street!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Bigbroben on Jan 25, 08:39 PM 2019
Nice job Ben, wow!  :love:

Now...did you have on the red socks or the blue socks for the testing, I am taking notes... :twisted:

No sock selection.  No bet selection at all, actually.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: ozon on Jan 25, 08:59 PM 2019
Bigbroben
My congratulations.
If I can ask, what bets were used , EC or insidebets
The second graph looks very smooth
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 25, 09:07 PM 2019
Hi Winner! Interesting variation of how to play roulette...Now, if 0 comes up, do you put that down as a loss, or wait for the next number?
eg,  25, 0, 30,   would that be a run, or have you started again on the 25?
Also, in your example above, taking the 1st line, how many wins (runs) are you going for? You obviously are not stopping at the 1st win.
Now, the problems begin when we have a lot of 1111s at the start.
Why not wait until we see, say, three 1s (chops) and then we will be betting for 5 wins from 15. ( 5 being the lowest number of 2s you have seen, right?) We could find the best progression to cover this.
Am I understanding all this correctly?

Cheers
Dave

Yes you are understanding correctly. Yes you could wait until you have 1111 .its all good
I ignore the zero  so if you have 23 0 I would continue until I had a result.
And no I don’t 🛑 on the first win i bet every second spin.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Bigbroben on Jan 25, 09:16 PM 2019
This is ECs, so I thought it was good to post in the ''Beating the even money'' thread!

But forget it: I just found an error in my sheet!!!  So it's all BS, back to -2.7%...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Proofreaders2000 on Jan 25, 10:36 PM 2019
Lemme try :)

Track the last six even chance outcomes, bet the majority once.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Jan 26, 03:26 AM 2019
Lemme try :)

Track the last six even chance outcomes, bet the majority once.

No, the results will show this is not the right strategy what you find mate.

Bigbroben, nice picturesy will you reveal your strategy her?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 26, 04:01 AM 2019
No, the results will show this is not the right strategy what you find mate.

Bigbroben, nice picturesy will you reveal your strategy her?
He has literally just said that there was an error in the program and so they were not correct
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 26, 04:25 PM 2019
The biggest drawdown 26 units 7500 betsif you were flatbetting.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 26, 04:43 PM 2019
So here was my last test on this observation of 2s
222212212111111211=8 -2 deficit
22212222222212122=15  +9 profit
221221111111122211=9 even
111211211111122221=6 -6 deficit
112222122122121211=10 +3 profit
212222211222122221=13+8 profit
20 units not bad
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: plolp on Jan 26, 05:09 PM 2019
@ Winner :
how do you define your "2" and your "1"
on this series of high and low ?

HHHHHLLLHH =  2 2 1 2 1 2

is it like that ? 
Thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 26, 05:14 PM 2019
@ Winner :
how do you define your "2" and your "1"
on this series of high and low ?

HHHHHLLLHH =  2 2 1 2 1 2

is it like that ? 
Thanks


Simple
# 12  5 is 2s
# 12 36 Is 1s
It’s just another way of keeping track of repeats and chops in a two spins to get results .
In your ex. 22122
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: plolp on Jan 26, 05:25 PM 2019
In your ex. 22122

  OK  I understand
So when there is 3 L
you notice 2 
Thank you .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: plolp on Jan 26, 05:35 PM 2019
to be sure
another example :

H
H    2
H
H   2
L
L    2
L
H   1
H
L    1
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 26, 06:10 PM 2019
So here was my last test on this observation of 2s
222212212111111211=8 -2 deficit
22212222222212122=15  +9 profit
221221111111122211=9 even
111211211111122221=6 -6 deficit
112222122122121211=10 +3 profit
212222211222122221=13+8 profit
20 units not bad
So you tend to see more 2s.? Do you switch up what EC you use or stick to one in particular
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: plolp on Jan 26, 06:21 PM 2019

no reason there is more "2" than "1"
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 26, 06:59 PM 2019
no reason there is more "2" than "1"
Exactly. So no reason to simply bet for more 2s than 1s. No better than any EC bet
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: ozon on Jan 26, 07:53 PM 2019
Plolp
So out of curiosity, what do you play on RS with such results.
Very short sessions and a lot of winnings
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: plolp on Jan 26, 08:41 PM 2019

The last 23 sessions are all played the same way.
If you look at them carefully, you have to notice what I'm doing.

I play without any attention to history (because I play directly)

No attention to numbers coming out while I play.

No intuition either.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 26, 09:43 PM 2019
to be sure
another example :

H
H    2
H
H   2
L
L    2
L
H   1
H
L    1
Correct
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 26, 09:46 PM 2019
Exactly. So no reason to simply bet for more 2s than 1s. No better than any EC bet

It is an EC bet all I said was that it is a way to track even bet between run and changes.the 🔑 is how to bet and make profit consistently.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 26, 09:56 PM 2019
You can choose to play chops and play 1s it doesn’t matter what I’m not doing is following a pattern or betting the same old Ftl or dbl that stuff doesn’t work ,if you want to wait for 3in row and then bet that’s fine 10 in a row of1s and 2s are rare but they do show it’s ugly face 130000 spins 2s happened only once .and 1s once but that’s a small sample so I don’t no on a a 100000 spins but I don’t care about that I’m In The casinos very short period make my profit and leave.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 26, 10:06 PM 2019
112111212111112111=4  -10
212211221212122111=9  +2 profit
222211212112122221=11+4
222111221222111222=11+4
2112122222221121222=12+6
211222122111221121=9 even
1211122112222122121=10+2
122211111112212122=8-2
221121111221111112=6-7
112121111121111122=5-6
222212221111121222=11+3
Total +21
Again it’s easy I’m only playin for repeat
I use flat combing a progression but not to crazy .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 26, 10:10 PM 2019
You can choose to play chops and play 1s it doesn’t matter what I’m not doing is following a pattern or betting the same old Ftl or dbl that stuff doesn’t work ,if you want to wait for 3in row and then bet that’s fine 10 in a row of1s and 2s are rare but they do show it’s ugly face 130000 spins 2s happened only once .and 1s happen 2 times but that’s a small sample so I don’t no on a a 100000 spins but I don’t care about that I’m In The casinos very short period make my profit and leave.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: plolp on Jan 27, 04:22 AM 2019

OK winner, but what is the advantage of playing the "ec" grouped by figure of 2?

You would go twice as fast playing red or black.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 27, 04:35 AM 2019
112111212111112111=4  -10
212211221212122111=9  +2 profit
222211212112122221=11+4
222111221222111222=11+4
2112122222221121222=12+6
211222122111221121=9 even
1211122112222122121=10+2
122211111112212122=8-2
221121111221111112=6-7
112121111121111122=5-6
222212221111121222=11+3
Total +21
Again it’s easy I’m only playin for repeat
I use flat combing a progression but not to crazy .

Dont you mean -4? Recalculate
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 27, 05:09 AM 2019
Dont you mean -4? Recalculate
Nope  like I said I use flat bet combined with progression.it’s up you to figure out how you would play this .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 27, 07:03 AM 2019
Heres the low down
14144 spins
7072 bets
1s 624
2s 594
The 1s beat the 2S by 30 bets  chops win
Throw in approx on a 00 wheel the zeros 145
So by my strategy to win is to flat be an combined with non  aggressive progression.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 27, 07:06 AM 2019
OK winner, but what is the advantage of playing the "ec" grouped by figure of 2?

You would go twice as fast playing red or black.
No have seen 22 colours in row I have not seen 18 losing bets in a row with this.
Not even close
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 27, 10:48 AM 2019
Here is results live play today. Profit
112211111112112122  =6          -6
1222211211122222201= 11      +2
212112221122212211=10        +2
Profit +4  short session
 

 
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 27, 11:53 AM 2019
22201220122211122221=12   +4
211221121212111212=8.     -2
221212122112211121=9.     -1
111222122211211121=8even
211222122211211121=9even
Profit +4
Test only no real play
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 27, 12:47 PM 2019
Another short test ,this is fun winning no effort
101122121222201120211=9 -3
11222122212122111202=10. +2
2122122222101121221=11 +3
Profit +5
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 27, 01:17 PM 2019
No this was more challenging but as you can see no wild progression.
21112211112121221211 =7 -4
2112220211212211121 =9 -2
2122202222121121111=10 +0
122212122211112122=10. +2
2021221121112201210011=8 -6
1222122122111101111=7 -5
212111221221211111=7-5
22121222011221221211=10 -1
212211121211222121=9 -1
11212111121221211=7 -3
112121211212212122=9 +3
Profit +5
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 27, 01:36 PM 2019
No this was more challenging but as you can see no wild progression.
21112211112121221211 =7 -4
2112220211212211121 =9 -2u
2122202222121121111=10 +0
122212122211112122=10. +2
2021221121112201210011=8 -6
1222122122111101111=7 -5
212111221221211111=7-5
22121222011221221211=10 -1
212211121211222121=9 -1
11212111121221211=7 -3
112121211212212122=9 +3
Profit +5

What is your progression ? And what is your bet exactly? Or are you not revealing it all to us. I'd understand but I would help to test if I got the full picture, as I'm sure would others.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 27, 01:37 PM 2019
By bet, I mean your trigger s .. When to bet when to stop etc
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 27, 05:24 PM 2019
What is your progression ? And what is your bet exactly? Or are you not revealing it all to us. I'd understand but I would help to test if I got the full picture, as I'm sure would others.
I mentioned that earlier I believe ,I flat bet with a non aggressive Marty.you have to test yours self to see if you even like it ,you can bet on the runs or changes but I will say this it’s not just betting red or black it’s the results in the series that I think makes the difference.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: daveylibra on Jan 28, 07:00 AM 2019
I can't figure out how to flat-bet and use a progression at the same time?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: plolp on Jan 28, 07:43 AM 2019
excuse error
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 28, 10:35 AM 2019
blackjack teams wait until a table is hot then they strike
With roulette it’s different  because we don’t remove numbers from the wheel there fixed we need to know how variance and probability of the set of spin and session played ..
I always flat bet  to see how far from std it goes then you can see what kind of progression is needed.there is a way to profit every session.
If you read the the beginning of the thread I mention we need to get the sessions close to even the number 9 plays a big roll in your end result how to use it well that you will have to test a lot. Session are not always balanced but after a session of 36 spins u begin to explore possibilities to balance it and use a progression to accomplish this .

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 28, 11:39 AM 2019
121212211122212221=10 +2
1212112112121211111=6-6
221212221222121112=11 +2
Profit +4
Nice and easy
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Jan 28, 11:48 AM 2019
... we need to know how variance and probability of the set of spin and session played ..
I always flat bet  to see how far from std it goes then you can see what kind of progression is needed.there is a way to profit every session...

How can past spins ever influence future ones? They don't.

That's why the concept of triggers, runs, chops, or patterns never works unless there is a physical bias.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 28, 12:32 PM 2019
How can past spins ever influence future ones? They don't.

That's why the concept of triggers, runs, chops, or patterns never works unless there is a physical bias.
I use no triggers,I don’t use Ftl/dbl /opposite last or whatever pattern your talking about I think I mention this once before on this thread.past spins have no meaning here .bias wheels have have no meaning here .so I guess there’s no debate.
I see that you like to VB so do what you do best go strain your eyes .mys can’t dont like that . As a matter so fact I’m meeting a frien in 1/2 hr he’s a Vb player I can’t wait to see him lose again .ill meet up with him after my winnings.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: daveylibra on Jan 28, 03:03 PM 2019
121212211122212221=10 +2
1212112112121211111=6-6
221212221222121112=11 +2
Profit +4
Nice and easy

But +2 -6 +2  =  -2.

Did you somehow break even on the second line, and profited by 2 on the first and third??
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 28, 03:07 PM 2019
But +2 -6 +2  =  -2.

Did you somehow break even on the second line, and profited by 2 on the first and third??

Winner could you note down how many units you make on each line using your own staking? Because atm it doesn't add up
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 28, 03:49 PM 2019
But +2 -6 +2  =  -2.

Did you somehow break even on the second line, and profited by 2 on the first and third??
If the second line was minus think how would I get +2 on the third line.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 28, 03:52 PM 2019
This was air ball 1hr ago local casino got bored at +4 and for you mr 🔥 fox I hit 4 in row vb
But to many people playing payouts took for ever.thats why I hate vb
 

212222111211212212=10 +2
122222221222121112=12 +2 and ad 4 zeros it would be +6
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: RouletteGhost on Jan 28, 06:58 PM 2019
good to see things back to normal around here...for now.

i read through the thread, it seems you are just betting for a repeat on high/low? every 2nd spin?

I understand the 1s and 2s but not understanding how/when you bet
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Jan 29, 12:57 AM 2019
As a matter so fact I’m meeting a frien in 1/2 hr he’s a Vb player I can’t wait to see him lose again .ill meet up with him after my winnings.

Good luck in your session. The thing is about VB, one can't play all the time, or at least I can't.  Only when conditions are right, so I might end up going and not playing. Just have to enjoy the restaurant and the bar  :wink:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: poluvolo on Jan 29, 06:33 AM 2019
HI
This bet selection  is one of the best bet selections I have ever seen for short time winning
even that period I am playing a single column system for real money at my local casino
yesterday I decided  to play this system  after testing 3000 spins with fake money
about money management I am expert to Johnson progression so I decided to play with johnson progression
I played two sessions 50 pair each session or to be more clarify 100 spins each session
not 18 pair each session as  member winner
i opened two lines one line betting for 1  and second line betting for 2 at the same time
my target profit was 10 units from each line so 20 units after 100 spins
finally  after 5 hours playing 200 spins i made 38 units profit
i had 1000 euro bankroll and i made 190 euro profit betting with 5 euro unit value
cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: nasty on Jan 29, 07:52 AM 2019
First time I heard about johnson progression..! Had a look on it, not that easy because I also don't understand everything..

In The Attachment u can read it.
Don't understand the part where I bet with 55 but after the loss I only distribute 50 in this example. And so it goes on.. then I bet with 65 And I only distribute 55?

But ok .. I maybe have to test it and learn it. So yes, could be a very good progression method for this bet selection
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 29, 02:49 PM 2019
122221222122221221=13 hits on the 2s +8
21110221212101222111=8 +6 bank went down 2 units from the last series.next bet 2
1122211111111111101=3 -5 next bet 13
222211212111221212=10 +9 our new high
21121222210121211210=9. +7 down 2 next bet 2
1221221201221111212=9 +7 still down 2
111111202202112221=7 +1 down 8
121222112211112221=9  +7 down2
20122121110121221121=8 +4 still down 5
222122222121122222=14. +18 done
Hope this helps with MM dis regard last MM on the other pages this is the best


Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 29, 03:01 PM 2019
122221222122221221=13 hits on the 2s +8
21110221212101222111=8 +6 bank went down 2 units from the last series.next bet 2
1122211111111111101=3 -5 next bet 13
222211212111221212=10 +9 our new high
21121222210121211210=9. +7 down 2 next bet 2
1221221201221111212=9 +7 still down 2
111111202202112221=7 +1 down 8
121222112211112221=9  +7 down2
20122121110121221121=8 +4 still down 5
222122222121122222=14. +18 done
Hope this helps with MM dis regard last MM on the other pages this is the best

Have you explained the MM you use for this somewhere?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 29, 03:58 PM 2019
Have you explained the MM you use for this somewhere?
Bw this is a modified Stan K that’s it brother with flatbetting when your in the plus.
Safe I could of 🛑 at any time I wanted to see with the 14 in a row 1 s if I could come out of that drawdown and it did and never was explosive.
Flatno would of like this rest is soul
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 29, 04:27 PM 2019
MM only starts afterthe first session +or minus then u begin your MM if plus then that is your🎯 number throughout until u decided to 🛑 if in the minus same thing try to get back to 0 then start over.
Hope that helps
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Jan 29, 04:31 PM 2019
Cool thanks mate.keep winning.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 29, 04:33 PM 2019
Cool thanks mate.keep winning.
Thank Bw
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: poluvolo on Jan 30, 08:36 AM 2019
HI again
yes the money management  from winner seems very smart
Yesterday  i tested the new money management from winner
playing online 10 shoes baccarat with excellent results betting only for run
every shoe about two cycles 36 spins or 18 pairs every cycle like roulette
today i will test the new money management betting up to 3000 sins
and then i will post the results
i will follow exactly the rules from winner
cheers





Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: valvo on Jan 31, 05:31 AM 2019
Hi Winner, when you are down and you are lets say 5 decisions into the next cycle and you reach your new high, Do you go back to flat betting or stay at the same level until end of cycle?

Thanks

Val
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 31, 10:37 AM 2019
Hi Winner, when you are down and you are lets say 5 decisions into the next cycle and you reach your new high, Do you go back to flat betting or stay at the same level until end of cycle?

Thanks

Val
Yes that’s correct trying to use casino 💴
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: valvo on Jan 31, 10:47 AM 2019
Sorry Winner just to clarify, its correct to go back to flat betting as soon as you have reached a new high even if it's half way through a cycle ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 31, 11:36 AM 2019
Sorry Winner just to clarify, its correct to go back to flat betting as soon as you have reached a new high even if it's half way through a cycle ?

Yes that’s correct.but test it real well before you play for real.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 31, 11:45 AM 2019
I was going over 20000 spins I found a combo that lost once in 20000 spins .if any one wants. To code this let me know
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: nichedelico on Jan 31, 02:36 PM 2019
I was going over 20000 spins I found a combo that lost once in 20000 spins .if any one wants. To code this let me know

I can test manually if you want, or if someone can code with Rx.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 31, 03:07 PM 2019
I can test manually if you want, or if someone can code with Rx.
Thank you but it takes so long time manually
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: valvo on Jan 31, 03:20 PM 2019
How far did the std go out?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 31, 03:48 PM 2019
How far did the std go out?
It lost 10in a row once in 20000 ?ex 2121212121 combo keeping at 36 spin cycle.it is far the best results better then playing for ones or twos.also the 1s out beat the the 2s by 30 results. Test away we might have a nice winning bet
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: valvo on Jan 31, 04:17 PM 2019
That's still very good.

I'll keep testing.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Jan 31, 04:21 PM 2019
212211212212122122 +9 using a up 1 on a loss and continue Up on a win just an idea for progression. I’m going to play with progression a bit .
On this I’m stopping on a win .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 01, 03:52 PM 2019
Total profit $3195
Drawn down 1023
20000 spins about 10000 bets
4 ways to play profit every time.
This one is a keeper
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 01, 04:15 PM 2019
The split 9 is far the best on a rolling base
Opposite 2-1is 2nd on list
Chase the 5-6 is 3rd
And for a safe bet flat bet 1s is ok with +3 profit goal .
There you have it Some winning strategy.
Test it and share.
Gamble responsibly.
Winner
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: valvo on Feb 02, 05:55 AM 2019
Hey Winner, excuse my lack of understanding is there any chance you could explain the first 3 types of selecting and betting you have mentioned.

Thanks in advance, Val
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 02, 07:16 AM 2019
Hey Winner, excuse my lack of understanding is there any chance you could explain the first 3 types of selecting and betting you have mentioned.

Thanks in advance, Val
Sure sent you pm
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 02, 08:46 AM 2019
For a single spin it’s hard to predict the out come but on volume roulette is not so random.
You need about 1 std up about a+4 in 2 sessions and 1std down about -10
+4 is not hard to do .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 02, 09:51 AM 2019
Here is the split 9
1111201111 here we start to bet opposite of the last nine series  212221112 - 221211111-22221212 end +12 with a Marty on a rolling basis.ya ya I can just hear Martin gale  .Don’t be scared of the Marty .
 
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 02, 10:07 AM 2019
Results last 8 session 288 spins 
Profit +79 , 5 Ls at most if you want to wait for 3 Ls in a row to start betting you will not lose with this.
Gamble responsibly
Winner
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 02, 11:41 AM 2019
Here’s yet another winning session
221112112112111212
21120122222222121101 +16
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 04, 12:57 PM 2019
Going through 25000spins I discovered something that is not supposed to take place in random and I have been at this for a long time and never seen this particular results absolutely incredible I can say for accuracy that this is the best bet I have come across only through reading Random can you find a bet that can make you a winner every time you go to the casinos. And no I not selling this but it does sound like a sales pitch 😆 but definitely I will keep this for my self .
I have given enough on this way of betting you have to find it for yourself it’s there .
I was ok with other 4 ways but This one allows me to bet on going only stopping when I’m tired not when the casino has beaten me .holy hell I found it.
Gamble responsibly
Winner
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 04, 02:14 PM 2019
The 21 is so up there amazing.wouldntmind  seeing others result.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 04, 04:07 PM 2019
211222122112111112 +8
112112222122111211+7
212212111211121222+8
If you want to win slow play this if you want to lose fast
Vaddi s is really good or any other inside bets with numbers.
A let’s see what else o beat the outside and the inside is easy.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 05, 11:26 AM 2019
More results +6
+7
+7
+7
+10
+7
+7
+7
+7
8
+8
+9
The even money has bee defeated 🤑
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Bigbroben on Feb 05, 11:44 AM 2019
That's big call!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 05, 11:52 AM 2019
That's big call!
Been at this for a long time and I will stand behind it ,like the show  years ago BEILIVE it or Not
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: RayManZ on Feb 05, 12:18 PM 2019
I was going over 20000 spins I found a combo that lost once in 20000 spins .if any one wants. To code this let me know

if you have a detailed plan i can code this. No problem.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 05, 12:56 PM 2019
All you can do is throw spins at it and see what sort of variance limits occur.  You're doing it the right way Winner, good job.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: daveylibra on Feb 05, 02:12 PM 2019
Here is the split 9
1111201111 here we start to bet opposite of the last nine series  212221112 - 221211111-22221212 end +12 with a Marty on a rolling basis.ya ya I can just hear Martin gale  .Don’t be scared of the Marty .

Hi Winner, so do you mean if the last 9 series gives more 1s, we bet 2s, and vice versa?
And the Marty, surely you are not advocating an unlimited Marty?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 05, 05:32 PM 2019
My MM is getting better better and safe non explosive 🧨
Results target +9 evey session
+9
+4
+4.50
-2
+9
-2
+6
+9

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 06, 01:41 PM 2019
2556 games won
2 losses
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 06, 02:12 PM 2019
Jumping from system to system is a waist of time ,odds don’t change but variants is were you can take advantage of the game .
 
Beat the outside and the inside is no problem.
Tip how to do it ,play your system as you would the out side but the only difference is you would play the numbers that have already come out. Instead of playing even money you bet the numbers that have shown .
But it take years to figure that out for some.
Or just buy your self a roulette computer and go and find  the right condition.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 06, 04:43 PM 2019
I’m not sure why I’m getting emails in regard of selling this when clearly I posted it for free .
Do not buy any thing in regards to gambling.don't get conned
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 06, 05:53 PM 2019
I’m not sure why I’m getting emails in regard of selling this when clearly I posted it for free .
Do not buy any thing in regards to gambling.don't get conned
I think because the real elements of the method have been dragged out over the course of a few pages , and so the true meaning of it is somewhat lost , especially the staking. A concise post on the exact betting procedure is needed.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 06, 06:12 PM 2019
I think because the real elements of the method have been dragged out over the course of a few pages , and so the true meaning of it is somewhat lost , especially the staking. A concise post on the exact betting procedure is needed.
Quite the contrary it’s explain in details it’s just that people jump from system to system and this is where the problem .instead of staying focused.that shits caries Into the live play when playing in casino distraction Is the killer.
Over a100 pages on Vaddis and non of you can figure out how many numbers to bet that tells everything.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: -Katalyst- on Feb 07, 01:02 AM 2019
“There’s not one guy here that can show how to make Living at roulette other then Steve”

@ Winner - well now you might agree with what I had previously posted - in another thread
 ....well at least now there are two guys on here that are winning - you n Uncle Stevie
  ;)


@ Winner - you really think that your Uncle Steve is the only one making money - well my point in the previous spray was alluding to the fact that one would have to be naive at best to think that people that are successful at this would actually come on here and drop their game in its entirety for all to see
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Battler on Feb 08, 05:49 AM 2019
....it’s just that people jump from system to system and this is where the problem is instead of staying focused...

Thank you Winner for posting your method and I think you are 100% correct with your analysis above.

Staying power is lacking to continue to focus on the positives and negatives of a particular method - its only when the wager is understood through much practice, that true depth of understanding of how to make it a success is possible

Looking forward to hearing more from you
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 08, 12:37 PM 2019
Its interesting how many on this forum have no clue on how to beat the most simplest bets on the game.its not hard .the really problem is that you are trying to find a bet to make you rich or try to make a living at it ,the Title is beating the even money bet Not how to make your first Million. You are deluded if you think that you can do this using vb wobbly wheels.computer excluded.and good luck trying to find a bias wheel.none of you have the patience .so this is why I like even money I sit there I get free drinks look at The  nice ladies .and make little profit cause at the end of the year it’s not going to be that little comprende amigos :twisted:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Proofreaders2000 on Feb 08, 12:51 PM 2019
Meeting nice ladies is one thing, but with the Grail I
can have Pamela Anderson greet me at the casino door.  ;)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Bigbroben on Feb 08, 01:01 PM 2019
She's getting old...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 08, 01:05 PM 2019
Good luck in your session. The thing is about VB, one can't play all the time, or at least I can't.  Only when conditions are right, so I might end up going and not playing. Just have to enjoy the restaurant and the bar  :wink:

Firefox,

Yes, conditions aren't always perfect.  You sound like a patient AP.   Most people just don't have the foresight, or the patience required for VB.  These days most forum roulette players are so impatient that they aren't willing to go to a real casino and will play the digital roulette games online via a lap top and even a cell phone just to try and get their immediate gratification.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 08, 01:47 PM 2019
Thanks to Glc old timer gave me Another idea for a bet section that beat everything that I come up with.
Results are now 2556 to 1 loss
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 08, 01:57 PM 2019
Thanks to Glc old timer gave me Another idea for a bet section that beat everything that I come up with.
Results are now 2556 to 1 loss

Whenever I think of GLC or see one of his old posts, I tend to hope he's out there playing, winning, and enjoying.  Good guy.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 08, 02:02 PM 2019
Whenever I think of GLC or see one of his old posts, I tend to hope he's out there playing, winning, and enjoying.  Good guy.  :thumbsup:
Master of progressions. Good guy you're right. And what happened to TwoCatSam
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 08, 02:08 PM 2019
Master of progressions. Good guy you're right. And what happened to TwoCatSam

So true.  He was like a progression hoarder, he had a closet full of them and could provide one for just about any circumstance, location, or method. 

TwoCatSam we all hope is off tending his garden somewhere, and it's always in full bloom... :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 08, 03:19 PM 2019
Here is the method
#1 How to track your bet
36 spin cycle I track high/low there’s odd /even red /black you choose.
Ex. 1 ,19 this is low/ high so I would mark this as a 1 equals a chop
       23 ,36 this high /high mark this as 2 equals a run.
Now do this for 36 spins in pairs like this you wait for the first result and you will bet on the second .
This is 36 spins and this is how it would look using 1sand2s. Simple.


122122112211111112=18 pairs that’s 36 spins that’s it.now do this for 25000 spins And then you can begin to know how to read random events .
From there you can look for a winning bet that can give you a profit each time you play.
So please do not pm and ask me how I’m betting and getting my results I have given you the  basics try to find something that works for you .there is so many variations.but 1 of them for me works every time . The progression is the most important part of the bet .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 08, 03:34 PM 2019
Here is the method
#1 How to track your bet
36 spin cycle I track high/low there’s odd /even red /black you choose.
Ex. 1 ,19 this is low/ high so I would mark this as a 1 equals a chop
       23 ,36 this high /high mark this as 2 equals a run.
Now do this for 36 spins in pairs like this you wait for the first result and you will bet on the second .
This is 36 spins and this is how it would look using 1sand2s. Simple.


122122112211111112=18 pairs that’s 36 spins that’s it.now do this for 25000 spins And then you can begin to know how to read random events .
From there you can look for a winning bet that can give you a profit each time you play.
So please do not pm and ask me how I’m betting and getting my results I have given you the  basics try to find something that works for you .there is so many variations.but 1 of them for me works every time . The progression is the most important part of the bet .
Hi Winner. So essentially you are saying that chops and runs , even though each are an even chance bet, behave different and are more predictable? What I mean is, by you saying the most important part is the progression , why dont you just use the MM on reds and blacks?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 08, 04:17 PM 2019
Hi Winner. So essentially you are saying that chops and runs , even though each are an even chance bet, behave different and are more predictable? What I mean is, by you saying the most important part is the progression , why dont you just use the MM on reds and blacks?
Bw red/ black I think the record is 32 in row of the same colour now that’s extreme .it’s not not hard to walk into acasino and see 20 in a row of the same colour.This style of betting doesn’t give variance a chance to remotely come close to 18 in a row but this is aslo extreme never seen it yet ,maybe it will can’t predict the future . I have at most seen 5 of one and 5 of the other in 25000 spins that’s 2556 games to 1 loss
I said the progression is most important because it has to complement the bet selection without going to extreme lengths this is what I found works for me without blowing bank rolls .
All you have Bw is only the next spin so if 12 comes out there’s only Two things it repeats another low or it changes to high that’s it .wrer all to lazy to test for great lengths because it’s boring as F———— golden nuggets don’t come easy.
Test for your self  see what you can find .


Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 08, 04:31 PM 2019
Here I’ll give you some results and you can play with it and see what you come up with.


11122111202211022211
122112122222122121
222121211222122221
1111211120222121112
22122021112222221121
1121221121122122121
221211221122121221
112121221221112221
2112121111122112201
112222222211111122
112222222211122122
222112222211122211
121211222111112112
12121101120211211221
2112111212221210112
1221212212211221112
110122222111122111
2121122221222121111
211122221122111221
121211122121111221
111112212111212212
Now have some fun and don’t be lazy see what you can up with this is from RAndom.org
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Feb 09, 08:59 AM 2019
Winner, as soon as a profit is made, will you launch a new cycle?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Feb 09, 09:27 AM 2019
Played RNG Betvoyager

12121212120201211212  - Lost this cycle?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 09, 09:33 AM 2019
Winner, as soon as a profit is made, will you launch a new cycle?
I’m not sure what you mean
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 09, 09:36 AM 2019
Played RNG Betvoyager

12121212120201211212  - Lost this cycle?
If you lost this cycle this is wher you should be launching another cycle.and how were you playing this?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Feb 09, 09:43 AM 2019
If you lost this cycle this is wher you should be launching another cycle.and how were you playing this?

I played for replaying 11,22 multistage progression (1-2-3, 2-4-6, etc.).
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 09, 10:52 AM 2019
I played for replaying 11,22 multistage progression (1-2-3, 2-4-6, etc.).
[/quote
Keep trying that handles chops you don’t win you don’t lose
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Feb 09, 11:39 AM 2019
Thanks, it looks like the progression + 1 / -1 works better. I will conduct testing ... Do I have to observe the length of the cycle? The cycle in 18 steps differs from the cycle in 45-56, etc., steps.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 09, 11:47 AM 2019
Thanks, it looks like the progression + 1 / -1 works better. I will conduct testing ... Do I have to observe the length of the cycle? The cycle in 18 steps differs from the cycle in 45-56, etc., steps.
The more cycle you test the more you can read different events happening and see where. Your bets can be place .if. I’m not in profit after the first  game 18 steps I continue.
Hope that helps
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 09, 12:01 PM 2019
100 bets deviation no more then 55/45 picking one pair over the other.so changing your bets consistently won’t help when some something is not working stick to what you start with.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 09, 01:53 PM 2019
Here is air ball session result
1101212221111121122. +3
221112121212211112 +2
101221122112102201221-3
222222121222121221 +2
Result +4 flat bet with progression on the third game 16 units on progression
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 09, 02:18 PM 2019
What’s interesting after thousand of test over the years roulette doesn’t seem so random.
The casinos need that HE or else guys like me would destroy them😆
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Feb 09, 02:53 PM 2019
Winner, for me the problem is what to do if a 0 appears, what do you do if a 0 appears, bet on the old value or keep track of the new?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 09, 03:29 PM 2019
Winner, for me the problem is what to do if a 0 appears, what do you do if a 0 appears, bet on the old value or keep track of the new?
Ingnore it
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 09, 09:49 PM 2019
Great work with this Winner. I think everyone on the forum has been checking this method out at some stage....

The idea of packaging the EC results into chops and runs, and then betting on them is brilliant.

Obviously, the challenge is how to place your bets..... I’ve been thinking about this and I’d like to put forward an idea.

My idea is to bet the series of 18 results (CHOPS and RUNS) using a series of mini labouchere bets.

Your labouchere betting string would start like this: 1 - 1. First bet is 2 units.

Technically, this string should finish with a +2 profit. However, I am happy for it to finish as soon as you’re in profit (+1). In summary, as soon as the string becomes positive, you reset and begin a new labouchere string (1 - 1) and continue betting the series of 18 chops and runs.

I have just finished playing an 18 string series:
1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2 (+3).

Like Winner, I have bet on the RUNS. In the above string, the CHOPS beat the RUNS 10 - 8. However, using the mini labouchere, I still finished with +3 units of profit.

Let me break this down...

18 string series using labouchere bets. I will be betting for RUNS.

Starting labouchere sequence 1 - 1
1 - 1
1st bet: 1 + 1 = 2 
(Result: CHOP / Loss - 2)

1 - 1 - 2
2nd bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: CHOP / Loss -5)

1 - 1 - 2 - 3
3rd bet: 1 + 3 = 4
(Result: RUN / Win -1)

1 - 2
4th bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: CHOP / Loss -4)

1 - 2 - 3
5th bet: 1 + 3 = 4
(Result: RUN / Win - 0)

2
6th bet: 2
(Result: CHOP / Loss -2)

2 - 2
7th bet: 2 + 2 = 4 
(Result: RUN / Win +2)

Result: CHOP-CHOP-RUN-CHOP-RUN-CHOP-RUN (+2 units profit)

We’re in profit so we finish this labouchere string and reset. We continue betting the 18 result series.

Reset labouchere sequence 1 - 1
1 - 1
1st bet: 1 + 1 = 2 
(Result: CHOP / Loss -2)

1 - 1 - 2
2nd bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: RUN / Win +1)

Result: CHOP-RUN (+1)
We’re in profit so we finish this labouchere string and reset. We continue betting the 18 result series.

Reset labouchere sequence 1 - 1
1 - 1
1st bet: 1 + 1 = 2
(Result: RUN / Win +2)

Result: RUN (+2)
We’re in profit so we finish this labouchere string and reset. We continue betting the 18 result series.

Reset labouchere sequence 1 - 1
1 - 1
1st bet: 1 + 1 = 2 
(Result: CHOP / Loss - 2)

1 - 1 - 2
2nd bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: RUN / Win +1)

Result: CHOP-RUN (+1)
We’re in profit so we finish this labouchere string and reset. We continue betting the 18 result series.

Reset labouchere sequence 1 - 1
1 - 1
1st bet: 1 + 1 = 2 
(Result: CHOP / Loss - 2)

1 - 1 - 2
2nd bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: CHOP / Loss -5)

1 - 1 - 2 - 3
3rd bet: 1 + 3 = 4
(Result: RUN / Win -1)

1 - 2
4th bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: CHOP / Loss -4)

1 - 2 - 3
5th bet: 1 + 3 = 4
(Result: CHOP / Loss -8)

1 - 2 - 3 - 4
6th bet: 1 + 4 = 5
(Result: RUN / Win -3)

Result: CHOP-CHOP-RUN-CHOP-CHOP-RUN (-3)

18 result series is complete.

We were betting for RUNS. The RUNS lost 8 - 10 but we still finished the sequence with a profit of 3 units.

CHOPS: 10
RUNS: 8
Profit + 3.

I have only tested this betting method for three sequences. Each one has finished in profit. It still needs a lot more testing.

If you think it’s any good, give it a go and post the results.

Any good Winner?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 09, 11:30 PM 2019
Great work with this Winner. I think everyone on the forum has been checking this method out at some stage....

The idea of packaging the EC results into chops and runs, and then betting on them is brilliant.

Obviously, the challenge is how to place your bets..... I’ve been thinking about this and I’d like to put forward an idea.

My idea is to bet the series of 18 results (CHOPS and RUNS) using a series of mini labouchere bets.

Your labouchere betting string would start like this: 1 - 1. First bet is 2 units.

Technically, this string should finish with a +2 profit. However, I am happy for it to finish as soon as you’re in profit (+1). In summary, as soon as the string becomes positive, you reset and begin a new labouchere string (1 - 1) and continue betting the series of 18 chops and runs.

I have just finished playing an 18 string series:
1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2 (+3).

Like Winner, I have bet on the RUNS. In the above string, the CHOPS beat the RUNS 10 - 8. However, using the mini labouchere, I still finished with +3 units of profit.

Let me break this down...

18 string series using labouchere bets. I will be betting for RUNS.

Starting labouchere sequence 1 - 1
1 - 1
1st bet: 1 + 1 = 2 
(Result: CHOP / Loss - 2)

1 - 1 - 2
2nd bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: CHOP / Loss -5)

1 - 1 - 2 - 3
3rd bet: 1 + 3 = 4
(Result: RUN / Win -1)

1 - 2
4th bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: CHOP / Loss -4)

1 - 2 - 3
5th bet: 1 + 3 = 4
(Result: RUN / Win - 0)

2
6th bet: 2
(Result: CHOP / Loss -2)

2 - 2
7th bet: 2 + 2 = 4 
(Result: RUN / Win +2)

Result: CHOP-CHOP-RUN-CHOP-RUN-CHOP-RUN (+2 units profit)

We’re in profit so we finish this labouchere string and reset. We continue betting the 18 result series.

Reset labouchere sequence 1 - 1
1 - 1
1st bet: 1 + 1 = 2 
(Result: CHOP / Loss -2)

1 - 1 - 2
2nd bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: RUN / Win +1)

Result: CHOP-RUN (+1)
We’re in profit so we finish this labouchere string and reset. We continue betting the 18 result series.

Reset labouchere sequence 1 - 1
1 - 1
1st bet: 1 + 1 = 2
(Result: RUN / Win +2)

Result: RUN (+2)
We’re in profit so we finish this labouchere string and reset. We continue betting the 18 result series.

Reset labouchere sequence 1 - 1
1 - 1
1st bet: 1 + 1 = 2 
(Result: CHOP / Loss - 2)

1 - 1 - 2
2nd bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: RUN / Win +1)

Result: CHOP-RUN (+1)
We’re in profit so we finish this labouchere string and reset. We continue betting the 18 result series.

Reset labouchere sequence 1 - 1
1 - 1
1st bet: 1 + 1 = 2 
(Result: CHOP / Loss - 2)

1 - 1 - 2
2nd bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: CHOP / Loss -5)

1 - 1 - 2 - 3
3rd bet: 1 + 3 = 4
(Result: RUN / Win -1)

1 - 2
4th bet: 1 + 2 = 3
(Result: CHOP / Loss -4)

1 - 2 - 3
5th bet: 1 + 3 = 4
(Result: CHOP / Loss -8)

1 - 2 - 3 - 4
6th bet: 1 + 4 = 5
(Result: RUN / Win -3)

Result: CHOP-CHOP-RUN-CHOP-CHOP-RUN (-3)

18 result series is complete.

We were betting for RUNS. The RUNS lost 8 - 10 but we still finished the sequence with a profit of 3 units.

CHOPS: 10
RUNS: 8
Profit + 3.

I have only tested this betting method for three sequences. Each one has finished in profit. It still needs a lot more testing.

If you think it’s any good, give it a go and post the results.

Any good Winner?
Interesting ,testing will tell.
25oooo spins
The stats are
Runs  15 /3 split is the most runs not in a row.this happened 2 times
Chops 15/3 split seen this 3 times
I have not tested with the labby but curious to see what happens .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 12:13 AM 2019
Interesting ,testing will tell.
25oooo spins
The stats are
Runs  15 /3 split is the most runs not in a row.this happened 2 times
Chops 15/3 split seen this 3 times
I have not tested with the labby but curious to see what happens .

Hi Winner 

I agree. It’s very early days for this little betting system. It will need plenty more work. It hasn’t been tested against a bad run of CHOPS yet. Hopefully a few more people will give it a try....

Again, awesome strategy Winner and thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 12:16 AM 2019
I have just completed another 18 result  cycle using the mini labouchere.

I’ll try and lay this out differently so it is easier to understand. It gets confusing... Also because the labouchere uses lots of 1s and 2s, I’ll try and refer to the system results as CHOPS and RUNS.

Betting RUNS again.

1st bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. RUN. (+1)
In profit (+1), reset

2nd bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. CHOP. (-5)
1 - 1 - 2 - 3 (1 +3 =4) Bet 4. RUN. (-1)
1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. RUN. (+2)
In profit (+2), reset

3rd bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. RUN. (+1)
In profit (+1), reset

4th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. RUN. (+1)
In profit (+1), reset

5th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. RUN. (+2)
In profit (+2), reset

6th bet series
1 - 1 (zero 1st spin, no loss)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. RUN. (+1)
In profit (+1), reset

7th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. RUN. (+2)
In profit (+2), reset

8th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. RUN. (+2)
In profit (+2), reset

9th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. RUN. (+2)
In profit (+2), reset

10th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-5)
18 bet series complete, do not reset (-5).

1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1 (+9).

We were betting for RUNS again. This time the RUNS won 10 - 8 and we finished the sequence with a profit of 9 units.

Remember, last time the RUNS lost 8 - 10, but a profit of +3 units was still achieved.

RUNS: 10
CHOPS: 8
Zero occurred once (1st spin so no loss)
Profit + 9.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 01:59 AM 2019
I have just completed another 18 result  cycle using the mini labouchere.

I’ll try and lay this out differently so it is easier to understand. It gets confusing... Also because the labouchere uses lots of 1s and 2s, I’ll try and refer to the system results as CHOPS and RUNS.

Betting RUNS again.

1st bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. RUN. (+1)
In profit (+1), reset

2nd bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. CHOP. (-5)
1 - 1 - 2 - 3 (1 +3 =4) Bet 4. RUN. (-1)
1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. RUN. (+2)
In profit (+2), reset

3rd bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. RUN. (+1)
In profit (+1), reset

4th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. RUN. (+1)
In profit (+1), reset

5th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. RUN. (+2)
In profit (+2), reset

6th bet series
1 - 1 (zero 1st spin, no loss)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. RUN. (+1)
In profit (+1), reset

7th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. RUN. (+2)
In profit (+2), reset

8th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. RUN. (+2)
In profit (+2), reset

9th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. RUN. (+2)
In profit (+2), reset

10th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-5)
18 bet series complete, do not reset (-5).

1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1 (+9).

We were betting for RUNS again. This time the RUNS won 10 - 8 and we finished the sequence with a profit of 9 units.

Remember, last time the RUNS lost 8 - 10, but a profit of +3 units was still achieved.

RUNS: 10
CHOPS: 8
Zero occurred once (1st spin so no loss)
Profit + 9.

You would have noticed, the 10th bet series of the previous game finished with two chops (a loss of -5 units).

Although I didn’t include them in the finished results, I played out the betting series. See below.

10th bet series
1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +1 =2) Bet 3. CHOP. (-5)
1 - 1 - 2 - 3 (1 +3 =4) Bet 4. CHOP. (-9)
1 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 (1 +4 =5) Bet 5. RUN. (-4)
1 - 2 - 3 (1 +3 =4) Bet 4. RUN. (0)
2 Bet (2 +0 = 2. RUN 2. (+2)

Amended results:

RUNS: 13
CHOPS: 9
Zero occurred once (1st spin so no loss)
Profit + 16
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 10, 09:37 AM 2019
Jono good results and not to explosive with the progression 👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 10, 11:25 AM 2019
Here are the splits on runs and chops in 18 series either way.

9/9
10/8
11/7
12/6
13/5
14/4
15/3
16/2 never seen
17/1never seen
18/0 never seen

     
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 10, 11:42 AM 2019
Here is more results Random has been tamed. :lol:
Here is a flat bet to a progression .
Flat bet until -4 then my progression starts 2 4 8 16

211212111112222121=-2
2100211211211112112=+2
1011222121111122112=+3
112221212122211212=-2
212221222212112111=+0
12122102112222122021=-2
2110022122211121101201=0
2121202211121222111=+0
211122122212112211=-2
210210111201111211111=+7
112111122222111211=+3
2111122122122100112=+1
1222210121212111222=+2
2222122012112122122=+7
1220022202112220222211=+11
2121221222221220212= +13
Highest bet was. 4units in the progression @1111loss 2,4
Random has been tamed
Sorry can’t give out the actual strategy but I in courage you to find a strategy that works for you using this method it’s there just look for it .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Feb 10, 01:19 PM 2019
I already broke my head. After trying a lot of progressions, everyone rolls down.
I wonder how to be here with such a series, 1122211111111111101 is one of your publications, mine is a murderer
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 10, 01:35 PM 2019
I already broke my head. After trying a lot of progressions, everyone rolls down.
I wonder how to be here with such a series, 1122211111111111101 is one of your publications, mine is a murderer
I already broke my head 😂 Adivil can help with your headache
That one the chops ruled but not a loss .trend is your friend
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 01:38 PM 2019
Here is more results Random has been tamed. :lol:
Here is a flat bet to a progression .
Flat bet until -4 then my progression starts 2 4 8 16

211212111112222121=-2
2100211211211112112=+2
1011222121111122112=+3
112221212122211212=-2
212221222212112111=+0
12122102112222122021=-2
2110022122211121101201=0
2121202211121222111=+0
211122122212112211=-2
210210111201111211111=+7
112111122222111211=+3
2111122122122100112=+1
1222210121212111222=+2
2222122012112122122=+7
1220022202112220222211=+11
2121221222221220212= +13
Highest bet was. 4units in the progression @1111loss 2,4
Random has been tamed
Sorry can’t give out the actual strategy but I in courage you to find a strategy that works for you using this method it’s there just look for it .

More impressive numbers Winner. You’re certainly giving us plenty of clues.. Amazing......
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 01:40 PM 2019
I already broke my head. After trying a lot of progressions, everyone rolls down.
I wonder how to be here with such a series, 1122211111111111101 is one of your publications, mine is a murderer

My betting strategy would not have survived this run of chops. A stop-loss would have been needed.

I will post some results soon which show this.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 01:53 PM 2019
The results of three more cycles.

Please note, using the mini labouchere betting, you often come to the end of an 18 spin cycle with the labouchere string incomplete. I have decided it’s better to finish the betting string. For that reason, the first game (below) extended to 20 betting cycles. 

1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2 (+11)

2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2 (+21)

2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 2 (+12)

During the third game it handled a stretch of chops. I have reproduced this section below.

1 - 1 (1 +1 =2) Bet 2. CHOP. (-2)
1 - 1 - 2 (1 +2 =3) Bet 3. CHOP. (-5)
1 - 1 - 2 - 3 (1 +3 =4) Bet 4. CHOP. (-9)
1 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 (1 +4 =5) Bet 5. CHOP. (-14)
1 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5  (1 +5 =6) Bet 6. RUN. (-8)
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 (1 +4 =5) Bet 5. CHOP. (-13)
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 -5 (1 +5 =6) Bet 6. RUN. (-7)
2 - 3 - 4 (2 +4 =6) Bet 6. RUN. (-1)
3 (3 +0 =3) Bet 3. CHOP. (-4)
3 - 3 (3 +3 =6) Bet 6. RUN. (+2)

Please notice a couple of things. Firstly, after the fourth spin it drops to (-14). Fortunately it recovered. However a couple more CHOPS and I would have been in trouble. A stop-loss might be sensible. Maybe 25 units for the stop-loss to kick in.

Notice I was betting for RUNS, but the CHOPS outnumbered the RUNS 6 - 4, yet I still emerged with a + 2 profit.

Over to you Winner. It did well, but an unfavourable run would hurt.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 10, 02:27 PM 2019
@ Jono nice results
My results my profit with your game all 3 is +8
Here this what you look for
Everyone knows that there’s short and long series my view is that a short series is from 1to 4 then from 5 and up you have long ,it’s in the long series where you have to find the switch by that I mean look for the number where you can switch your bet so variance does catch you. In my case I have a note book full of results I can go back and read it over-and over until I find something that does occur and can use it .It was on one thread I found it .it was a GLC post . He was more into playing around with progression but it was the idea what I used and switched it to the bet selection progression are not hard when it comes to even money you either win the first or you lose and try to recover simple .my head doesn’t  hurt any more and I don’t need Advil . Lol

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 10, 03:40 PM 2019
@ Jono nice results
My results my profit with your game all 3 is +8
Here this what you look for
Everyone knows that there’s short and long series my view is that a short series is from 1to 4 then from 5 and up you have long ,it’s in the long series where you have to find the switch by that I mean look for the number where you can switch your bet so variance does catch you. In my case I have a note book full of results I can go back and read it over-and over until I find something that does occur and can use it .It was on one thread I found it .it was a GLC post . He was more into playing around with progression but it was the idea what I used and switched it to the bet selection progression are not hard when it comes to even money you either win the first or you lose and try to recover simple .my head doesn’t  hurt any more and I don’t need Advil . Lol

A GLC thread comes to mind after reading your post, and it was actually something he detailed that won over time when I tested it (which is rare...nothing I test ever wins long, and most of them fail within the first 3000 spins).

The problem I had with it is that it couldn't be scaled in terms of the units bet without hitting typical table limits, so your net earning per hour were too limited to pursue it.

What you've done Winner is taken the core foundation and tweaked it a bit with a much faster recovery, improving it greatly. 

I haven't tested or attempted to work out what it is you're doing, looking forward to doing so when I get time, but regardless I want to say good job on building on the work of a well respected player with a long history of actual play.

Too often we're trying to build pyramids on quicksand, using a concept from someone who may not have played much outside of test software, or someone without years worth of actual play results (knowledge).  It doesn't mean their work is useless, but it does mean the odds of it being successful are likely much lower.

Lot of diamonds from past posters here and on VLS, but those diamonds may be still coal...have to apply some effort to turn it into what you want, and you're doing that.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 04:02 PM 2019
@ Jono nice results
My results my profit with your game all 3 is +8
Here this what you look for
Everyone knows that there’s short and long series my view is that a short series is from 1to 4 then from 5 and up you have long ,it’s in the long series where you have to find the switch by that I mean look for the number where you can switch your bet so variance does catch you. In my case I have a note book full of results I can go back and read it over-and over until I find something that does occur and can use it .It was on one thread I found it .it was a GLC post . He was more into playing around with progression but it was the idea what I used and switched it to the bet selection progression are not hard when it comes to even money you either win the first or you lose and try to recover simple .my head doesn’t  hurt any more and I don’t need Advil . Lol

Winner, I bet you don't dip down too low like I have a couple of times. You achieve sure and steady results. I like it....

More useful clues.... I will keep testing and see if I stumble across anything.

Thanks Winner
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 04:23 PM 2019
A GLC thread comes to mind after reading your post, and it was actually something he detailed that won over time when I tested it (which is rare...nothing I test ever wins long, and most of them fail within the first 3000 spins).

The problem I had with it is that it couldn't be scaled in terms of the units bet without hitting typical table limits, so your net earning per hour were too limited to pursue it.

What you've done Winner is taken the core foundation and tweaked it a bit with a much faster recovery, improving it greatly. 

I haven't tested or attempted to work out what it is you're doing, looking forward to doing so when I get time, but regardless I want to say good job on building on the work of a well respected player with a long history of actual play.

Too often we're trying to build pyramids on quicksand, using a concept from someone who may not have played much outside of test software, or someone without years worth of actual play results (knowledge).  It doesn't mean their work is useless, but it does mean the odds of it being successful are likely much lower.

Lot of diamonds from past posters here and on VLS, but those diamonds may be still coal...have to apply some effort to turn it into what you want, and you're doing that.  :thumbsup:

Mako, as I keep saying, there is too much good info on this forum. The biggest problem is keeping up with it all. I have got so much stuff bookmarked. I will eventually come back to it when I get a chance...

Cheers Mako
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 10, 04:31 PM 2019
121121222121212112=0
1110112121112212122=-1
2112122111112012121=+2
121212111212121121=+6
Try to spot where I went into my progression after 4 losss in row and if you can switch it to an advantage.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 10, 04:50 PM 2019
Winner, I bet you don't dip down too low like I have a couple of times. You achieve sure and steady results. I like it....

More useful clues.... I will keep testing and see if I stumble across anything.

Thanks Winner
I haven’t experienced extreme drawn down.ithink it’s because Im keeping it to a flat bet until a -4 but the combination of the bet selection combined with MM is interesting.
It’s simple just keep your records so you can go over  them .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 05:04 PM 2019
121121222121212112=0
1110112121112212122=-1
2112122111112012121=+2
121212111212121121=+6
Try to spot where I went into my progression after 4 losss in row and if you can switch it to an advantage.

Yep, game 3. There was a series of 5 CHOPS. You were betting RUNS (as usual).
18 spins. 7 RUNS. 11 CHOPS. 

CHOPS beat the runs 11 - 7 but you still came away with +2 profit.

Great work Winner
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 05:21 PM 2019
I haven’t experienced extreme drawn down.ithink it’s because Im keeping it to a flat bet until a -4 but the combination of the bet selection combined with MM is interesting.
It’s simple just keep your records so you can go over  them .

Winner - You've given us so many clues, you have practically spelled it out. Your advice on when to begin the progression will be very useful. The whole premise of this system where results are packaged into CHOPS and RUNS is brilliant.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 10, 05:28 PM 2019
Winner - You've given us so many clues, you have practically spelled it out. Your advice on when to begin the progression will be very useful. The whole premise of this system where results are packaged into CHOPS and RUNS is brilliant.
Thank you ,I really want you  guys to have something that works every time you play.thats  what I looked for for long time. Honestly I gave up roulette for a 2 years thought it was just nothing left to try i was wrong.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 10, 05:31 PM 2019
Here’s some more .
211112122112211212+2
222211202221022202221-2
2201122221222121122+3
111221112222222122+6
Profit +6
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 10, 05:37 PM 2019
Here’s some more .
211112122112211212+2
222211202221022202221-2
2201122221222121122+3
111221112222222122+6
Profit +6

Thanks Winner - you've shared a hell of a lot.

More steady progress with the above figures..... racking up more profit.

I'l try and complete some more tests but I'm back at work, maybe lunchtime.....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 11, 06:16 AM 2019
Winner, I decided to carry on testing the mini-labouchere betting system. Your betting method obviously works. However, I want to put this method under a bit of pressure and see if it holds up. May as well try and  break it in testing.....

2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 2 (+15)
RUNS - 10 / CHOPS - 7

2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2 (+8)
RUNS - 9 / CHOPS - 13

2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1,  2, 2, 2 (+20)
RUNS - 15 / CHOPS - 8

1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1 (-33)
RUNS - 6 / CHOPS - 12

2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2 (+15)
RUNS - 13 / CHOPS - 10

Notice the 4th sequence. A loss consisting  of 6 RUNS and 12 CHOPS (-33). Not the best result, but I’m glad it happened in testing. It really hit the ropes with a run of 7 straight CHOPS. I decided to quit at the 18th spin.

There is definitely an argument for a stop-loss of -25 units. Moving forward that’s what I will do. Set the stop-loss for -25.
 
Winner, how would your betting strategy have handled this losing string (1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1)?  I think it would have done much better.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 07:33 AM 2019
Winner, I decided to carry on testing the mini-labouchere betting system. Your betting method obviously works. However, I want to put this method under a bit of pressure and see if it holds up. May as well try and  break it in testing.....

2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 2 (+15)
RUNS - 10 / CHOPS - 7

2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2 (+8)
RUNS - 9 / CHOPS - 13

2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1,  2, 2, 2 (+20)
RUNS - 15 / CHOPS - 8

1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1 (-33)
RUNS - 6 / CHOPS - 12

2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2 (+15)
RUNS - 13 / CHOPS - 10

Notice the 4th sequence. A loss consisting  of 6 RUNS and 12 CHOPS (-33). Not the best result, but I’m glad it happened in testing. It really hit the ropes with a run of 7 straight CHOPS. I decided to quit at the 18th spin.

There is definitely an argument for a stop-loss of -25 units. Moving forward that’s what I will do. Set the stop-loss for -25.
 
Winner, how would your betting strategy have handled this losing string (1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1)?  I think it would have done much better.



I see you extend some on the result longer the 18 series but it really doesn’t matter.
Jono s results
1st game +15 winners results +3
2nd game+8 winners results-1
3rd game+20winnersresults+1
4th game-33 winners results-1
5th game +15winners  results-2

5 games total profit -2

As you can see you made more but your progression was higher.
My progression went as high as 2 units .
There were many times I was in profit and stop .
But I don’t believe in stop loss only stop win.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 07:51 AM 2019
Jono there were 3 switches in the 5 games you presented the long run and the long chops
It’s these long strings is were my game has an advantage I know when to switch from runs to chops and from chops to runs . The key is to find the right strings to make a switch and then you have it .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 07:58 AM 2019
I would like to see more guys throw results at me . Now this would be a good challenge .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 09:24 AM 2019
Here I’ll do my own challenge . This was a challenge but i tamed random once again.lol
22211112101012221211 -1
212221220121212121  -2
122121120222001212211= -2 6th step progression only seen this twice in 30000 spins
20111201012122221221=+2
121111222221112222=+4 ended in profit not  huge but still won
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 12:01 PM 2019
Headed to casino with my VB friend will see who comes out ahead.lol
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 11, 12:08 PM 2019
Headed to casino with my VB friend will see who comes out ahead.lol

Are you playing on a live wheel or a machine?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Sparks on Feb 11, 12:24 PM 2019
I would like to see more guys throw results at me . Now this would be a good challenge .

Here you go Winner, 30,000 results for you to see what your profit would be.

if you want me to set this up in Excel so it does it automatically let me know  ;)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 11, 01:39 PM 2019


I see you extend some on the result longer the 18 series but it really doesn’t matter.
Jono s results
1st game +15 winners results +3
2nd game+8 winners results-1
3rd game+20winnersresults+1
4th game-33 winners results-1
5th game +15winners  results-2

5 games total profit -2

As you can see you made more but your progression was higher.
My progression went as high as 2 units .
There were many times I was in profit and stop .
But I don’t believe in stop loss only stop win.

Winner, you turned my 4th game from a loss of -33, into a  loss of just 1. I’ll take that any day.....!

I’ll keep testing. Let us know how you go at the casino.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 04:01 PM 2019
Are you playing on a live wheel or a machine?
Live
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 04:15 PM 2019
Here you go Winner, 30,000 results for you to see what your profit would be.

if you want me to set this up in Excel so it does it automatically let me know  ;)
[/quote
I would need zeros to make it realistic.
Thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 04:22 PM 2019
Winner, you turned my 4th game from a loss of -33, into a  loss of just 1. I’ll take that any day.....!

I’ll keep testing. Let us know how you go at the casino.
My casino trip was good helped my VB buddy out he still gambling ,plays way to many numbers .im pretty decent at vb although get bored waiting for people to get paid out.called out a couple of numbers that I saw hit twice made his money back .
My system had zero problems.


Yes -33 I got -1 the system tames random
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 04:39 PM 2019
Casino result
211222211222122111=0
121222112221211111=+2
22122222212210112=-2
111211222222222212=+7
Total profit +7 highest bet 2 units
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Sparks on Feb 11, 05:37 PM 2019
No problem Winner, I'll re-do the file with the 0s included tomorrow for you
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 05:48 PM 2019
No problem Winner, I'll re-do the file with the 0s included tomorrow for you
[/quote
Ok thank you
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 11, 09:26 PM 2019
Winner, your system relies on packaging the results of two spins into a RUN or CHOP.  Money is then bet on the result.

The system relies on the result of two spins. No money is placed on the first spin. Only the second spin is wagered. Now I’ve noticed, I frequently hit a zero on the first spin. Although the first spin is part of the betting process, I don’t lose any money. It’s a void event. I re-spin and continue.

Therefore we are immune to the effect of a zero hitting half the time. If this is the case, the house edge goes from 2.7 to 1.35. Is this logic correct? (Sorry, I’m am not a maths guy).
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Bigbroben on Feb 11, 09:39 PM 2019
You're also betting half the time so odds of hitting Zero are the same.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 11, 09:47 PM 2019
Winner, your system relies on packaging the results of two spins into a RUN or CHOP.  Money is then bet on the result.

The system relies on the result of two spins. No money is placed on the first spin. Only the second spin is wagered. Now I’ve noticed, I frequently hit a zero on the first spin. Although the first spin is part of the betting process, I don’t lose any money. It’s a void event. I re-spin and continue.

Therefore we are immune to the effect of a zero hitting half the time. If this is the case, the house edge goes from 2.7 to 1.35. Is this logic correct? (Sorry, I’m am not a maths guy).
Regardless if the zero hits on the first spin it’s a wash .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 11, 09:51 PM 2019
You're also betting half the time so odds of hitting Zero are the same.

Thanks Ben. I'm definitely not a maths guy....

Have you tried Winners system yet? If so, have you had any luck?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Bigbroben on Feb 11, 10:21 PM 2019
Not yet.

I've left ECs for a while, not enough Excel challenge, I guess ( what kind of geek have I become?)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Feb 12, 03:31 AM 2019
Winner, could you elaborate a bit on the key when we need to switch?  If this is possible with an example. :question: I think the system with which we can play and be in +, a modified parachute by 16 steps, I still do not understand how to implement it, because mathematics is not my friend) M. b someone can check ....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Sparks on Feb 12, 04:40 AM 2019
Winner, here's the file with the 0s included

let me know how you get on
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 12, 05:13 AM 2019
Winner, I have picked apart your results but I can’t work out your betting strategy. I wish I could, it’s more resilient than mine...

See the results of 7 sessions this evening.

For the 7 sessions there is an overall profit of 14 units. The 14 unit profit came after CHOPS defeated RUNS 67 to 52 (I always bet on RUNS).

Note, I had to activate the stop-loss on the 3rd session and finished with a loss of -24 units. This was after the CHOPS outnumbered the RUNS 7 to 2 for this game.

In the final game I finished with a profit of 2 units, however the betting dipped down to -91 units.  It was another horror run with CHOPS outnumbering RUNS 16 to 9. Although the session recovered, the fact that it dipped down so far is not a good sign.

Full results below....

Results of mini-labouchere betting on Winners system
2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 2 (+9)
9 RUNS / 9 CHOPS

2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2, 2 (+13)
10 RUNS / 7 CHOPS

1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1
(-24)
2 RUNS / 7 CHOPS

1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2 (+4)
8 RUNS / 11 CHOPS

1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 2, 1
(+8)
8 RUNS / 8 CHOPS

1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 2
(+2)
6 RUNS / 9 CHOPS

1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 1, 2
(+2)
9 RUNS / 16 CHOPS
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: nottophammer on Feb 12, 06:23 AM 2019
Winner
is the chop and run sequence correct

(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F12%2Fsource.png&hash=1043bdf4c956014c3a7a3584e840c372) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OJwt0)

how do you use the zero result please.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 2BobBet on Feb 12, 07:53 AM 2019
@ Notto   As I understand it that number 22 is a chop, you ignore the 0 

I have been playing this and its a very stable bet selection, my money management is the same as winners flat bet up to a 4 unit loss then I carry on if im still on my string of 9 results

I then start my progression on the start of the next string of 9 results

Example

1,2,2,1,2,1,1,1,1
2,1,1,2,1,2,2,2,2  -- Use prog 2,4,6,12 ....  if behind , at the start of this string
1,1,1,1,1,2,1,1,1
1,2,2
plus 6 units for me on this All Flat Bet  O0
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: nottophammer on Feb 12, 09:17 AM 2019
Thanks Bob

Now ignore this if you like. But thanks to Steve for adding the race track on MPR.
Why thanks?
Well if you can use the track option where you play; you could incorporate the zero; by using the Voisins du zero against the orphen's+ the Tier sections.
Okay not a true 50/50; but by having zero, you can say bet the Voisin section to give a run.

(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F12%2Fsourcecd444.png&hash=3fd0d17b93b0ea780078af2f615de138) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OJWuV)

Just find your prog: if you want one.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 09:18 AM 2019
Winner
is the chop and run sequence correct

(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F12%2Fsource.png&hash=1043bdf4c956014c3a7a3584e840c372) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OJwt0)

how do you use the zero result please.
The zero is a wash .
If it comes on the second spin you keep betting .
Ex 10,  0 ,35  so here the zero came on the second spin so I would continue until I get the result of a run or a chop.
Hope That helps.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 09:47 AM 2019
Winner, here's the file with the 0s included

let me know how you get on
[/quote
The systems works great 👍🏼 had good results thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 2BobBet on Feb 12, 09:53 AM 2019
Thanks Winner thats how im playing

Thanks for posting this  :thumbsup:, slow money maker as you said but very, very good stable bet selection. Just won another 6 units online! with no panic drawdowns even with a small marty

It reminds me of a system Ego posted, again very stable bet selection playing against the last string of results
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 09:53 AM 2019
Winner, could you elaborate a bit on the key when we need to switch?  If this is possible with an example. :question: I think the system with which we can play and be in +, a modified parachute by 16 steps, I still do not understand how to implement it, because mathematics is not my friend) M. b someone can check ....
[/quote
There’s long series and short ones that’s where you find it
I’m not making this out to be a a treasure hunt although it is if you find it lol.
There s enough here I feel I didn’t hide anything at the same time you would appreciate it more if you founded it yourself self .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 09:56 AM 2019
Thanks Winner thats how im playing

Thanks for posting this  :thumbsup:, slow money maker as you said but very, very good stable bet selection. Just won another 6 units online! with no panic drawdowns even with a small marty

It reminds me of a system Ego posted, again very stable bet selection playing against the last string of results
Yes that’s one variation ,good results 9 opposite of 9 results on a rolling basis ,hard to get 18 of the same result
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 12, 11:15 AM 2019
Yes that’s one variation ,good results 9 opposite of 9 results on a rolling basis ,hard to get 18 of the same result

What the difference between that and just making up a random sequence of the same length while wearing red socks?   :twisted:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 11:26 AM 2019
What the difference between that and just making up a random sequence of the same length while wearing red socks?   :twisted:
What’s the difference between good eyesight and bad eyesight?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 12, 11:28 AM 2019
Seriously, what's the difference?

Take your time and see if you can put forth a logical reason.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 11:35 AM 2019
Seriously, what's the difference?

Take your time and see if you can put forth a logical reason.
Simple I have tried what u are suggesting and found it’s a losing bet .this is only one of the variation but it’s not how I bet.
Seriously what is the difference on my question.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 12:50 PM 2019
Michael Jordon missed around 9000shot in his whole career lost over 300 games 26 times
@ General can you tell me the logic in that .
A super athlete but and all those misses  .
So your a vb guy or you find biased wheels Im Not sure what you do ,if your winning good for you ,I’m also winning. Bad vs good eyesight answer is .There’s more then one  logical thing that could cause this.which one its up to you to find the cause .my point is that keep an open mind does matter how logica or insignificant it is.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 12, 01:15 PM 2019
Thanks Winner thats how im playing

Thanks for posting this  :thumbsup:, slow money maker as you said but very, very good stable bet selection. Just won another 6 units online! with no panic drawdowns even with a small marty

It reminds me of a system Ego posted, again very stable bet selection playing against the last string of results

It doesn't need to be a slow money maker. If it wins, including zero, just bet $1000 instead of $1 or $10 and you can give up your day job.

This advice is for free, I'm not even charging 500 EUR for it. And furthermore it can be applied to any system, if you find a place with the right table limits.  How cool is that!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 2BobBet on Feb 12, 01:16 PM 2019
Totally agree
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 02:24 PM 2019
Stats games tested not included live play.
3000/0 losses
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 12, 02:39 PM 2019
Anyone (other than winner) cracked this nut yet?
Seems like some folk are on the verge

Winner, if someone found the way you play exactly, then shared it here, would you admit they'd cracked it?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 02:52 PM 2019
Anyone (other than winner) cracked this nut yet?
Seems like some folk are on the verge

Winner, if someone found the way you play exactly, then shared it here, would you admit they'd cracked it?
Bw I’m not looking for someone to play the I am what I’m doing here showing people how to stick To one thing and not jump from system to system  there is a lot of variation within in this u have to find what works for you.
This system is easy the problem is when something doesn’t   resegnate right away people just right it off .
Vb players all they have is the next spin
Computer users only have the next spin
System players only have the next spin
No crystal ball here only the next spin this is what this bet selection offers only the next spin. Is a repeat or is it a change.
How you win is different for everyone one the amount you want to win is different for everyone.thats it
So use your god given brain to search for what works and stick to it don’t waste your time and wait for someone to hand it to you.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 12, 02:59 PM 2019
So i take that as a no then!

Didnt think so, its cool. We arent worthy. Meanwhile others share all.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 03:02 PM 2019
So i take that as a no then!

Didnt think so, its cool. We arent worthy. Meanwhile others share all.
I m not sure what your asking but its all there .
Bet selection
Progression what’s left
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: nottophammer on Feb 12, 03:06 PM 2019
Winner
Like it; but i use the voisin du zero against the tier and orphens, as it will use the zero.

Like you say, have a muck around to see what you find.

I m not sure what your asking but its all there .
Bet selection
Progression what’s left

Where is talk of prog: like can you name a page.
Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 03:21 PM 2019
Winner
Like it; but i use the voisin du zero against the tier and orphens, as it will use the zero.

Like you say, have a muck around to see what you find.

Where is talk of prog: like can you name a page.
Cheers
I’m flat betting until I’m -4 to 5 units then 24816 32
If I’m in the plus I won’t go below +3 I will end the session there .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: -Katalyst- on Feb 12, 03:41 PM 2019
So i take that as a no then!

Didnt think so, its cool. We arent worthy. Meanwhile others share all.

BW - no disrespect intended - nobody in their right mind will drop their entire play for all to see - Winner’s done more than most here - def more than the regurgitated “basic” math plays that we are constantly reminded of when half decent ideas are thrown around
- and there have been a few of them on this forum - though the norm is that their discarded shortly after because of boredom in finding solutions to turn them into profitable business
On another thread, I did give Winner stick about how presumptuous he was in thinking that uncle Steve was the only one making money on this forum from Roulette - now he’s found a way and to his credit has shared plenty
**When you will find it (your it) - without doubt, you will not share it openly and even then - you will be reserved about how you go about it

-Best Wishes-

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 12, 03:49 PM 2019
Anyone (other than winner) cracked this nut yet?
Seems like some folk are on the verge

Winner, if someone found the way you play exactly, then shared it here, would you admit they'd cracked it?

Hey Buffalo,

Winner has practically gift wrapped everything, it's all in this thread. It's based on flat betting 1111 and then a progression if you lose the 4 flat bets. I think the progression is 2, 4, 8, 16, 32. 2BOBBET has another variation which is similar. I was trialing a mini-lab which works really well if CHOPS and RUNS remain even. It even handles a small deficit in the CHOPS. However, I have shown it can't really handle a bad steak. Dips too low, not practical in the real world.

Winners betting strategy is very resilient. Follow what he has posted.  The concept of packaging the result of two spins into RUNS and CHOPS is brilliant. Full credit to Winner for sharing what he has so far.

Look forward to your contributions on this one Buffalo.

Jono
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 12, 04:18 PM 2019
Hey Buffalo,

Winner has practically gift wrapped everything, it's all in this thread. It's based on flat betting 1111 and then a progression if you lose the 4 flat bets. I think the progression is 2, 4, 8, 16, 32. 2BOBBET has another variation which is similar. I was trialing a mini-lab which works really well if CHOPS and RUNS remain even. It even handles a small deficit in the CHOPS. However, I have shown it can't really handle a bad steak. Dips too low, not practical in the real world.

Winners betting strategy is very resilient. Follow what he has posted.  The concept of packaging the result of two spins into RUNS and CHOPS is brilliant. Full credit to Winner for sharing what he has so far.

Look forward to your contributions on this one Buffalo.

Jono

Nice Jono, good job deep diving on this one. 

I haven't started looking at this yet, but it reminds a little bit of the Ching-A-Ling, where the creator's entire foundation for his method was that chops on any EC bet will account for 25% of the results, while streaks will make up the other 75%.  He had done multiple 1M+ RNG runs which had apparently led him to that conclusion.

Sidenote: You all should have seen The General in that particular thread, he gave that poor old bastard a stroke multiple times.  Makes his dances with Turbo look like a friendly tea party...Sputnik (EGO) remembers I'm sure.  :xd:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 12, 04:32 PM 2019
Nice Jono, good job deep diving on this one. 

I haven't started looking at this yet, but it reminds a little bit of the Ching-A-Ling, where the creator's entire foundation for his method was that chops on any EC bet will account for 25% of the results, while streaks will make up the other 75%.  He had done multiple 1M+ RNG runs which had apparently led him to that conclusion.

Sidenote: You all should have seen The General in that particular thread, he gave that poor old bastard a stroke multiple times.  Makes his dances with Turbo look like a friendly tea party...Sputnik (EGO) remembers I'm sure.  :xd:
The General reminds me of Conor Mcgregor loves to trash talk🙂
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 12, 04:45 PM 2019
Nice Jono, good job deep diving on this one. 

I haven't started looking at this yet, but it reminds a little bit of the Ching-A-Ling, where the creator's entire foundation for his method was that chops on any EC bet will account for 25% of the results, while streaks will make up the other 75%.  He had done multiple 1M+ RNG runs which had apparently led him to that conclusion.

Sidenote: You all should have seen The General in that particular thread, he gave that poor old bastard a stroke multiple times.  Makes his dances with Turbo look like a friendly tea party...Sputnik (EGO) remembers I'm sure.  :xd:

Thanks Mako - If you decide to have a go at this, let us know how you go.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 12, 04:53 PM 2019
Thanks Mako - If you decide to have a go at this, let us know how you go.

I will for sure, it's on my list.  I'm still fooling around with the daveylibra 18-unhit approach from last week, I haven't gotten it to fail enough yet so I can quit testing it and close the book.  RouletteGhost is testing a similar method as well.

The General reminds me of Conor Mcgregor loves to trash talk🙂

lol, yes, you can see the general doing that dipshit walk Conor does in the ring each time he posts against one of our fallacy approaches... :twisted:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: AndyCasinoK on Feb 12, 06:54 PM 2019
Hi All  !

Mako your a genius ! I was thinking about Ching-A-Ling progression for this method

"Level 1: 40p-60p-80p-£1-£1.20-£1.40.  Lose up by 20p; win down by 10p
Level 2: 80p-£1.20-£1.60-£2-£2.40-£2.80.    Lose up by 40p; win down by 20p
Level 3: £1.20-£1.80-£2.40-£3-£3.60-£4.20.    Lose up by 60p; win down by 30p

(On 2 consecutive wins back 2 places in level - or reset if in profit)

SESSION TARGET = £2 (5x40p units)

TOTAL BANK REQUIRED = £32.30

Cheers,
Atlantis. " 

here the link : http://www.rouletteforum.com/viewthread/10995/P15/
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 12, 07:14 PM 2019
@ Notto   As I understand it that number 22 is a chop, you ignore the 0 

I have been playing this and its a very stable bet selection, my money management is the same as winners flat bet up to a 4 unit loss then I carry on if im still on my string of 9 results

I then start my progression on the start of the next string of 9 results

Example

1,2,2,1,2,1,1,1,1
2,1,1,2,1,2,2,2,2  -- Use prog 2,4,6,12 ....  if behind , at the start of this string
1,1,1,1,1,2,1,1,1
1,2,2
plus 6 units for me on this All Flat Bet  O0

Hi 2Bob

I was looking at your figures above. You said you had flat-bet everything, however I notice you had a string of five CHOPS (3rd string). Wouldn't this have meant a small increase in your progression? Can you please clarify?

I assume you were betting RUNS......

Thanks 2Bob
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 2BobBet on Feb 13, 03:56 AM 2019
Sorry Jono I got the lines mixed up!
I dont bet for Runs and Chops ,I bet against the above result ,9 results on a rolling basis -Winner says this was the best selection in his testing

I will explain for everyone how I play

Record the first results either chops or runs

1,   2,   2,   1,   2,   1,  1,   1,   1   this is no betting record first 9 results- I now start to bet opposite of the above result!
2w,1w,1w,2w,1w,2w,2w,2w,2w -    All flat bet I could of stopped here but I will carry on
1w,1L,1L, 1w,  1L,2L ,1w, 1w,1w
1L, 2w,2w,                                         All flat bet plus 11 units

As you can see from this the original result should of won more , I was still learning the system so I recorded the results wrong the above is now how I play :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 13, 04:22 AM 2019
Sorry Jono I got the lines mixed up!
I dont bet for Runs and Chops ,I bet against the above result ,9 results on a rolling basis -Winner says this was the best selection in his testing

I will explain for everyone how I play

Record the first results either chops or runs

1,   2,   2,   1,   2,   1,  1,   1,   1   this is no betting record first 9 results- I now start to bet opposite of the above result!
2w,1w,1w,2w,1w,2w,2w,2w,2w -    All flat bet I could of stopped here but I will carry on
1w,1L,1L, 1w,  1L,2L ,1w, 1w,1w
1L, 2w,2w,                                         All flat bet plus 11 units

As you can see from this the original result should of won more , I was still learning the system so I recorded the results wrong the above is now how I play :thumbsup:

Thanks for explaining how you play concisely Bob. The more testers on board the better
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 13, 05:56 AM 2019
Sorry Jono I got the lines mixed up!
I dont bet for Runs and Chops ,I bet against the above result ,9 results on a rolling basis -Winner says this was the best selection in his testing

I will explain for everyone how I play

Record the first results either chops or runs

1,   2,   2,   1,   2,   1,  1,   1,   1   this is no betting record first 9 results- I now start to bet opposite of the above result!
2w,1w,1w,2w,1w,2w,2w,2w,2w -    All flat bet I could of stopped here but I will carry on
1w,1L,1L, 1w,  1L,2L ,1w, 1w,1w
1L, 2w,2w,                                         All flat bet plus 11 units

As you can see from this the original result should of won more , I was still learning the system so I recorded the results wrong the above is now how I play :thumbsup:

Hi 2Bob

Thanks for the explanation. It sounds a bit like ‘Pattern Breaker’. Do you remember that? It was a thread on this forum which had over 200 pages (John Legend).

It will interesting to apply the RUN / CHOP technique to this strategy.

Please keep posting your results 2Bob. It will be interesting to follow.

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 13, 06:03 AM 2019
Hi Winner

I was recording a few sessions this evening using a slightly modified betting strategy. The strategy incorporated your flat bet of 11111 followed by a progression.

Unfortunately I hit this nasty little run:
1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1,
 4 RUNS / 14 CHOPS

I can’t seem to pick the flow of the game at all.....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 2BobBet on Feb 13, 08:15 AM 2019
Jono

Thats why I play opposite of 9 put those results into a lines of nine and play opposite of the above

You would have won 4 times and lost slightly more with flat bet. Minus a few units on that string of results, just keep playing flat with a prog on the next string . It may have ended with a total loss but you have to see how its performing, do what you think is right!

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 10:12 AM 2019
How’s everyone doing?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Feb 13, 10:29 AM 2019
Grail not found
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 10:40 AM 2019
Grail not found
What exactly are you doing to find it?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 11:03 AM 2019
looking for a grail in my opinion is not the right way to look at the game you will never find one and that’s a fact.
What one should look for is how can I beat a game that has a 2.7 or5.22 % against the players and neutralize this to almost 0 but here you wouldn’t win anything.
One must document everything and then keep going back to it doesn’t s matter how long it takes . I’ve been on this journey far to long most people would give up ,if it was easy everyone would be doing it.
Try looking at the game from a maths view they use maths to beat you so you use maths to beat them they want you to keep doubling up well we all know this doesn’t work so use this doubling up as your weapon but not how they intend you to use it this is where the study comes into play your brain will hurt but take Advil and continue 🙂
 
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 11:16 AM 2019
#1 You need a bet selection
#2 You need some form of Money Management
#3 You need to learn the Count this is very important. Are you -4 or +6 and go from there.
This ain’t no holy grail and in no way indented it to be .but I can tell you this I will win more then I lose.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 11:42 AM 2019
Share this . My last session live play I came up against 4 zeros on a double zero wheel and it still couldn’t beat me so the zeros is irrelevant to the way I’m playing .
11210221001012221221= +0 this here was my final count and I made 4 units 25 dollars a spin
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 2BobBet on Feb 13, 11:52 AM 2019
#1 You need a bet selection
#2 You need some form of Money Management
#3 You need to learn the Count this is very important. Are you -4 or +6 and go from there.
This ain’t no holy grail and in no way indented it to be .but I can tell you this I will win more then I lose.

100 % agree . I have lost 1 bankroll playing this today , my fault i got greedy >:D I am still up from my initial deposit and waiting for Bank to double before raising unit value.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 13, 11:56 AM 2019
Try looking at the game from a maths view they use maths to beat you so you use maths to beat them they want you to keep doubling up well we all know this doesn’t work so use this doubling up as your weapon but not how they intend you to use it

The house doesn't want you to keep doubling. They just want you to keep playing for as long and as randomly as possible.

They don't use the maths of doubling or martingales to beat you. They use the law of large numbers.

The standard deviation of your loss from the mean is proportional to the square root of the number of trials whereas the mean is proportional to the  number of trials. Which means the deviation in proportion to the mean will get smaller as the number of spins increase. 95% of the time you'll be within 3 standard deviations of the mean.

Your mean expectation is negative, and the larger the spins, the more negative it will be, and the smaller your expected deviation from it will be.

Playing every day for 50 spins is the same as waiting till Sunday and playing 350 spins. If you play long enough, you'll lose, unless you are that lucky person who is 4 or 5 standard deviations in the positive.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 13, 12:00 PM 2019
Share this . My last session live play I came up against 4 zeros on a double zero wheel and it still couldn’t beat me so the zeros is irrelevant to the way I’m playing .
11210221001012221221= +0 this here was my final count and I made 4 units 25 dollars a spin

I think I can see how you may have reached the +4 in this session going by what you said earlier and your progression tactics...
Just to confirm - Would you care to share what your highest unit bet was in this session??

Regards,
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 12:01 PM 2019
The longer I play the more I win ,I wonder why I’m not losing.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 12:03 PM 2019
I think I can see how you may have reached the +4 in this session going by what you said earlier and your progression tactics...
Just to confirm - Would you care to share what your highest unit bet was in this session??

Regards,
A.
No problem Atlantis your an old forum buddy .highest bet 2 units
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Feb 13, 12:04 PM 2019
Good post, you encourage to move forward and not lose motivation. There was a question about what I was doing in order to get it. Probably we are trying to find the optimal progression that will allow us to lose less in case of a bad session. But while they all fail. I do not know if it is worth doing some exercises to develop these skills in the system ... But the difficulty lies in the fact that we are on this side of reality, and you are already beyond its borders, and sometimes it’s difficult for us to understand what you want to convey to us. ..
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 13, 12:09 PM 2019
The longer I play the more I win ,I wonder why I’m not losing.  :thumbsup:

Luck ::)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 12:16 PM 2019
Luck ::)
Luck .and I’m love in it.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 12:21 PM 2019
⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️ General I’m taking over your position your fired  I have more the stars .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 13, 12:30 PM 2019
As I said, 95% are within 3 SD but there's always a lucky few who are 4 or 5 SD or more on the positive side.

There are also many players who don't keep proper records or look at their results with rose tinted spectacles, ignoring their losses because "the casino was cheating " or "that was just a splash out on my birthday, it doesn't count".

Not saying you are one if these, but there are  lot of them around!

And luck has a habit of turning round and biting you in the ass when you least expect it ;)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 12:34 PM 2019
As I said, 95% are within 3 SD but there's always a lucky few who are 4 or 5 SD or more on the positive side.

There are also many players who don't keep proper records or look at their results with rose tinted spectacles, ignoring their losses because "the casino was cheating " or "that was just a splash out on my birthday, it doesn't count".

Not saying you are one if these, but there are  lot of them around!

And luck has a habit of turning round and biting you in the ass when you least expect it ;)

It only bites in the ass when you get greedy.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: MoneyT101 on Feb 13, 12:34 PM 2019
⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️ General I’m taking over your position your fired  I have more the stars .

I’m glad you’re winning, honestly!  Happy for any fellow roulette player...

Your method is a little more stable because it’s not based on 1 spin.  So the variance is a little more controlled. With the progression you will win more then you lose. 

But be careful
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 13, 12:35 PM 2019
As I said, 95% are within 3 SD but there's always a lucky few who are 4 or 5 SD or more on the positive side.

There are also many players who don't keep proper records or look at their results with rose tinted spectacles, ignoring their losses because "the casino was cheating " or "that was just a splash out on my birthday, it doesn't count".

Not saying you are one if these, but there are  lot of them around!

And luck has a habit of turning round and biting you in the ass when you least expect it ;)

And there are people that place very few bets.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 12:36 PM 2019
I’m glad you’re winning, honestly!  Happy for any fellow roulette player...

Your method is a little more stable because it’s not based on 1 spin.  So the variance is a little more controlled. With the progression you will win more then you lose. 

But be careful
Always careful thank you.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 13, 12:36 PM 2019
It only bites in the ass when you get greedy.

The wheel doesn't care how you feel or whether or not your greedy.  Just saying.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 12:41 PM 2019
And there are people that place very few bets.

Quite the contrary that way of betting is a 💤
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 12:42 PM 2019
The wheel doesn't care how you feel or whether or not your greedy.  Just saying.
Who said anything about feelings.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 12:45 PM 2019
General we all know your a physics man and that’s all good there’s a lot flaws to that way of playing.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 13, 12:47 PM 2019
The wheel doesn't care how you feel or whether or not your greedy.  Just saying.

True. It is also possible to lose from the start of a session, even if you have an advantage. And no matter what you do, you keep on losing, despite having an advantage.

You haven't been greedy, you haven't even been lucky, you've just lost. If you haven't been there, you haven't played.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 12:51 PM 2019
True. It is also possible to lose from the start of a session, even if you have an advantage. And no matter what you do, you keep on losing, despite having an advantage.

You haven't been greedy, you haven't even been lucky, you've just lost. If you haven't been there, you haven't played.
This must be your experience . Maybe try playing different game and I don’t mean any disrespect if something is not working for you why bang your head on the wall.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 13, 01:01 PM 2019
This must be your experience . Maybe try playing different game and I don’t mean any disrespect if something is not working for you why bang your head on the wall.

Winner,

How is your rating here on the MPR?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 13, 01:10 PM 2019
I generally do give up after a while if it's a losing session. It's easy to do that if they changed something or I just can't get the rhyhm right or I'm betting in the shadow.

But much harder if I'm getting the fall off spot on but the ball is just dropping in between my numbers. Quite possible since I only bet 5-7 numbers in the zone. Still, it happens!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 02:32 PM 2019
Winner,

How is your rating here on the MPR?
What’s mpr?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 02:34 PM 2019
I generally do give up after a while if it's a losing session. It's easy to do that if they changed something or I just can't get the rhyhm right or I'm betting in the shadow.

But much harder if I'm getting the fall off spot on but the ball is just dropping in between my numbers. Quite possible since I only bet 5-7 numbers in the zone. Still, it happens!
5 to 7 numbers are good when playing vb I tell my friend to do  that but he has a hard head doesn’t listens
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 13, 03:49 PM 2019
Sorry Jono I got the lines mixed up!
I dont bet for Runs and Chops ,I bet against the above result ,9 results on a rolling basis -Winner says this was the best selection in his testing

I will explain for everyone how I play

Record the first results either chops or runs

1,   2,   2,   1,   2,   1,  1,   1,   1   this is no betting record first 9 results- I now start to bet opposite of the above result!
2w,1w,1w,2w,1w,2w,2w,2w,2w -    All flat bet I could of stopped here but I will carry on
1w,1L,1L, 1w,  1L,2L ,1w, 1w,1w
1L, 2w,2w,                                         All flat bet plus 11 units

As you can see from this the original result should of won more , I was still learning the system so I recorded the results wrong the above is now how I play :thumbsup:

Sorry 2Bob, I just noticed I answered this last night..... I need more sleep!

Keep posting results everyone!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 13, 03:56 PM 2019
Share this . My last session live play I came up against 4 zeros on a double zero wheel and it still couldn’t beat me so the zeros is irrelevant to the way I’m playing .
11210221001012221221= +0 this here was my final count and I made 4 units 25 dollars a spin

You certainly have faith in your system Winner.

25 unit bets and a double zero wheel. It's like you're giving it every chance to fail.... only it's not.  Respect.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 04:09 PM 2019
You certainly have faith in your system Winner.

25 unit bets and a double zero wheel. It's like you're giving it every chance to fail.... only it's not.  Respect.
I’m trying
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 13, 06:24 PM 2019
What’s mpr?

Multiplayer Roulette. There is a game on this forum system you can play for fun. It's on the home page at the bottom.

http://www.rouletteplayers.org/register

As for VB, how many numbers you could play depends on the scatter plot. I tend to play on quite wide scatter wheels. That's the only thing left here. They are marginal but beatable.

Experts tell me I should play more numbers straight up like 10 or 15, but there is so little time to get bets down and I don't like calling out neighbours bets, it's a big attention draw. So it's a practical thing, but increases the variance of my loss/win pattern.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 13, 06:32 PM 2019
Multiplayer Roulette. There is a game on this forum system you can play for fun. It's on the home page at the bottom.

http://www.rouletteplayers.org/register

As for VB, how many numbers you could play depends on the scatter plot. I tend to play on quite wide scatter wheels. That's the only thing left here. They are marginal but beatable.

Experts tell me I should play more numbers straight up like 10 or 15, but there is so little time to get bets down and I don't like calling out neighbours bets, it's a big attention draw. So it's a practical thing, but increases the variance of my loss/win pattern.
Mpr not for me I play for real.thankyou
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 13, 07:00 PM 2019
I'm not keen on RNG games for obvious reasons ,so don't play that one, although I have tried it and Steve has done a good job. It's fast and ideal for trying out systems.

However, I was bored at motorway services the other week and turned £5 into £10 using a D'Alambert on 20p bets touch bet RNG roulette.

20p bets and £5 is about as much as I'll risk for fun using a fallacy system and that rarely  :twisted:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 14, 12:19 AM 2019
I'm not keen on RNG games for obvious reasons ,so don't play that one, although I have tried it and Steve has done a good job. It's fast and ideal for trying out systems.

However, I was bored at motorway services the other week and turned £5 into £10 using a D'Alambert on 20p bets touch bet RNG roulette.

20p bets and £5 is about as much as I'll risk for fun using a fallacy system and that rarely  :twisted:
your English pound is worth more then our Canadien I don’t like you. But I’ll take take your cash over ours 😂
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 14, 01:18 AM 2019
It won't be worth too much in a few months after we have left the EU. Brexit is a worse idea than playing 85% slots.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Feb 14, 04:49 AM 2019
Share this . My last session live play I came up against 4 zeros on a double zero wheel and it still couldn’t beat me so the zeros is irrelevant to the way I’m playing .
11210221001012221221= +0 this here was my final count and I made 4 units 25 dollars a spin

Winner, how 0 or how 4, if progression is 1,1,1, 1, 2,4,8,16 ??? I get a different result? To show exactly where you are playing in this example?
Google english, sorry! :sad2:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 04:52 AM 2019
Winner, how 0 or how 4, if progression is 1,1,1, 1, 2,4,8,16 ??? I get a different result? To show exactly where you are playing in this example?
Google english, sorry! :sad2:
Nope, you need to figure it out yourself man!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 14, 06:29 AM 2019
Sorry Jono I got the lines mixed up!
I dont bet for Runs and Chops ,I bet against the above result ,9 results on a rolling basis -Winner says this was the best selection in his testing

I will explain for everyone how I play

Record the first results either chops or runs

1,   2,   2,   1,   2,   1,  1,   1,   1   this is no betting record first 9 results- I now start to bet opposite of the above result!
2w,1w,1w,2w,1w,2w,2w,2w,2w -    All flat bet I could of stopped here but I will carry on
1w,1L,1L, 1w,  1L,2L ,1w, 1w,1w
1L, 2w,2w,                                         All flat bet plus 11 units

As you can see from this the original result should of won more , I was still learning the system so I recorded the results wrong the above is now how I play :thumbsup:

Hi 2Bob

Can  you please clarify your progression? Let’s say you’re on your first string of 9 (betting opposites) and you lose your first 5 spins in the string. Do you continue flat-betting the same amount  until you finish the string? 

At the beginning of the next string of 9 you start the level 2 progression and continue with this until the end of the string. Is that correct.

I have some spare time this weekend and want to test this alongside another idea I have.

Thanks 2Bob
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 2BobBet on Feb 14, 07:15 AM 2019
@ Jono  sort of , I will give you a scenario

here is a game I just played and lost !now 2 bankroll gone Im still ahead overall
1,1,1,2,1,1,1,1,2
1,1,2,2,1,2,2,1,1   all flat bet 4 wins  5 loses I wont progress on 1 loss
2,2,1,2,1,1,1,1,2  all flat bet  6 wins   3 losses only 1 unit down I may use progression as this string is even could go either way
2,1,1,2,2,1,1,1,2    start flat as im not winning much and see how it goes start flat betting lose first start next step of prog win
                               there was some w,l,w, in this session so I am thinking to start prog as Im not winning or losing much!
                                 Loss on next bet loss on next win on third bet :lol:
                                Now im thinking this is a bad session perhaps another unit and I'm out of here
                                Start prog on last 4 results real bad idea!  L,L,L,L I didnt go another step but I watched and I would have won
                                 on the fith step
As you can see its not going to win all the time and as with any system you have to make decision's along the way .
Overall i have played 13 sessions/Games and I have lost twice. Its a very good system one of the best on this Forum and I thank Winner for posting it  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Feb 14, 07:26 AM 2019
Nope, you need to figure it out yourself man!

 :girl_to:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: -Katalyst- on Feb 14, 07:34 AM 2019
Nope, you need to figure it out yourself man!

BW - this is the 5-6th time on diff occasions I’ve read your post and it’s brought a smile to my face every time!  :twisted: :twisted:
BTW - I sent you a pm a few days ago
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Feb 14, 07:42 AM 2019
Thanks for explaining how you play concisely Bob. The more testers on board the better

and did you read this post from BW? It's funny now?? :question:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Feb 14, 07:46 AM 2019
Anyone (other than winner) cracked this nut yet?
Seems like some folk are on the verge

Winner, if someone found the way you play exactly, then shared it here, would you admit they'd cracked it?

Or this one????????? :lol:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 07:52 AM 2019
BW - this is the 5-6th time on diff occasions I’ve read your post and it’s brought a smile to my face every time!  :twisted: :twisted:
BTW - I sent you a pm a few days ago
Cool, will check later bro. Been busy
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: -Katalyst- on Feb 14, 07:59 AM 2019
@Blueman - chill chill  8) 8)
Jonno and myself had given him a bit of stick after those posts - hence I found it funny that he said that to you in that manner - and knowing BW - he would not have meant anything derogatory towards you - just banter
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 14, 08:09 AM 2019
@Blueman - chill chill  8) 8)
Jonno and myself had given him a bit of stick after those posts - hence I found it funny that he said that to you in that manner - and knowing BW - he would not have meant anything derogatory towards you - just banter
Exactly, dont mind me. Im trying to fight the cloying cynicism that creeps up on me when posters dont reveal everything from the get-go.
I wish you guys luck.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 14, 09:09 AM 2019
Exactly, dont mind me. Im trying to fight the cloying cynicism that creeps up on me when posters dont reveal everything from the get-go.
I wish you guys luck.
Reveal everything I did .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 14, 09:10 AM 2019
Bw try sticking to one thing jumping from system to system doesn’t work just saying.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 14, 09:14 AM 2019
Card counting is not easy but it’s great system it works they don’t go half way through and say f- - - it lets gamble or let’s try a different system.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 2BobBet on Feb 14, 09:18 AM 2019
Card counting is not easy but it’s great system it works they don’t go half way through and say f- - - it lets gamble or let’s try a different system.

LOL :xd: :xd: :xd: :xd: :xd: :xd: :xd: :xd:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 14, 09:47 AM 2019
The nice thing about roulette that is different then black jack  is casinos allow you to track they supply a score card and a pencil. I don’t have to play min .every hand to get a running count I can skip spins until I get my running count .saving br
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 14, 10:10 AM 2019
This system is good for air ball ⚽️ 2 spins every min.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Feb 14, 12:20 PM 2019
Exactly, dont mind me. Im trying to fight the cloying cynicism that creeps up on me when posters dont reveal everything from the get-go.
I wish you guys luck.

Ironia......?! Ok, my fail! Good luck to you too! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Feb 14, 02:31 PM 2019
Share this . My last session live play I came up against 4 zeros on a double zero wheel and it still couldn’t beat me so the zeros is irrelevant to the way I’m playing .
11210221001012221221= +0 this here was my final count and I made 4 units 25 dollars a spin
progression 1-1-1-1-2-4-8-16/bet RUN
1= -1/1
1= -2/1
2= -1/1
1= -2/1
0= -3/1
2= -2/1
2= -1/1
1= -2/1
0= -3/1
0= -4/1
1= -5 /1 x 4L/ progr. start
0= -7 /2
1= -11 /4
2= -3 /8
2= -2 /1
2= -1 /1
1= -2 /1
2= -1 /1
2= 0 /1
1= -1/ 1

something like this?? :question:


Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 14, 02:41 PM 2019
I came up with my own twist.

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 2 1 1 2 2 2 2 1 2 1 1 2 1 1 2 1 1 2 1 1 2 2 1 1 2 2 1 2 1 2 2 2 1 1 2 2 1 2 1 1 2 2 2 2 1 1 1 2 2 1 1 2 1 1 1 2 1 1 2  2 2 1 2 2 2 1 2 1 = +15u using 2 step progression
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 14, 03:07 PM 2019
@ Jono  sort of , I will give you a scenario

here is a game I just played and lost !now 2 bankroll gone Im still ahead overall
1,1,1,2,1,1,1,1,2
1,1,2,2,1,2,2,1,1   all flat bet 4 wins  5 loses I wont progress on 1 loss
2,2,1,2,1,1,1,1,2  all flat bet  6 wins   3 losses only 1 unit down I may use progression as this string is even could go either way
2,1,1,2,2,1,1,1,2    start flat as im not winning much and see how it goes start flat betting lose first start next step of prog win
                               there was some w,l,w, in this session so I am thinking to start prog as Im not winning or losing much!
                                 Loss on next bet loss on next win on third bet :lol:
                                Now im thinking this is a bad session perhaps another unit and I'm out of here
                                Start prog on last 4 results real bad idea!  L,L,L,L I didnt go another step but I watched and I would have won
                                 on the fith step
As you can see its not going to win all the time and as with any system you have to make decision's along the way .
Overall i have played 13 sessions/Games and I have lost twice. Its a very good system one of the best on this Forum and I thank Winner for posting it  :thumbsup:

2 Bob

I agree, its a very good system. it's just a matter of working out a good betting strategy. This weekend I want to test a couple of staking methods simultaneously and see how they go. I will use this and another method I have been working on.

I will post results when I have them. I hope you keep testing too.

Thanks 2Bob

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 14, 06:53 PM 2019
I came up with my own twist.

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 2 1 1 2 2 2 2 1 2 1 1 2 1 1 2 1 1 2 1 1 2 2 1 1 2 2 1 2 1 2 2 2 1 1 2 2 1 2 1 1 2 2 2 2 1 1 1 2 2 1 1 2 1 1 1 2 1 1 2  2 2 1 2 2 2 1 2 1 = +15u using 2 step progression
Looks good
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 14, 09:09 PM 2019
What if we not see 18 pairs, just only 3 pairs? Example 2 1 1 / 2 1 2 / 1 1 1 / 2 2 1 / 1 2 2 / et etc maybe we can figure someting MM to this ad progression. I often saw 2 1 2 / 1 2 1 / 2  2 1 / sequences than 2 2 2 and 1 1 1. This means one 3 step prgoression could overcome with these repeated 3 sequence.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 14, 09:48 PM 2019
So I think first spin in an indicator. Example 2. The next 2 bet will be 1, so not to expect 2 2 2. If comes 2 2 1, or 2 1 1 , we won via progression. Next bet we see first spin only tje indicator. Example 1, so we bet 2, not to show 1 1 1 repeatedly. If 2 coke within 2 spins, we won. The hitrate is extremely high.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 14, 11:10 PM 2019
So I think first spin in an indicator. Example 2. The next 2 bet will be 1, so not to expect 2 2 2. If comes 2 2 1, or 2 1 1 , we won via progression. Next bet we see first spin only tje indicator. Example 1, so we bet 2, not to show 1 1 1 repeatedly. If 2 coke within 2 spins, we won. The hitrate is extremely high.
Triples come all the time .I have experienced it so be careful with those kind of bets they will catch you.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 15, 04:38 AM 2019
Thanks. I just try to tweak somehow your method, thanks that your shared here.

I have few quesrions for you, are you watchingy and betting the all 18 pairs, or have you some spins which you miss during session?

In your opinion better to play 1 or 2 in a whole session than exampl streaks or zigzags?

You also mentioned you know when to switch from 1 to 2 and vice versa. But what if comed 1 2 1 2 1 2 2 1 1 2 2 ?

You can ignore my questions, but you can answer without revealing how you play exactly. Your inspiration is well, we must figure out our own playing way :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Feb 15, 05:16 AM 2019
Reveal everything I did .

 Winner = Friedrich Nietzsche        :lol:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 10:53 AM 2019
You have 3 games 54 bets  can you make 4 units that’s 35% what bank is going to give you that.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 11:29 AM 2019
Don’t rack your brain  on waiting x amount of spin then bet .
Bet every second spin this what I’m doing it works. 4 units I’ll do that within my first game not hard .
And mr General says it’s all luck tested over 3000 games not  including live games and and consistently wining 4 units on all 3000games. Well I guess I’m going keep Lady Luck on my side 😆
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 15, 01:18 PM 2019
2 2 1 1 2 2 2 2 2 1 1 2 1 2 2 2 1 2 2 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 -> +5u my wingoal reached after 58 spins. Flatbet 1u, and not only betting 2s, yes would be more profit, but definitely only betting on 1 or 2 will catch you.

Always go for small wins per session for me is +5. With 50 euro stakes it is 250 euro.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 01:27 PM 2019
2 2 1 1 2 2 2 2 2 1 1 2 1 2 2 2 1 2 2 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 -> +5u my wingoal reached after 58 spins. Flatbet 1u, and not only betting 2s, yes would be more profit, but definitely only betting on 1 or 2 will catch you.

Always go for small wins per session for me is +5. With 50 euro stakes it is 250 euro.
That’s around 35% win 👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 15, 02:36 PM 2019
Winner

How would your progression perfrom on my posted numebrs? I am just curious  ;)

NEW LINE ( can anyone test it, I challange Winner)


1,1,2,2,2,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,2,1,2,0,1,1,2,1,2,2,1,2,2,2,1,2,2,2 ->+5u flatbat, max drawdown -3. Need to test more with this new view of numbers.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 02:59 PM 2019
Winner

How would your progression perfrom on my posted numebrs? I am just curious  ;)

NEW LINE ( can anyone test it, I challange Winner)


1,1,2,2,2,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,2,1,2,0,1,1,2,1,2,2,1,2,2,2,1,2,2,2 ->+5u flatbat, max drawdown -3. Need to test more with this new view of numbers.
+1 you beat me flat bet👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 04:08 PM 2019
Winner

How would your progression perfrom on my posted numebrs? I am just curious  ;)

NEW LINE ( can anyone test it, I challange Winner)


1,1,2,2,2,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,2,1,2,0,1,1,2,1,2,2,1,2,2,2,1,2,2,2 ->+5u flatbat, max drawdown -3. Need to test more with this new view of numbers.

Here I’ll give my power ball results on the sequence above .
Wllllwwwwlllwwwwwlwwwlwwwlllwlw +30
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 04:09 PM 2019
Have you ever needed that 32u bet in your progression Winner, or is it there as a last-resort? 

And if you don't have a stop loss and lost the 32u bet, would you just reset back to 1u and start over, taking the loss, or continue the marty to 64u?

Interesting how 2BOBBET / Jono / Mister Eko are modifying the selection of the system but using the same foundation.  Good job guys, and thanks Winner for continuing the discussion.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 04:21 PM 2019
Have you ever needed that 32u bet in your progression Winner, or is it there as a last-resort? 

And if you don't have a stop loss and lost the 32u bet, would you just reset back to 1u and start over, taking the loss, or continue the marty to 64u?

Interesting how 2BOBBET / Jono / Mister Eko are modifying the selection of the system but using the same foundation.  Good job guys, and thanks Winner for continuing the discussion.  :thumbsup:
Have you tried playing with this?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 15, 04:22 PM 2019
Winner, see below. This is the string from hell which killed my mini-lab system a few days ago. Bear in mind I always bet on RUNS. The string contained 4 RUNS / 14 CHOPS.   I decided to test it out against a few of the methods being discussed in this thread.

Original mini-lab betting strategy
1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1 (-70)

Modified mini-lab betting strategy
1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1 (-25)

2Bobs Staking Plan (Betting opposites)
1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1  (-1)

Marvin’s 5 Level Staking Plan
1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1 (+4)

Winner, can you please run this string through your system and post the results?
1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1 (4 RUNS / 14 CHOPS). 

Mister Elo? Anyone else?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 04:25 PM 2019
Winner, see below. This is the string from hell which killed my mini-lab system a few days ago. Bear in mind I always bet on RUNS. The string contained 4 RUNS / 14 CHOPS.   I decided to test it out against a few of the methods being discussed in this thread.

Original mini-lab betting strategy
1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1 (-70)

Modified mini-lab betting strategy
1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1 (-25)

2Bobs Staking Plan (Betting opposites)
1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1  (-1)

Marvin’s 5 Level Staking Plan
1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1 (+4)

Winner, can you please run this string through your system and post the results?
1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1 (4 RUNS / 14 CHOPS). 

Mister Elo? Anyone else?
[/quote
Yes in my testing have seen those results
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 15, 04:29 PM 2019
Have you ever needed that 32u bet in your progression Winner, or is it there as a last-resort? 

And if you don't have a stop loss and lost the 32u bet, would you just reset back to 1u and start over, taking the loss, or continue the marty to 64u?

Interesting how 2BOBBET / Jono / Mister Eko are modifying the selection of the system but using the same foundation.  Good job guys, and thanks Winner for continuing the discussion.  :thumbsup:

Mako, my mini lab system did really well when RUNS and CHOPS were even. It even did well when CHOPS outnumbered RUNS by three or four. Unfortunately it couldn’t handle a run from hell when CHOPS vastly outnumbered RUNS.

I’m going to play around with Marvin’s staking plan and 2Bobs method this weekend.

Hopefully you can start testing too.
Cheers Mako
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 04:38 PM 2019
Have you tried playing with this?

Just started today, read through everything and did a few tests to confirm I understand the base mechanics.  I haven't done enough work to start using any sort of MM yet, I did everything flat bet at first to see how it flows from cycle to cycle, and to get a feel for +/- STD after each round.

I like it so far, it's easy to track, fun to play.   :thumbsup:

Mako, my mini lab system did really well when RUNS and CHOPS were even. It even did well when CHOPS outnumbered RUNS by three or four. Unfortunately it couldn’t handle a run from hell when CHOPS vastly outnumbered RUNS.

I’m going to play around with Marvin’s staking plan and 2Bobs method this weekend.

Hopefully you can start testing too.
Cheers Mako

I will, I think we need to stick to the fundamentals that Winner has laid out, only when those are exhausted should we venture off into alternatives.

Correct me if I'm wrong boys, but to me that means flat betting until at 4x losses in a row, then beginning an aggressive progression. 

The real mystery lies in how Winner identifies when to switch bets from runs to chops, or back again, so far we're not very close in figuring that out.  That should be where we emphasize our efforts, then tweak the MM to follow.

In your examples of switching Winner so far it doesn't seem like there's an obvious pattern, like say "four chops in a row, switch to runs for the next four bets" etc. 

Very cool how you've used large scale tests to refine your work, it's the way it should be done for everything we pursue.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 04:39 PM 2019
Jono here’s what I got
1 wlwllwlllwwwwlwlw+9
2wlwllwwlllwwwlwwlllwl +9
3,wlwwlwwwwlwwllllwl+9
4,wlwllwwlllwwlwwwlwl+9
5,wlwllwwlllwwlwwwlwl+9
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 15, 04:43 PM 2019
Jono here’s what I got
1 wlwllwlllwwwwlwlw+10
2wlwllwwlllwwwlwwlllwl +9
3,wlwwlwwwwlwwllllwl+9
4,wlwllwwlllwwlwwwlwl+9
5,wlwllwwlllwwlwwwlwl+9

Damn Winner, you take the chocolates....!

The ‘run from hell’ for me turns into a pay-day for you!

Mister Eko? Anyone else??
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 04:46 PM 2019
Jono here’s what I got
1 wlwllwlllwwwwlwlw+9
2wlwllwwlllwwwlwwlllwl +9
3,wlwwlwwwwlwwllllwl+9
4,wlwllwwlllwwlwwwlwl+9
5,wlwllwwlllwwlwwwlwl+9

Hahaha, wow...impressive.  :love:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 15, 04:47 PM 2019
Correct me if I'm wrong boys, but to me that means flat betting until at 4x losses in a row, then beginning an aggressive progression. 

The real mystery lies in how Winner identifies when to switch bets from runs to chops, or back again, so far we're not very close in figuring that out.  That should be where we emphasize our efforts, then tweak the MM to follow.

In your examples of switching Winner so far it doesn't seem like there's an obvious pattern, like say "four chops in a row, switch to runs for the next four bets" etc. 

Very cool how you've used large scale tests to refine your work, it's the way it should be done for everything we pursue.

Correct Mako, although Winner never seems to go too far into his progression.

Good luck Mako, look forward to seeing your results 😊.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 04:50 PM 2019
Ok here will have some fun and please be truthful cause my system can tell if your lying 🤥
I’m going to give 8 results I want you to follow the the result untill you win one unit I don’t care if yo do a 8 step Marty this is just for fun  stop on your first match of my sequence
   12211212  start with this how fast can you win
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 04:52 PM 2019
Ok here will have some fun and please be truthful cause my system can tell if your lying 🤥
I’m going to give 8 results I want you to follow the the result unit you win one unit I don’t care if yo do a 8 step Marty this is just for fun  stop on your first match of my sequence
   12211212  start with this how fast can you win

I get +/- 0u for that string, break-even?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 2BobBet on Feb 15, 04:53 PM 2019
@ Jono and Mako

FYI I have not modified anything ,I am just using the 9 against 9 as Winner has already posted earlier in the thread,which he said was the best combination as its very hard for random to replicate the line above

Example
1,1,2,1,1,1,1,2,2,
2,1,1,2,2,1,1,1,2  bet for this line not to repeat the above

I have only used the money management as Winner set out  1u,1u,1u,1u,1u,2u,4u,8u,16u    9 steps total, if I lose on the 9 step I take it as a loss and start over again.

I have lost a few games now ( not one back to back) and i'm still not down overall, I am now starting to profit again

What I have noticed is you need to use judgement for when to use the prog, as I understand Winner is using a SD calculation for when to start his progression . This I think is crucial !
Good Luck to all
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 04:54 PM 2019
I get +/- 0u for that string, break-even?
Can you please give me your results
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 04:58 PM 2019
@ Jono and Mako

FYI I have not modified anything ,I am just using the 9 against 9 as Winner has already posted earlier in the thread,which he said was the best combination as its very hard for random to replicate the line above

Example
1,1,2,1,1,1,1,2,2,
2,1,1,2,2,1,1,1,2  bet for this line not to repeat the above

I have only used the money management as Winner set out  1u,1u,1u,1u,1u,2u,4u,8u,16u    9 steps total, if I lose on the 9 step I take it as a loss and start over again.

I have lost a few games now ( not one back to back) and i'm still not down overall, I am now starting to profit again

What I have noticed is you need to use judgement for when to use the prog, as I understand Winner is using a SD calculation for when to start his progression . This I think is crucial !
Good Luck to all

Yes, agree, he mentioned that +1 or -1 STD after 36 spins is a focal point for him, but it's not clear if then influences a switch.   For example, he goes through 36 spins and sees that Runs are at -1 STD.  So he begins betting on them, but goes 2,2,2,2 to start.  Does that means that despite the -STD actually getting further from expected he switches to Chops and begins a martingale?

That's where there's some confusion I think.

You're doing good work Bob, I did a few lines of your bet-opposite variant and it did well, I'm just staying on Winner's core method for now to see if we can lock it in.  :thumbsup:

Can you please give me your results

Betting on Runs to start: 1W, 2L, 2L, 1W, 1W, 2L, 1W, 2L   +/- 0u
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 05:05 PM 2019
Mako here are your results
Wwlwwwwl +4 flat +6 Marty
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 15, 05:14 PM 2019
Ok here will have some fun and please be truthful cause my system can tell if your lying 🤥
I’m going to give 8 results I want you to follow the the result untill you win one unit I don’t care if yo do a 8 step Marty this is just for fun  stop on your first match of my sequence
   12211212  start with this how fast can you win

Sure Winner
I’ll use my failed mini-lab system. Betting RUNS.
1st bet 1 - 1   CHOP (L) -2
2nd bet 1 - 1  -  2  RUN  (W) +1
3rd bet 1  RUN  (W) +2
Using the mini- lab the string ends with +2. This was a favourable string, the mini lab doesn’t do well against a bad string.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 15, 05:15 PM 2019
I am trying to figure out how Winner can bet. We see Jono s last numbers.

1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1

Winners answer was this about her W/L

5,wlwllwwlllwwlwwwlwl+9

So:

1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1
w l  w   l   l   w w  l   l   l   w  w l  w w w  l  w

Based on this Winner your betting numbers was these in this session ?

1 2  1  1  1  2  1  2  2  2  1  1  2  1  1  1  1
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 05:20 PM 2019
Mako here are your results
Wwlwwwwl +4 flat +6 Marty

Awesome, thank you!

So you started on Run, lets just say you chose that at random.  But you switched right away after winning on Run that first spin, betting on Chop for the next pair, which hit.  You then switched again, going back to Run, which lost on the third pair (wwl).

After that loss you stayed on Run for the fourth spin, a win, and stayed on it again for the fifth spin, also a win (wwlww).

But then you switched back to Chop after the 2-Runs-in-a-row-won, which won on the sixth spin (wwlwww).  You switched right away this time after the win, as you did after the first spin win, for spin seven, going back to Run, which won also.

Finally, you lost spin eight, a Chop, because you were still on Run, to end the series. +4u.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 15, 05:28 PM 2019
Awesome, thank you!

So you started on Run, lets just say you chose that at random.  But you switched right away after winning on Run that first spin, betting on Chop for the next pair, which hit.  You then switched again, going back to Run, which lost on the third pair (wwl).

After that loss you stayed on Run for the fourth spin, a win, and stayed on it again for the fifth spin, also a win (wwlww).

But then you switched back to Chop after the 2-Runs-in-a-row-won, which won on the sixth spin (wwlwww).  You switched right away this time after the win, as you did after the first spin win, for spin seven, going back to Run, which won also.

Finally, you lost spin eight, a Chop, because you were still on Run, to end the series. +4u.
Again, how does he know when to switch?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 05:29 PM 2019
So Winner switched the selection after the results for spin pairs 1, 3, 5, and 6. 

He left the selection on the previously chosen selection for spin pairs 2, 4, and 7.

Who here is good at picking out patterns?  :twisted:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 05:31 PM 2019
I am trying to figure out how Winner can bet. We see Jono s last numbers.

1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1

Winners answer was this about her W/L

5,wlwllwwlllwwlwwwlwl+9

So:

1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1
w l  w   l   l   w w  l   l   l   w  w l  w w w  l  w

Based on this Winner your betting numbers was these in this session ?

1 2  1  1  1  2  1  2  2  2  1  1  2  1  1  1  1

Here you go this is what it looks like
1w
21=lw
112=llw
1. =w
2221=lllw
1=w
1=w
21=lw
1=w
2=w
122=lwl


Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 15, 05:37 PM 2019
Ok here will have some fun and please be truthful cause my system can tell if your lying 🤥
I’m going to give 8 results I want you to follow the the result untill you win one unit I don’t care if yo do a 8 step Marty this is just for fun  stop on your first match of my sequence
   12211212  start with this how fast can you win

This would be the result using 2Bobs method?
1         2       2         1
1         2       1          2
L-1    L-2    W-1    W-0
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 05:39 PM 2019
12211212  start with this how fast can you win

Visual representation for this sequence:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 05:41 PM 2019
This would be the result using 2Bobs method?
1         2       2         1
1         2       1          2
L-1    L-2    W-1    W-0
Jono forget that ,all I said above is heres a sequence repeat it and stop on a win .
So if your first pair was a 1 you should stop that’s a Win if it lost continue with the next pair and so on.until you win.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 05:43 PM 2019
I gave you what I’m doing .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 05:47 PM 2019
Jono forget that ,all I said above is heres a sequence repeat it and stop on a win .
So if your first pair was a 1 you should stop that’s a Win if it lost continue with the next pair and so on.until you win.

Ok, that makes sense.  Each win resets that attempt to a brand new attempt, and the progression starts on any loss in that new attempt.

So for your example sequence of 1,2,2,1,1,2,1,2:

1=w
2=w
21=lw
1=w
2=w
1=w
2=l

+4u if flat, +6u if you used a progression after the loss in the third attempt of eight attempts total.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 05:53 PM 2019
Ok, that makes sense.  Each win resets that attempt to a brand new attempt, and the progression starts on any loss in that new attempt.

So for your example sequence of 1,2,2,1,1,2,1,2:

1=w
2=w
21=lw
1=w
2=w
1=w
2=l

+4u if flat, +6u if you used a progression after the loss in the third attempt of eight attempts total.

*Seven attempts total, typo above.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 15, 05:54 PM 2019
Here you go this is what it looks like
1w
21=lw
112=llw
1. =w
2221=lllw
1=w
1=w
21=lw
1=w
2=w
122=lwl

You definitely gave us the homework mate.

Soyou started with 1 betting fot 2 spins, than swith to 2, than next to 1 for 6 spins than 2 for 2 times but I cant figure out that why and when you deciding to switch fkr how many spins?🤔 maaaate, huge mind you are.

And look Winner the thread. Only 3 4 members discuss, and try to figure it out  from the whole forum !
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 05:55 PM 2019
*Seven attempts total, type above.
:thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 05:57 PM 2019
There are 30 sequence that I use to win and know when to switch my bets.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 15, 05:59 PM 2019
There are 30 sequence that I use to win and know when to switch my bets.

I am making extremely fast fast progress, so far I have zero of the 30.  :twisted:

From Eko's example, you played Run to start, won on it, and switched to Chop for the next bet...winning on it also:

1=w
2=w

But from the test sequence you played Run to start, won on it, but this time stayed on Run, and lost on the next attempt:

1w
21=lw

This is why my Mother told me that being in the CIA was probably out of the cards when I was 12...  :xd:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 15, 06:18 PM 2019
I am making extremely fast fast progress, so far I have zero of the 30.  :twisted:

From Eko's example, you played Run to start, won on it, and switched to Chop for the next bet...winning on it also:

1=w
2=w

But from the test sequence you played Run to start, won on it, but this time stayed on Run, and lost on the next attempt:

1w
21=lw

This is why my Mother told me that being in the CIA was probably out of the cards when I was 12...  :xd:

Agreed Mako. I’m going to disappear for a while and think about this. Headache!!!!!
See you in a few hours....
You’re keeping us interested anyway Winner! 😊
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 15, 07:21 PM 2019
I work on this too. Maybe we can do some privat group on this?

Winner, what happens when you loss the first 4 bets, then you start marty, and you also lose 2 4 8 16? Its just 8 loss, and can happen, no? Is not better to play flatbet?

And can I ask politely, how you discovered your betting way? How you decide when to switch and how long? I think these are the most important questions here. :o
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 07:35 PM 2019
I work on this too. Maybe we can do some privat group on this?

Winner, what happens when you loss the first 4 bets, then you start marty, and you also lose 2 4 8 16? Its just 8 loss, and can happen, no? Is not better to play flatbet?

And can I ask politely, how you discovered your betting way? How you decide when to switch and how long? I think these are the most important questions here. :o
Random is always changing so you change with it.
As far progression I like 1111 24816 32 64
But at time I will count the losses without playing as if I was playing then -4 comes around I’ll start not always .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 15, 07:50 PM 2019
Random is always changing so you change with it.
As far progression I like 1111 24816 32 64
But at time I will count the losses without playing as if I was playing then -4 comes around I’ll start not always .

So you dont have an exact procedure how to change run to chops or chops to run?

I saw you have extremely large hitrate.  Wouldnt be better to play safely progression like Marven 5 level staking plan with atlantis twist ? Because when I add 11 1 1 2 4 8 16 32 64 it is 130 units, and sessionly +3, +9, +15 winnings not as much as would to be.

What do you think ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 15, 08:12 PM 2019
So you dont have an exact procedure how to change run to chops or chops to run?

I saw you have extremely large hitrate.  Wouldnt be better to play safely progression like Marven 5 level staking plan with atlantis twist ? Because when I add 11 1 1 2 4 8 16 32 64 it is 130 units, and sessionly +3, +9, +15 winnings not as much as would to be.

What do you think ?
I do have a procedure .
Progression are a funny thing because even money is even money so it does matter how fancy you make you still only make one unit .
Labby won’t work
Marvin’s won’t work because your losses eventually out way your wins all those up as you win progression don’t work.
Basic Marty is really what makes your one unit the only thing I did is flat bet for the first 3 that’s really the only safe thing you can and try to keep your losses to a minimum.thats where the bet selection has to be powerful.thats all for now.thanks for trying this method
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 15, 08:33 PM 2019
Thanks for your answers.

Flatbet +5

2,2,1,1,2,1,2,1,1,1,2,1,2,1,1,2,1,2,1,1,1,1

My playing way is Marvel but with Atlantis modification. So:

2,2,1,1,2, bet 2
1, l -1
2 1 1 2 1 bet 1
2, l -2
1 1 2 1 2 bet 1
1, w -1
1 2 1 2 1 bet 1
1, w +0
2 1 2 1 1 bet 1
1, w +1
1 2 1 1 1 bet 1
2, l +0
2 1 1 1 2 bet 1
1, w +1
1 1 1 2 1 bet 1
2, l +0
1 1 2 1 2 bet 1
1, w +1
1 2 1 2 1 bet 1
1, w +2
2 1 2 1 1 bet 1
2, l +1
1 2 1 1 2 bet 1
1, w +2
2 1 1 2 1 bet 1
2, l +1
1 1 2 1 2 bet 1
1, w +2
1 2 1 2 1 bet 1
1, w +3
2 1 2 1 1 bet 1
1, w +4
1 2 1 1 1 bet 1
1 w +5

Today 3 session with this
+5
+3
+5

+13 units max drwdown -9 maximum using units 2. With 10 euro its 130 units with 50 would be 650 euro in one day.

Need to test so more !
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 15, 09:45 PM 2019
Thanks for your answers.

Flatbet +5

2,2,1,1,2,1,2,1,1,1,2,1,2,1,1,2,1,2,1,1,1,1

My playing way is Marvel but with Atlantis modification. So:

2,2,1,1,2, bet 2
1, l -1
2 1 1 2 1 bet 1
2, l -2
1 1 2 1 2 bet 1
1, w -1
1 2 1 2 1 bet 1
1, w +0
2 1 2 1 1 bet 1
1, w +1
1 2 1 1 1 bet 1
2, l +0
2 1 1 1 2 bet 1
1, w +1
1 1 1 2 1 bet 1
2, l +0
1 1 2 1 2 bet 1
1, w +1
1 2 1 2 1 bet 1
1, w +2
2 1 2 1 1 bet 1
2, l +1
1 2 1 1 2 bet 1
1, w +2
2 1 1 2 1 bet 1
2, l +1
1 1 2 1 2 bet 1
1, w +2
1 2 1 2 1 bet 1
1, w +3
2 1 2 1 1 bet 1
1, w +4
1 2 1 1 1 bet 1
1 w +5

Today 3 session with this
+5
+3
+5

+13 units max drwdown -9 maximum using units 2. With 10 euro its 130 units with 50 would be 650 euro in one day.

Need to test so more !

Well done Mister Eko. I like the Marvin / Atlantis method too. It will exploit dominant strings of CHOPS or RUNS.

Katalyst advised me to follow the wheel, which is what the Marvin system does!

keep posting your results please Mister Eko. 
Jono
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Feb 16, 01:50 AM 2019
And what if, up to -5, to play for the trend, and then with an increase in the rate by 1 unit and the game according to the Marvin method ...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 16, 09:50 AM 2019
Thanks for sharing this system Winner.

Have been looking into it and thought I would do some testing on how often Chops and Streaks appear. May be of use to someone.

I ran this through 100,000 randomly generated spins in a program I wrote, and these were the results:

Chops (high followed by a low, or low followed by a high): 25042
Streaks (two lows or two highs): 24958

The longest run of Chops in a row was 15
The longest run of Streaks in a row was 8
The longest run of alternate switches in a row (Chop, streak,chop, streak etc.) was 10

I found it interesting that the longest run of chops was much higher than streaks even over 100,000 spins, so I ran another 100,00 spins and the results were:

Chops : 24984
Streaks : 25016

The longest run of Chops in a row was 18
The longest run of Streaks in a row was 8
The longest run of alternate switches in a row (Chop, streak,chop, streak etc.) was 10

Longest run of chops is still way more than longest run of 'streaks' so ran one more time:

Chops : 24990
Streaks : 25010

The longest run of Chops in a row was 15
The longest run of Streaks in a row was 9
The longest run of alternate switches in a row (Chop, streak,chop, streak etc.) was 10

So it seems Chops and Streaks occur in pretty much equal amounts over the 100,00 spins as expected, but there might be value in betting for chops as you would suffer shorter losing streaks. You would need a progression that could overcome the longest run of streaks (9 in a row), plus maybe two extra as '0' might pop up just when you don't want it to!

So a progression that can handle 11 losses in a row and bet on chops  8)

If anyone would like any other data from this let me knwow and I'll program it in.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 16, 09:55 AM 2019
One way to use this Marvin’s staking plan is this ,instead of tracking L Ws you use the  1s as Ws in other words the 1s become your stakeing plan . It would have to me tested I have know time for that busy making money.
Ex 12222 your your first bet is 1unit because there is only 1 chop
      1222211 now last five results there’s two 1s your next bet is 2 units .
So use the ones as your Q to picking the amount you bet.
If someone would test this would be interesting money management
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 16, 10:12 AM 2019
Thanks for sharing this system Winner.

Have been looking into it and thought I would do some testing on how often Chops and Streaks appear. May be of use to someone.

I ran this through 100,000 randomly generated spins in a program I wrote, and these were the results:

Chops (high followed by a low, or low followed by a high): 25042
Streaks (two lows or two highs): 24958

The longest run of Chops in a row was 15
The longest run of Streaks in a row was 8
The longest run of alternate switches in a row (Chop, streak,chop, streak etc.) was 10

I found it interesting that the longest run of chops was much higher than streaks even over 100,000 spins, so I ran another 100,00 spins and the results were:

Chops : 24984
Streaks : 25016

The longest run of Chops in a row was 18
The longest run of Streaks in a row was 8
The longest run of alternate switches in a row (Chop, streak,chop, streak etc.) was 10

Longest run of chops is still way more than longest run of 'streaks' so ran one more time:

Chops : 24990
Streaks : 25010

The longest run of Chops in a row was 15
The longest run of Streaks in a row was 9
The longest run of alternate switches in a row (Chop, streak,chop, streak etc.) was 10

So it seems Chops and Streaks occur in pretty much equal amounts over the 100,00 spins as expected, but there might be value in betting for chops as you would suffer shorter losing streaks. You would need a progression that could overcome the longest run of streaks (9 in a row), plus maybe two extra as '0' might pop up just when you don't want it to!

So a progression that can handle 11 losses in a row and bet on chops  8)

If anyone would like any other data from this let me knwow and I'll program it in.
Wow very good  . What I found interesting in your test was The alternating results .
From streak to chop to streak there is an advantage there .for it went to 10 each test you did . Good work thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 16, 10:36 AM 2019
One way to use this Marvin’s staking plan is this ,instead of tracking L Ws you use the  1s as Ws in other words the 1s become your stakeing plan . It would have to me tested I have know time for that busy making money.
Ex 12222 your your first bet is 1unit because there is only 1 chop
      1222211 now last five results there’s two 1s your next bet is 2 units .
So use the ones as your Q to picking the amount you bet.
If someone would test this would be interesting money management

So are you think that seeing the last 5 results we place unit size? Example 2 2 1 2 2 4u on 2? Or 1 2 1 2 1 3u on 1?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 16, 11:47 AM 2019
So are you think that seeing the last 5 results we place unit size? Example 2 2 1 2 2 4u on 2? Or 1 2 1 2 1 3u on 1?
22122 only 1 unit use the chops for you decision. But this would have to Be tested have no clue on the results.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 16, 01:40 PM 2019
I ran a small test on 306 spins from a single table/single day at spielbank duisburg, acting as if I was playing continuously.

For this test I played chops only, never switching, and using Winner's 1-1-1-1-2-4-8-16-32 progression.

After manually watching it spin by spin, it seems you'd definitely need to have a switch strategy procedure in place that you've verified over extensive tests to be accurate, as winner does. The progression alone won't turn it into a winner by just blind betting chops or runs.  And of course you certainly wouldn't want to use any martingale or other aggressive progression without a perfect BS.

This was a single 0 wheel, which also reiterates the need for accurate selection as a 00 wheel would have fared far worse.

None of this is a surprise of course, but I think it's a good example of what Winner was talking about when he mentioned distractions.  We can get distracted and chase progressions for days, weeks even, but without accurate bet selection it's not worth the trouble.

It's likely not as extreme as the AP mantra of "if it doesn't win flat, then it doesn't win with a progression", but with ECs you can fool yourself for a long time even with accurate testing that you've found the "perfect" progression.

As the Baccarat guys do, we would need help in determining the sequences and resulting procedure to make switches when it's favorable, but I'm not sure how to start that process.

SESSION SUMMARY
74   Chops (W)   
74   Runs (L)   
5   Losses from 0 (79 total losses)   
      
16u   Highest progression level bet   
7   Longest loss streak   
      
+4u   Highest Bankroll   
-16u Lowest Bankroll   
      
+4u   Bankroll at end of session   

Spielbank Duisburg - Playing Chops (I use "2" for chops, "1" for runs) - 1,1,1,1,2,4,8,16,32                     
2   W                  
2   W                  
112   L   L   W            
2   W                  
112   L   L   W            
112   L   L   W            
12   L   W               
2   W                  
2   W                  
2   W                  
12   L   W               
112   L   L   W            
12   L   W               
2   W                  
2   W                  
1112   L   L   L   W         
2   W                  
011   L   L   L   W         
2   W                  
2   W                  
1112   L   L   L   W         
112   L   L   W            
12   L   W               
2   W                  
2   W                  
12   L   W               
11110112   L   L   L   L   L   L   W
112   L   L   W            
112   L   L   W            
12   L   W               
12   L   W               
2   W                  
1112   L   L   L   W         
12   L   W               
2   W                  
112   L   L   W            
12   L   W               
2   W                  
112   L   L   W            
12   L   W               
11112   L   L   L   L   W      
2   W                  
2   W                  
11112   L   L   L   L   W      
2   W                  
2   W                  
112   L   L   W            
11012   L   L   L   L   W      
2   W                  
2   W                  
2   W                  
111112   L   L   L   L   L   W   
2   W                  
2   W                  
01   L   W               
112   L   L   W            
2   W                  
2   W                  
2   W                  
2   W                  
2   W                  
2   W                  
1112   L   L   L   W         
2   W                  
2   W                  
01112   L   L   L   L   W      
2   W                  
2   W                  
2   W                  
12   L   W               
1   L                  
2   W                  
2   W                  
112   L   L   W            
2   W                  
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 16, 01:49 PM 2019
Her switching procedure is the most important thing in this method.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 16, 02:00 PM 2019
Her switching procedure is the most important thing in this method.

Agree, and it's where we need to focus.  We'll need hints or guidance as well, I doubt even as a group that we'll be able to look at the raw output and determine favorable switch points without some direction.

Baccarat players understand this, much easier though to look at their elaborate roadmaps if you're searching for a switch strategy.  Much harder with Roulette, I would advise playing with red/black EC over high/low just because visually it may be easier to spot successful switch points in RX or R-Sim due to the colors standing out.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 16, 02:31 PM 2019
I’m wondering if the switch point is determined by the actual numbers spun rather than the amount of chops and runs.

I have a few ideas and will look into it when I get more time

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 16, 03:41 PM 2019
Agree, and it's where we need to focus.  We'll need hints or guidance as well, I doubt even as a group that we'll be able to look at the raw output and determine favorable switch points without some direction.

Baccarat players understand this, much easier though to look at their elaborate roadmaps if you're searching for a switch strategy.  Much harder with Roulette, I would advise playing with red/black EC over high/low just because visually it may be easier to spot successful switch points in RX or R-Sim due to the colors standing out.

Great work Mako, MiniRoll and Mister Eko. I will be running tests using Marvin’s method. I haven’t been able to figure out Winners switching method, however the more games I play, something may become obvious.....

This could be significant, from Winner yesterday. “Jono forget that ,all I said above is heres a sequence repeat it and stop on a win .So if your first pair was a 1 you should stop that’s a Win if it lost continue with the next pair and so on.until you win.”
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 16, 03:49 PM 2019
Great work Mako, MiniRoll and Mister Eko. I will be running tests using Marvin’s method. I haven’t been able to figure out Winners switching method, however the more games I play, something may become obvious.....

This could be significant, from Winner yesterday. “Jono forget that ,all I said above is heres a sequence repeat it and stop on a win .So if your first pair was a 1 you should stop that’s a Win if it lost continue with the next pair and so on.until you win.”

He just meant that each attempt is it's own mini-session Jono, as in:

1 - win, stop, next attempt
1 - win, stop, next attempt
2221 - loss, loss, loss, win, stop, next attempt
221 - loss, loss, win, stop, next attempt

It's not a procedure hint, just how he applies the progression itself (2222221 = 1-1-1-1-2-4-8w).

The switch triggers are what matter, Winner mentioned 30 of them based on his previous experience, that's the key.

As in: 1,2,1,1 = switch. Or 2,2,1 = stay.  Those are pretend examples, I have no idea what they really are heheh.

He has pre-determined sequences setup as switch triggers and reacts in real-time accordingly.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 16, 04:00 PM 2019
One of the definitions  and features of random numbers is that future results should not be influenced or dependent on previous ones. Therefore the concepts of chops and runs are meaningless and you are chasing your tails trying to predict them.

The only difference between Baccarat and Roulette is Baccarat labours against a minus 1% edge whereas even chance roulette (with partage & 1 zero) has minus 1.35%.  Against either game, systems based on past results fail, but they fail quicker at Roulette than Baccarat. Which is why casinos often force you to play higher stakes at Baccarat, so  they can recover their money quicker.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 16, 04:10 PM 2019
What I not understand that why it is a good progression. When he wins at spin 3, he is -1. Only  generate profit, when he wins at f first spin. Why not just use flatbet, and after -5, raise unit size to 2 example. If he wins at spin 7, the result is -2.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 16, 04:26 PM 2019
He just meant that each attempt is it's own mini-session Jono, as in:

1 - win, stop, next attempt
1 - win, stop, next attempt
2221 - loss, loss, loss, win, stop, next attempt
221 - loss, loss, win, stop, next attempt

It's not a procedure hint, just how he applies the progression itself (2222221 = 1-1-1-1-2-4-8w).

The switch triggers are what matter, Winner mentioned 30 of them based on his previous experience, that's the key.

As in: 1,2,1,1 = switch. Or 2,2,1 = stay.  Those are pretend examples, I have no idea what they really are heheh.

He has pre-determined sequences setup as switch triggers and reacts in real-time accordingly.  :thumbsup:

Cheers Mako, thanks for clarifying. The switching method has me stumped.

What Firefox says obviously makes sense, although it’s not stopping Winner.

I’ll keep going with Marvin’s, if nothing else, it’s a bit of fun.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 16, 05:45 PM 2019
If, as he says, he has about 30 different patterns to chose from, then he must be dealing with blocks of 5.

12111 or 12221 for example.

As a five digit sequence with 2 numbers possible for each digit makes 32 combinations? 2x2x2x2x2=32

Not really sure how this would help predict future events though...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 16, 06:12 PM 2019
If, as he says, he has about 30 different patterns to chose from, then he must be dealing with blocks of 5.

12111 or 12221 for example.

As a five digit sequence with 2 numbers possible for each digit makes 32 combinations? 2x2x2x2x2=32

Not really sure how this would help predict future events though...
Me too miniRoll! I’m afraid it’s beyond my comprehension.....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 16, 06:26 PM 2019
What Firefox says obviously makes sense, although it’s not stopping Winner.

I’ll keep going with Marvin’s, if nothing else, it’s a bit of fun.

Systems are definitely fun as long as one realises that, and they don't win long term. If I run out of the right conditions on VB roulette, I tend to play occ small bets on even chances, or even occ positive progressions such as paroli or rev lab. Rev lab can definitely be distributed or cashed to make a quick hit. But these occ small stake random bets are basically just to justify hanging around and looking at diamonds or wheel speeds or dealer characteristics.

Winner is onto a positive 4 or 5 times SD position if his figures are accurate.

I'm suprised nobody has really mentioned the d'Alambert when playing against even chances without a zero. It's a very good system for steady profit. It can get get you into a nasty hole, same the Marty, which balances the wins, but it's a much gentler idea and smooths out big variations with a STOP.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 16, 06:58 PM 2019
1,1,2, bet 1
2,2,1, -1 bet 2
1,1,1, -4 bet 1
1, W -3 bet 1
1, W -2 bet 1
1, W -1 bet 1
1, w +0 bet 1
2,1, W +0 bet 1
2,0,1, -1 bet 1
1, W +0 bet 1
2,1, w +0 bet 1
2,2,1, -1 bet 2
2 w +0 bet 2
2, w +1 bet 2
2, w +2 bet 2
1,2, w +2 bet 2
2, w +3 bet 2
2, w +4 bet 2
2, w +5 bet 2
2, w +6 bet 2
2, w +7 bet 2
1,2, w +7 bet 2
1,1,2, +6 bet 1
0,1, w +6 bet 1
2,1, w +6 bet 1
2,1, w +6 bet 1
1, w +7 bet 1
1, w +8 bet 1
1, w +9 bet 1
2,1, w +9 bet 1
2,2,2,  L +6 bet 2
1,2, w +6 bet 2
2, w +7 bet 2
1,2, w +7 bet 2
1,2, w +7 bet 2
1,1,1, L +4 bet 1
1, w +5 bet 1
2,2,1, w +4 bet 2
1,2, w +4 bet 1
1, w +5 bet 1
1, w +6 bet 1
1, w +7 bet 1
2,2,2, L +4 bet 2
1,1,1, L +1 bet 1
2,1, +1 bet 1
1, +2 bet 1
1, +3 bet 1
2,2,2, +0 bet 2
1,2, +0 bet 2
2, +1 bet 2
1,2, +1 bet 2
1,2, +1 bet 2
2, +2 bet 2
1,2, +2 bet 2
2, +3 bet 2
2, +4 bet 2
2, +5 b2
1,1,1,+2 b1
1,1,1, +5 b1
2,1, +5 b1
1, +6 b1
2,2,1, +5 b2
1,2, +5 b1
1, +6 b1
2,1, +6 b1
2,2,1, +5 b2
1,1,2, +4 b1
1, +5 b1
1,1,0,1, +8 b1
2,2,1, +7 b2
1,1,2, +6 b1
1, +7 b1
1, +8 b1
2,2,2, +5 b2
1,1,2, +4 b1
1, +5 b1
1, +6 b1
2,1, +6 b1
1, +7 b1
1,
1,
1, +10 b1
2,2,1, +9 b2
1,2, +9 b1
1, +10 b1
2,1, +10 b1
1, +11 b1
1, +12 b1
2,1, +12 b1
2,1, +12 b1
1, +13 b1
2,1, +13 b1
2,1, +13 b1
1,
1,1, +16
1,1,1,1,1, +21
2,2,1, +20 b2
2, +21 b2
1,2, +21 b2
2,2,2, +24 b2
1,1,1, +21 b1
1,1,1, +24 b1
2,2,1, +23 b1
1,2, +23

FLATBET. Max drawdown -4, profit +23. This is first version, I jsut try to improve, twist this somehow...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 16, 08:12 PM 2019
One very long session. Max drawdown was -19, but I managed to win +13 units at the end. I dont know, I feel its too stable, soo the recovery comes, but inconsistent sometimes.

But win is win, maybe I should change wingoal to +4 only, it would be easier to reach, Today with this +36 units, max drawdown -19. Not the best its sure !!

1,1,1, b1
2,2,1, -1 b2
1,2, -1 b1
1,1, +1 b1
2,1, +1 b1
1, +2 b1
2,1, +2 b1
0,1, +2 b1
2,2,1, +1 b2
1,1,0, -2 b1 x2
1, +0 b1 x1
1, +1 b1
2,1, +1 b1
2,2,1, +0 b2
1,1,0, -3 x2 b1
1, -1 x1 b1
2,2,2, -4 x2 b2
0,0,1, -10 x3 b2
2,2, -4 b2 x2
2,2, +0 b2 x1
2,2, +2 b2     
1,2, +2 b2
2, +3 b2
1,1,1, +0 x2 b1
2,2,1, -2 b2
1,2, -2 b1
1, +0 x1 b1
2,1, +0 b1
2,1, +0 b1
2,2,1, -1 b2
1,1,2, -2 b1
2,2,2, -5 b2 x2
1,1,1, -11 b1 x3
2,1, -11 b1
1, -8 b1
2,2,1, -11 b2
2,2, -5 x2 b2
1,1,1, -11 x3 b1
2,2,1, -14 b2
2,
2, -8 x2 b2
1,2, -8 b2
2,2,2, -2 x1 b1
2,2, +0 b2
1,1,1, -3 x2 b1
1, -1 x1 b1
2,2,2, -4 x2 b2
1,1,1, -10 x3 b1
2,2,2, -19 x4 b2
2,2, -11 x3 b2
1,1,2, -14 x3 b1
1,1, -8 x2 b1
1,1, -4 x2 b1
2,2,1, -6 x2 b2
1,1,2, -8 x2 b1
2,2,1, -10 x2 b2
1,2, -10 x2 b1
2,1, -10 b2
2, -8 b2
1,2, -8 b2
1,2, -8 b2
2,2, -4 x1 b2
2, -3 b2
1,1,1, -6 x2 b1
1,1, -3 x1 b1
2,1, -3 b1
2,2,1, -4 b2
1,2, -4 b1
2,1, -4 b2
1,2, -4 b1
1,1, -2 b1
0,1,1,0,1,
1,0,1,1,
1, +2 b1
2,2,0,1, +1 b2
2,2, +3 b2
1,1,1, +0 x2 b1
1, +2 x1 b1
2,2,1, +1 b2
2, +2 b2
1,2, +2 b2
1,2, +2 b2
1,1,2, +1 b1
1,1,1, +4 b1
2,1, +4 b1
0,0,1, +3 b1
2,0,1, +3 b1
2,1, +3 b1
1, +4 b1
2,1, +4 b1
2,1, +4 b1
1,1,1, +7 b1
2,2,2, +4 x2 b2
1,1,2, +2 x2 b1
2,2,2, -4 x3 b2
2,2, -1, x2 +1 x1 b2
1,1,1, -2 x2 b1
1, +0 x1 b1
2,1, +0 b1
1, +1 b1
2,2,2, -2 x2 b2
2, +0 x1 b2
1,1,2, -1 b1
1, +0 b1
2,1, +0 b1
2,2,1, -1 b2
1,1,2, -2 b1
1,1,
1, +1 b1
2,1, +1 b1
2,2,2, -2 x2 b2
2,2,2, +2 x1 b2
2, +3 b2
1,2, +3 b2
2,2,2,
2, +7 b2
1,2,  +7 b2
1,1,2, +6 b1
1, +7 b1
2,1, +7 b1
2,1, +7 b1
2,
2,0, +4 x2 b2
0,1,2, +4 x2 b2
1,1,1, -2 x3 b1
1,1,1, +4 x1 b1
2,1, +4 b1
2,2,2, +1 x2 b2
2, +3 x1 b2
1,2, +3 b2
1,1,1, +0 x2 b1
2,2,1, -2 b2
1,1,2, -4 b1
2,2,2, -10 x3 b2
2, -7
2,2, -3 x2 b2
1,0,1, -9 x3 b1
1, -6 x2 b1
2,1, -6 b1
1, -4 b1
2,1, -4 b1
1, -2 b1
2,1, -2 b1
1,1,
1, +2 x1 b1
2,1,  +2 b1
2,1, +2 b1
2,1, +2 b1
2,2,2, -1 x2 b2
2,2,
2, +3 x1 b2
1,2, +3 b2
1,2, +3 b2
1,1,2, +2 b1
2,1, +2 b2
2,2,
2,  +5 b2
1,1,1, +2 x2 b1
2,2,2, -4 x3 b2
2,2, +1 x2 b2
1,2, +1 b2
0,1,2, +1 b2
1,0,1, -2 x2 b1
1,1,1, +2 x1 b1
2,1, +2 b1
2,1, +2 b1
2,1, +2 b1
1,1, +4 b1
2,2,1, +3 b2
1,1,2, +2 b1
1,1, +4 b1
2,1, +4 b1
1, +5 b1
2,1, +5 b1
2,2,1, +4 b2
1,2, +4 b1
2,1, +4 b2
1,1,1, +1 x2 b1
1,1, +2 x1 b1
2,2,1, +1 b2
2,2,2, +4 b2
1,2, +4 b2
1,1,2, +3 b1
2,2,2, +0 x2 b2
1,1,1, -6 x3 b1
1,0,1, -1 x2 b1
2,2,2, -7 x3 b2
1,2, -7 x3 b2
0,1,1, -16 x4 b1
2,1, -16 b1
1, -12 x4 b1
2,1, -12 b1
2,1, -12 b1
1, -8 x3 b1
2,1, -8 b1
1,1,0,0,1,1,1,1,1,1,0,1,1, +6 x1 b1
2,2,2, +3 x2 b2
1,1,1, -3 x3 b1
1, +0 x2 b1
2,2,1, -2 b2
2,2,2,2, +3 x1 b2
1,1,2, +2 b1
2,1, +2 b2
2,2, +4 b2
1,1,1, +1 x2 b1
2,2,1, -1 b2
2, +1 x1 b2
1,1,2, +0 b1
1,1, +2 b1
2,1, +2 b1
1,1,1, +5 b1
2,1, +5 b1
2,1, +5 b1
0,1, +5 b1
2,2,2, +2 x2 b2
2,2,2, +6 x1 b2
1,2, +6 b2
2,2,2, +9 b2
1,1,1, +6 x2 b1
1,1,1,1,1,1, +13 b1
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 16, 09:33 PM 2019
Thanks for sharing this system Winner.

Have been looking into it and thought I would do some testing on how often Chops and Streaks appear. May be of use to someone.

I ran this through 100,000 randomly generated spins in a program I wrote, and these were the results:

Chops (high followed by a low, or low followed by a high): 25042
Streaks (two lows or two highs): 24958

The longest run of Chops in a row was 15
The longest run of Streaks in a row was 8
The longest run of alternate switches in a row (Chop, streak,chop, streak etc.) was 10

I found it interesting that the longest run of chops was much higher than streaks even over 100,000 spins, so I ran another 100,00 spins and the results were:

Chops : 24984
Streaks : 25016

The longest run of Chops in a row was 18
The longest run of Streaks in a row was 8
The longest run of alternate switches in a row (Chop, streak,chop, streak etc.) was 10

Longest run of chops is still way more than longest run of 'streaks' so ran one more time:

Chops : 24990
Streaks : 25010

The longest run of Chops in a row was 15
The longest run of Streaks in a row was 9
The longest run of alternate switches in a row (Chop, streak,chop, streak etc.) was 10

So it seems Chops and Streaks occur in pretty much equal amounts over the 100,00 spins as expected, but there might be value in betting for chops as you would suffer shorter losing streaks. You would need a progression that could overcome the longest run of streaks (9 in a row), plus maybe two extra as '0' might pop up just when you don't want it to!

So a progression that can handle 11 losses in a row and bet on chops  8)

If anyone would like any other data from this let me knwow and I'll program it in.

Thanks for the tests!

Can you test, how many 3 sequence repeaters come in a row?
Example

2 2 2
1 1 1
222

Its 3 repeated sequence in a row.

Or 111
222
111
222

Its a 4 in a row.

But the 111
111
111 its not 3 repeat. I calculate 3 spin repeats that they change 1 to 2 and back. Do you unserstood this approach? :)

Would be good to know for me   ;)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 16, 09:57 PM 2019
Thanks for the tests!

Can you test, how many 3 sequence repeaters come in a row?
Example

2 2 2
1 1 1
222

Its 3 repeated sequence in a row.

Or 111
222
111
222

Its a 4 in a row.

But the 111
111
111 its not 3 repeat. I calculate 3 spin repeats that they change 1 to 2 and back. Do you unserstood this approach? :)

Would be good to know for me   ;)
Your on the track with the switch congratulations
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 16, 10:01 PM 2019
Your on the track with the switch congratulations

Am I on the right way Winner?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 16, 10:19 PM 2019
 :thumbsup:
Am I on the right way Winner?
:thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 16, 10:33 PM 2019
Am I on the right way Winner?

Mister Eko - did you give up on the Marvin staking plan?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 16, 11:30 PM 2019
Every journey begins with the first step, good job Eko... :thumbsup:

And thanks Winner for continuing to assist.  :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 17, 12:22 AM 2019
Every journey begins with the first step, good job Eko... :thumbsup:

And thanks Winner for continuing to assist.  :)

Winner, Eko, Mako,  2Bob and anyone else following

I’ve been doing pretty well with the Marvin method. Like Eko, I set my profit for 5 units.

So far I have finished three complete sequences, all for +5 units. I have never gone below 4. So, far all flat-bet.

One thing, it’s a bit of a grind. I’m not bothered because the more I play this thing, some of Winners tips may become apparent.

Here is a game I finished earlier. Notice how Marvin’s takes advantage of streaks...

[2 1 2 2 2] - Bet 2 / Result 1
LOSS (-1)

2 [1 2 2 2 1] - Bet 2 / Result 1
LOSS (-2)

2 1 [2 2 2 1 1 ] - Bet 2 / Result 1
LOSS (-3)

2 1 2 [ 2 2 1 1 1 ] - Bet 1 / Result 1
WIN (-2)

2 1 2 2 [ 2 1 1 1 1 ] - Bet 1 / Result 1
WIN (-1)

2 1 2 2 2 [ 1 1 1 1 1 ] - Bet 1 / Result 1
WIN (0)

2 1 2 2 2 1 [ 1 1 1 1 1 ] - Bet 1 / Result 1
WIN (1)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 [ 1 1 1 1 2 ] - Bet 1 / Result 2
LOSS (0)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 [ 1 1 1 2 2 ] - Bet 1 / Result 2
LOSS (-1)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 [ 1 1 2 2 1] - Bet 1 / Result 1
WIN (0)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 [ 1 2 2 1 2] - Bet 2 / Result 1
LOSS (-1)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 1[ 2 2 1 2 1] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (0)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 [ 2 1 2 1 2] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (1)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 [ 1 2 1 2 2] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (2)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 1 [ 2 1 2 2 2] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (3)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 1 2 [ 1 2 2 2 2] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (4)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 1 2 1 [ 2 2 2 2 2] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (5)

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 17, 12:32 AM 2019
Nice Jono, looks good, and you’re right, in my 300 spin session earlier the streaks were heavy, especially in the last 150. 

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 17, 01:45 AM 2019
Nice Jono, looks good, and you’re right, in my 300 spin session earlier the streaks were heavy, especially in the last 150.

Agreed Mako, Marvin’s is good at capitalising on streaks, however Winner’s method is obviously much more efficient.

In the time I made 15 units, Winner would probably be at +50.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 17, 03:28 AM 2019
Nice jono, are you playing with Atlantis modification, so watching the last 5 outcome?

Yes he would probably be more units, but you must see the used units too in the game. Example his progression goes up to 8, its a little bit more money to bet(400 euro, if 1 unit is 50 euro) than your flatbet. I prefer play safety.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 17, 04:22 AM 2019
Nice jono, are you playing with Atlantis modification, so watching the last 5 outcome?

Yes he would probably be more units, but you must see the used units too in the game. Example his progression goes up to 8, its a little bit more money to bet(400 euro, if 1 unit is 50 euro) than your flatbet. I prefer play safety.

Thanks Mister Eko. Correct I’m using the Marvin method with the Atlantis modification. Plenty more testing....

I’ve been following Winners posts and he doesn’t seem too use his progression too much. When he does it doesn’t go too far.

Plenty to think about Eko..... keep testing 😊
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 17, 01:21 PM 2019
2,2,2, b2
1,0,1, -3 x2 b1
1, -1 x1 b1
2, -2 b1
1,1,1, +1 b1
2,2,1, +0 b2
0,1,2, +0 b1
1,0,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1, +8 b1
2,2,1, +7 b2
2,2,2, +10 b2
1,2, +10 b2
1,1,1, +7 x2 b1
1,1, +10 b1
2,2,1, +9 b2
1,1,1, +6 x2 b1
1,1,1,1,1, +12 b1
2,1, +12 b1
2,2,1, +11 b2
2, +12 b2
1,2, +12 b2
1,1,1, +9 x2 b1
1,1, +12 b1
2,1, +12 b1
2,1, +12 b1
1,1, +14 b1
2,2,2, +11 x2 b2
2,2, +14 b2
1,1,2, +13 b1
2,2,2, +10 x2 b2
2,2, +13 b2
1,1,2, +12 b1
1, +13 b1
2,2,1, +12 b2
2,2, +14 b2
1,1,2, +13 b1
1,1,1,1, +17 b1
2,1, +17 b1
1,1, +19 b1
2,1, +19 b1
1,1, +21 b1

Max drawdown: -3
Profit: +21

Yesterday+today: +57u, max drawdown -19.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 17, 01:47 PM 2019
2,2,2, b2
1,0,1, -3 x2 b1
1, -1 x1 b1
2, -2 b1
1,1,1, +1 b1
2,2,1, +0 b2
0,1,2, +0 b1
1,0,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1, +8 b1
2,2,1, +7 b2
2,2,2, +10 b2
1,2, +10 b2
1,1,1, +7 x2 b1
1,1, +10 b1
2,2,1, +9 b2
1,1,1, +6 x2 b1
1,1,1,1,1, +12 b1
2,1, +12 b1
2,2,1, +11 b2
2, +12 b2
1,2, +12 b2
1,1,1, +9 x2 b1
1,1, +12 b1
2,1, +12 b1
2,1, +12 b1
1,1, +14 b1
2,2,2, +11 x2 b2
2,2, +14 b2
1,1,2, +13 b1
2,2,2, +10 x2 b2
2,2, +13 b2
1,1,2, +12 b1
1, +13 b1
2,2,1, +12 b2
2,2, +14 b2
1,1,2, +13 b1
1,1,1,1, +17 b1
2,1, +17 b1
1,1, +19 b1
2,1, +19 b1
1,1, +21 b1

Max drawdown: -3
Profit: +21

Yesterday+today: +57u, max drawdown -19.

Nice results Mister Eko!
What betting method are you using?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 17, 02:28 PM 2019
Nice results Mister Eko!
What betting method are you using?

I want to test more Jono, and I am trying to modify this! When it gives good results in long therm, I will send you , because you worked too on this with me. Please do tests you too friend with thinking how would the best  to bet ;) :)  I am close to the switching party, not with this what I posted, but what I am working on.

And no panic.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: ludo8400 on Feb 17, 02:44 PM 2019
Winner, Eko, Mako,  2Bob and anyone else following

I’ve been doing pretty well with the Marvin method. Like Eko, I set my profit for 5 units.

So far I have finished three complete sequences, all for +5 units. I have never gone below 4. So, far all flat-bet.

One thing, it’s a bit of a grind. I’m not bothered because the more I play this thing, some of Winners tips may become apparent.

Here is a game I finished earlier. Notice how Marvin’s takes advantage of streaks...

[2 1 2 2 2] - Bet 2 / Result 1
LOSS (-1)

2 [1 2 2 2 1] - Bet 2 / Result 1
LOSS (-2)

2 1 [2 2 2 1 1 ] - Bet 2 / Result 1
LOSS (-3)

2 1 2 [ 2 2 1 1 1 ] - Bet 1 / Result 1
WIN (-2)

2 1 2 2 [ 2 1 1 1 1 ] - Bet 1 / Result 1
WIN (-1)

2 1 2 2 2 [ 1 1 1 1 1 ] - Bet 1 / Result 1
WIN (0)

2 1 2 2 2 1 [ 1 1 1 1 1 ] - Bet 1 / Result 1
WIN (1)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 [ 1 1 1 1 2 ] - Bet 1 / Result 2
LOSS (0)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 [ 1 1 1 2 2 ] - Bet 1 / Result 2
LOSS (-1)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 [ 1 1 2 2 1] - Bet 1 / Result 1
WIN (0)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 [ 1 2 2 1 2] - Bet 2 / Result 1
LOSS (-1)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 1[ 2 2 1 2 1] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (0)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 [ 2 1 2 1 2] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (1)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 [ 1 2 1 2 2] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (2)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 1 [ 2 1 2 2 2] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (3)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 1 2 [ 1 2 2 2 2] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (4)

2 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 1 2 1 [ 2 2 2 2 2] - Bet 2 / Result 2
WIN (5)

Hello,
I put an Excel file on . Based on Marvin .

Happy testing
 :D

ludo8400
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 17, 02:55 PM 2019
I want to test more Jono, and I am trying to modify this! When it gives good results in long therm, I will send you , because you worked too on this with me. Please do tests you too friend with thinking how would the best  to bet ;) :)  I am close to the switching party, not with this what I posted, but what I am working on.

And no panic.

No worries Mister Eko, thank you!

Plenty more testing to go :). I hope you keep getting good results.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 17, 02:57 PM 2019
Hello,
I put an Excel file on . Based on Marvin .

Happy testing
 :D

ludo8400

Great job Ludo. Thank you. I will let you know how it goes  :)

Are you testing? Please share your results, success and failures. We can learn.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: ludo8400 on Feb 17, 03:40 PM 2019
Great job Ludo. Thank you. I will let you know how it goes  :)

Are you testing? Please share your results, success and failures. We can learn.

Made a little error
Here is new correct file

thanks

ludo8400
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: ludo8400 on Feb 17, 04:07 PM 2019
Made a little error
Here is new correct file

thanks

ludo8400

Hereby 5 test without zero and 5X 200 spins.

goodnight
ludo8400
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: ludo8400 on Feb 17, 04:08 PM 2019
Hereby 5 test without zero and 5X 200 spins.

goodnight
ludo8400

my fifth test

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 17, 04:50 PM 2019
I was thinking from Winners comment that Mister Eko was on the right track with the 111222111222 question, that he might be playing the system where you bet on the most frequent result of the last five. So if the last five were 11122, you would next bet on 1.

But a 111222111222 sequence would be a disaster!

So i programmed a system to test play this over hundreds of games using Winners progression of 1 1 1 1 2 4 8 16 32.

But It failed in the long run. Hopefully this isn't the way he plays and we are yet to discover it.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: nottophammer on Feb 17, 05:40 PM 2019
Now i play voisins against the tier and orphen. Not a true 50/50; but it uses the zero to bet if it shows.
+104 betting every spin
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F17%2Fsourceaebcc.png&hash=bbfa322fdacb60da471f6475c4829900) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OP8Ut)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 17, 06:09 PM 2019
Now i play voisins against the tier and orphen. Not a true 50/50; but it uses the zero to bet if it shows.
+104 betting every spin
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F17%2Fsourceaebcc.png&hash=bbfa322fdacb60da471f6475c4829900) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OP8Ut)


Sounds good Notto. Can you give any more details? Do you track chops and runs with the voisins vs the tier and orphens?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: nottophammer on Feb 18, 06:03 AM 2019
Mini
Using voisins against the tier and orphen
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F18%2Fsource.png&hash=6d07298f9cae0b015f3b457640524a1f) (http://www.pichost.org/image/Og1Yp)
Start is #29
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 18, 09:40 AM 2019
212211221111112221+ 18
111112211212121222+18
212121211122112122+18
112211221112221221+18
Highest bet was 5 unit
Not bad for Monday
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 18, 09:52 AM 2019
I was thinking from Winners comment that Mister Eko was on the right track with the 111222111222 question, that he might be playing the system where you bet on the most frequent result of the last five. So if the last five were 11122, you would next bet on 1.

But a 111222111222 sequence would be a disaster!

So i programmed a system to test play this over hundreds of games using Winners progression of 1 1 1 1 2 4 8 16 32.

But It failed in the long run. Hopefully this isn't the way he plays and we are yet to discover it.
Not exactly ,when I said he was on the right track I meant now he’s  thinking 🤔 about roulette  Not in a linear state it’s always changing . So switches are the key when to switch the bets makes this way of betting win.
From your test you can see that over 300000 spins it’s close to even that’ was my goal when I created this is how can I achieve almost 50/50 and from  my experience I could make a winning bet out of it and all my testing was done on a double zero even harder but it is possible to beat it .
Keep at you will find your own way .


Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 18, 10:00 AM 2019
You won’t get close to50/50 just betting red or black it never even s out .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 18, 10:15 AM 2019
212211221111112221+ 18
111112211212121222+18
212121211122112122+18
112211221112221221+18
Highest bet was 5 unit
Not bad for Monday

Congrat!

But it seems you won all your bets in the first spin? 😳 because you said your progression is 1 1 1 1 2 4 8 16 32.  So if you won on second spin you are even when you on the third you are in -1.

Can I ask what was the maximum drawdown during sessions?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 18, 10:52 AM 2019
Congrat!

But it seems you won all your bets in the first spin? 😳 because you said your progression is 1 1 1 1 2 4 8 16 32.  So if you won on second spin you are even when you on the third you are in -1.

Can I ask what was the maximum drawdown during sessions?
Max was 5 units
My bank roll is way ahead my progression is down to 1,2,4,8,16,32 64
Only When I was  building my BR I play 1111 2481632. 64
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 18, 11:05 AM 2019
Max was 5 units
My bank roll is way ahead my progression is down to 1,2,4,8,16,32 64
Only When I was  building my BR I play 1111 2481632. 64

That's  pretty impressive results! Although to get plus 18 from 18 bets, can I ask with your progression I take it you don't reset back to 1 on a win? Do you maybe go down one step on a win and up one step on a lose? So if you were at 8 progression then won that bet, you would bet 4 on the next bet?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 18, 01:13 PM 2019
212211221111112221+ 18
111112211212121222+18
212121211122112122+18
112211221112221221+18
Highest bet was 5 unit
Not bad for Monday
This is killing me Winner! 😊 However, these kind of results keep us inspired.....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Feb 18, 01:15 PM 2019
I was thinking from Winners comment that Mister Eko was on the right track with the 111222111222 question, that he might be playing the system where you bet on the most frequent result of the last five. So if the last five were 11122, you would next bet on 1.

But a 111222111222 sequence would be a disaster!

So i programmed a system to test play this over hundreds of games using Winners progression of 1 1 1 1 2 4 8 16 32.

But It failed in the long run. Hopefully this isn't the way he plays and we are yet to discover it.

Good work testing this MiniRoll. I’ve been doing ok with Marvin’s, but I’m aware it’s not going to hold up in the long run.....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 18, 01:38 PM 2019
Good work testing this MiniRoll. I’ve been doing ok with Marvin’s, but I’m aware it’s not going to hold up in the long run.....

Yup the key is working out the bet selection switch. I’m going to make a cup of tea and read through all the posts from the first page onwards to see if I can spot any clues I might have missed
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: nottophammer on Feb 18, 01:55 PM 2019
Mini
Using unit of 10; VdZ v T+Orphen; start #27
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F18%2Fsource4ed4f.png&hash=3aaaec18ab1340a769a282aec2b6c4f0) (http://www.pichost.org/image/Oj1gD)

This one even better; start #35
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F18%2Fsourcef7190.png&hash=8f1e292be0cf460a203f9afe034db322) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OjATl)

Luv that #1
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 18, 04:06 PM 2019
Mini
Using unit of 10; VdZ v T+Orphen; start #27
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F18%2Fsource4ed4f.png&hash=3aaaec18ab1340a769a282aec2b6c4f0) (http://www.pichost.org/image/Oj1gD)

This one even better; start #35
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F18%2Fsourcef7190.png&hash=8f1e292be0cf460a203f9afe034db322) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OjATl)

Luv that #1

Wow a test of eight spins and it still works! ::)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Madi on Feb 18, 04:48 PM 2019
Wow a test of eight spins and it still works! ::)

Uncle Tom
I am just dying from laugh after reading your comment.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Madi on Feb 18, 04:50 PM 2019
As i remember you suggested to test 1 spin. He is pretty close. I m dying man. Haha
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 18, 04:55 PM 2019
I tested it over one spin.  It won at a rate of 100% in my one spin test.  The trot is working!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: nottophammer on Feb 18, 05:36 PM 2019
The trot is working
Your getting it
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 18, 06:26 PM 2019
New system!

BR

Bet B.
I won +1. 1 unit can be 500, so 500 euro win.

Sell 250 euro, PM me
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 18, 11:43 PM 2019
Why bet all numbers as a one unit use ayks tracker to either bet numbers out or pairs with number etc you will only get an average of 12 numbers out per side so narrow your bets down
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 19, 09:11 AM 2019
I tested it over one spin.  It won at a rate of 100% in my one spin test.  The trot is working!
I was wheel watching I got so so dissy I forgot to put the chips on the right sector.
Then the wheel  got a little wobbly and and they had to get the level out it was off
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 19, 09:12 AM 2019
New system!

BR

Bet B.
I won +1. 1 unit can be 500, so 500 euro win.

Sell 250 euro, PM me
Mine will cost $1000
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 19, 09:16 AM 2019
How fast people move on ,like someone said here years ago if the holy grail was starring you in the face you wouldn’t even see it.and better yet if I gave you the holy grail you wouldn’t now what to do with it. :twisted:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 19, 09:17 AM 2019
Why bet all numbers as a one unit use ayks tracker to either bet numbers out or pairs with number etc you will only get an average of 12 numbers out per side so narrow your bets down
ThAt would be a little to advanced.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 19, 09:32 AM 2019
The switching method is key and the only real clue I can find is when Winner posted these results:

1w
21=lw
112=llw
1. =w
2221=lllw
1=w
1=w
21=lw
1=w
2=w
122=lwl

These break down as follows:
1   Bet on 1 Win
2   Bet on 1 Lost
1   Bet on 1 Win
Now switch to betting on 2's
1   Bet on 2 Lost
1   Bet on 2 Lost
2   Bet on 2 Win
Now switches back to betting on 1's. So at this point it looks like Winner is switching in blocks of 3, but this doesnt seem to be the case as we see below.
1   Bet on 1 Win
2   Bet on 1 Lost
2   Bet on 1 Lost
2  Bet on 1 Lost
1   Bet on 1 Win
So at this point you feel like Winner would switch to 2's, but he doesn't. He carry''s on betting 1's
1   Bet on 1 Win
1   Bet on 1 Win
2   Bet on 1 Lost
1   Bet on 1 Win
1   Bet on 1 Win
Now he switches to 2's. Current results are 10 1's and 6 2''s. So maybe switching, thinking the 2's will catch up?
2   Bet on 2 Win
1   Bet on 2 Lose
2   Bet on 2 Win
Now for the last bet he switches back to betting on 1's.
2   Bet on 1 Lost

First it looks like he is betting in blocks of three and then switching when he wins or losses a certain amount in that block of three, but this isnt the case.

So im stumped lol, maybe someone else can see the pattern here or maybe Winner could give us another run of results like about showing the wins and losses then maybe we might get somewhere  :smile:






Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 19, 09:50 AM 2019
How fast people move on ,like someone said here years ago if the holy grail was starring you in the face you wouldn’t even see it.and better yet if I gave you the holy grail you wouldn’t now what to do with it. :twisted:

I'd know what to do with it  :) Jump on the Boom train to Cash Cow farm and start milking the herd  :twisted:

But in all seriousness, this system is the reason I've started posting on this forum. I can see the potential and I feel I'm getting closer to solving it  ;)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 19, 03:08 PM 2019
I'd know what to do with it  :) Jump on the Boom train to Cash Cow farm and start milking the herd  :twisted:

But in all seriousness, this system is the reason I've started posting on this forum. I can see the potential and I feel I'm getting closer to solving it  ;)
👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 19, 03:19 PM 2019
I'd know what to do with it  :) Jump on the Boom train to Cash Cow farm and start milking the herd  :twisted:

But in all seriousness, this system is the reason I've started posting on this forum. I can see the potential and I feel I'm getting closer to solving it  ;)

Agree, this is the first place I start my day, pondering the 30 switch sequences and how to derive them.  But in reality I'm stuck, because like you miniroll, I went back through Winner's example switches and there's no pattern that sticks out. For me it would be just a guessing game because we don't have even a single switch sequence trigger example to build from.

Winner: Can you provide a small hint for us, as in something like "all sequences are blocks of 3" or "all sequences are blocks of 5", something like that?

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 19, 03:31 PM 2019
Ex 122112212122112111= 8 runs of 2$
Now would you switch to to betting 2s? 9/9 being even
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 19, 03:33 PM 2019
Ex 122112212122112111= 8 runs of 2$
Now would you switch to to betting 2s?

I will guess yes, because the 2s are -STD at that point?  Or did you abandon STD as an indicator in favor of going with the pre-set sequences as the trigger?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 19, 03:57 PM 2019
Ex 122112212122112111= 8 runs of 2$
Now would you switch to to betting 2s? 9/9 being even

I would say no as in your previous examples you don’t seem to be betting on the number that is lagging behind the 9/9

Or are you asking because the sequence ended with 111 so this is a trigger to bet on 2s?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 19, 04:36 PM 2019
What come in more short or long series?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 19, 04:43 PM 2019
I’m sure you’ll say short use the results and the end of your play to figure out the switch.
Then play the short series and figure out the switch within the switch.meaning how long will you bet before switching.back to short series .now before you do this you have to figure out the long series how often do they come.1112221111112222122222212222221111.
I think I just gave you the answer
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 20, 05:31 AM 2019
So in the sequence from earlier:
122112212122112111

Short series would be and sigle digit or double digits the same?:
[1] [22] [11] [22] [1] [2] [1] [22] [11] [2] 111

and the long series would be just the 111 at the end?
122112212122112 [111]

Am I on the right track?

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 20, 06:58 AM 2019
I experiment and consider last 3 results only and bet dominant side on rolling basis - that way capture streaks and switch when last 3 results say.

              L  L   w  w  w w w  w  w  L  w   L  w  L  L  w   L   w  L  w  L  L  w
2--1--1--2--2--2--2--2--2--2--2--2--1--2--1--1--2--2--2--1--2--1--1--2--2--2 

Use winner's progression or own progression or flatbet?

Possibility to use "3 bet cycles" for betting:

1-1-2
1-2-2
2-2-2
2-2-3
2-3-3...etc

If win stay in the same cycle - unless level or ahead overall in which case reset at first cycle.
If lose all 3 bets in a cycle - go up to next cycle.

Betting cyclically with above results (13 wins)

+0
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+0
+0
+0
+0
+0
+0
==
+6u profit
==

Highest cycle = 1-1-2

Winner's example using dominant of last 3:

              L  L  w   L  L  w  w  w  w  L  L   w w   L   w  w w w w   w  L   w w  w  w  w w    L  L  w w
1--1--1--2--2--2--1--1--1--1--1--1--2--2--2--2--1--2--2--2--2--2--2--1--2--2--2--2--2--2--1--1--1--1

Regards,
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Feb 20, 07:34 AM 2019
Beautifully explained atlantis , thanks. Winner.......... winer is a philosopher and fucks everybody here!? :lol:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 20, 08:30 AM 2019
I experiment and consider last 3 results only and bet dominant side on rolling basis - that way capture streaks and switch when last 3 results say.

              L  L   w  w  w w w  w  w  L  w   L  w  L  L  w   L   w  L  w  L  L  w
2--1--1--2--2--2--2--2--2--2--2--2--1--2--1--1--2--2--2--1--2--1--1--2--2--2 

Use winner's progression or own progression or flatbet?

Possibility to use "3 bet cycles" for betting:

1-1-2
1-2-2
2-2-2
2-2-3
2-3-3...etc

If win stay in the same cycle - unless level or ahead overall in which case reset at first cycle.
If lose all 3 bets in a cycle - go up to next cycle.

Betting cyclically with above results (13 wins)

+0
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+1
+0
+0
+0
+0
+0
+0
==
+6u profit
==

Highest cycle = 1-1-2

Winner's example using dominant of last 3:

              L  L  w   L  L  w  w  w  w  L  L   w w   L   w  w w w w   w  L   w w  w  w  w w    L  L  w w
1--1--1--2--2--2--1--1--1--1--1--1--2--2--2--2--1--2--2--2--2--2--2--1--2--2--2--2--2--2--1--1--1--1

Regards,
A.


Great work Atlantis! This looks a really good system. I will program it into my tester and see if it works over a few hundred games, thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 20, 09:20 AM 2019

Great work Atlantis! This looks a really good system. I will program it into my tester and see if it works over a few hundred games, thanks

Can you post the results please example few hunderds sessions?

Thanks if yes.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 20, 10:28 AM 2019
Can you post the results please example few hunderds sessions?

Thanks if yes.

Yup no problem, unfortunately the results arn't good.

So I ran 1000 games playing for about 36 spins per game, betting as Atlantis described. Using Winners 1 1 1 1 2 4 8 16 32 progression. Resetting the progression back to the start on a Win

First 1000 Games Result
Highest Balance: +65
Lowest Balance: - 534
Finishing Balance: -515

I ran another 1000 games to check but results were pretty simular:

Second batch of 1000 games
Highest Balance +69
Lowest Balance : -571
Finishing Balance : -504

I tried adding in a stop on the game when you got to +3 profit, that game would end and a new one would start. I also tried Atlantis suggestion of the 3 bet cycles, but these just made it worse.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: RayManZ on Feb 20, 10:42 AM 2019
Yup no problem, unfortunately the results arn't good.

So I ran 1000 games playing for about 36 spins per game, betting as Atlantis described. Using Winners 1 1 1 1 2 4 8 16 32 progression. Resetting the progression back to the start on a Win

First 1000 Games Result
Highest Balance: +65
Lowest Balance: - 534
Finishing Balance: -515

I ran another 1000 games to check but results were pretty simular:

Second batch of 1000 games
Highest Balance +69
Lowest Balance : -571
Finishing Balance : -504

I tried adding in a stop on the game when you got to +3 profit, that game would end and a new one would start. I also tried Atlantis suggestion of the 3 bet cycles, but these just made it worse.

You got the progression of alantis wrong.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 20, 10:57 AM 2019
You got the progression of alantis wrong.

These Results were using Atlantis betting method - Using the last 3 results betting on the dominant one. So if 112 were the last results I would bet the next result was a 1.

The Progression I used was Winners 1 1 1 1 2 4 8 16 32.

I did try Atlantis progression as well in a seperate game but that seemed to perform worse over the 1000 games. I didn't keep the results.  I will see if I can redo it using his progression and post results
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 20, 11:38 AM 2019
These Results were using Atlantis betting method - Using the last 3 results betting on the dominant one. So if 112 were the last results I would bet the next result was a 1.

The Progression I used was Winners 1 1 1 1 2 4 8 16 32.

I did try Atlantis progression as well in a seperate game but that seemed to perform worse over the 1000 games. I didn't keep the results.  I will see if I can redo it using his progression and post results

So the Results using the 3 stage progression as Atlantis described were as follows:

First 1000 games finished -413
Second 1000 games finished -693

So I think we still need to crack Winners betting stratagey
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 20, 11:56 AM 2019
OK. fair enough - as I said in the post, was only an experiment...
There may be better way utilising virtual betting, 'no bets' or 'stopping points' for example. We just need to figure out a better strategy for betting these 1's and 2's 'pair' results.
Miniroll - I suppose you DID test using last 3 'pair results' and not just last 3 outcomes??
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: IVO on Feb 20, 12:04 PM 2019
Hi gentlemen,
maybe we have to try to play patterns 111 (trend for 1s) or 222 (trend for 2s)?  :question:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 20, 12:07 PM 2019
Hi Ivo,

I thought about that too - maybe something in that. :)
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 20, 12:28 PM 2019
OK. fair enough - as I said in the post, was only an experiment...
There may be better way utilising virtual betting, 'no bets' or 'stopping points' for example. We just need to figure out a better strategy for betting these 1's and 2's 'pair' results.
Miniroll - I suppose you DID test using last 3 'pair results' and not just last 3 outcomes??
A.

Hi yeah i am looking at the 1 1 1 2 2 11 1 2 2 results, so next bet would be 2 as last 3 results were 122.

 I'm not looking at the 0-36 numbers spun on the wheel if thats what you mean?

I think money managment and progression is one thing, but you really need to be more accurate with the bets which is what Winner seeems to have done, or at least found a pattern that wins most of the time. I'm not sure how and I think unless we can crack that, then it's really no different for us just betting on red/black and suffering from the house edge in the long run.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 20, 12:32 PM 2019
Hi yeah i am looking at the 1 1 1 2 2 11 1 2 2 results, so next bet would be 2 as last 3 results were 122.

 I'm not looking at the 0-36 numbers spun on the wheel if thats what you mean?

Eh? Sorry - do not understand. Are you using RB, OE or HL ec's?  How are you getting your 1 and 2 pair results if you do not look at the wheel?
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 20, 12:37 PM 2019
Eh? Sorry - do not understand. Are you using RB, OE or HL ec's?  How are you getting your 1 and 2 pair results if you do not look at the wheel?
A.

Sorry didn't explain that very well lol. I meant for placing the bet I'm looking at the last 3, 1 or 2 pair results. Of course I look at wheel to get the 1 or 2 results, so a high number followed by a  high number would be a 2 and a low followed by a high number would be a 1
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 20, 12:41 PM 2019
LOL! :) Thanks for your clarification. That answers my question then. I understand now that you did do it correctly. :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: mohitomish on Feb 20, 01:10 PM 2019
I’m sure you’ll say short use the results and the end of your play to figure out the switch.
Then play the short series and figure out the switch within the switch.meaning how long will you bet before switching.back to short series .now before you do this you have to figure out the long series how often do they come.1112221111112222122222212222221111.
I think I just gave you the answer

Sorry, couldn't help myself, winner please correct me If I'm wrong but from what I understand you are comparing recent trends with the larger or global trends then take the decision on the switch?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 20, 01:20 PM 2019
Nice work attempting to brainstorm it guys, and thanks for the large scale tests miniroll.  And thanks to Winner for continuing to help. :thumbsup:

We need to put all of Winner's switch examples in the thread together into a master list, then feed it to an AI program to determine the pattern...someone get IBM Watson on the phone...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 02:34 PM 2019
Here is something you can experiment with.
30 switches ever time you win go to the next patterns

1st 1221212
2-    21111222
3-11212212
4-12111112
5-22211211
6-22211211
7-12211221
8-21212111
9-112212111
10-22222222
11-22212221
12-22112222
13-12111122
14-11112122
15-12221121
16-12122111
17-11111112
18-11111221
19-11112222
20-22221221
21-12222122
22-11122211
23-11121222
24-22212212
25-12221121
26-22111211
27-21222122
28-11211211
29-11211111
30-22121111

Now start with number 1 on a win move through all 30 pattern on a loss continue until you hit .this how I found my switches within a switch.
Progression
111248163264
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 02:48 PM 2019
3600/1 that s not bad statistics .and again I’m not looking fo approval .its something I’ve worked on for a while.
There’s nothing complicated about betting .
Roulette is full of sequences and they repeat but they have limits on how long they repeat.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 20, 02:58 PM 2019
example line 5 and 6 a spin results? would lose all those bets? so plus 18 on your wins are you continously betting the progression win or lose? as those results would wipe out restart on every line after? you would need 128 wins throughout the overall game to compensate...read that wrong...but looks like matrix style..sorry didnt read it properly
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 03:08 PM 2019
example line 5 and 6 a spin results? would lose all those bets? so plus 18 on your wins are you continously betting the progression win or lose? as those results would wipe out restart on every line after? you would need 128 wins throughout the overall game to compensate...read that wrong...but looks like matrix style..sorry didnt read it properly
No it’s not a matrix and no it does not wipe out br
Sorry typing to fast ,line 6
22111211.
Like I said on a win move down.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 20, 03:11 PM 2019
yep sorry...read it wrong couldnt delete post
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 20, 03:29 PM 2019
No it’s not a matrix and no it does not wipe out br
Sorry typing to fast ,line 6
22111211.
Like I said on a win move down.

Thanks for the clarification and helping us! So are you starting always with line 1 and move up on a win ? But as it seems the progression not gives always a prifit for you, just if you hit in the first spin, am I right?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 03:56 PM 2019
Thanks for the clarification and helping us! So are you starting always with line 1 and move up on a win ? But as it seems the progression not gives always a prifit for you, just if you hit in the first spin, am I right?
Building your bank roll takes time once you your ahead and even If ilose some session I’m ok .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 04:00 PM 2019
Im in a position where I can just bet 1248 16  32 64
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 20, 04:39 PM 2019
Im in a position where I can just bet 1248 16  32 64

So you alwqys start with the line 1 and move up on a win, right?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 05:11 PM 2019
So you alwqys start with the line 1 and move up on a win, right?
[/quote
If this is your stream of 18 series
So you you would start with line one
Here is the wL of the results
121121121222111111
Wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
The is of coarse an exi would win on the first line move to the second  and on on a loss stay with the line until a win.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 05:13 PM 2019
Again this will win often but  I found the sequence or switch from this typ of practice
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 05:19 PM 2019
Here was my session today  played my perfect switch
2221122112211112222111+12
wwwlllwllwwllwlwwwwllw
212222222211222221 +13
wlwwwwwwwwlllwwwwl
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 20, 05:26 PM 2019
Thanks for releasing your switch sequence Winner. Looks really good and a few manual tests ive done on some of my own sequences showed good results.

Just got to program in all this code to my program then i'm off to Cash Cow Farm to do some milking  8)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 05:28 PM 2019
Thanks for releasing your switch sequence Winner. Looks really good and a few manual tests ive done on some of my own sequences showed good results.

Just got to program in all this code to my program then i'm off to Cash Cow Farm to do some milking  8)
Ok sounds good have fun
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 20, 05:48 PM 2019
Just a quick question Winner

Row 1 only has 7 numbers and Row 9 has 9 numbers?

All the others have 8 numbers, is this correct?

Thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 05:51 PM 2019
Sorry my bad
12211212
You go crazy 😜 this is the right combo
Remove the 1 on the 9 numbers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 20, 06:04 PM 2019
Sorry my bad
12211212
You go crazy 😜 this is the right combo
Remove the 1 on the 9 numbers

9-112212111

Which 1 lol?

From the start, middle or end  :xd:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 06:06 PM 2019
The end🤪
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 20, 06:07 PM 2019
Now that sounds like a movie 🍿 ending
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 20, 06:14 PM 2019
Thanks Winner.

Only we must figure somth non-agressive progression, cause playing marty is not party  :o
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 20, 06:16 PM 2019
Now that sounds like a movie 🍿 ending

I like "Fin" in French movies because it seems so French to me.  Just "End." No "The End", just....the bleakness of "End".  ;D

Thanks Winner.

Only we must figure somth non-agressive progression, cause playing marty is not party  :o

Well that's the trick Eko, that Winner has gotten accurate enough with switch selection that there's no concern about going too far into any progression because it will hit.

Or 3599 times out of 3600 anyway.  Pretty good.  :love:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 20, 06:50 PM 2019
I like "Fin" in French movies because it seems so French to me.  Just "End." No "The End", just....the bleakness of "End".  ;D

Well that's the trick Eko, that Winner has gotten accurate enough with switch selection that there's no concern about going too far into any progression because it will hit.

Or 3599 times out of 3600 anyway.  Pretty good.  :love:

Okey than you think he switch witin the 30 switching sequences?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 20, 07:22 PM 2019
I played with your sequences one session, I jsut started with line 1 and followed the numebrs if win I went to step2.



Progression: 1 2 3/4 8 12/ 31u

1,
1,
2,W +0 b2   
2,W +1 B3
2,
1,W +1 B4
1,W +1 b5
1,
1,
1,
1,W -3 b6
1,
1,
2,W +0 b7
1,W +1 b8
2,w+1 b9
0,1, w +1 b10
1,
2,W +1 b11
1,
2,w +1 b12
2, w +1 b13
1, w +1 b14
2,
2,
2,
1,W -3 b15
2,
2,w +1 b16
2,
2, w +1 b17
2,
2,
1, w +0 b18
2,
1,w +1 b19
1, w +1 b20
2, w +1 b 21
0,1, w +1 b22
2,
1, w +1 b23
2,
1, w +1 b24
1,
1,
1,
2,
1,
2, w -3 b25
2,
2, w +1 b26
1,
2, w +1 b27
2, w +1 b28
1, w +1 b29
2,
1, w +1 b30
2, w +1       +15u
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Feb 21, 12:12 AM 2019
Here is something you can experiment with.
30 switches ever time you win go to the next patterns

1st 1221212
2-    21111222
3-11212212
4-12111112
5-22211211
6-22211211
7-12211221
8-21212111
9-112212111
10-22222222
11-22212221
12-22112222
13-12111122
14-11112122
15-12221121
16-12122111
17-11111112
18-11111221
19-11112222
20-22221221
21-12222122
22-11122211
23-11121222
24-22212212
25-12221121
26-22111211
27-21222122
28-11211211
29-11211111
30-22121111

Now start with number 1 on a win move through all 30 pattern on a loss continue until you hit .this how I found my switches within a switch.
Progression
111248163264

Is it 1 and 2 units you play with on every line? But you're talking about progression? Sorry, don't understand.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 21, 04:09 AM 2019
Hi winner,

Thank you for showing your 30 "switch patterns"
With the 30 patterns - are you FOLLOWING the patterns until a win?  - or betting OPPOSITE the patterns until a win? Or does it matter? After a win you go down to the next pattern and resume from the start of that pattern, right? ;)

Cheers,
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 21, 04:39 AM 2019
Nice result playing the "switch patterns", Mister Eko...
I wonder - what u think about using a parlay after a win? Obviously this relies on being able to achieve 2 consecutive wins together at some point; but means can have a less riskier progression string...
eg: MODIFIED BOFFINS BET:
1-1-1-2-2-3-4-5-7-7-9-11 = 53 units at risk.
This just an idea - Winner's prog may be best... for as the saying goes: "If it ain't broke - don't fix it!"
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 21, 08:08 AM 2019
Hi winner,

Thank you for showing your 30 "switch patterns"
With the 30 patterns - are you FOLLOWING the patterns until a win?  - or betting OPPOSITE the patterns until a win? Or does it matter? After a win you go down to the next pattern and resume from the start of that pattern, right? ;)

Cheers,
A.

I tested following.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 21, 08:26 AM 2019
Nice result playing the "switch patterns", Mister Eko...
I wonder - what u think about using a parlay after a win? Obviously this relies on being able to achieve 2 consecutive wins together at some point; but means can have a less riskier progression string...
eg: MODIFIED BOFFINS BET:
1-1-1-2-2-3-4-5-7-7-9-11 = 53 units at risk.
This just an idea - Winner's prog may be best... for as the saying goes: "If it ain't broke - don't fix it!"
A.
Stage 1 bet selection ,found
Stage 2 progression ,can’t be manipulated unfair payouts makes it so.you can sit out some bets but really that’s all. If you want to hit in 5 wait for for 3 Ls
Stage 3 strategy  comes within the switches but the switches are triggered from the result making it safe ,bank roll can’t be touched .
Stage 4 putting it all together the last and most important .


Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 21, 11:36 AM 2019
stage 4 is where you would you get stats like 3599/1
The first 3 stages are the guts and the 4 stages is the glory .
Even money has been dealt with .
Not hard to play inside now with less numbers.
Now Turbo mentions playing repeats you can’t have 2 unless 1comes out you can’t have 3 unless 2 shows and so on so my even money makes this kind of play even easier.
Find the 4 stage and start milking the cash 🐄
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 21, 12:30 PM 2019
Remember what I said stick to one thing stop jumping around that’s how you get good at something.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: IVO on Feb 21, 01:16 PM 2019
Dear Winner, I would like to ask, do you follow past spins? Correct or wrong idea? Thanks in advance
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 21, 01:32 PM 2019
Dear Winner, I would like to ask, do you follow past spins? Correct or wrong idea? Thanks in advance

No
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 21, 01:57 PM 2019
What’s a good name for this system any 💡
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 21, 01:57 PM 2019
Remember what I said stick to one thing stop jumping around that’s how you get good at something.

Thanks the advice Winner, but if someone cant figure out smth to turn it profitable, i think, he will go, and msut go.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 21, 01:59 PM 2019
Thanks the advice Winner, but if someone cant figure out smth to turn it profitable, i think, he will go, and msut go.
And then he must go😢
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 21, 02:01 PM 2019
There’s an old proverb
Seek and you shall find.
But it should say
Stick to something long enough and you shall win
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 21, 02:04 PM 2019
What’s a good name for this system any 💡

I named it "Benihana" in the Excel worksheet where I keep the test notes and data...the CHOPS remind me of the cooks there
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 21, 02:18 PM 2019
222112122211111221=9 no win no loss but watch now the switch
12212221021121102212=10 +5 easy
112121122111121112=6 now the switch
211111121222122111=+1 not much profit but still. A win
212220201211211012112=9-2 now the switch
2211111122220212212=+10 +3 add it up +9 very small progression.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 21, 04:24 PM 2019
222112122211111221=9 no win no loss but watch now the switch
12212221021121102212=10 +5 easy
112121122111121112=6 now the switch
211111121222122111=+1 not much profit but still. A win
212220201211211012112=9-2 now the switch
2211111122220212212=+10 +3 add it up +9 very small progression.

Winner, do you continue your progression from one game to the next, or start each game fresh at level 1 progression?

So if you finished a game with 2 losses, and your progression was say 1 2 4 8, you would finish that game by betting 2 units and losing, would you then start the next game betting 4 units on your first bet, or restart the progression sequence by betting 1 unit as the first bet on a new game?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 21, 06:25 PM 2019
Here was my session today  played my perfect switch
2221122112211112222111+12
wwwlllwllwwllwlwwwwllw
212222222211222221 +13
wlwwwwwwwwlllwwwwl

I'm testing your system to see if I have it right but my results don't match yours. I assume you are using a 1 2 4 8 16 32 64 progression on this result:

212222222211222221 +13

So your first bet is on number 2 in both the games, but the first number on row 1 of you table is a 1?

1st 1221212
2-    21111222
3-11212212
4-12111112
5-22211211
6-22211211
7-12211221
8-21212111
9-112212111

So here is the game where you won +13 broken down as I see it

Result     You Bet On      Amount bet       Win/Lose       Balance
2               1 (1st Line)              1                    Lose               -1
So on a lose you bet the next number to the right on the current ine
1                2 (1st Line)             2                     Lose              -3               
2                2 (1st Line)             4                     Win                 1
So now you have won you move down to the next line and start with the first number on the left?
2                  2 (2nd Line)           1                      Win               1
Move down another line as won
2                  1 (3rd Line)             1                    Lose               1
2                  1 (3rd Line)             2                    Lose              -1
2                  2 (3rd Line)             4                    Win                 3
Move down to line 4 as won
2                  1 (4th Line)              1                   Lose                2
2                   2 (4th Line)             2                   Win                  4
Move down to line 5
2                  2 (5th Line)              1                    Win                  5
Move down to line 6
1                 2 (6th Line)               1                    Lose                 4
1                 2 (6th Line)               2                    Lose                 2
2                 2 (6th Line)               4                    Win                   6
Move down to line 7
2                 1 (7th Line)               1                    Lose                 5                   
2                 2 (7th Line)               2                    Win                   7
Move down to 8th Line
2                 2 (8th Line)               1                    Win                    8
Move down to 9th Line
2                 1 (9th Line)               1                    Lose                   7
1                 1 (9th Line)               2                   Win                      9

So you see I make it a win of 9 units? So Im not sure i'm doing it right? Could you point out where I'm going wrong please?








Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 22, 04:13 AM 2019
Here are the 30 "switch patterns" again updated with winner's typing amendments. Each pattern should consist of a line of 8.

1-12211212
2-21111222
3-11212212
4-12111112
5-22211211
6-22111211
7-12211221
8-21212111
9-11221211
10-22222222
11-22212221
12-22112222
13-12111122
14-11112122
15-12221121
16-12122111
17-11111112
18-11111221
19-11112222
20-22221221
21-12222122
22-11122211
23-11121222
24-22212212
25-12221121
26-22111211
27-21222122
28-11211211
29-11211111
30-22121111
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 22, 04:18 AM 2019
I'm testing your system to see if I have it right but my results don't match yours. I assume you are using a 1 2 4 8 16 32 64 progression on this result:

212222222211222221 +13

 I make it a win of 9 units? So I'm not sure i'm doing it right? Could you point out where I'm going wrong please?

I got +9 too...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: RayManZ on Feb 22, 09:30 AM 2019
I got +9 too...

He said he does not use those patterns anymore. He is one stage further.

Get those 30.000 cycle of 36 spins and look at the averages. How many 2's? 1? 11? 111? 1111? 222? 2222? etc. Could be the awnser. I dont know. Maybe winner can respond to my sugestion.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: -Katalyst- on Feb 22, 09:46 AM 2019
Further to the above - what Winner has shown are patterns to go through/experiment with - and in doing so - he suggests that one may come across/become familiar with the switching patterns
- he hasn't disclosed his specific play as yet so you are not going to get the same result as him
-what was on offer was the opportunity to find those 'switch' patterns - the crux of this approach
......random not being so random where volumes/clusters are concerned

-Best Wishes-
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: precogmiles on Feb 22, 11:12 AM 2019
Further to the above - what Winner has shown are patterns to go through/experiment with - and in doing so - he suggests that one may come across/become familiar with the switching patterns
- he hasn't disclosed his specific play as yet so you are not going to get the same result as him
-what was on offer was the opportunity to find those 'switch' patterns - the crux of this approach
......random not being so random where volumes/clusters are concerned

-Best Wishes-

Very smart, this is what most people don't understand.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 22, 12:09 PM 2019
He said he does not use those patterns anymore. He is one stage further.

Get those 30.000 cycle of 36 spins and look at the averages. How many 2's? 1? 11? 111? 1111? 222? 2222? etc. Could be the awnser. I dont know. Maybe winner can respond to my sugestion.

The avareges not makes sense for the systems. Maybe he switch only one number, then if lost he switch fkr pairs, then three and four numbers. Example bet 1, came, so lost, he bets 2 2 or something pair of numbers, if lost bets 1 1 1 or 1 2 1, then 4 numbers.

What dk you think guys? Winner?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 22, 01:22 PM 2019
Maybe it to so with Sputnik's idea of "triplets": singles, series of 2 and series of 2+...?

1212221112 = singles and series of 2+

2221122111 = series of 2 and series of 2+

122122122 = singles and series of 2

1221112212 = singles, series of 2 and series of 2+

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 22, 01:52 PM 2019
just get someone  to excel all combos and  find the least popular..then make a mm to deal with it..keeping mm within parameters of losing less in ratio to the rest of other combos that are possible and bet against it happening
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Feb 22, 01:57 PM 2019
Maybe it to so with Sputnik's idea of "triplets": singles, series of 2 and series of 2+...?

1212221112 = singles and series of 2+

2221122111 = series of 2 and series of 2+

122122122 = singles and series of 2

1221112212 = singles, series of 2 and series of 2+

A.

I like you man, you have similar thinking like me :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 23, 07:11 AM 2019
I've been running some tests on the system Winner released to us. Ive run it over 10,000 games betting on Chop and Runs. This is all flat betting 1 unit per bet with no progression used.

The aim was to see if using the pattern provided by Winner would increase the amnount of wins compared to just randomly betting on Chops or Runs.

As you can see the results are pretty simular. So i'm not sure it offers any real advantage.

However, Winner is obviously making his system work, and he no doubt plays it differently to us and uses different numbers.

This test was really just for me to see if the numbers provided would increase my chance of winning, and thought I would share for anyone else wondering.


Winners System
Profit after 10,000 Games: -5195
Longest losing run: 17

Second Test of Winner's System
Profit after 10,000 Games: -5077
Longest losing run: 21



Random betting on Chops or Runs
Profit after 10,000 Games: -4858
Longest losing run: 20

Second Test of Random betting
Profit after 10,000 Games: -5232
Longest losing run: 17
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 23, 08:34 AM 2019
you sure he,s doing chops ..not following for a streak by converting results to a 3 unit base bet ..one on dozen 1 or dozen 3 depending on hi or lo  and one unit each on the last two ds hit in hi or lo in conjunction..
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 08:44 AM 2019
stage 4 is where you would you get stats like 3599/1
The first 3 stages are the guts and the 4 stages is the glory .
Even money has been dealt with .
Not hard to play inside now with less numbers.
Now Turbo mentions playing repeats you can’t have 2 unless 1comes out you can’t have 3 unless 2 shows and so on so my even money makes this kind of play even easier.
Find the 4 stage and start milking the cash 🐄
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 23, 08:47 AM 2019
i did mention playing inside bets but you said it was too advanced  :question:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 08:54 AM 2019
Last night air ⚽️
111222222022112211=10 +2
122212121212121121=9+0
212212121121111211=7 -4
1211122111112101111=4 -11
212122221121122112= 10. +1
1111220121221212121==8-3
122211222212222121=12 +6
Results +6
Now when I add the switches brings my total profit +10
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 08:55 AM 2019
i did mention playing inside bets but you said it was too advanced  :question:
I was kidding
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 09:02 AM 2019
I've been running some tests on the system Winner released to us. Ive run it over 10,000 games betting on Chop and Runs. This is all flat betting 1 unit per bet with no progression used.

The aim was to see if using the pattern provided by Winner would increase the amnount of wins compared to just randomly betting on Chops or Runs.

As you can see the results are pretty simular. So i'm not sure it offers any real advantage.

However, Winner is obviously making his system work, and he no doubt plays it differently to us and uses different numbers.

This test was really just for me to see if the numbers provided would increase my chance of winning, and thought I would share for anyone else wondering.


Winners System
Profit after 10,000 Games: -5195
Longest losing run: 17

Second Test of Winner's System
Profit after 10,000 Games: -5077
Longest losing run: 21



Random betting on Chops or Runs
Profit after 10,000 Games: -4858
Longest losing run: 20

Second Test of Random betting
Profit after 10,000 Games: -5232
Longest losing run: 17
Winners sytem -4858
Winners system-5232
Thanks for for those stats that just proves that my 4 stage is still winning
I’m not sure what you did  ???
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 09:12 AM 2019
Here’s another air ball play from the othe night.
111212222222221112=11 +4
1122211221222022221=12+5
1211211112012111121=5 -9 need progression
2222221102112122111=10. -2. Need progression
121110202211121112022=8. -4
1112120121111212111=5  -8
21122112110022212211=9 -1
212121222211122222= 12 +6
Total profit +6
With switch +20 sorry made a mistake it was 20 not 19
2hrs of play
And I leave when I  say I want to leave not because I’m losing money and they make me leave.ftc
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: andrebac on Feb 23, 09:24 AM 2019
Here’s another air ball play from the othe night.
111212222222221112=11 +4
1122211221222022221=12+5
1211211112012111121=5 -9 need progression
2222221102112122111=10. -2. Need progression
121110202211121112022=8. -4
1112120121111212111=5  -8
21122112110022212211=9 -1
212121222211122222= 12 +6
Total profit +6
With switch +20 sorry made a mistake it was 20 not 19
2hrs of play
And I leave when I  say I want to leave not because I’m losing money and they make me leave.ftc

winner,
may you show a play by play?
I think we understand it differently from what you play
thanks in advance
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 09:30 AM 2019
winner,
may you show a play by play?
I think we understand it differently from what you play
thanks in advance
How do you you understand it?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 23, 09:35 AM 2019
I was kidding

thought you was as your results doesnt match up with money won..everyone has been testing it wrong for days..
and can,t test unless they had your actual numbers etc..but the basics are there as i mentioned earlier
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 09:45 AM 2019
thought you was as your results doesnt match up with money won..everyone has been testing it wrong for days..
and can,t test unless they had your actual numbers etc..but the basics are there as i mentioned earlier
No what I said was if you beat the outside you beat the inside.but if you can’t figure out how to beat the outside how are you even attempting to win on the inside.
I was kidding because everyone wants to be fed a fish 🐠 for life instead of learning how to do it. That’s all .
The wins come from playing outside only  mr sixth sense
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 23, 11:08 AM 2019
no problem just my take on it..if you know the switches or runs..it stands to reason the 4th stage could be the last 10 spins..at this point if you knew how the outside worked you can then bet for the inside..at this point you are nearly at the crux at the end of the cycle...there will be repeats already on numbers out..but the actual amount of numbers out would narrow the bets down where its not a 50/50 bet but the odds are higher in your favour on a hit on say 10 to 14 numbers...which is average for the lo and high..
this is the only way i can see you hitting plus 18 a game as everyone has tested the progression on your results and can,t get it to work
a simple marty doen,t match up..

but as you say you must know the outside 1st..
no disputing this..

and i,m probably right wide of the mark..its just my take on it...turbo won,t bet on a sleeper as you say..but he does bet on numbers out like in your example of his quote
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 23, 11:28 AM 2019
and it comes to mind just using the last 2 ds out in high and lo whichever corresponds to your bet and progress in them as the law of the third applies most of the time on them which would give the higher payout than the usual 1 unit as it takes time to get 6 unique ds out
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 01:23 PM 2019
and it comes to mind just using the last 2 ds out in high and lo whichever corresponds to your bet and progress in them as the law of the third applies most of the time on them which would give the higher payout than the usual 1 unit as it takes time to get 6 unique ds out
There’s no law here just betting even money with a progression
Personally I would never bet more then 18 # if your betting 2 dozen you deserve to lose  your br.never do this.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 01:27 PM 2019
If your going to bet inside numbers it’s easy u use the sytem but instead of betting on the outside u bet the numbers that already came out that simple less numbers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 23, 01:39 PM 2019
i said this at start..use ayks  tracker and bet numbers out from your bet..sure it,ll start with just the few numbers out but hits could be early and repeats happen..numbers will only build up to whatever they set to at 37..this is where you said its too advanced..
only question now is how you choose your bet selection
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 02:26 PM 2019
i said this at start..use ayks  tracker and bet numbers out from your bet..sure it,ll start with just the few numbers out but hits could be early and repeats happen..numbers will only build up to whatever they set to at 37..this is where you said its too advanced..
only question now is how you choose your bet selection
I bet on 2 s
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Feb 23, 03:02 PM 2019
last question...am i right the inside numbers ..this is how you got to the winning amounts per lines in your example ?..so 2,s no switches..
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 04:20 PM 2019
last question...am i right the inside numbers ..this is how you got to the winning amounts per lines in your example ?..so 2,s no switches..
No it was not I was only play outside .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 04:37 PM 2019
Here this would be the results from one of my session
121111222221212121=9 betting even money only 2s
Betting all the numberthat has shown only 
Profit is $108 flat betting.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 23, 05:56 PM 2019
We need Precogmiles to come into this thread and remove view Winner's notebook with the 30 sequences... >:D

6th-Sense is right though: miniroll if you can you should code a ton of raw chops/streaks and have the output data show you the most common and least common sequences/combinations.  I think that's the only way we're going to start drilling down that magic 30....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 23, 06:48 PM 2019
We need Precogmiles to come into this thread and remove view Winner's notebook with the 30 sequences... >:D

6th-Sense is right though: miniroll if you can you should code a ton of raw chops/streaks and have the output data show you the most common and least common sequences/combinations.  I think that's the only way we're going to start drilling down that magic 30....
I like that Mako magic 30
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 24, 03:19 AM 2019
We need Precogmiles to come into this thread and remove view Winner's notebook with the 30 sequences... >:D

6th-Sense is right though: miniroll if you can you should code a ton of raw chops/streaks and have the output data show you the most common and least common s equences/combinations.  I think that's the only way we're going to start drilling down that magic 30....

Hi Mako, yeah I was thinking about doing that but then I thought if I ask it to look for the sequence ‘112’ and see how often it is followed by a 1 or a 2, would it not be about 50/50? So the sequence 1121 would appear just as often as 1122?

Winner has given us 30 sequences and I believe with a 8 digit sequence of 2 numbers there is 256 possible combinations? So I’m not really sure if the Magic 30 would have any reason to appear more than any others?

Maybe Winner could give us a hint as to why those 30?

But yeah I might see if I can run it as a test just for fun. So I would run say, 1 million games and count all the   possible 8 digit sequences that appear and then list them in order of frequency?  8)

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 24, 05:03 AM 2019
One more thought on the way Winners system might work.

So he starts betting on 2's and waits for maybe a pattern of 4 to appear. As an example I will use one of the results he posted:

111222222022112211=10 +2

So you can see the first 4 out are 1112. So starting at the top of his patterns we go down till we find a 1112.

On the second line we see it  21 [1112] 22

So he bets 2 for the next round and wins.

Now the last four are 1222. So looking down the rows we find it at the end of row 12:
12-221 [1222] 2
So next he would bet on a 2 and so on.

Am I on the right track Winner or barking up the wrong tree?

1-12211212
2-21111222
3-11212212
4-12111112
5-22211211
6-22111211
7-12211221
8-21212111
9-11221211
10-22222222
11-22212221
12-22112222
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 24, 10:32 AM 2019
Hi Mako, yeah I was thinking about doing that but then I thought if I ask it to look for the sequence ‘112’ and see how often it is followed by a 1 or a 2, would it not be about 50/50? So the sequence 1121 would appear just as often as 1122?

Winner has given us 30 sequences and I believe with a 8 digit sequence of 2 numbers there is 256 possible combinations? So I’m not really sure if the Magic 30 would have any reason to appear more than any others?

Maybe Winner could give us a hint as to why those 30?

But yeah I might see if I can run it as a test just for fun. So I would run say, 1 million games and count all the   possible 8 digit sequences that appear and then list them in order of frequency?  8)
Don’t bother with 1 million that’s a waist of time I have tried something similar it’s not predictable.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 24, 11:55 AM 2019
I m reading some other systems on the forum  and the end result is o I think all those winning is just luck . Then  in my opinion it doesn’t work a system should be tested and manipulated until it works .
Computers do they work yes and no but it’s not based on luck and your system should do the same.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Feb 24, 01:14 PM 2019
I m reading some other systems on the forum  and the end result is o I think all those winning is just luck . Then  in my opinion it doesn’t work a system should be tested and manipulated until it works .
Computers do they work yes and no but it’s not based on luck and your system should do the same.

That’s the way I see it. I get all the   points that the ball has no memory, unfair payouts, house edge, blah, blah, blah, etc, etc,  but there has to be some way to beat it!  ???
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 24, 01:47 PM 2019
I m reading some other systems on the forum  and the end result is o I think all those winning is just luck . Then  in my opinion it doesn’t work a system should be tested and manipulated until it works .
Computers do they work yes and no but it’s not based on luck and your system should do the same.

Agree, though I'd put it at 99.9% are luck/dancing between the raindrops, while one out of every thousand is actually performing over time for whatever reason. 

Let's say you're winning, and you continue to win for the rest of the year.  And lets say two other people on the forum who I won't name are also winning, have been winning for most of 2018, and win throughout 2019.

That's three methods that are working, for now, over time, over a significant amount of spins...out of say 3000 total methods posted here and VLS and the other major forums the past decade? 

So one in a thousand...and one of you three will fail by the end of 2019, you were dancing between the raindrops, it was just an outlier lucky run that does occur, remember Steve's example of a fallacy system he had run for over a year that won...right up until it lost.

But that does leave two of you, two who will win past 2019, who will grow a bankroll large enough to walk away at a profit whenever doomsday comes...if it ever does.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 24, 02:43 PM 2019
Agree, though I'd put it at 99.9% are luck/dancing between the raindrops, while one out of every thousand is actually performing over time for whatever reason. 

Let's say you're winning, and you continue to win for the rest of the year.  And lets say two other people on the forum who I won't name are also winning, have been winning for most of 2018, and win throughout 2019.

That's three methods that are working, for now, over time, over a significant amount of spins...out of say 3000 total methods posted here and VLS and the other major forums the past decade? 

So one in a thousand...and one of you three will fail by the end of 2019, you were dancing between the raindrops, it was just an outlier lucky run that does occur, remember Steve's example of a fallacy system he had run for over a year that won...right up until it lost.

But that does leave two of you, two who will win past 2019, who will grow a bankroll large enough to walk away at a profit whenever doomsday comes...if it ever does.  :thumbsup:
Any sytem will lose be it computer ,VB,or whatever but can you be way head with Bank roll where  the loss does not effect it .that’s the key.
Blackjack players/card counters  lose all the time but can they be a head financially.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 24, 02:47 PM 2019
Don’t fear losing ,yes it sucks but if you have a great system like mine no fear magic 30 is here lol
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 24, 02:48 PM 2019
Step 1 bet selection
Step 2 progression
Step 3 when to know how to switch systems
Step 4 putting all together.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 24, 04:53 PM 2019
21212221201212122201=11+2
121201212111012212101=7-7 progression needed
211122222222211221=12+6
+15 with appropriate switches and progression
I won’t be posting anymore results.
So just keep at boys you’ll get it .
Maybe I’ll write a book from  the last 20 years .anyways it’s been nice to share this with you all.
Good luck o ya you don’t need it with this.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: luckyfella on Feb 24, 08:10 PM 2019
I played red black reorganised to 1,2 like winner. Yes, waiting gamblers fallacy that the math boyz say lose itlr. General say it's luck. With math, luck seems to follow me. Strange ?

Note that math works in all locations and all formats.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: luckyfella on Feb 24, 08:22 PM 2019
Extra pockets and unfair payouts are cited by mathboyz that we can't win playing roulette.

Assume there's a casino whose wheel is without the extra zero pocket and the payout is fair.

Can you win consistently with such a setting ?

That's the base level starting point.

Why must your system win ?

What is the math basis why your system wins ?
(the most important part)

Note - that session graph above is pure luck. Question is can you be luck in more often than not. Answer lies in math - it's a probability game.

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 24, 09:00 PM 2019


Note - that session graph above is pure luck. Question is can you be luck in more often than not. Answer lies in math - it's a probability game.

Cheers

The math says that your luck will run out and that you will inevitably lose your entire bankroll, never to break even again after you've played enough sessions.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: luckyfella on Feb 24, 09:05 PM 2019
The math says that your luck will run out and that you will inevitably lose your entire bankroll, never to break even again after you've played enough sessions.
Hey General, Yes you are correct about luck. I tested my luck with continuous betting and this is what I got. Incredible run isn't it ? Has to be a record of sort.  :xd: :xd: :xd:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 24, 10:30 PM 2019
Hey General, Yes you are correct about luck. I tested my luck with continuous betting and this is what I got. Incredible run isn't it ? Has to be a record of sort.  :xd: :xd: :xd:

Well, as we all know charts are proof that a system works or doesn't work ,and my chart shows that your system doesn't work.  And my chart contains more spins. Geez, darn!  ::)
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F25%2Fsource.png&hash=88ea4186e5946f24e1a905556914cfaa) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OvxaA)

Awe bummer.. sorry. ::)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: luckyfella on Feb 24, 10:35 PM 2019
Well, as we all know charts are proof that a system works or doesn't work and my chart shows that your system doesn't work.
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F25%2FsourRce.png&hash=9d43d3f26509811f11429225cb34125f) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OvxaA)
General, you use trolling on every forum to raise your profile visibility. Good strategy :thumbsup:
So, how's your wobbly wheel business ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 24, 11:01 PM 2019
General, you use trolling on every forum to raise your profile visibility. Good strategy :thumbsup:
So, how's your wobbly wheel business ?

I really enjoy the wobbly wheels.  Business is very good on the wobbly ones and the ones that don't wobble. . :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: luckyfella on Feb 24, 11:50 PM 2019
I really enjoy the wobbly wheels.  Business is very good on the wobbly ones and the ones that don't wobble. . :)
Sorry General, I don't believe you.
Your business is down ;)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Feb 25, 01:15 AM 2019
Here is something you can experiment with.
30 switches ever time you win go to the next patterns

1st 1221212
2-    21111222
3-11212212
4-12111112
5-22211211
6-22211211
7-12211221
8-21212111
9-112212111
10-22222222
11-22212221
12-22112222
13-12111122
14-11112122
15-12221121
16-12122111
17-11111112
18-11111221
19-11112222
20-22221221
21-12222122
22-11122211
23-11121222
24-22212212
25-12221121
26-22111211
27-21222122
28-11211211
29-11211111
30-22121111

Now start with number 1 on a win move through all 30 pattern on a loss continue until you hit .this how I found my switches within a switch.
Progression
111248163264

So 1 is for example red and 2 black? You go through the sessions with above progression. Win or loose doesn't matter you ride through the progression and lines above. Is this correct?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 25, 08:18 AM 2019
One more thought on the way Winners system might work.

So he starts betting on 2's and waits for maybe a pattern of 4 to appear. As an example I will use one of the results he posted:

111222222022112211=10 +2

So you can see the first 4 out are 1112. So starting at the top of his patterns we go down till we find a 1112.

On the second line we see it  21 [1112] 22

So he bets 2 for the next round and wins.

Now the last four are 1222. So looking down the rows we find it at the end of row 12:
12-221 [1222] 2
So next he would bet on a 2 and so on.

Am I on the right track Winner or barking up the wrong tree?

1-12211212
2-21111222
3-11212212
4-12111112
5-22211211
6-22111211
7-12211221
8-21212111
9-11221211
10-22222222
11-22212221
12-22112222

That's an Interesting idea!?
Thing is, there are sometimes more than one line that match a result of four eg: 2221 = line 5 and 11

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 09:04 AM 2019
I really enjoy the wobbly wheels.  Business is very good on the wobbly ones and the ones that don't wobble. . :)
What would make a wobbly wheel win and I’m serious.i don’t see any value to this.
From what I gather GENERAL you think you are the only one on the planet winning at such a simple game.
Here’.this what I do when I brored maybe all people here should try this for an exercise.
General you included cause I don’t think your as smart as you think you are.


Chess has 64 squares your job is to number each square  .
Now you are going to use the knight and I will give a number to start on but u can start anywhere you like so number49 now the knights can only move in an L so now your Job Mr GENERAL and all is to move the knight across the board and only touch each square only ONCE until you clear the whole board until you come back to number 49 if for whatever ..reason you over lap u start over this is all done blind folded when you get really good .I’m at the blind folded stage.
You go from number to number until you get back to number 49
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 25, 10:15 AM 2019
Wobbly wheels means ones with defects. It doesn't mean wobbly necessarily, that's just a nickname. It could be pockets, numbers ring, balance, stator, rotor, spindle, bearings, or other things. But whatever the defect, certain pockets can be favoured more than others. It only takes a 1/36 pocket and you break even; a bit like your 12s simulation without zero. 1/35 or greater, and you're in business. That's the value in it.

He's not the only one making money out of it. I made many £1000's in the 90s from biased wheel play. However, I belueve The General has made much much more than that.

I've not had the time to investigate wheels in recent years. Its an exacting process. Much more difficult than you might think, statistically, and logistically. There are many things the house can do to throw you off the scent. Also the modern wheels are much more defect free than some old ones. Opportunities are still out there though.  :smile:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 11:24 AM 2019
Wobbly wheels means ones with defects. It doesn't mean wobbly necessarily, that's just a nickname. It could be pockets, numbers ring, balance, stator, rotor, spindle, bearings, or other things. But whatever the defect, certain pockets can be favoured more than others. It only takes a 1/36 pocket and you break even; a bit like your 12s simulation without zero. 1/35 or greater, and you're in business. That's the value in it.

He's not the only one making money out of it. I made many £1000's in the 90s from biased wheel play. However, I belueve The General has made much much more than that.

I've not had the time to investigate wheels in recent years. Its an exacting process. Much more difficult than you might think, statistically, and logistically. There are many things the house can do to throw you off the scent. Also the modern wheels are much more defect free than some old ones. Opportunities are still out there though.  :smile:
What your traveling the world for these give me a break that’s bull shit
Biased wheels are close to exitinct
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 11:31 AM 2019
Magic 30 go in play you win leave.
No sitting around looking for Wobblies
And why would one spend all that time if is difficult. Jagger days are over.
And easy for the casino to switch the wheels.
O yes forgot The General Looks for marking so he knows which wheel it is in case they switch it ,cough cough give me a break :twisted:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 11:40 AM 2019
Well, as we all know charts are proof that a system works or doesn't work ,and my chart shows that your system doesn't work.  And my chart contains more spins. Geez, darn!  ::)
(https://www.rouletteforum.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pichost.org%2Fimages%2F2019%2F02%2F25%2Fsource.png&hash=88ea4186e5946f24e1a905556914cfaa) (http://www.pichost.org/image/OvxaA)

Awe bummer.. sorry. ::)

📬open the mail General you might find a winning strategy.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Feb 25, 11:50 AM 2019
What your traveling the world for these give me a break that’s bull shit
Biased wheels are close to exitinct

Check out what I wrote more carefully. I said I'm not looking for these since the 1990s. It's too time consuming for me.

But there are opportunities if you look, even if it's temporary bias. A certain rotor and stator combo or a levelling issue.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 25, 11:50 AM 2019
Hee Hee! :) Simple system for betting LAST 2 'pair' results: 1-2, 1-1, 2-1 and 2-2 to repeat in exactly the same order.
I use 10 sessions of winner's past results posted earlier.

1
2
1 w
1 L
1 w
1 w
2 L
2 L
2 w
2 w
2 w
1 L
2 w
1 w
2 w
1 w
2 w
1 w  = +8


2
1
2 w
1 w
2 w
2 L
2 w
1 L
2 w
0==
1 w
2 w
1 w
2 w
1 w
2 w
2 L
2 w
0==
1 L   = +7 (half-stake returns on 0's)


1
2
1 w
2 w
0==
1 w
2 w
1 w
2 w
1 L
1 L
1 w
0==
1 w
2 L
2 L
1 L
2 w
1 w
0==
1 L = +2.5 (half-stake returns on 0's)


2
1
1 L
1 w
2 L
2 L
2 w
2 w
2 w
2 w
2 w
2 w
2 w
1 L
1 L
2 L
2 L
1 L  = +0

2
2
2 w
1 L
1 L
2 L
1 w
2 w
2 L
2 w
1 L
1 L
1 w
1 w
1 w
2 L
2 L
1 L  = -2
 
1
2
2 L
1 L
2 w
2 w
2 w
1 L
0==
2 w
1 w
1 L
2 L
1 w
1 L
0 L
2 L
2 L
1 L
2 w  = -3.5  (half-stake returns on 0's)




1
1
2 L
1 w
2 w
1 w
1 L
2 L
2 L
1 L
1 L
1 w
1 w
2 L
1 w
1 L
1 w
2 w = +0

2
1
1 L
1 w
1 w
1 w
1 w
2 L
1 w
2 w
2 L
2 w
1 L
2 w
2 L
1 L
1 L
1 w   = +2
 

2
1
2 w
2 L
2 w
0==
2 w
0==
1 L
2 w
1 w
1 L
2 L
1 w
1 L
0==
1 w
2 L
1 w
1 L
2 L  = -1.5 (half-stake returns on 0's)


2
2
1 L
1 L
1 w
1 w
1 w
1 w
2 L
2 L
2 w
2 w
0==
2 w
1 L
2 w
2 L
1 L
2 w  = +1.5 (half-stake returns on 0's)

TOTAL = +14 (flatbetting)

Probably just luck...? Still I showed it to win! :)

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 25, 11:56 AM 2019
21212221201212122201=11+2
121201212111012212101=7-7 progression needed
211122222222211221=12+6
+15 with appropriate switches and progression
I won’t be posting anymore results.
So just keep at boys you’ll get it .
Maybe I’ll write a book from  the last 20 years .anyways it’s been nice to share this with you all.
Good luck o ya you don’t need it with this.

Winner,

Where's the proof of concept?  What are the logical reasons that it should work?  The math?

By the way, a progression can't turn a losing system into a winning system in the long run.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 25, 12:11 PM 2019
Hee Hee! :) Simple system for betting LAST 2 'pair' results: 1-2, 1-1, 2-1 and 2-2 to repeat in exactly the same order.
I use 10 sessions of winner's past results posted earlier.

Oops- I complicate rules unnecessarily! :)
Results obtained by simply betting for penultimate 'pair result' to occur (last but one pair result)
 - - In which case maybe use target and progression from "10 days in Monte Carlo" book pdf? :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 12:15 PM 2019
Winner,

Where's the proof of concept?  What are the logical reasons that it should work?  The math?

By the way, a progression can't turn a losing system into a winning system in the long run.
Who says
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 12:21 PM 2019
General Show me the math cause last I check your kind of play still pays 35 to 1
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Feb 25, 12:21 PM 2019
Who says

Mathematicians like Dr. Edward Thorp.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 25, 12:31 PM 2019
Ol' Teddy Thorpe's book:

https://www.bookyards.com/en/book/details/16582/The-Mathematics-Of-Gambling
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 12:42 PM 2019
Mathematicians like Dr. Edward Thorp.
It’s called countermeasures. I ve see what happens to card counters and it’s illegal to where concealed devices. I have a roulette computer and my sytem is easier anyone can use it you don’t have to be a MIT 🤓
1+1 =2 for me I think I no math
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 01:16 PM 2019
Mathematicians like Dr. Edward Thorp.
Hers my math
12210121111202112121-7 profit +2
21112201212211212222=0 profit +6
1122112212122122211+2
112122220121120011121-4
2112211202221111111. -6 profit +4
221222122221211111 +0 profit +6
112122212221121111 +0 profit +1
21121212121212111111-5 +1
1211101212122122121-2 profit +5
Total +27 I didn’t even break a 😓 that’s  my math
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 25, 01:33 PM 2019
With all due respect "winner" , his point is valid because anyone can post endless winning sessions without giving the full system. These roulette forums have been full of semi systems that promise so much but are never fully discovered (see 120+ pages of Vaddi etc)
That's the kicker. As soon as the cat is out the bag, it'll be tested and run through thousands of spins until it loses , you know this - but you shouldn't see this as a dent to your reputation. 
Issue is this, you wont tell anyone if they finally "get it". So the whole excerise is one big merry go round
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 01:33 PM 2019
Any ways I’m not really interested in what u have to say Mr General go and win your way and I’ll win mine
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 01:36 PM 2019
With all due respect "winner" , his point is valid because anyone can post endless winning sessions without giving the full system. These roulette forums have been full of semi systems that promise so much but are never fully discovered (see 120+ pages of Vaddi etc)
That's the kicker. As soon as the cat is out the bag, it'll be tested and run through thousands of spins until it loses , you know this - but you shouldn't see this as a dent to your reputation. 
Issue is this, you wont tell anyone if they finally "get it". So the whole excerise is one big merry go round
Merry go round  don’t no about that
You have a bet selection
You have progression and all the switches
Sorry if you can’t manage to put a winning bet together it’s all there .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 25, 02:20 PM 2019
12210121111202112121-7 profit +2

Can anyone tell me how he gets +2 even using his progression 1-1-1-2-4-8-16-32-64. Struggling to understand...

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: buffalowizard on Feb 25, 02:28 PM 2019
12210121111202112121-7 profit +2

Can anyone tell me how he gets +2 even using his progression 1-1-1-2-4-8-16-32-64. Struggling to understand...

A.

No one knows exactly how he plays and he aint tellin' , so it's fruitless.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 25, 02:46 PM 2019
The "Magic 30©" are an illusive bunch...they are hidden in the shadows, yet fully exposed under in sun simultaneously.... >:D

We'll get there.  It will take time, and thread bumps, and many eyes smarter than the two eyes typing this post to nail them down, but I do feel Winner has given enough examples that we can break it down eventually.

Rome wasn't built in a day.  All we can do is enjoy the journey, try looking at it from various angles.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 03:52 PM 2019
No one knows exactly how he plays and he aint tellin' , so it's fruitless.
Bw you won’t get it because you fail to explore what is hidden.your the type that if I gave you the the exact recipe you will say there is something still missing .sorry can’t help those who want there 🥩 cut for them
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 04:09 PM 2019
I put this deliberately under the testing thread .
Atlantis I flat on 2 s when I’m in the minus I bring in the magic 30. Progression is  124 8 16 32 64 128 I can do thi because I’ve doubled my 🏦 roll
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 25, 04:38 PM 2019
No one knows exactly how he plays and he aint tellin' , so it's fruitless.
I don’t see General giving anyone any fruit either.
Or Steve he’s not handing his stealth roulette computer.
Come on man try .
The problem with all these guys that have great ideas they let it out of the bag for all the casinos to know ,card counters / computer guys and people like Dr. Thorp .i get a kick out the Dr. Part like it’s supposed to impress me .then they all have to go covert.more work until they get caught.
I go in I sit down  I play I win I leave .I don’t work as hard as black jack players do those poor bastards and then they have to be Careful not to get banned .
The 👁 in the sky thinks I’m another dumb gambler playing roulette that’s supposed to be unbeatable. I’ll just keep milking them.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 26, 02:37 AM 2019
I put this deliberately under the testing thread .
Atlantis I flat on 2 s when I’m in the minus I bring in the magic 30. Progression is  124 8 16 32 64 128 I can do thi because I’ve doubled my 🏦 roll

Thank you for that. I see you elect to use regular martingale now due to having increased your bankroll already. Good. :)
Ok then - just how far into the minus before you decide to bring on the "magic 30" patterns + progression?  -3? - 4?
From your previous posts I suspect may be -4 - can you at least confirm that?
Or do you stay at 1unit continuing to bet until  3 or 4 successive losers in a row before switching.....?

Your result:
12210121111202112121

Seems like you would go into switch progression after the 10th or 11th result (1's)...

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 26, 07:32 AM 2019
Hello winner,

I will try to understand one of your recent results better.

I take your 18 real results + 2 zero's result below.

12210121111202112121 = 7 +2

Progression: (as you stated)

1-2-4-8-16-32-64-128

I start by betting 1u until -4 then switch to pattern containing the EARLIEST  incidence of last 4 'pair results'.

1 L-1                                                -1
2 w+1                                               0
2 w+1                                               +1
1 L-1                                                 0
0 L-1                                                -1
1 L-1                                                -2
2 w+1                                               -1
1 L-1                                                -2
1 L-1                                                -3
1 L-1                 switch to line 2        -4*   Time to start progression 1-2-4-8 etc. and switch (2111) = Pattern 2   
1 w+1                switch to line 3       -3      reset prog to 1-2-4-8 etc...
2 L-1                                                -4
0 L-2                                                -6
2 w+4                switch to line 4       -2      won so reset prog to 1-2-4-8 etc...
1 w+1                switch to line 5       -1      won so reset prog to 1-2-4-8 etc...
1 L-1                                                -2
2 w+2                switch to line 6        0       won so reset prog to 1-2-4-8 etc...
1 L-1                                                 -1
2 w+2                switch to line 7        +1     won so reset prog to 1-2-4-8 etc...
1 w+1                end of 18 results      +2     won so reset prog to 1-2-4-8 etc...

L-10; w+12; Profit = +2units.
Highest bet = 4

12210121111202112121 = 7 +2

1-12211212
2-21111222
3-11212212
4-12111112
5-22211211
6-22111211
7-12211221

The green shows earliest incidence of last 4 pair results. (line 2)
The red highlights the actual bets and selections made using the progression.

Anyhow  - this is how I arrive at same profit (+2) as you and also coincides with your results from the switch patterns - As to whether it in fact correct - I dunno... but it seems to fit the selections... ?!??  :)

Regards,
Atlantis.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 26, 12:29 PM 2019
There is someone here that has 97% but not the immortal way.congrats and hope people here find there way .check your PMS for the one who almost crack it.
Ps and please keep it for your self let others do there own work.you will appreciate more
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 26, 01:06 PM 2019
There is someone here that has 97% but not the immortal way.congrats and hope people here find there way .check your PMS for the one who almost crack it.
Ps and please keep it for your self let others do there own work.you will appreciate more

Thanks Winner, any time we get a long thread from someone doing well who's willing to share information it's appreciated. 

It doesn't matter if it's fallacy, or luck, or an actual solid method, when people share how they're playing it's both fun and educational at the same time.

Cheers to you.  :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 26, 01:17 PM 2019
Thanks Winner, any time we get a long thread from someone doing well who's willing to share information it's appreciated. 

It doesn't matter if it's fallacy, or luck, or an actual solid method, when people share how they're playing it's both fun and educational at the same time.

Cheers to you.  :)
Thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Feb 26, 01:19 PM 2019
And if one can improve this be my guest I’m open to hearing it.thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 28, 06:56 AM 2019
Hi winner,

Well in order to perhaps improve it, if it actually does need improving that is, we need to understand it first! LOL :)

It would help immensely if you could show a few more example results that clearly demonstrate how you reached the ending total + or minus.

I imagine that if in plus or less than -4 at any time during the sequence there is no need to switch to the patterns at all - so you could theoretically end a series with a small loss just flatbetting.  I suppose then you would start a new series and depending how things go may have to use switch progression during that one..?

I would like to ask: Do you have crystal clear rules on when to switch and switch back or not that you apply consistently over every session?

If not. and it is more personally subjective or of an intuitional nature or a guess, then it is going to be very difficult indeed for anybody at all to work out just exactly how you operate your method successfully.

Now, sticking to the same clear and defined rules for EVERY session may not always be advisable, I know - but I assume you have some sort of rules to cover all sorts of eventualities in the results that might occur.

Can you tell us more about WHY you are so certain about your system working -"immortally" - as long as it is operated in the correct fashion and followed to the letter.

I assume that the example I posted, even though duplicates your result, is incorrect in some ways and that I don't have the switching idea quite right.

Any info you can share will be most welcome and shine some light and point the way towards the proper and correct way to proceed.

I can see that progression is the key - I have always thought the marty you play to be a little 'dangerous' so I would probably personally adapt with a less riskier type of progression.

Best regards,
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: RayManZ on Feb 28, 09:07 AM 2019
Here is my play of a session of 36 spins. All flat bet

1   
2   W
1   L
2   W
1   L
1   L
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
2   L
1   W
2   L

I just follow what happend the last time a number appeared.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 28, 09:16 AM 2019
1   
2   W
1   L
2   W
1   L
1   L
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
1   W
2   L
1   W
2   L

Don't geddit, Raymanz. If you're following what happened last time  then how come you lost after the second 2?

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Maui13 on Feb 28, 09:31 AM 2019
Also confused AF!

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: RayManZ on Feb 28, 10:14 AM 2019
Don't geddit, Raymanz. If you're following what happened last time  then how come you lost after the second 2?

A.

Mainly because i'm an idiot and made a mistake  :sad2:. That should be a W indeed. Sorry for the confussion.

Just try it on some of the sequences already posted here.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 28, 10:49 AM 2019
Ok. Thanks RayManZ.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Feb 28, 11:22 AM 2019
Today it struck me that maybe we could use the Arithmetical Progressions from the VDW math-based theorem on 9 'pair results' somehow. This is a 'binary' game of 1's and 2's so it would apply to this EC system.
Might be necessary to no-bet or completely rule out the ones that would indicate "mutual bets" in the 7-8-9 range.
I wonder if this could be used to advantage by getting a small edge even just flatbetting? Thoughts anyone?
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: RayManZ on Feb 28, 02:12 PM 2019
1   
2   W
2   W
2   W
2   W
1   L
2   W
1   L
2   W
2   L
2   W
1   L
1   L
1   W
1   W
1   W
2   L
1   L

+3 flat bet.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Feb 28, 02:14 PM 2019
Nice Ray, where are your test numbers coming from RNG, or actual wheel spins?  Keep it up, you're hitting beyond expectation so far.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 01, 06:44 AM 2019
EXAMPLE

VDW theory applied to winner's 'pair results'

Flatbet playing AP's up to 6 results only (no mutual bets)
On a win/loss use last 2 outcomes towards tracking next AP. (Winkels idea - captures streaks)
Possibility to use progression after an L??

I use RayManZ last 2 session results:


1   
2
1
2
1 W 1-3-5
1
1 W 2-3-4
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
2 L 1-2-3
1
2
end of spins

+9




1   
2   

2   W 2-3-4
2   W 1-2-3
1   
2   
1   
2   W 1-3-5
2   
2   W 2-3-4
1   L 1-2-3
1   
1   W 3-4-5
1   W 1-2-3
1   W 1-2-3
2   L 1-2-3
1   
end of spins

+5

Any comments/help from Nicksmi most appreciated! :)

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Mar 01, 09:09 AM 2019
EXAMPLE

VDW theory applied to winner's 'pair results'

Flatbet playing AP's up to 6 results only (no mutual bets)
On a win/loss use last 2 outcomes towards tracking next AP. (Winkels idea - captures streaks)
Possibility to use progression after an L??

I use RayManZ last 2 session results:


1   
2
1
2
1 W 1-3-5
1
1 W 2-3-4
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
1 W 1-2-3
2 L 1-2-3
1
2
end of spins

+9




1   
2   

2   W 2-3-4
2   W 1-2-3
1   
2   
1   
2   W 1-3-5
2   
2   W 2-3-4
1   L 1-2-3
1   
1   W 3-4-5
1   W 1-2-3
1   W 1-2-3
2   L 1-2-3
1   
end of spins

+5

Any comments/help from Nicksmi most appreciated! :)

A.

Could you explain this in a bit more detail please I don’t really see what you are doing?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 01, 10:28 AM 2019
Hi miniroll171,

The principle is covered quite well in this topic here:

https://betselection.cc/roulette-forum/use-math-to-beat-roulettebaccarat/msg45746/#msg45746

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: miniroll171 on Mar 01, 12:12 PM 2019
Hi miniroll171,

The principle is covered quite well in this topic here:

https://betselection.cc/roulette-forum/use-math-to-beat-roulettebaccarat/msg45746/#msg45746

A.

Thanks, yeah I remember reading about this a while ago now lol.
Definitely worth trying with this system. I will do some testing over the weekend.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 01, 12:40 PM 2019
Hi miniroll171,

The principle is covered quite well in this topic here:

https://betselection.cc/roulette-forum/use-math-to-beat-roulettebaccarat/msg45746/#msg45746

A.

Atlantis, do youthink it works in long therm? I read the topic of the progression, if I could understood, would be good..  ;D
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 01, 04:47 PM 2019
Atlantis, do youthink it works in long therm? I read the topic of the progression, if I could understood, would be good..  ;D

I don't know. Maybe it better than random betting with patterns - because it math based and something that HAS to happen within 9 spins... I don't like dangerous martingale type progressions such as winner uses.
Nickmsi did a lot of testing with vdw theory and would like to hear his point of view.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Nickmsi on Mar 02, 08:25 AM 2019
Hello Atlantis,

I have attached a sheet that plays the VDW in the manner you suggested except I added an Offset to give us twice as many bets.

If you look at sheet 2 you will see some results of testing.  It won 8/10 sessions, each session being 10,000 spins.  It made a meager 416 profit flat betting. This was tested with 100,000 No Zero spins from BetVoyager.

Cheers

Nick
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Let Me Win on Mar 03, 06:08 AM 2019
Thanks Nick your excel sheets are always well made.

Could you explain please what you mean by added an offset to create more bets?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Nickmsi on Mar 03, 09:44 AM 2019
Offset simply means you can play 2 streams of Runs and Chops.

If the first 3 spins are

1-Red
2-Black
3-Black

The first Chop to be formed is Spin 1and Spin 2:  RB

If you offset the start with Spin 2 being the start then Spin 2 and Spin 3 form a Run: BB

Now you are playing 2 streams instead of 1

Cheers
Nick



Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: MoneyT101 on Mar 03, 01:25 PM 2019
I don't know. Maybe it better than random betting with patterns - because it math based and something that HAS to happen within 9 spins...

100% better then random


If you offset the start with Spin 2 being the start then Spin 2 and Spin 3 form a Run: BB

Now you are playing 2 streams instead of 1

Cheers
Nick


Very good tip Nick, hope everyone is paying attention.

I gave more info on in my last topic about this.

You can take and combine spins in a set format and the results will be the same.  Doesn’t have to come consecutively.  Maybe this will help you find what your searching for idk...

Good luck everyone!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Mar 03, 01:33 PM 2019
MoneyT you should look into this thread, the method is right up your alley.  And thanks Nick, always like to see you in a thread, wish you would participate more!  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 04, 05:49 AM 2019
Hello Atlantis,

I have attached a sheet that plays the VDW in the manner you suggested except I added an Offset to give us twice as many bets.

If you look at sheet 2 you will see some results of testing.  It won 8/10 sessions, each session being 10,000 spins.  It made a meager 416 profit flat betting. This was tested with 100,000 No Zero spins from BetVoyager.

Cheers

Nick


Thanks Nick for your chart.

I see what you mean about the "offset" stream... It's like a "bet within a bet" and gives more wagering signals. If using a progression then a lengthy losing run needs to be avoided - possibly a stop after 2 L's or something like that.
Maybe something can be noticed or gained by analysing the results of both of the streams independently to make a more effective play method overall...?

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 07, 09:20 AM 2019
Update still winning  :twisted:
But I see everyone has moved on very normal on forums
Always looking for the next flavour .
Humans get bored  pretty fast.lol
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 07, 09:31 AM 2019
Maybe I’ll make it easier for you .
I’ll present my A4 strategy this one is for elementary students it’s easier for you to learn.
Magic 30 I guess was to hard for everyone
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 07, 10:40 AM 2019
Here are the 30 "switch patterns" again updated with winner's typing amendments. Each pattern should consist of a line of 8.

1-12211212
2-21111222
3-11212212
4-12111112
5-22211211
6-22111211
7-12211221
8-21212111
9-11221211
10-22222222
11-22212221
12-22112222
13-12111122
14-11112122
15-12221121
16-12122111
17-11111112
18-11111221
19-11112222
20-22221221
21-12222122
22-11122211
23-11121222
24-22212212
25-12221121
26-22111211
27-21222122
28-11211211
29-11211111
30-22121111
These are really magic figure out when to switch damit
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 07, 12:59 PM 2019
Hers a question feel free to answer .
Does it make a difference betting against or for repeat?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: IVO on Mar 07, 01:55 PM 2019
Hi Winner, I dont want to be offensive or negative, I don´t understand how do you play it, because you don´t want to explain it , only we can make a guess, there are a lot of combinations
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 07, 02:10 PM 2019
Is like mathematician, or phisic gave you an equation, and he says, solve it if you wanna win, but there are so many conbiantions, and hidden combinations, that if we sit on this for whole life, 99% of people will not notice these hidden things, because only now the matematician man. In this case you. So people, like normally they move on,I understand them, they dont wanna Wast lf time for something they think it will not going for nowhere. Thanks Winner this strategy, I am sure this is very hard to figure it out. If you wanna help for us to reeach your level, you must teach more, becaause sooner or later everybody will move on, but you can play this for a long so no problem for you ;) :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Mar 07, 02:34 PM 2019
Hi Winner, I dont want to be offensive or negative, I don´t understand how do you play it, because you don´t want to explain it , only we can make a guess, there are a lot of combinations

Long ago I said, the viner fu.king us! :lol:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 07, 02:49 PM 2019
Update still winning  :twisted:
But I see everyone has moved on very normal on forums
Always looking for the next flavour .
Humans get bored  pretty fast.lol

I still check out this thread everyday... I'm glad to hear you're still Winning! I'm not surprised to hear the system is holding up.

Winner, I know you always start betting RUNS, however I have been using the Atlantis/Marven method to start the session. You can sometimes go through the entire 18 string session without dropping below -4. More often than not end up at +8 or so.

Winner, I'm still not 100% sure what you're doing, but in testing, I win more than I lose. Definitely not giving up on this any time soon....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 07, 03:28 PM 2019
Is like mathematician, or phisic gave you an equation, and he says, solve it if you wanna win, but there are so many conbiantions, and hidden combinations, that if we sit on this for whole life, 99% of people will not notice these hidden things, because only now the matematician man. In this case you. So people, like normally they move on,I understand them, they dont wanna Wast lf time for something they think it will not going for nowhere. Thanks Winner this strategy, I am sure this is very hard to figure it out. If you wanna help for us to reeach your level, you must teach more, becaause sooner or later everybody will move on, but you can play this for a long so no problem for you ;) :)
Magic 30  are the combos.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 07, 03:40 PM 2019
So here try this since no one answerd if it makes a difference in playing for or against a pattern . There is no difference.
There are 30 patterns I gave you.
The last 3 results are what you focus on this is how I came to this.
35000 spins I was just trying to see how it played flat betting either1s or 2 s it’s how you learn to read it .
So noI’m not just betting on 2 s or ones .Im using the 30 patterns to bet.
And playing a random game .this is roulette after all .
1 Just track your data.
2 take the last 3 results  from your data .
3 look at your magic 39 list starting from the 1 and find the first match of you first 3 results .
Please give me a 👍🏼 if you understand this far .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: hanshuckebein on Mar 07, 03:55 PM 2019
 :thumbsup:

and thanks a lot!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 07, 04:01 PM 2019
So here try this since no one answerd if it makes a difference in playing for or against a pattern . There is no difference.
There are 30 patterns I gave you.
The last 3 results are what you focus on this is how I came to this.
35000 spins I was just trying to see how it played flat betting either1s or 2 s it’s how you learn to read it .
So noI’m not just betting on 2 s or ones .Im using the 30 patterns to bet.
And playing a random game .this is roulette after all .
1 Just track your data.
2 take the last 3 results  from your data .
3 look at your magic 39 list starting from the 1 and find the first match of you first 3 results .
Please give me a 👍🏼 if you understand this far .

My results: 2 1 1 2 1 2 2 2 1 2 2 2 2

This match line two on the table: (2) 21111222
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 07, 04:17 PM 2019
My results: 2 1 1 2 1 2 2 2 1 2 2 2 2

This match line two on the table: (2) 21111222
ok good
211 is your first 3 👍🏼
Now I usually start to bet against the next five on those from #2 pattern.
When you Get a win look back at the next 3  and now how to apply the switch .
Scroll down from where you first started an look for the next 3 that matches your results  an so on . Now how simple is that play Random  with random .
Now there’s one extra step to make the decision more random and that is .when you win is it a 1 or a 2 I use
1 for  betting against and
2 bet the same to make a decision for me .
So that now it’s roulette that makes the decision right through I’m just the observer.get it.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 07, 04:28 PM 2019
Every one should watch the video on you tube on quantum physics double slit theory.i love that one because Dr Quantum explains .become the observer and things are not so random.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 07, 04:33 PM 2019
ok good
211 is your first 3 👍🏼
Now I usually start to bet against the next five on those from #2 pattern.
When you Get a win look back at the next 3  and now how to apply the switch .
Scroll down from where you first started an look for the next 3 that matches your results  an so on . Now how simple is that play Random  with random .
Now there’s one extra step to make the decision more random and that is .when you win is it a 1 or a 2 I use
1 for  betting against and
2 bet the same to make a decision for me .
So that now it’s roulette that makes the decision right through I’m just the observer.get it.

Awesome information Winner. As I say, I already win more than I lose playing this but I will apply what you have just taught. I always believed that once you started betting your list of switching patterns, you continued on with the pattern below (sequentially). I was wrong.

I will let you know how it goes. Thanks again Winner.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 07, 04:33 PM 2019
Everything comes in waves
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: IVO on Mar 07, 04:40 PM 2019
ok good
211 is your first 3 👍🏼
Now I usually start to bet against the next five on those from #2 pattern.
When you Get a win look back at the next 3  and now how to apply the switch .
Scroll down from where you first started an look for the next 3 that matches your results  an so on . Now how simple is that play Random  with random .
Now there’s one extra step to make the decision more random and that is .when you win is it a 1 or a 2 I use
1 for  betting against and
2 bet the same to make a decision for me .
So that now it’s roulette that makes the decision right through I’m just the observer.get it.

very interesting  :thumbsup:

about against and repeat: for example if you win this pattern 2 1 1 2 then next pattern you will bet for repeat, do I understand correct?  Many thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 07, 05:31 PM 2019
Thanks for the t eachings Winner.

So if I have these numbers:

1,1,2,2,2,1,1,1,1,1,

The first 3 numebr is 1 1 2. This first 3 numebr matching with line 3. The next 5 numebr is 12212, but u said, usually you bet against, so the opponent numebrs are 2 1 1 2 1. So we win in the first bet. +1, but I have a question, that if it lose, do you use progression, or you use if you at -4?

So we won, and we retrack our last 3  numbers? 1 2 2. And we again find a match with the first 3 numbers of our magic 30 from start line 1?  It is not totally clear for me.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: SWEET on Mar 08, 01:42 AM 2019
Here are the splits on runs and chops in 18 series either way.

9/9
10/8
11/7
12/6
13/5
14/4
15/3
16/2 never seen
17/1never seen
18/0 never seen

   
Hi Winner,
The limit,  of at least 3, is something to ponder!
We build a progression that can survive at least 3/18..vs., 15/18
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 08, 07:07 AM 2019
Ok Let me get this right...

We are not betting just for the 2's as before and then switching to a pattern when -4 or thereabouts anymore?

Instead we note the last 3 outcomes and we consult the patterns and find the first line where the 3 results match those outcomes. We then proceed to bet AGAINST the remaining 5 results on that line...

On a win we again check the last 3 results and find the earliest line BELOW the one we're currently on for a match. Once found we again bet FOR or AGAINST the remaining 5 results of that pattern  - depending upon whether the last win was a 1 (bet against) or a 2 (bet repeat) until another win.... then same procedure again... etc..

Yes? Ok - got it so far!

And all of this so far is flatbetting - presumably until some kind of minus situation?

So - now what happens if there is NOT a win inside 5 bets?

Do you continue to go down to start of next line or use the last 3 results to find a new pattern in which case do you increase your bets with the progression? And, because it a LOSS, do you bet FOR or AGAINST in that case on the remaining 5 of the new pattern?

As I understand it during play and betting you never go UPWARDS through the patterns only DOWNWARDS - so I presume when you've reached the last pattern (30) you begin searching again from pattern 1??? But please correct if I am wrong on that.

So you see there are still many questions and ambiguity on how to operate it - very important that everyone is following the same way for consistency in findings and results...

I would like to thank you for sharing again - but this seem different to what you were doing before - but I like the random nature of it anyhow. Good Luck.

A.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 08:55 AM 2019
ok good
211 is your first 3 👍🏼
Now I usually start to bet against the next five on those from #2 pattern.
When you Get a win look back at the next 3  and now how to apply the switch .
Scroll down from where you first started an look for the next 3 that matches your results  an so on . Now how simple is that play Random  with random .
Now there’s one extra step to make the decision more random and that is .when you win is it a 1 or a 2 I use
1 for  betting against and
2 bet the same to make a decision for me .
So that now it’s roulette that makes the decision right through I’m just the observer.get it.
Atlantis it’s all here
Progression is personal I don’t know your financial situation .
At first I used flat bet for the first 4 and theMarty. now I just use  straight Marty 124816.
And yes scroll down the list and when your at the end start from the 1
Hope that helps
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 08:57 AM 2019
Hi Winner,
The limit,  of at least 3, is something to ponder!
We build a progression that can survive at least 3/18..vs., 15/18
[/quotey
Yes this is true
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 08, 09:26 AM 2019
OK - the main thing I'd like to know and I ask again: What happens after a 5-step loss? whether it be 5-step Flat OR 5-step Progression....?
Start again? Take the last 3 results and find a new pattern below? Carry on down to next line and start from position 1?  And do we bet FOR or AGAINST the remaining 5 after a LOSS??
Sorry, I cannot find reference to that.
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 09:47 AM 2019
OK - the main thing I'd like to know and I ask again: What happens after a 5-step loss? whether it be 5-step Flat OR 5-step Progression....?
Start again? Take the last 3 results and find a new pattern below? Carry on down to next line and start from position 1?  And do we bet FOR or AGAINST the remaining 5 after a LOSS??
Sorry, I cannot find reference to that.
A.
Let me ask you a ? What would you do if you lost 5 in a row
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 08, 10:06 AM 2019
Let me ask you a ? What would you do if you lost 5 in a row

You answer a question with another question - Ok - I'll play along for awhile in the hope that you will address my enquiries...
 
Well it would depend if those were 5 1u bets - which might be recoverable....
But if it were a 5 step marti 1-2-4-8-16 I would stop  after -31    (-36 if I lost the flatbets beforehand as well)
and it CAN HAPPEN as we all know. :)

So what would you do winner? Play on or Stop? Let's say you play 5x1u bets and lose on the very first pattern?
Stop or Play on? If play on - please answer my previous post question. It not so much the financial I'm concerned with as to the correct rule of play after 5 L's in a row! That's all. You tell what to do after a win - but what if a 5-loss?
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 11:13 AM 2019
You answer a question with another question - Ok - I'll play along for awhile in the hope that you will address my enquiries...
 
Well it would depend if those were 5 1u bets - which might be recoverable....
But if it were a 5 step marti 1-2-4-8-16 I would stop  after -31    (-36 if I lost the flatbets beforehand as well)
and it CAN HAPPEN as we all know. :)

So what would you do winner? Play on or Stop? Let's say you play 5x1u bets and lose on the very first pattern?
Stop or Play on? If play on - please answer my previous post question. It not so much the financial I'm concerned with as to the correct rule of play after 5 L's in a row! That's all. You tell what to do after a win - but what if a 5-loss?
A.
LLLLL-31
But my bankroll is +3599 /1
So now you answer my ?
What happens is you fail to read .
I will repeat my self fir the last time
 Progression 1111 2481632 until your bank grows then drop the  first 3 .you should be able to grow BR before losing 10 in  a row
Stop win +4

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 11:19 AM 2019
Atlantis if you want I can share my A4 strategy this is  with a 1,2 progression
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Mar 08, 11:37 AM 2019
Winner, you sound like another graduate from the Priyanka school of roulette.

She always won too, so she said, but when asked something she would reply with "the answer is there to see" or reply with a riddle, or just answer a question with another question!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 08, 11:46 AM 2019
I say thank you Winner! I guess we have a pretty good picture of it. Now we can test and see how it goes.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 11:56 AM 2019
Winner, you sound like another graduate from the Priyanka school of roulette.

She always won too, so she said, but when asked something she would reply with "the answer is there to see" or reply with a riddle, or just answer a question with another question!
I do lose but I win more
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 11:58 AM 2019
I say thank you Winner! I guess we have a pretty good picture of it. Now we can test and see how it goes.
Hey I try casino is my enemy and my friend cause without them we can’t cant  🥛 them
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 12:11 PM 2019
Here let’s try some 🧠 games
You have 8 patterns
111.     
112
121
122
222
221
212
212
The probability for one pattern is 1/8
Take for ex .pattern
122 how many time on a continuous run will this show within 36 spins of my pairings sytem
There’s is a limited amount ,it’s up to you to find this . Once you know this all other patterns will be the same then build a system on this finding.
A4 strategy was found from this.
Tip they can’t all come out.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 12:25 PM 2019
Winner, you sound like another graduate from the Priyanka school of roulette.

She always won too, so she said, but when asked something she would reply with "the answer is there to see" or reply with a riddle, or just answer a question with another question!
Answer a question with another question is because human brain is very LAZY.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 12:31 PM 2019
🔥 FOX what is 1+1=
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Mar 08, 01:36 PM 2019
I still check this thread daily and do enjoy the riddle because eventually we'll get it. 

Thanks Winner for keeping it going, as the creator of the system I'm sure it seems frustrating that no one has gotten it, but I've had players privately give me their exact bet selection for their particular grail methods they use and it STILL takes extra questions and answers to get it right hahaha  :twisted:

Keep it up... the "answer a question with another question" routine actually made me chuckle reading through the responses today...Sherlock Holmes here is treating us like Watson, and some are bristling at it. 

People not named Winner: Don't get frustrated, treat it as something to ponder as you drink your morning coffee.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 02:07 PM 2019
I still check this thread daily and do enjoy the riddle because eventually we'll get it. 

Thanks Winner for keeping it going, as the creator of the system I'm sure it seems frustrating that no one has gotten it, but I've had players privately give me their exact bet selection for their particular grail methods they use and it STILL takes extra questions and answers to get it right hahaha  :twisted:

Keep it up... the "answer a question with another question" routine actually made me chuckle reading through the responses today...Sherlock Holmes here is treating us like Watson, and some are bristling at it. 

People not named Winner: Don't get frustrated, treat it as something to ponder as you drink your morning coffee.  :thumbsup:
Mako what fun is it when 1+1 always =2 boring
Take the Brain for ex they still can figure it out.
But they made a lot of discoveries.
Numbers Are an illusion
We are everything

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 08, 02:18 PM 2019
A Little test playing against it showed -26 after 16 spins. But of course, it's not that simple.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 08, 02:59 PM 2019
Answer a question with another question is because human brain is very LAZY.

In my opinion, a lot of this comes down to intuition....

For instance, you match your initial result  of 2 2 1 to line 6. You start betting against it. Your first bet losses, however you win with the next bet. The pattern now looks like this: 2 2 1 1 2.

You now look for the first available instance of this pattern (2 2 1 1 2.). This appears on line 12. You now bet against this pattern repeating. Your first bet here would be 1. What are the chance of making that line repeat?

This is why Winner can’t be more specific with rules.... There is a lot of intuition involved.

My opinion.....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 03:34 PM 2019
In my opinion, a lot of this comes down to intuition....

For instance, you match your initial result  of 2 2 1 to line 6. You start betting against it. Your first bet losses, however you win with the next bet. The pattern now looks like this: 2 2 1 1 2.

You now look for the first available instance of this pattern (2 2 1 1 2.). This appears on line 12. You now bet against this pattern repeating. Your first bet here would be 1. What are the chance of making that line repeat?

This is why Winner can’t be more specific with rules.... There is a lot of intuition involved.

My opinion.....
Intuition is something we all have and should you use it at all times .

Rule 1 there are none
Rule 2 never believe in any rules they only hinder your growth.
Rule 3 government make new rules every day and look at us now
Rule4 banks make s rules you have to pay interest and look at us now.
So yes winner does not not have any rules but I’m still sharing with you on how to stimulate your brain to become free of any rules.
O yes one more
Rule 5 do not ever take anything for the gospel truth.things always change even when you have set rules.
 
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 03:41 PM 2019
There’s 36/38 numbers on a wheel it’s not infinite therefore roulette has limits.
Casinos know this so they implemented table limits instead.cause they now we can beat the shit out of them , so roulette is beatable the table limits are not.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 03:43 PM 2019
Anyways spent way to much time on here have to go play a little love to  shoot the shit all day but have to go and  🥛 the 🐮.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 08, 04:05 PM 2019
LOL! Just in case there is any misunderstanding here: All I wanted to know was if you stopped (or should I say re-started after a 5 loss)
You say you can afford to do that - OK. So you take the loss and start a new game later perhaps. OR - do you immediately take the last 3 losing results from the 5 losing bets and find the next below pattern that matches and continue betting afresh using the remaining 5 results in the new pattern as you told us?
Stop or carry on? That's all I wanted an answer to!

Btw, you made a typo in your list of 8 combo's
111     
112
121
122
222
221
212
212 - should be 211

And I agree with what you said regarding these over 36 spins. Very interesting.
A
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 08, 04:25 PM 2019
111     
112
121
122
222
221
212
211

what if we add to this numbers their repeat and their opposite too, so:

111 111222
112 112221
121 121212
122 122211
222 222111
221 221112
212 212121
211 211122

This would be our betting structure, but of course we can catch one 6 losing bets too, like Winner can catch losing streaks, so the marty can kill our bankroll very ez.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 06:30 PM 2019
LOL! Just in case there is any misunderstanding here: All I wanted to know was if you stopped (or should I say re-started after a 5 loss)
You say you can afford to do that - OK. So you take the loss and start a new game later perhaps. OR - do you immediately take the last 3 losing results from the 5 losing bets and find the next below pattern that matches and continue betting afresh using the remaining 5 results in the new pattern as you told us?
Stop or carry on? That's all I wanted an answer to!

Btw, you made a typo in your list of 8 combo's
111     
112
121
122
222
221
212
212 - should be 211

And I agree with what you said regarding these over 36 spins. Very interesting.
A
I like you Atlantis Iknow your a good guy.
1111 248 16 32 64
I will begin playing this and build from there when your up in bank roll simply play 124816 if I lose 31 units and I have I will build it back start over .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 06:45 PM 2019
111     
112
121
122
222
221
212
211

what if we add to this numbers their repeat and their opposite too, so:

111 111222
112 112221
121 121212
122 122211
222 222111
221 221112
212 212121
211 211122

This would be our betting structure, but of course we can catch one 6 losing bets too, like Winner can catch losing streaks, so the marty can kill our bankroll very ez.
Ok answer me this other then a Marty what other progression can win ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 07:06 PM 2019
I remember GLC loved the guy he was in my opinion the master of progression
Had all kinds
Bottom line doesn’t matter how you slice it your grinding your self out of a hole.
Fibo
Danbert
Up as you win this is a good one try at get 2 wins in row on a consistent basis.
Parlay
Trio is interesting
But they all fail
Bottom line  .even money you lose the first how do you get your money back
Grinding or Marty  it’s all preference
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Mar 08, 07:24 PM 2019
I still check this thread daily and do enjoy the riddle because eventually we'll get it. 

Thanks Winner for keeping it going, as the creator of the system I'm sure it seems frustrating that no one has gotten it, but I've had players privately give me their exact bet selection for their particular grail methods they use and it STILL takes extra questions and answers to get it right hahaha  :twisted:

Keep it up... the "answer a question with another question" routine actually made me chuckle reading through the responses today...Sherlock Holmes here is treating us like Watson, and some are bristling at it. 

People not named Winner: Don't get frustrated, treat it as something to ponder as you drink your morning coffee.  :thumbsup:

Mako, he guesses the even chances, and uses a Martingale when he gets it wrong. So basically he's a Marty player.

There's nothing more to know.

I just hope nobody new reading this thinks the Marty is a good idea. Because it isn't. I think we have some responsibility to point that out.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 07:30 PM 2019
Mako, he guesses the even chances, and uses a Martingale when he gets it wrong. So basically he's a Marty player.

There's nothing more to know.

I just hope nobody new reading this thinks the Marty is a good idea. Because it isn't. I think we have some responsibility to point that out.
Ya go back to hurting your eyes on visuals
And how would you you bet an even money when you lose genius
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 07:43 PM 2019
Visual player are funny he say I guess and bet the Marty
Ok Sherlock what do you do when your visualization you guess and when you lose 5 in row you use progression don’t bs
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 08, 07:52 PM 2019
I remember GLC loved the guy he was in my opinion the master of progression
Had all kinds
Bottom line doesn’t matter how you slice it your grinding your self out of a hole.
Fibo
Danbert
Up as you win this is a good one try at get 2 wins in row on a consistent basis.
Parlay
Trio is interesting
But they all fail
Bottom line  .even money you lose the first how do you get your money back
Grinding or Marty  it’s all preference

You dont have to get back your money immediately
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 08:34 PM 2019
You dont have to get back your money immediately
Mister Eko shed some light on how you would bet on an even money bet
Lwllwlllllllwlllllllllllllwlllww
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Mar 08, 09:22 PM 2019
And how would you you bet an even money when you lose

I don't play even chances as a rule but I may make the odd min EC bet as cover.

When I lose, I just make another flat min bet sometime later.

On average I win half the bets and therefore I lose very little, only to the house zero edge 1.35% of my total EC action in the long run.

Whereas with a Marty, even if it came off, and I win back my unit, I would be exposing some big bets like 32, 64,128 to the house edge and losing significant amounts to zero because my total action is higher.

That's why it's a poor system.

Good article on the Marty here. You can see mathematicians reckon it's a loser.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martingale_(betting_system)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 09:27 PM 2019
I don't play even chances as a rule but I may make the odd min EC bet as cover.

When I lose, I just make another flat min bet sometime later.

On average I win half the bets and therefore I lose very little, only to the house zero edge 1.35% of my total EC action in the long run.

Whereas with a Marty, even if it came off, and I win back my unit, I would be exposing some big bets like 32, 64,128 to the house edge and losing significant amounts to zero because my total action is higher.

That's why it's a poor system.

Good article on the Marty here. You can see mathematicians reckon it's a loser.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martingale_(betting_system)
No need to post articles on maths I’m aware on how it works .
It’s only poor if you don’t no what your doing .i don’t lose a little I only win  milking the cow
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 08, 09:28 PM 2019
Mister Eko shed some light on how you would bet on an even money bet
Lwllwlllllllwlllllllllllllwlllww

After 7 loss, 1 win, and 14 loss immadiately. Dont say, that marty, or any of your prgoression can keep it to positive mate. I have in my pocket one 4 stepping bank-divisor progression, which your strategy can easily survive without betting much money, like Marty. Of course, what you linked, the Marty kills much more moeny from the bankroll ( maybe the whole bankrooll) than this divisor betting . Maybe I can share with you via PM, because you shared the basic system with me. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 09:32 PM 2019
After 7 loss, 1 win, and 14 loss immadiately. Dont say, that marty, or any of your prgoression can keep it to positive mate. I have in my pocket one 4 stepping bank-divisor progression, which your strategy can easily survive without betting much money, like Marty. Of course, what you linked, the Marty kills much more moeny from the bankroll ( maybe the whole bankrooll) than this divisor betting . Maybe I can share with you via PM, because you shared the basic system with me. :thumbsup:
I’m aware of the divisor it was created for horse racing not roulette so you can divide as much as you want it’s aslow death but you will die .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: SWEET on Mar 08, 09:44 PM 2019
Here let’s try some 🧠 games
You have 8 patterns
111.     
112
121
122
222
221
212
212
The probability for one pattern is 1/8
Take for ex .pattern
122 how many time on a continuous run will this show within 36 spins of my pairings sytem
There’s is a limited amount ,it’s up to you to find this . Once you know this all other patterns will be the same then build a system on this finding.
A4 strategy was found from this.
Tip they can’t all come out.
Hi Winner,
They, cant all come out...
Thus we could bet them like John Legend's Pattern Breaker?
As the probability of all, (the last, 8th pattern ) ,
to hit, when 7 pattern has appeared, is quite low...
And use marty to bet...7units risked...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 08, 09:47 PM 2019
I’m aware of the divisor it was created for horse racing not roulette so you can divide as much as you want it’s aslow death but you will die .

No, it can be use for even chance betting. Its more safer than martingale, I think this kind of betting would be new for 99% of members here
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: SWEET on Mar 08, 09:51 PM 2019
If we bet, follow, bet the 122..marthy...
Then...
1/7  must win..

The loser 122,
=211=-7units
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 08, 09:59 PM 2019
No, it can be use for even chance betting. Its more safer than martingale, I think this kind of betting would be new for 99% of members here
Ok
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: SWEET on Mar 09, 12:31 AM 2019
We can also bet a line of 9bet.

123456789first line
123456789second line.

Bet second line following the first line,
Lose all if 2nd line hit exactly against the first line..

eg.
111222111 first
222111222 second, lose all...

The progression, 111234567 stop at profit...lose all=32u
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 09, 05:13 AM 2019
Quote
The probability for one pattern is 1/8
Take for ex .pattern
122 how many time on a continuous run will this show within 36 spins of my pairings sytem
There’s is a limited amount ,it’s up to you to find this . Once you know this all other patterns will be the same then build a system on this finding.
A4 strategy was found from this.
Tip they can’t all come out.

36 spins=18 'pair results'

18 results = 6 'triplet patterns'

The max you could get 'continuously' from 36 real number spins with that particular combo therefore would be:

122122122122122122 = 6 TIMES

Each triplet has 1 in 8 chance of  appearing.

But looking at a couple of thousand results it seem more likely to show up only 1, 2 or 3 times...

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Mar 09, 05:24 AM 2019
It’s only poor if you don’t no what your doing.

You clearly don't know what you're doing if you are exposing bets like 32,64,and 128 to the house edge to claw back one unit.

If you must use a progression, use something like Sweet's example. It doesn't contain huge bets and thus will lose less long term.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 09, 09:04 AM 2019
You clearly don't know what you're doing if you are exposing bets like 32,64,and 128 to the house edge to claw back one unit.

If you must use a progression, use something like Sweet's example. It doesn't contain huge bets and thus will lose less long term.
Cracks me up when gamblers use the words long term .PLease define This because clearly you don’t have a clue ,is this 30 /100 years I don’t know what you mean .lol
And you have no idea on how I play in real time and when I use progression and when I don’t .so there are no rules when it come to gambling only disapline
Clearly your not an outside player so no clue why you responde to post that you don’t have experience in .
If you want me to coach you personally let me know I do have a price .and I will show how do do visuals in a better way then you know.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 09, 09:21 AM 2019
36 spins=18 'pair results'

18 results = 6 'triplet patterns'

The max you could get 'continuously' from 36 real number spins with that particular combo therefore would be:

122122122122122122 = 6 TIMES

Each triplet has 1 in 8 chance of  appearing.

But looking at a couple of thousand results it seem more likely to show up only 1, 2 or 3 times...

A.
I have 40000 result Atlantis on @ double zero haven’t experienced it not saying can never happen but at the same time I never seen 38 numbers come out In 38 spins .and I’m sure you haven’t either you been at this a long time.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 09, 11:58 AM 2019
Hi Winner,
They, cant all come out...
Thus we could bet them like John Legend's Pattern Breaker?
As the probability of all, (the last, 8th pattern ) ,
to hit, when 7 pattern has appeared, is quite low...
And use marty to bet...7units risked...
The problem with johns systems you can grow old befor you put a bet Down boring and they lose.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 09, 12:19 PM 2019
The problem with johns systems you can grow old befor you put a bet Down boring and they lose.

True. Dont use johnson progression. Try infinite divisor. Maybe I will post it later. Its in finalization now, unbeatable
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 09, 12:21 PM 2019
True. Dont use johnson progression. Try infinite divisor. Maybe I will post it later. Its in finalization now, unbeatable
Unbeatable music to my ear
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 09, 01:39 PM 2019
Quote
I have 40000 result Atlantis on @ double zero haven’t experienced it not saying can never happen but at the same time I never seen 38 numbers come out In 38 spins .and I’m sure you haven’t either you been at this a long time.

With the triplet 'pair' combos it very rare to see a pattern of 18 results with same triplet repeating SIX TIMES IN A ROW.
So one idea would be if you see last three 'pair' results are 121 (that's already 3 results of the 18) you can start by betting AGAINST it. Keep betting against 121 happening in that order every three results until a win. Then take the last 3 pair results and restart eg:

121-121-2
        LLL-w

212-22
       Lw


222-221
       LLw

221-221-21
        LLL-Lw

121-2
       w

212-212-212-1
       LLL - LLL -w

Need to use mild progression?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 09, 05:03 PM 2019
With the triplet 'pair' combos it very rare to see a pattern of 18 results with same triplet repeating SIX TIMES IN A ROW.
So one idea would be if you see last three 'pair' results are 121 (that's already 3 results of the 18) you can start by betting AGAINST it. Keep betting against 121 happening in that order every three results until a win. Then take the last 3 pair results and restart eg:

121-121-2
        LLL-w

212-22
       Lw


222-221
       LLw

221-221-21
        LLL-Lw

121-2
       w

212-212-212-1
       LLL - LLL -w

Need to use mild progression?

Great work Atlantis. Breaking it down like this shows how much potential this method has and how robust it is.

People who are conservative and don’t want to use the marty, can try the staking plan below. GLC takes the credit for this.....

The staking plan is broken down into lines. Each line is broken down into groups of five results. If at the end of five results you are in profit, you stay on the same staking level for another 5 bets. If at the end of five results you have a loss, then you increase the wager for another 5 results.

Level 1 (5 bets of 1 unit)
1          1         1          1         1     
If you finish these five results for a loss, then you increase the wager by one unit for another 5 results)

Level 2 (5 bets of 2 units)
2          2         2          2         2     

Level 3 (5 bets of 3 units)
3         3         3          3         3   

When you finish in profit at the end of 5 results, you drop a back a level.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 09, 05:09 PM 2019
Great work Atlantis. Breaking it down like this shows how much potential this method has and how robust it is.

People who are conservative and don’t want to use the marty, can try the staking plan below. GLC takes the credit for this.....

The staking plan is broken down into lines. Each line is broken down into groups of five results. If at the end of five results you are in profit, you stay on the same staking level for another 5 bets. If at the end of five results you have a loss, then you increase the wager for another 5 results.

Level 1 (5 bets of 1 unit)
1          1         1          1         1     
If you finish these five results for a loss, then you increase the wager by one unit for another 5 results)

Level 2 (5 bets of 2 units)
2          2         2          2         2     

Level 3 (5 bets of 3 units)
3         3         3          3         3   

When you finish in profit at the end of 5 results, you drop a back a level.

Quick example:

2, 2, 2 - 1
             W

2, 2, 1 - 2, 1
              L  W

1, 2, 1 - 1, 1
             L  W

5 results - W L W L W (5 bets of 1 unit)
Apply these results to the five level staking plan.

Level 1 (5 bets of 1 unit)
1          1         1          1         1         
W        L        W        L         W        +1

+1 overall. Stay on level one for another 5 bets.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 09, 06:24 PM 2019
Problem with this that only first win gives profit. Second win even, third win -1, fourth win -2 overall.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 09, 06:53 PM 2019
Quick example:

2, 2, 2 - 1
             W

2, 2, 1 - 2, 1
              L  W

1, 2, 1 - 1, 1
             L  W

5 results - W L W L W (5 bets of 1 unit)
Apply these results to the five level staking plan.

Level 1 (5 bets of 1 unit)
1          1         1          1         1         
W        L        W        L         W        +1

+1 overall. Stay on level one for another 5 bets.

More results

1, 1, 1 - 1, 2
            L  W
1, 1, 2 - 1, 2
             L W
2, 1, 2 - 1
             W

Continue Level 1 (5 bets of 1 unit)
1          1         1          1         1         
L        W        L        W         W        +1 (+2 overall)

1, 2, 1 - 1, 2, 2
             L  L  W
1, 2, 2 - 1, 1
              L W
Level 1 (5 bets of 1 unit)
1          1         1          1         1         
L        L        W          L         W        -1 (+1 overall)

2, 1, 1 - 1
             W
1, 1, 1 - 2
             W
1, 1, 2 - 1, 1, 2
             L L L
Level 2 (5 bets of 2 units)
2          2         2          2         2     
W        W        L          L.        L.    -2 (-1 overall)


1, 1, 2 - 1, 2, 1
             L W w
1, 2, 1 - 2, 2
              W L
Level 3 (5 bets of 2 units)
3          3         3          3         3     
L        W        W          W        L    +3 (+2 overall)

Wow! It’s a grind....!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 09, 06:57 PM 2019
Problem with this that only first win gives profit. Second win even, third win -1, fourth win -2 overall.

You just take it one line at a time. If you loose one line you move to the next line etc.....

It’s a grind though!!!

Please share the divisor method and we can give it a test. Thanks 😊
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: SWEET on Mar 09, 09:30 PM 2019
We could even ' filtered' the 18result into half, to 9results.
Say..
For easy visual, first 9results=1, last remaining=2
18 results=
111111111.222222222

That will become...
111111111(above)
222222222(below)

Then if bet against=win all 9spins,
If follow=lose all...

121212121above
212121212below...against=win all, follow=lose all.

111222111
222111222...same win all , lose all

THE MAIN POINT=just nine spins, easy to play, with marthy...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: SWEET on Mar 09, 09:37 PM 2019
We could also wait for, the perceived LIMIT, of only 3hit/18 results.

If first 9decision, has no hit, then there COULD  be 3hit in next 9decisions.

If only 1hit, then there be 2/9
If only 2hit, then 1/9
If 3hit, then no bet...
What you think?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: SWEET on Mar 09, 09:57 PM 2019
36 spins=18 'pair results'

18 results = 6 'triplet patterns'

The max you could get 'continuously' from 36 real number spins with that particular combo therefore would be:

122122122122122122 = 6 TIMES

Each triplet has 1 in 8 chance of  appearing.

But looking at a couple of thousand results it seem more likely to show up only 1, 2 or 3 times...

A.

Atlantis,
If we dont want to wait for 3 same triplet,
We could play against any first three triplet...

eg.
First 9spins=three sets of triplet..

111, 222, 111=first three.
222, 111, 222=last three, win all if play against...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: The General on Mar 09, 10:04 PM 2019
Why must you wait?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: SWEET on Mar 09, 11:33 PM 2019
Why must you wait?
Because, we bet the last three wont duplicate the first three, as we bet against...
Or if bet follow,then, the last three wont hit reversal.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 09, 11:47 PM 2019
We could also wait for, the perceived LIMIT, of only 3hit/18 results.

If first 9decision, has no hit, then there COULD  be 3hit in next 9decisions.

If only 1hit, then there be 2/9
If only 2hit, then 1/9
If 3hit, then no bet...
What you think?

Hi Sweet

I think you need to give it a test! Please let us know how it goes.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: SWEET on Mar 10, 12:38 AM 2019
Hi Sweet

I think you need to give it a test! Please let us know how it goes.
Unfortunately, I am computer dumb....

Waiting for 0/9, 1/9, 2/9, will be a longggggggg wait...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Madi on Mar 10, 01:38 AM 2019
Why must you wait?

This will help you to get some free point for free car parking or get a drink.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 10, 03:13 AM 2019
Unfortunately, I am computer dumb....

Waiting for 0/9, 1/9, 2/9, will be a longggggggg wait...

Me too. I manually test everything!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 10, 07:15 AM 2019
Hi jono,

I call that progression the "best of five" - but better if you reset the count back to 1 ANYTIME you get level or ahead, so use it as a "gr8player five" instead. However - it still can be a grind! LOL :)

I extend my thought to bet AGAINST any triplet of 3 as before but this time only when one has shown up TWICE in succession.
This happens much more frequently than you would think and there are 8 patterns to watch for...
For example:

111111121221111212    =LW

211211222212122111    =LW

121121221111212122     =W

222222221222112211     =LLW

122122111111112212     =LW

Red shows the repeating triplets. Bold shows the W's

:)

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: IVO on Mar 10, 08:53 AM 2019
1 2 2   1 2 2   1 2 2
1 1 1   1 1 2   1 1 1   = +1
1 1 2   1 2 2   1 1 2  = -3
2 2 2   2 2 1   2 2 2  = +3
1 1 1   1 2 2   1 1 2  = +4
2 2 1   2 1 1   1 2 1  = +5
1 2 1   1 1 1   1 2 1  = -5
1 1 2   2 2 2   2 2 2  = +5
2 1 1   1 2 1   1 2 2 = +1
2 2 2   2 1 2   1 1 1 = +4       
1 2 2   1 2 2   2 2 1 = +1
total: + 16     flat bet
--------------------------------
2 1 1   2 1 1   2 1 1
1 1 2   2 2 1   2 2 1   = -1   
2 2 1   1 2 2   1 2 1   = +3   
1 1 1   2 2 2   1 1 2   = +1   
2 1 2   1 1 2   1 2 1   = +3   
1 1 2   2 2 2   2 2 2   = +1   
2 2 2   2 2 1   1 1 2   = +1   
1 1 1   1 1 1   2 1 2   = +3   
1 2 2   2 2 2   1 2 2   = +5   
1 1 2   1 1 1   2 1 1   = +3   
1 1 2   2 2 1   2 1 1   = -5   
total: + 14 flat bet
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 10, 09:35 AM 2019
1 2 2   1 2 2   1 2 2
1 1 1   1 1 2   1 1 1   = +1
1 1 2   1 2 2   1 1 2  = -3
2 2 2   2 2 1   2 2 2  = +3
1 1 1   1 2 2   1 1 2  = +4
2 2 1   2 1 1   1 2 1  = +5
1 2 1   1 1 1   1 2 1  = -5
1 1 2   2 2 2   2 2 2  = +5
2 1 1   1 2 1   1 2 2 = +1
2 2 2   2 1 2   1 1 1 = +4       
1 2 2   1 2 2   2 2 1 = +1
total: + 16     flat bet
--------------------------------
2 1 1   2 1 1   2 1 1
1 1 2   2 2 1   2 2 1   = -1   
2 2 1   1 2 2   1 2 1   = +3   
1 1 1   2 2 2   1 1 2   = +1   
2 1 2   1 1 2   1 2 1   = +3   
1 1 2   2 2 2   2 2 2   = +1   
2 2 2   2 2 1   1 1 2   = +1   
1 1 1   1 1 1   2 1 2   = +3   
1 2 2   2 2 2   1 2 2   = +5   
1 1 2   1 1 1   2 1 1   = +3   
1 1 2   2 2 1   2 1 1   = -5   
total: + 14 flat bet

How do you play it IVO?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Shogun on Mar 10, 09:44 AM 2019
How do you play it IVO?

Looks to me like he is betting against the line above.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: IVO on Mar 10, 09:48 AM 2019
Looks to me like he is betting against the line above.
yes, you are right, against the line above  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Shogun on Mar 10, 09:50 AM 2019
yes, you are right, against the line above  :thumbsup:

Very nice 😊 flat betting too 👍
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 10, 09:56 AM 2019
Nice! Thank you. Needs more testing of course, but looks good.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 10, 09:57 AM 2019
Ivo,

Good results flatbetting there using winners idea of bet opposite last 9. :)

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 10, 11:24 AM 2019
1,1,W 1
2,2,l -2 2/4
2,1,w 0 1/2
1,1,l -3 2/4
1,1,w -1
1,1,w 1 1/2
1,2,w 2
1,2,w 3
0,1,w 4
1,2,w 5
1,2,w 6
2,1,w 7
2,2,l 4 2/4
2,1,w 6 1/2
2,2,w 7
2,2,w 8
2,2,w 9
1,2,w 10
1,1,l 7 2/4
2,0,l 1 3/6
1,2,w 4
1,2,w 7 2/4
1,1,W 9 1/2
1,1,w 10
2,1,w 11
2,2,l 8 2/4
2,1,w 10 1/2
2,2,w 11
1,2,w 12
1,2,w 13
1,1,l 10 2/4
1,1,W 12 1/2
2,2,l 9 2/4
1,1,l 3 3/6
2,1,w 6
1,1,w 9 2/4
2,2,l 3 3/6
2,1,w 6
1,1,l  -3 4/8
2,1,w 1
1,1,w 5 3/6
2,2,l -4 4/8
2,1,w 0
2,2,w 4 3/6
1,2,w 7
1,2,w 10 2/4
2,1,W 12 1/2
2,2,w 13
2,2,w 14
1,1,L 11 2/4
1,1,w 13 1/2
1,1,w 14
2,1,w 15
1,2,w 16
2,1,w 17
1,2,w 18
1,2,w 19
1,2,w 20
2,1,w 21
1,1,w 22
2,1,w 23
1,1,w 24
0,1,w 25
2,2,l  22 2/4
1,1,l 18 3/6
1,2,w 21 2/4
1,1,w 23
2,2,l 4 17 3/6
2,1,W 5 20
1,2,w 6 23 2/4
1,1,l 3 17 3/6
2,1,w 20

Profit: +20u
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 10, 11:56 AM 2019
1,1,W 1
2,2,l -2 2/4
2,1,w 0 1/2
1,1,l -3 2/4
1,1,w -1
1,1,w 1 1/2
1,2,w 2
1,2,w 3
0,1,w 4
1,2,w 5
1,2,w 6
2,1,w 7
2,2,l 4 2/4
2,1,w 6 1/2
2,2,w 7
2,2,w 8
2,2,w 9
1,2,w 10
1,1,l 7 2/4
2,0,l 1 3/6
1,2,w 4
1,2,w 7 2/4
1,1,W 9 1/2
1,1,w 10
2,1,w 11
2,2,l 8 2/4
2,1,w 10 1/2
2,2,w 11
1,2,w 12
1,2,w 13
1,1,l 10 2/4
1,1,W 12 1/2
2,2,l 9 2/4
1,1,l 3 3/6
2,1,w 6
1,1,w 9 2/4
2,2,l 3 3/6
2,1,w 6
1,1,l  -3 4/8
2,1,w 1
1,1,w 5 3/6
2,2,l -4 4/8
2,1,w 0
2,2,w 4 3/6
1,2,w 7
1,2,w 10 2/4
2,1,W 12 1/2
2,2,w 13
2,2,w 14
1,1,L 11 2/4
1,1,w 13 1/2
1,1,w 14
2,1,w 15
1,2,w 16
2,1,w 17
1,2,w 18
1,2,w 19
1,2,w 20
2,1,w 21
1,1,w 22
2,1,w 23
1,1,w 24
0,1,w 25
2,2,l  22 2/4
1,1,l 18 3/6
1,2,w 21 2/4
1,1,w 23
2,2,l 4 17 3/6
2,1,W 5 20
1,2,w 6 23 2/4
1,1,l 3 17 3/6
2,1,w 20

Profit: +20u
👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 10, 11:57 AM 2019
1 2 2   1 2 2   1 2 2
1 1 1   1 1 2   1 1 1   = +1
1 1 2   1 2 2   1 1 2  = -3
2 2 2   2 2 1   2 2 2  = +3
1 1 1   1 2 2   1 1 2  = +4
2 2 1   2 1 1   1 2 1  = +5
1 2 1   1 1 1   1 2 1  = -5
1 1 2   2 2 2   2 2 2  = +5
2 1 1   1 2 1   1 2 2 = +1
2 2 2   2 1 2   1 1 1 = +4       
1 2 2   1 2 2   2 2 1 = +1
total: + 16     flat bet
--------------------------------
2 1 1   2 1 1   2 1 1
1 1 2   2 2 1   2 2 1   = -1   
2 2 1   1 2 2   1 2 1   = +3   
1 1 1   2 2 2   1 1 2   = +1   
2 1 2   1 1 2   1 2 1   = +3   
1 1 2   2 2 2   2 2 2   = +1   
2 2 2   2 2 1   1 1 2   = +1   
1 1 1   1 1 1   2 1 2   = +3   
1 2 2   2 2 2   1 2 2   = +5   
1 1 2   1 1 1   2 1 1   = +3   
1 1 2   2 2 1   2 1 1   = -5   
total: + 14 flat bet
👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 10, 12:21 PM 2019
This is a short RX test. RX is very random, will it go better with real spins?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 10, 12:22 PM 2019
1,1,W 1
2,2,l -2 2/4
2,1,w 0 1/2
1,1,l -3 2/4
1,1,w -1
1,1,w 1 1/2
1,2,w 2
1,2,w 3
0,1,w 4
1,2,w 5
1,2,w 6
2,1,w 7
2,2,l 4 2/4
2,1,w 6 1/2
2,2,w 7
2,2,w 8
2,2,w 9
1,2,w 10
1,1,l 7 2/4
2,0,l 1 3/6
1,2,w 4
1,2,w 7 2/4
1,1,W 9 1/2
1,1,w 10
2,1,w 11
2,2,l 8 2/4
2,1,w 10 1/2
2,2,w 11
1,2,w 12
1,2,w 13
1,1,l 10 2/4
1,1,W 12 1/2
2,2,l 9 2/4
1,1,l 3 3/6
2,1,w 6
1,1,w 9 2/4
2,2,l 3 3/6
2,1,w 6
1,1,l  -3 4/8
2,1,w 1
1,1,w 5 3/6
2,2,l -4 4/8
2,1,w 0
2,2,w 4 3/6
1,2,w 7
1,2,w 10 2/4
2,1,W 12 1/2
2,2,w 13
2,2,w 14
1,1,L 11 2/4
1,1,w 13 1/2
1,1,w 14
2,1,w 15
1,2,w 16
2,1,w 17
1,2,w 18
1,2,w 19
1,2,w 20
2,1,w 21
1,1,w 22
2,1,w 23
1,1,w 24
0,1,w 25
2,2,l  22 2/4
1,1,l 18 3/6
1,2,w 21 2/4
1,1,w 23
2,2,l 4 17 3/6
2,1,W 5 20
1,2,w 6 23 2/4
1,1,l 3 17 3/6
2,1,w 20

Profit: +20u

I don't understand this betting method? What means 1/2, 2/4...?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 10, 12:49 PM 2019
Hi IVO,

I test some Opposite 9's sessions too:

212122221
222121121  -3
121222212  +5
222122112  -1
112112212  -1
211221211  +3
112222222  +1
221121212  +3
111112222  +1
121112221  -5
112121122  +3
==========
total = +6

121111112
221122211   +1
111111222    +3
221222111   +7
222112212   +1
212211121   +3
221111111    -1
111121111    -3
222221112   +1
112112122   +3
212112221   -3
========
total = +12

112111121
221222121     +3
221211221     -3
211111112      +1
121122122     +1
221212211     +3
221121122     +3
122212112     +3
111112212     +1
212122122    +1
111221121     +1
========
total = +14

222221221
111122111      +5
221122221      -1
211221122      +1
112211222      -1
222122111     +7
211121121      -1
111211121      -3
221211212     +1
111121111      +3
121222212     +1
=========
total = +12


112211221
212111211       -3
121221211       +1
112222122       +3
211122121        -1
111122121        -7
221211221       +3
222122222       +1
211122122        -4
122122121        -1
212121222        +1
========
total = -7


111122112       
112112111         -3
111222221         +1
221111122         +5
211222111         +3
211211222         +1
212122111         +5
121211112         +5
212222211         +5
111112212         +2
221222111         +3
========
total = +31


+67 flatbet   :)

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 10, 12:55 PM 2019
Hi IVO,

I test some Opposite 9's sessions too:

212122221
222121121  -3
121222212  +5
222122112  -1
112112212  -1
211221211  +3
112222222  +1
221121212  +3
111112222  +1
121112221  -5
112121122  +3
==========
total = +6

121111112
221122211   +1
111111222    +3
221222111   +7
222112212   +1
212211121   +3
221111111    -1
111121111    -3
222221112   +1
112112122   +3
212112221   -3
========
total = +12

112111121
221222121     +3
221211221     -3
211111112      +1
121122122     +1
221212211     +3
221121122     +3
122212112     +3
111112212     +1
212122122    +1
111221121     +1
========
total = +14

222221221
111122111      +5
221122221      -1
211221122      +1
112211222      -1
222122111     +7
211121121      -1
111211121      -3
221211212     +1
111121111      +3
121222212     +1
=========
total = +12


112211221
212111211       -3
121221211       +1
112222122       +3
211122121        -1
111122121        -7
221211221       +3
222122222       +1
211122122        -4
122122121        -1
212121222        +1
========
total = -7


111122112       
112112111         -3
111222221         +1
221111122         +5
211222111         +3
211211222         +1
212122111         +5
121211112         +5
212222211         +5
111112212         +2
221222111         +3
========
total = +31


+67 flatbet   :)

A.
Nice results
A
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: IVO on Mar 10, 01:11 PM 2019
Hi Atlantis
great job  :smile: , many thanks to Winner  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 10, 01:16 PM 2019
I don't understand this betting method? What means 1/2, 2/4...?

First bet unit size/second bet unit size
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 10, 01:19 PM 2019
Hi IVO,

I test some Opposite 9's sessions too:

212122221
222121121  -3
121222212  +5
222122112  -1
112112212  -1
211221211  +3
112222222  +1
221121212  +3
111112222  +1
121112221  -5
112121122  +3
==========
total = +6

121111112
221122211   +1
111111222    +3
221222111   +7
222112212   +1
212211121   +3
221111111    -1
111121111    -3
222221112   +1
112112122   +3
212112221   -3
========
total = +12

112111121
221222121     +3
221211221     -3
211111112      +1
121122122     +1
221212211     +3
221121122     +3
122212112     +3
111112212     +1
212122122    +1
111221121     +1
========
total = +14

222221221
111122111      +5
221122221      -1
211221122      +1
112211222      -1
222122111     +7
211121121      -1
111211121      -3
221211212     +1
111121111      +3
121222212     +1
=========
total = +12


112211221
212111211       -3
121221211       +1
112222122       +3
211122121        -1
111122121        -7
221211221       +3
222122222       +1
211122122        -4
122122121        -1
212121222        +1
========
total = -7


111122112       
112112111         -3
111222221         +1
221111122         +5
211222111         +3
211211222         +1
212122111         +5
121211112         +5
212222211         +5
111112212         +2
221222111         +3
========
total = +31


+67 flatbet   :)

A.

I think the last session was +27, but nice results too, maybe this is the best way to play this? 🤔
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Mar 10, 02:11 PM 2019
Winner/Atlantis/Eko/IVO/Sweet, very nice, excellent work in this thread   :love:

You basically have improved on the myriad of methods similar to Pattern Breaker that we've seen over the years (nearly all of which always came in a -2.6% EV under my testing on 0 wheels, they hit exactly where it should no matter what I did with them) and gotten it to the point where it would be extremely difficult for the wheel to beat you.

I could see this going for a large span of time/spins before the raindrops finally hit you, and by then as Winner described, you're so far ahead in terms of total BR that you could endure countless loss sessions even on a -5.3% 00 wheel while still being in profit.

Impressive, good job guys, and thanks to Winner for validating it through robust testing and then sharing the results with us.  :thumbsup:

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 10, 02:19 PM 2019
Looks like there is a difference between RX spins and real spins. I don't have the chart but a short test showed +11. Will test it more.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 10, 02:28 PM 2019
I'm not sure how to handle the zero. Taken it as a miss and add two new numbers as 1 or 2?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 10, 02:51 PM 2019
1,1,2, 2,2,1, 1,1,1,
1,1,1, 1,2,1, 2,0,1,1, -3
2,1,2, 2,1,2, 2,2,1, +3
2,2,2, 2,2,2, 1,2,1, -3
1,2,0,1, 2,1,2, 1,1,1, -1
1,2,1, 2,2,2, 1,2,2, -3
1,2,1, 2,1,1, 1,1,2, -3
2,1,1, 2,1,1, 1,2,2, -3
2,1,1, 1,2,1, 1,1,2, -3
2,2,1, 2,2,1, 2,1,2, -3
2,1,2, 2,2,2, 1,1,1, +1 (-18)

1,1,1, 2,1,1, 2,2,1,
1,2,1, 2,1,2, 2,1,1, -3
1,2,1, 1,1,0,1, 2,2,1, -3
1,1,2, 1,1,2, 2,2,1, -3
1,2,1, 1,2,1, 1,1,1, +3
1,2,2, 1,1,2, 1,2,1, -1
1,1,2, 1,2,1, 1,2,1, -3
2,1,1, 1,1,1, 1,1,1, -1
1,2,2, 1,2,1, 2,2,2, +5
2,1,1, 1,1,1, 1,2,2, +1
1,1,2, 1,1,1, 2,2,1, -1 (-6)

1,2,1, 1,2,1, 1,2,1,
0,1,2,2, 1,1,1, 0,1,1,2, -1
1,2,2, 1,1,1, 0,1,2,2, -7
2,0,0,1,2, 2,2,2, 2,2,1, +5
2,2,1, 1,1,2, 2,1,1, +1
2,1,2, 1,2,1, 2,2,1, +1
1,1,2, 2,2,2, 1,1,1, +1
2,1,1, 2,2,1, 2,2,1, +1
1,1,2, 2,1,2, 2,1,2, +3
2,2,2, 2,2,1, 1,1,1, +3
2,2,2, 1,1,1, 2,2,2, +1 (+8)

Overall: -16

I not saw 1 line become similar like other line, we expected to see 1 win for 90%. We can ride your lines with progression, to not become a bigger loss, like -5, or -7, because we have 0 too, you know, and NOT JUST 1 AND 2. I
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 10, 03:20 PM 2019
Another spins:

2,2,1, 1,2,1, 1,1,1,
2,2,1, 1,1,2, 2,2,1, -1
1,2,2, 1,2,1, 2,1,2, +3
2,2,2, 1,1,1, 1,1,2, -3
1,2,2, 1,1,2, 2,1,1, -1
2,1,1, 0,1,1,0,1, 1,0,1,1, +1
1,2,2, 0,1,2,2, 1,1,1, +1
1,2,2, 1,2,1, 2,1,2, -3
1,1,2, 1,1,1, 2,1,0,0,1, -3
2,0,1,2, 1,1,2, 1,2,1, -1
1,1,1, 2,2,2, 1,1,2, +3 (-4)

2,2,2, 2,2,1, 1,1,1,
2,1,1, 2,2,2, 2,1,1, -1
2,1,2, 1,2,2, 1,1,1, -3
2,1,1, 1,2,1, 2,2,2, +1
2,2,2, 2,1,2, 2,2,2, +1
2,1,2, 1,1,2, 1,2,1, -1
2,1,2, 2,0,0,1,2, 1,1,1, -5
1,1,1, 2,1,2, 2,2,2, +1
1,2,1, 1,1,2, 2,1,1, -1
1,2,2, 2,2,2, 2,2,1, -1
0,1,1,2, 1,1,2, 1,1,2, +3 (-6)

1,1,1, 1,2,1, 2,1,2,
1,2,2, 2,2,2, 2,1,2, -1
1,2,1, 1,2,2, 1,2,2, -1
2,1,1, 1,2,2, 2,2,2, -3
1,2,0,1, 2,1,0,1, 1,1,1, +7
2,1,2, 1,2,1, 1,1,2, +3
2,1,1, 1,2,1, 1,2,1, -3
1,2,1, 2,2,1, 1,2,2, -1
1,1,1, 1,1,1, 2,2,1, +1
2,2,2, 1,2,1, 1,2,2, +3
2,2,1, 1,1,1, 0,1,2,2, -5 (+0)

Overall: -10
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 10, 03:43 PM 2019
Hi Mister Eko,

I use your results and play only after 2 SAME 'triplets' until a win.
(Could use mild progression; "best of 5" has been suggested)
If necessary I carry on betting from beginning of next line.
I stripped out the 0's for clarity and they don't affect things too much.

1,1,2, 2,2,1, 1,1,1,
1,1,1, 1,2,1, 2,1,1, Lw
2,1,2, 2,1,2, 2,2,1, Lw
2,2,2, 2,2,2, 1,2,1, w
1,2,1, 2,1,2, 1,1,1,
1,2,1, 2,2,2, 1,2,2,
1,2,1, 2,1,1, 1,1,2,
2,1,1, 2,1,1, 1,2,2,  w
2,1,1, 1,2,1, 1,1,2,
2,2,1, 2,2,1, 2,1,2,  Lw
2,1,2, 2,2,2, 1,1,1,  Lw
1,1,1, 2,1,1, 2,2,1,  w
1,2,1, 2,1,2, 2,1,1,
1,2,1, 1,1,1, 2,2,1,
1,1,2, 1,1,2, 2,2,1,  w
1,2,1, 1,2,1, 1,1,1,  Lw
1,2,2, 1,1,2, 1,2,1,
1,1,2, 1,2,1, 1,2,1,
2,1,1, 1,1,1, 1,1,1,
1,2,2, 1,2,1, 2,2,2, Lw
2,1,1, 1,1,1, 1,2,2,
1,1,2, 1,1,1, 2,2,1,
1,2,1, 1,2,1, 1,2,1, LLL
1,2,2, 1,1,1, 1,1,2, Lw
1,2,2, 1,1,1, 1,2,2,
2,1,2, 2,2,2, 2,2,1,
2,2,1, 1,1,2, 2,1,1, w
2,1,2, 1,2,1, 2,2,1,
1,1,2, 2,2,2, 1,1,1,
2,1,1, 2,2,1, 2,2,1,
1,1,2, 2,1,2, 2,1,2, w
2,2,2, 2,2,1, 1,1,1, Lw
2,2,2, 1,1,1, 2,2,2,

But the better way to play against the repeats would be to track all results vertically or horizontally and commence betting as soon as you see a repeat of ANY triplet.
A
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 10, 03:45 PM 2019
Hi jono,

I call that progression the "best of five" - but better if you reset the count back to 1 ANYTIME you get level or ahead, so use it as a "gr8player five" instead. However - it still can be a grind! LOL :)

I extend my thought to bet AGAINST any triplet of 3 as before but this time only when one has shown up TWICE in succession.
This happens much more frequently than you would think and there are 8 patterns to watch for...
For example:

111111121221111212    =LW

211211222212122111    =LW

121121221111212122     =W

222222221222112211     =LLW

122122111111112212     =LW

Red shows the repeating triplets. Bold shows the W's

:)

A.
.

The ‘best of five progression’. Thanks Atlantis.  It’s a very safe way of betting but you need patience.

I like your idea of betting against a pattern that appears twice. Another good strategy.

Thanks Atlantis
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 10, 03:52 PM 2019
Hi IVO,

I test some Opposite 9's sessions too:

+67 flatbet   :)

A.

Great job Atlantis! Love the flatbet.... 😊
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 10, 03:55 PM 2019
.

The ‘best of five progression’. Thanks Atlantis.  It’s a very safe way of betting but you need patience.

I like your idea of betting against a pattern that appears twice. Another good strategy.

Thanks Atlantis

Hi Jono - well winner said he had 40,000 results and had not seen a triplet hit 6 times in succession over 36 spins (18 'pair' results)

112-112-112-112-112-112  - very rare, not seen yet, but *could occur*

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 10, 05:23 PM 2019
Hi Jono - well winner said he had 40,000 results and had not seen a triplet hit 6 times in succession over 36 spins (18 'pair' results)

112-112-112-112-112-112  - very rare, not seen yet, but *could occur*

A.

Its okay atlantis, but I see that very rare to bet, somewhere in your example I saw 3 line to miss betting, its 3x9 27 bets, equals 54 spins to miss!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 11, 02:00 AM 2019
Hi Jono - well winner said he had 40,000 results and had not seen a triplet hit 6 times in succession over 36 spins (18 'pair' results)

112-112-112-112-112-112  - very rare, not seen yet, but *could occur*

A.

Thanks Atlantis, that’s some very handy information to have.

Anyway, for testing, I have decided to go with the ‘betting against’ approach.

Winners method using the ‘Best of Five’ staking (Test series).

Procedure: I am betting the opposite of 10 spins (2x best of five staking).

2    1    2    2    1    2    1    2    1     1
1    2    1     1    2    1    1    1     1     1
W W  W    W  W   W  L   W    L     L
Spins 1-10, all level 1 bets.
(+4)

1    2    1    1     2    1    1     1    1     1
2   2    2    1     1    2    1     1    2    2
W  L   W   L    W   W   L    L    L    W
Spins 11-15, level 2 bets. Spins 16-20,  level 1 bets.
(+1)

2    2    1    1    2     1     2     2     1     2   
L    L   W   L   W    W   W    W    L     L
Spins 21-25, level 2 bets. Spins 26-28, level 3 bets. Spins 29-30, level 1 bets (I was halfway through level 3, but I hit a high and so reset to level 1).
(+5)

2    2    1    1    2    1    2    2    1     2
2    1    1    2    1    2    2    2    1     2
L   W   L    W  W   W  L     L    L     L
Spins 31-40, all level 1 bets.
(-2)

2    1    1    2    1    2    2    2    1     2
2    2   1    2    2    1     2    2    2    1
L   W   L   L    W   W   L    L    W   W
Spins 41-45, level 2 bets. Spins 46-50,  level 3 bets.
(+1)

2    2   1    2    2    1     2    2    2    1
2    2   1    1     1    2     2    2    2    1
L    L   L   W   W  W    L    L     L    L
Spins 51-55, level 1 bets. Spin 56, level 2 bet (new high). Spins 57-60,  level 1 bets.
(-3)

2    2   1    1     1    2     2    2    2    1
2    2   1    2     1    2    2    1    1    1
L    L   L   W    L    L   W   W  W   L
Spins 61-65, level 2 bets. Spins 66-70,  level 3 bets.
(-9)

2    2   1    2     1    2    2    1    1    1
1    1    1    1     1     1    1    2    1    2
W  W  L   W   L    W   W   W  L   W
Spins 71-75, level 4 bets. Spins 76-80,  level 3 bets.
(+13)

1    1    1    1    1     1    1    2    1     2
2   2    2   2    1     1    2   1     2    2
W W  W  W   L    L    W  W   W  L
Spins 81-90, all level 1 bets.
(+4)

2   2    2   2    1     1    2   1     2    2
2   1    2    2    2    1    2   2    1     2
L   W  L    L    W   L  W   W  W    L
Spins 91-95, level 1 bets. Spins 96-100,  level 2 bets.
(+1)
————————
Total = +15
————————
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 11, 05:53 AM 2019
Thanks Atlantis, that’s some very handy information to have.

Anyway, for testing, I have decided to go with the ‘betting against’ approach.

Winners method using the ‘Best of Five’ staking (Test series).

Procedure: I am betting the opposite of 10 spins (2x best of five staking).

2    1    2    2    1    2    1    2    1     1
1    2    1     1    2    1    1    1     1     1
W W  W    W  W   W  L   W    L     L
Spins 1-10, all level 1 bets.
(+4)

1    2    1    1     2    1    1     1    1     1
2   2    2    1     1    2    1     1    2    2
W  L   W   L    W   W   L    L    L    W
Spins 11-15, level 2 bets. Spins 16-20,  level 1 bets.
(+1)

2    2    1    1    2     1     2     2     1     2   
L    L   W   L   W    W   W    W    L     L
Spins 21-25, level 2 bets. Spins 26-28, level 3 bets. Spins 29-30, level 1 bets (I was halfway through level 3, but I hit a high and so reset to level 1).
(+5)

2    2    1    1    2    1    2    2    1     2
2    1    1    2    1    2    2    2    1     2
L   W   L    W  W   W  L     L    L     L
Spins 31-40, all level 1 bets.
(-2)

2    1    1    2    1    2    2    2    1     2
2    2   1    2    2    1     2    2    2    1
L   W   L   L    W   W   L    L    W   W
Spins 41-45, level 2 bets. Spins 46-50,  level 3 bets.
(+1)

2    2   1    2    2    1     2    2    2    1
2    2   1    1     1    2     2    2    2    1
L    L   L   W   W  W    L    L     L    L
Spins 51-55, level 1 bets. Spin 56, level 2 bet (new high). Spins 57-60,  level 1 bets.
(-3)

2    2   1    1     1    2     2    2    2    1
2    2   1    2     1    2    2    1    1    1
L    L   L   W    L    L   W   W  W   L
Spins 61-65, level 2 bets. Spins 66-70,  level 3 bets.
(-9)

2    2   1    2     1    2    2    1    1    1
1    1    1    1     1     1    1    2    1    2
W  W  L   W   L    W   W   W  L   W
Spins 71-75, level 4 bets. Spins 76-80,  level 3 bets.
(+13)

1    1    1    1    1     1    1    2    1     2
2   2    2   2    1     1    2   1     2    2
W W  W  W   L    L    W  W   W  L
Spins 81-90, all level 1 bets.
(+4)

2   2    2   2    1     1    2   1     2    2
2   1    2    2    2    1    2   2    1     2
L   W  L    L    W   L  W   W  W    L
Spins 91-95, level 1 bets. Spins 96-100,  level 2 bets.
(+1)
————————
Total = +15
————————

Nice testing Jono! But what means level 1, 1 unit, level 2, 2 units?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 11, 06:14 AM 2019
1,1,2, 2,2,1, 1,1,1,
1,1,1, 1,2,1, 2,1,1, Lw
2,1,2, 2,1,2, 2,2,1, Lw
Hi Atlantis, i like your idea, just for clarification please confirm that i have got it  right:   
HL,LH,LL, HH,LL,HL, LH,HL,HL
HL,LH,HL, HL,HH,LH, LL,HL,HL
LL,LH,HH, HH,LH,LL, HH,HH,LH.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 11, 06:26 AM 2019
Nice testing Jono! But what means level 1, 1 unit, level 2, 2 units?

No worries Boyd, it’s called  ‘Best of Five’ strategy. See instructions below....

The staking plan is broken down into lines. Each line consists of groups of five results. If at the end of five results you have a loss, you move to the next level for another 5 bets. If you are in profit, you go down a line.

Level 1 (5 bets of 1 unit)
1          1         1          1         1     
If you finish these five results for a loss, then you move to the next line.

Level 2 (5 bets of 2 units)
2          2         2          2         2     

Level 3 (5 bets of 3 units)
3         3         3          3         3   

When you finish in profit at the end of 5 results, you drop a back a level. However, use your discretion. If you are in profit and you haven’t finished the line, you can drop back anyway. Use your judgement.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 11, 06:47 AM 2019
Hi jono,

I call that progression the "best of five" - but better if you reset the count back to 1 ANYTIME you get level or ahead, so use it as a "gr8player five" instead. However - it still can be a grind! LOL :)

I extend my thought to bet AGAINST any triplet of 3 as before but this time only when one has shown up TWICE in succession.
This happens much more frequently than you would think and there are 8 patterns to watch for...
For example:

111111121221111212    =LW

211211222212122111    =LW

121121221111212122     =W

222222221222112211     =LLW

122122111111112212     =LW

Red shows the repeating triplets. Bold shows the W's

:)

A.
Time to give this a test Atlantis. I guess a bit of patience is involved but I believe it will be worth it.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 11, 08:24 AM 2019
Need to test it with my numbers jono. If the first 3000 spin is profitable than okey. I not even had first 300 spin profitable.

And we cant ignore the 0, because if we are betting, zhe 0 can come, and its a loss.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 11, 09:11 AM 2019
Hi Atlantis, i like your idea, just for clarification please confirm that i have got it  right:   
HL,LH,LL, HH,LL,HL, LH,HL,HL
HL,LH,HL, HL,HH,LH, LL,HL,HL
LL,LH,HH, HH,LH,LL, HH,HH,LH.


Hi Loukoumas,

Yes that is how I am playing it, but you don't need to restrict to lines of 9 as I showed in Mister Eko's results.
Just track the 'pair' results until you see ANY double triplet trigger eg:

112211222111221(112112)12  = LW

HINT: Do it on a rolling basis - always look back at the last six results in the tracking history to check for the next double triplet trigger...

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 11, 02:00 PM 2019
Some may know I looked at 'pair betting' dominants before. This topic here might be interesting to some:
https://www.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=17630.msg163649#msg163649
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 11, 02:24 PM 2019
Posting only betting on 2s with in a 3 frame spin . 12481632
121121+1
112122+3
222212+5
212122+5
222122+5
112112+2
222111-4
121222+5
222222+6
122222+5
212222+5
222122+5
212222+5
221222+5
222222+6
221221+3
212222+5
222211+1
21112+2
122122+4
212122+4
121222+4
222122+5
If math is correct
+79
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 11, 02:33 PM 2019
Forget that made a mistake hate when that happens
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 11, 02:38 PM 2019
Need to test it with my numbers jono. If the first 3000 spin is profitable than okey. I not even had first 300 spin profitable.

And we cant ignore the 0, because if we are betting, zhe 0 can come, and its a loss.
.
Hi Mister Eko - The only time I ignore the zero is when it occurs in the first spin.  In this case it’s meaningless and I spin again. If the zero occurs in the second spin, I record it as a loss (-1).

Good luck with testing.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 11, 02:39 PM 2019
Posting only betting on 2s with in a 3 frame spin . 12481632
121121+1
112122+3
222212+5
212122+5
222122+5
112112+2
222111-4
121222+5
222222+6
122222+5
212222+5
222122+5
212222+5
221222+5
222222+6
221221+3
212222+5
222211+1
21112+2
122122+4
212122+4
121222+4
222122+5
If math is correct
+79

Yes but here you had 40 1s and 98 2s. Its easy to win with 2s...

Try this.

111211
122111
211111
111222
211211
111122
222111
221122
112211
211111
111112
211221
212221
122112
211211
211121
112212
112111
122112
112211
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 11, 07:41 PM 2019
Hi jono,

I extend my thought to bet AGAINST any triplet of 3 as before but this time only when one has shown up TWICE in succession.
This happens much more frequently than you would think and there are 8 patterns to watch for...
For example:

111111121221111212    =LW

211211222212122111    =LW

121121221111212122     =W

222222221222112211     =LLW

122122111111112212     =LW

Red shows the repeating triplets. Bold shows the W's

:)

A.

Atlantis, what is the best progression to use on this? I initially thought a martingale. Now I'm thinking a mini labrouchere or best of five could be the go.

My results:

1 1 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 1 2 2 2 1 2 1 1 2 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 1     

My first betting opportunity was two losses and then a win.
My second betting opportunity was one loss and a win.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                                   
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: -Katalyst- on Mar 12, 06:54 AM 2019
Yes but here you had 40 1s and 98 2s. Its easy to win with 2s...

Try this.

111211
122111
211111
111222
211211
111122
222111
221122
112211
211111
111112
211221
212221
122112
211211
211121
112212
112111
122112
112211



Hi Guys - you guys keep dancing around it - so here’s something to add to what Winner has shared  - extrapolate and play with - follow the beat of the ball   ;)  - play both 1s and the 2s - look for the change - strategy is simple and effective - it’s all highlighted below - please explore for yourself 🙏🏽

**am only chasing 2 bets per set
Staged Progression:
2,4
6,12
10,20
(def play around with this to see options)


111211   -6
122111   +6
211111   -6
111222   +6
211211   
111122   +2
222111    +2
221122   +2
112211
211111
111112
211221   +2
212221
122112   +2
211211
211121
112212   -6; +6
112111
122112   +2
112211

--------->+12

- you can take it to another level 👍🏽

........"there's always a game"
🙂
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: -Katalyst- on Mar 12, 07:06 AM 2019
————->+14

Calcs a bit out 🤔
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Person S on Mar 12, 07:42 AM 2019
VDW + tic-tac-toe
I noticed that if you play VDW, you do not need to use the tracker.
Everything can be done by analogy with the game of tic-tac-toe.
For example :
111
111
121 there are 4 of them, but as we know after completing the AP, we are starting a new
or
122
122
211 here 1
I hope that someone will be useful ...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 09:52 AM 2019
If you take 37/38 spins we know that you wil never see 38 numbers come in and you won’t  see 38 red/blacks in a row ect. I can here the maths boys now it can happen ok I’ll answer fo you yes but not in my life time.haha

In 50000 spins tests of 18 pairs I have yet to see18 of the same 1s/2s in row.
And 6 triplets  in a row . I think also the zeros help break patterns IN Our favour.
Bv from what Nick showed me it produced 6 triplets in 18 pairs  ,and then again it’s Rng and no zero that’s  why I
think zeros help break patterns.for me I don’t play no zero . Partage I will play most definitely.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 10:06 AM 2019
So now This Is a fact that a cycle is key .
So I have taken the 18 pairs and turned them  into straight 18 spins cycle.
And I got the same results .
The interesting thing is I use the first triplet to begin the session .and what I found is that it can be magic .shorting the cycle to 12 spin betting session within 18 spins and still looking for chops and runs within 18 spins .i will continue with this playing air ball .and report back to the few of that are interested in beating the even 💵
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 12:02 PM 2019
111– 12122120122101  +4 zero repeat off 111 every  3 spin after the first pattern
222-12011212202111+4
211-1121122011221 +4   201 lost 3 wins on the 4th
12012112222111122+4
111-21112111221222+4
1201-1211211122211+4  lost on a 121 hit on the5th
2201-2222122121201+4
And now that’s how easy it is air ball
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 02:59 PM 2019
This here is the 👑 Of all.
221-11211222012112+4  repeat pattern wins on the 4 th
20201-1121211121102+4
111-22212220222011+4
121-2022221022121+4
112-11121222222222+4
212-11212222211202+4
This is the most consistent bet on the planet all testing done and for you to enjoy.for free
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 03:04 PM 2019
Key points
Easy to use no crazy wait time for betting.
You can use a mild progression 124816. 32
You can make 4 units a game no sweat
Everyone is welcome to post results I have 50000 so you can’t shock me and ad the zeros please. I don’t mind them lol
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 03:08 PM 2019
And I’m not asking you to post results cause I’m lazy and don’t feel like doing it myself.all the work is done just like to see others post don’t be  scared .dont worry about the Vb players or computer phonatics they won’t bite forums are for sharing and why not.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 12, 03:32 PM 2019
111– 12122120122101  +4 zero repeat off 111 every  3 spin after the first pattern
222-12011212202111+4
211-1121122011221 +4   201 lost 3 wins on the 4th
12012112222111122+4
111-21112111221222+4
1201-1211211122211+4  lost on a 121 hit on the5th
2201-2222122121201+4
And now that’s how easy it is air ball

At lat but one line you have 1201, and its followed 121 121 112. It seems it just hit at the 7th spin, isnt it?

You always use marty?

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 03:38 PM 2019
At lat but one line you have 1201, and its followed 121 121 112. It seems it just hit at the 7th spin, isnt it?

You always use marty?

Yes sorry it hit in the 8 very rare
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 12, 03:42 PM 2019

Yes sorry it hit in the 8 very rare

But when it hits, and it will, it a huge loss. And we win only +1 to recover this 1 2 4 8 16 32 64 128 loss....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 12, 03:54 PM 2019
I run a 2x10 session with a 3-step marty 1-2-4 then stop.

1,1,2, - 2,2,1, 1,1,1, 1,1,1, 1,2,1, +4
2,0,1,1, - 2,1,2, 2,1,2, 2,2,1, 2,2,2, +4
2,2,2, - 1,2,1, 1,2,0,1, 2,1,2, 1,1,1, +4
1,2,1, - 2,2,2, 1,2,2, 1,2,1, 2,1,1, -4
1,1,2, - 2,1,1, 2,1,1, 1,2,2, 2,1,1, +4
1,2,1, - 1,1,2, 2,2,1, 2,2,1, 2,1,2, +4
2,1,2, - 2,2,2, 1,1,1, 1,1,1, 2,1,1, +4
2,2,1, - 1,2,1, 2,1,2, 2,1,1, 1,2,1, +4
1,1,0,1, - 2,2,1, 1,1,2, 1,1,2, 2,2,1, +4
1,2,1, - 1,2,1, 1,1,1, 1,2,2, 1,1,2, -4 (+24)

1,2,1, - 1,1,2, 1,2,1, 1,2,1, 2,1,1, -12
1,1,1, - 1,1,1, 1,2,2, 1,2,1, 2,2,2, -4
2,1,1, - 1,1,1, 1,2,2, 1,1,2, 1,1,1, +4
2,2,1, - 1,2,1, 1,2,1, 1,2,1, 0,1,2,2, +4
1,1,1, - 0,1,1,2, 1,2,2, 1,1,1, 0,1,2,2, -4
2,0,0,1,2, - 2,2,2, 2,2,1, 2,2,1, 1,1,2, +4
2,1,1, - 2,1,2, 1,2,1, 2,2,1, 1,1,2, +4
2,2,2, - 1,1,1, 2,1,1, 2,2,1, 2,2,1, +4
1,1,2, - 2,1,2, 2,1,2, 2,2,2, 2,2,1, +4
1,1,1, - 2,2,2, 1,1,1, 2,2,2, 2,2,1, -4 (+0)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 12, 04:05 PM 2019
This here is the 👑 Of all.
221-11211222012112+4  repeat pattern wins on the 4 th
20201-1121211121102+4
111-22212220222011+4
121-2022221022121+4
112-11121222222222+4
212-11212222211202+4
This is the most consistent bet on the planet all testing done and for you to enjoy.for free

Thanks for sharing Winner. This keeps getting better....

Can I clarify what you have done? I don't want to go off testing the wrong thing. Can you please confirm?

2   2  1  –  1  1  2     1  1  2     2  2  0     1  2  1    1  2   + 4    repeat pattern wins on the 4th
2   2  1  -  W W W   W W W    L  L  L     W L  L    W L
                +1+2+3  +4+5+6   +5+3 -1  +7+6+4 +5+4   (+4)

Thanks Winner

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 04:26 PM 2019
Thanks for sharing Winner. This keeps getting better....

Can I clarify what you have done? I don't want to go off testing the wrong thing. Can you please confirm?

2   2  1  –  1  1  2     1  1  2     2  2  0     1  2  1    1  2   + 4    repeat pattern wins on the 4th
2   2  1  -  W W W   W W W    L  L  L     W L  L    W L
                +1+2+3  +4+5+6   +5+3 -1  +7+6+4 +5+4   (+4)

Thanks Winner
I was stopping on every win but that looks good to on a rolling basis.nice
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 04:30 PM 2019
I know Marty can get scary for a lot of people even me.thats why it’s good to experiment with different ones 
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 12, 04:37 PM 2019
I know Marty can get scary for a lot of people even me.thats why it’s good to experiment with different ones

Thanks Winner. I think I'll stick with your method. Simpler.

This method gets better everyday....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 12, 05:05 PM 2019
I run a 2x10 session with a 3-step marty 1-2-4 then stop.

1,1,2, - 2,2,1, 1,1,1, 1,1,1, 1,2,1, +4
2,0,1,1, - 2,1,2, 2,1,2, 2,2,1, 2,2,2, +4
2,2,2, - 1,2,1, 1,2,0,1, 2,1,2, 1,1,1, +4
1,2,1, - 2,2,2, 1,2,2, 1,2,1, 2,1,1, -4
1,1,2, - 2,1,1, 2,1,1, 1,2,2, 2,1,1, +4
1,2,1, - 1,1,2, 2,2,1, 2,2,1, 2,1,2, +4
2,1,2, - 2,2,2, 1,1,1, 1,1,1, 2,1,1, +4
2,2,1, - 1,2,1, 2,1,2, 2,1,1, 1,2,1, +4
1,1,0,1, - 2,2,1, 1,1,2, 1,1,2, 2,2,1, +4
1,2,1, - 1,2,1, 1,1,1, 1,2,2, 1,1,2, -4 (+24)

1,2,1, - 1,1,2, 1,2,1, 1,2,1, 2,1,1, -12
1,1,1, - 1,1,1, 1,2,2, 1,2,1, 2,2,2, -4
2,1,1, - 1,1,1, 1,2,2, 1,1,2, 1,1,1, +4
2,2,1, - 1,2,1, 1,2,1, 1,2,1, 0,1,2,2, +4
1,1,1, - 0,1,1,2, 1,2,2, 1,1,1, 0,1,2,2, -4
2,0,0,1,2, - 2,2,2, 2,2,1, 2,2,1, 1,1,2, +4
2,1,1, - 2,1,2, 1,2,1, 2,2,1, 1,1,2, +4
2,2,2, - 1,1,1, 2,1,1, 2,2,1, 2,2,1, +4
1,1,2, - 2,1,2, 2,1,2, 2,2,2, 2,2,1, +4
1,1,1, - 2,2,2, 1,1,1, 2,2,2, 2,2,1, -4 (+0)
Nice work Mister Eko. A very safe approach but excellent results anyway.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 05:50 PM 2019
I will present a progression seemed to work on 2 million spins .later
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Mar 12, 06:15 PM 2019
Much more clear now, thanks Winner, excellent.  Good job by the people testing as well, this is turning into a great thread.  :love:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 12, 06:36 PM 2019
1. bet against
2. bet same like 1. numbers
ASSA
if minus first bet then 2. bet against
AASS

1,1,2, - 2,2,1,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(+3 A) 1,2,1,(-1)  (+4)
2,0,1,1, - 2,1,2,(+1 S) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 2,2,1,(-1 A) 2,2,2,(-1)  (+2)
2,2,2, - 1,2,1,(+1 S) 1,2,0,1,(+3 S) 2,1,2,(-3 A) 1,1,1,(+1)  (+2)
1,2,1, - 2,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(+1 A) 2,1,1,(+1)  (+4)
1,1,2, - 2,1,1,(+1 S) 2,1,1,(+3 S) 1,2,2,(-3 A) 2,1,1,(+3)  (+4)
1,2,1, - 1,1,2,(+1 S) 2,2,1,(-3 S) 2,2,1,(+3 A) 2,1,2,(+1)  (+2)
2,1,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 1,1,1,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(+3 S) 2,1,1,(+1) (+6)
2,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 2,1,1,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1) (+2)
1,1,0,1, - 2,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-3 S) 1,1,2,(+3 A) 2,2,1,(+3) (+4)
1,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-3 A) 1,1,1,(-1 S) 1,2,2,(-1 S) 1,1,2,(+1) (-4) +26

1,2,1, - 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1 S) 1,2,1,(+3 A) 2,1,1, (+1) (+4)
1,1,1, - 1,1,1,(-3 A) 1,2,2,(+2 S) 1,2,1,(+1 S) 2,2,2, (-1) (-1)
2,1,1, - 1,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1, (+1) (+2)
2,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(-3 S) 1,2,1,(+3 S) 0,1,2,2,(+1) (+0)
1,1,1, - 0,1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(-1 A) 0,1,2,2,(+1) (+2)
2,0,0,1,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 2,2,1,(-1 S) 2,2,1,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(-3) (-2)
2,1,1, - 2,1,2,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(+3 S) 2,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-3) (+0)
2,2,2, - 1,1,1,(+3 S) 2,1,1,(+1 S) 2,2,1,(+1 A) 2,2,1,(-3) (+2)
1,1,2, - 2,1,2,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(-3 S) 2,2,2,(+1 S) 2,2,1,(+1) (-2)
1,1,1, - 2,2,2,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(-3 S) 2,2,2,(-3 A) 2,2,1,(-1) (-4) +1


1,2,1, - 1,1,1,(-1 A) 2,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-3 S) 2,2,1,(-3) (-6)
1,2,2, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 2,2,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(-3) (+0)
1,1,2, - 1,2,2,(-1 A) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(+3) (+0)
0,1,1,0,1, - 1,0,1,1,(-3 A) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 0,1,2,2,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(-1) (+0)
1,2,2, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(+1) (+4)
2,1,0,0,1, - 2,0,1,2,(-1 A) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 1,2,1,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(+1) (-2)
2,2,2, - 1,1,2,(+1 S) 2,2,2,(-1 S) 2,2,1,(+1 A) 1,1,1,(+1) (+2)
2,1,1, - 2,2,2,(+1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 S) 2,1,2,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(+1) (+0)
1,1,1, - 2,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(+1 S) 2,2,2,(-1 S) 2,2,2,(+3) (+2)
2,1,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(-1 S) 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1) (-2) (-2)

2,1,2, - 2,0,0,1,2,(-3 A) 1,1,1,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(+3 S) 2,1,2,(-1) (+0)
2,2,2, - 1,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(+3) (+2)
2,2,2, - 2,2,1,(-1 A) 0,1,1,2,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(+3) (+8)
1,1,1, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 1,2,2,(-1 S) 2,2,2,(+1) (+2)
2,1,2, - 1,2,1,(+3 S) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,2,(+3 A) 2,1,1,(+3) (+10)
1,2,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 1,2,0,1,(+1 S) 2,1,0,1,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(+1) (+0)
2,1,2, - 1,2,1,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(+1) (+2)
1,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-3 A) 2,2,1,(-1 S)  1,2,2,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(-1) (-6)
1,1,1, - 2,2,1,(+1 S) 2,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(-1) (+0)
2,2,1, - 1,1,1,(+1 S) 0,1,2,2,(-1 S) 2,1,2,(-1 A) 0,1,1,2,(-1) (-2) +16

Overall:  +41 units and FLATBET !!!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 06:40 PM 2019
This was coded by N1ckyyy
Monaco came up with it I just modified it a bit.
Flat bet until -4 go to level 2
Level 2 bet 2 units until -12 or back to -1 if you lose -12 level 3
Level 3 bet 4 units until -32 or back to -6 if you -32 go to level 4
Level 4 bet 8  reset when your -4
Try it out looks on graph if you I can post the graph
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 06:45 PM 2019
1. bet against
2. bet same like 1. numbers
ASSA
if minus first bet then 2. bet against
AASS

1,1,2, - 2,2,1,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(+3 A) 1,2,1,(-1)  (+4)
2,0,1,1, - 2,1,2,(+1 S) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 2,2,1,(-1 A) 2,2,2,(-1)  (+2)
2,2,2, - 1,2,1,(+1 S) 1,2,0,1,(+3 S) 2,1,2,(-3 A) 1,1,1,(+1)  (+2)
1,2,1, - 2,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(+1 A) 2,1,1,(+1)  (+4)
1,1,2, - 2,1,1,(+1 S) 2,1,1,(+3 S) 1,2,2,(-3 A) 2,1,1,(+3)  (+4)
1,2,1, - 1,1,2,(+1 S) 2,2,1,(-3 S) 2,2,1,(+3 A) 2,1,2,(+1)  (+2)
2,1,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 1,1,1,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(+3 S) 2,1,1,(+1) (+6)
2,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 2,1,1,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1) (+2)
1,1,0,1, - 2,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-3 S) 1,1,2,(+3 A) 2,2,1,(+3) (+4)
1,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-3 A) 1,1,1,(-1 S) 1,2,2,(-1 S) 1,1,2,(+1) (-4) +26

1,2,1, - 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1 S) 1,2,1,(+3 A) 2,1,1, (+1) (+4)
1,1,1, - 1,1,1,(-3 A) 1,2,2,(+2 S) 1,2,1,(+1 S) 2,2,2, (-1) (-1)
2,1,1, - 1,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1, (+1) (+2)
2,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(-3 S) 1,2,1,(+3 S) 0,1,2,2,(+1) (+0)
1,1,1, - 0,1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(-1 A) 0,1,2,2,(+1) (+2)
2,0,0,1,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 2,2,1,(-1 S) 2,2,1,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(-3) (-2)
2,1,1, - 2,1,2,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(+3 S) 2,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-3) (+0)
2,2,2, - 1,1,1,(+3 S) 2,1,1,(+1 S) 2,2,1,(+1 A) 2,2,1,(-3) (+2)
1,1,2, - 2,1,2,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(-3 S) 2,2,2,(+1 S) 2,2,1,(+1) (-2)
1,1,1, - 2,2,2,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(-3 S) 2,2,2,(-3 A) 2,2,1,(-1) (-4) +1


1,2,1, - 1,1,1,(-1 A) 2,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-3 S) 2,2,1,(-3) (-6)
1,2,2, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 2,2,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(-3) (+0)
1,1,2, - 1,2,2,(-1 A) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(+3) (+0)
0,1,1,0,1, - 1,0,1,1,(-3 A) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 0,1,2,2,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(-1) (+0)
1,2,2, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(+1) (+4)
2,1,0,0,1, - 2,0,1,2,(-1 A) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 1,2,1,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(+1) (-2)
2,2,2, - 1,1,2,(+1 S) 2,2,2,(-1 S) 2,2,1,(+1 A) 1,1,1,(+1) (+2)
2,1,1, - 2,2,2,(+1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 S) 2,1,2,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(+1) (+0)
1,1,1, - 2,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(+1 S) 2,2,2,(-1 S) 2,2,2,(+3) (+2)
2,1,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(-1 S) 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1) (-2) (-2)

2,1,2, - 2,0,0,1,2,(-3 A) 1,1,1,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(+3 S) 2,1,2,(-1) (+0)
2,2,2, - 1,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(+3) (+2)
2,2,2, - 2,2,1,(-1 A) 0,1,1,2,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(+3) (+8)
1,1,1, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 1,2,2,(-1 S) 2,2,2,(+1) (+2)
2,1,2, - 1,2,1,(+3 S) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,2,(+3 A) 2,1,1,(+3) (+10)
1,2,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 1,2,0,1,(+1 S) 2,1,0,1,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(+1) (+0)
2,1,2, - 1,2,1,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(+1) (+2)
1,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-3 A) 2,2,1,(-1 S)  1,2,2,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(-1) (-6)
1,1,1, - 2,2,1,(+1 S) 2,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(-1) (+0)
2,2,1, - 1,1,1,(+1 S) 0,1,2,2,(-1 S) 2,1,2,(-1 A) 0,1,1,2,(-1) (-2) +16

Overall:  +41 units and FLATBET !!!
👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 12, 07:05 PM 2019
1. bet against
2. bet same like 1. numbers
ASSA
if minus first bet then 2. bet against
AASS

1,1,2, - 2,2,1,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(+3 A) 1,2,1,(-1)  (+4)
2,0,1,1, - 2,1,2,(+1 S) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 2,2,1,(-1 A) 2,2,2,(-1)  (+2)
2,2,2, - 1,2,1,(+1 S) 1,2,0,1,(+3 S) 2,1,2,(-3 A) 1,1,1,(+1)  (+2)
1,2,1, - 2,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(+1 A) 2,1,1,(+1)  (+4)
1,1,2, - 2,1,1,(+1 S) 2,1,1,(+3 S) 1,2,2,(-3 A) 2,1,1,(+3)  (+4)
1,2,1, - 1,1,2,(+1 S) 2,2,1,(-3 S) 2,2,1,(+3 A) 2,1,2,(+1)  (+2)
2,1,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 1,1,1,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(+3 S) 2,1,1,(+1) (+6)
2,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 2,1,1,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1) (+2)
1,1,0,1, - 2,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-3 S) 1,1,2,(+3 A) 2,2,1,(+3) (+4)
1,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-3 A) 1,1,1,(-1 S) 1,2,2,(-1 S) 1,1,2,(+1) (-4) +26

1,2,1, - 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1 S) 1,2,1,(+3 A) 2,1,1, (+1) (+4)
1,1,1, - 1,1,1,(-3 A) 1,2,2,(+2 S) 1,2,1,(+1 S) 2,2,2, (-1) (-1)
2,1,1, - 1,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1, (+1) (+2)
2,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(-3 S) 1,2,1,(+3 S) 0,1,2,2,(+1) (+0)
1,1,1, - 0,1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(-1 A) 0,1,2,2,(+1) (+2)
2,0,0,1,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 2,2,1,(-1 S) 2,2,1,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(-3) (-2)
2,1,1, - 2,1,2,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(+3 S) 2,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-3) (+0)
2,2,2, - 1,1,1,(+3 S) 2,1,1,(+1 S) 2,2,1,(+1 A) 2,2,1,(-3) (+2)
1,1,2, - 2,1,2,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(-3 S) 2,2,2,(+1 S) 2,2,1,(+1) (-2)
1,1,1, - 2,2,2,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(-3 S) 2,2,2,(-3 A) 2,2,1,(-1) (-4) +1


1,2,1, - 1,1,1,(-1 A) 2,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-3 S) 2,2,1,(-3) (-6)
1,2,2, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 2,2,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(-3) (+0)
1,1,2, - 1,2,2,(-1 A) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(+3) (+0)
0,1,1,0,1, - 1,0,1,1,(-3 A) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 0,1,2,2,(+3 S) 1,1,1,(-1) (+0)
1,2,2, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(+1) (+4)
2,1,0,0,1, - 2,0,1,2,(-1 A) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 1,2,1,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(+1) (-2)
2,2,2, - 1,1,2,(+1 S) 2,2,2,(-1 S) 2,2,1,(+1 A) 1,1,1,(+1) (+2)
2,1,1, - 2,2,2,(+1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 S) 2,1,2,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(+1) (+0)
1,1,1, - 2,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(+1 S) 2,2,2,(-1 S) 2,2,2,(+3) (+2)
2,1,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(-1 S) 1,1,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1) (-2) (-2)

2,1,2, - 2,0,0,1,2,(-3 A) 1,1,1,(+1 S) 1,1,1,(+3 S) 2,1,2,(-1) (+0)
2,2,2, - 1,2,1,(+1 S) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(+3) (+2)
2,2,2, - 2,2,1,(-1 A) 0,1,1,2,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(+3) (+8)
1,1,1, - 1,2,1,(-1 A) 2,1,2,(+3 S) 1,2,2,(-1 S) 2,2,2,(+1) (+2)
2,1,2, - 1,2,1,(+3 S) 1,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,2,(+3 A) 2,1,1,(+3) (+10)
1,2,2, - 2,2,2,(-1 A) 1,2,0,1,(+1 S) 2,1,0,1,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(+1) (+0)
2,1,2, - 1,2,1,(+3 S) 1,1,2,(-1 S) 2,1,1,(-1 A) 1,2,1,(+1) (+2)
1,2,1, - 1,2,1,(-3 A) 2,2,1,(-1 S)  1,2,2,(-1 S) 1,1,1,(-1) (-6)
1,1,1, - 2,2,1,(+1 S) 2,2,2,(+1 S) 1,2,1,(-1 A) 1,2,2,(-1) (+0)
2,2,1, - 1,1,1,(+1 S) 0,1,2,2,(-1 S) 2,1,2,(-1 A) 0,1,1,2,(-1) (-2) +16

Overall:  +41 units and FLATBET !!!


Great results Mister Eko! Can you please clarify the rules. I don't quite follow....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 12, 07:46 PM 2019
Two kind of betting

Example:

1 2 1 - 1 . always start with A (against) come 111 (-1) If the first cycle is negative, we play isntead of same (S) against, so  not switch to same (S).  Came 1 1 2 (-1). Now play same.  2 1 2 comes (+1) now last stage switch to A (against ) comes 2 2 1. (+1) Overall: +0

It was ASSA - against, same, same, against.

If the first cycle is +1 or +3, we stay on same, and not switch to against betting.

Maybe I will test it with Winners new progression. In this case I see -3, so complete losing rare. So we could add one good progression to it, but try it Jono  with your own numebrs, and try to improve, change, modifie. 

I just posted an idea, casue I fuking hate whoes just read these thread, and stoles the informations for free, the ideas, and nothing to improve here !
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 12, 08:03 PM 2019
Two kind of betting

Example:

1 2 1 - 1 . always start with A (against) come 111 (-1) If the first cycle is negative, we play isntead of same (S) against, so  not switch to same (S).  Came 1 1 2 (-1). Now play same.  2 1 2 comes (+1) now last stage switch to A (against ) comes 2 2 1. (+1) Overall: +0

It was ASSA - against, same, same, against.

If the first cycle is +1 or +3, we stay on same, and not switch to against betting.

Maybe I will test it with Winners new progression. In this case I see -3, so complete losing rare. So we could add one good progression to it, but try it Jono  with your own numebrs, and try to improve, change, modifie. 

I just posted an idea, casue I fuking hate whoes just read these thread, and stoles the informations for free, the ideas, and nothing to improve here !

Thanks for the clarification Mister Eko. I love that you achieve the profit with flat bet.

Don't worry, I'm working on my own betting method as we speak. It's a continuation of the method Atlantis posted a couple of days ago, but with some changes.  I think you will like it....  That's not to say the methods you and Winner have posted aren't good. They're bloody amazing! However, I want to continue developing this idea because I have already started working on it.

I will post something later.... thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 12, 08:25 PM 2019
I know that you work on this Jono (y).  Atlantis too and a few other members. Nicely, slowly we are moving forward, but if I achieve one profitable thing, I will only share with those, whoes worked with us on this system

Eko
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 12, 09:01 PM 2019
Continuous play, switching between A (against betting) and S (same betting).

1,1,2, (A) 2,2,1, +3 (S) 1,1,1, +2 (nb) 1,1,1, (A) 1,2,1, +1 (S) 2,0,1,1, +2 (S) 2,1,2, +3 (S) +6 (A) 2,1,2, +3 (A) 2,2,1, +4 (S) 2,2,2, +5 NB 2,2,2, (A) 1,2,1, +6 (S)1,2,0,1, +9 (A) 2,1,2, +12 (S) 1,1,1, +11 NB 1,2,1, (A) 2,2,2, +12 NB 1,2,2, (A) 1,2,1, +11 (S) 2,1,1, +10 (S) 1,1,2, +9 (S) 2,1,1, +8 (level 2 S) 2,1,1, +14 (level 1 A) 1,2,2, +17 (S) 2,1,1, +14 (A) 1,2,1, +15 (S) 1,1,2, +16 (S) 2,2,1, +13 (S) 2,2,1, +16 (A) 2,1,2, +17 (S) 2,1,2, +20 (A) 2,2,2, +19 (NB) 1,1,1, (NB )1,1,1, (A) 2,1,1, +18 (S)2,2,1, +19 (S)1,2,1, +20 (S) 2,1,2, +17 (A)2,1,1, +16 (S) 1,2,1, +15 (level 2 same) 1,1,0,1, +17 (NB) 2,2,1, (A) 1,1,2, +23 (level 1 S) 1,1,2, +26 (A) 2,2,1, +29 (S) 1,2,1, +30 (S) 1,2,1, +33 (A) 1,1,1, +32 (NB) 1,2,2, (A) 1,1,2, +31 (S) 1,2,1, +30 (S) 1,1,2, +29 (S) 1,2,1, +28 level 2 (S) 1,2,1, +34 (level 1 A) 2,1,1, +35 (S) 1,1,1, +36 (NB) 1,1,1, (A) 1,2,2, +37 (S) 1,2,1, (+38 S)2,2,2, +37 (NB) 2,1,1, (A) 1,1,1, +36 (nb) 1,2,2, (A) 1,1,2, +35 (S) 1,1,1, +36 (nb) 2,2,1, (A) 1,2,1, +35 (S) 1,2,1, +38 (A)1,2,1, +35 (A) 0,1,2,2, +34 ( S) 1,1,1, (+33 level 2 nb) 0,1,1,2, (A)1,2,2, +31 (S) 1,1,1, (+29 nb) 0,1,2,2, (A) 2,0,0,1,2,(+31 S)2,2,2, +33 NB
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 10:09 PM 2019
Mister Eko that’s great man the more ways to play the better if you have for ex 5methods
 and switch form method to method and win a few units and then-call it a day.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 10:20 PM 2019
Remember we’re trying to milk the cow not kill it
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 12, 10:26 PM 2019
Yes yes milk like natural big boobs mate
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 12, 10:35 PM 2019
Yes yes milk like natural big boobs mate
😂
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 12, 11:46 PM 2019
After recent developments, the following may appear redundant, but I thought I would share the results anyway. This was completed a couple of days ago.

This is a continuation of Atlantis’ idea of betting against the third triplet appearing. Please see below. 140 spins have produced 13 betting opportunities. There’s a lot of waiting around, but the system is quite robust.

Colours
Blue – double triplet. Begin betting against third triplet.
Red – losing bets
Green – winning bet

1 1 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 1 2 2 0 2 1 2 1 1 2 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 1 1 1 0 0 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 2  1 1 1 2 2 1 2 1 1 0 1 1 2 1 2 2 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 2 1 2 2 2 1 2 1 2 1 1 2 1 1 2 2 1 1 2 2 2 2 2 1 2 1 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 2 1 2 1 1 1 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 2 1 1 2 2 2 2 0 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 2 1 1 2 1 1 1   

Broken down, the 13 betting opportunities look like this.
L L W     L W     W      L L W     L W    W      W

What’s the best money management to use?

I ran all the results through the popular MM methods. These are sorted from most successful to least successful.

Mini-labouchere: +8
Martingale: +7
D’Alembert: +7
Best of five: +6
Fibonacci: +5
Flat bet: +1
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 12, 11:48 PM 2019
Yes yes milk like natural big boobs mate

 ;D  This thread keeps getting better......!!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 13, 12:44 AM 2019
After recent developments, the following may appear redundant, but I thought I would share the results anyway. This was completed a couple of days ago.

This is a continuation of Atlantis’ idea of betting against the third triplet appearing. Please see below. 140 spins have produced 13 betting opportunities. There’s a lot of waiting around, but the system is quite robust.

Colours
Blue – double triplet. Begin betting against third triplet.
Red – losing bets
Green – winning bet

1 1 2 1 2 2 1 2 2 1 1 2 2 0 2 1 2 1 1 2 2 2 1 2 2 1 2 1 1 1 0 0 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 2  1 1 1 2 2 1 2 1 1 0 1 1 2 1 2 2 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 2 1 2 2 2 1 2 1 2 1 1 2 1 1 2 2 1 1 2 2 2 2 2 1 2 1 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 2 1 2 1 1 1 1 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 2 1 1 2 2 2 2 0 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 2 1 1 2 1 1 1   

Broken down, the 13 betting opportunities look like this.
L L W     L W     W      L L W     L W    W      W

What’s the best money management to use?

I ran all the results through the popular MM methods. These are sorted from most successful to least successful.

Mini-labouchere: +8
Martingale: +7
D’Alembert: +7
Best of five: +6
Fibonacci: +5
Flat bet: +1
I like the results 👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 13, 01:46 AM 2019
Excuse me, It seems you guys are playing  a mix of Pattern Attack and Pattern Breaker on roulette.

I think is better don't play these patterns for obvious reasons:

111 1111111...
222  2222222...
121  2121212...
212 12121212...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 13, 08:45 AM 2019
In matrix 4 style, track vertically for dominants or non dominants after 3. Write down the horizontal  formation   of 4 dominants or 4 non dominants in a row anywhere in the matrix and bet opposite up to 3 times for the run to break. I used prog 1,1,2  ( a cyclic 111,222,333,.. may also  fit to this i guess..).
2 2 2 2
1 1 2 2
2 2 2 2
2 2 1 1
2 1 2 2
2 2 1 1    bet opp here, W
2 1 1 1
2 2 1 2
1 2 1 2
2 1 2 1
1 2 1 2    bet opp here, W
2 1 1 2
1 2 1 1
1 1 1 2
1 2 1 1
1 1 1 2
2 1 2 2
1 2 1 1
1 1 2 2
1 2 2 2
1 1 2 1
2 2 2 2
2 1 2 1
1 2 2 2
1 2 2 1
1 2 2 1
2 1 2 2     bet opp here, W
2 1 2 2
2 1 1 2
1 2 2 1
1 2 1 1     bet opp here, LLW
2 2 2 1   
I still cant determine  if the optimal trigger is after 4 or  3 runs for this approach ( 4 runs is safer but someone could also play after 3 for faster results).
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 13, 10:40 AM 2019
@Andre
Its not exactly as you have it in your mind. 1, 2 stands for a pair of ECs (e.g  1.1.1,1.1,1,1 stands for 7 alternate H/L in a row. How many times have you seen this pattern? Very rarely. Apart from this, we try avoid to play this system continuously, thats why we are talking for same pairs, same triplets, triggers, stoploss progs etc., to cope with variance and come ahead. This is more sophisticated than PB which is more exposed to randomness than this. I suggest you to re-read the whole thread and systems posted here and you will discover a lot of potential with ECs,  the easiest bet someone can make in roulette..
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 13, 01:29 PM 2019
This is a nice profit earner . Got up this morning had my first cup of coffee and I thought I know what the wheel can’t do but what does it do often  .
The #3 in a session plays a big role .Now I have tested this many times and had great results a little slower but none the less  good profit .
Here is a list for people just coming on the seen and doesn’t know what the hell is  going on.
Here is a list of ways to play.
1 -bet either 1sor 2s flat bet until your +1 stop move to next method
2- bet opposite or same from first pattern until +1 flat bet move to next method
3-bet for magic 30 until 1 unit +
4-bet either 1or2s count -4 without betting virtually ,then bet 248163264 for 1 unit , risky yes use at your desecration
5 the best one . You track the first 3 and you bet the dominant until you hit 3 ex
112 I’ll bet 1 firt 3 spins if you lose wait for the break and retract another .
Ex 112 1 w
112 -221.w
112-222 L wait for it to break
112-22222221 here’s the break
112-2222222121bet 1 for3 spins
Hope this help everyone and like mister Eko says milk the boobies don’t kill them.


Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 13, 02:13 PM 2019
I re read the thread and now I understand it.

It's a very interesting strategy. I love using this kind of strategies playing baccarat or roulette.

Congrats!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 13, 02:27 PM 2019
This is a nice profit earner . Got up this morning had my first cup of coffee and I thought I know what the wheel can’t do but what does it do often  .
The #3 in a session plays a big role .Now I have tested this many times and had great results a little slower but none the less  good profit .
Here is a list for people just coming on the seen and doesn’t know what the hell is  going on.
Here is a list of ways to play.
1 -bet either 1sor 2s flat bet until your +1 stop move to next method
2- bet opposite or same from first pattern until +1 flat bet move to next method
3-bet for magic 30 until 1 unit +
4-bet either 1or2s count -4 without betting virtually ,then bet 248163264 for 1 unit , risky yes use at your desecration
5 the best one . You track the first 3 and you bet the dominant until you hit 3 ex
112 I’ll bet 1 firt 3 spins if you lose wait for the break and retract another .
Ex 112 1 w
112 -221.w
112-222 L wait for it to break
112-22222221 here’s the break
112-2222222121bet 1 for3 spins
Hope this help everyone and like mister Eko says milk the boobies don’t kill them.

I tried your #5 idea which you said was "best":

211-2 w
121-1 w
221-111-11212-2 LLLw
211-2 w
122-1 w
222-2 w
222-2 w
122-21 Lw
1221 w
111-221 LLw
222-2 w
212-2 w
221-12 Lw
112-1 w
121-1 w
212-2 w
111-1 w
212-12 Lw
221-2 w
112-1 w
221-2 w
212-2 w
222-111-211-12 LLLLw
112-1 w
212-2 w

25 wins
Longest Losing run=4
Nice - Could be decent with suitable progression! :)
I stopped after each win and restart tracking on new line.

PS - OH! just realised I had bet the first leg of the starting triplet for max of 3 times - and NOT the dominant!!!!
Still it seemed to work good :)
EG 112 - bet the 1
EG 212 - bet the 2
EG 122 - bet the 1

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 13, 03:59 PM 2019
Here are som LW results from method 5
wwlw+2
Wwww+4
Wllwww+2
Llwlwl+0
Llwlww+0
Wwwww+5
Lwwww+4
Lllww-1
Wwww+4
Wwllllw-1
Llllwww-1
Wwwlllw+1
Wllllwwwww+2
Lwwllw+0
Wwwww+5
Lwwlw+1
Lllww-1
Lllwwllllw-4
Llww+0
Wllllw-2lwwllww+1
315 spin flat as for for those who don’t like progression
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 13, 04:49 PM 2019
I tried your #5 idea which you said was "best":

211-2 w
121-1 w
221-111-11212-2 LLLw
211-2 w
122-1 w
222-2 w
222-2 w
122-21 Lw
1221 w
111-221 LLw
222-2 w
212-2 w
221-12 Lw
112-1 w
121-1 w
212-2 w
111-1 w
212-12 Lw
221-2 w
112-1 w
221-2 w
212-2 w
222-111-211-12 LLLLw
112-1 w
212-2 w

25 wins
Longest Losing run=4
Nice - Could be decent with suitable progression! :)
I stopped after each win and restart tracking on new line.

PS - OH! just realised I had bet the first leg of the starting triplet for max of 3 times - and NOT the dominant!!!!
Still it seemed to work good :)
EG 112 - bet the 1
EG 212 - bet the 2
EG 122 - bet the 1

A.
just remember if you lose 3 in a row stop until it breaks then re track.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 13, 04:52 PM 2019
Can’t forget I’m doing this on a double 0 wheel
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 13, 04:59 PM 2019
When I was testing the third triplet system (previous post), I was trying to work out a good way of placing bets earlier. 

Obviously, Winner and Mister Eko have been posting some fantastic methods. Here’s another alternative.

This method consists of placing only two bets. At the end of the two bets, win or lose, you stop. Look for a new opportunity and restart.  The most you can lose per sequence is two bets in a row. Your first betting sequence is a 1-2 marty. If you lose the first sequence, you wait for a new opportunity and bet again. This time you increase the marty to 2-4. You bring it back to 1-2 on a win.

For this method you have to wait for a trigger. You’re betting against a pattern of three repeating itself, but you’re giving it one number in and then betting against it…..

Here’s an example….

1 2 1   1  (Trigger – bet against the pattern (blue) repeating for two bets).

1 2 1   1 2 2 (+1) Lose the first bet (red) but win on the second bet (green). Look for a new opportunity and start again.

Begin test series

2  1  2   2  2  1   (+1)
                 W     
 2  2  1  1  1  2  0  1  1  1  1  2  (+2)
                                              W
1  2  0  1  2  0  1  1  1  1  2 (+3)
                                          W
2  2  2  1  0  2  2  2  1  2  1  0  1  2  1  1  1   (+4)
                                                                   W
1  1  2  1  2   (+5)
                W
1  1  2 1  1  1   (+6)
                 L  W
2  1  2 2  1  1  (+7)
                 L W
2  2  2 2  2  1  (+8)
                 L W
2  1  0  2  2  2  1  2  1  2  1  1  1  1  1  2 (+9)
                                                           L W
2  1  2  1  1  1  (+10)
                    W
1  1  0  1  2  2  2  1  2  1  (+11)
                                     W
2  2  1  1  2  2  1  2  2  2   (+12)
                                  L  W
1  1  1  2  2  1  2  2  (+9)  1  1  (+1 separate mini-lab betting)
                         L  L            L  W
We lost, however the triplet pattern has just repeated itself twice. You can now bet against the appearance of the third triplet.   When betting against the appearance of the third triplet, I’m going to use the mini-lab and record the results separately. 

Now back to normal betting, although you will have to increase marty to 2-4 when the next betting opportunity comes along.

2  0  2  2  1  2  1  1  2  (+11)  Set marty back to 1-2 for next betting opportunity

1  2  1  1  2  0  (+8) Increase marty to 2-4 for next betting opportunity
                 L  L
2  2  1  1  2  2  1  2  1  (+10)  Set marty back to 1-2 for next betting opportunity
                             L  W
1  1  2  1  1  1  (+11)
                 L W
2  2  1  0  1  2  1 1  1 (+12)
                                 W
2  1  2    2 1  1 (+13)
                   L  W
2  2  1    2  2  1  (+10)    2  2  2 (-1 mini-lab separate betting)
                   L  L                L  L  W
Increase marty to 2-4 for next betting opportunity
2  2  1  1  1   1  1  2 (+12)
                            L  W
Set marty back to 1-2 for next betting opportunity
1  0  1   2  2  2    2  2  1  (+13)
                                L  W
2  1  1  0  1  1  1  2  1  1  1  (+14)
                                          W
1  0  2   2  2  2  2  2  2  (+11)  1 (+3)
                                L  L             W
Increase marty to 2-4 for next betting opportunity
2  2  0   1  1  2    1  2  (+13)
                                W
Set marty back to 1-2 for next betting opportunity
2  2  2  1  2  2  2  (+14)
                         W
+14  (normal betting)  +3 (third triplet betting)
____________
Total +17
_____________

Quite complicated but I thought I would put it out there anyway, it won't be for everyone.  Other methods are simpler…..

Stay away from cows and boobies…..  ;D






Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 13, 05:03 PM 2019
When I was testing the third triplet system (previous post), I was trying to work out a good way of placing bets earlier. 

Obviously, Winner and Mister Eko have been posting some fantastic methods. Here’s another alternative.

This method consists of placing only two bets. At the end of the two bets, win or lose, you stop. Look for a new opportunity and restart.  The most you can lose per sequence is two bets in a row. Your first betting sequence is a 1-2 marty. If you lose the first sequence, you wait for a new opportunity and bet again. This time you increase the marty to 2-4. You bring it back to 1-2 on a win.

For this method you have to wait for a trigger. You’re betting against a pattern of three repeating itself, but you’re giving it one number in and then betting against it…..

Here’s an example….

1 2 1   1  (Trigger – bet against the pattern (blue) repeating for two bets).

1 2 1   1 2 2 (+1) Lose the first bet (red) but win on the second bet (green). Look for a new opportunity and start again.

Begin test series

2  1  2   2  2  1   (+1)
                     W   
 2  2  1  1  1  2  0  1  1  1  1  2  (+2)
                                              W
1  2  0  1  2  0  1  1  1  1  2 (+3)
                                          W
2  2  2  1  0  2  2  2  1  2  1  0  1  2  1  1  1   (+4)
                                                                   W
1  1  2  1  2   (+5)
                W
1  1  2 1  1  1   (+6)
                 L  W
2  1  2 2  1  1  (+7)
                 L W
2  2  2 2  2  1  (+8)
                 L W
2  1  0  2  2  2  1  2  1  2  1  1  1  1  1  2 (+9)
                                                           L W
2  1  2  1  1  1  (+10)
                    W
1  1  0  1  2  2  2  1  2  1  (+11)
                                     W
2  2  1  1  2  2  1  2  2  2   (+12)
                                  L  W
1  1  1  2  2  1  2  2  (+9)  1  1  (+1 separate mini-lab betting)
                         L  L            L  W
We lost, however the triplet pattern has just repeated itself twice. You can now bet against the appearance of the third triplet.   When betting against the appearance of the third triplet, I’m going to use the mini-lab and record the results separately. 

Now back to normal betting, although you will have to increase marty to 2-4 when the next betting opportunity comes along.

2  0  2  2  1  2  1  1  2  (+11)  Set marty back to 1-2 for next betting opportunity

1  2  1  1  2  0  (+8) Increase marty to 2-4 for next betting opportunity
                 L  L
2  2  1  1  2  2  1  2  1  (+10)  Set marty back to 1-2 for next betting opportunity
                             L  W
1  1  2  1  1  1  (+11)
                 L W
2  2  1  0  1  2  1 1  1 (+12)
                                 W
2  1  2    2 1  1 (+13)
                   L  W
2  2  1    2  2  1  (+10)    2  2  2 (-1 mini-lab separate betting)
                   L  L                L  L  W
Increase marty to 2-4 for next betting opportunity
2  2  1  1  1   1  1  2 (+12)
                            L  W
Set marty back to 1-2 for next betting opportunity
1  0  1   2  2  2    2  2  1  (+13)
                                L  W
2  1  1  0  1  1  1  2  1  1  1  (+14)
                                          W
1  0  2   2  2  2  2  2  2  (+11)  1 (+3)
                                L  L             W
Increase marty to 2-4 for next betting opportunity
2  2  0   1  1  2    1  2  (+13)
                                W
Set marty back to 1-2 for next betting opportunity
2  2  2  1  2  2  2  (+14)
                         W
+14  (normal betting)  +3 (third triplet betting)
____________
Total +17
_____________

Quite complicated but I thought I would put it out there anyway, it won't be for everyone.  Other methods are simpler…..

Stay away from cows and boobies…..  ;D
works well bet get some units and then switch methods .👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 13, 05:07 PM 2019
Here are som LW results from method 5
wwlw+2
Wwww+4
Wllwww+2
Llwlwl+0
Llwlww+0
Wwwww+5
Lwwww+4
Lllww-1
Wwww+4
Wwllllw-1
Llllwww-1
Wwwlllw+1
Wllllwwwww+2
Lwwllw+0
Wwwww+5
Lwwlw+1
Lllww-1
Lllwwllllw-4
Llww+0
Wllllw-2lwwllww+1
315 spin flat as for for those who don’t like progression

Unbelievable Winner. I can't believe you're doing this on a double zero wheel. What a system!!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mako on Mar 13, 05:31 PM 2019
Unbelievable Winner. I can't believe you're doing this on a double zero wheel. What a system!!

Agree, pretty incredible.  Imagine how well it must do on a French 0 wheel with La Partage... :love:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 13, 06:06 PM 2019
I tried your #5 idea which you said was "best":

211-2 w
121-1 w
221-111-11212-2 LLLw
211-2 w
122-1 w
222-2 w
222-2 w
122-21 Lw
1221 w
111-221 LLw
222-2 w
212-2 w
221-12 Lw
112-1 w
121-1 w
212-2 w
111-1 w
212-12 Lw
221-2 w
112-1 w
221-2 w
212-2 w
222-111-211-12 LLLLw
112-1 w
212-2 w

25 wins
Longest Losing run=4
Nice - Could be decent with suitable progression! :)
I stopped after each win and restart tracking on new line.

PS - OH! just realised I had bet the first leg of the starting triplet for max of 3 times - and NOT the dominant!!!!
Still it seemed to work good :)
EG 112 - bet the 1
EG 212 - bet the 2
EG 122 - bet the 1

A.

Another session - same method as above (winner's #5 idea with my adjustment):

221-12w
121-221LLw
212-2w
211-2w
212-2w
112-1w
222-2w
121-21Lw
121-1w
212-112LLw
122-1w
122-1w
222-2w
111-2222121-1LLLw
211-12Lw
222-112LLw
211-2w
111-21Lw
122-21Lw
222-2w
222-1111221LLLw
112-1w
212-2w
221-112LLw
221-12Lw
112-1w
112-1w
111-1w
222-2w
112-21Lw
221-1111111221-2LLLw
222-1111212-2LLLw
222-2w
122-1w

34 wins.
25 loss.
= +9 flatbet

More with suitable progression. :)
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 13, 06:14 PM 2019
Another session - same method as above (winner's #5 idea with my adjustment):

221-12w
121-221LLw
212-2w
211-2w
212-2w
112-1w
222-2w
121-21Lw
121-1w
212-112LLw
122-1w
122-1w
222-2w
111-2222121-1LLLw
211-12Lw
222-112LLw
211-2w
111-21Lw
122-21Lw
222-2w
222-1111221LLLw
112-1w
212-2w
221-112LLw
221-12Lw
112-1w
112-1w
111-1w
222-2w
112-21Lw
221-1111111221-2LLLw
222-1111212-2LLLw
222-2w
122-1w

34 wins.
25 loss.
= +9 flatbet

More with suitable progression. :)
A.

I'll take +9 flat bet any day. Very minimal risk. Nice result!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 13, 10:21 PM 2019
I tried your #5 idea which you said was "best":

211-2 w
121-1 w
221-111-11212-2 LLLw
211-2 w
122-1 w
222-2 w
222-2 w
122-21 Lw
1221 w
111-221 LLw
222-2 w
212-2 w
221-12 Lw
112-1 w
121-1 w
212-2 w
111-1 w
212-12 Lw
221-2 w
112-1 w
221-2 w
212-2 w
222-111-211-12 LLLLw
112-1 w
212-2 w

25 wins
Longest Losing run=4
Nice - Could be decent with suitable progression! :)
I stopped after each win and restart tracking on new line.

PS - OH! just realised I had bet the first leg of the starting triplet for max of 3 times - and NOT the dominant!!!!
Still it seemed to work good :)
EG 112 - bet the 1
EG 212 - bet the 2
EG 122 - bet the 1

A.

Can you answer a question?

Why not betting the dominant on this EG 122?

I use a similar system when I'm playing baccarat. This is an old system.

EX: BPP  I bet 3 times P

The advantage of playin baccarat using this system is that there's no zero.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 13, 10:39 PM 2019
Can you answer a question?

Why not betting the dominant on this EG 122?

I use a similar system when I'm playing baccarat. This is an old system.

EX: BPP  I bet 3 times P

The advantage of playin baccarat using this system is that there's no zero.
Zeros don’t effect these method and I only play double 00 and it does well . In 50000 trials never seen 18 in row of any paired group.
Triplets have  never seen 6 in row so the zeros help breakup the pattern just like the ties in Baccarat. So I no for a fact what the wheel doesn’t do.its just a matter finding what It does often.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 13, 10:53 PM 2019
Another session - same method as above (winner's #5 idea with my adjustment):

221-12w
121-221LLw
212-2w
211-2w
212-2w
112-1w
222-2w
121-21Lw
121-1w
212-112LLw
122-1w
122-1w
222-2w
111-2222121-1LLLw
211-12Lw
222-112LLw
211-2w
111-21Lw
122-21Lw
222-2w
222-1111221LLLw
112-1w
212-2w
221-112LLw
221-12Lw
112-1w
112-1w
111-1w
222-2w
112-21Lw
221-1111111221-2LLLw
222-1111212-2LLLw
222-2w
122-1w

34 wins.
25 loss.
= +9 flatbet

More with suitable progression. :)
A.
I got +5 from you ex Atlantis still good for.fb
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 13, 11:23 PM 2019
WINNER

How about using a trigger?

1 2 1  2 (one virtual loss) and bet the dominant (1) using a two steps progression.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 14, 12:19 AM 2019
Can someone test it? FB or using progression

When you see:

B  B  bet B  - if win, start again

R R bet R  - if win, start again

When you lose you can use a progression waiting for a hit.

B B R lose - start the progression
R R B lose - second step of the progression
B B B win - third step of the progression

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 14, 12:32 AM 2019
When you see: B B or R R

B  B  bet B  - if win, start again

R R bet R  - if win, start again

When you lose you can use a progression waiting for a hit.

For example:

B B R lose (wait for another trigger) - start the progression
R R B lose (wait for another trigger) - second step of the progression
B B  B win - third step of the progression
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 14, 12:44 AM 2019
I'm sorry . I forgot to mention something.

Wait for 3 or 2 virtual losses.

Ex

B B R first virtual loss
B B R second virtual loss
R R B third virtual loss

Start

The goal is to have

BBB
or RRR
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 14, 01:59 AM 2019
Betting The Dominant - Powerful Progression

2 1 2 (2 is the dominant)

So let's suppose:

B R B (B is the dominant)

There are only four blacks on the first collum.

So you will place one chip on the second collum and one chip on the third collum.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 14, 12:28 PM 2019
Betting The Dominant - Powerful Progression

2 1 2 (2 is the dominant)

So let's suppose:

B R B (B is the dominant)

There are only four blacks on the first collum.

So you will place one chip on the second collum and one chip on the third collum.
I would not bet on 24 numbers

first Colum has 6 blacks.



Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 14, 12:50 PM 2019

first Colum has 6 blacks.

You're wrong, there are only 4 blacks

Whatever.  Forget it.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 14, 01:50 PM 2019
You're wrong, there are only 4 blacks

Whatever.  Forget it.
Chill out my boy are you taking the first colum.147 10 13 16 19 22 25 28 31 34 ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: ludo8400 on Mar 14, 03:05 PM 2019
Chill out my boy are you taking the first colum.147 10 13 16 19 22 25 28 31 34 ?

@ winner

the black numbers in the first colum are : 4,  10, 13, 22, 28 and 31 = TOTAL = 6

 :)
ludo8400
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 14, 03:09 PM 2019
Sorry, I meant the third collum.

6  15  24  33

I'm playing this way right now.

For example

2 1 2 (2 is the dominant)

B R B (B is the dominant)

I place one chip on the first and on the second collum

Doing great until now
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 14, 03:24 PM 2019
@ winner

the black numbers in the first colum are : 4,  10, 13, 22, 28 and 31 = TOTAL = 6

 :)
ludo8400
Yes I’m aware of that .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: 6th-sense on Mar 14, 04:00 PM 2019
Betting The Dominant - Powerful Progression

2 1 2 (2 is the dominant)

So let's suppose:

B R B (B is the dominant)

There are only four blacks on the first collum.

So you will place one chip on the second collum and one chip on the third collum.

Might as well play abc and follow the colour..into missing a b or c and cover yourself on last dozen out and straight colour numbers on missing a b or c..
If your going to narrow winners bet down just go for numbers out instead
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 14, 06:41 PM 2019
I like this one.

Your goal is to have B B B or R R R

Wait for (2 or 3 virtual losses)

Ex: B B R first v loss
       R R B second v loss

Wait for the trigger:

R R or
B B

If you got B B bet B (Place a chip on the first and second column) or B outside bet

If you got R R bet R (Place a chip on the first and third column) or R outside bet
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 14, 11:01 PM 2019
This is a nice profit earner . Got up this morning had my first cup of coffee and I thought I know what the wheel can’t do but what does it do often  .
The #3 in a session plays a big role .Now I have tested this many times and had great results a little slower but none the less  good profit .
Here is a list for people just coming on the seen and doesn’t know what the hell is  going on.
Here is a list of ways to play.
1 -bet either 1sor 2s flat bet until your +1 stop move to next method
2- bet opposite or same from first pattern until +1 flat bet move to next method
3-bet for magic 30 until 1 unit +
4-bet either 1or2s count -4 without betting virtually ,then bet 248163264 for 1 unit , risky yes use at your desecration
5 the best one . You track the first 3 and you bet the dominant until you hit 3 ex
112 I’ll bet 1 firt 3 spins if you lose wait for the break and retract another .
Ex 112 1 w
112 -221.w
112-222 L wait for it to break
112-22222221 here’s the break
112-2222222121bet 1 for3 spins
Hope this help everyone and like mister Eko says milk the boobies don’t kill them.

I think I am missing something.

1 1 2 is for example, same of B B R or L L H?

When I see B B R Do I bet B (the dominant) for 3 times?
Or when I see L L H Do I bet L (the dominant) for 3 times?

Am I right?

Thanks in advance
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 14, 11:03 PM 2019
When I have a win how and when should I restart/retrack?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Roulettebeater on Mar 15, 01:16 AM 2019
When I have a win how and when should I restart/retrack?

André
Didn’t you say one day that roulette is unbeatable and you stopped playing ?

What happened since then ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 15, 01:30 AM 2019
André
Didn’t you say one day that roulette is unbeatable and you stopped playing ?

What happened since then ?

Nope, I never stop playing roulette.

I play baccarat everyday and I like to try new strategies on roulette.

You can't become a millionaire playing roulette. You have to grind it to make some money. Hit and run style. Play one session and get out of the table.

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Roulettebeater on Mar 15, 01:59 AM 2019
Nope, I never stop playing roulette.

I play baccarat everyday and I like to try new strategies on roulette.

You can't become a millionaire playing roulette. You have to grind it to make some money. Hit and run style. Play one session and get out of the table.

Cheers

And what system are you using ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 15, 02:08 AM 2019
I've completed a few more tests of the system I posted a couple of days ago.

A reminder of the rules, this method consists of placing only two bets. At the end of the two bets, win or lose, you stop. Look for a new opportunity and restart.  The most you can lose per sequence is two bets in a row. You use a 1-2 marty, therefore the most you can lose is 3 units. 

For this method you have to wait for a trigger. You’re betting against a pattern of three repeating itself, but you’re giving it one number in and then betting against it…..

Here’s an example….

1 2 1   1  Trigger – bet against the pattern (underlined).

1 2 1   1 2 2 (+1) Lose the first bet (red) but win on the second bet (green). L W + 1 unit

If you lose the two bets, then the triplet has repeated itself twice. You now bet against the triplet repeating itself 3 times. I always record these bets separately and I use a mini lab for the wager. See below.... All bets against the appearance of the third triplet are recorded in blue. These bets have a (T) in front of them.

Underlined numbers - The first triplet which we will bet against.
Blue numbers - The appearance of the third triplet. I bet this separately (T).
Red numbers - losing bet
Green numbers - Winning bet

TEST SERIES

111 222 222 (T)221 122 211              (LL-3)  (LLW-1) 
122 212 121 212 121 121                   (LL-3)                     
(T)2 122 121 211 211 (T)1 121 1        (W+2) (LW+1) (LL-3) (W+2) 
12 1112 2111 112 10111 1                 (W+1) (LW+1)                         
21 212 22 211 211 (T)22 112              (W+1) (W+1) (LL-3) (LW+1)     
111 12201 212 212 (T)12 121             (W+1) (LL-3) (W+2)                  
122 211 22 221 222 2 121                   (LW+1) (W+1) (LW+1)             
11 1 212 22 222 222 (T)1 112               (W+1) (W+1) (LL-3) (W+2)      
112 (T)2 211 22 12220 222 21               (LL-3) (W+2) (W+1) (W+1)   
121 121 (T)11 120 121 11 1 212           (LL-3) (LW+1) (W+1)
22 222 110 211 212 2111                       (W+1) (LW+1)                               
12 111 020 221 112 111 2022                 (W+1) (LW+1)                       
1 112 12 0 121 11 12121 11                    (W+1)  (W+1)  (W+1)           
211 22 112 110 (T)02 221 221 (T)1      (W+1) (LL-3)  (LW+1)  (LL-3)  (W+2)  
2121 212 22 2111 222 221                  (W+1)  (LW+1) 

I finished this session at +8 units.

Fairly slow but reasonably safe.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: poluvolo on Mar 15, 06:27 AM 2019
Great  job  jono 1167
cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 15, 07:24 AM 2019
Hi Jono, very good job indeed but i have a few queries:
 a)  I can see that the bold trigger has always to match with 1st leg of previous triplet  but how you pick this base triplet in a session? You track always for the appearance of xxx+x to start betting?
 b) You stick  to 1-2 prog for 2 first bets, dont go for 2-4 on a loss  anymore?
 c) How exactly you play the mini lab (eg 1st blue triplet 111 minus, how you bet next blues, can you give a short example with few of them)?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 15, 08:08 AM 2019

Hi Loukoumas,

Yes that is how I am playing it, but you don't need to restrict to lines of 9 as I showed in Mister Eko's results.
Just track the 'pair' results until you see ANY double triplet trigger eg:

112211222111221(112112)12  = LW

HINT: Do it on a rolling basis - always look back at the last six results in the tracking history to check for the next double triplet trigger...

A.

I just mention, though it pretty obvious, that to cut down on waiting time and increase number of bet opportunities can separately track RB and OE EC results and bet after formation of double 'triplets' on those too. :)
Easier with a tracker prog or sheet though ;)
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: shoust on Mar 15, 08:46 AM 2019
Hi Winner, based on your post describing the magic 30 on page 40, when you record the results,do you bet every spin after the first 3 or every other spin?
EG: LLLLHLHLHL would give chop run scenario 222111111 (what I've been looking at, recording the chops and runs after every new number), or every two spins 22111 (what seems to be the case after reading deeper, recording chops and runs after every pair of numbers.).

Thanks
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 15, 09:09 AM 2019
Hi Winner, based on your post describing the magic 30 on page 40, when you record the results,do you bet every spin after the first 3 or every other spin?
EG: LLLLHLHLHL would give chop run scenario 222111111 (what I've been looking at, recording the chops and runs after every new number), or every two spins 22111 (what seems to be the case after reading deeper, recording chops and runs after every pair of numbers.).

Thanks
Yes I play continuously
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: shoust on Mar 15, 09:36 AM 2019
Ok thanks, I was asking because I made a webpage that calculates the next suggestion using the same method, open up the html file in your browser of choice and choose the EC you want to play, you then input the first 4 results to see what to bet next. Default game is Baccarat and default progression is Martingale.
Enjoy
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 15, 09:40 AM 2019
Ok thanks, I was asking because I made a webpage that calculates the next suggestion using the same method, open up the html file in your browser of choice and choose the EC you want to play, you then input the first 4 results to see what to bet next. Default game is Baccarat and default progression is Martingale.
Enjoy
nice Thanks.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 15, 09:42 AM 2019
I just mention, though it pretty obvious, that to cut down on waiting time and increase number of bet opportunities can separately track RB and OE EC results and bet after formation of double 'triplets' on those too. :)
Easier with a tracker prog or sheet though ;)
A.
This is why you have to figure out how to blend the choice of play with a play to while the time.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 15, 02:13 PM 2019
So what does all this testing teach us as far as games with uneven payouts .
The longer you play the greater the chance of losing .The  shorter the sessions the greater chance of winning.
+4 at 50 place bets is ideal .if your on a streak just keep playing but never give all back ,never go below +4.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 15, 02:48 PM 2019
Hi Jono, very good job indeed but i have a few queries:
 a)  I can see that the bold trigger has always to match with 1st leg of previous triplet  but how you pick this base triplet in a session? You track always for the appearance of xxx+x to start betting?
 b) You stick  to 1-2 prog for 2 first bets, dont go for 2-4 on a loss  anymore?
 c) How exactly you play the mini lab (eg 1st blue triplet 111 minus, how you bet next blues, can you give a short example with few of them)?

No worries. I’ll answer your queries. To begin with, I came up with this method when I was testing Atlantis’ method of betting against the third triplet appearing. There’s a lot of waiting around in that method, so this provides opportunities whilst waiting for that third triplet to appear.

A) correct, I just wait for the first triplet to begin repeating itself. E.g. 2 1 1  2..... Start betting here because the first triplet has begun repeating.

B) Correct, I now just use the 1 2 Marty. If I have two losses, I take the -3 units and move on. This is the most you can lose at this stage.

C) I’ll explain the mini-lab. At this stage, the string will look like this: 2 1 1  2 1 1. You now begin to bet against the appearance of the third triplet appearing. This will last for three bets. Of course, the triplet could repeat again, in which case you would end up betting against the triplet appearing for the fourth time. This is very rare and it hasn’t happened to me yet, but no doubt it will in the future.

Anyway, at this stage we’re betting against the triplet appearing for the third time. 2 1 1  2 1 1. I record these bets separately using the mini lab.

The first mini-lab bet is 1-1 (1+1 =2). We lose. (String now looks like this: 2 1 1  2 1 1  2). The second mini-lab bet is 1-1-2 (1 + 2. Add two outside numbers). We lose again. (String now looks like this: 2 1 1  2 1 1  2 1). The third mini-lab bet is 1-1-2-3 (1 + 4 Add two outside numbers). We win. (LLW -1). The string now looks like this:  2 1 1  2 1 1  2 1 2.
Remember, next time you use the mini-lab,  it carries over, it will look like this: 1-2-3. Your first bet will be four.

That’s it.... The method isn’t perfect but it’s what I’ve been experimenting with. If you can improve it, please do.

For now I’m going to test Winners ‘Dominant 3’ method. I’ll post results later...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 15, 02:55 PM 2019
Very clever, Jono = I like your use of the mini-lab when playing against the repeating triplet! Good stuff. A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 15, 09:56 PM 2019
No worries. I’ll answer your queries. To begin with, I came up with this method when I was testing Atlantis’ method of betting against the third triplet appearing. There’s a lot of waiting around in that method, so this provides opportunities whilst waiting for that third triplet to appear.

A) correct, I just wait for the first triplet to begin repeating itself. E.g. 2 1 1  2..... Start betting here because the first triplet has begun repeating.

B) Correct, I now just use the 1 2 Marty. If I have two losses, I take the -3 units and move on. This is the most you can lose at this stage.

C) I’ll explain the mini-lab. At this stage, the string will look like this: 2 1 1  2 1 1. You now begin to bet against the appearance of the third triplet appearing. This will last for three bets. Of course, the triplet could repeat again, in which case you would end up betting against the triplet appearing for the fourth time. This is very rare and it hasn’t happened to me yet, but no doubt it will in the future.

Anyway, at this stage we’re betting against the triplet appearing for the third time. 2 1 1  2 1 1. I record these bets separately using the mini lab.

The first mini-lab bet is 1-1 (1+1 =2). We lose. (String now looks like this: 2 1 1  2 1 1  2). The second mini-lab bet is 1-1-2 (1 + 2. Add two outside numbers). We lose again. (String now looks like this: 2 1 1  2 1 1  2 1). The third mini-lab bet is 1-1-2-3 (1 + 4 Add two outside numbers). We win. (LLW -1). The string now looks like this:  2 1 1  2 1 1  2 1 2.
Remember, next time you use the mini-lab,  it carries over, it will look like this: 1-2-3. Your first bet will be four.

That’s it.... The method isn’t perfect but it’s what I’ve been experimenting with. If you can improve it, please do.

For now I’m going to test Winners ‘Dominant 3’ method. I’ll post results later...

Good job jono mate  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 16, 12:47 AM 2019
Dominant 3 System (Winner)

I have just finished testing Winners’s ‘Dominant 3 System’. I had a horror run at the end, but the system still finished positive.

I tested all numbers with the common money management systems. Full results below....

1,1,2 - 2,2,1        LLW -1
2,2,1 - 1,1,1        LLL -3
1,1,1 - 1              W +1
1,1,1 - 1              W +1
1,2,1  - 2,0,1      LLW -1
2,0,1,1 - 2,1       LW 0
2,1,2 - 2            W+1
2,1,2, 2              W+1
2,2,1 - 2            W+1
2,2,2 - 2          W+1
2,2,2, - 1,2        LW 0
1,2,1, - 1.           W+1
1,2,0,1, - 1        W+1
1,2,1, - 2, 1       LW 0
2,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,2 - 2           W+1
2,1,2 - 2          W+1
2,1,2 - 1,2      LW 0
1,2,1 - 1         W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,1    LLW -1
2,2,1 - 1,2     LW 0
1,2,1 - 1        W+1
1,1,2 - 2,2,1     W+1
2,2,1 - 1,1,2    LLW -1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,2     LLL-3
2,2,2 - 1,2       LW 0
1,2,2 - 1,2        LW 0
1,2,1 - 2,2,1     LLW -1
2,2,1 - 2          W+1
2,2,2 - 2         W+1
2,1,1 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,2,1 - 1           W+1
1,2,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,1 - 2,2,1     LLW-1
2,2,1 - 1,1,2     LLW-1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 0,1         LW 0
0,1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL-3
1,1,1 - 2,1         W+1
2,1,1 - 2,2,2     LLL-3
2,2,2- 1,1,2      LLW-1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,2 - 2,1        LW 0
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,1 - 1           W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,1 - 1.          W+1
1,2,1 - 2,1        LW 0
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,1      LLW-1
2,2,1 - 2          W+1
2,1,2 - 2          W+1
2,2,2 - 1,1,1     LLL-3
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,1      W+1
2,2,1 - 1,2        LW 0
1,2,1,l - 1          W+1
1,1,2 - 2,1         LW 0
2,1,1 - 2,1         LW 0
2,1,1 - 2,1        LW 0
2,1,1 - 2,1        LW 0
2,1,0,1 - 2,2,1  LLW -1
2,2,1 - 1,1,0     LLL-3
1,1,0,1 - 1         W+1
1,2,2 - 2           W+1
2,2,1 - 1,1,0     LLL-3
1,1,0,1 - 2,2,2  LLL-3
2,2,2 - 0,0,1    LLL-3
0,0,1,2,2 - 2    W+1
2,2,1, - 2         W+1
2,1,1 - 1           W+1

Results
130 spins
Flat bet: + 9
Limited Marty (1-2-4. Stop): +10
Unlimited Marty (1,2,4,6,16....) +73
Mini lab: +66
Best of five: +26

I thought the mini-lab or best of five worked best. The unlimited Marty had to survive a progression at 128, so it was risky. The only one I didn’t test was the D’ambert. I will test that later.

Any system which gives a profit flat bet is powerful. If not for the bad run at the end, the flat bet was due for around 20 units profit.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 16, 07:19 AM 2019
Dominant 3 System (Winner)

I have just finished testing Winners’s ‘Dominant 3 System’. I had a horror run at the end, but the system still finished positive.

I tested all numbers with the common money management systems. Full results below....

1,1,2 - 2,2,1        LLW -1
2,2,1 - 1,1,1        LLL -3
1,1,1 - 1              W +1
1,1,1 - 1              W +1
1,2,1  - 2,0,1      LLW -1
2,0,1,1 - 2,1       LW 0
2,1,2 - 2            W+1
2,1,2, 2              W+1
2,2,1 - 2            W+1
2,2,2 - 2          W+1
2,2,2, - 1,2        LW 0
1,2,1, - 1.           W+1
1,2,0,1, - 1        W+1
1,2,1, - 2, 1       LW 0
2,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,2 - 2           W+1
2,1,2 - 2          W+1
2,1,2 - 1,2      LW 0
1,2,1 - 1         W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,1    LLW -1
2,2,1 - 1,2     LW 0
1,2,1 - 1        W+1
1,1,2 - 2,2,1     W+1
2,2,1 - 1,1,2    LLW -1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,2     LLL-3
2,2,2 - 1,2       LW 0
1,2,2 - 1,2        LW 0
1,2,1 - 2,2,1     LLW -1
2,2,1 - 2          W+1
2,2,2 - 2         W+1
2,1,1 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,2,1 - 1           W+1
1,2,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,1 - 2,2,1     LLW-1
2,2,1 - 1,1,2     LLW-1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 0,1         LW 0
0,1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL-3
1,1,1 - 2,1         W+1
2,1,1 - 2,2,2     LLL-3
2,2,2- 1,1,2      LLW-1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,2 - 2,1        LW 0
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,1 - 1           W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,1 - 1.          W+1
1,2,1 - 2,1        LW 0
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,1      LLW-1
2,2,1 - 2          W+1
2,1,2 - 2          W+1
2,2,2 - 1,1,1     LLL-3
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,1      W+1
2,2,1 - 1,2        LW 0
1,2,1,l - 1          W+1
1,1,2 - 2,1         LW 0
2,1,1 - 2,1         LW 0
2,1,1 - 2,1        LW 0
2,1,1 - 2,1        LW 0
2,1,0,1 - 2,2,1  LLW -1
2,2,1 - 1,1,0     LLL-3
1,1,0,1 - 1         W+1
1,2,2 - 2           W+1
2,2,1 - 1,1,0     LLL-3
1,1,0,1 - 2,2,2  LLL-3
2,2,2 - 0,0,1    LLL-3
0,0,1,2,2 - 2    W+1
2,2,1, - 2         W+1
2,1,1 - 1           W+1

Results
130 spins
Flat bet: + 9
Limited Marty (1-2-4. Stop): +10
Unlimited Marty (1,2,4,6,16....) +73
Mini lab: +66
Best of five: +26

I thought the mini-lab or best of five worked best. The unlimited Marty had to survive a progression at 128, so it was risky. The only one I didn’t test was the D’ambert. I will test that later.

Any system which gives a profit flat bet is powerful. If not for the bad run at the end, the flat bet was due for around 20 units profit.

Jono, can you explain how the mini lab works? Thank you!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 16, 08:58 AM 2019
Dominant 3 System (Winner)

I have just finished testing Winners’s ‘Dominant 3 System’. I had a horror run at the end, but the system still finished positive.

I tested all numbers with the common money management systems. Full results below....

1,1,2 - 2,2,1        LLW -1
2,2,1 - 1,1,1        LLL -3
1,1,1 - 1              W +1
1,1,1 - 1              W +1
1,2,1  - 2,0,1      LLW -1
2,0,1,1 - 2,1       LW 0
2,1,2 - 2            W+1
2,1,2, 2              W+1
2,2,1 - 2            W+1
2,2,2 - 2          W+1
2,2,2, - 1,2        LW 0
1,2,1, - 1.           W+1
1,2,0,1, - 1        W+1
1,2,1, - 2, 1       LW 0
2,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,2 - 2           W+1
2,1,2 - 2          W+1
2,1,2 - 1,2      LW 0
1,2,1 - 1         W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,1    LLW -1
2,2,1 - 1,2     LW 0
1,2,1 - 1        W+1
1,1,2 - 2,2,1     W+1
2,2,1 - 1,1,2    LLW -1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,2     LLL-3
2,2,2 - 1,2       LW 0
1,2,2 - 1,2        LW 0
1,2,1 - 2,2,1     LLW -1
2,2,1 - 2          W+1
2,2,2 - 2         W+1
2,1,1 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,2,1 - 1           W+1
1,2,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,1 - 2,2,1     LLW-1
2,2,1 - 1,1,2     LLW-1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 0,1         LW 0
0,1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL-3
1,1,1 - 2,1         W+1
2,1,1 - 2,2,2     LLL-3
2,2,2- 1,1,2      LLW-1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,2 - 2,1        LW 0
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,1 - 1           W+1
1,1,2 - 1           W+1
1,2,1 - 1.          W+1
1,2,1 - 2,1        LW 0
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,1      LLW-1
2,2,1 - 2          W+1
2,1,2 - 2          W+1
2,2,2 - 1,1,1     LLL-3
1,1,1 - 1            W+1
1,1,1 - 2,2,1      W+1
2,2,1 - 1,2        LW 0
1,2,1,l - 1          W+1
1,1,2 - 2,1         LW 0
2,1,1 - 2,1         LW 0
2,1,1 - 2,1        LW 0
2,1,1 - 2,1        LW 0
2,1,0,1 - 2,2,1  LLW -1
2,2,1 - 1,1,0     LLL-3
1,1,0,1 - 1         W+1
1,2,2 - 2           W+1
2,2,1 - 1,1,0     LLL-3
1,1,0,1 - 2,2,2  LLL-3
2,2,2 - 0,0,1    LLL-3
0,0,1,2,2 - 2    W+1
2,2,1, - 2         W+1
2,1,1 - 1           W+1

Results
130 spins
Flat bet: + 9
Limited Marty (1-2-4. Stop): +10
Unlimited Marty (1,2,4,6,16....) +73
Mini lab: +66
Best of five: +26

I thought the mini-lab or best of five worked best. The unlimited Marty had to survive a progression at 128, so it was risky. The only one I didn’t test was the D’ambert. I will test that later.

Any system which gives a profit flat bet is powerful. If not for the bad run at the end, the flat bet was due for around 20 units profit.
Hey jono nice job . The couple mistakes I noticed is when you get 3 Ls in a row you need to stop and wait for a break ,this is what I have done and it works .i mentioned this when I wrote the system 3 .
Here is the end where you 9 Ls IN a row.
221-110 lll stop until It breaks
1101-222 here it broke on the 2 following another 22 win
Now here
222-001 LLL stop
001-222 break on the 2 following another 22 win
Hope this helps .
Your ex
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 16, 02:59 PM 2019
Dominant system.  Flat bet
Live wheel
Real money
Chip value $10
Session time about 2h30m playing

1,1,2-1.     W+1
1,1,1-1.     W+1
1,2,1-1.     W+1
1,1,0,1- 2,2,1   LLW -1
2,2,1-1,2. Lw0
1,2,1-2,1.  Lw0
2,1,2-2.     W+1
2,2,2-1,2.  Lw0 
1,2,1-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,1-1.      W+1
1,2,0,2-1,2.  Lw0
1,2,0,1-2,2,1.   LLw-1
2,2,1-1,2.      Lw0
1,2,1-1.      W+1
1,2,0,0,2-1,2.   Lw0
1,2,2-1,1,2.     LLw-1
1,1,2-1.     W+1
1,2,2-1,1,1.   LLL-3
2,1,1-1.   W+1
1,2,1-2,2,1.  LLw-1
2,2,1-2.     W+1
2,2,1-1,1,1.    LLL-3
2,2,2-1,2.     Lw0
1,2,2-1,2.      Lw0
1,2,1-2,2,2.   LLL-3
1,1,1-2,1.     Lw0
2,1,2-2.     W+1
2,1,0,1-2,1.  Lw0
2,1,1-1.  W+1
1,1,2-1.   W+1
1,2,1-1.   W+1
1,1,1-1.   W+1
1,1,1-1.   W+1
1,1,1-1.   W+1

Profit +3

I had a terrible run but I recovered at the end of the session.

Special thanks to Atlantis!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 16, 03:48 PM 2019
If you are lost, here is a full explanation by ATLANTIS on how to play the system:

Track the High/Low EC results in PAIRS. (2 spins of wheel))
Chop=1 eg: HL or LH
Run=2 eg: RR or BB

Record the results as 1's and 2's on a line like this:

112 - when you get ANY three results like this take the DOMINANT result of the triplet and bet it to occur for max of 3 times *OR* take the FIRST result of the triplet and bet it to occur for max of 3 spins. In this case you are betting for a 1 pair result to occur for a max of 3 times only whichever of the 2 betting method you follow (dominant or first only).
REMEMBER TO STOP AT A WINNER and begin to record a NEW LINE of results underneath!

For this small example I choose to always bet the DOMINANT this session:

So after
112- wait for the next SPIN result...
If is H - bet 1u on LOW (betting for a 1: HL)
If it is L - bet 1u on HIGH. (betting for a 1: LH)

If it is "1" result record it like so:

112-1 WON - won first bet. restart

If you win on second bet it will look like this:

112-21 WON second bet; restart

If you win on third bet it will be:

112-221 WON third bet; restart


NOW - If you lose all 3 bets STOP betting for now - will look like:

112-222

Now we track and just wait for a change (in this case a "1" to happen)

112-22222221 - Ok here is the CHANGE- wait for 2 more pair results to complete the triplet:

112-2222222121 - Now take the last triplet - 121 - take the dominant again which is 1 and bet another 3 times on the 1 eg:

112-222-2222121-1 LLLW - you lost three bets then won on the first bet of the second attempt.
 restart again on new line underneath.

Up to you to bet flat or use mild progression eg: best of 5, cyclic betting etc.

++++++++++++++++++

HH LH LL=
    2    1  2 so you bet 2(the dominant)

Or

HL LH HH
   1     1   2 so you bet 1 (the dominant)


And after a win STRAIGHT AWAY YOU RECORD THE NEXT NEW TRIPLET THAT OCCURS.

++++++++++++

My other idea is to bet only when you see a double repeat of a triplet of "pairs". Bet against the same triplet occurring. For example:

You see
121-121- bet against a repeat of 1-2-1 until a win

121-121-11 = LW; restart

eg:

222-222-2 = W; restart

eg:

122-122-121 = LLW; restart

You might have to wait some time for a trigger if using just H/L - so on this particular idea you *could* also record the results separately for the other 2 Ec's: O/E and R/B as well to get more and faster bets to cut down on waiting time. Just stop when you've made a few units!!!!!
I have a target of +3, +4 or +5 depending on how things go and amount of time etc..
I think you have to figure out a suitable progression to make it pay, and apply it individually to each of EC's independently if you're operating it on more than one EC type...

By ATLANTIS
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 16, 03:54 PM 2019
121 2101+1  221+2 111+3 121+4 easy air ball 00 wheel
112 -211+1 221+2 211+3 122+4 easy
212-222+1 211+3 121+4
122-211+1 111+2 121+3 221+4
212-211+1 121+2 1022+3 221+4
212-111+1 212+2 112+3 111+4
Can’t get any easier then this, later this evening go for round 2


Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 16, 04:15 PM 2019
Always love the look on pit bosses face when a player bets the max on an even money say $500 And wins then does this  3 in a row and walks away .there face says it all . WJGF
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 16, 04:42 PM 2019
Jono, can you explain how the mini lab works? Thank you!

No worries Boyd, you can read about the labouchere here: https://www.gamblingsites.com/systems-strategies/labouchere/

I use it like this. Start with 1-1.

First bet 1-1 (1+1 = 2. Lose).

Second bet: Add 2 to the end, giving 1-1-2 (Add outside numbers. 1+2 = 3. Lose)

Third bet: Add 3 to the end, giving 1-1-2-3 (Add outside numbers. 1+3 = 4. Win)

Fourth bet: Remove outside numbers, (1 and 3), leaving 1-2. Add 1 and 2 =3. Win.

Fifth bet. Back to 1-1 etc...

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 16, 04:47 PM 2019
Hey jono nice job . The couple mistakes I noticed is when you get 3 Ls in a row you need to stop and wait for a break ,this is what I have done and it works .i mentioned this when I wrote the system 3 .
Here is the end where you 9 Ls IN a row.
221-110 lll stop until It breaks
1101-222 here it broke on the 2 following another 22 win
Now here
222-001 LLL stop
001-222 break on the 2 following another 22 win
Hope this helps .
Your ex

Thanks Winner. Great advice!
I will apply it to the next series.

Dominant 3 is my favourite system. Simple and effective.

Thanks for all the help Winner
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 16, 04:53 PM 2019
Profit +3

I had a terrible run but I recovered at the end of the session.

Special thanks to Atlantis!

Nice work. I’ll take 3 units flat bet any day!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 16, 07:23 PM 2019
Thanks Winner. Great advice!
I will apply it to the next series.

Dominant 3 is my favourite system. Simple and effective.

Thanks for all the help Winner

Jono, are you palying now AGAISNT the first 3 dominant spin, or the SAME i nthe next 3 spins?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 16, 07:32 PM 2019
My Agaianst, and Same betting type works not bad, but you must know when to switch. I choose 222 and 111 no bet because of long series of 1111111 or 2222222 or 111222111222. Rather no bet. But see when I switch.


2,2,1, (A) 2,2,1, -3 A 1,1,2, +0 A 2,1,1, +1 S 2,1,2, +2 S 1,2,1, +5 A 2,2,1, +4 S 1,1,2, +2 A 2,2,2, +3 nb 1,1,1, nb 2,1,1, A 2,2,1, +2 S 2,2,1, +5 A 1,1,2, +8 A 2,1,2, +7 S 2,1,2, +10 A 2,2,2, nb

Flatbet +10
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 16, 07:38 PM 2019
Nice work. I’ll take 3 units flat bet any day!

Thank you Jono!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 16, 07:42 PM 2019
Another rough session

Dominant system.  Flat bet
Live wheel
Real money
Chip value $10
Session time around 1h40m playing

2,1,1-1.  W+1
1,1,1-2,2,2.  LLL-3
1,1,2-2,1.  Lw0
2,1,2-2.  W+1
2,2,1-2.  W+1
2,2,1-2.   W+1
2,1,2-0,1,1.    LLL-3
2,2,1-2.   W+1
2,1,2-1,0,1.   LLL-3
2,2,2-2.    W+1
2,2,1-2.   W+1
2,2,2-2.   W+1
2,2,2-2.   W+1
2,2,1-2.   W+1
2,1,2 -2.   W+1
2,2,1-2.    W+1
2,2,2-1,2.  Lw0
1,2,2-1,2.  WL0
1,2,2-2.   W+1

Profit +4
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: ozon on Mar 16, 08:19 PM 2019
Hi Andre
I have a question from another topic
We probably play some online casinos with one source of live view for bacaratts and roulette.
My question is how you can win the money there, I'm a little above the money I put in and the game is not possible there, all the time of disconnection and I can not play the next spin on roulette.
For me, if you are a profitable player, playing online is almost completely impossible. They try to make it impossible to do so.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 16, 08:23 PM 2019
Jono, are you palying now AGAISNT the first 3 dominant spin, or the SAME i nthe next 3 spins?

Hi Mister Eko - I’m playing the same as the last 3 dominant.

2,2,1 - 2          W

1,1,1 - 2,1      LW

So far it’s very consistent. I’ll post some more results later.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 16, 08:49 PM 2019
Hi Mister Eko - I’m playing the same as the last 3 dominant.

2,2,1 - 2          W

1,1,1 - 2,1      LW

So far it’s very consistent. I’ll post some more results later.

With which progression?

I thought while now in ylur tests you played against repeating triplets with 2 bets marty.

After wim you recalculate the last 3 spins or do you collect fresh 3 number?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 16, 09:05 PM 2019
With which progression?

I thought while now in ylur tests you played against repeating triplets with 2 bets marty.

After wim you recalculate the last 3 spins or do you collect fresh 3 number?

Sorry Mister Eko - yesterday I started testing Winner’s ‘dominant three’ system.

The best way to play this system is flat-bet or with mini lab. I like Winner’s system because it is very simple.

I will post more results later today.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 12:07 AM 2019
Reality Shock

Dominant system.  Flat bet
Live wheel
Real money
Chip value $10
Session time around 2h00m playing

1,2,1-1.    W+1
2,1,1-2,2,2.    LLL-3
1,1,0,1-1.   W+1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,2-1,1,1    LLL-3
2,1,2-1,1,2.  LLw-1
1,1,2-1.  W+1
1,2,2-1,2.  Lw0
1,2,2-2.   W+1
2,1,2-1,1,2.   LLw-1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,2-1,2.   Lw0
1,2,2-1,1,2.   LLw-1
1,2,2-1,2.   Lw0
1,2,2-2.   W+1
2,1,2-2.   W+1
2,2,1-1,1,1.   LLL-3
2,1,2-1,1,2.   LLW-1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,1-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,1-1.   W+1
1,1,2-2,2,2.   LLL-3

Profit -9



Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 12:38 AM 2019
Reality Shock

Dominant system.  Flat bet
Live wheel
Real money
Chip value $10
Session time around 2h00m playing

1,2,1-1.    W+1
2,1,1-2,2,2.    LLL-3
1,1,0,1-1.   W+1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,2-1,1,1    LLL-3
2,1,2-1,1,2.  LLw-1
1,1,2-1.  W+1
1,2,2-1,2.  Lw0
1,2,2-2.   W+1
2,1,2-1,1,2.   LLw-1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,2-1,2.   Lw0
1,2,2-1,1,2.   LLw-1
1,2,2-1,2.   Lw0
1,2,2-2.   W+1
2,1,2-2.   W+1
2,2,1-1,1,1.   LLL-3
2,1,2-1,1,2.   LLW-1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,1-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,1-1.   W+1
1,1,2-2,2,2.   LLL-3

Profit -9
121
121-3
122nb
211+1
011+2
112+3done session
212nb
121+1
112+2
121+3done session

122nb
121+1
222+2
212+3
112+4 done
121nb
212+1
122+2
112+3
122+4 done
222nb
212+1
222+2
111+3
121+4 done
211nb
221+1
211+2
212+3
111+4 done
Here are your number Andre +4 is win target as you can see when I’m done I do not finish with the rest of the numbers in the session.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 12:57 AM 2019
121
121-3
122nb
211+1
011+2
112+3done session
212nb
121+1
112+2
121+3done session

122nb
121+1
222+2
212+3
112+4 done
121nb
212+1
122+2
112+3
122+4 done
222nb
212+1
222+2
111+3
121+4 done
211nb
221+1
211+2
212+3
111+4 done
Here are your number Andre +4 is win target as you can see when I’m done I do not finish with the rest of the numbers in the session.

Nope, I recorded wrong.

1,2,1-1.    W+1
1,1,1-2,2,2.    LLL-3 it's num 1
1,1,0,1-1.   W+1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,2-1,1,1    LLL-3
2,1,2-1,1,2.  LLw-1
1,1,2-1.  W+1
1,2,2-1,2.  Lw0
1,2,2-2.   W+1
2,1,2-1,1,2.   LLw-1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,2-1,2.   Lw0
1,2,2-1,1,2.   LLw-1
1,2,2-1,2.   Lw0
1,2,2-2.   W+1
2,1,2-2.   W+1
2,2,1-1,1,1.   LLL-3
2,1,2-1,1,2.   LLW-1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,1-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,1-1.   W+1
1,1,2-2,2,2.   LLL-3

Profit -9
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 17, 01:41 AM 2019
Guys,

I just finished a 55 spin session of the dominant system. I hit a bad stretch and the mini lab increased alarmingly in a short space of time. Although it recovered, if I was playing with real money, I wouldn’t have had the nerve to keep going.

For that reason,  I’m not going to use the mini lab again....

Having said that, the flat-bet still finished with a profit.

I’m now going to try the d’alembert. It might not increase as quickly as the Labouchère. I’ll post the full results of  today’s session tomorrow when I can access my computer.

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 17, 01:49 AM 2019
Reality Shock

Dominant system.  Flat bet
Live wheel
Real money
Chip value $10
Session time around 2h00m playing

1,2,1-1.    W+1
2,1,1-2,2,2.    LLL-3
1,1,0,1-1.   W+1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,2-1,1,1    LLL-3
2,1,2-1,1,2.  LLw-1
1,1,2-1.  W+1
1,2,2-1,2.  Lw0
1,2,2-2.   W+1
2,1,2-1,1,2.   LLw-1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,2-1,2.   Lw0
1,2,2-1,1,2.   LLw-1
1,2,2-1,2.   Lw0
1,2,2-2.   W+1
2,1,2-2.   W+1
2,2,1-1,1,1.   LLL-3
2,1,2-1,1,2.   LLW-1
1,1,2-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,1-2,1.   Lw0
2,1,1-1.   W+1
1,1,2-2,2,2.   LLL-3

Profit -9

Sorry Andre.

Thanks for posting the results. It’s good to hear the good and bad.

I was just about to test the dominant system with the d’lalembert. I wonder how your numbers would have gone with this?

Overall I’m very cautious and I would rather take the occasional loss flat-bet than take a huge hit when a progression fails.

You have played a few games now. Are you up overall?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 05:57 AM 2019
121
121-3
122nb
211+1
011+2
112+3done session
212nb
121+1
112+2
121+3done session

122nb
121+1
222+2
212+3
112+4 done
121nb
212+1
122+2
112+3
122+4 done
222nb
212+1
222+2
111+3
121+4 done
211nb
221+1
211+2
212+3
111+4 done
Here are your number Andre +4 is win target as you can see when I’m done I do not finish with the rest of the numbers in the session.

I don't see any sense here.
It seems you changed mostly the results just to fit in your system. No offense.
When we lose 3 times in a row we have to track and just wait for a change (in this case a "1" to happen)
112-22222221 - Ok here is the CHANGE- wait for 2 more pair results to complete the triplet:
112-2222222121 - Now take the last triplet - 121 - take the dominant again which is 1 and bet another 3 times on the 1 eg:

By the way what's "nb"? And for what it is?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 17, 06:46 AM 2019
Andre,

The thing is - winner's system and any or all of the variations posted cannot ALWAYS win by flatbet alone and EVERY TIME. This should not be so much of a shock to anybody; winner already said as much and even stated you can only really win by using some kind of progression...
I find the results aren't too bad with any of the ideas. You do get regular wins. The losses will happen as you showed but even those might be contained if using a clever type of progression. However - It is a LONG LOSING RUN that is going to kill it and if using standard marti will prove quite COSTLY when it does happen.
I posted the idea of wait until 2 same triplets then bet against a third same happening  because of the fact that 6 triplets of same in a row was very, very rare - but still, to win overall requires use of a progression because you do not know at what step of the betting line the win will eventually come...

212-212-1w

122-122-2w

121-121-11Lw

121-121-11Lw

111-111-112LLw

121-121-121-122 LLLLLw

Regards,
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Mar 17, 07:19 AM 2019
I don't see any sense here.
It seems you changed mostly the results just to fit in your system. No offense.


By the way what's "nb"? And for what it is?

I think nb means "no bet" while he waits for something to happen. Then he bets accordingly.

But whether you bet patterns according to what just happened, or just bet the same colour all the time, or use something like Downtown's matrix, it is all exactly the same thing.

You can make some steady money with a Marty with any bet selection until it blows up on you.

Personally if you are going to bet on EC, I like the matrix. As good as any other, but psychologically, it takes the pressure off bet selection ideas or changing them around etc.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 09:02 AM 2019
@Andre how much money do think you can make flat betting in 50 spins ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 09:16 AM 2019
I don't see any sense here.
It seems you changed mostly the results just to fit in your system. No offense.
When we lose 3 times in a row we have to track and just wait for a change (in this case a "1" to happen)
112-22222221 - Ok here is the CHANGE- wait for 2 more pair results to complete the triplet:
112-2222222121 - Now take the last triplet - 121 - take the dominant again which is 1 and bet another 3 times on the 1 eg:

By the way what's "nb"? And for what it is?
It seems you changed mostly the results just to fit you system.
To quote Bruce Lee
You put water into a cup it becomes the cup
You put water into a tea pot it becomes the tea pot
You put water into a bottle it becomes the bottle
Be water my friend .
I can only give the boat to cross the river then it’s up to you to cross.
Be aware of the 🐊 they can kill you.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 10:19 AM 2019
Air ball last night
212 111 +1 222 +2 0212 +3 111+4. 12.   
111 1101 -7 221  222+1 122 +2  22
221 212+1 2202+2 222-7 222121
121 -7 211+1 0100+2 202+3 120+4 2 lots of zero
112 2022+1 112+2 122+3 221+4 2112
2hrs play
+16

       
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 01:25 PM 2019
It seems you changed mostly the results just to fit you system.
To quote Bruce Lee
You put water into a cup it becomes the cup
You put water into a tea pot it becomes the tea pot
You put water into a bottle it becomes the bottle
Be water my friend .
I can only give the boat to cross the river then it’s up to you to cross.
Be aware of the 🐊 they can kill you.

To quote Friedrich Nietzsche

People don't want to hear the truth because they don't want their illusions destroyed.

And the truth is nobody can beat roulette in long term.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 17, 01:25 PM 2019
My Agaianst, and Same betting type works not bad, but you must know when to switch. I choose 222 and 111 no bet because of long series of 1111111 or 2222222 or 111222111222. Rather no bet. But see when I switch.


2,2,1, (A) 2,2,1, -3 A 1,1,2, +0 A 2,1,1, +1 S 2,1,2, +2 S 1,2,1, +5 A 2,2,1, +4 S 1,1,2, +2 A 2,2,2, +3 nb 1,1,1, nb 2,1,1, A 2,2,1, +2 S 2,2,1, +5 A 1,1,2, +8 A 2,1,2, +7 S 2,1,2, +10 A 2,2,2, nb

Flatbet +10

Hi Mister Eko,
Great idea!
Could you clarify a bit more on the trigger you use to switch between A and S please?
I like your idea of no-bet the 111 and 222 combo's too.
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 01:27 PM 2019
To quote Friedrich Nietzsche

People don't want to hear the truth because they don't want their illusions destroyed.

And the truth is nobody can beat roulette in long term.
Is long term 1 day 100 years .I always laugh at this when gamblers lose.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 01:38 PM 2019
Andre,

The thing is - winner's system and any or all of the variations posted cannot ALWAYS win by flatbet alone and EVERY TIME. This should not be so much of a shock to anybody; winner already said as much and even stated you can only really win by using some kind of progression...
I find the results aren't too bad with any of the ideas. You do get regular wins. The losses will happen as you showed but even those might be contained if using a clever type of progression. However - It is a LONG LOSING RUN that is going to kill it and if using standard marti will prove quite COSTLY when it does happen.
I posted the idea of wait until 2 same triplets then bet against a third same happening  because of the fact that 6 triplets of same in a row was very, very rare - but still, to win overall requires use of a progression because you do not know at what step of the betting line the win will eventually come...

212-212-1w

122-122-2w

121-121-11Lw

121-121-11Lw

111-111-112LLw

121-121-121-122 LLLLLw

Regards,
A.

Hi Atlantis,

I know that, but I think all the systems look the same at the end of the day.

Some systems just delay the losses.
And it makes us feel like we're in control of the game.

Using progression you win more but when you lose, you lose big.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 01:44 PM 2019
Is long term 1 day 100 years .I always laugh at this when gamblers lose.

Long term means a life time. What's the use of winning for a whole year and losing everything in the end?

Someday the reality will slap your face, just wait . It can occur sooner or later.


Good luck!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 01:51 PM 2019
You can make some steady money with a Marty with any bet selection until it blows up on you.

Personally if you are going to bet on EC, I like the matrix. As good as any other, but psychologically, it takes the pressure off bet selection ideas or changing them around etc.

I have to agree with you.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 01:53 PM 2019
Long term means a life time. What's the use of winning for a whole year and losing everything in the end?

Someday the reality will slap your face, just wait . It can occur sooner or later.


Good luck!
Don’t need luck
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 01:59 PM 2019
Losing is part of the game except it . That’s the real problem
Like I said in my earlier post if you think your going to be rich playing casino game your delusional.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 02:01 PM 2019
The only weapon the casino have is the odds you take those out and you’ll win for life that’s would long term.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 02:14 PM 2019
 Dec 05, 01:22 PM 2018

By WINNER


https://www.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=21119.0
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 02:40 PM 2019
Dec 05, 01:22 PM 2018

By WINNER


https://www.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=21119.0
O O dam-you found me out . Why don’t you go back and sell your losing baccarat systems all loser .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 02:42 PM 2019
Don’t ever pm asking me to sell you my system again cause I don’t sell anything not like your losing baccarat hg BS
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 02:45 PM 2019
O O dam-you found me out . Why don’t you go back and sell your losing baccarat systems all loser .

Lol I like your conclusion. It's mine too.
 >:D
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 02:47 PM 2019
Betting The Dominant - Powerful Progression

2 1 2 (2 is the dominant)

So let's suppose:

B R B (B is the dominant)

There are only four blacks on the first collum.

So you will place one chip on the second collum and one chip on the third collum.
This is why you have no clue on playing roulette, you can’t figure out how many reds or blacks there are in the columns .
And when corrected you take a childish fit .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 02:49 PM 2019
Lol I like your conclusion. It's mine too.
 >:D
Move on grasshopper go and learn how to lose and make sure you don’t get angry and smash your computer again loser
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 02:50 PM 2019
C'MON, tell me more about your conclusion. Lol.  :twisted:

https://www.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=21119.0
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 02:51 PM 2019
C'MON, tell me more about your conclusion. Lol

https://www.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=21119.0
$2000 for you
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 02:51 PM 2019
O sorry forgot you lost play baccarat
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 17, 02:53 PM 2019
Well, I got to go.

Don't be angry, ok
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 17, 02:54 PM 2019
Well, I got to go.

Don't be angry, ok
Not one bit grasshopper go learn how lose
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 17, 03:56 PM 2019
Andre,

The thing is - winner's system and any or all of the variations posted cannot ALWAYS win by flatbet alone and EVERY TIME. This should not be so much of a shock to anybody; winner already said as much and even stated you can only really win by using some kind of progression...
I find the results aren't too bad with any of the ideas. You do get regular wins. The losses will happen as you showed but even those might be contained if using a clever type of progression. However - It is a LONG LOSING RUN that is going to kill it and if using standard marti will prove quite COSTLY when it does happen.
I posted the idea of wait until 2 same triplets then bet against a third same happening  because of the fact that 6 triplets of same in a row was very, very rare - but still, to win overall requires use of a progression because you do not know at what step of the betting line the win will eventually come...

212-212-1w

122-122-2w

121-121-11Lw

121-121-11Lw

111-111-112LLw

121-121-121-122 LLLLLw

Regards,
A.

Hi Atlantis

Your idea of betting against two triplets works really well. The only reason I'm not using it is that I'm currently testing the 'Dominant 3' system. Ideally I will be using your method and the Dominant 3 method in the future. As Winner says, mix it up a bit.

I would describe betting against the two triplets as a very conservative approach. In the time I was using it, I never managed to get the triplets to repeat three times. No doubt it's possible and you need to be prepared for it.

I'm still testing Dominant 3. At this stage the D'Alembert (+1-1) is holding up. To me, getting a win on even money is a huge bonus, but in the future, I would expect to be playing with a conservative progression. A loss of 9 units for 50 spins is far from a disaster. A disaster is when an aggressive progression blows up in your face. 

Look forward to posting more results using the D'Alembert progression soon.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 18, 12:48 PM 2019
@Andre because you have no clue on beating the game this one here is for you .
Some of u have been on this forum for a long time you know how to think about random
But still u fail . Iknow for a fact that roulette when looked at odds you can’t beat it I’m the first to admit that . The title of this thread is beating the even money game not beating the odds game .but some Idiots still believe they can . Like I said if you can’t beat the outside what makes you think you’ll beat the inside numbers it’s all the same .
Guys like Andre are not disciplined enough and believe me there’s a lot of out there .
Consistently losing every day. Idiots
Like Columbo, I'm sure some of old guys know who he was ,I believe you have  got throw out shit to weed out the idiots .
In this case there’s was only one .But a few that gave up trying to find a bet that is easy to play every time .
Lots of ideas on this thread and not one of u can make anything work short  term ,meaning less then 3hrs play. Some have tried and done ok .
The old guys keep trying but they get bored and move on .lol I was one of them .
This will be my last post on this thread its served its purpose .
I can see only a few winning .
In all the bet selection I presented there is only one that can win consistently .
Icall this one  The worm 🐛 guard.
The reason behind the worm guard it can win 100% of the timer  will get you out of the WORM HOLES every time. Well that’s it for talk .
I’ll will leave this thread with some great result on the worm guard.
@ Andre
I’ll START CARING When YOUR OPINIONS START PAYING MY Bills .
Worm guard results.


Wll+1
Www
wll+2
Wll+3
Wwl+4
Www
Www+5
LLL +6
Www+7
Wwl+8
Wwl+9
Wll+10
Lww+11
Wow+12
Wwl+13
Wll+14
Wll+15
Wwl+16
LLL +17
LLL +18
Wwl+19
Lww+20
Wll+21
Lww+23
Wwl+24
To be continued 60000 games


Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 18, 02:27 PM 2019
@Andre because you have no clue on beating the game this one here is for you .
Some of u have been on this forum for a long time you know how to think about random
But still u fail . Iknow for a fact that roulette when looked at odds you can’t beat it I’m the first to admit that . The title of this thread is beating the even money game not beating the odds game .but some Idiots still believe they can . Like I said if you can’t beat the outside what makes you think you’ll beat the inside numbers it’s all the same .
Guys like Andre are not disciplined enough and believe me there’s a lot of out there .
Consistently losing every day. Idiots
Like Columbo, I'm sure some of old guys know who he was ,I believe you have  got throw out shit to weed out the idiots .
In this case there’s was only one .But a few that gave up trying to find a bet that is easy to play every time .
Lots of ideas on this thread and not one of u can make anything work short  term ,meaning less then 3hrs play. Some have tried and done ok .
The old guys keep trying but they get bored and move on .lol I was one of them .
This will be my last post on this thread its served its purpose .
I can see only a few winning .
In all the bet selection I presented there is only one that can win consistently .
Icall this one  The worm 🐛 guard.
The reason behind the worm guard it can win 100% of the timer  will get you out of the WORM HOLES every time. Well that’s it for talk .
I’ll will leave this thread with some great result on the worm guard.
@ Andre
I’ll START CARING When YOUR OPINIONS START PAYING MY Bills .
Worm guard results.


Wll+1
Www
wll+2
Wll+3
Wwl+4
Www
Www+5
LLL +6
Www+7
Wwl+8
Wwl+9
Wll+10
Lww+11
Wow+12
Wwl+13
Wll+14
Wll+15
Wwl+16
LLL +17
LLL +18
Wwl+19
Lww+20
Wll+21
Lww+23
Wwl+24
To be continued 60000 games

Great work Winner. I’ll take those results any day.

Winner, I’ve just finished a 100 spin session. I’ll post the results in about 1 hour.  Just need to get back to the desktop pc.

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 18, 02:51 PM 2019
Hey! winner  - Sorry to hear you're going - thanks for the interesting discussion and ideas.

I've also developed something from this topic which seems quite  promising at this early stage. Appears to cut out long losing runs + gives regular wins. Uses triplet 'pairs' like yours...

I'll show some results:

Quote
w
w
Lw
w     
w
LLL
w
LLw
LLw
w
w
w
Lw
LLL
w
w
LLL
Lw
w
w
Lw
w
LLw
w
w
w
w
Lw
Lw
w
w
w
Lw
w
w
w
w
w
w
LLL
w
Lw
w
Lw
LLw
Lw
w
Lw
LLw
w
Lw
Lw
LLw
LLw
w
w
LLw
Lw
LLw
w
w
LLw
Lw
w
LLw
Lw
w
LL
w
w
w
LLw
w
LLw
w
w
w
Lw
w
w
w
Lw
w
LLL
w
w
w
LLw
LLw
w
w
w
LLw
w
w
w
w
w
w

 :smile:

Gonna call it ermmm: "Triplet Takedown"    :lol: :twisted:

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 18, 02:54 PM 2019
Hey! winner  - Sorry to hear you're going - thanks for the interesting discussion and ideas.

I've also developed something from this topic which seems quite  promising at this early stage. Appears to cut out long losing runs + gives regular wins. Uses triplet 'pairs' like yours...

I'll show some results:

 :smile:

Gonna call it ermmm: "Triplet Takedown"    :lol: :twisted:

A.
Not leaving just done with this thread .after I post some result for Mr Andre the impatient man 😆
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 18, 03:00 PM 2019
Wwl +1
Wwl +2
Lww+3
Lww+4
Lww+5
Wll+6
Wwl +7
Lww+8
Lww+9
Wll+10
LLL +11
Lww+12
Wlw+13
Wwl+14
Www
LLL +15
Www
Lwl +16
LLL +17
Www
Www+18
LLL +19
Lww+20
Wlw+21
Wwl+22
Lwl+23
Lwl+24
The worm guard hasn’t lost 6 in row 60000 games mr Andre
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 18, 03:53 PM 2019
I did a short test playing d'Alembert. First I played the most dominant, but it wasn't good. Then I decided to switch when the pattern switched. So first I played with, but if I lost I played against it. Now I remember what Winner said. That can be the key. I will continue to test.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: poluvolo on Mar 18, 04:32 PM 2019
Hi
Yesterday  I played  as ATLANTIS idea
wait until two same triplets  then  bet against
all EC at the same time not only H/L
of course more betting oportunities
my results after session from airball machines
180 spins two hours
LW
W
LW
W
W
LLW
W
of course to early  but.... vry nice results
cheers
about  your last post ATLANTIS  YOU PLAY TRIPLETS AND BETTIING FOR DOMINANT OR SOMETHING DIFFERENT IDEA?

L









Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 18, 04:50 PM 2019
I think it would be very handy is someone on board could program for us a simple excel tracker (or even in rx) highlighted Atlantis idea of 2 same triplets appearance in rolling basis ( next tracking string of two triplets must be right after the previous one breaks ). Something like this for all ECs :
   
SPINS    H/L                  O/E                                    R/B
24            H                      E                                         B
33            H      2              O       1                               B          2
22            H                      E                                         B
19            H      2             O       1                               R           1
36            H                      E                                         R
17            L       1             O       1                               B           1
15            L                       O                                        B           
7              L        2             O       2                              R           1   
21            H                      O                                        R           
27            H        2            O        2                             R           2
5              L                       O                                        R             
19            H        1             O        2                            R           2
23            H                      O                                        R             
27            H       2             O        2                             R           2
5              L                       O                                        R           
29            H      1              O        2                             B            1
14            L                       E                                        R           
21            H       1             O       1                              R            2   
36            H                      E                                        R             
35            H       2             O        1                            B             1 
21            H                      O                                       R             
10            L        1             E         1                            B             1
5              L                       O                                       R             
36            H        1            E         1                            R             2
35            H                      O                                       B               
21           H        2            O         2                            R             1           
27            H                      O                                       R           
11            L        1            O         2                             B            1
22           H                        E                                       B             
34           H        2              E         2                           R              1   
24           H                        E                                       B             
32           H         2             E         2                           R             1
16           L                         E                                       R                   
34           H                    E         2                            R            2
36           H                        E                                       R             
33           H        2              O        1                            B           1
14           L                         E                                       R                 
10           L         2              E         2                            B           1
35           H                        O                                       B
1             L        1              O        2                             R           1     
28           H                        E                                       B           
27          H        2               O        1                            R           1
33           H                        O                                      B               
6             L         1              E        1                             B           2
   
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 18, 05:02 PM 2019
OK Winner, Atlantis, Mr Eko

Check this out…..

Dominant 3 Method
Using D’alembert (+1-1) money management

221 – 2 W,   122 – 1 L0W,   10012 – 221 LLW,    2101 – 1W,   211 – 21 LW,    111 – 1 W,   0122 – 2 W,   212 – 012 LLW,   122 – 112 LLW,   112 – 1W,   221 – 2W,   222 – 111 LLL,   221 – 12 LW,   212 – 2W,   212 – 02 LW,   221 – 12 LW,   212 – 2W,   111 – 222 LLL,   222 – 2W,   112 – 21 LW, 112 – 222 LLL,   122 – 2W,   0211 – 221 LLW,   222 – 2W,   121 – 1W,   222 – 2W,   111 – 21 LW,   221 – 2W,   1021 – 21 LW,   221 – 2W,   121 – 221 LLW,   211 – 21 LW,    212 – 2 W,   121 – 1W,   0121 – 222 LLL,   122 – 2 W,   111 – 1 W,   212 – 12 LW,   212 – 12 LW,   222 – 112 LLW,    122 – 2 W,   112 – 1W,   111 – 1W,   211 – 1W,   111 – 1W,   111 – 21LW,   121 – 1 W,   122 – 2W,   121 – 1W,   121 – 21 LW,   221 – 1W,   212 – 02 LW,   121 – 1W,   112 – 221 LLW,   112 – 221 LLW,   112 – 1W,   112 – 21 LW,   111 – 1W,   112 – 1W,   212 – 2W.

Profit: +42 units (D’alembert)
(+12 Units flat bet).

I was really happy with the way the d’alembert held up. I never once felt like the progressions got out of control. A couple of days ago I tested the Dominant 3 with the mini-lab. After a few bad runs I found myself betting 35-40 units. Although it easily recovered, I didn’t feel comfortable betting such high numbers. The largest bet I had this session was 7 units.

Here’s an example of a bad run from today's game.

    L        L        L        W       L          W         L           L         L          W         L         L         W        W         W         W
    1       2        3         4        3          4          3          4          5          6             5         6         7         6           5          4       (Progression used)     
   -1      -3       -6       -2       -5         -1        -4         -8        -13       -7        -12      -18         -11      -5          0         +4   

You can see by the sixteenth spin, we’re at plus four units. When you hit a new high or breakeven, reset the progression to one.

Andre, after 50 spins I was sitting on -1 unit flat bet. The first 50 spins were tough with the zero showing up more than usual. The second 50 spins were much better. The -1 unit turned into +12 (flat bet). I don’t think your result of -9 from a few days ago was a disaster.  Sure, it wasn’t a great session but I’ve seen worse using different systems.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 18, 09:20 PM 2019
Jono and others.

I give you one testing approach with zeros.

If any of yours twisted system survival these approach, you will win in long run.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 18, 09:50 PM 2019
Jono and others.

I give you one testing approach with zeros.

If any of yours twisted system survival these approach, you will win in long run.

Thanks Mister Eko, that’s a hell of a lot of numbers!

I can randomly select a block of 50 numbers and run them through a test series. Sorry Mister I wish I had more time.... 

Have you played these numbers?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 18, 10:30 PM 2019
Thanks Mister Eko, that’s a hell of a lot of numbers!

I can randomly select a block of 50 numbers and run them through a test series. Sorry Mister I wish I had more time.... 

Have you played these numbers?

Actually Mister Eko, I'll use them all, from start to finish! It will save me physically activating every single spin.

That's actually a really valuable resource.

Thanks for sharing  :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 18, 10:36 PM 2019
Hello guys,

Let's imagine the following situation ...

I'm going to the roulette table...
Let's pretend that the following sequence/triplex occurred. (1,1,2)
I then start betting on the dominant (1). I can win or lose. Right?

Actually the triplex did not happen in the past spins. I just pretended that it occurred. Do you understand the point here?

The wheel doesn't give a crap on what happened in the past.

That's the problem with most systems.
Repeaters, uniques, trends, patterns, etc are all  only in your head.

Most of the systems I use to play baccarat, I bet  that an extremely rare event will not occur. That's the way I like it.

Soon I'll post some of my strategies here.

Please be polite.

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 18, 11:42 PM 2019
Hello guys,

Let's imagine the following situation ...

I'm going to the roulette table...
Let's pretend that the following sequence/triplex occurred. (1,1,2)
I then start betting on the dominant (1). I can win or lose. Right?

Actually the triplex did not happen in the past spins. I just pretended that it occurred. Do you understand the point here?

The wheel doesn't give a crap on what happened in the past.

That's the problem with most systems.
Repeaters, uniques, trends, patterns, etc are all  only in your head.

Most of the systems I use to play baccarat, I bet  that an extremely rare event will not occur. That's the way I like it.

Soon I'll post some of my strategies here.

Please be polite.

Cheers


Andre, of course what you say makes perfect sense. If the game was predictable and it followed a predetermined set of rules, then we wouldn't need to worry about using a progression. Everything would be flat-bet. We use a progression when our system doesn't behave like we expect it to.

For me, using a system is about being consistent. Knowing exactly what decision to make when an outcome occurs....

Firefox said something interesting in the Colour Matrix thread... he believed the colour matrix system provided a mental advantage because the pressure of making a decision was taken off the person placing the bet. I agree with this. The same applies to using a system. When you're following a set of rules, the pressure of making a decision is lifted from your shoulders. When the system fails (bet loses), a progression is introduced.

The physics guys are going to hate this, but in the face of all evidence to the contrary, I believe a HG is possible! I also believe that with discipline, and a good system (set of rules), the house edge can be beaten. Yep, this is coming from the guy who spends most of his time testing....

Here is Firefox's original quote form the Colour Matrix thread....


I've been thinking about this and can see an advantage .... but not a mathematical one, it's a psychological one!

It enables you to bet fairly randomly on both red and black but have the pressure of bet selection taken off you.

This could be an advantage if you're playing a progression fairly deep. There's  some pressure to choose the right target and it's possible to beat yourself up if you get it wrong.

But following the chart, that pressure is taken off you. You can always blame the matrix if it was the wrong choice

Therefore the system is more fun and relaxing to play, and for that reason better than making a personal decision each time  :smile:


Hey Andre, at least you and Winner have the balls to bet with real money! I'm not there yet..... but I'm close. :)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Mar 18, 11:55 PM 2019
More fun, but not more profitable ;)

And yes, a HG is possible based on increased prediction accuracy. Looking at patterns in even chances for the last three/ten/hundred/thousand spins does not give you any increase in prediction accuracy.

Negative progressions simply alter your win/loss patterns. They give you steady profits and then a thumping loss at some stage. And you lose more in the end, because you expose bigger bets to the house edge (0)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 19, 12:09 AM 2019
More fun, but not more profitable ;)

And yes, a HG is possible based on increased prediction accuracy. Looking at patterns in even chances for the last three/ten/hundred/thousand spins does not give you any increase in prediction accuracy.

Negative progressions simply alter your win/loss patterns. They give you steady profits and then a thumping loss at some stage. And you lose more in the end, because you expose bigger bets to the house edge (0)

I'm with you Firefox. I don't like progressions either. I use them reluctantly and I'm always looking at ways of keeping them as low as possible....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Anastasius on Mar 19, 12:11 AM 2019
F.fox How do u increase ur chances is it with visual ballistics .i dont understand vb since they alter the spin speed and also the ball scattering and they call off the bets half way thru a spin.. or is there some other method
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: poluvolo on Mar 19, 12:51 AM 2019
HI again one more day of testing  playing as  atlantis idea
betting against 2 triplets same patterns
only one break rule
so about 2 same patterns 111 and 222
O/E  WE BETTING AGAINST
H/L WE BETTING AGAINST
B/R  WHEN WE HAVE  111 OR 222  DOUBLE SAME PATTERNS AT BLACK RED  WE DOND BET AGAINST
so my results after 1000 spins at airball machines
LW
W
W
W
LW
LLW
W
W
W
W
L
W
LW
W
LW
LW
W
W
LW
W
LW
W
W
LW
W
LW
W
W
LW
LLLW
W
W
LW
W
LW
W
LW
W
W
LLW
LLLW
W
LLW
W
W
W
LW
W
W







Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Mar 19, 01:00 AM 2019
#Antonius Anything which increases prediction accuracy.

1. Visual ballistics
2. Computer ballistics
3. Wheel defects analysis
4. Dealer spin and signature analysis

They are all different and they are not applicable all the time. You have to find the right conditions. You can't just rock up and play. You have to do a lot of homework both away from the wheel and at it.

VB is not viable on high speed wheels with a lot of scatter or on wheels where you can't bet late into the spin. It's a B&M casino method, and for certain conditions only. You have to clock the spin speed on every single spin before you observe or decide to play, and you have to be able to do that by counting in your head to an accuracy of 0.1 to 0.2 seconds.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Mar 19, 01:12 AM 2019
I'm with you Firefox. I don't like progressions either. I use them reluctantly and I'm always looking at ways of keeping them as low as possible....

Low progressions and insurance lines alter your win loss patterns again. You have steady wins but not so consistent, and just medium losses when it goes wrong.

Unfortunately the uneven pay off means that whichever way you twist and turn with bet selection and bet size you still end up losing, on average, the total amount bet multiplied by the house edge.

In Winner's hypothetical game with no zero, and no house edge, whichever way you bet, be it flat, negative progression, or positive progression, you will, on average, end up breaking even.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 19, 02:05 AM 2019
Jono and others.

I give you one testing approach with zeros.

If any of yours twisted system survival these approach, you will win in long run.

I can go through it but it will of course take some time. Is it live spins? Besides that I will do my own tests.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 19, 05:42 AM 2019
If i had to choose amongst all these quality systems posted in this topic, i will go for just two:
a)   Atlantis  xxxxxx+xx  approach (bet opposite from two previous same triplets).
b)   jono' s  xxx+xxx approach (waiting for  the 1st leg of a triplet  start repeating itself once, then bet  for the 2nd triplet the dominant ECs from the previous one.
In both approaches i would go  for just TWO bets.
Tracking for a new pattern would be right UPON (not after) either a real win or a virtual one (in case we had to stop due to a losing string).
Optimal progression is still questionable for both approaches.
Jono dont disregard Labby yet. You may find an interesting  modification here  https://www.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=14305.msg121536#msg121536 to adapt it, as an alternative to Dalembert from your previous post.
Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Madi on Mar 19, 06:28 AM 2019
Guys
One thing i need to say, when u design system just dont use any kind of progression. More powerfull progression just indicates weak selection. Its been enough with progression. Now its time to leave it. Start new day
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 19, 06:34 AM 2019
If i had to choose amongst all these quality systems posted in this topic, i will go for just two:
a)   Atlantis  xxxxxx+xx  approach (bet opposite from two previous same triplets).
b)   jono' s  xxx+xxx approach (waiting for  the 1st leg of a triplet  start repeating itself once, then bet  for the 2nd triplet the dominant ECs from the previous one.
In both approaches i would go  for just TWO bets.
Tracking for a new pattern would be right UPON (not after) either a real win or a virtual one (in case we had to stop due to a losing string).
Optimal progression is still questionable for both approaches.
Jono dont disregard Labby yet. You may find an interesting  modification here  https://www.rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=14305.msg121536#msg121536 to adapt it, as an alternative to Dalembert from your previous post.
Cheers

Loukoumas

Great work tracking down the extra information on the labouchère. I’ll read up in it later. I’m happy to give it another go.... I’ve got to say though, the d’alembert hasn’t let me down yet. I’ll post more results tomorrow morning.

You’re right Loukoumas, there is a lot of quality information in this thread. I’d love to know a bit more information about Winners ‘Worm Guard’. Having said that, I feel more confident that I have some handy tools at my disposal.

Cheers Loukoumas
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 19, 07:23 AM 2019
Hi
Yesterday  I played  as ATLANTIS idea
wait until two same triplets  then  bet against
all EC at the same time not only H/L
of course more betting oportunities
my results after session from airball machines
180 spins two hours
LW
W
LW
W
W
LLW
W
of course to early  but.... vry nice results
cheers
about  your last post ATLANTIS  YOU PLAY TRIPLETS AND BETTIING FOR DOMINANT OR SOMETHING DIFFERENT IDEA?

L

Hi poluvolo,

Thanks for your results.
Yes - "Triplet Takedown" is a something different idea! However am testing strength of it with Mister Eko's challenge +0's results to see how it handles those.
After the conclusion of the test I will report back with the results for all to see.
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: poluvolo on Mar 19, 07:47 AM 2019
Could be possible someone
explain  the switching method from Mister eko?
I mean the method about  betting  Same and Against  at previus triplets
only with one small example


Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 19, 08:37 AM 2019
Worm 🐛 guard results
Lwl+1
Wwl+2
Wwl+3
Www
Www+4
Lww+5
Wll+6
Lwl+7
Www
Lww
wlw+8
Wlw+9
Www
LLw+10
Wwl +11
Www
Wll+12
LLL +13
Wwl+14
Lwl+15
LLw +16
LLL +17
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: poluvolo on Mar 19, 10:10 AM 2019
how many spins average winner  these results?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 19, 01:37 PM 2019
Worm 🐛  guard results
I happy for those who are trying to put together a method .matbe one day you’ll come to know the worm guard after messing around for years trying to beat the odds .cough cough.
LLw +1
Wll+2
Wlw+3
Lww+4
Lwl+5
LLL +6
LLL+7
LLw +8
Wlw+9
Lwl+10
To be continued
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 19, 02:41 PM 2019
Worm 🐛  guard results
I happy for those who are trying to put together a method .matbe one day you’ll come to know the worm guard after messing around for years trying to beat the odds .cough cough.
LLw +1
Wll+2
Wlw+3
Lww+4
Lwl+5
LLL +6
LLL+7
LLw +8
Wlw+9
Lwl+10
To be continued

Damn Winner!!! 👍
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 19, 03:49 PM 2019
Worm 🐛  guard results

LLw +1
Wll+2
Wlw+3
Lww+4
Lwl+5
LLL +6
LLL+7
LLw +8
Wlw+9
Lwl+10
 

Hi winner,
Of course I am interested in the "worm guard" (like the name , btw) :)
I would even be more impressed if you could duplicate those fantastic results given but this time using some actual results provided by a member to test with...
Have you thought of testing  the "worm guard" on Mister Eko's challenge+0  results?
It would really be great if you could show if those results would hold up and be just as good after testing on the first 200 or so results in Mister Eko's file??
Reason I ask is  - it would be very interesting to see how your method copes with these. My personal view is that any EC system that can beat these results and pass this test could well be classed and accepted as a long term winner.
I'm slowly working my way thru them all myself.
I'm certain if you could prove "worm guard" delivers the same amazing results like you showed above it will rightly get  the due respect and attention it deserves. Ppl will sit up and want to to analyse and figure it out for themselves with or without your help. However - this is roulette - we all know what CAN happen given time whether using flatbet or progression. You showed some good results; but how are we to know what may happen further down the line if and when the pendulum swings in the opposite direction and good fortune disappears and the dreaded long losing run manifests?
However, let me thank you for sparking interest in the 'worm guard' and I salute your positive attitude and well- intentioned efforts to defeat the roulette! :) 

Best wishes,
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 19, 04:12 PM 2019
Worm 🐛  guard results
I happy for those who are trying to put together a method .matbe one day you’ll come to know the worm guard after messing around for years trying to beat the odds .cough cough.
LLw +1
Wll+2
Wlw+3
Lww+4
Lwl+5
LLL +6
LLL+7
LLw +8
Wlw+9
Lwl+10
To be continued

Winner, are you playing new style ? What is this worms playing mate? :)

I think Winner generates every triplets +1 units. So after 200 spins, its around 66 triples, he would get 66 units.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 19, 04:22 PM 2019
Atlantis No need for  mr  Eko challenge I have tested every thing I mentioned on this thread I posted a few methods to bet , from flat to a progression. You can make a few dollars with them and again this thread was a way for people to understand a way to look at the game and not the odds . Stick to one thing and dissect the shit out of it and once you find it stick with it .Out of the methods I presented I like alot of them it helped me create  the 🐛 guard which I would like to keep to myself but I believe that the ones that work at and keep experimenting you’ll find that winning bet that can help you win for as long as you play roulette.long waiting times I don’t like so if a system or method requires to long of a wait to place bets you have to ask your self is it worth it.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 19, 04:29 PM 2019
Jono and others.

I give you one testing approach with zeros.

If any of yours twisted system survival these approach, you will win in long run.

Mr Eko said these numbers would be tough and he was right!

For full results, see below.....

Winners's Dominant 3 (using D'alembert) 100 results


1,1,2 - 2,2,1 LLW  (0),  1,1,1 - 1 W (+1),  1,1,1 - 2,1 LW  (+2),  2,0,1,1 - 2,1 LW  (+3),  2,2,1 - 2 W  (+4),  2,2,1 - 2 W  (+5),  2,2,2 - 2 W (+6),   2,1,2 - 1,1,2 LLW  (+6),  0,1,2,1 - 2,1 LW (+7),   1,1,1 - 2,1 LW  (+8),  2,2,2 - 1,2 LW   (+9),
2,1,2 - 1,2 LW.  (+10),  1,1,1 - 1 W   (+11),   2,2,1 - 1,2 LW (+12),  1,1,1 - 2,2,2 LLL (+6),   1,1,1 - 2,1 LW (+7),  1,1,2 - 2,2,1 LLW  (+4),   2,2,1 - 2 W   (+9),   1,2,2 - 1,2 LW  (+10),   2,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL (-5),  1,1,1 - 2,1  LW (-4),  1,2,2 - 1,1,2  LW  (-3),  1,2,1 - 2,2,1  LLW (-11),  1,1,2 - 1  W (-5),  1,1,0,1 - 2,2,1 LLW (-9),   1,1,2 - 1 W (-3),  1,2,2 - 2 W (+2), 1,1,2 -1 W  (+6),  1,2,1 - 1 W (+9),  1,1,1 - 2,2,1 LLW (+8),  1,2,1 - 2,1  LW  (+9),  1,1,2 - 1  W  (+12),  2,1,1 - 2,1  LW  (+13), 2,1,1 - 1  W (+15),  1,1,1 - 1 W  (+16),   1,1,2 - 2,1  LW  (+17),  2,1,2 - 2  W (+18),  2,2,1 - 1,1,1 LLL (+12),
1,1,2 - 2,1  LW  (+13), 1,2,1 - 1  W (+17),  1,2,2 - 1,1,2 LLW (+15),  1,1,2 - 1 W  (+19), 1,2,1 - 0,1 LW  (+20),  2,2,1 - 1,1,0 LLL (+8),  1,1,2 - 1  W  (+14),  2,2,1 - 1,1,0 LLL (-4), 1,2,2 - 2 W  (+4) 0,0,1,2,2 - 2 W (+11),  2,2,2 - 1,2 LW  (+12),  2,1,1 - 1 W  (+18),  2,2,1 - 1,2 LW (+19), 1,2,1 - 2,1 LW (+20),
2,2,1 - 1,1,2 LLW (+20)

Profit = +20 units (D'alembert)
(Flat bet -3)

These numbers were definitely tougher. This time yesterday I was sitting on +42 d'alembert and +12 flat bet for the same number of spins. However, I'm glad the system has held up with a tougher set of numbers.

What's really good is that I only went to level 8 in the progression and everything recovered really quickly. 8 units is not a large bet!

You might think I would be disappointed with -3 flat bet. Not at all! Another good result with a tough set of numbers. After 100 spins, -3 units flat bet is far from a disaster.

* One of the reasons the progression holds up is that I try to reset if where I can. On the second last spin I was equal with the most recent high (20 units). The progression was telling me to place 5 units on the next spin, however I reset it (1 unit).

I will post another 100 results tomorrow morning. They will be a continuation of these results.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 19, 04:30 PM 2019
Atlantis No need for  mr  Eko challenge I have tested every thing I mentioned on this thread I posted a few methods to bet , from flat to a progression. You can make a few dollars with them and again this thread was a way for people to understand a way to look at the game and not the odds . Stick to one thing and dissect the shit out of it and once you find it stick with it .Out of the methods I presented I like alot of them it helped me create  the 🐛 guard which I would like to keep to myself but I believe that the ones that work at and keep experimenting you’ll find that winning bet that can help you win for as long as you play roulette.long waiting times I don’t like so if a system or method requires to long of a wait to place bets you have to ask your self is it worth it.

Winner, are you switching between your methods after every triplets or ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 19, 06:28 PM 2019
Mr Eko said these numbers would be tough and he was right!

For full results, see below.....

Winners's Dominant 3 (using D'alembert) 100 results


1,1,2 - 2,2,1 LLW  (0),  1,1,1 - 1 W (+1),  1,1,1 - 2,1 LW  (+2),  2,0,1,1 - 2,1 LW  (+3),  2,2,1 - 2 W  (+4),  2,2,1 - 2 W  (+5),  2,2,2 - 2 W (+6),   2,1,2 - 1,1,2 LLW  (+6),  0,1,2,1 - 2,1 LW (+7),   1,1,1 - 2,1 LW  (+8),  2,2,2 - 1,2 LW   (+9),
2,1,2 - 1,2 LW.  (+10),  1,1,1 - 1 W   (+11),   2,2,1 - 1,2 LW (+12),  1,1,1 - 2,2,2 LLL (+6),   1,1,1 - 2,1 LW (+7),  1,1,2 - 2,2,1 LLW  (+4),   2,2,1 - 2 W   (+9),   1,2,2 - 1,2 LW  (+10),   2,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL (-5),  1,1,1 - 2,1  LW (-4),  1,2,2 - 1,1,2  LW  (-3),  1,2,1 - 2,2,1  LLW (-11),  1,1,2 - 1  W (-5),  1,1,0,1 - 2,2,1 LLW (-9),   1,1,2 - 1 W (-3),  1,2,2 - 2 W (+2), 1,1,2 -1 W  (+6),  1,2,1 - 1 W (+9),  1,1,1 - 2,2,1 LLW (+8),  1,2,1 - 2,1  LW  (+9),  1,1,2 - 1  W  (+12),  2,1,1 - 2,1  LW  (+13), 2,1,1 - 1  W (+15),  1,1,1 - 1 W  (+16),   1,1,2 - 2,1  LW  (+17),  2,1,2 - 2  W (+18),  2,2,1 - 1,1,1 LLL (+12),
1,1,2 - 2,1  LW  (+13), 1,2,1 - 1  W (+17),  1,2,2 - 1,1,2 LLW (+15),  1,1,2 - 1 W  (+19), 1,2,1 - 0,1 LW  (+20),  2,2,1 - 1,1,0 LLL (+8),  1,1,2 - 1  W  (+14),  2,2,1 - 1,1,0 LLL (-4), 1,2,2 - 2 W  (+4) 0,0,1,2,2 - 2 W (+11),  2,2,2 - 1,2 LW  (+12),  2,1,1 - 1 W  (+18),  2,2,1 - 1,2 LW (+19), 1,2,1 - 2,1 LW (+20),
2,2,1 - 1,1,2 LLW (+20)

Profit = +20 units (D'alembert)
(Flat bet -3)

These numbers were definitely tougher. This time yesterday I was sitting on +42 d'alembert and +12 flat bet for the same number of spins. However, I'm glad the system has held up with a tougher set of numbers.

What's really good is that I only went to level 8 in the progression and everything recovered really quickly. 8 units is not a large bet!

You might think I would be disappointed with -3 flat bet. Not at all! Another good result with a tough set of numbers. After 100 spins, -3 units flat bet is far from a disaster.

* One of the reasons the progression holds up is that I try to reset if where I can. On the second last spin I was equal with the most recent high (20 units). The progression was telling me to place 5 units on the next spin, however I reset it (1 unit).

I will post another 100 results tomorrow morning. They will be a continuation of these results.

Jono, thanks that you testing with my disaster numebers! These will be ahrder and harder after spin by spins ! Yes these are live numbers.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 19, 11:19 PM 2019


What's really good is that I only went to level 8 in the progression and everything recovered really quickly. 8 units is not a large bet!

You might think I would be disappointed with -3 flat bet. Not at all! Another good result with a tough set of numbers. After 100 spins, -3 units flat bet is far from a disaster.


If you're betting $1 value chips, that's ok. Otherwise if you are making bets with chips $100 value or more, then this is a disaster.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 20, 01:50 AM 2019
If you're betting $1 value chips, that's ok. Otherwise if you are making bets with chips $100 value or more, then this is a disaster.

Not such a big disaster, while the winnings will bwcome larger then the bets. If you played this with 100 euros, 800 euro was the max bet, while you won 2000 euro. Its not bad, no disaster. Anyway I think too, that dalembert will sooner or later kill us. Especially the dominant 3 version. But its just mine
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 20, 09:23 AM 2019
🐛 guard result to all the nay sayers

lwl+
LLL+
Www-
wll-
LLL-
Wwl
Www
Lww
Lww
Wwl
LLw
Www
LLL
Wlw
Lww
Wwl
Lwl
Wll
Www
LLL
LLL
Lwl
Wll
LLw
Www
Wll
Wlw
Wwl
Lww
Lwl
Wll
LLL
Wlw
LLL
LLw
Lww
LLL
Www
Wll
LLL
Wwl
Lwl
Www
Wll
Wlw
Lww
Lww
Wwl
LLL
Wll
Wll
Wwl
LLL
Lww
Wwl
LLL
Wwl
Lwl
Lww
Lwl
Lwl
LLw
Wll
Wwl
Wlw
LLL
Lwl
LLL
Lww
Lww
Wlw
Wll
LLL
Wwl
Lww
Wll
Lwl
LLL
Wwl
+20 flat bet /11124816
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 20, 02:14 PM 2019
🐛 guard result to all the nay sayers

lwl+
LLL+
Www-
wll-
Etc.......

+20 flat bet /11124816

Not too many spins. Nice strike rate Winner!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 20, 02:25 PM 2019
Testing Mr Eko's challenge. I try d'Alembert but I don't know if Jono and I are doing it exactly the same. So far so good, but many numbers to go through. Will continue the test..
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 20, 02:26 PM 2019
Btw, had to bet 9 units once
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 20, 02:45 PM 2019
Testing Mr Eko's challenge. I try d'Alembert but I don't know if Jono and I are doing it exactly the same. So far so good, but many numbers to go through. Will continue the test..

Nice chart Boyd!

In my last post I said I try to reset the progression where I can. In my last game (second last spin), the progression was telling me to place 5 units on the next spin. However, because I was even with the most recent high, I reset the progression to 1 unit.

This has definitely helped....

Good job Boyd
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 20, 03:14 PM 2019
Nice chart Boyd!

In my last post I said I try to reset the progression where I can. In my last game (second last spin), the progression was telling me to place 5 units on the next spin. However, because I was even with the most recent high, I reset the progression to 1 unit.

This has definitely helped....

Good job Boyd

Hello Jono,

Have you considered testing winner's 'dominant 3' on a rolling basis?

2
2
1
2w
1L
2L
2w
2w
1L
1L
2L
1w
2L
2w
2w
2w
1L
2w
1L
1w
1w
2L
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
2L
2L
2w
2w
2w
2w
2w
1L
2w
2w
2w
1L
1L
1w
1w
2L
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
2L
1w
1w
1w
2L
1w
2L
2w
1L
2w
1L
1w
2L
2L
2w
2w
1L
2w
1L
1w
2L
2L
1L
1L
1w
1w
2L
1w
2L
1L
2L
2w
1L
1L
2w

84 spins
win 50
lose 34
Profit = 16 +flatbet+

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 20, 03:22 PM 2019
Nice chart Boyd!

In my last post I said I try to reset the progression where I can. In my last game (second last spin), the progression was telling me to place 5 units on the next spin. However, because I was even with the most recent high, I reset the progression to 1 unit.

This has definitely helped....

Good job Boyd

Thanks Jono! Thank you for testing too! I also reset on a new high. I hope I can stick to the rules and it doesn't go out of control. We'll see.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 20, 03:39 PM 2019
Here another session
Flatbet did not win
Progression required.

2
2
1
2w
1L
1w
1w
2L
2L
1L
1L
1w
2L
1w
2L
2w
1L
1L
2L
2L
2w
1L
1L
1w
1w
1w
2L
2L
1L
2w
1L
1w
1w
1w
2L
2L
2w
2w
1L
1L
2L
2L
2w
1L
2w
2w
1L
2w
1L
1w
1w
1w
2L
1w
2L
2w
1L
1L
2L
1w
1w
1w
1w
2L
1w
2L
2w
1L
1L
1w
2L
2L
2w

33w
37L

-4 +flatbet+

Could try winner's prog 111-2-4-8-16-32 or the one's you're working with. :)

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 20, 03:49 PM 2019
Hello Jono,

Have you considered testing winner's 'dominant 3' on a rolling basis?

2
2
1
2w
1L
2L
2w
2w
1L
1L
2L
1w
2L
2w
2w
2w
1L
2w
1L
1w
1w
2L
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
2L
2L
2w
2w
2w
2w
2w
1L
2w
2w
2w
1L
1L
1w
1w
2L
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
1w
2L
1w
1w
1w
2L
1w
2L
2w
1L
2w
1L
1w
2L
2L
2w
2w
1L
2w
1L
1w
2L
2L
1L
1L
1w
1w
2L
1w
2L
1L
2L
2w
1L
1L
2w

84 spins
win 50
lose 34
Profit = 16 +flatbet+

A.

16 units flat-bet! Nice results Atlantis and a very good strike rate too. What method are you using?

No, I haven't been using the Dominant system on a rolling basis... I can easily try it in the future though... Interesting, you would get completely different results when you take the same numbers in a different sequence.

Keep up the good work Atlantis. I'm just about to publish another session of Mr Eko's numbers.

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 20, 03:54 PM 2019
Here another session
Flatbet did not win
Progression required.

2
2
etc....

-4 +flatbet+

Could try winner's prog 111-2-4-8-16-32 or the one's you're working with. :)

A.

Atlantis, the d'alembert has been really good to me. A couple of times it has gone to level 10. Level 10 is only a 10 unit bet! Even I can handle that. One thing, I always reset the progression when I am equal to the previous high. Eg. On my last game I was due to place five units on the next bet, however I was equal with the previous high, so back to one!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 20, 03:56 PM 2019
Jono1167 wrote:
Quote
What method are you using?

Erm... winner's dominant 3 :)

Up to you whether you use his rule to stop after 3L's and wait for a virtual w before continuing

A
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 20, 04:00 PM 2019
Atlantis, the d'alembert has been really good to me. A couple of times it has gone to level 10. Level 10 is only a 10 unit bet! Even I can handle that. One thing, I always reset the progression when I am equal to the previous high. Eg. On my last game I was due to place five units on the next bet, however I was equal with the previous high, so back to one!

Yes  - I agree with you. Not too bad at all. The reset is also a wise move.
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 20, 04:11 PM 2019
Session 2
More of Mr Eko's 'hell numbers'..... ( Continuation of previous session - Spins 99 to 201)

2,2,2 - 1,1,1 LLL   (+14)  -6 fb.   2,1,1 - 2,2,1 LLW  (+11)  -7 fb.   2,2,1 - 1,1,2 LLW  (+7)  -8 fb.   2,1,2 - 2 W  (+21)  (+13) -7 fb.   1,2,2 - 2 W  (+18)  -6 fb. 2,2,2 - 1,1,1 LLL  (+3)  -9 fb.   1,2,2 - 2 W  (+10)  -8 fb.   1,1,1 - 2,2,2 LLL  (-11)  -11 fb.   2,2,1 - 1,2 LW  (-11)  -11 fb.   1,1,1 - 1 W  (-1)  -10 fb.   2,2,1 - 1,1,2 LLW  (-8)  -11 fb.   2,2,1 - 1,2  LW  (-7)  -11 fb.   2,1,2 - 1,2 LW  (-6)  -11 fb.   1,2,2 - 2 W  (+3)  -10 fb.   2,1,1 - 1 W  (+11)  -9 fb.   1,1,2 - 1 W   (+18)  -8 fb.   2,2,1 - 1,2 LW  (+19)  -8 fb.   2,1,1 - 2,1 LW   (+20)  -8 fb.   1,0,1,1 - 0,1 - LW (+21)  -8 fb.   1,0,1,1 - 1 W (+22)  -7 fb.   2,2,0,1 - 2 W (+23)  -6 fb.   2,1,1 - 1 W (+24)  -5 fb.   1,2,2 - 1,2 LW  (+25)  -5 fb.   1,2,1 - 2,1  LW (+26)  -5 fb.   1,2,1 - 1  W (+27)  -4 fb.  1,2,1 - 0,0,1  LLW (+27)  -5 fb
2,0,1,2 - 1,1,2 LLW (+26)  -6 fb.   1,2,1 - 1 W (+29)  -5 fb.  1,1,2 - 2,2,1 LLW (+29)  -6 fb.   1,2,2 - 2 W (+30)  -5 fb.   2,2,2,1,1,1 LLL (+24)  -8 fb.   1,2,1 - 1 W (+28)  -7 fb.   2,2,2 - 2 W (+31)  -6 fb.   1,1,2 - 1 W (+33)  -5 fb.   2,1,2 - 2 W (+34)  -4 fb.   1,1,1 - 2,1 LW (+35)  -4 fb.   1,1,2 - 1 W (+36)  -3 fb  66.  2,2,2 - 2 W (+37)  -2 fb.   2,2,2 - 1,2 LW (+38) -2 fb.   2,2,2 - 2 LW (+39)  -2 fb.   1,2,1 - 1 W (+40)  -1 fb.   2,1,2 - 1,2 LW (+41)  -1 fb.   1,2,2 - 0,0,1 LLL (+35)  -4 fb.   2,1,1 - 1 W (+39)  -3 fb.   1,1,1 - 2,1 LW (+40)  -3 fb.   2,2,2 - 2 W (+43)  -2 fb.   1,2,1 - 1 W (+44)  -1 fb.   1,2,2 - 1,1,1 LLL (+38)  -4 fb.   2,2,2 - 2 W (+42)  -3 fb.   2,2,2 - 1,0,1  LLL (+30)  -6 fb.   1,2,1 - 1  W (+36)  -5 fb.   2,1,1 -,2,1 LW (+37)  -5 fb.   1,1,1 - 2,1 LW (+38)  -5 fb.   2,1,2 - 1,2 LW (+39)  -5 fb.   2,2,2 - 2 W (+44)  -4 fb.   2,1,2 - 1,2 LW (+45)  -4 fb.   1,1,2 - 2,1 LW  (+46)  -4 fb

Profit = +46 units - D'alembert money management. (Profit this session +26 units)
(Flat bet -4) - This session -1.

Another good result with a tough set of numbers. The profit increased slightly with the d'alembert, lost another unit flat-bet. Still only -4 units FB for 201 spins, not too bad. Easily recoverable with a good session.

More testing underway.....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 20, 04:16 PM 2019
Jono1167 wrote:
Erm... winner's dominant 3 :)

Up to you whether you use his rule to stop after 3L's and wait for a virtual w before continuing

A

Atlantis, I'm choosing not to stop. I'm only testing so I want to make t as difficult as possible...

Of course, the 'dominant 3'!

Cheers Atlantis
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 20, 04:18 PM 2019
Atlantis, I'm choosing not to stop. I'm only testing so I want to make t as difficult as possible...

Of course, the 'dominant 3'!

Cheers Atlantis

Same results as previous session (-4 flatbet)

2
2
1
2w    +1
1L     +0
1w    +1
1w    +1
2L     +0
2L     -1
1L     -2
1L     +0  2u bet
1w    +1
2L    +0
1w   +1
2L    +0
2w    +1
1L     +0
1L     -1
2L     -2
2L     +0  2u bet
2w    +1
1L     +0
1L     -1
1w    +0
1w    +1
1w    +2
2L     +1
2L     +0
1L     -1
2w    +1  2u bet
1L    +0
1w    +1
1w    +2
1w    +3
2L     +2
2L    +1       
2w    +2     
2w    +3
1L     +2
1L     +1
2L     +0
2L     -2   2u bet
2w    +2   4u bet
1L    +1
2w   +2
2w   +3
1L    +2
2w   +3
1L    +2
1w    +3
1w    +4
1w    +5
2L    +4
1w    +5
2L    +4
2w   +5
1L    +4
1L    +3
2L    +2
1w   +4   2u bet
1w   +5
1w   +6
1w   +7
2L   +6
1w   +7
2L    +6
2w   +7
1L    +6
1L    +5
1w   +6
2L    +5
2L    +4
2w    +5


+5 profit this time :)
using winner's 111-2-4-8-16-32
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 20, 10:00 PM 2019
Anyway I think too, that dalembert will sooner or later kill us.

Yes, It will. Using any kind of progression in a game that there's a 0
or two 00 will wipe out all your profits, soon or later.

Sorry

"The devil gives you the first time for free"
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 20, 10:49 PM 2019
How about do some tests using Parlay 31

Win two in a row makes a new high in this parley progression.

1 1 1 2 2 4 4 8 8 - 31 unit bankroll

Nine chances to hit two in a row.

Example betting Red:

Bet R 1u - Loss -1
Bet R 1u - Loss -2
Bet R 1u - Loss -3
Bet R 2u - Loss -5
Bet R 2u - Loss -7
Bet R 4u - Win  -3 Parley the win and bet 8u
Bet R 8u - Win  +5 New High Restart
(If we lost the Parley bet ex. Bet R 8u - Loss -11 then we continue with progression)
Bet R 4u - Win -7 Parley the win
Bet R 8u - Win +1 New High Restart
(If we lost the Parley bet ex. Bet R 8u - Loss -15 then we continue with progression)
Bet R 8u - Loss -23
Bet R 8u - Win -15 Parley the win
Bet R 16u - Win +1

Do not count the parley bet as a step in the progression.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Still on Mar 20, 11:09 PM 2019
Worm 🐛  guard results
I happy for those who are trying to put together a method .matbe one day you’ll come to know the worm guard after messing around for years trying to beat the odds .cough cough.
LLw +1
Wll+2
Wlw+3
Lww+4
Lwl+5
LLL +6
LLL+7
LLw +8
Wlw+9
Lwl+10
To be continued

Trying to interpret this.  There are 19 losses and 11 wins.   But you are picking up one unit per every three spins?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 20, 11:20 PM 2019
By GLC

If I may say so stright upfront, even at the risk of apparent conceit, I consider my "Gr8Player's Progression" to be the absolute best and most efficient negative progression that I've ever seen. And, that's exactly what I had in mind when I designed it: efficiency. It's both mild enough to allow for your "variance" to correct itself, yet raises your unit sizes just enough for efficient recouping.

It's based upon a use of "7-series". Can't use my progression with 3, 5, or even 9; for the 7 works best. That's what the professional sports leagues use, the 7-game series. And it seems to work best here, as well. Seven seems "just right" to ascertain exactly "who's getting the best (or worst) of it", before one needs to make a bet-sizing "adjustments".

(Sidenote: I currently do not utilize this progression, but that's should not be viewed as anything against this MM method, as much as it is a reflection of just how far my Baccarat game/trending has come; I no longer feel the need for any "drawn out" negative progression for MY play.)

Onto the progression:

1 1 1 1 1 1 1
2 2 2 2 2 2 2
3 3 3 3 3 3 3
4 4 4 4 4 4 4
5 5 5 5 5 5 5

 Starting at the 1-unit level (or, as I call it "1-villle"..."ville" because that's where you want to "live", in 1-ville, for we don't like to live in 3-, 4- or 5-ville) you remain there unless you lose by more than a -1. In other words, obviously any "plus" after the 7 bets and you remain; if you were to lose the series at 4 losses to 3 wins, so a -1, stay at the same level. If, however, you lose 5 and win only 2 (for a -3) or lose 6 and win only 1 (for a -5) or lose all 7 (for a -7), you move up to level 2.

Now, say you're at a -3 for the first level, and you move up to level 2, as soon as you are at a +2 in level two, you end that series and return to level one. For example:

-1 +1 -1 -1 +1 -1 -1 = -3 on to level 2:

+2 -2 +2 +2 = +4 now you're at a +1 for the group (-3 +4 = +1), go back to level 1 immediately.

You are ALWAYS seeking to return to "1-ville". I did not design this progression as an excuse to raise my bets; on the contrary, I designed it for it's EFFICIENCY in recouping and relative "mildness". So lower those bets as quickly as you can.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 21, 12:48 AM 2019
By GLC

If I may say so stright upfront, even at the risk of apparent conceit, I consider my "Gr8Player's Progression" to be the absolute best and most efficient negative progression that I've ever seen. And, that's exactly what I had in mind when I designed it: efficiency. It's both mild enough to allow for your "variance" to correct itself, yet raises your unit sizes just enough for efficient recouping.

It's based upon a use of "7-series". Can't use my progression with 3, 5, or even 9; for the 7 works best. That's what the professional sports leagues use, the 7-game series. And it seems to work best here, as well. Seven seems "just right" to ascertain exactly "who's getting the best (or worst) of it", before one needs to make a bet-sizing "adjustments".

(Sidenote: I currently do not utilize this progression, but that's should not be viewed as anything against this MM method, as much as it is a reflection of just how far my Baccarat game/trending has come; I no longer feel the need for any "drawn out" negative progression for MY play.)

Onto the progression:

1 1 1 1 1 1 1
2 2 2 2 2 2 2
3 3 3 3 3 3 3
4 4 4 4 4 4 4
5 5 5 5 5 5 5

 Starting at the 1-unit level (or, as I call it "1-villle"..."ville" because that's where you want to "live", in 1-ville, for we don't like to live in 3-, 4- or 5-ville) you remain there unless you lose by more than a -1. In other words, obviously any "plus" after the 7 bets and you remain; if you were to lose the series at 4 losses to 3 wins, so a -1, stay at the same level. If, however, you lose 5 and win only 2 (for a -3) or lose 6 and win only 1 (for a -5) or lose all 7 (for a -7), you move up to level 2.

Now, say you're at a -3 for the first level, and you move up to level 2, as soon as you are at a +2 in level two, you end that series and return to level one. For example:

-1 +1 -1 -1 +1 -1 -1 = -3 on to level 2:

+2 -2 +2 +2 = +4 now you're at a +1 for the group (-3 +4 = +1), go back to level 1 immediately.

You are ALWAYS seeking to return to "1-ville". I did not design this progression as an excuse to raise my bets; on the contrary, I designed it for it's EFFICIENCY in recouping and relative "mildness". So lower those bets as quickly as you can.

Thanks for posting this Andre...

Previously we have been using something very similar, except Atlantis called it 'best of five' - Instead of seven steps, there were five. The seven steps seems to be safer because you don't have to move up as quickly. 

Great info - I will test this with Mister Eko's numbers.

I hate using a progression, but since I don't have a HG, I'm forced to use one.

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: mohitomish on Mar 21, 04:45 AM 2019
My Agaianst, and Same betting type works not bad, but you must know when to switch. I choose 222 and 111 no bet because of long series of 1111111 or 2222222 or 111222111222. Rather no bet. But see when I switch.


2,2,1, (A) 2,2,1, -3 A 1,1,2, +0 A 2,1,1, +1 S 2,1,2, +2 S 1,2,1, +5 A 2,2,1, +4 S 1,1,2, +2 A 2,2,2, +3 nb 1,1,1, nb 2,1,1, A 2,2,1, +2 S 2,2,1, +5 A 1,1,2, +8 A 2,1,2, +7 S 2,1,2, +10 A 2,2,2, nb

Flatbet +10

Hi Eko,

U r not following the rules u posted before.  after the first losses and u r -3,  u should have played ASS but u played AAS,  Can i know why?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Colin67 on Mar 21, 05:31 AM 2019
How about do some tests using Parlay 31

Win two in a row makes a new high in this parley progression.

1 1 1 2 2 4 4 8 8 - 31 unit bankroll

Nine chances to hit two in a row.

Example betting Red:

Bet R 1u - Loss -1
Bet R 1u - Loss -2
Bet R 1u - Loss -3
Bet R 2u - Loss -5
Bet R 2u - Loss -7
Bet R 4u - Win  -3 Parley the win and bet 8u
Bet R 8u - Win  +5 New High Restart
(If we lost the Parley bet ex. Bet R 8u - Loss -11 then we continue with progression)
Bet R 4u - Win -7 Parley the win
Bet R 8u - Win +1 New High Restart
(If we lost the Parley bet ex. Bet R 8u - Loss -15 then we continue with progression)
Bet R 8u - Loss -23
Bet R 8u - Win -15 Parley the win
Bet R 16u - Win +1

Do not count the parley bet as a step in the progression.

How about combining the dlembert with the parlay so up 1 if you lose then when you win you parlay the bet,and if the parlay bet is lost you move up 1 again ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: poluvolo on Mar 21, 10:40 AM 2019
YES  I agree
even  Mister eko is very kindly guy and answer to my privet question
still I am very confused about his method rules
I WISH POST HIS METHOD RULES FOR LAST TIME AND BE MORE CLEARLY
BCAUSE  HIS BET SELECTION IS VERY INTERSTING
cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 21, 03:04 PM 2019
Thanks Andre Chass for GLC method. I decided to test that too on Mr Eko's number. Good start and max unit to bet so far for this was 3 units. Not the same high as previous method, but lower stake.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 21, 11:41 PM 2019
Thanks Andre Chass for GLC method. I decided to test that too on Mr Eko's number. Good start and max unit to bet so far for this was 3 units. Not the same high as previous method, but lower stake.

 :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 21, 11:42 PM 2019
Thanks for posting this Andre...

Previously we have been using something very similar, except Atlantis called it 'best of five' - Instead of seven steps, there were five. The seven steps seems to be safer because you don't have to move up as quickly. 

Great info - I will test this with Mister Eko's numbers.

I hate using a progression, but since I don't have a HG, I'm forced to use one.

Cheers

Post the results here

 :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 23, 01:07 AM 2019
Toughest session yet..... see results below....

2,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+40) -7 fb
2,2,2 - 2  W  (+44) -6 fb
2,1,2 - 0,1,2  LLW  (+42) -7 fb
1,0,1 - 1  W  (+46) -6 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W  (+47) -5 fb
2,1,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+41) -8 fb
2,2,1 - 1,1,2  LLW  (+38) -8 fb
1,1,2 - 1   W  (+43) -7 fb
1,2,1 - 2,2,1  LLW   (+40) -8 fb 
1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+22) -11 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW  (+15) -12 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW  (+16) -13 fb
1,1,2 -,2,2,2  LLL. (-14) -16 fb
1,1,1 - 1    W (-2) -15 fb
0,1,2,2 - 2  W (+9) -14 fb
1,2,0,1 - 1  W (+19) -13 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+20) -13 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+21) -13 fb
1,1,0,0,1 - 1  W (+30) -12 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W  (+38) -11 fb
0,1,1,2 - 2,2,1  LLW (+32) -14 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW  (+25) -15 fb
2,2,2 - 2  W (34) -14 fb
1,1,2 - 2,1  LW (+26) -14 fb
2,2,1 - 1,1,2  LLW (+29) -15 fb
2,1,2 - 1,1,2  LLW (+21) -16 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (+31) -15 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW  (+30) -15 fb       
2,1,0,1 - 2,2,2  LLL  (+0) -18 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW (+1) -18 fb
2,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL. (-40) -21 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W. (-25) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 2,2,1  LLW  (-28) -21 fb
0,1,1,2 - 1  W  (-13) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 2,1  LW (-12) -20 fb
0,1,2,1 - 0,1  LW (-11) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W (+3) -19 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW (-9) -20 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW (-8) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W  (+6) -19 fb
1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL. (-36) -22 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W (-20) -21 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (-5) -20 fb
2,2,1 - 2  W (+9) -19 fb
1,2,1 - 1  W (+22) -18 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+23) -18 fb
2,1,1 - 1  W (+35) -17 fb
2,2,2 - 2 W  (+46) -16 fb
2,1,1 - 2,2,2   LLL (+40) -19 fb
2,2,2 - 1,1,2  LLW (+37) -20 fb
1,2,2 - 1,2  LW  (+38) -20 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+39) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+40) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (+45) -19 fb
1,1,2 - 0,1  LW (+46) -18 fb
1,2,2 - 2  W (+50) -17 fb
1,1,1 - 1   W  (+53) -16 fb
2,2,1 - 1 W (+55) -15 fb

Total profit: +55 units (This session +9)
Flat bet -15 (This session -11).

I won’t be able to salvage the flat-bet but that’s ok.... I plan to use a conservative progression.

No more testing the ‘Dominant 3’. I’m happy the system has proved itself against a tough set of numbers.

I’m now going to test some of the other systems against Mr Eko’s numbers.
😊
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 23, 01:29 AM 2019
Toughest session yet..... see results below....

2,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+40) -7 fb
2,2,2 - 2  W  (+44) -6 fb
2,1,2 - 0,1,2  LLW  (+42) -7 fb
1,0,1 - 1  W  (+46) -6 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W  (+47) -5 fb
2,1,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+41) -8 fb
2,2,1 - 1,1,2  LLW  (+38) -8 fb
1,1,2 - 1   W  (+43) -7 fb
1,2,1 - 2,2,1  LLW   (+40) -8 fb 
1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+22) -11 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW  (+15) -12 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW  (+16) -13 fb
1,1,2 -,2,2,2  LLL. (-14) -16 fb
1,1,1 - 1    W (-2) -15 fb
0,1,2,2 - 2  W (+9) -14 fb
1,2,0,1 - 1  W (+19) -13 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+20) -13 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+21) -13 fb
1,1,0,0,1 - 1  W (+30) -12 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W  (+38) -11 fb
0,1,1,2 - 2,2,1  LLW (+32) -14 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW  (+25) -15 fb
2,2,2 - 2  W (34) -14 fb
1,1,2 - 2,1  LW (+26) -14 fb
2,2,1 - 1,1,2  LLW (+29) -15 fb
2,1,2 - 1,1,2  LLW (+21) -16 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (+31) -15 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW  (+30) -15 fb       
2,1,0,1 - 2,2,2  LLL  (+0) -18 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW (+1) -18 fb
2,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL. (-40) -21 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W. (-25) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 2,2,1  LLW  (-28) -21 fb
0,1,1,2 - 1  W  (-13) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 2,1  LW (-12) -20 fb
0,1,2,1 - 0,1  LW (-11) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W (+3) -19 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW (-9) -20 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW (-8) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W  (+6) -19 fb
1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL. (-36) -22 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W (-20) -21 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (-5) -20 fb
2,2,1 - 2  W (+9) -19 fb
1,2,1 - 1  W (+22) -18 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+23) -18 fb
2,1,1 - 1  W (+35) -17 fb
2,2,2 - 2 W  (+46) -16 fb
2,1,1 - 2,2,2   LLL (+40) -19 fb
2,2,2 - 1,1,2  LLW (+37) -20 fb
1,2,2 - 1,2  LW  (+38) -20 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+39) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+40) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (+45) -19 fb
1,1,2 - 0,1  LW (+46) -18 fb
1,2,2 - 2  W (+50) -17 fb
1,1,1 - 1   W  (+53) -16 fb
2,2,1 - 1 W (+55) -15 fb

Total profit: +55 units (This session +9)
Flat bet -15 (This session -11).

I won’t be able to salvage the flat-bet but that’s ok.... I plan to use a conservative progression.

No more testing the ‘Dominant 3’. I’m happy the system has proved itself against a tough set of numbers.

I’m now going to test some of the other systems against Mr Eko’s numbers.
😊

What kind of progression did you use?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 23, 02:09 AM 2019
What kind of progression did you use?

Hi Andre

This was the d’alembert progression. I was already halfway through this test when you posted information about the ‘Gr8Player's Progression’.

I plan on testing this soon.

Cheers Andre
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Let Me Win on Mar 23, 02:58 AM 2019
The great progression was used successfully but with ten steps instead of seven in the book "Ten Days At Monte Carlo at The Banks Expense.


https://archive.org/details/TenDaysAtMonteCarloAtTheBankSEx
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 23, 03:04 AM 2019
Toughest session yet..... see results below....

2,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+40) -7 fb
2,2,2 - 2  W  (+44) -6 fb
2,1,2 - 0,1,2  LLW  (+42) -7 fb
1,0,1 - 1  W  (+46) -6 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W  (+47) -5 fb
2,1,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+41) -8 fb
2,2,1 - 1,1,2  LLW  (+38) -8 fb
1,1,2 - 1   W  (+43) -7 fb
1,2,1 - 2,2,1  LLW   (+40) -8 fb 
1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+22) -11 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW  (+15) -12 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW  (+16) -13 fb
1,1,2 -,2,2,2  LLL. (-14) -16 fb
1,1,1 - 1    W (-2) -15 fb
0,1,2,2 - 2  W (+9) -14 fb
1,2,0,1 - 1  W (+19) -13 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+20) -13 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+21) -13 fb
1,1,0,0,1 - 1  W (+30) -12 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W  (+38) -11 fb
0,1,1,2 - 2,2,1  LLW (+32) -14 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW  (+25) -15 fb
2,2,2 - 2  W (34) -14 fb
1,1,2 - 2,1  LW (+26) -14 fb
2,2,1 - 1,1,2  LLW (+29) -15 fb
2,1,2 - 1,1,2  LLW (+21) -16 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (+31) -15 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW  (+30) -15 fb       
2,1,0,1 - 2,2,2  LLL  (+0) -18 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW (+1) -18 fb
2,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL. (-40) -21 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W. (-25) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 2,2,1  LLW  (-28) -21 fb
0,1,1,2 - 1  W  (-13) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 2,1  LW (-12) -20 fb
0,1,2,1 - 0,1  LW (-11) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W (+3) -19 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW (-9) -20 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW (-8) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W  (+6) -19 fb
1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL. (-36) -22 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W (-20) -21 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (-5) -20 fb
2,2,1 - 2  W (+9) -19 fb
1,2,1 - 1  W (+22) -18 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+23) -18 fb
2,1,1 - 1  W (+35) -17 fb
2,2,2 - 2 W  (+46) -16 fb
2,1,1 - 2,2,2   LLL (+40) -19 fb
2,2,2 - 1,1,2  LLW (+37) -20 fb
1,2,2 - 1,2  LW  (+38) -20 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+39) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+40) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (+45) -19 fb
1,1,2 - 0,1  LW (+46) -18 fb
1,2,2 - 2  W (+50) -17 fb
1,1,1 - 1   W  (+53) -16 fb
2,2,1 - 1 W (+55) -15 fb

Total profit: +55 units (This session +9)
Flat bet -15 (This session -11).

I won’t be able to salvage the flat-bet but that’s ok.... I plan to use a conservative progression.

No more testing the ‘Dominant 3’. I’m happy the system has proved itself against a tough set of numbers.

I’m now going to test some of the other systems against Mr Eko’s numbers.
😊

What was the biggest unit you had to bet?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 23, 03:17 AM 2019
What was the biggest unit you had to bet?

The biggest bet was 16 units. Not ideal but they were tough numbers.

A bet of 16 is level 5 of a Marty. A bet of 16 is level 16 in the D’alembert.

Let us know if you have more success with a different progression.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 23, 04:59 AM 2019
Regarding Gr8 players prog:
LEVEL 1:  −1, 1, 1,−1, −1,−1.−1        −3 up next LEVEL
LEVEL 2:  2, −2, −2, −2, 2, 2, −2       −2 up next LEVEL
LEVEL 3:  3, −3. −3, 3.−3,−3,−3       −9  up next LEVEL what we do here? Go back to LEVEL 2 or continue?
LEVEL 4:  4, 4. 4 what we do here? Go back 2  LEVELS (start from  LEVEL2)? Or 1 back, start from LEVEL 3?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Let Me Win on Mar 23, 05:15 AM 2019
You can read the book it is fully explained there with examples.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 23, 05:23 AM 2019
I google it but i couldnt find it, where is it Letmewin?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Let Me Win on Mar 23, 05:25 AM 2019
https://archive.org/details/TenDaysAtMonteCarloAtTheBankSEx
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 23, 08:31 AM 2019
Regarding Gr8 players prog:
LEVEL 1:  −1, 1, 1,−1, −1,−1.−1        −3 up next LEVEL
LEVEL 2:  2, −2, −2, −2, 2, 2, −2       −2 up next LEVEL
LEVEL 3:  3, −3. −3, 3.−3,−3,−3       −9  up next LEVEL what we do here? Go back to LEVEL 2 or continue?
LEVEL 4:  4, 4. 4 what we do here? Go back 2  LEVELS (start from  LEVEL2)? Or 1 back, start from LEVEL 3?


Here is how I might play your results, Loukoumas, using that progression:

-1; 1  = +0 level so restart level 1
1        =+1 new high so restart level 1
-1; -1; -1; -1; 1; -1; -1  = -4  in minus so up to 2u
-2; 2; 2; -2; 2; -2; -2    = -6  still in minus so up to 3u
3; -3; -3; -3; 3; 3; 3     = -3  improved so back down to 2u for next 7 bets

In the book LetMeWin showed each Level can have 10 bets or stages...

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 23, 10:07 AM 2019
As GLC showed best with not so high stake I continued the test. It is played the most dominant last 7. Must be thousands of numbers that Mr Eko provided. Well, a bit on the way at least.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: ice789 on Mar 23, 10:27 AM 2019
As GLC showed best with not so high stake I continued the test. It is played the most dominant last 7. Must be thousands of numbers that Mr Eko provided. Well, a bit on the way at least.

pls share code drsgon ts2
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 23, 10:30 AM 2019
pls share code drsgon ts2

I can't code. I'm doing it by hand.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 23, 10:37 AM 2019
-1; 1  = +0 level so restart level 1
1        =+1 new high so restart level 1
-1; -1; -1; -1; 1; -1; -1  = -4  in minus so up to 2u
Correct, but according GLC we havent to think for a level within a level, so we just track for at least -1 1st level  total to move up to next level.
-2; 2; 2; -2; 2; -2; -2 ?   
3; -3; -3; -3; 3; 3; 3.?   Those are different from my example.
Anyway i write what i think should be right according this old post:
LEVEL 1:  −1, 1, 1,−1, −1,−1.−1        −3 up next LEVEL
LEVEL 2:  2, −2, −2, −2, 2, 2, −2       −2 up next LEVEL
LEVEL 3:  3 (return to level 2 since we are +1plus, GLC is clear at this point,  meaning that in any stage of a level we are +1plus we have to go back to previous level)
LEVEL 2:−2,−2, 2,−2,−2,−2, 2 (instead of 4 from my example) −6 up next LEVEL
LEVEL 3: +3,+3 (if  next +3 again we have to go back at LEVEL 1 though, we always seek to return at "ville"1).
Note that is different approach  from cyclic 5 progression
11111
22222
33333
44444
55555
where always have to complete all 5 stages of a level.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 23, 10:54 AM 2019
Quote
Regarding Gr8 players prog:
LEVEL 1:  −1, 1, 1,−1, −1,−1.−1        −3 up next LEVEL
LEVEL 2:  2, −2, −2, −2, 2, 2, −2       −2 up next LEVEL
LEVEL 3:  3, −3. −3, 3.−3,−3,−3       −9  up next LEVEL what we do here? Go back to LEVEL 2 or continue?
LEVEL 4:  4, 4. 4 what we do here? Go back 2  LEVELS (start from  LEVEL2)? Or 1 back, start from LEVEL 3?

At the end of Level 2 you have got -2 - but it should be -5
At the end of Level 3 you would be -14 overall

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: -Katalyst- on Mar 23, 11:03 AM 2019
Must be thousands of numbers that Mr Eko provided. Well, a bit on the way at least.


**14605 sets
- so prbly around 28500 numbers (0s inclusive)

@ Jono - the dominant 3 mechanically doesn’t hold up, having said that - there’s still money to be made with this set up - I guess that’s where intuit & experience also comes into play

-Best-
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 23, 11:06 AM 2019
  We say same thing Atlantis, I just make the addition separately for each level.You add the total sum. ;)
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 23, 11:19 AM 2019
  We say same thing Atlantis, I just make the addition separately for each level.You add the total sum. ;)

Yes you are right! :)
All I'm saying is that at the end of level 3 you are -14
If u check the way I do it using your wins and losses it is only -3 at the end of level 3!

Agree that main idea is to try and keep as long as possible in "1-ville".

Regards,
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 23, 11:34 AM 2019
Hi Loukoumas,

You w/l register  = LWWLLLLWLLLWWLWLLWLLLWWW

-1; 1  = +0 level so restart level 1
1        =+1 new high so restart level 1
-1; -1; -1; -1; 1; -1; -1  = -4  in minus so up to 2u
-2; 2; 2; -2; 2; -2; -2    = -6  still in minus so up to 3u
3; -3; -3; -3; 3; 3; 3     = -3  improved so back down to 2u for next 7 bets

LW
W
LLLLWLL
LWWLWLL
WLLLWWW

A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 23, 12:15 PM 2019
Yes , right, just now your approach flashed into my mind! :thumbsup:
So you propose a slight modification to GLCs only for level1. IF we reach +1plus within 1st level we track the level back from the start and we do it until conscecutive loses  lead us to step up.Clever!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Mar 23, 12:55 PM 2019

**14605 sets
- so prbly around 28500 numbers (0s inclusive)

@ Jono - the dominant 3 mechanically doesn’t hold up, having said that - there’s still money to be made with this set up - I guess that’s where intuit & experience also comes into play

-Best-

28500 numbers! So if I count it right I have passed 500 spins ( as there is no need to type down every number on RX).
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 23, 04:23 PM 2019

**14605 sets
- so prbly around 28500 numbers (0s inclusive)

@ Jono - the dominant 3 mechanically doesn’t hold up, having said that - there’s still money to be made with this set up - I guess that’s where intuit & experience also comes into play

-Best-

All good Katalyst. I’m going to test some of the other methods but with different progressions.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 23, 09:53 PM 2019
Toughest session yet..... see results below....

2,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+40) -7 fb
2,2,2 - 2  W  (+44) -6 fb
2,1,2 - 0,1,2  LLW  (+42) -7 fb
1,0,1 - 1  W  (+46) -6 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W  (+47) -5 fb
2,1,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+41) -8 fb
2,2,1 - 1,1,2  LLW  (+38) -8 fb
1,1,2 - 1   W  (+43) -7 fb
1,2,1 - 2,2,1  LLW   (+40) -8 fb 
1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL  (+22) -11 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW  (+15) -12 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW  (+16) -13 fb
1,1,2 -,2,2,2  LLL. (-14) -16 fb
1,1,1 - 1    W (-2) -15 fb
0,1,2,2 - 2  W (+9) -14 fb
1,2,0,1 - 1  W (+19) -13 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+20) -13 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+21) -13 fb
1,1,0,0,1 - 1  W (+30) -12 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W  (+38) -11 fb
0,1,1,2 - 2,2,1  LLW (+32) -14 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW  (+25) -15 fb
2,2,2 - 2  W (34) -14 fb
1,1,2 - 2,1  LW (+26) -14 fb
2,2,1 - 1,1,2  LLW (+29) -15 fb
2,1,2 - 1,1,2  LLW (+21) -16 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (+31) -15 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW  (+30) -15 fb       
2,1,0,1 - 2,2,2  LLL  (+0) -18 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW (+1) -18 fb
2,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL. (-40) -21 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W. (-25) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 2,2,1  LLW  (-28) -21 fb
0,1,1,2 - 1  W  (-13) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 2,1  LW (-12) -20 fb
0,1,2,1 - 0,1  LW (-11) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W (+3) -19 fb
1,1,1 - 2,2,1  LLW (-9) -20 fb
2,2,2 - 1,2  LW (-8) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W  (+6) -19 fb
1,2,2 - 1,1,1  LLL. (-36) -22 fb
1,1,1 - 1  W (-20) -21 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (-5) -20 fb
2,2,1 - 2  W (+9) -19 fb
1,2,1 - 1  W (+22) -18 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+23) -18 fb
2,1,1 - 1  W (+35) -17 fb
2,2,2 - 2 W  (+46) -16 fb
2,1,1 - 2,2,2   LLL (+40) -19 fb
2,2,2 - 1,1,2  LLW (+37) -20 fb
1,2,2 - 1,2  LW  (+38) -20 fb
2,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+39) -20 fb
1,1,1 - 2,1  LW (+40) -20 fb
1,1,2 - 1  W (+45) -19 fb
1,1,2 - 0,1  LW (+46) -18 fb
1,2,2 - 2  W (+50) -17 fb
1,1,1 - 1   W  (+53) -16 fb
2,2,1 - 1 W (+55) -15 fb

Total profit: +55 units (This session +9)
Flat bet -15 (This session -11).

I won’t be able to salvage the flat-bet but that’s ok.... I plan to use a conservative progression.

No more testing the ‘Dominant 3’. I’m happy the system has proved itself against a tough set of numbers.

I’m now going to test some of the other systems against Mr Eko’s numbers.
😊

Jono, I said I have incredible hard numbers. 99% of systems will fail on this.

Anyway, I worked on my against, and same switching method. I not revealed yet now, because not was the best results, but I kept to work on this, amd I think I found a way that kept me to positive after thousands of numbers. Even this is very very small numbers, an maybe the next 2000 numbers will lose more.

I wanna go thorough all my numbers, whick killed the dominant 3 method too, killed the Atlantis best of five, and now killing GLC method too.

Please guys, downllad my numbers, and try to discover something against them !  ;) :thumbsup:

Cheers
Eko
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 23, 10:49 PM 2019
Jono, I said I have incredible hard numbers. 99% of systems will fail on this.

Anyway, I worked on my against, and same switching method. I not revealed yet now, because not was the best results, but I kept to work on this, amd I think I found a way that kept me to positive after thousands of numbers. Even this is very very small numbers, an maybe the next 2000 numbers will lose more.

I wanna go thorough all my numbers, whick killed the dominant 3 method too, killed the Atlantis best of five, and now killing GLC method too.

Please guys, downllad my numbers, and try to discover something against them !  ;) :thumbsup:

Cheers
Eko

All good Mister Eko. I would rather test myself against difficult numbers.

Still testing different methods... 😊
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 24, 02:31 AM 2019
I believe the best way to improve the strategy is to avoid betting the dominants
 2-2-2 and 1-1-1

What do you think, guys?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 24, 05:22 AM 2019
I believe the best way to improve the strategy is to avoid betting the dominants
 2-2-2 and 1-1-1

What do you think, guys?
I think it sounds like a good idea. Give it a go Andre.

I’ve just started testing a switching method. It’s probably similar to what Mister Eko is doing...

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: loukoumas on Mar 24, 06:20 AM 2019
I have been searching and found the original gr8 players post mentioned by GLC here https://betselection.cc/profile/gr8player/?area=showposts;start=75.
There are some hints i want to point out after reading carefully this post about his 7 step progression:
a) We pick up randomly any 7 spins to build up our 1st level ("1-villle"). Dont need to look for a new high within  it, cause this will make things unecessarily complicated. We sit at this level either on a plus or 1 unit minus at most (4-3 loss series, we move onto next level only when  -3 ,-5 or -7 occur ). IMPORTANT: We do the same with anyone stepping level eg. if we finish level 2 and we are -2 units behind (in total with level1) we stay at level 2, if we finish level 3 with -3 in total we stay also at level 3 and so on. On the contrary  if we are behind -3 units or more after we have finished level 2 we move up to level 3, at level 3  when behind -4 or more move up level 4 etc.
b) Always we seek to return to level 1, in order to keep progression as lower as possible. At this point comes the debatable part, unfortunately not cleared from gr8 player: Assuming we start level 2 with +2 units after -3 loss on level1, hence we are -1. What do we do here?  We return to level 1? (in this case -1loss must be considered the first spin in a series of a new "1-villle", so we have to track for  another 6 spins to complete it. Or we continue on level 2 until a total plus (or minus over -1units)? First choice is more safe but also more complicated than second. Why? If we start level 3 with +3 after -5 loss from previous level we are 2 units down, so we have to step back to level 2 and start over tracking for another 6 spins of 2 units and so on. However if  we start level 3 with +3 after -4 loss from previous level we are 1 unit down, therefore we have to step back to level1and start over tracking for another 6 spins of 1 unit this time. Picking to go with the second choice instead, we just seek for a plus in total to step back (not as many forths and backs), but progression may escalate a little more larger. Feel free to comment.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: atlantis on Mar 24, 07:30 AM 2019
Hi Loukoumas,

We are not tied to operate it exactly like gr8player suggests. I take your point about the further clarity which would have been helpful though. I think it a matter of personal choice in the end how one operates it. It is quite evident that there is some room for flexibility as it is described. I have already set out my own take on it - it is basically the more cautious approach that you have alluded to.  I am comfortable with that and it suits me personally. Up to others if they wish to have fewer steps or make it more aggressive.
But I think you are quite right to further question and seek clarity on this. It is most important to know how to operate a system properly each time and to react correctly in each eventuality that occurs during play  One needs to be absolutely certain and confident about such matters when practicing in order to get valid and meaningful results. If enough trial results are favourable and positive only then can one think about going on to play in real casino and prepare to risk any real monies.
A.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 27, 01:13 PM 2019
Worm guard results
Wwwwlwllllwwwwllwlwllwwwwwllwllwlllwlwlllllwwwwlllwlwlwwlwwwlwlwwlwlwlwwwlllwllwllwwllwwllllwlllwwlwlwlwwlwwllwllwlllwwwwwwlwwwwwllwl.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Still on Mar 27, 03:00 PM 2019
Worm guard results
Wwwwlwllllwwwwllwlwllwwwwwllwllwlllwlwlllllwwwwlllwlwlwwlwwwlwlwwlwlwlwwwlllwllwllwwllwwllllwlllwwlwlwlwwlwwllwllwlllwwwwwwlwwwwwllwl.

Can you point again to the systems you studied that eventually gave you the idea for this?

Which do you think is the most valid, detailed, system proposed so far in this thread?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 27, 04:39 PM 2019
Can you point again to the systems you studied that eventually gave you the idea for this?

Which do you think is the most valid, detailed, system proposed so far in this thread?
[/quote I will not very one needs to bupuy Andrew baccarat no lose / wait all day for a trigger systems ..
This thread is call beat the even money bet under the testing thread.if any one wants holy grails need to contact mr Grasshopper Andrew he has the way.😂
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 27, 04:43 PM 2019
I believe the best way to improve the strategy is to avoid betting the dominants
 2-2-2 and 1-1-1

What do you think, guys?
😂 ok
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Still on Mar 28, 01:57 PM 2019
I will not very one needs to bupuy Andrew baccarat no lose / wait all day for a trigger systems ..
This thread is call beat the even money bet under the testing thread.if any one wants holy grails need to contact mr Grasshopper Andrew he has the way.😂

Can i ask, when did you discover your first system that stayed above water (in profit)? 

How long did you develop other, profitable systems, before landing on the Grasshopper Guard method you now use?  :twisted:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 28, 04:57 PM 2019
I believe the best way to improve the strategy is to avoid betting the dominants
 2-2-2 and 1-1-1

What do you think, guys?

I know I cant beat roulette in the long term, but I like to test and create strategies. It's a hobby to keep my brain working and healthy.

I'm fine here. Good luck
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Roulettebeater on Mar 28, 07:04 PM 2019
I know I cant beat roulette in the long term, but I like to test and create strategies. It's a hobby to keep my brain working and healthy.

I'm fine here. Good luck

André

You can make fortune from roulette, all you need is smart brain, big nose and faith in the dealer !
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Mar 28, 08:25 PM 2019
Worm guard results
Wwwwlwllllwwwwllwlwllwwwwwllwllwlllwlwlllllwwwwlllwlwlwwlwwwlwlwwlwlwlwwwlllwllwllwwllwwllllwlllwwlwlwlwwlwwllwllwlllwwwwwwlwwwwwllwl.

Great results Winner! That's a hell of a lot of W's.

I'm still testing with Mister Eko's numbers. It's been going well so I'm planning a trip to the B&M next weekend. Time to grow a pair and get serious...

This 'Worm Guard' has really got me guessing.... I should be perfectly happy with the methods I'm using because they appear to be  working. However any clues about 'Worm Guard' would be well received!

Cheers Winner - I'd say 'good luck' but I don't think you need it......

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 29, 09:41 AM 2019
Wwlwwlwlwwwwlwll
Wllwllwwlllllwwlwlllww
Lllwlwwllwwwlwlllwwll
Wwlwwwwwlwlwlllwwwlllwww
Wwwwllllwlwwwllwlllwwlww
Lllwwlwllwwwlwlwlwwwlwllwllwlwllwlllw
Wlwwlwllwwwlwlwlwwwllllwwwlllwwwlwwl
Wwlwwwlwwwwwlwlwwlllwwlwwwllwllllwwwllwlwwlwlwlwlww
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 29, 12:05 PM 2019
Wlwlwwlwlllwlllwwwllwwlwllw
Wwwllwwwwlwwllllwwlwwlwwwwwwlllwwlwwlllw
Lwwwwwllwllwlwwllwwwwlw.
+12 flat
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 29, 12:06 PM 2019
Wwlwwlwlwwwwlwll
Wllwllwwlllllwwlwlllww
Lllwlwwllwwwlwlllwwll
Wwlwwwwwlwlwlllwwwlllwww
Wwwwllllwlwwwllwlllwwlww
Lllwwlwllwwwlwlwlwwwlwllwllwlwllwlllw
Wlwwlwllwwwlwlwlwwwllllwwwlllwwwlwwl
Wwlwwwlwwwwwlwlwwlllwwlwwwllwllllwwwllwlwwlwlwlwlww
15 flat
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: IVO on Mar 29, 01:02 PM 2019
15 flat
congrats to your successful strategy
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Still on Mar 29, 02:05 PM 2019
15 flat

Can you post the permanence (drop sequence) of numbers that corresponds with this performance?

Or, would that tend to reveal too much about the system?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 30, 02:10 PM 2019
Snake guard results flat bet

Vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
Vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
Vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
Vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
Vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
Vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
Vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

The earth is flat  :xd:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Mar 31, 04:55 AM 2019
Can you post the permanence (drop sequence) of numbers that corresponds with this performance?

Or, would that tend to reveal too much about the system?

Of course he can not! Man is a joke. :thumbsup:

 
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Mar 31, 07:15 AM 2019
Okey

Wwwwwwwwllwwwwwwwwllllwlllwwwwwlllwwwwwwllwwllwwwwwwwlllwwwwwwwwlwwwwwllwwwwwwlwwwlwwwwwwwlwwwwwwwllwwwwlwwwlwwwwwwllwwwww

+50 flat
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: zorro on Mar 31, 08:56 AM 2019
To winner & friends(?), well, some of them :-)


winner. „ Lots of ideas on this thread and not one of u can make anything work short  term ,meaning less then 3hrs play. „

Here a suggestion from well-known 2-fig. ec.gambling


Now you are 2 persons,  A  +  B

A plays    spin 1 + 2   which gives him his  run/chops

B plays    spin 2 + 3    ( spin 2 is spin 1 for pl. B)

B‘s spin 3 ist next(first sin 1 for pl. A)

ex for L/H

12 15 4 22 26 9

A  12 15   run 2

B   15  4   run 2

A   4   22  chop 1  etc…

this on all Ecs ~ 6 opp. To shorten playing time.  May double your wins (and losses) in
same time.



concerning progression:  my recommend.:   contre d‘alembert. ( POSITIVE progri.)

When WIN 

step 1 2 3   - and STAY  with this level ( don‘t gett greedy) ‚til it breaks, and go back, (lost level 3,
then back to 2, 1 – and then BREAK ( as winner suggested) til next trigger (  222  222 222 221)
shows up.

W  w  w  ww    L w  w ll    l    lllllllll   w(trigger)  l l l l     w ww   wwwwlll

1   2   3   3  3    3 2    3 32  1/   STOP                     1(stop)      12    33333321/Stop     etc.

no more fear of collapsing your marti.

may it help. Have fun.
z.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Mar 31, 11:27 AM 2019
Of course he can not! Man is a joke. :thumbsup:
What are we joking about did I miss something.🤔
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Andre Chass on Mar 31, 01:28 PM 2019
Okey

Wwwwwwwwllwwwwwwwwllllwlllwwwwwlllwwwwwwllwwllwwwwwwwlllwwwwwwwwlwwwwwllwwwwwwlwwwlwwwwwwwlwwwwwwwllwwwwlwwwlwwwwwwllwwwww

+50 flat

Lol

Wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
Wwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
Wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

+ 666  flat  >:D
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 01, 12:15 AM 2019
Okey

Wwwwwwwwllwwwwwwwwllllwlllwwwwwlllwwwwwwllwwllwwwwwwwlllwwwwwwwwlwwwwwllwwwwwwlwwwlwwwwwwwlwwwwwwwllwwwwlwwwlwwwwwwllwwwww

+50 flat

Mister Eko

Your numbers cleaned me up... Back to the drawing board!

I'm happy to be cleaned up testing. I'd rather not have a false sense of security....

The above numbers look like a really good result.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Apr 03, 12:56 PM 2019
Worm guard allows you to trap double wins be it ww/LL using 18 spin cycle betting for runners/ choppers and found pairing is not necessary.
Wwwlwllw +6( 2 double wins)
Wwwwww+9  (3x double wins )
Wllwlwwwll+9. (3xDW)
Lwlwllwwww+9 (3xDW)
Wllwwwll+9.   ( 3xDW)
Wllwwlwww+9(3xDW)
Wwlllwww+9 (3xDW)
Llllwwlwll+12(4xDW)
Wlwlwwww+6(2DW)
The lowest being 1 double and the highest 4 doubles .no Marty need
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 03, 02:51 PM 2019
Worm guard allows you to trap double wins be it ww/LL using 18 spin cycle betting for runners/ choppers and found pairing is not necessary.
Wwwlwllw +6( 2 double wins)
Wwwwww+9  (3x double wins )
Wllwlwwwll+9. (3xDW)
Lwlwllwwww+9 (3xDW)
Wllwwwll+9.   ( 3xDW)
Wllwwlwww+9(3xDW)
Wwlllwww+9 (3xDW)
Llllwwlwll+12(4xDW)
Wlwlwwww+6(2DW)
The lowest being 1 double and the highest 4 doubles .no Marty need

I’m testing a new way to beat Eko’s numbers.....

Double trap wins sounds good and the results look even better. No marty.... Impressive!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Apr 03, 03:09 PM 2019
I’m testing a new way to beat Eko’s numbers.....

Double trap wins sounds good and the results look even better. No marty.... Impressive!
Yes jono I’ll pm you with the strategy, I want to make sure that there’s no worm hole we can get caught with.hence the the name worm guard
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 03, 04:01 PM 2019
Yes jono I’ll pm you with the strategy, I want to make sure that there’s no worm hole we can get caught with.hence the the name worm guard

Wow, thanks Winner. That would be great. I'm currently working on a method which might beat Eko's numbers. I'm on to something which seems to be holding up. I'll share any findings with you too.

Anyway, I'm not giving up. Back to testing....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Apr 03, 04:37 PM 2019
Wow, thanks Winner. That would be great. I'm currently working on a method which might beat Eko's numbers. I'm on to something which seems to be holding up. I'll share any findings with you too.

Anyway, I'm not giving up. Back to testing....
Ok 👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Apr 03, 06:19 PM 2019
Guys please share with me ideas too, I working on too  :-\
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 03, 08:00 PM 2019
Guys please share with me ideas too, I working on too  :-\

Mister Eko

I'm still working my way through your numbers. I've gone through seven different methods. All have eventually failed against your numbers. The current method is the strongest and its still going. If this method works I'll let you know. I'll need a few days yet. So many numbers to get through....

If this method fails, I have another one to test. With every failure, the method improves slightly.  Leave it with me.

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Apr 03, 09:55 PM 2019
Guys please share with me ideas too, I working on too  :-\
I will
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: boyd30 on Apr 04, 01:13 AM 2019
Mister Eko

I'm still working my way through your numbers. I've gone through seven different methods. All have eventually failed against your numbers. The current method is the strongest and its still going. If this method works I'll let you know. I'll need a few days yet. So many numbers to get through....

If this method fails, I have another one to test. With every failure, the method improves slightly.  Leave it with me.

Cheers

Haven't been here for a litte while. I wonder if it's worth going on with the D'Alembert testing? If It fails eventually no idea. Best regards!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Apr 04, 04:09 AM 2019
Thanks jono and winner.

I have another methid in my pocket. What if we could combinate this method with the VDW method?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Apr 04, 05:39 AM 2019
VdW offers no advantage in roulette bet selection in any form.

Either an arithmetic progression is not guaranteed, in which case, either colour can win. Or if an arithmetic progression is due, it can be formed by either colour in which case,  either colour can win.

The probability that either partition/colour can win the next spin is still 50%, or 48.65% if you care to include zero.

VdW is an example of a mis-application of a valid mathematical principle in order to justify a fallacy argument ie Trying to predict the result of the next spin from previous ones.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Apr 04, 06:21 AM 2019
VdW offers no advantage in roulette bet selection in any form.

Either an arithmetic progression is not guaranteed, in which case, either colour can win. Or if an arithmetic progression is due, it can be formed by either colour in which case,  either colour can win.

The probability that either partition/colour can win the next spin is still 50%, or 48.65% if you care to include zero.

VdW is an example of a mis-application of a valid mathematical principle in order to justify a fallacy argument ie Trying to predict the result of the next spin from previous ones.

Everyone, who is not ap or vb player, trying to predict the resukts of the next spin from previous ones.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Apr 04, 07:24 AM 2019
Fair enough. But you may as well predict randomly in that case.  Just trying to save you some time, and anyone else new who happens to be reading.

For what it's worth, I think Downtown's colour matrix is good. It doesn't offer any advantage, but psychologically takes the pressure off even chance selections.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Mister Eko on Apr 04, 07:57 AM 2019
Why, have you some tstrategy in your pocket, which offers any advantage ? Expect vb ap shits
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Roulettebeater on Apr 04, 08:01 AM 2019
Fair enough. But you may as well predict randomly in that case.  Just trying to save you some time, and anyone else new who happens to be reading.

For what it's worth, I think Downtown's colour matrix is good. It doesn't offer any advantage, but psychologically takes the pressure off even chance selections.

I want that you tell me a comprehensive approach to the evaluation of accuracy !

In simple words, How do you evaluate the performance of a bet ? In the past I heard that if your bet falls within the result’s range (< 11 numbers) then your bets seems to have somehow accuracy.

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Apr 04, 09:03 AM 2019
There's no strategy which offers any advantage in the selection of an even chance bet. They are distributed evenly around the wheel and as such, any prediction of a sector will contain a number of both partitions of any even chance.

If you are talking about the prediction of a number, then if you predicted randomly, your mean error would be +/- 9.25  pockets. So any system (computer, VB, DS, or rotor defect) which gives an average error of less than about +/- 9 pockets will give you an edge on the house.

If you are predicting randomly (or from immediate  past results - it comes to the same thing) even chances are better to play as the house edge is less (European wheel with partage only). If you are predicting randomly on US wheel, it doesn't matter if you play EC or numbers. All bets are equally bad, apart from the 5 number bet (0 00 1 2 3) which is even worse.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Roulettebeater on Apr 04, 09:14 AM 2019
There's no strategy which offers any advantage in the selection of an even chance bet. They are distributed evenly around the wheel and as such, any prediction of a sector will contain a number of both partitions of any even chance.

If you are talking about the prediction of a number, then if you predicted randomly, your mean error would be +/- 9.25  pockets. So any system (computer, VB, DS, or rotor defect) which gives an average error of less than about +/- 9 pockets will give you an edge on the house.

If you are predicting randomly (or from immediate  past results - it comes to the same thing) even chances are better to play as the house edge is less (European wheel with partage only). If you are predicting randomly on US wheel, it doesn't matter if you play EC or numbers. All bets are equally bad, apart from the 5 number bet (0 00 1 2 3) which is even worse.

So a bet (1 number) that has an average <9 pockets from result will lead to an edge ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Apr 04, 09:29 AM 2019
So a bet (1 number) that has an average <9 pockets from result will lead to an edge ?

Correct. See attached, courtesy of Bigbroben.

It could take a while to realise though. Variance is very high on just one number, so ideally you want to be be betting on 5-7 numbers in your prediction area to keep the cash flow up  :twisted:
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Anastasius on Apr 04, 09:34 AM 2019
Does mean bet numbers hitting 9x above average...
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Apr 04, 09:37 AM 2019
Nope, it means your prediction is less than 9 pockets from the result.

If it was a 9x frequency number, I think we'd all be on it regardless of method!
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Roulettebeater on Apr 04, 09:45 AM 2019
Correct. See attached, courtesy of Bigbroben.

It could take a while to realise though. Variance is very high on just one number, so ideally you want to be be betting on 5-7 numbers in your prediction area to keep the cash flow up  :twisted:

Yes, one of my pyhiscs’s based system seems to perform good, I don’t bet only one number, bet selection points out to one pocket, I cover it as well as it’s 8 neigbors, frequently the result falls within the range of 3-7 pockets.

What you think ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Apr 04, 09:55 AM 2019
You should be raking it in if you can get within 7 pockets average error!

One thing though, you should be 7 pockets +/  missing on both sides If you are  consistently 7 pockets short, then a shift correction needs to be applied.

If you are both +/ on the target equally, then a shift won't help and your prediction is optimised for your method.

A scatter plot of your predictions versus result will help visualise if you can improve by applying a shift.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Roulettebeater on Apr 04, 10:06 AM 2019
You should be raking it in if you can get within 7 pockets average error!

One thing though, you should be 7 pockets +/  missing on both sides If you are  consistently 7 pockets short, then a shift correction needs to be applied.

If you are both +/ on the target equally, then a shift won't help and your prediction is optimised for your method.

A scatter plot of your predictions versus result will help visualise if you can improve by applying a shift.

Yes it’s + - on the target equally, I also think that the method is already optimized, in fact I am covering 8 pockets on each side, so total is 17 numbers. Do you think I have edge. ?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Apr 04, 10:30 AM 2019
Your edge depends on your prediction error, not on the number of pockets you bet.

It depends on the wheel. If the scatter peak is long and flat , 17 pockets may be Ok. If the scatter peak is tighter and higher, then 17 is probably too many. Some of your numbers could be just average or negative expectation for that spin. About 10 probably better. Two neighbours bets in the zone would do.

I'd do well to get 17 bets down! Usually two or three chips on splits or straights  in the zone is all I manage. I guess touch bet would be easier, but I don't play those.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Roulettebeater on Apr 04, 10:40 AM 2019
Your edge depends on your prediction error, not on the number of pockets you bet.

It depends on the wheel. If the scatter peak is long and flat , 17 pockets may be Ok. If the scatter peak is tighter and higher, then 17 is probably too many. Some of your numbers could be just average or negative expectation for that spin. About 10 probably better. Two neighbours bets in the zone would do.

I'd do well to get 17 bets down! Usually two or three chips on splits or straights  in the zone is all I manage. I guess touch bet would be easier, but I don't play those.

Maybe !
But I really don’t like to play long sessions, playing only 2 neighbors can be stressful because you might need lo sit longer on the table, but as you said it depends !
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Firefox on Apr 04, 12:13 PM 2019
Well it can be stressful just hitting. I hit 7 splits in a row last week and I was only betting a handful of numbers. Pit boss was staring at me, and knew I was looking in the wheel. It was only £250, I play for small stakes. Had to go back to betting red/black and a few random bets before I coloured up.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Apr 08, 03:02 PM 2019
Who’s jumped 🚢 worm guard hasn’t lol
Wwwlwlwlwlwlllwwllwwllwwwwlwwlllwwlllllwlwllwwllwwwwllwwwllwllwww nice little profit
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Apr 08, 04:13 PM 2019
Jono how’s it going?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 08, 04:15 PM 2019
Who’s jumped 🚢 worm guard hasn’t lol
Wwwlwlwlwlwlllwwllwwllwwwwlwwlllwwlllllwlwllwwllwwwwllwwwllwllwww nice little profit

Not me! I think I’m about 2/3 the way through Mister Eko’s numbers (so many numbers it’s hard to be sure). I’m going to make it through to the end this time.

Probably another week and I will post results.

Great results with Worm Guard Winner. Still not sure how you can be so consistent.....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Apr 08, 04:45 PM 2019
Not me! I think I’m about 2/3 the way through Mister Eko’s numbers (so many numbers it’s hard to be sure). I’m going to make it through to the end this time.

Probably another week and I will post results.

Great results with Worm Guard Winner. Still not sure how you can be so consistent.....
let me know how your making out when your done and I’ll compare what you doing with the worm guard.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 08, 04:54 PM 2019
let me know how your making out when your done and I’ll compare what you doing with the worm guard.

Cheers Winner. No worries.

I’ll post all results in about a week. About 2/3rds through, so far so good. I would be very unlucky not to complete the numbers this time. This is about the eighth attempt.

I’ve tested  the different methods discussed on this thread but they all eventually come unstuck. Not to say they aren’t good methods, but these numbers are very unforgiving. So many zeros.......

How about some easier numbers next time Mister Eko!!??? 😊
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 11, 08:01 PM 2019
Cheers Winner. No worries.

I’ll post all results in about a week. About 2/3rds through, so far so good. I would be very unlucky not to complete the numbers this time. This is about the eighth attempt.

I’ve tested  the different methods discussed on this thread but they all eventually come unstuck. Not to say they aren’t good methods, but these numbers are very unforgiving. So many zeros.......

How about some easier numbers next time Mister Eko!!??? 😊

A heads-up.... I underestimated Mr Eko's numbers. When I did the above post earlier in the week, I said I was about 2/3rds of the way through the numbers. Not quite..... I estimate I'm only just over halfway. There's actually 29,209 numbers. I put them into a word doc and did a character count.... 29,209  1s & 2s (runs and chops) equates to 58,418 individual numbers. A hell of a lot....

The system is still ahead. I just need  plenty more time.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Still on Apr 11, 08:34 PM 2019
A heads-up.... I underestimated Mr Eko's numbers. When I did the above post earlier in the week, I said I was about 2/3rds of the way through the numbers. Not quite..... I estimate I'm only just over halfway. There's actually 29,209 numbers. I put them into a word doc and did a character count.... 29,209  1s & 2s (runs and chops) equates to 58,418 individual numbers. A hell of a lot....

The system is still ahead. I just need  plenty more time.

I could program this in VBA/Excel if i knew the rules.   Is this a modification not yet discussed in this thread?

If you've placed 15k bets and it's still ahead, that's saying something.  About how many units are you up now?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 11, 09:48 PM 2019
I could program this in VBA/Excel if i knew the rules.   Is this a modification not yet discussed in this thread?

If you've placed 15k bets and it's still ahead, that's saying something.  About how many units are you up now?

I haven't worked out the winnings. Because there are so many numbers I'm just putting down WL, LLW, WW LLL etc. I'll go through and do the sums at the end. When I hit a very bad patch, I do some quick maths to make sure the system hasn't sunk.

I'm still fine tuning the rules... I've got the main system, but I'm also looking at identifying an earlier betting opportunity using a separate betting stream. 

By the end of next week, even if I'm not through the numbers, I will start finishing off. I'm starting to realise that with the amount of numbers involved, it's not practical to test everything manually.

I will share everything when complete.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Still on Apr 11, 10:11 PM 2019
I haven't worked out the winnings. Because there are so many numbers I'm just putting down WL, LLW, WW LLL etc. I'll go through and do the sums at the end. When I hit a very bad patch, I do some quick maths to make sure the system hasn't sunk.

I'm still fine tuning the rules... I've got the main system, but I'm also looking at identifying an earlier betting opportunity using a separate betting stream. 

By the end of next week, even if I'm not through the numbers, I will start finishing off. I'm starting to realise that with the amount of numbers involved, it's not practical to test everything manually.

I will share everything when complete.

If you post the wins/loss stream in a text, i'll process it and report.   I have Excel 365 on my desktop now and some time on my hands. 
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 12, 07:52 AM 2019
If you post the wins/loss stream in a text, i'll process it and report.   I have Excel 365 on my desktop now and some time on my hands.

Sorry Still, can’t do that. Numbers and W-Ls everywhere. Eg: 1,2,2 - 2 LLL W  2,2,1 - 2,1 LW.
I need to go through and separate  everything.
Busy weekend....
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Apr 12, 11:54 AM 2019
Sorry Still, can’t do that. Numbers and W-Ls everywhere. Eg: 1,2,2 - 2 LLL W  2,2,1 - 2,1 LW.
I need to go through and separate  everything.
Busy weekend....

Congrats I’m sure you will make something work .
Thanks for testing I know that’s a lot of work when testing manually.👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Apr 18, 02:23 PM 2019
Worm guard stats
9/1 loss 124=7
8/1
13/1
3/1
9/1
5/1
3/1
9/1
3/1
10/1
5/1
13/1
9/1
4/1
4/1
1/1
1/1
11/1
12/1
3/1
53/1
7/1
1/1
2/1
13/1
7/1
3/1
13/1
9/1
15/1
14/1
14/1
3/1
1/1
19/1
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 18, 03:52 PM 2019
Worm guard stats
9/1 loss 124=7
8/1
13/1
3/1
9/1
5/1
3/1
9/1
3/1
10/1
5/1
13/1
9/1
4/1
4/1
1/1
1/1
11/1
12/1
3/1
53/1
7/1
1/1
2/1
13/1
7/1
3/1
13/1
9/1
15/1
14/1
14/1
3/1
1/1
19/1

Great work Winner! I’ll take those stats every day of the week. 👍

An update on Mr Eko’s numbers. I made it through everything last week. I now have a whole lot of Ws and Ls (1,1,1,2,2,1,2,2,1,2 - LW etc). I’m now doing all the calculations.

I was originally going to use three different betting streams, but I couldn’t get it to work, so back to the start. It’s a balance between identifying betting opportunities whilst making profit. I think I finally have the balance right, two betting streams on the go.

Just so many numbers to get through. I don’t want to get careless and make a mistake.

I should be through everything next week.

Look forward to updating then....

Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on Apr 18, 04:33 PM 2019
Jono 👍🏼
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Taotie on Apr 18, 09:57 PM 2019
EC progression for beating the even money:.... Ignatus, you should code this for RX.  :thumbsup:

Return to the start on any new bankroll high.

Return to current level on any win without new bankroll high.

For example,  betting FTL (you can bet whichever EC you want) each level with a three step martingale (provided the virtual bet loses. If the virtual bet wins, that ends the martingale and you move to next level.

On each new level when you lose the first 2 bets the next bet is virtual. If it wins you move to the next level. If it loses you continue with the third step of the martingale of the same level.

1
2
virtual bet (vb)
vb lose 4
vb win - next level
2
4
virtual bet
vb lose 8
vb win - next level
3
6
virtual bet
vb lose 12
vb win - next level
4
8
virtual bet
vb lose 16
vb win - next level
5
10
virtual bet
vb lose 20
vb win - next level
6
12
virtual bet
vb lose 24
win - next level
8
16
virtual bet
vb lose 32
vb win - next level
10
20
virtual bet
vb lose 40
vb win - next level
15
30
virtual bet
vb lose 60
vb win - next level
20
40
virtual bet
vb lose 80
vb win - next level
25
50
vb lose 100
vb win - next level
30
60
Reach this point run away.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Taotie on Apr 18, 10:07 PM 2019
The EC 1-100 spread for this progression is realistic enough for many real world playing conditions.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: nottophammer on Apr 21, 06:26 AM 2019
What you doing in here DTown?
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Apr 26, 09:18 PM 2019
Jono 👍🏼

Still working on this Winner.....

Unfortunately I have restarted. I made it through to the end a couple of weeks ago, but as I was doing the calculations I identified another couple of betting opportunities. On top of this, one of the earlier opportunities wasn’t working out. It was becoming too confusing , so I opted to restart using the modified method.

I had no idea it would take this long but  I want to finish.  Hopefully I will have something worthwhile to show at the end.

Cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: poluvolo on Apr 27, 02:33 AM 2019
we are very grateful to you jono1167
go ahead
cheers
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: blueman on Apr 29, 06:08 AM 2019
1
2
virtual bet (vb)
vb lose 4

NOW PLAY FOR REAL 4 U?? Corect?

vb win - next level
2
4
virtual bet
vb lose 8
vb win - next level
3
6
virtual bet
vb lose 12
vb win - next level
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on May 08, 11:57 AM 2019
Word of advice to all roulette players stop jumping from system to system.
Instead try and confuse random with your chosen sytem.
The 🔑 is in the (pattern results) of your you chosen system.
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Winner on May 08, 02:52 PM 2019
Here this for all those that gave up on This.
121 -1 starting with patterns.
122 +1 hit on 2
222  +3 hit on 3
111-3hit on 1
112-1hit on 3
221+1 hit on 1
For an easy +4 patterns are alive on where it hits on nothing more nothing less . No I’m not going to post all my hard work ,but there is advantage playing in groups .
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: Gerard711 on May 22, 10:57 AM 2019
You certainly have faith in your system Winner.

25 unit bets and a double zero wheel. It's like you're giving it every chance to fail.... only it's not.  Respect.

What about using this at Baccarat anyone try that no zeros ,push on a tie
Title: Re: Beating the even money
Post by: jono1167 on Jun 05, 05:06 PM 2019
Disclaimer: Maths/physics guys please tune out now, the following will not interest you.

I have been following Winner’s ‘even money’ thread since the beginning of the year. In case you missed it, Winner came up with a method to apply to even money bets. It involves grouping the results into 1s and 2s. If you don’t know how the method works, read the first post on this thread. It explains everything better than I could.

A couple of months ago Mister Eko published a set of numbers (29,209 groups of 1s and 2s made up of 58,418 individual results). He issued a challenge for anyone who thought they could successfully get through the numbers. I was keen to test a few methods I had been working on, so I decided to give it a go. I got through the entire set of numbers in approximately six weeks, but having got through everything, I became aware I had missed some betting opportunities along the way. With this in mind, I decided to start again. That was about seven weeks ago. Second time lucky and finally, all done….!

In summary, I completed Mister Eko’s numbers with a profit of 1,102 units. Now for the bad news…. Despite the success of the system during the testing phase, in practice, the method is turning out to be mind-numbingly boring. A truckload of patience and discipline is required. I started testing on R-Sim two weeks ago, and despite positive results, I have decided to throw the towel in. I would have more fun watching paint dry. Painful….

If you’re still interested and you don’t mind a system where massive amounts of patience is required, then read on.

MONEY MANAGEMENT
Firstly, money management. I used the labouchere with a base of 1 unit.
Example:
Loss      Loss         Loss         Loss           Loss             Loss             Win               Win            Win         Win         Win
  1           11           112          1123        11234         112345       1123456         12345          234           3              1
Bet 1    Bet 2       Bet 3        Bet 4         Bet 5            Bet 6            Bet 7             Bet 6          Bet 6       Bet 3       Bet 1 
 -1           -3             -6             -10            -15               -21                -14                 -8                -2            +1            +2

I hate using progressions, the bigger the progression, the bigger the loss (when it comes). Therefore I decided to cap the progression at the seventh step. After the seventh loss in a row, freeze the progression: 1123456. Continue until you have a win, and then start decreasing as per usual. Fortunately after 29,209 results, I never had any more than nine losses in a row across any of the betting methods. Recovering from nine losses is fairly straight forward.

To achieve the profit of 1,102 units I used four different betting methods. These were divided into three different betting streams. I will explain everything below.

BETTING METHODS 1 & 2 (BETTING STREAM A): (744 units profit)
Betting for twins and against triplets.

This was the most common opportunity I encountered. The first thing you look for is a twin forming. Example: 221 - 22_ ? Here you are going to be betting for the twin forming. You will be betting for a 1. Unfortunately a 2 comes up. The string now looks like this: 221 – 222 (L) -1. This string ends here because the twin has failed to form. We look for a new opportunity.

Another twin starts to form: 111 – 11_. We will be betting for a 1.
Success, we get the 1: 111 – 111 (W). We can now start betting against the triplet forming. We are looking for a 2. Unfortunately another 1 appears. The string now looks like this: 111 – 111 - 1 (W L). We continue looking for a 2. This time the 2 appears. The string now looks like this: 111 – 111 - 12 (W  LW). It’s a win, the triplet has failed to form. The string finishes here at +1.

When betting against the triplet forming, the worst result I encountered was nine straight losses. Over the course of testing, nine straight losses occurred on three occassions. Here is an example:

212  212  212  212   212  1  (W LLL LLL LLL W).


BETTING METHOD 3 (Betting stream B): (261 units profit)
Betting against quads.


Betting against quads was the second most common betting opportunity I encountered.

Step 1: Look for the quad to start forming. Description: The quad forms, you wait for four more results, then start betting against the first quad. Example: 2222 – 2112 - ? You will be betting for a 1. We get a 2 (a loss), the string now looks like this: 2222 – 2112 – 2 (L). We are still looking for a 1 to appear. This time we get a hit. The string now looks like this: 2222 – 2112 – 21 (LW).

The worst result I had betting against the quad forming was nine straight losses. This occurred on two occasions.

Please see example of nine losses for the quad.  2222 - 2112 – 2222 – 2112 – 21 (LLLL LLLL LW)


BETTING METHOD 4. Betting against a three-of-a-kind triplets. (97 units profit)

Betting against three-of-a-kind triplets was the third most common betting opportunity I encountered.

Step 1: Look for the three-of-a-kind triplet to start forming. Example: 222 – 111 - ? Now start betting against the third three-of-a-kind. Your first bet will be a 1. Unfortunately a 2 appears.  Example: 222 – 111 – 2 (L). You need to bet the 1 again. Another 2 appears: 222 – 111 – 22 (LL). Third time lucky, the 1 finally appears. The string looks like this: 222 – 111 – 221 (LLW).

The worst run I had betting against the three-of-a-kind triplet was seven losses in a row. Here is an example: 222 – 111 – 222 – 111 - 21 (LLL LLL LW).


Testing on Roulette Simulator

I started testing this method on Roulette Simulator (rated game), just