*PATTERN 4*
Here are the rules for this new idea of mine. Could this simple method be a Holy Grail?
I don't know, it has true random beaten I know that. And Twister is killing BV RNG with it. So lets see what the future brings us.
THE RULES...
1, Record spins in rows of three for one or more of the EVEN CHANCES until you have 9 spins. There must be NO ZERO in these nine. Example...
HLH-PATTERN 1
LLL
HLL--NINE SPINS NO ZERO.
2, You now bet against the FIRST PATTERN forming as the FOURTH PATTERN (SPINS 10-12)
3, Using the grand martingale over a three step progression as follows 1,3,7
4, You play for ONE WIN from one to three steps, then STOP. don't play continuosly, allow at least 20 spins to pass before commencing a NEW GAME.
5, My records show a phenomenal strikerate for this simple even chance system. *PATTERN 4* shows a lot of potential for both LIVE AND RNG play. Although I've proofed it on HIGH and LOW. It seems to be even more powerful combined with RED and BLACK , ODD and EVEN. I will champion LIVE PLAY results for now.
And TWISTER WILL ATTEMPT TO DO THE IMPOSSIBLE. Take several thousand units off an RNG at BV.
Welcome to *PATTERN 4*
THIS IS THE ONE :xd: :twisted: :LoL: !
thanks JL, we owe you :thumbsup:
Day One I am +500 Units
I do play ALL THREE EC's
RB
OE
HL
I play a Grand Marti of 1-3-7
I don't do recovery, I take the loss.
Every time you finish a 12 Spin Session, log out and start over
Each Session of 12 Spins take around 60-90 Seconds
Rinse and Repeat :xd: :twisted: :thumbsup:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 14, 03:50 PM 2011
THIS IS THE ONE :xd: :twisted: :LoL: !
thanks JL, we owe you :thumbsup:
Day One I am +500 Units
I do play ALL THREE EC's
RB
OE
HL
I play a Grand Marti of 1-3-7
I don't do recovery, I take the loss.
Every time you finish a 12 Spin Session, log out and start over
Each Session of 12 Spins take around 60-90 Seconds
Rinse and Repeat :xd: :twisted: :thumbsup:
500 UNITS!
Twister that's CRAZY!!!!!!!!
I am very happy for you ;D ;D ;D
we take 0 as a loss for the 4th patterns?
Twister is buying the drinks in ;D
Cheers John for making this new thread :thumbsup:
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 14, 04:09 PM 2011
500 UNITS!
Twister that's CRAZY!!!!!!!!
I am very happy for you ;D ;D ;D
Crazy and True :xd: :twisted: !!!
If all 3 EC's hit on the 3rd leg its a +9 Unit Session !
When it happens its tasty :twisted:
Ive experienced single losses but no double or treble loss. It will happen Im sure. Only time will tell us how this holds up 8) 8) 8) 8)
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 14, 03:50 PM 2011
THIS IS THE ONE :xd: :twisted: :LoL: !
thanks JL, we owe you :thumbsup:
Day One I am +500 Units
I do play ALL THREE EC's
RB
OE
HL
I play a Grand Marti of 1-3-7
I don't do recovery, I take the loss.
Every time you finish a 12 Spin Session, log out and start over
Each Session of 12 Spins take around 60-90 Seconds
Rinse and Repeat :xd: :twisted: :thumbsup:
I know LoL, lets hope you really have BV beat twister. I know TRUE RANDOM is beat with a method that only takes 12 spins a game. It is the anwser for Americans who have to play real BM casinos. Over the next week we will find out if this can really rule an RNG.
And when I learn BACCARAT we really will have ONE SYSTEM TO RULE THEM ALL. It looks like its got it ALL COVERED. No more excuses people. START WINNING...
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 14, 04:15 PM 2011
Twister is buying the drinks in ;D
Cheers John for making this new thread :thumbsup:
Thanks Zig, what Twisters done today is amazing. I cant believe I could have found a 12 spin betting miracle. All the guys who always say MV5 is too slow live have got nothing left to moan about. Get on with it, IF THIS GOES MAINSTREAM :o :o ??? :o
Twister.
Can you please show a example how you write down and track all 3 even chance or anuone else if Twisters not here :)
Cheers Jon
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 14, 04:36 PM 2011
Twister.
Can you please show a example how you write down and track all 3 even chance or anuone else if Twisters not here :)
Cheers Jon
I dont write anything down mate 8)
I spin 9 Spins on Auto. Takes around 10-15 seconds
I then stop the Spins
I then look at the number of the first spin
for an example lets say that number is 4
I now know my first three bets are going to be R O H (red odd high) (opposite to No4)
The next results deciede what my next bets are
for example lets say 23 hits
we have 3 wins. Session end :xd: :twisted:
Rinse and Repeat 8) 8) 8) 8)
Love what you're doing JL :thumbsup:
Could you clarify what to do if any of the first three patterns are repeated?
example
HHH
LLL
HHH
??? Bet now on LLL OR
HHH
LLL
HHH
LHL
??? Bet now on LLL after 3 unique patterns have shown?
Thanks
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 14, 04:52 PM 2011
I don't write anything down mate 8)
I spin 9 Spins on Auto. Takes around 10-15 seconds
I then stop the Spins
I then look at the number of the first spin
for an example lets say that number is 4
I now know my first three bets are going to be are O H (red odd high) (opposite to No4)
The next results deciede what my next bets are
for example lets say 23 hits
we have 3 wins. Session end :xd: :twisted:
Rinse and Repeat 8) 8) 8) 8)
So if first number was 4 you bet 1 unit on red,high,odd right? And then the next 2 numbers and do the same ?
Jon
Hi John can you clarify from your testing for everyone if you bet after 3 UNIQUE patterns have formed OR just after ANY 3 patterns without a zero. So there is no confusion
Cheers :smile:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 14, 05:09 PM 2011
Hi John can you clarify from your testing for everyone if you bet after 3 UNIQUE patterns have formed OR just after ANY 3 patterns without a zero. So there is no confusion
Cheers :smile:
My results were drawn from the first 12 spins of each PATTERN BREAKER GAME. Yes you will still bet even if there are patterns repeated. ZEROS are the no, no. And if all 9 spins were HIGH OR LOW. NO BET.
:thumbsup:
There's no mathematical basis/advantage of breaking it down in sessions broken apart versus one long continuous session?
Word of warning if you play it straight through you will break even minus the house edge because you do the same exact thing over and over. It's like playing Red or Black straight through, you will come out even minus the times when you hit zero.
If you can't win playing long term than explain how you can win playing short term intervals?? Everything must have a sound explanation to it and can't just be. J Legend, are you going to post your testing records on the forum.
I don't know if it's inevitable that P4 will come crashing down and the only way to find out is long extensive testing. And as disapointing as it might be I hope everyone on will be honest enough to concede if it really works or not. There seems to be a little bit of blind faith going on here that can cloud one's judgment. Just trying to be voice of reason, that's all.
Sure, let's test :)
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 14, 03:50 PM 2011
THIS IS THE ONE :xd: :twisted: :LoL: !
thanks JL, we owe you :thumbsup:
Day One I am +500 Units
I do ONLY play at BV NZ RNG
I do play ALL THREE EC's
RB
OE
HL
I play a Grand Marti of 1-3-7
I don't do recovery, I take the loss.
Every time you finish a 12 Spin Session, log out and start over
Each Session of 12 Spins take around 60-90 Seconds
Rinse and Repeat :xd: :twisted: :thumbsup:
Congrats, Twister!
This could very well be to the unnatural variances of RNG simulators because they are not truly random by nature only pseudo-random. People complain about odd, crazy losing streaks and you also hear about amazing winning streaks as well that blows the variance in every direction more so than live wheels or dealers.
So good for you if you keep winning but let's see for the long haul though because that is key; crazy variance or not, every thing will average out in the end.
Quote from: Moxy on Apr 14, 06:05 PM 2011
There's no mathematical basis/advantage of breaking it down in sessions broken apart versus one long continuous session?
Word of warning if you play it straight through you will break even minus the house edge because you do the same exact thing over and over. It's like playing Red or Black straight through, you will come out even minus the times when you hit zero.
If you can't win playing long term than explain how you can win playing short term intervals?? Everything must have a sound explanation to it and can't just be. J Legend, are you going to post your testing records on the forum.
I don't know if it's inevitable that P4 will come crashing down and the only way to find out is long extensive testing. And as disapointing as it might be I hope everyone on will be honest enough to concede if it really works or not. There seems to be a little bit of blind faith going on here that can cloud one's judgment. Just trying to be voice of reason, that's all.
That is why WE DONT PLAY IT STRAIGHT THROUGH. You win because your bet selection is asking random to do something in a precise place.
I have 2600 games recorded MOXY where random was only able to match the forth pattern with the first pattern 49 times. Thats a little better than breaking even mate.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 14, 06:17 PM 2011
That is why WE don't PLAY IT STRAIGHT THROUGH. You win because your bet selection is asking random to do something in a precise place.
I have 2600 games recorded MOXY where random was only able to match the forth pattern with the first pattern 49 times. that's a little better than breaking even mate.
Hi John.
Thats amazing.
Did you test with interuption between the sessions? wait 20 spin between for example or just strait play?
Jon
QuoteThat is why WE don't PLAY IT STRAIGHT THROUGH. You win because your bet selection is asking random to do something in a precise place.
I have 2600 games recorded MOXY where random was only able to match the forth pattern with the first pattern 49 times. that's a little better than breaking even mate.
You could be right or you could be very, very lucky; but you must have an explanation to that like every thing else in nature
if you are right.
If I roll the dice once every day for one year or straight through in one day and reach an equal amount of rolls, I will get close to a ratio of 1/6 of
7's that would come out for both events proving that it doesn't matter when or how long it takes you to complete each of your tests.
So how do you explain having a 1/7 W/L ratio playing straight through uninterrupted and then suddenly improving to a 1/10 or 1/13 by playing it in intervals in different sessions with gaps in between? Reasonable enough question, I would think.
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 14, 06:22 PM 2011
Hi John.
that's amazing.
Did you test with interuption between the sessions? wait 20 spin between for example or just strait play?
Jon
No there MUST be AT LEAST 20 spins between games. EVERYONE READ THIS CAREFULLY. My discovery was made testing PATTERN BREAKER GAMES REMEMBER. And they were all SINGULAR. 5 games a day on average. So there is a POWER POINT in this. STICK TO THE PLAN.
Even out, no this is going up and up. My main interest is Twster vs BV ;D RNG. If he breaks 3,000 units in profit. PATTERN 4 is the betting miracle weve been waiting 300 years for.
Quote from: Moxy on Apr 14, 06:05 PM 2011
And as disapointing as it might be I hope everyone on will be honest enough to concede if it really works or not.
Hmm well when i tried to bet this continuous i reported on this site a - 11 loss
Also for anyone on paddypower they can see me in play as i use the same name. I dont sit there looking at 1000s of random number spins and try to see if it works betting continuous. I test EVERYTHING using small chips on a REAL WHEEL for everybody to see.
Just my little 2p worth :thumbsup:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 14, 06:38 PM 2011
Hmm well when I tried to bet this continuous I reported on this site a - 11 loss
Also for anyone on paddypower they can see me in play as I use the same name. I don't sit there looking at 1000s of random number spins and try to see if it works betting continuous. I test EVERYTHING using small chips on a REAL WHEEL for everybody to see.
Just my little 2p worth :thumbsup:
I will look for you Zig ;D I have same name to in PP ;D
Ok, no response.
For all we know John could be working for the casino just feeding you guys misinformation and fallacies just to round up more suckers to the casino door. ???
Just saying...
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 14, 06:45 PM 2011
I will look for you Zig ;D I have same name to in PP ;D
lol i know. I see you leave the table today as i logged in :D
Quote from: Moxy on Apr 14, 06:05 PM 2011
There's no mathematical basis/advantage of breaking it down in sessions broken apart versus one long continuous session?
Word of warning if you play it straight through you will break even minus the house edge because you do the same exact thing over and over. It's like playing Red or Black straight through, you will come out even minus the times when you hit zero.
If you can't win playing long term than explain how you can win playing short term intervals?? Everything must have a sound explanation to it and can't just be. J Legend, are you going to post your testing records on the forum.
I don't know if it's inevitable that P4 will come crashing down and the only way to find out is long extensive testing. And as disapointing as it might be I hope everyone on will be honest enough to concede if it really works or not. There seems to be a little bit of blind faith going on here that can cloud one's judgment. Just trying to be voice of reason, that's all.
@Moxy: Congratulations on your post :thumbsup: Some common sense is always welcome!!!
The only way to get somewhere is through extensive testing. In this method, it is all the same wether the testing is made using continuos spins or making small breaks of 10,20 or 50 spins between 'attacks'. The result is going to be the same and, negative as I may sound, I am afraid the result is that you end up losing the house edge (actually more because of the small progression)
Sorry to sound negative in this case...
If I am shown some real spins where the advantage of this bet selection method is proved I will very gladly change my mind though ;)As I said in another post of mine, using patterns to bet is a well known technique to Baccarat players. Lots of variations have been tested and not a single one (that I know of) has ended up as a long term winner. And Baccarat has a much lower house edge than Roulette!!!
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 14, 07:03 PM 2011
LoL I know. I see you leave the table today as I logged in :D
Cooooooool ;D
I don't know if it's inevitable that P4 will come crashing down and the only way to find out is long extensive testing. And as disapointing as it might be I hope everyone on will be honest enough to concede if it really works or not. There seems to be a little bit of blind faith going on here that can cloud one's judgment. Just trying to be voice of reason, that's all.--Moxy
All bets are subject to the house edge and unfair payouts. JohnLegend gets his inspiration from the users in the forum. He seems to need their energy to be creative.
@ Moxy.
@ moxy...
I've never spoken to john but I know his background. I can vouch that he's done more to help people here and elsewhere over the years to make a profit at roulette than most other people on this site. The same argument could be levelled at you with a lot more ground. Which casino do you work for? I'm sure you don't work for a casino but your debate is an age old one- hit and run vs. Mathematical probability. This is something you should debate elsewhere in a separate thread as it is applicable ( in your mind) to probably more than half the methods posted here. That's not to say that there isn't plenty of people here who will agree with you but I would suggest taking this up elsewhere as it's not actually a method and neither contributes to the testing of this method.
Thanks man.
Woods
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 14, 03:50 PM 2011
THIS IS THE ONE :xd: :twisted: :LoL: !
thanks JL, we owe you :thumbsup:
Day One I am +500 Units
I do ONLY play at BV NZ RNG
I do play ALL THREE EC's
RB
OE
HL
I play a Grand Marti of 1-3-7
I don't do recovery, I take the loss.
Every time you finish a 12 Spin Session, log out and start over
Each Session of 12 Spins take around 60-90 Seconds
Rinse and Repeat :xd: :twisted: :thumbsup:
---------------
@twister, log out for how long?! Does it matter?
vundarosa
Quote from: woods101 on Apr 14, 08:22 PM 2011
@ Moxy.
@ moxy...
I've never spoken to john but I know his background. I can vouch that he's done more to help people here and elsewhere over the years to make a profit at roulette than most other people on this site. The same argument could be levelled at you with a lot more ground. Which casino do you work for? I'm sure you don't work for a casino but your debate is an age old one- hit and run vs. Mathematical probability. This is something you should debate elsewhere in a separate thread as it is applicable ( in your mind) to probably more than half the methods posted here. That's not to say that there isn't plenty of people here who will agree with you but I would suggest taking this up elsewhere as it's not actually a method and neither contributes to the testing of this method.
Thanks man.
Woods
Believe me, I'm no mathematician, and judging from the enthusiasm here, I want it to work as much as the rest of these guys.
My point is, however John is doing it, it could be something inadvertent that he might not be aware that is making it work long term. Who knows, maybe if we establish what it is then it may very be the reason for a positive long term expectation, that's all.
Is there a basis that we can go back on to why John is beating the house edge time and time again?
John suggested to play 5 sessions a day. I'm not quite sure if its a good idea.
Lets say that this system will fail after 500 sessions. Playing 5sessions/day it will take three months to find out that. Than we realize that we have wasted 3 months for nothing. We can even make a rule 1 session per day which give us 1 year and 6 months of testing.
IMO we should abuse it just like twister did it, winning 500units today. This way we will find out if it holds up or not.
I'm still a little bit confused why we have to wait 20 spins between sessions. Does it really change our outcome?
Quote from: Moxy on Apr 14, 06:25 PM 2011
You could be right or you could be very, very lucky; but you must have an explanation to that like every thing else in nature if you are right.
If I roll the dice once every day for one year or straight through in one day and reach an equal amount of rolls, I will get close to a ratio of 1/6 of 7's that would come out for both events proving that it doesn't matter when or how long it takes you to complete each of your tests.
So how do you explain having a 1/7 W/L ratio playing straight through uninterrupted and then suddenly improving to a 1/10 or 1/13 by playing it in intervals in different sessions with gaps in between? Reasonable enough question, I would think.
Everybody playing this system needs to keep the above post tucked away in the back of your mind.
Have fun while you're winning. But please, don't give it all back if the spins stop being so favorable.
Here's a suggestion and I'm not saying this is mathematically correct either, but it may help a little.
When you sit down to play, if you win the 1st 3 12 spin sessions (or some such predictor), keep playing. You may be having a lucky streak.
If you lose within the first 3 games, quit and come back another day. You may be having an unlucky day.
This is an intangible factor that, if you have good instincts this, may, I emphasize "may", help you stay ahead in the long run.
Playing for extended periods of time while you're hot, increasing bets with the houses money, etc... vs quiting while the quiting is good when you're cold is a possible way to win at gambling.
In the long run, it may not matter that much because you never know if you're quitting just before getting hot or if you're going to keep playing just as you're going into a down turn, but I can testify that in the short run it seems to make a difference for me.
G
Hi Guys,
Well, the math for this is simple up to a point. Each grouping of three EC's has a one in eight chance of appearing.
Now here is the math that might be making the difference. What are the odds of any group of three EC's repeating or NOT repeating EXACTLY four groups later?
I have no way of calculating that. I'm sure one of you math geeks can figure it out for us.
By combining the two different odds should give us an idea of why it is working so well.
Scooby Doo
Quote from: kenio on Apr 14, 09:16 PM 2011
John suggested to play 5 sessions a day. I'm not quite sure if its a good idea.
Lets say that this system will fail after 500 sessions. Playing 5sessions/day it will take three months to find out that. Than we realize that we have wasted 3 months for nothing. We can even make a rule 1 session per day which give us 1 year and 6 months of testing.
in my opinion we should abuse it just like twister did it, winning 500units today. This way we will find out if it holds up or not.
I'm still a little bit confused why we have to wait 20 spins between sessions. Does it really change our outcome?
Yes it does, Twister is only able to get the turnover he has because he is using a super fast RNG. He still shuts down between bets.
Remember, I made this discovery while analyzing records for PATTERN BREAKER. There its working under the same conditions, And that means it needs to be applied the same.
What those of you who turn to math as soon as theres a threat on the horizon dont understand is, random isnt good at doing certain things We know it can do most things GIVEN TIME, but when put on the spot, it performs IN OUR FAVOUR.
As for me being a casino spy, come on Moxy. Hey Twister and Atlantis are my associates. We said amongst ourselves we'll do the casinos a great favour and forge the MATRIX VERTICAL concept into a great method.
PATTERN 4 showed me an average strike of 53/1 over 2600 games where 7/1 is required to break even. And a game is done and dusted in 10-12 spins. If this ever goes even partially mainstream, casinos will be more than a little concerned.
DAY TWO OF TWISTER VS BV
That is why WE don't PLAY IT STRAIGHT THROUGH. You win because your bet selection is asking random to do something in a precise place.
I have 2600 games recorded MOXY where random was only able to match the forth pattern with the first pattern 49 times. that's a little better than breaking even mate.
Thats what John said.
So if we have 7/1 Loss/Win ratio using 1,2,4 progression or even better @ 1,3,7 i like it very much.
John recorded 2600 games which means more than 25k spins. Only 49 losses out of 2600 - 1 loss 4 50 wins.
Remember to discard Zeros and get out after each win 4 every EC u play.
If after another 2600 games we have 100 or 200 losses do the math - still way ahead.
I think we lost in this discussion little bit track of profit in Long Term even when we agree that
the way to play is in series of separate short sessions.
Thats my humble opinion.
Thx 4 hard work and words of criticism. We need both.
@vundarosa
I log out and then straight back in again. 5 seconds max :xd:
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 15, 01:22 AM 2011
Yes it does, Twister is only able to get the turnover he has because he is using a super fast RNG. He still shuts down between bets.
Remember, I made this discovery while analyzing records for PATTERN BREAKER. There its working under the same conditions, And that means it needs to be applied the same.
What those of you who turn to math as soon as theres a threat on the horizon don't understand is, random isnt good at doing certain things We know it can do most things GIVEN TIME, but when put on the spot, it performs IN OUR FAVOUR.
As for me being a casino spy, come on Moxy. Hey Twister and Atlantis are my associates. We said amongst ourselves we'll do the casinos a great favour and forge the MATRIX VERTICAL concept into a great method.
PATTERN 4 showed me an average strike of 53/1 over 2600 games where 7/1 is required to break even. And a game is done and dusted in 10-12 spins. If this ever goes even partially mainstream, casinos will be more than a little concerned.
DAY TWO OF TWISTER VS BV
Yes your not wrong JL :thumbsup:
Lets see how things go today
I'm gonna do everythin the same
I played for around 8hrs yesterday :xd: :xd: :LoL:
ROUND TWO !!!
Things are a little slower today
I've had 4 losses this mornin already
Profit is at +49 Units for the day so far
I know I wont win as much today, as got "work" to do as devoted 8hrs to playin yesterday LoL :LoL:
Will update later when I've played some more :xd: :xd: :xd: :xd:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 04:57 AM 2011
Things are a little slower today
I've had 4 losses this mornin already
Profit is at +49 Units for the day so far
I know I wont win as much today, as got "work" to do as devoted 8hrs to playin yesterday LoL :LoL:
Will update later when I've played some more :xd: :xd: :xd: :xd:
Does 4 losses means 4x11 units?
I just had a session
The first three numbers were 25 25 27
So Im now bettin Low Even Black
Spin
No2 !
BEAUTIFUL :xd: :xd: :lol:
OK had a few more PM's about P4 on BV NZ
The reason for my good profit is down to turnover
1 full game lasts around 60-90 seconds, then Im onto the next game.
Also I play usin a Grand Marti. So if all 3 EC's hit on the third leg its a +9 Units game :xd: :xd:
Anyone who is not sure, post ure P4 questions here :thumbsup:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 05:54 AM 2011
I just had a session
The first three numbers were 25 25 27
So I'm now bettin Low Even Black
Spin
No2 !
BEAUTIFUL :xd: :xd: :LoL:
Keep it going Twister 4 figures is what im waiting for it tells me P4 owns BV. ;D
All 4 for the each of 3 EC's?? Is it not 11x3x4=132 units lost then?
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 14, 03:48 PM 2011
Welcome to *PATTERN 4*
Really like this one ,John.
Well done. :thumbsup:
As for the negative posters in here ,can you just do us all a favour and leave this thread.
I've had a gutful of these type of posters in another forum.Really don't want to see this negative type of poster start up in here. :(
Quote from: marivo on Apr 15, 06:47 AM 2011
All 4 for the each of 3 EC's?? Is it not 11x3x4=132 units lost then?
Ah I think I must of wrote it up wrong, sorry mate.
I meant I had 4 losses of one EC
I really shud keep written notes for stats etc
Im really more focused on my Profit and Loss :lol:
I just can't get my head around why starting a new game after a win should make a difference.
With BV, when you close the roulette window, I'm pretty sure the stream of numbers remains active. When you resume the session, the stream of numbers simply resumes.
Current Profit for the day is +74 Units
Been "workin" not playing :lol:
Quote from: The_Force on Apr 15, 08:13 AM 2011
I just can't get my head around why starting a new game after a win should make a difference.
With BV, when you close the roulette window, I'm pretty sure the stream of numbers remains active. When you resume the session, the stream of numbers simply resumes.
Thats not correct mate.
Each new game has a different Checksum. So different numbers.
If that were not the case you would be right, and it wudnt work. But it isnt so it does :lol:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 08:14 AM 2011
Current Profit for the day is +74 Units
Been "working" not playing :LoL:
Is this on real money mode.
Well done if it is.
Whats your unit size.
10 pound a unit and Betvoyager might not be too impressed :xd:
john why 20 spins later and not 10.
...
Quote from: moles40 on Apr 15, 08:33 AM 2011
Is this on real money mode.
Well done if it is.
what's your unit size.
10 pound a unit and Betvoyager might not be too impressed :xd:
Yes real money mate :xd:
Unit size is private, but I aint playin for pennies ! :wink:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 08:53 AM 2011
Yes real money mate :xd:
Unit size is private, but I ain't playin for pennies ! :wink:
I am :-[
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 09:05 AM 2011
I am :-[
that's fine Zig :thumbsup:
We all did to start with :)
Just joined BV today,
Have a question........it doesn't let you spin more than 3 times without betting, and no mutually exclusive bets allowed ?????
Apologies if I'm being a bit dumb lol ???
Gordon
@ Gordonline: You have to bet 3 units on 19-36 or 1-18 and the three opposite natural lines 1 unit each at BetVoyager to advance spins.
Couple questions to Twisteruk.
1. What BR is needed playing only one EC ( High/Low)
2. Are US players accepted at betvoyager?
3. Exiting after every session, you dont have to wait 20 spins to start tracking?
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 09:05 AM 2011
I am :-[
Me to on slingshot ;D
I saw you win ;D ;D ;D
Proofreaders2000
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Quote from: kenio on Apr 15, 09:13 AM 2011
Couple questions to Twisteruk.
1. What BR is needed playing only one EC ( High/Low)
2. Are US players accepted at betvoyager?
3. Exiting after every session, you don't have to wait 20 spins to start tracking?
I would say the minimum bank is 33 Units. That gives you 3 Banks.
I have no idea mate, sorry.
No. Every new game a new checksum is generated so ure startin each session with new numbers
Hope that helps :)
@ Kenio: BetVoyager does not accept U.S. residents. (Although if you are a U.S.citizen living abroad, that's ok.)
Hi All
I'm playing BV NZ starting today and playing real money and will post all results later
Playing all 3 E/C bets with 3 seperate banks as Twister is doing (1,2,4) stopping after 12 spins with no progression
Rinse & Repeat (You have to be in it to win it) ;D
Gordon
Quote from: Proofreaders2000 link=topic=4697. msg47602#msg47602 date=1302874059
@ Kenio: BetVoyager does not accept U. S. residents. (Although if you are a U. S. citizen living abroad, that's ok. )
I've found this. Not sure if it still works
hxxp: rouletteforum. cc/online-gaming/betvoyage-for-us-players/
Quote from: Gordonline on Apr 15, 09:46 AM 2011
Hi All
I'm playing BV NZ starting today and playing real money and will post all results later
Playing all 3 E/C bets with 3 separate banks as Twister is doing (1,2,4) stopping after 12 spins with no progression
Rinse & Repeat (You have to be in it to win it) ;D
Gordon
I do prefer a 1-3-7 :D
Hope you have funn mate :xd:
Quote from: kenio on Apr 15, 09:48 AM 2011
I've found this. Not sure if it still works
hxxp: rouletteforum. cc/online-gaming/betvoyage-for-us-players/
If you are a U.S. resident you can speak to ThomasGrant about that option.
I thought you were asking about
directly joining
BetVoyager as a U.S. resident for real money.
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 15, 09:15 AM 2011
Me to on slingshot ;D
I saw you win ;D ;D ;D
Yes i saw you win too ;D Sometimes after a couple of wins i give up waiting for the matrix and log in later
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 10:01 AM 2011
Yes I saw you win too ;D Sometimes after a couple of wins I give up waiting for the matrix and log in later
Yes ;D Only pennies.
i play to some other system while wait. Matrix to but so slow :D
Jon
Twister
I will give that progression a go as well, thanks,
Out of interest are all 3 E/C's winning equally, as most of my testing prior to playing for real were not so good on the Reb/Black bets ???
Gordon
Quote from: Gordonline on Apr 15, 10:10 AM 2011
Twister
I will give that progression a go as well, thanks,
Out of interest are all 3 E/C's winning equally, as most of my testing prior to playing for real were not so good on the Reb/Black bets ???
Gordon
I personally have not noticed any difference btwn the 3
But it is still early days :ooh:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 10:12 AM 2011
I personally have not noticed any difference between the 3
But it is still early days :ooh:
All received.....Over
Will keep you posted
Gordon
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 15, 10:06 AM 2011
Yes ;D Only pennies.
i play to some other system while wait. Matrix to but so slow :D
Jon
I was on my second progression doing the Matrix on slingshot but a 2nd quad just wouldnt come. So i transferd to real wheel and did pattern breaker for one win and recoverd it in one spin :D
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 10:23 AM 2011
I was on my second progression doing the Matrix on slingshot but a 2nd quad just wouldnt come. So I transferd to real wheel and did pattern breaker for one win and recoverd it in one spin :D
Nice ;D
I have try Matrix on slingshot but it so slow. Last night track for 2 hours and now 4quad ???
Today it came right away ;D
I notice on the slingshot it repeat numbers very often.
Jon
I wanted to lend several alternative even-chance tactics to consider:
Henry Halves (European wheel neighbor friendly)
A. 1st 12, 25-30 (3 natural lines)
B. 2nd 12 31-36 (also 3 natural lines)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Henry Halves (American wheel neighbor friendly)
A. 1-6, 13-18, 31-36 (3 natural lines)
B. 7-12, 19-24, 25-30 (3 natural lines)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Checkerboard Halves (Red and Black friendly streets)
(A) RED Streets: 1,2,3: 7,8,9: 16,17,18: 19,20,21: 25,26,27: 34,35,36
(B) BLACK Strts: 4,5,6: 10,11,12: 13,14,15: 22,23,24: 28,29,30: 31,32,33
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 15, 10:39 AM 2011
Nice ;D
I notice on the slingshot it repeat numbers very often.
Jon
Yes and gets stuck on sectors. Fire method would suit slingshot.
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 10:54 AM 2011
Yes and gets stuck on sectors. Fire method would suit slingshot.
Yes. I think its good for the New bet from Flat but so short time to place all on slingshot.
Whats Fire Method ?
Cheers
5 Sessions played so far on BV NZ
1st -9 (R/B Lost)
2nd +6
3rd +3
4th -9 (R/B Lost)
5th -21 (H/L & O/E Lost)
Balance so far -30 ooops :(
Never give up ;D
Gordon
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 15, 10:56 AM 2011
what's Fire Method ?
Cheers
Oh its some sector play i see one on the internet long time ago. Can't remember the whole method, but its something like...
If you see a repeater or 2 numbers side by side within 3 spins play them numbers pus its nieghbours for 6 spins i think
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 11:09 AM 2011
Oh its some sector play I see one on the internet long time ago. Can't remember the whole method, but its something like...
If you see a repeater or 2 numbers side by side within 3 spins play them numbers pus its nieghbours for 6 spins I think
I see :)
Quote from: Gordonline on Apr 15, 10:10 AM 2011
Twister
I will give that progression a go as well, thanks,
Out of interest are all 3 E/C's winning equally, as most of my testing prior to playing for real were not so good on the Reb/Black bets ???
Gordon
Gordon like your motto at the bottom of this page. Well ive played 20 games live now and won them all. Im only playing hi lo at the mo, using 2,4,8. While Twister is playing all three E/C's and giving BV a good hiding.
Im trying to find out if I can get anywhere near that magnificent strike of 53/1 Ill be content with half of that. ;D ;D
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 15, 12:07 PM 2011
Gordon like your motto at the bottom of this page. Well I've played 20 games live now and won them all. I'm only playing hi lo at the mo, using 2,4,8. While Twister is playing all three E/C's and giving BV a good hiding.
I'm trying to find out if I can get anywhere near that magnificent strike of 53/1 Ill be content with half of that. ;D ;D
Nice to read ure doin well mate :thumbsup:
How long did those 20 games take to play all together ?
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 15, 12:07 PM 2011
Gordon like your motto at the bottom of this page. Well I've played 20 games live now and won them all. I'm only playing hi lo at the mo, using 2,4,8. While Twister is playing all three E/C's and giving BV a good hiding.
I'm trying to find out if I can get anywhere near that magnificent strike of 53/1 Ill be content with half of that. ;D ;D
Hi. Here is my short stats on the playing today.
10 seperate sessions playing MV5 between the waiting.
Only playing High/Low on PP Slingshot.
10 sessions won
0 sessions lost :D
Cheers
Jon
I'm back to just betting H/L now. Feel more comfortable with that on a zero wheel table :thumbsup:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 12:10 PM 2011
Nice to read your doin well mate :thumbsup:
How long did those 20 games take to play all together ?
About 3.5hrs Twister. I saw a streak of 126 wins in my records. And a short one of 6. Im looking for 25/1 or better overall. SEE, here is where the maths boys lose touch. After my 13th win I continued tracking spins and the FITFH pattern was reproduced on the EIGTH. The repeat happens alright.
Just not the very first game too often. THATS WHY WE DONT GO CONTINUOSLY. One day this will be understood until then we have to keep winning and spreading the word.
@Johnlegend
Playing in the real casino,when we seat at the table do you recommend to wait 9 spins or we can use the last 9 which can be found on the board?
Quote from: kenio on Apr 15, 01:02 PM 2011
@Johnlegend
Playing in the real casino,when we seat at the table do you recommend to wait 9 spins or we can use the last 9 which can be found on the board?
With this i dont use old spins since its only a couple spins to track. 9 to be exact :) and bet on 10 spin.
Jon
BetVoyager No Zero Alert
Hi guys and gals
I bring bad news
BV NZ ***MAY*** of sussed my game play
Yesterday it was SOOOO different. I was winning and it didnt know why or how
Out of the 3 EC its only lettin one win, and its impossible to know which one that will be !
Yesterday all 3 were winning easy, with the odd loss here and there but easy recovered by multiple wins
Maybe its just random claiming some wins back, who knows ?
But for today Im stopping play
I will test the water 2morrow, see what gives.
Until then keep stakes on BV to a minimum, or none at all.
Today I end on -50 Units
Until 2morrow !
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 15, 01:10 PM 2011
With this I don't use old spins since its only a couple spins to track. 9 to be exact :) and bet on 10 spin.
Jon
Jon just gave you my anwser. This is the fastest method ive ever been involved with. 9 spins is nothing for a method this powerful.
JL,
I not only don't mind if you delete my posts if they're not in keeping with the general tenor of the other posters on this topic, I actually prefer if you would.
I only want to voice a word of caution every now and then, not interrupt the topic.
We've all seen soooooooooo many topics that start out like gang busters only to end up in the discard section.
The great surprise to everyone on the forum, including those posting on this topic, will be if this doesn't eventually fail at right around the 2% house edge. Even Steven if playing no zero roulette.
LOL,
G
Quote from: GLC on Apr 15, 01:22 PM 2011
JL,
I not only don't mind if you delete my posts if they're not in keeping with the general tenor of the other posters on this topic, I actually prefer if you would.
I only want to voice a word of caution every now and then, not interrupt the topic.
We've all seen soooooooooo many topics that start out like gang busters only to end up in the discard section.
The great surprise to everyone on the forum, including those posting on this topic, will be if this doesn't eventually fail at right around the 2% house edge. Even Steven if playing no zero roulette.
LoL,
G
Mmm, GLC I realize your thinking is oldschool. but you do not grasp WHY THIS WORKS. If you have a ONE IN EIGHT chance of a pattern forming in the first place that's one thing. But its got to present that pattern to you in THREE SPINS. I don't think people who buy into the house edge ball with no memory chain of thought will ever get this.
I'm WELL AWARE OF what's SUPPOSED TO HAPPEN ON PAPER. But what happens when you have an on the spot challenge is another thing let me tell you.
THE MV5 has random defeated. And so to does Pattern *4*. Not because what its asking random to do can't be done. It just cannot be done ON THE SPOT too often.
Like I've said and will keep saying. Until you divorce your mind from traditional outdated thinking. And start understanding the very nature of random, is the very reason these precise methods work.
You will always be a sceptic who thinks this game can't be beaten longterm.
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 01:10 PM 2011
BetVoyager No Zero Alert
Hi guys and gals
I bring bad news
BV NZ ***MAY*** of sussed my game play
Yesterday it was SOOOO different. I was winning and it didn't know why or how
Out of the 3 EC its only lettin one win, and its impossible to know which one that will be !
Yesterday all 3 were winning easy, with the odd loss here and there but easy recovered by multiple wins
Maybe its just random claiming some wins back, who knows ?
But for today I'm stopping play
I will test the water 2morrow, see what gives.
Until then keep stakes on BV to a minimum, or none at all.
Today I end on -50 Units
Until 2morrow !
I really don't think BV can suss your gameplay.
The numbers in BV come in packets. It doesn't decide what number will come after you bet.
hi JL when you came across this method the number 4 was mentioned dont you think it would be better playing 4 wide instead of 3 surely this would make it even more difficult to beat just a thought keep up the good work
Quote from: The_Force on Apr 15, 02:37 PM 2011
I really don't think BV can suss your gameplay.
The numbers in BV come in packets. It doesn't decide what number will come after you bet.
Yes I know they do, hence the Checksum ;D
Ah well we will see what 2morrow brings
Im still over 450 Units up :xd:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 02:45 PM 2011
Yes I know they do, hence the Checksum ;D
Ah well we will see what 2morrow brings
I'm still over 450 Units up :xd:
Can I just ask, why don't you just stop the game if you're in profit? From my testing, sometimes you win on 2 of the ECs on the first step, but the last one goes all the way to the third step. Why don't you just finish the game if you're in profit?
Quote from: The_Force on Apr 15, 02:48 PM 2011
Can I just ask, why don't you just stop the game if you're in profit? From my testing, sometimes you win on 2 of the ECs on the first step, but the last one goes all the way to the third step. Why don't you just finish the game if you're in profit?
Yes that point was raised yesterday, I did reply you could do that.
The reason yesterday I wasnt was because I was having so many total wins 3/3
Very different today
See what 2morrow brings 8)
Hi Twister nice to see you winning some pennys ;D
Maybe alternate your days between pattern breaker for or against and 4
also Matrix :smile:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 03:03 PM 2011
Hi Twister nice to see you winning some pennys ;D
Maybe alternate your days between pattern breaker for or against and 4
also Matrix :smile:
That is a fine idea mate :xd: :lol:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 03:06 PM 2011
That is a fine idea mate :xd: :lol:
It was Just Random Twister.
As U say, 'claiming' back the balance of power once again!!
Happened to me on Wednesday.
I just played my 1st Live game LoL
1st bet WIN !
buuuuuuuuuut OMG its slow compared to turbo RNG LoL :lol:
I'm goin to alternate btwn Roulette and Baccarat
I'm playing at PaddyPower LIVE
I have 3 Roulette Wheels to choose from plus Bac
I think if I just go round in a circle that will take the 20 minutes to each one :xd: :xd: :LoL:
You could randomly pick what method you will use and on what wheel out of a hat ;D
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 04:06 PM 2011
You could randomly pick what method you will use and on what wheel out of a hat ;D
Amazingly I did think that :D :D :D
With my luck random would choose me to play Matrix 4 at Supercasino live dealer every day >:(
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 04:04 PM 2011
I just played my 1st Live game LoL
1st bet WIN !
buuuuuuuuuut OMG its slow compared to turbo RNG LoL :LoL:
I'm goin to alternate between Roulette and Baccarat
I'm playing at PaddyPower LIVE
I have 3 Roulette Wheels to choose from plus Bac
I think if I just go round in a circle that will take the 20 minutes to each one :xd: :xd: :LoL:
Sloooooooooooooow yes :yawn:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 04:11 PM 2011
With my luck random would choose me to play Matrix 4 at Supercasino live dealer every day >:(
Why whats up Zig ?
They spin between 2 and 3 mins. unless its turbo hour which is every 1 min
You got TV presenters chatting and reading out emails in between
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 04:18 PM 2011
They spin between 2 and 3 mins. unless its turbo hour which is every 1 min
You got TV presenters chatting and reading out emails in between
Urrgghhhhh i remember that channel
I used to stop playin when those live dealers came on and chat shite :lol:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 04:18 PM 2011
They spin between 2 and 3 mins. unless its turbo hour which is every 1 min
You got TV presenters chatting and reading out emails in between
LOL. Maiby you can be a celeberty on tv ;D
Sorry bad english :)
Jon
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 15, 04:54 PM 2011
LoL. Maiby you can be a celeberty on tv ;D
Sorry bad English :)
Jon
It was embarrassing because they call out the winners on national TV after every spin. :D
It was like BobTheBuilder wins ÂÃ,£4080
next we have ZigZag
he wins ÂÃ,£1 :-[
AGAIN! >:(
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 15, 05:01 PM 2011
It was embarrassing because they call out the winners on national TV after every spin. :D
It was like BobTheBuilder wins ÂÃ,£4080
next we have ZigZag
he wins ÂÃ,£1 :-[
AGAIN! >:(
LOOOOOOL :D :D :D :D :D :D
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 15, 01:46 PM 2011
Mmm, GLC I realize your thinking is oldschool. ......
You will always be a sceptic who thinks this game can't be beaten longterm.
I think you may be right about me being old school. I just can't get my head around why noting 3 results, then skipping 6 spins, then bet against the original 3 results repeating beats random.
If it does, we should be able to pick say 6 results like HLHHLH then wait 12 spins and bet that HLHHLH won't repeat. Or any other size patterns like 4, 5, 7, 10.
As a matter of fact, we should be able to play for your 3's pattern in 12 spins, then immediately go to a 4's pattern for 16 spins, then go for a 5's pattern for 20 spins etc... Probably get a 3's pattern inside the 5's pattern since it will have been at least 20 spins. Then we don't have to wait so long for betting opportunities.
I've been testing the 6's with a 6 step martingale and have never had to go beyond the 4th step (1-2-4-8) before a win. Heck, I'm up 120 flippin units. It's all I can do to keep from crossing the river of logic to your side. Since I'm not a 100% math guy or I wouldn't post any of the my posts.
Believe me. If you guys continue to win with these systems, I will be happy to help lighten the pockets of our local casinos.
Good Luck to all of us,
G
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 08:16 AM 2011
that's not correct mate.
Each new game has a different Checksum. So different numbers.
If that were not the case you would be right, and it wouldn't work. But it isnt so it does :LoL:
------------------------
I wonder if the same is true for other RNGs....... if not, not too sure it will work somewhere else (other RNGs).....
vundarosa
Here is an update from my play today........unfortunately I was called out to 2 fires during gameplay at 16.30 hours and only just got home :(
6th Session +8 Units
7th Session +5 Units
Balance now -17 Units which is better than the -30 after 5 sessions ;D
I'm also thinking that if I'm up at either stage I'll rinse and repeat or maybe just bet H/L as that seems to win mostly at 1st bet
Will see tomorrow
Time for something to eat and a shower :thumbsup:
Gordon
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 15, 10:12 AM 2011
I personally have not noticed any difference between the 3
But it is still early days :ooh:
-----------------
Twist, do you remember which EC you had your 4 losses?
vundarosa
I have completed what I consider to be a statistically sound spread sample (over 3000 spins) of results using Pattern4 criteria as definitively set out by JL. I also checked a few optional plays but still the traps were there.
Rules were carefully followed and all games suitably spaced or taken from different days data at Wiesbaden. There were so many losses within small groups of numbers that provided 'alarm bells' as to the ability of this method to provide consistent long winning streaks, although short winning streaks were common, but never enough to counter the loss of a bank.
Trying to dig out of such bad runs would have been fatal as there were triple loss situations no matter what strategy or EC you used.
The negative results were also largely H/L based so cannot be accounted for by mix of EC's.
How this equates with earlier reports I am not sure other than as cycles within cycles we can get unique trends and this method may produce some skewed results at times which we may be able to take advantage of, but with great care.
At this time I will continue to monitor the original Pattern Breaker/Filler ideas as well as ongoing monitoring of P4.
I have reflected also on WHY this P4 method should work and why the PB/F should work. I have some theories but prefer not to 'wish' in advance.
The results of the P4 test are not positive based on a 1,3,7 staking or 1,2,4 or flat staking. I wont publish a total till I completed a triple test (9000 spins).
P4 is a neat idea but I would exercise extreme caution and test over a wide variety of sources, always live data.
It is curious that in testing of roulette theory some early results in quite large samples can give misleading and over optimistic outcomes. It can be a cruel joke sometimes but we must always perservere and remain detached about results.
I hope others have better outcomes than mine and I remain very postive about the theory and application of Pattern Breaker/Filler.
Please accept my report as a caution, not as a red light. Cheers.
I want to be fair and responsible about this, and I felt a bit guilty about being maybe over cautious on the 3000 spin sample result which showed a small loss.
Even a 3000 spin sample or a 30,000 spin sample is not definitive proof and statistics can be used to prove anything as economists readily utilise when gazing into their dark glass.
My previous post suggested caution, an orange light, and to be fair the results were disappointing and showed a net loss and dangerous clustering of losses at times.
All data there was randomly selected from Wiesbaden live.
Now I have switched to sourcing material from my notes of live play at a B+M casino and samples are from individual day sessions.
Well so far I have tested about 1000 spins of these and I have 2000 further to go.
I have played 3 EC's over 25 sessions.
There was a one EC loss on sessions 10,12,13 and 22.
So you could call those games 30,36,39 and 66.
Obviously between these were streaks of wins.
At the 1000 spin mark result stands at + 69 units with 71 wins and 4 losses.
I have been at pains to edit out zero interference ( although if playing live I would heavily hedge for zero as a game within a game).
To be specific if as in session10, zero appeared at the start of a fourth set of three outcome sequence, then I have handled like so...
0
8
9 X L L X B R X E O
and leave this group out and then start afresh ( writing off the zero but as I have it hedged it is a bonus win).
And if zero appeared midway through a 4th sequence then I would abandon that sequence ( if there were no results from the first spin of the sequence) and write off the earlier outcome(s) then go to a fresh sequence after the three outcomes of the sequence were satisfied, ie
23 - 0 - 32 or 23 - 32 - 0
23
0
32
14 and start the new 4th sequence with 14.
Pedantic I know but need to be clear here as to rules in these grey areas. JL has stressed keep clear of zero.
So, encouraging, and lets hope the earlier was simply a blip. I suspect not nevertheless. Time will tell. What is shown though, and true to form, roulette can provide winning streaks which we can mop up as long as we dont get drawn into chasing a loss streak. Clearly this method is good at providing streaks of wins and it may be that a parlay approach can be a useful way to more conservatively harvest the wins should we find clustering of losses in our extended sample testing. Cheers.
Ongoing testing shows more volatility, much as I anticipated.
Further 800 spins and now at +71 units having peaked at +96 and re-traced to +56 before bouncing up again. Way too long a sequence of spins to effectively stand still.
To be fair this result 129-10, in this test session, has never been negative so for the overview we could need to go a lot further but it will never be far enough. Nevertheless this is fair but short of the claimed status.
I think we can gauge the nature of this performance - it is volatile and maybe with some tweaking the volatility could be 'dampened'. More on this later.
I going back to study the PB/F which may have more reasons to be more consistent.
Hi XXVV
Really interesting to read your extensive testing. Very much appreciate it :thumbsup:
Did you come across any 2 losses in a row on one of the same EC's?
Really looking forward to your test results on PB/F :smile:
Thanks for your testing over at weisbaden.
Did you run the system with the 20 spin gap before you play another round,as I can't see how this makes any difference to your chances of winning or loosing in the long term.
Live Play update !
Im now just playing LIVE :thumbsup:
Just Played 9 Sessions with 4 different Casinos but 9 different Wheels
Im playing a 5-10-25 Unit Spread (my personal choice)
Sessions Played 9
Sessions Won 9
Profit +10 Units
Bets Won of First Step 5
Bets Won on Second Step 3
Bets Won on Third Step 1
Duration around 25 Minutes
Rinse and Repeat :xd: :lol:
Twister you are right
Betvoyager is not the same as yesterday, it's harder to win.
I actually had 2 loses in a row with H/L :-\ :-\ :-\ :-\
But i managed to pull up
Im using 1 2 4 and recovery with 8 16 32 so i pulled out 8)
I will put my stats tomorow when i play some more and we can then compare 1 2 4 to your 1 3 7 if anybody is interested
Il have a break from BV now, maybe start again later or tomorow
Quote from: soggett on Apr 16, 09:11 AM 2011
Twister you are right
Betvoyager is not the same as yesterday, it's harder to win.
I actually had 2 loses in a row with H/L :-\ :-\ :-\ :-\
But I managed to pull up
I'm using 1 2 4 and recovery with 8 16 32 so I pulled out 8)
I will put my stats tomorow when I play some more and we can then compare 1 2 4 to your 1 3 7 if anybody is interested
Il have a break from BV now, maybe start again later or tomorow
At the end of the day an RNG IN REAL PLAY CANNOT BE TRUSTED. Okay my results for first 50 games played live for PATTERN 4.
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 50
TOTAL GAMES WON 48
TOTAL GAMES LOST 2
BALANCE =78 UNITS PLUS
STRIKERATE 24/1
I would be happy with anything near this strikerate longterm. The first winning streak was quite impressive. 34 games in a row. The second 13 games in a row. So the losses one containing a ZERO incidentally, came on the 35th and 49th games. What I do after a loss is use this progression 7,14,28 to immediately pull back half of my loss then continue at level 1 stakes 2,4,8. I can see potential here for some serious money management gold mines. After each game I close down and played another game 15-30 mins later. I have to apply PATTERN 4 exactly as I did PATTERN BREAKER. A strikerate like this for a 10-12 spin game is a gift. Lets make no mistake about that.
Next report at 100 games played.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 16, 10:20 AM 2011
At the end of the day an RNG IN REAL PLAY CANNOT BE TRUSTED. Okay my results for first 50 games played live for PATTERN 4.
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 50
TOTAL GAMES WON 48
TOTAL GAMES LOST 2
BALANCE =78 UNITS PLUS
STRIKERATE 24/1
I would be happy with anything near this strikerate longterm. The first winning streak was quite impressive. 34 games in a row. The second 13 games in a row. So the losses one containing a ZERO incidentally, came on the 35th and 49th games. What I do after a loss is use this progression 7,14,28 to immediately pull back half of my loss then continue at level 1 stakes 2,4,8. I can see potential here for some serious money management gold mines. After each game I close down and played another game 15-30 mins later. I have to apply PATTERN 4 exactly as I did PATTERN BREAKER. A strikerate like this for a 10-12 spin game is a gift. Lets make no mistake about that.
Next report at 100 games played.
I agree
My results are nowhere near yours
I don't know, think i'll go back to live dealers, I have to think it over
Your results are :o :o :o :o
can't wait to see 100
Do you bet on all 3 EC?
Or just H/L?
Quote from: soggett on Apr 16, 01:28 PM 2011
I agree
My results are nowhere near yours
I don't know, think i'll go back to live dealers, I have to think it over
Your results are :o :o :o :o
can't wait to see 100
Do you bet on all 3 EC?
Or just H/L?
Only H and L Soggett. I dont have the same faith in the other two Even shots.
I will tell you something else, betting against H and L becoming FIVE POINTERS in a FOUR WIDE MATRIX is looking like an ACCESSABLE HOLY GRAIL. To be used anywhere. EVEN B & M
casinos. The turnover is THERE. Will keep you posted.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 16, 01:41 PM 2011
Only H and L Soggett. I don't have the same faith in the other two Even shots.
I will tell you something else, betting against H and L becoming FIVE POINTERS in a FOUR WIDE MATRIX is looking like an ACCESSABLE HOLY GRAIL. To be used anywhere. EVEN B & M
casinos. The turnover is THERE. Will keep you posted.
Hi JohnL,
Sounds good. Maybe it could be played flatbetting a level stake?
A.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 16, 01:41 PM 2011
Only H and L Soggett. I don't have the same faith in the other two Even shots.
I will tell you something else, betting against H and L becoming FIVE POINTERS in a FOUR WIDE MATRIX is looking like an ACCESSABLE HOLY GRAIL. To be used anywhere. EVEN B & M
casinos. The turnover is THERE. Will keep you posted.
MV5 is the master system.
Love to hear your result on H/L :)
Jon
Quote from: atlantis on Apr 16, 01:49 PM 2011
Hi JohnL,
Sounds good. Maybe it could be played flatbetting a level stake?
A.
Hi Atlantis, well heres whats on my mind. BETTING AGAINST H AN L TRIPS BECOMING FIVE POINTERS.
Simply put its INVINCIBLE, and the turnover is vastly improved no 100 spins anymore with no action. Ive been playing this the same time as PATTERN BREAKER 4 And betting against trips becoming FIVE POINTERS is out performing P4
There is no need hit and run either. YES MATHS
DEVOTEES. You can play till you fall asleep. BETTING HI LO TRIPS to not become FIVE POINTERS has random TAMED. GAME OVER....
Here is a test session with rng:
Playing against QUADS not to become 5-POINTERS @ flatbetting
H H L H
H L H L
L H H L
L H L L
H L L L
L L H H-----+1 (col4) +1
L H L H
L H H L
L L L L
L L L L---- -1 (col1) +0
L L L H
H H H H
H H L H
L H H H
L H L L---- +1 (col4) +1
H L H H---- +1 (col2) +2
H H L H
H H L L
H L L H
H H H H---- -1 (col1) +1
L H L H
L L L L
L L H L
L H L H
L L L L ----- -1 (col1) +0
3won
3lost
100 spins = +0
A.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 16, 01:58 PM 2011
Hi Atlantis, well heres what's on my mind. BETTING AGAINST H AN L TRIPS BECOMING FIVE POINTERS.
Simply put its INVINCIBLE, and the turnover is vastly improved no 100 spins anymore with no action. I've been playing this the same time as PATTERN BREAKER 4 And betting against trips becoming FIVE POINTERS is out performing P4
There is no need hit and run either. YES MATHS
DEVOTEES. You can play till you fall asleep. BETTING HI LO TRIPS to not become FIVE POINTERS has random TAMED. GAME OVER....
HA HA HA :D
We must be related lol
I have a note pad full of H/L bettin trips not to become Quads or 5 pointers. Started today while playing PB4 P4 MV5 XYZ :xd: :xd: :lol:
I am a newbie so i sould proberly not say this but i will anyway.
RNG is not roulette. Its a program just like slots.
No offense to those ho play RNG just my oppinion :)
Cheers
Jon
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 16, 02:10 PM 2011
HA HA HA :D
We must be related LoL
I have a note pad full of H/L bettin trips not to become Quads or 5 pointers. Started today while playing PB4 P4 MV5 XYZ :xd: :xd: :LoL:
Twister.
Whats XYZ ?
Cheers
Jon
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 16, 02:13 PM 2011
I am a newbie so I sould proberly not say this but I will anyway.
RNG is not roulette. Its a program just like slots.
No offense to those ho play RNG just my oppinion :)
Cheers
Jon
Yeah Im back to LIVE play
I have 9 wheels Im movin btwn lol
By the time ive done all 9 its ready to start over :xd:
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 16, 02:15 PM 2011
Twister.
what's XYZ ?
Cheers
Jon
A joke mate ;D
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 16, 02:10 PM 2011
HA HA HA :D
We must be related LoL
I have a note pad full of H/L bettin trips not to become Quads or 5 pointers. Started today while playing PB4 P4 MV5 XYZ :xd: :xd: :LoL:
Yes Twister itd great isnt it, it can be used in a real land casino too. So our American friends are no longer left out in the cold. ;D
Quote from: atlantis link=topic=4697. msg47862#msg47862 date=1302977183
Here is a test session with rng:
Playing against QUADS not to become 5-POINTERS @ flatbetting
H H L H
H L H L
L H H L
L H L L
H L L L
L L H H-----+1 (col4) +1
L H L H
L H H L
L L L L
L L L L---- -1 (col1) +0
L L L H
H H H H
H H L H
L H H H
L H L L---- +1 (col4) +1
H L H H---- +1 (col2) +2
H H L H
H H L L
H L L H
H H H H---- -1 (col1) +1
L H L H
L L L L
L L H L
L H L H
L L L L ----- -1 (col1) +0
3won
3lost
100 spins = +0
A.
Why not to use Pattern 4 as a 4 vertical matrix?
Hi Kenio,
That's also quite an interesting idea. Bet that the 4th line will not be a repeat of the 1st line
H H L H
H L H L
L H H L
L H L L ---won@1st bet (col1)
A.
Quote from: atlantis link=topic=4697. msg47891#msg47891 date=1302989049
Hi Kenio,
That's also quite an interesting idea. Bet that the 4th line will not be a repeat of the 1st line
H H L H
H L H L
L H H L
L H L L ---won@1st bet (col1)
A.
You can use progression 1-3-7-15 risking 26 units.
H H L H
H L H L
L H H L
L H L L ---won@1st bet (col1)
I like that idea too Kenio. PatternMatrix :thumbsup:
You can use it as the paterrn 4 will be different than pattern 1 or it will be the same.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 16, 01:58 PM 2011
Hi Atlantis, well heres what's on my mind. BETTING AGAINST H AN L TRIPS BECOMING FIVE POINTERS.
Hi John. Now I know you like the H/L as I do and from my short test its been working sweet. I also suggest you have a look at Kattilas matrix 9 for the ECs also, but maybe against quads :thumbsup:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 16, 06:38 PM 2011
Hi John. Now I know you like the H/L as I do and from my short test its been working sweet. I also suggest you have a look at Kattilas matrix 9 for the ECs also, but maybe against quads :thumbsup:
Hi ZigZag.
I didnt find matrix from kattilla ???
Cheers
Jon
Hi Jon
I only just found it myself today. Its in the notepad section.
I havent started testing yet, but looks really interesting. :smile:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 16, 07:20 PM 2011
Hi Jon
I only just found it myself today. Its in the notepad section.
I haven't started testing yet, but looks really interesting. :smile:
Thanks. I will check it out :)
Cheers
Jon
Just to be thorough I tested 102 additional games which involved the 3 x EC's on the Pattern4 method.
After this work on P4 I will not be going any further with it or variations of it because it really has no satisfactory reason to consistently win.
It does win from time to time, with some streaks but my research has thrown up so many potential traps that I would advise no further work on what had appeared to be a very attractive idea. However that is why we test so we dont throw away resources playing live. The idea of continuing with progressions is courting disaster because I have seen double and triple losses in the high volume of live data Ive been through, whether on same EC or across several EC sequences.
Data was from live Dublin Bet sequences always spaced a day apart.
Using the 1,3,7 series the end result was -51 units and 18 total losses were experienced.
Again I emphasise roulette is notorious for cycles within cycles and thus I cannot state long streaks dont happen but in the data I have sampled they just were not there.
Out of curiosity I tested also on a total of 200 games, flat staking and at one stage after 1000 spins (!) was +20 units but this later re-traced and ended overall -5 units in some 2500 spins. This is not a big loss but neither did it produce worthwhile consistent wins, because earlier gains were cancelled out.
I personally have found the method too volatile and inconsistent.
Nevertheless a shrewd player could pick up a few points here and there and then get out ( say +3 to +5) , but I think there are better and safer ways to do this.
For example the Pattern Breaker family is different because there is a significant reason why it would tend to work ( note tendency not certainty).
So will continue on that earlier PB thread and suggest some extra ways to tap the profit potential energy there. Of course it takes longer to monitor but 3 EC's can be phased at say 20 spin intervals and you can rotate earnings and derive extra from the ongoing tendency for the missing eighth pattern to fully manifest, step by step.
Care should be taken to fully test this one as well because volume of results takes so much longer to materialise on PB but we can be guided here by JL having used this for three years prior to publishing, and for which I am very grateful for his data and his sharing of a proven method.
Many can doodle with hourly little variations/ bright ideas but the hard graft is to prove it works before making claims that can mislead.
Hope to add a worthwhile extra method to PB which can consistently triple the result from the usual win returns. This requires only a further dozen spins, but I have to test it much more first. Will discuss it next week on PB.
Hi XXVV,
Thanks for your findings - much appreciated.
A.
Quote from: XXVV on Apr 17, 12:15 AM 2011
Just to be thorough I tested 102 additional games which involved the 3 x EC's on the Pattern4 method.
After this work on P4 I will not be going any further with it or variations of it because it really has no satisfactory reason to consistently win.
It does win from time to time, with some streaks but my research has thrown up so many potential traps that I would advise no further work on what had appeared to be a very attractive idea. However that is why we test so we don't throw away resources playing live. The idea of continuing with progressions is courting disaster because I have seen double and triple losses in the high volume of live data I've been through, whether on same EC or across several EC sequences.
Data was from live Dublin Bet sequences always spaced a day apart.
Using the 1,3,7 series the end result was -51 units and 18 total losses were experienced.
Again I emphasise roulette is notorious for cycles within cycles and thus I cannot state long streaks don't happen but in the data I have sampled they just were not there.
Out of curiosity I tested also on a total of 200 games, flat staking and at one stage after 1000 spins (!) was +20 units but this later re-traced and ended overall -5 units in some 2500 spins. This is not a big loss but neither did it produce worthwhile consistent wins, because earlier gains were cancelled out.
I personally have found the method too volatile and inconsistent.
Nevertheless a shrewd player could pick up a few points here and there and then get out ( say +3 to +5) , but I think there are better and safer ways to do this.
For example the Pattern Breaker family is different because there is a significant reason why it would tend to work ( note tendency not certainty).
So will continue on that earlier PB thread and suggest some extra ways to tap the profit potential energy there. Of course it takes longer to monitor but 3 EC's can be phased at say 20 spin intervals and you can rotate earnings and derive extra from the ongoing tendency for the missing eighth pattern to fully manifest, step by step.
Care should be taken to fully test this one as well because volume of results takes so much longer to materialise on PB but we can be guided here by JL having used this for three years prior to publishing, and for which I am very grateful for his data and his sharing of a proven method.
Many can doodle with hourly little variations/ bright ideas but the hard graft is to prove it works before making claims that can mislead.
Hope to add a worthwhile extra method to PB which can consistently triple the result from the usual win returns. This requires only a further dozen spins, but I have to test it much more first. Will discuss it next week on PB.
XXVV im not sure how you test data. But your results dont mirror my findings. Its strange everytime a method is tested at dublin net or that German site. The results are not good.
I collected my results from bookie based casinos and some from real land casinos. So you arrive at the conclusion P4 has no value. YET, having played 60 games over the last two days, I have a record of 58/2.
And a winning streak in there of 34 straight wins. :wink:
You guys gave me an idea...
Ok, first my stats so far with PB4 on BV NZ, all 3 EC
TOTAL GAMES: 36
H/L B/R O/E
WIN 32 29 31
LOST 3 7 5
LOST 2 IN ROW 1 0 0
WIN ON 1 STEP 19 18 23
WIN ON 2 STEP 10 6 5
WIN ON 3 STEP 3 5 3
TOTAL: + 71 units
108 bets - 92 wins - 16 loses - thats about 7/1
I used 1 2 4 and recover 8 16 32
When I lost 2 in a row (16th game) i started after each loss to bet 4 times 8 16 32 to recover the 2 losses in a row and it worked like a charm
Now, i tryed going over the numbers with PB4 with 4 numbers/bets ( example: HHHH/RRRR/OOOO - don't know how to say it,sorry for bad english) and bet on 13,14,15,16 spin. So the first 4 spins not to be equal to fourth 4 spins.
The result:
Only 1 lose in that 36 games and 6 possible losses - on that six times I have recorded only last tree numbers unfortunatelly :-[
But even so, if they all lost that woul be only 7 losses. Isn't that a great win/loss ratio?
36 games - 108 bets - 7 losses - thats about 15/1
what do you guys think?
And that was on BV NZ RNG, imagine that on a live wheel where the results are even more briliant... :o :o :o :o
What do you think?
Could you check it with your numbers guys and see the stats?
Sorry, just saw that atlantis explained it better
The Pattern Matrix
How are your results Atlantis
Quote from: soggett on Apr 17, 09:15 AM 2011
Sorry, just saw that atlantis explained it better
The Pattern Matrix
How are your results Atlantis
------------------
@John, this seems to be really incredible....best of both worlds.
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Apr 17, 09:40 AM 2011
------------------
@John, this seems to be really incredible....best of both worlds.
vundarosa
Yes, I have to agree with you
This should have an even better strike rate
(Just tried it on Baccarat also, works like a charm >:D )
Quote from: vundarosa on Apr 17, 09:40 AM 2011
------------------
@John, this seems to be really incredible....best of both worlds.
vundarosa
INCREDIBLE is an understatement Vundarosa. It is the ACCESSABLE HOLY GRAIL. I cannot see anything bettering this alround. Even XXVV cannot come back negative on this. I have had the easiest time of my 12 years playing real money on this game. I never once felt under threat. Especially since I know how the LAW OF AVERAGES WORKS. I scrutinize every 5x4 block of 20 spins. When you have a 20 spin block that only produced say 6 or 7 matches out of a possible 20. Look what will happen in the next 20. TRIPS, QUADS and beyond staring at you. You can read this like a book because the turnover is there so you don't become jaded and unfocused. You are seeing RANDOM tamed, brought to book in that 4 wide matrix by its keeper the LAW OF AVERAGES. Making profit just became MAINSTREAM reality FOR ALL.
;D
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 17, 09:49 AM 2011
INCREDIBLE is an understatement Vundarosa. It is the ACCESSABLE HOLY GRAIL. I cannot see anything bettering this alround. Even XXVV cannot come back negative on this. I have had the easiest time of my 12 years playing real money on this game. I never once felt under threat. Especially since I know how the LAW OF AVERAGES WORKS. I scrutinize every 5x4 block of 20 spins. When you have a 20 spin block that only produced say 6 or 7 matches out of a possible 20. Look what will happen in the next 20. TRIPS, QUADS and beyond staring at you. You can read this like a book because the turnover is there so you don't become jaded and unfocused. You are seeing RANDOM tamed, brought to book in that 4 wide matrix by its keeper the LAW OF AVERAGES. Making profit just became MAINSTREAM reality FOR ALL.
;D
-------------
"I have had the easiest time of my 12 years playing real money on this game. I never once felt under threat. "
This is exactly how i felt, never under threat, so predictable. This has to be THE ONE!
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Apr 17, 10:04 AM 2011
-------------
"I have had the easiest time of my 12 years playing real money on this game. I never once felt under threat. "
This is exactly how I felt, never under threat, so predictable. This has to be THE ONE!
vundarosa
It is. even though I can hear XXVV, OPHIS AND SUPERMAN oiling up their BOTS, THIS IS THE ONE...
Quote from: atlantis on Apr 16, 05:24 PM 2011
Hi Kenio,
That's also quite an interesting idea. Bet that the 4th line will not be a repeat of the 1st line
H H L H
H L H L
L H H L
L H L L ---won@1st bet (col1)
A.
This seems to be the ultimate grail.You can play continuously as well.
Can you tell me if this has been seen before I'm playing betfair rng
HHHL
LHHL
LHHL
LHHL
LHHL
L
I can't BELIEVE THIS HAS HAPPENED
TOTAL GAMES: 36
H/L B/R O/E
WIN 32 29 31
LOST 3 7 5
LOST 2 IN ROW 1 0 0
WIN ON 1 STEP 19 18 23
WIN ON 2 STEP 10 6 5
WIN ON 3 STEP 3 5 3
TOTAL: + 71 units
108 bets - 92 wins - 16 loses - that's about 7/1
Hi All
I played last night on BV NZ that Pattern 1 would not be the same as Pattern 4 and recorded 56 spins straight, continuous betting from spin 13 onwards and my results were as follows,
I was betting on all 3 E/C's with a 1,2,4,8, but if I had a loss didn't use progression
It ended with a balance of +1 (Highest +9 Lowest -5) however if you take a look at the table below and Soggetts results above if I flat betted only on the 1st bet it would of ended with a better result +3 (obviously the risk is also lower) Soggetts result only betting on the 1st bet would of ended in +28
Just thought I would mention this as more often than not we win on 1st leg and if flat betting can still produce good results its worth trying.
Strange as it may seem if I had run seperate banks on all legs flat betting only it would of produced a net result of +9 units :o
1st 2nd 3rd 4th 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 1st 2nd 3rd 4th
Number of Bets 11 5 1 0 11 4 2 11 11 7 3 1
Wins 6 4 1 0 8 2 1 0 4 5 2 0
Losses 5 1 0 0 3 2 1 1 7 2 1 1
Unit Balance 1 3 1 0 5 0 0 -1 -3 3 1 -1
Hope the above makes sense and feel free to comment ;D
Gordon :thumbsup:
Quote from: joiner29 on Apr 17, 04:50 PM 2011
Can you tell me if this has been seen before I'm playing betfair rng
HHHL
LHHL
LHHL
LHHL
LHHL
L
I can't BELIEVE THIS HAS HAPPENED
RNG is not Roulette. Real wheel real result ;D
Cheers
Jon
Looking forward to testing matrix and also re testing earlier P4 results on a different and extended progression which will account for the difference in results between myself and JL wrt final result and length of streaks.
Oiling up (lol)!!!
XXVV
Quote from: Gordonline on Apr 17, 04:54 PM 2011
TOTAL GAMES: 36
H/L B/R O/E
WIN 32 29 31
LOST 3 7 5
LOST 2 IN ROW 1 0 0
WIN ON 1 STEP 19 18 23
WIN ON 2 STEP 10 6 5
WIN ON 3 STEP 3 5 3
TOTAL: + 71 units
108 bets - 92 wins - 16 loses - that's about 7/1
Hi All
I played last night on BV NZ that Pattern 1 would not be the same as Pattern 4 and recorded 56 spins straight, continuous betting from spin 13 onwards and my results were as follows,
I was betting on all 3 E/C's with a 1,2,4,8, but if I had a loss didn't use progression
It ended with a balance of +1 (Highest +9 Lowest -5) however if you take a look at the table below and Soggetts results above if I flat betted only on the 1st bet it would of ended with a better result +3 (obviously the risk is also lower) Soggetts result only betting on the 1st bet would of ended in +28
Just thought I would mention this as more often than not we win on 1st leg and if flat betting can still produce good results its worth trying.
Strange as it may seem if I had run separate banks on all legs flat betting only it would of produced a net result of +9 units :o
1st 2nd 3rd 4th 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 1st 2nd 3rd 4th
Number of Bets 11 5 1 0 11 4 2 11 11 7 3 1
Wins 6 4 1 0 8 2 1 0 4 5 2 0
Losses 5 1 0 0 3 2 1 1 7 2 1 1
Unit Balance 1 3 1 0 5 0 0 -1 -3 3 1 -1
Hope the above makes sense and feel free to comment ;D
Gordon :thumbsup:
I see what you mean, nice :thumbsup:
Didn't thought of flat betting
And I would have been +12, you have to include the losts of sessions, not just wins on step 2 and 3 ;)
But you're doing it wrong, we don't bet continuously, one PB4 and then exit. Rinse and Repeat. That way you reset the RNG pattern (or something like that, BV says so)
I'm now testing PB 4 on a 4 wide instead of 3 wide, and it seems its even better :)
What do you think about that?
Guys. . . . . ive been dabbling in this system. . . . have only played 46 games and had 5 losses. Seems to have a ratio of 9 wins to 1 loss for me, which is kinda similar to a few other guys results.
Ive been playing a mixture of RNG, Live and B&M casinos so I consider the results pretty real. . . . as opposed to JUST RNG. But it is a very small sample.
What I dont get is that when playing 3 wide there are only 8 different patterns that can come out. So isnt it just a 1 in 8 chance of losing?? Im unsure of how the 4th line affects the odds tho. Dosn't really sound that great for a grail. . . . 1 in 8 chance of losing. . .
And if we change it to a 4 wide matrix there are still only 15 patterns and a 4th progression added. . . 1 in 15 chance of losing is better but STILL dosnt sound that flash to me either. . .
Am I missing something here? Cause I kinda hope so. . . .
Thanks guys. . . . . but great systems Johnlegend!
Quote from: Smee on Apr 18, 03:34 AM 2011
Guys. . . . . I've been dabbling in this system. . . . have only played 46 games and had 5 losses. Seems to have a ratio of 9 wins to 1 loss for me, which is kinda similar to a few other guys results.
I've been playing a mixture of RNG, Live and B&M casinos so I consider the results pretty real. . . . as opposed to JUST RNG. But it is a very small sample.
What I don't get is that when playing 3 wide there are only 8 different patterns that can come out. So isnt it just a 1 in 8 chance of losing?? I'm unsure of how the 4th line affects the odds tho. Dosn't really sound that great for a grail. . . . 1 in 8 chance of losing. . .
And if we change it to a 4 wide matrix there are still only 15 patterns and a 4th progression added. . . 1 in 15 chance of losing is better but STILL dosnt sound that flash to me either. . .
Am I missing something here? Cause I kinda hope so. . . .
Thanks guys. . . . . but great systems Johnlegend!
Smee thankyou, here's how I see it on paper its true you should lose once every 8 games. But my sample of results simply didn't read like that. It is down to when you enter the cycle no question. Just as XXVV has observed a window of oppurtunity, to exploit the last pattern. On paper those EIGHT PATTERNS should form one after the other. The reality is I have games taking anything from 30 spins to 130 spins to come to a conclusion. So we can take advantage of these inconsistencies..
Hello JohnLegend,
Once again thank you for all your work.
I have not been able to keep up with the developments and wanted to see if you could possible recap the strategy to date... how to play, like you did for your first entry explaining the Pattern 4.
This would be great as I am going to let it be tested over 50,000/100,000 spins, I will post the results as soon as possible.
I love the speed of this particular system. While you are waiting for MV5, MV5 Hi/Lo, Pattern4 may have made enough to balance a 1st progression loss (when/if it happens).
There are only 24 hours in the day, at least on this planet.
So I am prioritising for entirely selfish reasons and am conducting a very definitive test of the P/F ( variant of Pattern Breaker) with two or three levels of play annexed. Results will be on Pattern Breaker thread or also on the workshop thread on the Gambling Framework , ie "Experimental Ideas in Professional Play'.
Early results have been remarkably consistent and the effective current run of wins on the level one EC is +30 sessions.
Reason for this relatively consistent winning is the choice of playing the eighth pattern which means that you will have balancing/ restorative elastic forces working with you mainly and not against you. There are still some surprises of course but generally we can say by selection of this particular target bet we have the tide in our favour-for a short time.
Second reason for success is thus timing.
We await the trigger signal (appearance of pattern #7 and can then deduce pattern #8), play for a short time , usually appearing after 40 spins, sometimes much later, but we play only for a window of opportunity that will frequently permit about +5 units o/a three EC profit on level one, or about +20 units o/a on level two playing the three EC bets on a 1.3.7 progression ( risking 11 units), with a guide that we play about 4 cycles of bets on every EC, ie say 12 bets at this level usually. Sometimes its longer if we encounter a triple loss and we want to recover that loss. We can play on till say we recover part or all the loss or overall we are close to a +20 unit profit o/a which seems to be reasonable norm ( tipping point).
Please note those who question or test and just grind on without pause, not breaking spin outcomes into session groupings are wasting their time. They then wonder why the o/a result is a loss.
It is in the true nature of roulette to be cyclic and sub cyclic, ie cycles within cycles and the only way we can win against the house edge is to select very short passages of play where a trend, bias or skew materialises, like the eddy in a stream current, and take a modest profit, and leave.
There are many examples of short trend and bias behaviour, and that has nothing to do with the questioned mechanics of a wheel ( wheel bias) which in our culture is now unlikely. Our search is for examples of streaks where the extent of the streak ( in a short cycle) runs counter to the limits expected within probablity theory ( in a big cycle).
On the small scale this can be outrageous ( for example 15 or more reds in a row) but this pattern happens relatively frequently on live tables and its frequency has been measured and milked, or an individual number can repeat five times even with a dealer change midway ( I have seen this), or an imbalance of zero appearances where six can occur in ten spins. These trends take place in small sequences. At the time they are startling yet in the scheme of things, say a day's results, or a week's results, they are nothing that much out of the ordinary.
On another (small) scale there are random forces at work that would cause incredible repeats and chaotic behaviour and there can be forces at work in another direction that grow stronger with time that would seek to bring into more order the average appearance of a set of numbers so the proportion that repeat within 37 spins is consistent within a small range, being the 'phenomenon of the third'.
On a bigger scale, say 50-100 spins, there are forces that seek to balance out and re-distribute like an elastic force the small triad patterns of the eight possible outcomes within every EC, ie 24 in all.
After the seventh triad, as JL brilliantly discovered, the eighth triad pattern can be deduced and must still materialise before the cycle wraps and re-starts.
This restorative force can be harnessed by us and can help us take short term profit, before it might appear to degenerate and work against us. It is just that a new cycle is underway, thus a new session is needed.
However there can be an overlap, a grey area where the three EC's produce this completion at different times, thus the only way to continue in phase with this restorative energy is to stop and re-calibrate.
This is what the system testers might miss, and certainly edited long lists of spin outcomes totally miss.
A session exists while we watch. As soon as we leave, the session for us finishes, even though the wheel keeps spinning outcomes. Our reality is different from the infinite space of potential sessions ( for others).
It works on other levels too in a live casino where the energies of the dealer and the onlookers/ players have a unique edge, but this can change as key parties leave or arrive. However if we are there throughout it is our session, and ours only, and for the others they all have unique experiences.
So I wont be testing the P4 matrix variations, just yet anyway.
I have played this for real money and won quite a lot , the amazing thing is how many times I win on the first bet. This method works like magic , a fantastic system for sure. :)
The only thing that can kill this is of course the green 0.
Quote from: Kingspin on Apr 24, 04:08 PM 2011
I have played this for real money and won quite a lot , the amazing thing is how many times I win on the first bet. This method works like magic , a fantastic system for sure. :)
The only thing that can kill this is of course the green 0.
Hi King ;D
How do you play it? Bet against the first pattern to be the 4 pattern ?
Cheers
Jon
Yes betting against the first pattern becoming the fourth , this is one fantastic system.
Quote from: Kingspin on Apr 24, 05:02 PM 2011
Yes betting against the first pattern becoming the fourth , this is one fantastic system.
I havent play it so much only tested. Will test more:)
Cheers
Jon
Hi all,
Been gone awhile, WOW has there been an improvement it the systems. Been playing John's TEMPLET 7 and Scoopy's DOUBLE-STREET LIGHT all week with good results.
While reading this thread I started to get confused and there are a couple things I would like to ask.
Do we track 3 or 4 per line? or is 4 just a deveation from the original system?
When appling it to Bacarat it would be BBP?
Has anyone tried it on other even money bets like Sic Bo, H/L or Craps, Pass line?
Thanks
Phishalot
TRACKER:
link:://rouletteforum.cc/coding-for-roulette/(release)-patterns-tracker/ (link:://rouletteforum.cc/coding-for-roulette/(release)-patterns-tracker/)
The tracker is superb , 1 won ÂÃ,£500 just by betting the single numbers in place of the even chances , e.g. if the software says H E are I concentrated the single number bets on the are of the table the software indicated ie the higher red numbers , worked like magic. This was on pb4 which is a very good system. The units were ÂÃ,£1chips. 500 units! :)
The guy who made the software deserves credit for this it's truly the dogs dangly bits.
you are delusional if you think there is anything unusual about any particular pattern repeating at any particular time.
Quote from: Red Nickels on May 01, 08:30 AM 2011
You are delusional if you think there is anything unusual about any particular pattern repeating at any particular time.
SO how do you win?
I've been trying to figure that out for a long time. I can't give you a definitive answer to that question unfortunately, but I know it's not by betting that a particular very brief even chance sequence will not repeat a few sequences later, as there would certainly be nothing unusual about that.
Quote from: graham44 on May 03, 10:16 AM 2011
HI! Can you explain the system to us?
go to page 1
do you reset when you win and re track again or just carry on,can someone please clarify this for me
Quote from: sarif on May 05, 08:55 PM 2011
do you reset when you win and re track again or just carry on,can someone please clarify this for me
Yes Sarif, this is the best way to play PATTERN 4.
Hello all,
JohnLegend, just as a quick brainstorm.
Would it be more advantages to play a 3 or 4 pattern combination of all even chances together.
3 pattern example; first look for High/Low then Red/Black then Odd/Even
so you would have for example
HRO
LRO
LBE
. . . here we are looking for the 4th pattern not to be the same as the first
In essence the chances I believe are still the same as the original pattern 4 system. However it feels like we are throwing more "elements" into the mix.....
Any thoughts.....
random. independent. random. independent. random. independent.
you will have no different results if you look for any sequence to be the same or not to be the same at any point. there is nothing magical about 4 sequences later or 1 sequence later or 10 or 100 sequences later or previous.
How come i am winning week in week out with this superb system then red nickers. :)
Try playing it on a wheel and see you much you win before posting negative stuff... >:(
Quote from: Kingspin on May 09, 01:18 PM 2011
How come I am winning week in week out with this superb system then red nickers. :)
Try playing it on a wheel and see you much you win before posting negative stuff... >:(
Its true!
In my tests it wins to.
But its not any reason to it why it wins its just random.
But if win its all good :D and all sould be glad.
Cheers
Jon
Play pattern 4 on dozens
Instead of 8 different patterns there are 27 different patterns
Playing two dozens each time in 3 step progression.
Loss would be -26 for progression of 1-1, 3-3, 9-9,
Any thoughts out there, JohnLegend??
Quote from: amk on May 09, 01:48 PM 2011
Play pattern 4 on dozens
Instead of 8 different patterns there are 27 different patterns
Playing two dozens each time in 3 step progression.
Loss would be -26 for progression of 1-1, 3-3, 9-9,
Any thoughts out there, JohnLegend??
I already covered that one AMK with scooby we called it DECODER 3. The trouble is it can take half a year to get down to the final pattern. Played PATTERN 4 Style, might be worth testing.
What I have to make clear is PATTERN 4 and PATTERN BREAKER will more or less match their expected hit rate played consecutively. Played hit and run style its a different ball game. EXAMPLE play PATTERN 4 consecutively and you will typically win five or six times then lose.
Played the way I play get used to winning streaks in excess of 20 in a row. It becomes a certain winner longterm. I've been trying to get this across for a year now on this forum.
You may NEVER see a winning streak anywhere near 30 in a row it you play long sessions. I have 3 winning streaks of more than 40 in a row played HIT AND RUN. And double losses are non existent.
I will say this clear, play P4 as I do and you will ABSOLUTELY beat this game for the rest of your life. WHO WANTS TO BE A 1 PERCENTER? Bring patience to the game and you are there.
Hello Johnlegend. . . :)
I been trying this system for a while now, and its a winner! But play to long, like you said, and you can lose. . . :(
Can you tell me exactly how you play, progression and for how long and how many times a day!
I also been playing it with dozens and collums, and had top results, but again, I think I play to long and lose, and then play catch up!
Whats your progression? 1,2,4 or 1,3,7 and what do you do if you lose? Do you up progression or start again?
I noticed at the beginning on first post, you played 3 lines of 3, but flicking through it went 4 lines wide. I was playing high low, odd even and red black at the same time for three games only, winning max 9 units. . . But keep going back for more. I really would like to know how long and what way the creator of this plays this system. .
And I always look through your posts and systems on here, and would like to know, which one is the one you think is your best!!!
Cheers ;D ;D ;D
There is no such thing as "hit and run." what do you think, that playing a certain amount of spins intermitently is different than playing any other amount of spins continuously or not? nevermind, happy winnings, I will even test your system on my real spins if I have time, or you can do it-- you can find the download in Reply 25 of "The Manilla System" which is about 15 systems down the list of full systems. but you will probably come up with some tweaks that will work with those spins. the only way you could accurately test is to pretend you sat down after the 1st spin, after the 2nd spin, after the 3rd spin, etc. because obviously you could arrive at any time during any sequence of spins. which is why "hit and run" makes no sense...
Quote from: Red Nickels on May 09, 04:13 PM 2011
There is no such thing as "hit and run." what do you think, that playing a certain amount of spins intermitently is different than playing any other amount of spins continuously or not? nevermind, happy winnings, I will even test your system on my real spins if I have time, or you can do it-- you can find the download in Reply 25 of "The Manilla System" which is about 15 systems down the list of full systems. but you will probably come up with some tweaks that will work with those spins. the only way you could accurately test is to pretend you sat down after the 1st spin, after the 2nd spin, after the 3rd spin, etc. because obviously you could arrive at any time during any sequence of spins. which is why "hit and run" makes no sense...
numbers of the real spin feom manila topic came winer for pattern breaker4 and pattern filler where you play for missing sequence to come...pattern breaker loses ;) ;)
Quote from: Red Nickels on May 09, 04:13 PM 2011
There is no such thing as "hit and run." what do you think, that playing a certain amount of spins intermitently is different than playing any other amount of spins continuously or not? nevermind, happy winnings, I will even test your system on my real spins if I have time, or you can do it-- you can find the download in Reply 25 of "The Manilla System" which is about 15 systems down the list of full systems. but you will probably come up with some tweaks that will work with those spins. the only way you could accurately test is to pretend you sat down after the 1st spin, after the 2nd spin, after the 3rd spin, etc. because obviously you could arrive at any time during any sequence of spins. which is why "hit and run" makes no sense...
The winning streaks prove theres a difference. Not a SINGLE WINNING STREAK of 20 or more with continuos play. With hit and run I have 13 streaks of at least 20. Its all about when you enter the cycle.
Quote from: paul2007 on May 09, 03:39 PM 2011
Hello Johnlegend. . . :)
I been trying this system for a while now, and its a winner! But play to long, like you said, and you can lose. . . :(
Can you tell me exactly how you play, progression and for how long and how many times a day!
I also been playing it with dozens and collums, and had top results, but again, I think I play to long and lose, and then play catch up!
what's your progression? 1,2,4 or 1,3,7 and what do you do if you lose? Do you up progression or start again?
I noticed at the beginning on first post, you played 3 lines of 3, but flicking through it went 4 lines wide. I was playing high low, odd even and red black at the same time for three games only, winning max 9 units. . . But keep going back for more. I really would like to know how long and what way the creator of this plays this system. .
And I always look through your posts and systems on here, and would like to know, which one is the one you think is your best!!!
Cheers ;D ;D ;D
For Pattern 4 I play for one win, and shut it down. I use multiple levels and start in the middle. I will post all my results and staking soon. WHY DOES HIT AND RUN WORK?
It works simply because you are more likely to win your FIRST GAME many times over than win a multiple play session. Call it luck whatever there is simply no denying that a method like P4 will produce winning streaks played hit and run, that DEFY the true strikerate the law of averages dictates should be your slice of the win loss pie.
Of course you can have two close losses playing hit and run, but when you hit that streak it will go on and on. And even playing at a one level progression of say 2,4,8. You will show a profit. USING MULTI LEVEL STAKING. You simply are assured profit.
And because double losses are rare playing hit and run you can snatch back at least half your loss on the very next game. Then carry on accumulating further profits, so its always one step backwards, three steps forward with this method.
John,
can i use this P4 in RNG fast play mode (without spinning)?
Quote from: Cash83 on May 10, 10:37 AM 2011
John,
can I use this P4 in RNG fast play mode (without spinning)?
I dont recommend playing RNGs they are not roulette. If they were a good method would beat them as it does a real wheel. That said the only chance you have of beating them is hit and run before they read you like a bestseller.
You raise a really interesting yet fundamental point Red Nickels.
In questioning whether "hit and run" differs in the long term from continuous play, you are sceptical that there is a difference.
John has made it very clear in several posts that his evidence in real live play roulette (not RNG) demonstrates that he has achieved long streaks of wins in his results by playing for ONE HIT in a game then quitting.
He has also stated that the point of entry is critical.
Thus entry and exit points need to be carefully defined.
John has mentioned that in continuous play such relatively frequent streaks of 20+ would be unlikely and that in the longer view the expectation of equilibrium or cancelling out of profit would be satisfied. This is even allowing for exclusion of zero (tax). The wins would simply balance out the losses.
Yet in a history of results of hit and run strategy with the above conditions met (and a suitable handling of zero) a sound net profit results, according to John.
I believe the reason for this, and it is fundamental to the true nature of roulette, and fundamental if we are to be winners, is that there is an eternal battle that rages in the sequence of outcomes from the roulette wheel.
The battle is a fight between the forces of Deviation ( Ecart), and the forces of Balance ( Equilibre).
Depending on the size of the window through which we view these outcomes the two forces may be at different poles, and one may be dominant over the other.
In the bigger picture we know that equilibrium has mastery through the mysterious ways of balance and what appears to be some sort of memory.
Even hard headed Statisticians have confided to me over this latter phenomenon. 'Transparent Mathematics' appears to acknowledge this also.
Deviations (deviation standard) appears to diminish the bigger the sample, to say less than 1% in a sample of 100,000 spins.
By contrast in the short cycles, the deviation, the Ecart, dominates. This is the opportunity we can seize.
It seems only a very few really understand this and use this to their advantage consistently.
As brilliant European theorists have stated "the problem to play the losing bets with small units, and the winning bets with large units, remains unsolved, but it is possible to ride the winning streaks with large units and the losing streaks with smaller bets".
That approach is really another subject, and one where there has been fascinating work. However the essence here is that by selecting the right time to enter and to exit as soon as possible after a first hit the player is keeping that window of opportunity as small as possible and thus is reducing the risk of increased exposure to the corrective balancing forces which would neutralise any gain.
In other words hit and run.
Hit after a suitable trigger and get out after the first win. If the method, such as this one (or others like it) is simple and short cycle in exposure then the scales will tip in the favour of the smart player.
There is still the risk of short term loss but it is reduced, and by effective money management, can be quickly controlled.
It just requires a style of play that is the opposite of gambling.
The pattern 4 is at the top , personally i think it is the probably the best system i have played to date. I have to rate it 9.5 0ut of ten. I have won buckets full of money so far with it. :)
Quote from: Kingspin on May 11, 04:54 PM 2011
The pattern 4 is at the top , personally I think it is the probably the best system I have played to date. I have to rate it 9.5 0ut of ten. I have won buckets full of money so far with it. :)
Kingspin can you please tell me that how you are playing this method ? :smile:
Quote from: Kingspin on May 11, 04:54 PM 2011
The pattern 4 is at the top , personally I think it is the probably the best system I have played to date. I have to rate it 9.5 0ut of ten. I have won buckets full of money so far with it. :)
I think PATTERN 4 is a gem. I had a winning streak of 32 in a real casino over 3 days. Once you have won a 100 times you can never relinguish your BR. Playing as I do I have never lost twice in a row. Using a losing even playing continuosly double losses are infrequent.
You play this and Scoobies DIVIDE AND CONQUER in a real casino, you go home a winner EVERYTIME, not 4 times out of five.
Dont be a gambler, Know you are going to win. MV5, P4, PATTERN BREAKER, DIVIDE & CONQUER. What more do you want? I only have one method left to share on this forum. Ill tell you all, and from there you either realize what you have before you right here or you carry on flitting from method to method but never really getting anywhere making any real money. I will be using the aforementioned methods extensively over the coming years and to a point of annoyance to the casinos.
I've been watching this silently.
i will keep posting results from live spins (wiesbaden)
i play continuation.
wait 9 spins after any result then bet
i use 3 banks:
1-3-7
2-5-11
2-5-11
i stay at 2-5-11 till bankroll deplicts or until reaching new high
profit target 47 units (new bank-100% profit)
----------------------------------
test1 +47 units
test2 +25 units
Test3 +31
test4 -40
Watch the graphs after 10500 spins
two forms with reset and with no reset after 1st win
the bet system is pattern Breaker with no reset after 1st win
;D
this is just to point that several different sessions, not played continuously take advantage on continuous play.
other thing to consider is that by playing all 3 even chances at same time will not get us more ahead than playing just one of your choice.
at last I think we must stop thinking like machines, for anything to succeed there must be the power of human decision.
good work, would like to see your thoughts on this
cheers
just to let u know.
if u will close graph window and all individual trackers then test will be performed much faster.
well. less visible = faster.
so best is to just minimize it.
Quote from: ophis on May 11, 09:15 PM 2011
Just to let you know.
if you will close graph window and all individual trackers then test will be performed much faster.
well. less visible = faster.
so best is to just minimize it.
thank you ophis!
Meanwhile one more manual test
test5 +21
The pattern 4 tests look pretty good so far. :twisted:
Dudes - ive been playing and playing and tweaking and tweaking this and now i need some help. Im totally convinced this is a winner, just not in its current form. Maybe I should make a new thread. . . . . i dunno, but i dont wanna hijack this one either.
I played with a 3 column matrix, then 4, then 5 and now i play with 6. I have found 6 has the best win to lose ratio and the progression is kinda reasonable and affordable with a martingale. With 6 lines there are 64 pattern combinations so each line has a 1 in 64 chance of losing. It seems to totally fail 1. 5% of the lines.
Im really keen to go to 7 lines (128 combinations) or even 8 lines (256 combinations!) but need a better progression cause my stomach cant handle betting 128 units to make 1!
Ive been testing online live with real money at various places but mainly betfair and a couple of playtech casinos. Also Fairway Casino. I havnt played any RNG - totally rigged.
Ive also played this on dozens / columns with success but the martingale progression is a killer.
From my testing I think, I need a really cheap even betting live roulette table - less than $1 per unit, or a progression that can take us up to 7 or 8 losses without my sphincter twitching!
Im totally convinced if you can afford 7 or 8 losses before a win. . . . . this system is a winner. Just gotta add a couple more lines. . . . .
Quote from: Smee on May 14, 03:30 AM 2011
Dudes - I've been playing and playing and tweaking and tweaking this and now I need some help. I'm totally convinced this is a winner, just not in its current form. Maybe I should make a new thread. . . . . I dunno, but I don't wanna hijack this one either.
I played with a 3 column matrix, then 4, then 5 and now I play with 6. I have found 6 has the best win to lose ratio and the progression is kinda reasonable and affordable with a martingale. With 6 lines there are 64 pattern combinations so each line has a 1 in 64 chance of losing. It seems to totally fail 1. 5% of the lines.
I'm really keen to go to 7 lines (128 combinations) or even 8 lines (256 combinations!) but need a better progression cause my stomach can't handle betting 128 units to make 1!
I've been testing online live with real money at various places but mainly betfair and a couple of playtech casinos. Also Fairway Casino. I havnt played any RNG - totally rigged.
I've also played this on dozens / columns with success but the martingale progression is a killer.
From my testing I think, I need a really cheap even betting live roulette table - less than $1 per unit, or a progression that can take us up to 7 or 8 losses without my sphincter twitching!
I'm totally convinced if you can afford 7 or 8 losses before a win. . . . . this system is a winner. Just gotta add a couple more lines. . . . .
Snee I cant agree with that, P4 is DEFINATELY a winner in its current form. You are overthinking this. Its not meant to be invincible. Its a hit and run method and, as such it defies its paper stats. MECHANICAL SYSTEMS do not have to be played MECHANICALY.
You have the REAL POWER in how you employ them. If I want a method with a three figured strikerate I have it in MATRIX VERTICAL 5.
If I want faster turnover I have it with methods like P4, and D&C. The bottom line is the numbers. Do I have to win 7 times to match every loss? On paper YES, in reality NO.
What you have to do with EVERY SYSTEM you encounter is learn its common behaviour. PATTERN 4 holds no surprises, played straight on paper it wins 5-8 times to every loss AS IT SHOULD.
Played HIT AND RUN STYLE, its a different animal. Below are the win loss streaks of my last 200 games to illustrate this fact.
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L--9/1
W,W,W,W,W,L--5/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,
W,W,W,W,L--23/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L--10/1
W,W,W,W,L--4/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L--14/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L--10/1
W,W,W,L--3/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L--8/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L--13/1
W,W,L--2/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L--15/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L--9/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,L--6/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L--16/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L-12/1
W,W,W,W,W,L--5/1
W,W,W,W,L--4/1
W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,W,L--15/1
GAMES 201
WINS 183
LOSSES 18
PROFIT 65 POINTS To a one level progression.
These are the type of results you will enjoy playing hit and run style with PATTERN 4. You will cheat random and the law of averages overall when you hit a winning streak that goes into double figures. Playing consecutively You will not. Try to understand this, those who do will be on their way to conquering this game for the rest of their lives.
Hello JohnLegend,
Thanks again for all your work and help. Feel really fortunate.
I wanted to see if it might be possible for you to inform us on your precise playing method at the moment. For example your staking plan, the multiple levels etc.. after a loss.
In short any details which are not in your original explanation of Pattern 4.
I have been contemplating many variations of Pattern 4 and other strategies (for a longtime) but it doesn't get any better. Strange feeling to finally be able to let go of it all and just play with no doubt!!
Quote from: amk on May 14, 12:44 PM 2011
Hello JohnLegend,
Thanks again for all your work and help. Feel really fortunate.
I wanted to see if it might be possible for you to inform us on your precise playing method at the moment. For example your staking plan, the multiple levels etc.. after a loss.
In short any details which are not in your original explanation of Pattern 4.
I have been contemplating many variations of Pattern 4 and other strategies (for a longtime) but it doesn't get any better. Strange feeling to finally be able to let go of it all and just play with no doubt!!
Hit and run is the general playing method Amk. I use three progression levels
(LEVEL 1), 2,4,8
(LEVEL 2), 6,12,24--STARTING LEVEL
(LEVEL 3), 12,24,48
After a win on the first game OF EACH NEW DAY. I drop to level 1 stakes and play 4 more singular games.
After a loss at level 1 I jump to level 3 FOR ONE GAME. If the lost occurred on my FIRST GAME OF THE DAY LEVEL TWO STAKES (RARE) I jump to level 3 for two games.
I have yet to lose a first game at level 2 and have never lost TWICE. And as I said its all relative, once you are locked into a double figures winning streak, you pull ahead and profit overall is assured. Hit and Run assures it.
Thanks JohnLegend!!
Hopefully my last brainstorm....
In a real casino there are many wheels. In theory, Pattern 4 could be played continually without waiting for 20 spins to pass....
After you have 9 spins on one wheel and play Pattern 4 you can walk to the next wheel and play the following 9 spins directly.
After a game walk to the next wheel....
or is this nothing new?
if the zero comes up at the third bet is that a loss and move to the next row or do you rebet third spin
Quote from: amk on May 14, 01:49 PM 2011
Thanks JohnLegend!!
Hopefully my last brainstorm....
In a real casino there are many wheels. In theory, Pattern 4 could be played continually without waiting for 20 spins to pass....
After you have 9 spins on one wheel and play Pattern 4 you can walk to the next wheel and play the following 9 spins directly.
After a game walk to the next wheel....
or is this nothing new?
Yes that would work in a live casino I've done this. But no matter how I play, its for a TOTAL of five wins A DAY. I make ocassional exception to this as I did on holiday with DIVIDE AND CONQUER. But in general I seek five wins per day from each of my bread and butter methods. And as the bankrolls of each grow, so to does the unit value of a point.
The avewrage human being will never be able to adhere to what I do, I realize this. But this level of discipline has brought me great success. And it will others if they can stick to it.
Quote from: joiner29 on May 14, 02:01 PM 2011
If the zero comes up at the third bet is that a loss and move to the next row or do you rebet third spin
The game is lost, this is tbe power of Pattern 4 played hit and run style. 4 of my 18 losses in the previous results contained a green goblin. It makes for a minor setback, understand this. Once you are locked into a dounle figures winning streak you have overcome what all the maths boys dictate your expected numbers should be. This is the reward for your patience and persistence. WHEN YOU ENTER THE CYCLE, is the single most important factor. Playing hit and run, you will often cheat all the laws and gain a bigger slice of the winning pie, its that simple.
Hi John
Patience is key with this hit & run method and tonight played 5 games "Live Wheel" exactly as you suggested (Ophis Tracker PB4 H/L only) with a first win on L2 and then 4 games at L1, and only twice had to go to the 2nd progression +14 units and stopped job done ;D
Gordon :thumbsup:
hi john, you say that when you enter the cycle is the most important factor, how do you determine when to enter or is it just random after any nine spins
Quote from: joiner29 on May 15, 04:47 AM 2011
Hi john, you say that when you enter the cycle is the most important factor, how do you determine when to enter or is it just random after any nine spins
Its random Joiner. If you look at my previous results, you will see some streaks are short while others are longer. The longer streak occur when you are fortunate to enter the cycle at the right time several times in a row. This would never happen as often if you played consecutively, its your reward for being PATIENT.
Hello JohnLegend
Is ScoobyDoo informed about Pattern 4.......
Hello everyone
I would like to present a conservative way of playing this good system.
I record 4 spins no bet
then I bet the next pair (2spins) against the first 2 results.
Example
1-B
2-r
3-r
4-r
5- bet against B- Bet RED
6- bet against are - Bet Black
I bet the two spins no matter if win or lose the first one.
For money management I use the progression:
+1 on a win (until reach a new high)
stay the same on a loss.
Target +10
Stop at -20 Loss
--------------------------------------------------------------------
I think it is a more conservative way of betting this
here follow three test sessions on Real Spins from Dublin Bet, a member on the forum gave...
three games +30
Would really appreciate your thoughts on this.
thanks john L
I will keep on posting results if anyone interested.
Offtopic- Menphis Grizzlies lost semi-final for Thunder Oaklaoma :-(
NBA
more 2 tests
Last one with big swing and drawdown, but it came alive.
so far +90 at about 830 spins
???
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 14, 01:25 PM 2011
Hit and run is the general playing method Amk. I use three progression levels
(LEVEL 1), 2,4,8
(LEVEL 2), 6,12,24--STARTING LEVEL
(LEVEL 3), 12,24,48
After a win on the first game OF EACH NEW DAY. I drop to level 1 stakes and play 4 more singular games.
After a loss at level 1 I jump to level 3 FOR ONE GAME. If the lost occurred on my FIRST GAME OF THE DAY LEVEL TWO STAKES (RARE) I jump to level 3 for two games.
I have yet to lose a first game at level 2 and have never lost TWICE. And as I said its all relative, once you are locked into a double figures winning streak, you pull ahead and profit overall is assured. Hit and Run assures it.
note that this progression
when lost deplicts 210 units
(worst case scenario lose 1st level 2
then twice in a row level 3)
two comparative tests - one waits 20 spins between games then retracks and uses the above stake plan
the other one uses the original version grand mart 1-3-7
Made over the same spins, obviously. Live spins from smart live casino, posted in a thread from labahalala on live actuals, by the missed twisterUK.
one last note: the tests are made in comparison to a tweeak I am testing on the testing zone of the forum wich I called pattern X... anyways another subject on another thread to keep this tidy.
link:://rouletteforum.cc/testing-zone/pattern-x-continuous-play-testing-zone/ (link:://rouletteforum.cc/testing-zone/pattern-x-continuous-play-testing-zone/)
...For Your Consideration. We can discuss conclusions...
Great system this is. I am interested in testing pattern matrix. Maybe latter we could evolve on that subject. Any ideas on this? PM me if you may.
PLEASE DELETE MY REPLIES #213 & #214 so the thread keeps clean
thanks again JL
Quote from: albertojonas on May 16, 12:02 AM 2011
note that this progression
when lost deplicts 210 units
(worst case scenario lose 1st level 2
then twice in a row level 3)
two comparative tests - one waits 20 spins between games then retracks and uses the above stake plan
the other one uses the original version grand mart 1-3-7
Made over the same spins, obviously. Live spins from smart live casino, posted in a thread from labahalala on live actuals, by the missed twisterUK.
one last note: the tests are made in comparison to a tweeak I am testing on the testing zone of the forum wich I called pattern X... anyways another subject on another thread to keep this tidy.
link:://rouletteforum.cc/testing-zone/pattern-x-continuous-play-testing-zone/ (link:://rouletteforum.cc/testing-zone/pattern-x-continuous-play-testing-zone/)
...For Your Consideration. We can discuss conclusions...
Great system this is. I am interested in testing pattern matrix. Maybe latter we could evolve on that subject. Any ideas on this? PM me if you may.
PLEASE DELETE MY REPLIES #213 & #214 so the thread keeps clean
thanks again JL
Hi Albertojonas, my staking plan is what I use, I have a large BR I would suggest newbies adjust to suit their pocket. I have absolute faith in the solid delivery of the method. After testing and playing nearly 1,000 games Its win loss pattern and ratio are more predictable than other methods ive used.
What people must do is test enough games to gain the same understanding and confidence I have.Once you know what this method delivers the vast majority of time, youll understand that the progressions are worth the risk.
Just for fun I wanted to see how PATTERN 4 performed on RNG.
I played on a multi wheel format, skipping from one wheel to the other.
Won 42 units in half an hour, then the RNG game crashed, the ball kept spinning round and round without landing.... (has anyone seen this?)
I then closed the game and went to the main menu and no games were showing that I could play....
Only live wheel can be played........
Quote from: amk on May 16, 04:33 PM 2011
Just for fun I wanted to see how PATTERN 4 performed on RNG.
I played on a multi wheel format, skipping from one wheel to the other.
Won 42 units in half an hour, then the RNG game crashed, the ball kept spinning round and round without landing.... (has anyone seen this?)
I then closed the game and went to the main menu and no games were showing that I could play....
Only live wheel can be played........
;) suspicious minds...
Quote from: amk on May 16, 04:33 PM 2011
Just for fun I wanted to see how PATTERN 4 performed on RNG.
I played on a multi wheel format, skipping from one wheel to the other.
Won 42 units in half an hour, then the RNG game crashed, the ball kept spinning round and round without landing.... (has anyone seen this?)
I then closed the game and went to the main menu and no games were showing that I could play....
Only live wheel can be played........
Its a machine RNG. Will not happen in live roulette. It happens all the time its beacuse it bugg in program or bad line.
Jon
I wanted to test a random theory based on the great work of JohnLegend and Scoobydoo..
on RNG, and hope it can contribute in some form to the phenomena of RANDOM on the real wheel..
I call it RANDOM U
Method:
Chose 4 levels of any 3 pattern combination of H and L, never only H or only L, at random and play their opposites.
example: at random...
HHL
LHL
LHH
LHL
I used a very aggressive full progression of .10, .20, .40, .80 etc 204.80 giving me 4 levels. (It should only really be played with a conservative PATTERN 4 progression this way you can play for higher winning units and only use a 3 level progression.) After a win I skip between 6 to 8 spins, changing each time, and create another 4 level random pattern, I played continually.....
TOTAL UNITS WON +100
GAMES WON 80
GAMES LOST 20
LONGEST WINNING STREAK, 18
AVERAGE WINNING STREAK, 7
AVERAGE PROGRESSION LEVEL, 2
ONLY REACHED LEVEL4 ONCE AND WON ON FIRST BET
I think that one of the most difficult feats to accomplish in roulette is guessing what will be the right sequence of even money bets. In RANDOM U you are actually playing against yourself. What are the chances that you will guess at random the correct sequence of 9 even money bets (1 in 512 for 3 level progression. I played continually but should skip 6 to 8 spins between prog. levels) So bet against yourself that you won't get it right.....
The chances on a real wheel have to be much better...
Just wanted to add this as food for thought and hope it might sparks some ideas in the veterans.....
Could someone delete my above entry.
Should have made another thread for it.
Success to everyone with PATTERN 4 O0
Hope everyone will keep posting their results...
I think Twister at the beginning of the thread had a very profound approach to PATTERN $
I hope he is doing well
He only plays the progression at one level 1-3-7 and "takes the loss"
I will test with 1-2-4, only 7 unit loss.....
You have a 10/1 strike rate with many long winning sessions....
This is great I think for the newbies not at a high progression level such as JohnLegend
As JohnLegend said "3 steps forward one step back"....
Was at my local B&M and these are the results of a continuous Pattern4. I unfortunately jumped between betting on Pattern4 and matrix where one bets that a quad does not become a fiver which crashed costing me my BR. If however I had been only betting on Pattern4 I would have been in a positive balance... here are the H's and L's
LHH
LHL
HLH
HLL
LLL
HLH
LLL
LLH
HLL
HLH
LLH
HHH
HHH
HLL
HLL
HLL
L0H
HLH
LHL
+24
- 14
PROFIT +10
The casino returns 50% of bet on a zero, my good luck
Hello JohnLegend,
I wanted to see if you could comment on your statement below for us..
"I will tell you something else, betting against H and L becoming FIVE POINTERS in a FOUR WIDE MATRIX is looking like an ACCESSABLE HOLY GRAIL"
How is this method performing?
You play it like this:
HLLHL
LLHLH
LLHLH
LHLHL
.......... now you are betting that the fifth pattern does not become the first? (no zero in matrix?)
Could you possible delve into this for us...
Also a few weeks ago, you guys were hailing P4 when played as a 4-wide matrix (betting against spins 13-16 being the same as spins 1-4) as the ultimate grail, but it seems you're all back to a 3-wide matrix now, so where's the grail here? ???
By the way, the original method for P4 doesn't work for me AT ALL, it loses far too often.
Side B you produce nothing near a grail, you contribute nothing your like a one trick pony, one record track..
As your so cleaver an 'know it all' Why don't you try helping develop something instead of preaching your same old tripe no one's listening to ya
bottom line is, if it aint constructive get on your donkey an move on
Excuse me but I don't know you and I don't believe you know me so I'd like to know what you are basing your insults on? And what is that "same old tripe" that you speak of?
I am always one for testing new, promising systems, which is why I have read and re-read the 15 pages of this very topic. Based on what I read, I asked a simple question: is this game to be played as a 3-wide matrix or 4-wide?
I then said that my initial tests show that the original P4 method loses me money, I am sorry if this inconveniences you in any way, it is my experience, that's all.
It started as 3-wide, much talk of grail, then 4-wide, even better grail, then it seemed to have gone back to 3-wide without any explanation, hence my question. I would welcome an answer.
Quote from: Side B on May 19, 01:23 PM 2011
Excuse me but I don't know you and I don't believe you know me so I'd like to know what you are basing your insults on? And what is that "same old tripe" that you speak of?
I am always one for testing new, promising systems, which is why I have read and re-read the 15 pages of this very topic. Based on what I read, I asked a simple question: is this game to be played as a 3-wide matrix or 4-wide?
I then said that my initial tests show that the original P4 method loses me money, I am sorry if this inconveniences you in any way, it is my experience, that's all.
It started as 3-wide, much talk of grail, then 4-wide, even better grail, then it seemed to have gone back to 3-wide without any explanation, hence my question. I would welcome an answer.
Guys lets remain civil about this. Side B ive only ever played PATTERN 4 in a three wide format HIT AND RUN STYLE. This *IS NOT A CONTINUOS PLAY METHOD.
You enter the game randomly and play for one win THEN YOU ARE GONE. Do this and Use a multi level staking plan and I assure you, youll show a profit. Winning streaks defy the paper numbers for this method. Hit and run you can win over 20 times in a row.
And double losses are Rare. I will update my results tomorrow.
Quote from: Side B on May 19, 01:23 PM 2011
Excuse me but I don't know you and I don't believe you know me so I'd like to know what you are basing your insults on? And what is that "same old tripe" that you speak of?
I am always one for testing new, promising systems, which is why I have read and re-read the 15 pages of this very topic. Based on what I read, I asked a simple question: is this game to be played as a 3-wide matrix or 4-wide?
I then said that my initial tests show that the original P4 method loses me money, I am sorry if this inconveniences you in any way, it is my experience, that's all.
It started as 3-wide, much talk of grail, then 4-wide, even better grail, then it seemed to have gone back to 3-wide without any explanation, hence my question. I would welcome an answer.
i am still working on this pattern 4 and X methods.
you're being a bit bitter but i understand your statements.
what is the difference of playing hit and run or playing multiple sessions a day even on multiple wheels?
another point is the multiple staking method risks too many chips for the profit it intends (stage 3 is over 80 chips)
another one is what is the difference between playing it in a wide matrix 3-4-5-6-etc
the principle is the same: -outcome will not repeat after a certain number of spins.
same as last, opposite as last, playing the same outcome with a 2 spins gap, or 3,4,5,6 etc
always bet red, always bet black, play for chops.
there is a world well explored on this subject
now
my point is with all this questions one can make 1 out of 3 decisions:
1- study it and try to reach some kind of conclusion with the help of testing, brainstorming, esperimenting, comparing, etc, etc
2- try to see the work of others (leeching)
3- forget about it and move on (disapointment)
all being said,
i keep studying it.
:thumbsup:
Quote from: albertojonas on May 19, 04:10 PM 2011
i am still working on this pattern 4 and X methods.
you're being a bit bitter but I understand your statements.
what is the difference of playing hit and run or playing multiple sessions a day even on multiple wheels?
another point is the multiple staking method risks too many chips for the profit it intends (stage 3 is over 80 chips)
another one is what is the difference between playing it in a wide matrix 3-4-5-6-etc
the principle is the same: -outcome will not repeat after a certain number of spins.
same as last, opposite as last, playing the same outcome with a 2 spins gap, or 3,4,5,6 etc
always bet red, always bet black, play for chops.
there is a world well explored on this subject
now
my point is with all this questions one can make 1 out of 3 decisions:
1- study it and try to reach some kind of conclusion with the help of testing, brainstorming, esperimenting, comparing, etc, etc
2- try to see the work of others (leeching)
3- forget about it and move on (disapointment)
all being said,
i keep studying it.
:thumbsup:
Albertojonas. As I stated before the staking plan I use reflects my BR. You could use
1,2,4
3,6,12
And still make a tidy profit. Do you know I have several streaks of 30 plus before LOSING THE FIRST GAME. Somehow you have to realize ALL OF YOU,.Less is more with a method like this.
I know you all lack this patience and discipline, I myself took several years to attain it. But I tell you all absolutely. When, if you find it you rule this game as long as you play it. I need you to understand the only thing that now keeps casinos safe is the weakness inherent in virtually every human being that plays this game.
In March next year I intend to commence making my mark on this game. There will be no doubt in the minds of the casino people someone stepped into their house and beat them fair and square. And if any of you are able to join me for even a week all expenses paid by me. You will be witness to this. You will see exactly how I play these methods.
And you will fully understand that the difference between success and failure longterm is the decision making and iron discipline you must use. Let me leave you with this thought. Who ever heard of a champion poker player who A, played every hand in a tournament. And B, staked the same on every hand.
And you really think Roulette is that different. THINK AGAIN...
Well I'm sorry guys but I played hit and run and followed the exact same rules, but had 3 losing games out of 7 games played so I'm sorry but it's a non-starter for me.
And I hope the "you're being bitter" comment wasn't for me. i was only asking a question and this strato guy just started laying into me for no reason, it's completely unacceptable behaviour.
Quote from: Side B on May 19, 05:31 PM 2011
Well I'm sorry guys but I played hit and run and followed the exact same rules, but had 3 losing games out of 7 games played so I'm sorry but it's a non-starter for me.
And I hope the "you're being bitter" comment wasn't for me. I was only asking a question and this strato guy just started laying into me for no reason, it's completely unacceptable behaviour.
Side B it seems theres always someone catching losses with every method. Out of interest how many games have you recoded hit and run in total. What was your longesr winning streak, and what live casino/s do you use?
Hello JohnLegend,
Thanks again for your help and invitation!! Lot to think about..
I had an idea and hope it can help somehow.. What makes PATTERN 4 successful is the HIT AND RUN. 20 spins between games minimum.
For the best HIT AND RUN we could play online once every 20 or 30 minutes or once per hour. A session lasting several hours is reduced to a convenient pace. You can play perhaps 10-15-20 games per day.. One game would take just 1 or two minutes. I feel this would provide the optimum random approach. As you mention PATTERN 4 takes a lot of patience.
Due to most peoples busy day this might not be possible unless its played on an IPhone.
Any use?
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 19, 05:42 PM 2011
Side B it seems theres always someone catching losses with every method. Out of interest how many games have you recoded hit and run in total. What was your longesr winning streak, and what live casino/s do you use?
I play at supercasino.com, alternating between the two different live airball wheels. I've only played 7 games, always hit and run, first game lost, next 4 games won (=longest streak), next 2 games lost.
AMK.
Due to most peoples busy day this might not be possible unless its played on an IPhone.
Any use?
Do you mean playing roulette on a Iphone? :ooh:
I bought a couple months ago the new iphone 4 but i can not even write on it with my big fingers :D LOL.
Jon
Quote from: Side B on May 19, 05:51 PM 2011
I play at supercasino.com, alternating between the two different live airball wheels. I've only played 7 games, always hit and run, first game lost, next 4 games won (=longest streak), next 2 games lost.
Maiby you have a cloud of bad luck hanging over you since you seem to be the only one ho lose so much with this ;D
Cheers
Jon
Cloud of bad luck? Right... that must be it then! Genius! We have a holy grail that is wholly dependent on not having bad luck, fantastic!
I have nothing to add to this thread, good "luck" to you all! :D
Quote from: Side B on May 19, 06:15 PM 2011
Cloud of bad luck? Right... that must be it then! Genius! We have a holy grail that is wholly dependent on not having bad luck, fantastic!
I have nothing to add to this thread, good "luck" to you all! :D
LOL :D
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 19, 05:04 PM 2011
Albertojonas. As I stated before the staking plan I use reflects my BR. You could use
1,2,4
3,6,12
And still make a tidy profit. Do you know I have several streaks of 30 plus before LOSING THE FIRST GAME. Somehow you have to realize ALL OF YOU,.Less is more with a method like this.
I know you all lack this patience and discipline, I myself took several years to attain it. But I tell you all absolutely. When, if you find it you rule this game as long as you play it. I need you to understand the only thing that now keeps casinos safe is the weakness inherent in virtually every human being that plays this game.
In March next year I intend to commence making my mark on this game. There will be no doubt in the minds of the casino people someone stepped into their house and beat them fair and square. And if any of you are able to join me for even a week all expenses paid by me. You will be witness to this. You will see exactly how I play these methods.
And you will fully understand that the difference between success and failure longterm is the decision making and iron discipline you must use. Let me leave you with this thought. Who ever heard of a champion poker player who A, played every hand in a tournament. And B, staked the same on every hand.
And you really think Roulette is that different. THINK AGAIN...
you did not answer direct to the point to any of my statements. I am sorry i posted it, i meant no harm, only improvement on work or discussion. i find bravery in the way you stand for your hit and run method, howewer i would wish you to be more open about discussing and improving it. this is not dissenting.
i have not any doubt about how you apply these systems, neither your hit n' run style. All other points i mentioned before are not above questioning, and proving, still.
i wish you all the best of luck, and i recognize we all have to be bitter sometimes.
JohnLegend, as many others in these foruns, has a speech wish finds him a bit above the others but that is understandable too, we all think we possess a private glorious tiny bit of truth unknown to anyone else. i do not intend to bring a war on this, as you can clearly check by my other posts on this forum, and in this thread itself.
If anyone is still open for investigation on this cool system, i am avaliable.
As for you, John Legend - No Blood no Foul!
ET Loves You!
Quote from: Side B on May 19, 05:51 PM 2011
I play at supercasino.com, alternating between the two different live airball wheels. I've only played 7 games, always hit and run, first game lost, next 4 games won (=longest streak), next 2 games lost.
Side B 7 games? Try playing a Proper live wheel for 100 games over five days.
There is no way you should be losing 3 times in 7 games. Even consecutively you will oftem win 7 or more times between losses. In fact I could make profit playing consecutively if I wanted to. But HIT AND RUN definately strings longer winning streaks together. PLAY A REAL LIVE WHEEL side b. Accept no substitute.
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 19, 07:30 PM 2011
Side B 7 games? Try playing a Proper live wheel for 100 games over five days.
There is no way you should be losing 3 times in 7 games. Even consecutively you will oftem win 7 or more times between losses. In fact I could make profit playing consecutively if I wanted to. But HIT AND RUN definately strings longer winning streaks together. PLAY A REAL LIVE WHEEL side b. Accept no substitute.
plz share with us the consecutive method
thx
JL I thought airball wheels were fine? It's a UK-based casino with live broadcasts to two airball wheels so there should be no cheating in theory.
Should I take my money to a different casino? Which ones do you recommend?
john legend - can you clarify please, does 3 spins at LLW mean 1 game or 3 games?
i. e 2 losers and a winner or 1 winning game (cycle)
so when you say 20 winners in a row you really mean 20 winning cycles?
Thanks bud
Ian
Quote from: Side B on May 20, 07:50 AM 2011
JL I thought airball wheels were fine? It's a UK-based casino with live broadcasts to two airball wheels so there should be no cheating in theory.
Should I take my money to a different casino? Which ones do you recommend?
I recommend Betfreds and Paddypower online. Yes Airball should be okay but I think its still not as good as a croupier. All I can say is all my results money and ideas have come from real online wheels and real B&M casinos. Online betfreds has NEVER let me down so, I would definately give them a try and see what you think.
Will someone please be kind enough to check their previous games results and see what is the maximum amount of losses or wins in a row in continuous play betting against a match in the 4th row above
e.g..
LLL
LLH
LHH
LLH H in BOLD is first of 5 wins in a row
HHL
HHL
LLL here two L IN ITALICS in a row are losses
LLH
many thanks
MP
I apologise SideB
My results for this p4 is 41 wins to 3 losses testing roughly 3 games a day. using the wheels behavior to try assist my prediction when to enter the game. i test for a while before i started recording results
For 7 point risk and playing for half recovery on a loss,,, no double loss yet
SideB i'm sorry if that is your true results, sometimes i'm sure certain member are here to try an cause discontent and it get really tiring . after reading your post again I misunderstood you.
whens that date for vegas people, it would be quality if all members of this great forum met in vegas for a beer an a spin
JohnLegend
Do you think there is any merit to playing once every 20 or 30 minutes per hour on a live online wheel? This should provide the ideal circumstances for PATTERN 4...
Also just wanted to say to all that it is clear JohnLegends PATTERN 4 works. Some might experience a shaky start... I am sure if you went over live spin records from B&M casinos you will see..
Thanks again JohnLegend and enjoy your bliss...
Quote from: amk on May 20, 12:53 PM 2011
JohnLegend
Do you think there is any merit to playing once every 20 or 30 minutes per hour on a live online wheel? This should provide the ideal circumstances for PATTERN 4...
Also just wanted to say to all that it is clear JohnLegends PATTERN 4 works. Some might experience a shaky start... I am sure if you went over live spin records from B&M casinos you will see..
Thanks again JohnLegend and enjoy your bliss...
Amk their value is in the results, if you get a 12 plus winning streak playing consecutively it will be an exception. Playing hit and run its the norm. Do you see what I'm saying here?. You all want to get rich overnight playing this game.
Be more concerned that you are beating this game at all. When most people would laugh out loud at anyone daring to even mention they beat this game everyday.
That will be the whole point of my trip to Europe next year, I'm going to start planting the seeds of doubt over the smug attitude several big casinos have towards this games invincibility. No I wont be breaking the bank.
Ill be making it clear, that if ever enough people were to play these methods theyd be done. I already have a few people using Pattern 4 who couldnt win for toffee before. Now they can win plenty. March 2012 is the start of a landmark year people. I'm praying Twister/Paul makes a full recovery and can join me somewhere along the way. His positive go for it attitude is what brought me back to this forum, plus together with Atlantis helped me realize the full potential of the matrix vertical concept. Speaking of which wheres Atlantis?
I
Quote from: Midnight Player on May 20, 12:29 PM 2011
Will someone please be kind enough to check their previous games results and see what is the maximum amount of losses or wins in a row in continuous play betting against a match in the 4th row above
e.g..
LLL
LLH
LHH
LLH H in BOLD is first of 5 wins in a row
HHL
HHL
LLL here two L IN ITALICS in a row are losses
LLH
many thanks
MP
if you want play continuous why don't you bet every spin?
To answer my own question I have found 13 wins in a row so I guess my little idea is sunk :D
Quote from: strato1985 on May 20, 12:51 PM 2011
I apologise SideB
My results for this p4 is 41 wins to 3 losses testing roughly 3 games a day. using the wheels behavior to try assist my prediction when to enter the game. I test for a while before I started recording results
For 7 point risk and playing for half recovery on a loss,,, no double loss yet
SideB i'm sorry if that is your true results, sometimes i'm sure certain member are here to try an cause discontent and it get really tiring . after reading your post again I misunderstood you.
whens that date for vegas people, it would be quality if all members of this great forum met in vegas for a beer an a spin
Apology accepted, I'm certainly not one of those negative people, but everyone should feel free to question systems, especially if a system is hailed as a possible HG but loses in tests. It's always disappointing when a promising system ends up losing, and I don't enjoy being the bearer of bad news! Anyway, I won't be testing this further, but I wish you guys good luck with it. :thumbsup:
Quote from: Side B on May 21, 08:27 AM 2011
Apology accepted, I'm certainly not one of those negative people, but everyone should feel free to question systems, especially if a system is hailed as a possible method but loses in tests. It's always disappointing when a promising system ends up losing, and I don't enjoy being the bearer of bad news! Anyway, I won't be testing this further, but I wish you guys good luck with it. :thumbsup:
Possible method? Its a method Side B and an excellent one. Its a pity youre backing out after only a handful of games on an Airball m/c.
But its that fickle short term mindset that assures the game remains unchallenged in the mainstream forever.
I am being more and more drawn to P4. The first game of each new day is proving a goldmine. I have not lost the lead off game now for 29 straight days. Ive added ODD AND EVEN to the mix. And have 29 wins in a row for HIGH and LOW. And 9 for ODD AND EVEN.
I dont have the same faith in RED AND BLACK. So I will stay wilth the aforementioned TWO even chances. I will update my results for P4 tomorrow.
The line of thinking I want to try and convey to all of you all, is just because you are playing a mechanical method, it doesnt have to be played like a robot. I have total faith in the game after a loss for example.
And havent gone into this in much detail, but its turning into something of a phenom. In all the 400 real money games Ive now played there has only been 3 double losses played hit and run. For a method with A GAURANTEED 12 spin turnover, thats astounding.
When I know I can take this method anywhere in the world and use it successfuly with these numbers im excited.
;D
Fender i'm glad you said that,, I was just saying it on the other topic..
p4 for me is something else on paddypower wheel, your recommendation .
PB is also a hit
xxvv never rated p4 very highly , he does seem to be good at the number crunching I will read back to see his findings
I note your comment Strato.
Please do not be too literal with some of my earlier research. A lot of progress has been made in recent weeks and to be fair to all, the matrix family of bets all have considerable potential and it is part of my plan to review P4 and PB in coming weeks, along with others.
All bets have their unique characteristics, with strengths and weaknesses.
If we go into that jungle with a map and a torch and some other tools learned from earlier experience we will make better progress next time round.
Who knows we may discover a lost City of Gold!
hello John,
I'm new to this forum and read the PB4. I went to a live casino last night. yes, it had 00. the single zero wheel was closed so I gave it a shot. I sat through 72 spins with a 4 unit win. using $25 stakes. I won 3x on the first and 1x on the 2nd spin. My only complaint was that it took 3 hrs because of crowded tables. Also while tracking the 00 came up on the 8th spin. . UGH! started a new game over and on the 6th spin a single zero came up on the 8th spin a 00 again. So three games were interupted. these were all new games and no bets were made, just setting up the matrix but of course I had to start over. I was a little frustrated as you can imagine with the time involved and only 72 spins. I did not wait 20 spins before the next game because of time. Is this absolutely necessary? Also, when when the 0 or oo pops like this last night:
LHH
LHL
L00. . . do I finish the game with a virtual spin or do I just start another line? I was also tempted to play continuous because of the wait. Looking back while I was playing it would have worked also with no losses. Any suggestions are helpful. Thank you for a great contribution!
Clothdog
Quote from: clothdog on May 22, 09:55 AM 2011
Hello John,
I'm new to this forum and read the PB4. I went to a live casino last night. yes, it had 00. the single zero wheel was closed so I gave it a shot. I sat through 72 spins with a 4 unit win. using $25 stakes. I won 3x on the first and 1x on the 2nd spin. My only complaint was that it took 3 hrs because of crowded tables. Also while tracking the 00 came up on the 8th spin. . UGH! started a new game over and on the 6th spin a single zero came up on the 8th spin a 00 again. So three games were interupted. these were all new games and no bets were made, just setting up the matrix but of course I had to start over. I was a little frustrated as you can imagine with the time involved and only 72 spins. I did not wait 20 spins before the next game because of time. Is this absolutely necessary? Also, when when the 0 or oo pops like this last night:
LHH
LHL
L00. . . do I finish the game with a virtual spin or do I just start another line? I was also tempted to play continuous because of the wait. Looking back while I was playing it would have worked also with no losses. Any suggestions are helpful. Thank you for a great contribution!
Clothdog
no you do not have to wait 20 spins,i make 10 units per 53 interuption spins, its in a code that I found that wins consistently.
Quote from: clothdog on May 22, 09:55 AM 2011
Hello John,
I'm new to this forum and read the PB4. I went to a live casino last night. yes, it had 00. the single zero wheel was closed so I gave it a shot. I sat through 72 spins with a 4 unit win. using $25 stakes. I won 3x on the first and 1x on the 2nd spin. My only complaint was that it took 3 hrs because of crowded tables. Also while tracking the 00 came up on the 8th spin. . UGH! started a new game over and on the 6th spin a single zero came up on the 8th spin a 00 again. So three games were interupted. these were all new games and no bets were made, just setting up the matrix but of course I had to start over. I was a little frustrated as you can imagine with the time involved and only 72 spins. I did not wait 20 spins before the next game because of time. Is this absolutely necessary? Also, when when the 0 or oo pops like this last night:
LHH
LHL
L00. . . do I finish the game with a virtual spin or do I just start another line? I was also tempted to play continuous because of the wait. Looking back while I was playing it would have worked also with no losses. Any suggestions are helpful. Thank you for a great contribution!
Clothdog
CLOTHDOG hI, wait? I don't understand what you mean by wait. that's one of the powerpoints of PATTERN 4, you already know from the time you commence playing a game you will be betting from the 10th to the 12th spin seeking a win on one of them. I think you have mis-understood the method somewhere along the line.
If I go to a bricks and mortar casino I will move from table to table until I attain my 5 games. The only time I will be forced to play more than five games is upon pulling back after a losing game. But such is my confidence on the strikerate of the game following a loss. I will pull back at least half my loss immediately. I now have 410 games played with only 3 double losses among them playing HIT AND RUN STYLE. Its phenomenal. ;D
Quote from: albertojonas on May 19, 08:04 PM 2011
plz share with us the consecutive method
thanks
Albertojonas, my appologies if you think I was ignoring you or evading your questions. Consecutively playing pattern 4 would be as follows.
H H H
L H L
H L H
L L L---WIN BET 1
L L L
H H L
H 0 H--WIN BET 1
L H L
L L H
H L L--WIN BET 3
L H L
L H L
H L L---LOST GAME.
I hope that helps you understand what I mean by consecutively. The only time I play consecutively is DIRECTLY AFTER A LOSING GAME. Thats when it has merit. Otherwise HIT AND RUN is the best policy for stringing together winning streaks that defy the law of averages and push you on to great profit levels.
An update of results for PATTERN 4
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 410
TOTAL GAMES WON 379
TOTAL GAMES LOST 31
STRIKERATE APPROX 12/1
BALANCE =348 units plus
Double losses 3
longest winning streak 37
First game longest winning streak (current) 30 games. 8) 8) 8) 8)
Hello JohnL. Congratulations for developing this method. It really seems good.
I have a few questions:
1. What bankroll would you recommend if i play only one level of progression 1 2 4 or 1 3 7. . .
and if i loose i just wait for another game(take the loss)?
2. can i make profit with the above or should i chase losses or play multiple levels?
3. how many games should i play in a day?
4. Which one is better P4 or MV5?
5. What are the chances to lose entire bankroll if you do it right and play Hit and Run?
also you said you lost 31 times. Is that 31*for ex(2+4+8)=434 units?
Thank you in advance.
Quote from: antondj on May 22, 12:35 PM 2011
Hello JohnL. Congratulations for developing this method. It really seems good.
I have a few questions:
1. What bankroll would you recommend if I play only one level of progression 1 2 4 or 1 3 7. . .
and if I lose I just wait for another game(take the loss)?
2. can I make profit with the above or should I chase losses or play multiple levels?
3. how many games should I play in a day?
4. Which one is better P4 or MV5?
5. What are the chances to lose entire bankroll if you do it right and play Hit and Run?
also you said you lost 31 times. Is that 31*for ex(2+4+8)=434 units?
Thank you in advance.
I recommend you have 200 units for any method minumum. The idea is to have at least 15--20 times your progression. With a mdthod like P4 you are never likely to lose more than twice in a row it will be very rare and even a double loss doesnt happen often. After a losing game I will bet to recover at least half the loss. The winning streaks for the game after a loss are fantastic. I have one over 100. So I recommend you use at least two levels example.
1,2,4-level one
3,6,12-level two
Yes 31 x 14 or 7 depending on what you use. I start the first game of everyday on level 2 stakes as it has a great strikerate. Currently 30 wins in a row.
Hi Warrior;
Quoteno you do not have to wait 20 spins,i make 10 units per 53 interuption spins, its in a code that I found that wins consistently.
Could you please explain what you mean with the above quote.
Thanks;
iggy
Quote from: Iggy on May 22, 01:08 PM 2011
Hi Warrior;
Could you please explain what you mean with the above quote.
Thanks;
iggy
iggy sorry my friend ,this is johns thread if it s ok with him i will post it but other wise i will put it on another thread.
Quote from: warrior on May 22, 01:47 PM 2011
iggy sorry my friend ,this is johns thread if it s ok with him I will post it but other wise I will put it on another thread.
warrior go ahead, youve got me curious too with your CODE.
Me to :)
Jon
If there's anyone on the forum that's not interested after a comment like that, the only thing left to do for them is shovel the dirt in onto their casket! :o
Quote from: GLC on May 22, 04:34 PM 2011
If there's anyone on the forum that's not interested after a comment like that, the only thing left to do for them is shovel the dirt in onto their casket! :o
Youd be surprised Glc there are three roulette killers on this forum and not even 50 members playing any of them. The human mind is a funny thing.
Next year im going to cause a stir in Europe. After winning several thousand, I will purposely settle on one prominent casino and outplay my welcome. I will play until they are forced to ask me to leave and ill make such a noise when they do it will make the press. They wont know how im beating them only that I am. Then things will begin to snowball, and even the most sceptical and fickle minds will start to come around.
"Next year I'm going to cause a stir in Europe. After winning several thousand, I will purposely settle on one prominent casino and outplay my welcome. I will play until they are forced to ask me to leave and ill make such a noise when they do it will make the press. They wont know how I'm beating them only that I am. Then things will begin to snowball, and even the most sceptical and fickle minds will start to come around"
Hi John
I know I have only been a member of this great forum for a few months and have alot to learn but in my eyes "the glass is always half full"
I'd love to join you in Europe and bear witness to the Casino having to eat humble pie ;D
Keep us posted on your planned trip, and by the way P4 is awesome :thumbsup:
Gordon
granted xxvv my posts are not that in depth but i'll post my results as a contribution live wheel paddypower 3-5 games a day.
I've never seen 3 losses in a row, i've witnessed double loss but not been caught by one as yet.
my results so far since recording
63 wins - 4 losses down to 15-1 ratio ( better than the swindon town odds to win a game) division 3 here we go
so if i hit a double loss i've lost 28pts + 12pts (cause i only made up half recover on the three losses) so 63 points won 40 points lost so +22
is that correct anyone ? thats using fender progression above
Quote from: Gordonline on May 22, 05:40 PM 2011
"Next year I'm going to cause a stir in Europe. After winning several thousand, I will purposely settle on one prominent casino and outplay my welcome. I will play until they are forced to ask me to leave and ill make such a noise when they do it will make the press. They wont know how I'm beating them only that I am. Then things will begin to snowball, and even the most sceptical and fickle minds will start to come around"
Hi John
I know I have only been a member of this great forum for a few months and have a lot to learn but in my eyes "the glass is always half full"
I'd love to join you in Europe and bear witness to the Casino having to eat humble pie ;D
Keep us posted on your planned trip, and by the way P4 is awesome :thumbsup:
Gordon
It is, I will. Id like to invite up to three of you who can make it all expenses paid a year today. That way you not only will see me in action youll be part of it. And youll be able to come back on this forum and tell all Jl is for real. And more importantly the methods are for real. Im not talking mickey mouse money here. Im aiming to systemactically take 200,000 euros from the casino I settle on in a week. Theyll know within a few days ive got their number. Then theyll go about trying to get me out of there. But the sweet part is they cannot expel me for any kind of cheating. I will make a scene of it and it will go to press. Ive been building up to this a long time.
I am playing pattern 4 just on the high / low , should i play all 3 even chances at the same time or not john...
Quote from: Kingspin on May 23, 12:09 AM 2011
I am playing pattern 4 just on the high / low , should I play all 3 even chances at the same time or not john...
Tell you what Kingspin I'm currently playing HIGH AND LOW and ODD AND EVEN. And the results are very similar. I don't have the same faith in red and black.
I currently have some impressive results accumulating. For HIGH AND LOW I have a winning streak of 18 games in a row overall and 31 in a row for the first game of the day.
For ODD AND EVEN I have a winning streak of 12 currently and 14 for the first game of the day. So I recommend those two even shots for the P4 method Kingspin. by the way I'm not playing them at the same time I will play one game for HIGH LOW then one for ODD EVEN for a total of 10 games a day.
"Tell you what Kingspin I'm currently playing HIGH AND LOW and ODD AND EVEN. And the results are very similar. I don't have the same faith in red and black."
Why on earth would Red/Black be any different? They're all EC!
And how does faith fit into the whole thing?
[If I don't ask someone else is bound to! ;) ]
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 22, 01:57 PM 2011
warrior go ahead, youve got me curious too with your CODE.
While playing P4 the last 12 trips at BM,were very good while waiting for the 20 spins to take its coarse, I was paying attention to the gaps, what I mean by that is what happens at a 10 spin interval betting the pattern wont repeat,then 9 spins and so on ,very good results ,so I began to play in this fashion.the gaps were as follows
we always begin with P4 on a win we let one spin pass this will be our next number to track For the next10 spins and you do this for the next 54 spins a total of 9 bets will be placed .
now for the code, you starT P4 we win, next let 1 spin go by we wait for 10 spins lets say its 5 12 36 3 25 13 12 35 23 10 ,we bet against the 5 12 36 ok.i will write down the numbers that I use,
P4
10 SPINS
9
8
7
6
5
4
3 HERE WE STOP we bet we win, immediatly we look at 9 spins back and start to bet at P4 AGAIN. progression same as John LEVEL1- 1 2 4
LEVEL 2 - 3 6 12
a-7 will come when your betting like this because your betting 9 times in 54 spins verses every 20 spins that's normal, 2 in row is rare have not seen yet played real 11 games results were really nice this is still new have no clue as far as many spin trial as playing was done in real mode in BM.everyone s thoughts are welcome WARRIOR.
one more thing,if you lose to a -7 let 1 spin go by a continue to the the next number and wait for your next betting oppurtunity ,if you incounter a any 0 is ingnored ,when your on the attack its considered a loss.
Quote from: esoito on May 23, 09:25 AM 2011
"Tell you what Kingspin I'm currently playing HIGH AND LOW and ODD AND EVEN. And the results are very similar. I don't have the same faith in red and black."
Why on earth would Red/Black be any different? They're all EC!
And how does faith fit into the whole thing?
[If I don't ask someone else is bound to! ;) ]
Its not that simple Esoito, when most people think of an even chance. what's the first thing that comes to mind? RED AND BLACK of course. And still this game remains unbeatable in the maintstream concious.
Going by the results I have The Pattern breaker concept was born on HIGH and LOW and shall remain there.
Faith belief confidence all the same thing to me Esoito, not to be taken in a biblical context. Although I already know we have some HOLY GRAILS in our midst.
Its a given to me already that played HIT AND RUN PATTERN 4 will take any live wheel anywhere on the planet. Can one man start something that snowballs into a phenomenon and draws mainstream attention. Ill find out in 300 days. PATTERN 4, DIVIDE AND CONQUER AND MATRIX VERTICAL 5 are going to leave an impression on some of the most high profile casinos on the planet over the next 3 years.
What happens in Europe will be phase 1.
Damn Ive missed this Thread :xd:
John talk to me about Phase 1 !!!
Quote from: Twisteruk on May 23, 11:17 AM 2011
Darn I've missed this Thread :xd:
John talk to me about Phase 1 !!!
Good to see you on here Paul, I will Pm you later just going to get some food.
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 23, 12:18 PM 2011
Good to see you on here Paul, I will Pm you later just going to get some food.
OK mate ;D
Ive missed so much of this Thread lol
Have you dropped any other bombs !?!?
These are my sessons BM.LEVEL 1 AND LEVEL 2 PROGRESSION
P4 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3
+1 +2 +3 +4 +5 +6 +7 +8 +9 that's 54 spins session1
+1 +2 +3 +4 +5 +6 +7 +8 +9 session2
+1 +2 +3 +4 +5 +6 +7 +8 +9 session3
+1 +2 +3 +4 +5 +6 +7 -7 +1 session 4 did not progress here was happy with 1 unit
+1 +2 +3 +4 +5 +6 ended my session got hungry.session 5
+1 +2 +3 +4 +5 +6 +7 +8 +9 day 6
+1 +2 +3 +4 -7 +0 +1 +2 +3 day7
+1 -7-3 +0 +1 +2 +3 +4 +5 day8
+1 +2 +3 +4 -7 +0 -7 -4 -7 day 9 not so good
+1 +2 +3 +4 -7 +0 +1 +2 -5 day10
+1 +2 +3 +4 +5 +6 +7 +8 +9 day 11
+1 +2 +3 +4 +5 +6 +7 +8 +1 lost on my last 3 bets still 1 unit profit.day 12
+1 +2 +3 -4 -1 +0 +1 +2 +3 day 10 there you have some of my session, when I do another 12 day trip i will post more of my session.W
Hi Warrior;
Thank You for the explanation. It is really appreciated.
It is an interesting idea for sure. Will have to try it out.
Thanks again. . . . . . . .
iggy
Hi everyone! Thank you so much for the excellent Johnlegend sistems and of course the creators of this forum. Guys, I have access only to the 0 / 00 roulette, I wanted to ask is working pattern 4 with 00 roulette? Thanks.
You can but be very careful not to stay on the table too long. I played the other night on a 0/00 wheel. the zero's hit 6 times in 33 spins. you have to keep starting over or you lose when that happens very frustrating.
cd
The energy uses the shortest way and smallest amount of energy to get from point A to point B. Copy! Bet it on Baccarat, craps or SicBo.
Hermes
p4 recorded results live single zero paddypower live wheel ,
played quite a few games lately hit an run style one or two wins a time
prog 1,2,4-level one 3,6,12-level two
81 win - 6 losses half recovery/3pts on loss
81pts won
3pts x 6 = 18pts recovered
99pts won - 6 x 4pts not recovered (24pts) = +75pts
Is this right?
llh
hhh
hhh
llh loss no bet
Now i've done this a couple of time this is surly an example of how you can read the games patterns an use it to your advantage. i just had that pattern above
my logic was telling me 6 H in the middle rows low is coming next two spins low low then high, i dodged it like david haye dodges punches
Thanks Clothdog! Can i play if appear that situation
HLH
H0L
LLL
No. If a zero comes in, you must start a new pattern as I understand it.
cd
strato,
I had this the other night
HHL
LHH
HHH
HHH-W...SEE THERE WERE 8 H'S IN A ROW OR ONLY 3 L'S IN 15 SPINS :o...I played continous
HLH
LHL
L-W....AND STOP
CD
i see what you mean now,, played consecutively your more prone to hitting into that formation
when its on a streak its time to pull out for 20 mins else your more likely bump into the loss , i have seen about 20 highs in a row before but only once so the law is on my side there really!!
I've never play 0/00 wheel before
Hello everyone and especially Twisteruk!!! Welcome back!
Had some food for thought, hopefully will help PATTERN 4
Due to PATTERN 4's 12/1 strikerate and very rare double losses I thought it might be an idea to play with 5 stages.. If you lose at stage 1 you go to stage 2 and play there until you are even again or above then go back to stage 1. Or lose at stage 1 then 2 then 3 (most rare case has not been seen yet) and then go back to stage 1 when you are even or above. . The stages I have developed only need 4 wins to get you back to even but will actually leave you 4 units in the plus at stage 3,4,5
STAGE 1 1-2-4 TOTAL -7
STAGE 2 2-4-8 TOTAL -21 4 WINS AT THIS STAGE AND YOU HAVE +1 UNIT
STAGE 3 5-10-20 TOTAL -36 5 WINS AT THIS STAGE AND YOU HAVE + 4 UNITS
STAGE 4 10-20-40 TOTAL -106 4 WINS AT THIS STAGE AND YOU HAVE +4 UNITS
STAGE 5 30-60-120 TOTAL -316 4 WINS AT THIS STAGE AND YOU HAVE +4 UNITS
I think using this "STAGE PLAY" it is impossible to ever lose. From the data we have at this point of PATTERN 4 you will always have a 4 win streak somewhere in these 5 stages....
Any thoughts...
Quote from: amk on May 24, 08:38 AM 2011
Hello everyone and especially Twisteruk!!! Welcome back!
Thanx mate :)
it's good to hear you feel better Twister
your be back on form soon .. just think of that trip to vegas with fender!!
Quote from: strato1985 on May 24, 08:57 AM 2011
It's good to hear you feel better Twister
your be back on form soon .. just think of that trip to vegas with fender!!
Yes indeed !
That is something to look forward too ;D
Hope we all fly Virgin as they fly direct to lost wages :xd:
haha lost wages ,,, never heard that before !! classic
I think the whole forum members should just meet for a beer out there, i've never been but i will go next year as the profits are rising very steadily now ;-)
I may even go sooner . I'm more of a counrty cottage man myself than a dessert donkey, but i wouldn't turn my nose up to a few dollar notes!
Quote from: strato1985 on May 24, 08:57 AM 2011
It's good to hear you feel better Twister
your be back on form soon .. just think of that trip to vegas with fender!!
First Twister and me will conquer Monte Carlo. >:( ;D :( 8) :o
Quote from: warrior on May 23, 09:54 AM 2011
While playing P4 the last 12 trips at BM,were very good while waiting for the 20 spins to take its coarse, I was paying attention to the gaps, what I mean by that is what happens at a 10 spin interval betting the pattern wont repeat,then 9 spins and so on ,very good results ,so I began to play in this fashion.the gaps were as follows
we always begin with P4 on a win we let one spin pass this will be our next number to track For the next10 spins and you do this for the next 54 spins a total of 9 bets will be placed .
now for the code, you starT P4 we win, next let 1 spin go by we wait for 10 spins lets say its 5 12 36 3 25 13 12 35 23 10 ,we bet against the 5 12 36 ok.i will write down the numbers that I use,
P4
10 SPINS
9
8
7
6
5
4
3 HERE WE STOP we bet we win, immediatly we look at 9 spins back and start to bet at P4 AGAIN. progression same as John LEVEL1- 1 2 4
LEVEL 2 - 3 6 12
a-7 will come when your betting like this because your betting 9 times in 54 spins verses every 20 spins that's normal, 2 in row is rare have not seen yet played real 11 games results were really nice this is still new have no clue as far as many spin trial as playing was done in real mode in BM.everyone s thoughts are welcome WARRIOR.
one more thing,if you lose to a -7 let 1 spin go by a continue to the the next number and wait for your next betting oppurtunity ,if you incounter a any 0 is ingnored ,when your on the attack its considered a loss.
this just keeps on WINNING.
Quote from: strato1985 on May 24, 09:49 AM 2011
Haha lost wages ,,, never heard that before !! classic
I think the whole forum members should just meet for a beer out there, i've never been but I will go next year as the profits are rising very steadily now ;-)
I may even go sooner . I'm more of a counrty cottage man myself than a dessert donkey, but I wouldn't turn my nose up to a few dollar notes!
lol yeah I know its a good one huh ?
I was flyin from San Fran to Vegas and as we desended the pilot said, " we are now on our decent to lost wages"
lol
the whole plane went quiet for about a second then there was laughter everywhere :D
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 24, 10:53 AM 2011
First Twister and me will conquer Monte Carlo. >:( ;D :( 8) :o
Ah, never been there. Ive always gone West on my travels mainly lol, but sounds like a plan mate :thumbsup:
Who else is comin ?
I would love to be there and watch history in the making!!
Twistter, when you played at BV you logged out after every game. When you returned did you then only wait a few spins and start PATTERN 4 again ie no 20 spins inbetween?
When you log in and out the numbers from your last game are gone. In essence this is like walking from wheel to wheel but ofcourse it is RNG. I have been doing this and had a nice winning streak of 26. Everytime I login again I change between 3 to 8 spins free spins and then start PATTERN 4.
Was this your approach?
i'll remember that one twister!!
Invitation only twister
I can understand it would be impractical for loads of us to be following and crowding around the table fenders on.
amk has shown interest an I would love to meet up with you all in vegas for a beer, It would be good if the likes of
Stackbundles, scooby, xxvv, amk an any others who would join in, an just meet for a couple of beers in vegas next year
It's good to hear you more positive an cheerful today twister
Quote from: amk on May 24, 12:09 PM 2011
I would love to be there and watch history in the making!!
Twistter, when you played at BV you logged out after every game. When you returned did you then only wait a few spins and start PATTERN 4 again ie no 20 spins inbetween?
When you log in and out the numbers from your last game are gone. In essence this is like walking from wheel to wheel but ofcourse it is RNG. I have been doing this and had a nice winning streak of 26. Everytime I login again I change between 3 to 8 spins free spins and then start PATTERN 4.
Was this your approach?
Hi mate
I logged out after each winning session then logged back in, did the spins and started playing again straight away
With BV, so they say, they have a new checksum with each new batch of numbers.
I have tested BV and concluded that they were most likely the best RNG out there but Im playin Real Wheel now. Not right now but when I resume I will be.
At the moment Im just playing with Vics Tipping Tool while I rest in bed
Quote from: strato1985 on May 24, 12:29 PM 2011
I'll remember that one twister!!
Invitation only twister
I can understand it would be impractical for loads of us to be following and crowding around the table fenders on.
amk has shown interest an I would love to meet up with you all in vegas for a beer, It would be good if the likes of
Stackbundles, scooby, xxvv, amk an any others who would join in, an just meet for a couple of beers in vegas next year
It's good to hear you more positive an cheerful today twister
Ah ok :thumbsup:
Yes Vegas is Awesome so next year if we all meet up that would be brilliant !
Yeah today is a good day. Ive stayed in bed all day and slept mostly apart from test Vics Tipping Tool ;D
I just wanna get back to 100% but I know my body is gonna take time, I get tired real easy
Anyhoo enough about that, lets think of next Spring ? Summer in Vegas !!!
April/May in Vegas would be lovely ;D
I will fly with Virgin, cant be doin with goin Indirect !
That's what i'm talking about!!! holiday in vegas
It's not really the sort of holiday you can take the misses on she'd be bored stiff!!
virgin first class all the way!!
Quote from: Twisteruk on May 24, 11:43 AM 2011
Ah, never been there. I've always gone West on my travels mainly LoL, but sounds like a plan mate :thumbsup:
Who else is comin ?
We will see Paul, Im offering to cover expenses for three people. I dont know if Atlantis lives in the U.S or UK. I read an article this morning about a man called Don Johnson who wiped out some casinos in Atlantic city with blackjack. You never hear of anyone doing any real damage with Roulette, thats going to change. 8)
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 25, 01:27 AM 2011
We will see Paul, I'm offering to cover expenses for three people. I don't know if Atlantis lives in the U.S or UK. I read an article this morning about a man called Don Johnson who wiped out some casinos in Atlantic city with blackjack. You never hear of anyone doing any real damage with Roulette, that's going to change. 8)
Have u ever considered Macau? 4 times the volume of Vegas strip. Recently a new casino opened worth 1.9 Bln with 400+ tables. U could do some serious damage there. :)
London to Honkong and then by ferry 2 Macau. ;D
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 25, 01:27 AM 2011
We will see Paul, I'm offering to cover expenses for three people. I don't know if Atlantis lives in the U.S or UK. I read an article this morning about a man called Don Johnson who wiped out some casinos in Atlantic city with blackjack. You never hear of anyone doing any real damage with Roulette, that's going to change. 8)
WooHoo !
I hadnt read the small print :D
I dont know either if Alantis is UK or US
Do you remember the film Predator ? When that black guy (cant remember his name) opens up with that machine gun that fires like a billion rounds a second ?
That will be us on the Roulette Tables, destruction EVERYWHERE !!! :xd: :twisted: :lol:
Hello JohnLegend,
Macau sounds very interesting.....
I had a question. From your data what is the shortest gap you have seen between wins.. ie between games not including a double loss
Example: 2 wins in a row followed by 1 win followed by 3 wins in a row
How many times have you seen very short winning sessions under 4 consecutive wins back to back?
For the method of play I am working on I only need 1 session of 4 consecutive wins during a 4 stage progression
1. Johnlegend thanks for great sistem! Are there any guys from usa who always win with this system in the 0 / 00 roulette. Please reply.
"Do you remember the film Predator ? When that black guy (can't remember his name) opens up with that machine gun that fires like a billion rounds a second ?"
Hi Twister
Nice to see you're doing well
Carl Weathers was the guy in the film.....and that was what I call a "GUN" lol
I'm definitely up for an assault on the Casino's (Expenses paid or not)
Pattern 4 is awesome and I don't no why, but with my testing Hi & Lo seems to be winning by a long shot............sometimes people say it makes no difference as there all 50/50 odds but then again proof is always in the testing ;D
Gordon ;D
Quote from: Gordonline on May 25, 07:50 AM 2011
"Do you remember the film Predator ? When that black guy (can't remember his name) opens up with that machine gun that fires like a billion rounds a second ?"
Hi Twister
Nice to see you're doing well
Carl Weathers was the guy in the film.....and that was what I call a "GUN" LoL
I'm definitely up for an assault on the Casino's (Expenses paid or not)
Pattern 4 is awesome and I don't no why, but with my testing Hi & Lo seems to be winning by a long shot............sometimes people say it makes no difference as there all 50/50 odds but then again proof is always in the testing ;D
Gordon ;D
Hell Yeah !!! :twisted: :xd: :D
Quote from: Gordonline on May 25, 07:50 AM 2011
"Do you remember the film Predator ? When that black guy (can't remember his name) opens up with that machine gun that fires like a billion rounds a second ?"
Hi Twister
Nice to see you're doing well
Carl Weathers was the guy in the film.....and that was what I call a "GUN" LoL
I'm definitely up for an assault on the Casino's (Expenses paid or not)
Pattern 4 is awesome and I don't no why, but with my testing Hi & Lo seems to be winning by a long shot............sometimes people say it makes no difference as there all 50/50 odds but then again proof is always in the testing ;D
Gordon ;D
-------------------
"Carl Weathers was the guy in the film.....and that was what I call a "GUN" LoL"
and he called it "O'l painless" or something to that effect :twisted: :twisted:
vundarosa
M
Quote from: Twisteruk on May 25, 03:08 AM 2011
WooHoo !
I hadnt read the small print :D
I don't know either if Alantis is UK or US
Do you remember the film Predator ? When that black guy (can't remember his name) opens up with that machine gun that fires like a billion rounds a second ?
That will be us on the Roulette Tables, destruction EVERYWHERE !!! :xd: :twisted: :LoL:
Ahh, PREDATOR thats one of my alltime fave movies best thing Arnie ever did in my opinion. Yes I know that bit, in our case itll be, all I know is we hit them with every method we had no casino on earth couldve survived lol. :ooh:
Quote from: vundarosa on May 25, 08:46 AM 2011
-------------------
"Carl Weathers was the guy in the film.....and that was what I call a "GUN" LoL"
and he called it "O'l painless" or something to that effect :twisted: :twisted:
vundarosa
get well sooon twister, there is shoot out ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D,hell of a gun :o :o :o
Quote from: Gordonline on May 25, 07:50 AM 2011
"Do you remember the film Predator ? When that black guy (can't remember his name) opens up with that machine gun that fires like a billion rounds a second ?"
Hi Twister
Nice to see you're doing well
Carl Weathers was the guy in the film.....and that was what I call a "GUN" LoL
I'm definitely up for an assault on the Casino's (Expenses paid or not)
Pattern 4 is awesome and I don't no why, but with my testing Hi & Lo seems to be winning by a long shot............sometimes people say it makes no difference as there all 50/50 odds but then again proof is always in the testing ;D
Gordon ;D
Gordon Absolutely, an even chance is an even chance. But I've found HIGH and LOW out performs READ AND BLACK. When ever I've been to a casino people pile stacks on red and black so much sometimes that it looks like NEW YORK City. Its never like that for HIGH AND LOW.
And the game remains unbroken in the minds of the masses. Its time to RATTLE THE CAGE,'that phrase comes from another one of my fave movies. Pattern 4 has the game broken people its TIME we stop looking and start building BR's. I'm taking some serious fire power to Europe, then well see where phase2 will happen. Macau sounds good. PHASE 3 changes the history of this game. So theres only one place that can be. LOST WAGES.
Hello JohnLegend!
I know its time to stop looking for any additions to PATTERN 4....
Been playing on BV and works like magic. 84 games, One double loss, two winning streaks of 26.
I just wanted to see what the shortest winning streak is back to back and perhaps to back that youve seen? 3-2-4 or 4-3-1 etc
I will continue to follow the yellow brick road...
Quote from: amk on May 25, 09:58 AM 2011
Hello JohnLegend!
I know its time to stop looking for any additions to PATTERN 4....
Been playing on BV and works like magic. 84 games, One double loss, two winning streaks of 26.
I just wanted to see what the shortest winning streak is back to back and perhaps to back that youve seen? 3-2-4 or 4-3-1 etc
I will continue to follow the yellow brick road...
are you playing BV RNG surely that is dangerous if you are
Hello John,
I'm planning on the casino saturday. My wife and I..anniversary..dinner and gambling!
Your suggestion please: tracking 9 spins- win..leave table and go to other table or wait for X number of spins to go by and play again. or if lose, stay at same table till win and then leave or go to other table. thanks! :thumbsup:
CD
From what i can see there's been so many twists, turns, suggestions, additions, subtractions, ideas and everything else into this method and pretty much all of youre other methods john (which isnt you're fault) thats its BLOODY HARD to work out how to play this the best way :(
Quote from: Fraudster on May 25, 10:20 AM 2011
From what I can see there's been so many twists, turns, suggestions, additions, subtractions, ideas and everything else into this method and pretty much all of youre other methods john (which isnt you're fault) that's its BLOODY HARD to work out how to play this the best way :(
i do not get what the missconception is.
Every rule to play pattern 4 is here in this thread well explained and revised
basically track 9 spins of the even chance of your choice then at spin 10 start bet aginst spin 1 outcome until win.
the progression mostly extensevly tested by XXVV was 1-3-7
Cheers
Quote from: amk on May 25, 09:58 AM 2011
Hello JohnLegend!
I know its time to stop looking for any additions to PATTERN 4....
Been playing on BV and works like magic. 84 games, One double loss, two winning streaks of 26.
I just wanted to see what the shortest winning streak is back to back and perhaps to back that youve seen? 3-2-4 or 4-3-1 etc
I will continue to follow the yellow brick road...
Hi AMK, well the shortest streak will be a double loss. From time to time I get two losses inside six games. But my extreme belief in this method has been cemented by two observations. A, the lack of double losses. And B, the constant formation of winning streaks in excess of 10. More impressive still the winning streaks for the first game of the day. I'm now 33/0 for HIGH AND LOW.
The clincher for me is I can note wins and losses in my mind and stay under the radar until I decide I want to announce, the days when this game was thought unbeatable are numbered.
PATTERN 4 has revealed itself as the ultimate B & M method to me, I'm counting down the days to MARCH 1ST 2012. By the close of 2012
The thinking on this game will have changed for many. I want it to be known that this forum was where it all took off.
Its simply a method that cannot show negative numbers when managed properly. Its not as invincible as MV5 but its turnover is locked and certain inside a given timeframe.
Hey JL :)
I was wondering if you could give another write up for the rules ? Reason bein this Thread is over 20 pages long and newcomers may be put off reading all the way through it
Plus it would be good for them to see how you "manage" the system too !
What you think mate ? O0
Quote from: Twisteruk on May 25, 12:00 PM 2011
Hey JL :)
I was wondering if you could give another write up for the rules ? Reason bein this Thread is over 20 pages long and newcomers may be put off reading all the way through it
Plus it would be good for them to see how you "manage" the system too !
ti
What you think mate ? O0
That is an excellent idea Twister, After dinner I will give the definitive rules.
pattern 4
100 wins - 8 losses.... no double loss ... AS OF YET!!
I agree true B&M basher, this wkend bristol I'll try
I have never played a method with such a conservative progression, that can turn 100 wins from 108 games
I still like playing pattern breaker at the same time, i'll post results when i get a reasonable amount of live stats
Hi All
I'm currently going through 3300+ spins methodically, all "Live Wheel Sessions" I started recording them back end of last year and so far I'm 2500 spins down the excel sheet and have only experienced one loss on the first bet session, and only one double loss (Hi & Lo)
So far, very powerful stats, ;D ;D
Hopefully I will be able to finish and post my results by end of play tonight
Gordon
Quote from: strato1985 on May 25, 01:08 PM 2011
Pattern 4
100 wins - 8 losses.... no double loss ... AS OF YET!!
I agree true B&M basher, this wkend bristol I'll try
I have never played a method with such a conservative progression, that can turn 100 wins from 108 games
I still like playing pattern breaker at the same time, i'll post results when I get a reasonable amount of live stats
I am playing pattern breaker simultaneously too strategy, it makes sense. Your numbers are mirroring mine. My strikerate is holding around 12/1 overall hit and run style. But its the scarceness of double losses that validates PATTERN 4 A roulette killer.
In years gone by youd always hear people say "YEAH BUT WHEN THE INEVITABLE DOWNTURN STARTS, ALL PREVIOUSLY ACCUMULATED PROFITS WILL BE WIPED OUT".
That notion implies to me that their method wasn't strong to start with. CONSISTENCY is the first thing you should seek in a good method. Once you have it, this will translate to any table in the world without exception.
THE DEFINITIVE RULES
1, Record spins for HIGH AND LOW until you have 9 in three rows of three Example
H H H
H L L
H L H
2, You now over the next three spins bet the first pattern wlll not repeat as the FOURTH PATTERN. So in this example you will bet that H H H doesn't form.
3, Using a THREE STEP PROGRESSION you bet 1-3 times against that first pattern. So here are three examples of three winning games.
L L L-WIN BET 1
H L H-WIN BET 2
H H L-WIN BET 3
4, I use a multi level three step progression. as follows
1,2,4 LEVEL 1
3,6,12 LEVEL 2 (STARTING GAME EACH DAY)
12,24,48 LEVEL 3
I always start the first game at level 2 then drop down to level 1 for four more games. Level 3 only comes into play if I suffer a double loss. Or if I lose the first game of the day.
I have NEVER lost the FIRST TWO GAMES of the day. And even losing the first game is uncommon. Im currently on a streak of 33 wins.
Now how much you stake depends on your bankroll.
5, This method is to be played RANDOMLY HIT AND RUN STYLE. My first game might be 6,00 am in the morning, and my last 8,00 pm at night. The only time I play consecutively IS DIRECTLY AFTER A LOSS. Now in case some of you are unsure what I mean by consecutively heres an example.
H H H
H L L
L L L
H H H-LOST GAME
H L L
H L H
L H H-WON BET ONE
6, Maintain PATIENCE, this method will break any wheel out there. I'm concious that many might be dumbfounded, that a method this basic could really be ROULETTES UNDOING. Well I can tell you, it WILL BE.
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 25, 09:41 AM 2011
Gordon Absolutely, an even chance is an even chance. But I've found HIGH and LOW out performs READ AND BLACK. When ever I've been to a casino people pile stacks on red and black so much sometimes that it looks like NEW YORK City. Its never like that for HIGH AND LOW.
And the game remains unbroken in the minds of the masses. Its time to RATTLE THE CAGE,'that phrase comes from another one of my fave movies. Pattern 4 has the game broken people its TIME we stop looking and start building BR's. I'm taking some serious fire power to Europe, then well see where phase2 will happen. Macau sounds good. PHASE 3 changes the history of this game. So theres only one place that can be. LOST WAGES.
WHATS PHASE 3?
John if you win so often why not play it FLAT instead if the deadly Marty 1-3-7?
With Bermuda Triangle I didn't lose a game. I use it on Baccarat table.
Hermes
The progression wins 97.3 times out of every hundred.
"1,2,4 LEVEL 1
3,6,12 LEVEL 2 (STARTING GAME EACH DAY)
12,24,48 LEVEL 3
I always start the first game at level 2 then drop down to level 1 for four more games. Level 3 only comes into play if I suffer a double loss. Or if I lose the first game of the day.
I have NEVER lost the FIRST TWO GAMES of the day. And even losing the first game is uncommon. I'm currently on a streak of 33 wins."
Hi PB4 Fans
Here goes for my longest post on this excellent forum and strategy
As promised, I have finished meticulously going through my 3332 Spins, (which are made up from 45 Live Wheel Sessions from last 6 months of playing)
Using JL's Level 1,2,3 progression and always starting at L2 here are my results........
There were 307 games available to bet and I tested by recording the first 9 spins then started betting on spins 10,11,12 of course stopping at first win, but if a loss occured on the first game jump to Level 3 for 2 games to achieve +3
Out of the 307 games, there were 155 wins on the first bet, 29 single losses followed by at least 1 win, and 2 double losses mid way through a betting session (see below)
Amongst the 29 single losses, 4 of those happened on the first game, but each time they were followed by 2 winning games to achieve +3 units
The 2 double losses (ref above) both happened after the initial (L2 win +3) and then 2 (L1 wins +1), but on the 4th L1 bet a loss occured of -7, so jumped to L3 (12,24,48) for recovery but sustained a double loss which is -84, strange how the 2 doubles happened at the same sequences of betting (Its a funny old game at times) ;D
Now for the good bit, +125 units overall, and out of interest I checked the results using just one level of betting (1,3,7) and took the loss of -11 if and when it came and this resulted in an overall balance of +83, which if you preferred a more conservative method still works
I will endeavour to compare the Red/Black and Odd/Even when I get time
Need to ask you John, about our Green Genie friend, do you always wait for 9 cosecutive spins without the zero before starting your first session or do we treat it the same as Pattern Breaker where we ignore the 3 spins it sits in, for example
HHL
LHL
0HH (Ignore these spins)
HHH
LLL (First bet on Spin 13-16)
This is how I was testing it just so you know, and also if I was midway between games I ignored the 3 spins where the zero appeared and if it happened twice or more so be it
I know this will be down to personal preference but its worth mentioning so we all try and sing from the same hymn sheet
My suggestion in treating our Green Genie friend is this........as it sits between 26 & 32 (Single Zero European Wheel) why not treat it as a High number, this way we make our game a little easier and at the end of the day we are still betting on an even chance, also if this is the future we are more than likely going to be betting rather high stakes so it would be prudent to be covering it anyway (5% Insurance bet)
I'm open to suggestions on this John :-\
Sorry for the long post, hope it all makes sense and look forward to any comments, its time for me to knock out some ZZZZZZZ's :yawn:
Kind Regards
Gordon ;D
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 25, 02:11 PM 2011
I am playing pattern breaker simultaneously too strategy, it makes sense. Your numbers are mirroring mine. My strikerate is holding around 12/1 overall hit and run style. But its the scarceness of double losses that validates PATTERN 4 A roulette killer.
In years gone by youd always hear people say "YEAH BUT WHEN THE INEVITABLE DOWNTURN STARTS, ALL PREVIOUSLY ACCUMULATED PROFITS WILL BE WIPED OUT".
That notion implies to me that their method wasn't strong to start with. CONSISTENCY is the first thing you should seek in a good method. Once you have it, this will translate to any table in the world without exception.
THE DEFINITIVE RULES
1, Record spins for HIGH AND LOW until you have 9 in three rows of three Example
H H H
H L L
H L H
2, You now over the next three spins bet the first pattern wlll not repeat as the FOURTH PATTERN. So in this example you will bet that H H H doesn't form.
3, Using a THREE STEP PROGRESSION you bet 1-3 times against that first pattern. So here are three examples of three winning games.
L L L-WIN BET 1
H L H-WIN BET 2
H H L-WIN BET 3
4, I use a multi level three step progression. as follows
1,2,4 LEVEL 1
3,6,12 LEVEL 2 (STARTING GAME EACH DAY)
12,24,48 LEVEL 3
I always start the first game at level 2 then drop down to level 1 for four more games. Level 3 only comes into play if I suffer a double loss. Or if I lose the first game of the day.
I have NEVER lost the FIRST TWO GAMES of the day. And even losing the first game is uncommon. I'm currently on a streak of 33 wins.
Now how much you stake depends on your bankroll.
5, This method is to be played RANDOMLY HIT AND RUN STYLE. My first game might be 6,00 am in the morning, and my last 8,00 pm at night. The only time I play consecutively IS DIRECTLY AFTER A LOSS. Now in case some of you are unsure what I mean by consecutively heres an example.
H H H
H L L
L L L
H H H-LOST GAME
H L L
H L H
L H H-WON BET ONE
6, Maintain PATIENCE, this method will break any wheel out there. I'm concious that many might be dumbfounded, that a method this basic could really be ROULETTES UNDOING. Well I can tell you, it WILL BE.
Nice one JL :thumbsup:
Im sure the members will appreciate that :)
Just one point of clarity mate, if ure playin on a Live Wheel how long do you wait after ure win before you resume another hit and run ?
Quote from: Twisteruk on May 26, 03:03 AM 2011
Nice one JL :thumbsup:
I'm sure the members will appreciate that :)
Just one point of clarity mate, if your playing on a Live Wheel how long do you wait after your win before you resume another hit and run ?
This is the thing Twister, theres no set number of spins or time. That part of the method is as random as the game itself. Lets say im in a casino with three tables. I would play three games consecutively one after the other for each table. Take a break then randomly pick a table for my fourth game and another for my fifth. Take the money and go home. One thing youll learn about me if we meet up in Europe is my iron discipline. Im never tempted to play half the nighr like some people. I came to make money not impress anyone.
The only difference next year is the amount I will be taking each day and after a while the casino people will realize im no lucky punter. Thats when the fun and games start.
Especially as I never tip the croupier either. I already get some nasty glances from them and im not winning one fifth a game of what I will be this time next year. So in the meantime we should all be building impregnable BANKROLLS. History is in the making next year, when the Olympic games come to London Ill be in Europe winning some gold of my own, and more importantly planting the seeds of doubt. In the minds of the casino boys. The belief in this games invincibility will be tarnished with each passing month. Until it starts to settle in peoples minds.
I always keep in mind most people have sheep mentality. They dont believe something is possible until they see it done over and over. T
So Play HIT AND RUN RANDOMLY PEOPLE. Your objective is to build a very powerful financial fortress example Two players play PATTERN 4. One risks 25% of his TOTAL BANKROLL on a game. The other risks 2.5% on a game.
Who would you be more concerned for? Im the latter in that example and so should everyone be.
Thanks again JohnLegend for taking the time to explain and to Gordonline for the great stats, this forum has a good flow...
Gordonline you mentioned that each time you had a single loss it was always followed by at least one win. How many times did this occur, just one win? If you have the time and don't mind looking up, how many times did 2,3 and 4 wins happen directly after a single loss?
Also, after a double loss how many wins did you record until your next single loss?
JohnLegend might you have this stat for double losses as well?
Great news people
Gord that's good stats, i'm stats are as I play now
111 games won
10 games lost no double loss yet
just as john said about playing double stakes first game,,,, I hit my first loss on the first game
so that's scared me off that for a moment even though that is the first time its happened in 100 games!!! statistically it work
Its becoming a game with positive expectancy!!!
Update thats two losses on the first game won on the second step, like busses they are.
John - as the name implies - LEGEND!!!
Really excited about this. Been testing, and just put a bit of my own spice to it, but if you stick to the basics it works like a charm - EVERY TIME!!!
I play it
XXX - count 6 spins then play against XXX to form again. I don't even bother with the 6 spins in between. Even if a 0 falls in those six, I just count it as a spin.
Then I switch between HL & OE.... play 15 games consecutive but change between those.
After every 5 games I double up the progression - 1,3,7 - 5 games - 2,6,14 - 5 games 4,12,28 5 games and that's it. So far with the units I play, only 1 hour per day... I bring home 1/2 my salary!!!
KICK ASS SYSTEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Love it love it love it!!!
Well done to JohnLegend for a great system, I have been thinking, what causes the losses and is there any number, street etc that we can additionally bet on (besides the H or L) to convert any of the losses into wins? Any ideas anybody? For example the first and last street of the same H or L not bet on... or the same number of the spin designating the original H or L that we are betting against, in other words how do we try to improve on the pioneer work done by JohnLegend?
Quote from: Maui13 on May 26, 02:20 PM 2011
John - as the name implies - LEGEND!!!
Really excited about this. Been testing, and just put a bit of my own spice to it, but if you stick to the basics it works like a charm - EVERY TIME!!!
I play it
XXX - count 6 spins then play against XXX to form again. I don't even bother with the 6 spins in between. Even if a 0 falls in those six, I just count it as a spin.
Then I switch between HL & OE.... play 15 games consecutive but change between those.
After every 5 games I double up the progression - 1,3,7 - 5 games - 2,6,14 - 5 games 4,12,28 5 games and that's it. So far with the units I play, only 1 hour per day... I bring home 1/2 my salary!!!
KICK arse SYSTEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Love it love it love it!!!
Thanks Maui13 Im no legend I just want to raise awareness among alot of people this game can be beaten. House edge and house limits are hurdles that can be overcome.
You must start believing this. And you will become part of the minority who beat this game.
John you say "And even losing the first game is uncommon", john from what I understand the chance of losing the first progression of the day is 1 in 8 on average, so are you beating these odds. I have lost quite a few on the first game recently , but did win second level..
Quote from: amk on May 26, 01:08 PM 2011
Thanks again JohnLegend for taking the time to explain and to Gordonline for the great stats, this forum has a good flow...
Gordonline you mentioned that each time you had a single loss it was always followed by at least one win. How many times did this occur, just one win? If you have the time and don't mind looking up, how many times did 2,3 and 4 wins happen directly after a single loss?
Also, after a double loss how many wins did you record until your next single loss?
JohnLegend might you have this stat for double losses as well?
Hi Amk the lack of double losses is what makes this method a killer. Ive played 430 games now and had 3 double losses. But never the first two games.
Another POWERPOINT of this method is the winning streaks for the first game of the day. I have a 34 day winning streak. How you stake thid method will be up to you. It is capable of making a profit at a single three step progression. But I advocate using at least two levels. They dont have to be steep like the ones in the rules. It could simply be
1,2,4
2,4,8
When youve won several hundred units, you can take more risk with that second level. Its all good.
Quote from: Kingspin on May 26, 04:44 PM 2011
John you say "And even losing the first game is uncommon", john from what I understand the chance of losing the first progression of the day is 1 in 8 on average, so are you beating these odds.
Beating that number is an understatement Kingspin. From the sample I have thus far 430 real play games. The shortest streak I have is 17 and theres a winning streak of 36 in there. Im currently on a streak of 34. Europe is PHASE 1. Theyll know by the fall of 2012 that roulette has been well and truly broken. DIVIDE AND CONQUER. And MV5 Will also be employed as will PATTERN BREAKER.
"Thanks again JohnLegend for taking the time to explain and to Gordonline for the great stats, this forum has a good flow...
Gordonline you mentioned that each time you had a single loss it was always followed by at least one win. How many times did this occur, just one win? If you have the time and don't mind looking up, how many times did 2,3 and 4 wins happen directly after a single loss?
Also, after a double loss how many wins did you record until your next single loss?
JohnLegend might you have this stat for double losses as well?"
Hi amk
All the single losses were followed by 4 wins most of the time, and there wasn't a double loss at the beginning of any game, but the 2 occasions where a double loss occurred happened on the 4th and 5th game of a 6 game session.
John also suggests that if you have a single loss you jump to level 3 for 1 game and then end the session
Hope that answers your query :)
Just to add to my stats on those 3300 spins I counted how many of the 8 patterns occurred
HHH 123
LLL 125
HLH 116
LHL 126
HHL 115
LLH 141
HLL 128
LHH 142
There were 78 "3 spin patterns" where the zero occurred
Gordon ;D
I gave this a try rng real money , playing with 10p chips and won 15 chips , then got a back to back loss wiped me out! The rng hammered it :(
Quote from: Kingspin on May 26, 07:51 PM 2011
I gave this a try rng real money , playing with 10p chips and won 15 chips , then got a back to back loss wiped me out! The rng hammered it :(
Kingspin you know by now RNGS are not roulette. Play REAL wheels only for REAL results not a manmade scam.
Yes I know john , to be honest this was just a test to see how much I could hammer rng real play with. 15 chips PROFIT would be pretty good going before a double loss happens which without doubt it will on rng. I played progression 1 2 4 mostly with a few games 1 3 7.
Rng can switch in loosing bets at will so be warned any one trying rng..
For what I recon now, half of the hype around this system is made by the creator. there were better systems here that remained untested. This bet as many flaws to succeed.
John Legend I recognize you have good ideas and maybe you're an expertise on roulette so please do not deny this and try to improve it.
Despite your lack of interest in this, as I think you're a bit delighted by luck, I am sharing some points of view:
you bet for an EC wich pays 1:1
however your progression on all 3 stages risks 6:1 like 7 units ti conquer one.
imagine you would play for a dozen
with simple progression 1234 wich pays2:1
you would only risk a 5:1 ratio on the progression.
Food for thought.
Also would like to see here some real tests.
Just one from my two cents.
Best Regards
Quote from: Kingspin on May 25, 05:03 PM 2011
The progression wins 97.3 times out of every hundred.
How did you arrive to those numbers?
I don't think it's any where near 97.3 that was a mistake . I am not an expert on mathmatics
but after thinking about it the chances of losing the first 3 bets (level 1) would be approx 1 in 8.
The chances of losing level 1 and level 2 probably double this at 1 in 16 approx. Does this sound right!
That 6 12 24 starting progression I would avoid like the plague, that's my own personal opinion though. I just think it could be hard work recovering on a level 1 loss probably quite a long time playing to recover. On real wheels though I am sure it would give longer winning streaks than rng..
I recently won lots with this method and then lost a bucket full on high stakes . John i would not play big stakes when you attack your casino's !
Quote from: Kingspin on May 26, 08:27 PM 2011
I don't think it's any where near 97.3 that was a mistake . I am not an expert on mathmatics
but after thinking about it the chances of losing the first 3 bets (level 1) would be approx 1 in 8.
The chances of losing level 1 and level 2 probably double this at 1 in 16 approx. Does this sound right!
That 6 12 24 starting progression I would avoid like the plague, that's my own personal opinion though. I just think it could be hard work recovering on a level 1 loss probably quite a long time playing to recover. On real wheels though I am sure it would give longer winning streaks than rng..
I recently won lots with this method and then lost a bucket full on high stakes . John I would not play big stakes when you attack your casino's !
fresh example from earlier today...Paddy Power Casino
If anyone doubts on these spins just go check em out from the casino :yawn:
Quote from: Kingspin on May 26, 08:27 PM 2011
I don't think it's any where near 97.3 that was a mistake . I am not an expert on mathmatics
but after thinking about it the chances of losing the first 3 bets (level 1) would be approx 1 in 8.
The chances of losing level 1 and level 2 probably double this at 1 in 16 approx. Does this sound right!
That 6 12 24 starting progression I would avoid like the plague, that's my own personal opinion though. I just think it could be hard work recovering on a level 1 loss probably quite a long time playing to recover. On real wheels though I am sure it would give longer winning streaks than rng..
I recently won lots with this method and then lost a bucket full on high stakes . John I would not play big stakes when you attack your casino's !
Kingspin all the classic doubts and climb downs are being aired by you and Albertojonas. that's good. But who advocates running before you can walk?
The classic mistake made by every player is to move up too quickly. I will indeed be playing for higher stakes next year. But its all relative. You don't risk 42 units if your bankroll is only 200.
It should be at least 1,000 good moneymanagement is crucial to suceed with any method. Also playing hit and run is what makes the difference with strikerate. I know already few people have anywhere near the patience to do this properly.
It defies probability, on paper yes, you should be getting around 7 wins to every loss were you to play as casinos want you to play. LIVE allnight ON THE WHEEL.
Play HIT AND RUN,'its a different animal of course you get two losses close to eachother. But once you're locked into a winning streak. that's when you push beyond all expectations. And you build the most important element of it all, YOUR BANKROLL.
The human mind is the weak link always. I'm now so far ahead with this method 20 losses in a row couldnt wipe out my profits. We have a roulette killer here. If you take my advice you are going to show positive results.
I know that people always bend somewhere. don't! Three double losses in 430 games is phenomenal. Another member is yet to even find a double loss. HIT AND RUN.
Thats how you play this method nothing else. One other point I want to make clear several of my losses were caused by the ZERO. I accept that as I know the method is dealing with house edge and STILL yielding positive results.
For TURNOVER, POTENTIAL STRIKERATE and RISK. This method is hard to beat. Other methods that can compare and surpass its results will require a small fortune to run.
Stay on track.
Has no one perhaps coded this for online live wheels???
JohnLegend,
When the zero appears during your bet sequence for PATTERN 4 (not as last bet) I assume you continue betting and accept that the zero either represents an H or L
Example:
HLL
LHL
HHL
....... betting against HLL (LHH)
First H appears, then the ZERO, now continue the bet sequence and bet against L...
Also, you mention that the only time you bet continually is after a loss this I assume is also the case for a double loss or do you pull out and go to another wheel?
to albertojonas, reply #348, on your real live session, as far as i can tell using this method, you should've bet H on Spin 49, not L (H being the opposite of spin 40, an L) & therefore won.. so you would've gone to -6 at that point, & not moved to -30.
Quote from: monaco on May 27, 09:19 AM 2011
To albertojonas, reply #348, on your real live session, as far as I can tell using this method, you should've bet H on Spin 49, not L (H being the opposite of spin 40, an L) & therefore won.. so you would've gone to -6 at that point, & not moved to -30.
yes its true, Monaco , thx. But what if?
Pattern 4 results live play
120 wins - 10 losses . No double loss yet
I'm writing this down as I play it an win it. this way you can monitor my progress an it kinda helps me out too..
we could sit an dwell on what if's all day .. these bad losses probably do exist somewhere on records.
The real question is how often does it happen??
My view damage limitation if you get caught up in one, i'e wait a while before playing another round / not betting over you BR limit 2.5% of your bankroll is a first class point
Saying that as I looked at it thats back to the 12- 1 !! at first i was at 20-1 but i've played a lot more frequent games, hit an run style . just hitting the wheel more often
Quote from: amk on May 27, 09:14 AM 2011
JohnLegend,
When the zero appears during your bet sequence for PATTERN 4 (not as last bet) I assume you continue betting and accept that the zero either represents an H or L
Example:
HLL
LHL
HHL
....... betting against HLL (LHH)
First H appears, then the ZERO, now continue the bet sequence and bet against L...
Also, you mention that the only time you bet continually is after a loss this I assume is also the case for a double loss or do you pull out and go to another wheel?
Yes treat zero as collateral damage. This is the whole point of my enthusiasm Amk the Zero may be responsible for a loss here and there but overall its ever forward.
Look I realize whenever you talk of progressions people get jittery. The thing is my staking levels are tailored to my BR I suggest newbies stay low. 1,2,4 etc
You have to walk before you can run. Not everybody has what it takes to be a longterm winner with this game. You need to visualize where you want to be 6 months from now. Ill state it clear, theres no more testing debating to be done on my part. Scooby doo, Twister, Atlantis and myself have bestowed four methods on this forum that will beat roulette until the end of time.
Its up to all to realize their power use them, STAY WITH THEM. Until your BANKROLL is so powerful you are winning more than you earn.
Now I will help anyone to master these methods as best I can. What I cannot give you is patience and iron discipline to reach the level where you fully understand the power thats on this forum. And any that can make it to that level have a very bright prosperous future ahead of them.
I had a bit of a hick-up earlier tonight when I wanted to try and make deposits, but managed and in short...here are the results:
HHH
XXX
XXX
LLL +3
HLL
XXX
XXX
HHL +1
HLH
XXX
XXX
LHH bet one would have been won, but internet delay (I live in Africa...yup internet sucs)
Closed and opened different table.
LLH
XXX
XXX
LHH +1
HLH
XXX
XXX
LLL +3
Then before I retired, I decided, just for fun, to throw 1 at RNG (the rest were all LIVE)
HLL
XXX
XXX
HLH + 3
That left me, with + 11 in a short period of time. This was all done at 888Casino. I play progression of 1,3,7
Regards,
Mauricio
I think johns right
thats really good results maul13 my results are similar
i'm not goin to post all my results as i play, i've learnt a valuable lesson in keeping my own results and will do forever more.
my reason being is some will never learn, doubters will be all if's an buts .i will post if anything dramatic happens.
In the meantime i pray for twisters return to health, money is meaningless without health
Quote from: Maui13 on May 27, 04:15 PM 2011
I had a bit of a hick-up earlier tonight when I wanted to try and make deposits, but managed and in short...here are the results:
HHH
XXX
XXX
LLL +3
HLL
XXX
XXX
HHL +1
HLH
XXX
XXX
LHH bet one would have been won, but internet delay (I live in Africa...yup internet sucs)
Closed and opened different table.
LLH
XXX
XXX
LHH +1
HLH
XXX
XXX
LLL +3
Then before I retired, I decided, just for fun, to throw 1 at RNG (the rest were all LIVE)
HLL
XXX
XXX
HLH + 3
That left me, with + 11 in a short period of time. This was all done at 888Casino. I play progression of 1,3,7
Regards,
Mauricio
you can now loose one game but not the first
:thumbsup:
Hi All
Now started playing PB4 for real and have played 2 sessions on 888.com
Last night +3, +1, +1, +1, -7, +6 Game finished +5
Tonight +3, +1, -7, +6 Game finished +3
Even having a single loss both tines still ended in profit, have to be very strict and disciplined as JL says over and over again :thumbsup:
I'm treating Zero as a high number due to it being between 26 & 32, makes recording the outcomes much easier
Gordon ;D
Quote from: Gordonline on May 27, 07:38 PM 2011
Last night +3, +1, +1, +1, -7, +6 Game finished +5
Tonight +3, +1, -7, +6 Game finished +3
Hi Gordon,
What progression are you playing to come back with the +6 after the -7
Regards,
Mauricio
Quote from: strato1985 on May 27, 04:28 PM 2011
I think johns right
that's really good results maul13 my results are similar
i'm not goin to post all my results as I play, i've learnt a valuable lesson in keeping my own results and will do forever more.
my reason being is some will never learn, doubters will be all if's an buts .i will post if anything dramatic happens.
In the meantime I pray for twisters return to health, money is meaningless without health
Thanx mate I appreciate your best wishes
Im currently not playin. I want to and I did a couple of days ago but I just got burnt out, unbelieveable how utterly tired I was
I will check in as often as I can and read your reports
I would just say think about playin this on Baccarat. There it is truly 50/50 and Tie is a Push (money back) ;D
Cheers guys :smile:
:o Had a bit of a crappy session...
H L L
x x x
x x x
L L L -3
x x x
x x x
L L H +3
x x x
x x x
H L L +3
x x x
x x x
H L L -11
Changed tables
Then I tried to recover. Progression was 1,3,7 switched to 2,6,14
L H L
x x x
x x x
L H L - 22
Total units lost = 30
Live tables, 888casino
Did I do something wrong???
Regards,
Mauricio
Quote from: Maui13 on May 28, 06:06 AM 2011
:o Had a bit of a crappy session...
H L L
x x x
x x x
L L L -3
x x x
x x x
L L H +3
x x x
x x x
H L L +3
x x x
x x x
H L L -11
Changed tables
Then I tried to recover. Progression was 1,3,7 switched to 2,6,14
L H L
x x x
x x x
L H L - 22
Total units lost = 30
Live tables, 888casino
Did I do something wrong???
Regards,
Mauricio
I think your doing two things wrong Mauricio. Firstly you don't bet on all 3 spins in a game if you win the first bet as you did with the first game. You should have stopped right there.
Secondly you are playing consecutively. That is not the way I advise. The method thrives from RANDOM HIT AND RUN. Consecutive play is only done after a total losing game. Example of my FIVE GAMES played yesterday.
GAME 1--APPROX 7.30 AM
H H L
X X X
X X X
H L L--Win bet 2 PLUS 4 POINTS
GAME 2--APPROX 9.00 AM
L H L
X X X
X X X
HH L--Win bet 1 PLUS 2 POINTS
GAME 3--APROX 9.30 Different live wheel
H H L
X X X
X X X
L L L--Win bet 1 PLUS 2 POINTS
GAME 4 APPROX 3.OO PM
L H L
X X X
X X X
LH H--Win bet 3 PLUS 2 POINTS
GAME 5 APROX 4.30 PM
L L L
X X X
X X X
0 H L--Win bet 2 PLUS 2 POINTS
This is how I play the method.
Quote from: Maui13 on May 28, 06:06 AM 2011
:o Had a bit of a crappy session...
H L L
x x x
x x x
L L L -3
x x x
x x x
L L H +3
x x x
x x x
H L L +3
x x x
x x x
H L L -11
Changed tables
Then I tried to recover. Progression was 1,3,7 switched to 2,6,14
L H L
x x x
x x x
L H L - 22
Total units lost = 30
Live tables, 888casino
Did I do something wrong???
Regards,
Mauricio
What is the difference? it could happen in different wheals as well. mauricio changed to recover. he intended hit e run. i am sorry for your loss.
I told you so
Quote from: albertojonas on May 28, 07:04 AM 2011
What is the difference? it could happen in different wheals as well. mauricio changed to recover. he intended hit e run. I am sorry for your loss.
I told you so
Mmmm, Albertojonas I'm getting a negative resentful vibe from you. If you don't like me or the method you are not obligated to post on here remember that.
Now Maui13 what you should of done is stayed on that table and played a recovery game STRAIGHT AFTER the losing game. I posted the rules for a reason STICK to them and you will get the desired results.
THE POWERPOINT of this method is the scarceness of DOUBLE LOSSES. The only thing I revise from the rules is stakes for newbies. I'm using three levels because I have a vast BR you can stay at two modest levels until you build up to a stronger BR. My guideline is your LEVEL 1 stakes should be no more than 5% of your total bankroll.
John,
Thank you, yes indeed I did play it wrong then. I played example:
HHH
XXX
XXX
LLL - I played all 3, regardless of wins or losses. Thank you for clearing that up. Also with the hit and run, I assumed ( my mistake ) that 5 games in a row, then leave. I understand now that you play 5, but 1 at a time, for x amount of units, leave and return later to do it again.
Let me hit the tables again and see if things pick up! :thumbsup:
@ albertojonas - thank you, but like everything else in life, we can't always win. It's HOW you play the game that makes you a winner! :wink:
Regards,
Mauricio
John,
Just to confirm and make double sure:
You say after a loss I should have stayed and played a recovery game....am I correct in saying
that it would be something like this:
HHH
XXX
XXX
HHH - losing streak
LLL - then I would have played it here??? and what progression???
Regards,
Mauricio
Quote from: Maui13 on May 28, 07:35 AM 2011
John,
Just to confirm and make double sure:
You say after a loss I should have stayed and played a recovery game....am I correct in saying
that it would be something like this:
HHH
XXX
XXX
HHH - losing streak
LLL - then I would have played it here??? and what progression???
Regards,
Mauricio
No it would be like this
H H H
L H L
H L H
H H H-LOST GAME
H L L
H L H
L L H--Won bet 1
Do not attempt to recover all your 7 units attempt to recover fair portion of say 3 units, staking 3,6,12
Its all relative Maui13, do you think you could ever wipe out a 1,000 unit BR playing this method as I do with level 1 stakes of 3, 6, 12??
One step at a time, the stronger your BANKROLL is with this method the more invincible you are. And with the winning streaks that are posdible and the lack of double losses. Well think about it. I will give an update later.
Just out of interest I checked the last 26 visits to my local B&M here in S Africa and the first 12 numbers of every visit showed the following for P4 (recovery bet on visits 13 & 14)
Visits 1 to 12 all wins
Visits 13 and 14 loses each (immediate second session on both netted wins)
Visits 15 to 26 all wins
Summary: 26/26 wins
Midnight, another SA player! Yay!!!
John - I've hit the tables again after you helped me get the process sorted, and I am happy to say that I've been giving it breaks of anywhere between 30 mins and an hour. Playing 1 game and leaving. I'm going to call it a day...bit of recovery of + 7 Thank you John!!!
Now a cold beer and BBQ will be the order of the day! :xd:
Regards,
Mauricio
Quote from: Maui13 on May 28, 10:54 AM 2011
Midnight, another SA player! Yay!!!
John - I've hit the tables again after you helped me get the process sorted, and I am happy to say that I've been giving it breaks of anywhere between 30 mins and an hour. Playing 1 game and leaving. I'm going to call it a day...bit of recovery of + 7 Thank you John!!!
Now a cold beer and BBQ will be the order of the day! :xd:
Regards,
Mauricio
You are welcome Mauricio. I know its hard not to stay and play and play. And you know what? If your bankroll is huge that would be possible. Because lets say you play a continuos session and win 5 games in a row then hit a loss. You can pull back that loss very quickly and carry on. But until you have that power base behind you. You play more cautiously and grind out the profits ever increasing the size of your BR.
Its all relative, if I walk into a casino with 2000 units with the intention of risking 49 units. to win 7 a game. My Bankroll will never be challenged with this method. If I come through the door with 100 units to win that amount. One double loss and I am gone. And that is the classic reason casinos thrive. The people playing their games not only don't have a winning method longterm, they have no idea about money management. They come with 100 units to win 100 units or more. And nearly always leave with NOTHING.
I SEE THIS AGAIN AND AGAIN, as the saying goes failing to prepare, is preparing to FAIL. That saying is spot on when it comes to roulette.
Okay a results update for PATTERN 4
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 450
TOTAL GAMES WON 416
TOTAL GAMES LOST 34
STRIKERATE APPROX 13/1
BALANCE 408 POINTS PLUS
DOUBLE LOSSES 3
LONGEST WINNING STREAK 37
LONGEST WINNING STREAK (FIRST GAME) 35
I lost my first game today ending a superb 35 day winning streak, my longest ever. I recovered a portion on the loss on the very next game. That phenomenon is solid gold. Still no double loss on the very first two games of the day. This could be the grail within an excellent method. That game after a first game loss will have a truly great strikerate. Its only experience that brings these kind of nuggets to the mind.
a lot of people even if they have a strong method never stay with it long enough to learn its true strengths and weaknesses. Again the mind gives up long before a good method. If you are fickle and constantly switch from method to method you will never really get anywhere.
Because there is no method with any real functional pace that doesn't lose, you must know this first. You learn to read the strengths of a good method and work them. Anyone looking for a method with a B and M friendly turnover has to accept this. If I say I have a method that will lose so infrequently its of no significance to you. It will come at a price be sure of that. And that price will be TIME, turnover. If for example I say I will play MATRIX VERTICAL 5 betting against 7 FIVE POINTERS forming for high and low. And use one FIVE POINTER as my trigger. I may never lose a game. But how many games will I get in a day especially at a real casino? Not many...
So we make a trade, we have PATTERN 4 and DIVIDE AND CONQUER. Both casino friendly, D & c Is the fastest roulette killer EVER. But the only problem in a real environment is you have to record data or risk losing track. I don't want any attention drawn to me in the innitial stages of my assault. And someone winning all the time with a pen and paper will do just that. Pattern Breaker is the same you have no choice you have to track patterns unless you have an incredible memory (I don't) that's why Pattern 4 is the chosen one as my prime weapon when I make my assault. It ticks all the boxes. I can walk in win and leave without anyone ever noticing in those early weeks.
Question For U John Legend
Are the Rules for this Game play, exactly the same at the Rules posted up on
the first page of this Topic, or, have they Morphed into other additional Ones?
Chris
Nice to see another SA player Mauricio ;)
John Legend
Do as you will.
I am nothing but good vibe.
Cheers
Quote from: Maui13 on May 28, 02:11 AM 2011
Hi Gordon,
What progression are you playing to come back with the +6 after the -7
Regards,
Mauricio
Hi Mauricio
My progression units are
L1 (1,2,4) 7 Units
L2 (3,6,12) 21 Units
L3 (6,12,24) 42 Units
First game as JL suggests L2 (3,6,12) +3 then I play L1 (1,2,4) +1 for 4 games
I won 1st game +3, won 2nd game +1, but lost 3rd game -7 so jumped to L3 for 4th game and won with (6,12,24) to achieve +6 which gave me a balance of +3 (+3 +1 -7 +6)
Hope that makes sense
After reading the last few posts from JL I have realised that if I win the first game I should leave it maybe 30 mins and continue at L1 for 2nd game and so on,
So far I have been playing my games continuously even after the 1st win due to only playing late at night, I know at the end of the day every bet is 50/50, but unless you play the same rules as JL, consistently how can you compare results ;D
Gordon
I don't want to urinate on any ones bonfires here but what i find is you will win with this system for x amount of hours or x amount of spins which ever , thats the good news.
The bad news is you will for sure after a certain time loose the lot!
I have tried the waiting for another 20 spins thing and it seems to make no difference.
Quote from: Kingspin on May 28, 07:11 PM 2011
I don't want to urinate on any ones bonfires here but what I find is you will win with this system for x amount of hours or x amount of spins which ever , that's the good news.
The bad news is you will for sure after a certain time lose the lot!
I have tried the waiting for another 20 spins thing and it seems to make no difference.
of course it doesn't.
Glad you jumped to the conclusion.
;-)
Well, you don't have to urinate on mine. I played 6 games tonight at the casino 00 wheel (no choice, thats all we have)and won all 6. +6 units. I stood between 2 tables and played both. When I won, I left as John said and went to another part and hit that table and another table and won, came back and won on the original 2., and said good night. +$150. Are you going to the casino Kingspin or playing online?
CD
Quote from: Kingspin on May 28, 07:11 PM 2011
I don't want to urinate on any ones bonfires here but what I find is you will win with this system for x amount of hours or x amount of spins which ever , that's the good news.
The bad news is you will for sure after a certain time lose the lot!
I have tried the waiting for another 20 spins thing and it seems to make no difference.
Kingspin from what I can gather you are not playing the method correctly at all. Play for hours?
I can give ten people a method and there will always be three or four who cant follow the rules, then come back and give negative reports. Play as I play Kingspin and you will win as I win.
IGNORE the stipulations of the method and of course you will go negative. If you want a fail proof method I have one for you Kingspin, Albertojonas an anyone else who thinks a method has no merit unless IT NEVER LOSES.
But judging from your responses on this thread I seriously doubt youd have the PATIENCE. And Im afraid thats the trade. TIME/INVINCIBILITY.
So I accept not everyone can get it, can stick to the plan. Only thing I dont like is you moaning it didnt work for you when you werent executing it properly to begin with. And you are very, very wrong About Hit and run VS consecutive play.
You will never ever see a winning streak of 37 playing consecutively. NEVER, if you dont get that forget it and move on.
Hi JohnLegend, do you perhaps know why this method works? What is the reason behind it? Will this work if one plays the 13th, 14th and 15th spin instead? This game is a random type of event so I believe any attempt at constant play will conflict in some way, almost like its a different kind of animal to random? Is it also possible that we are seeing a winning cycle within a larger cycle and that the bottom of the curve is approaching sometime in the future?
Just a couple of thoughts on this very interesting phenomenon... By the way my findings with win rates mirror yours, 12/1
Quote from: Midnight Player on May 29, 06:29 AM 2011
Hi JohnLegend, do you perhaps know why this method works? What is the reason behind it? Will this work if one plays the 13th, 14th and 15th spin instead? This game is a random type of event so I believe any attempt at constant play will conflict in some way, almost like its a different kind of animal to random? Is it also possible that we are seeing a winning cycle within a larger cycle and that the bottom of the curve is approaching sometime in the future?
Just a couple of thoughts on this very interesting phenomenon... By the way my findings with win rates mirror yours, 12/1
Hi midnight player, it would probably work for pattern 5,6,7 etc. I settled on Pattern 4 as A, It was long enough after the first pattern to weaken the chaining of repeaters enough and B, it wasnt too long a wait to get a game. I can walk into a casino check the history marker and play a game straight.
So yes it could work I think on several set gaps. I know its powerpoint is the scarceness of double losses, and the potential to chain winning streaks far beyond 7/1 together every now and then, when played hit and run.
To be Frank it should be impossible to show negative results with this method. IF YOU PLAY IT PROPERLY. But IF is a big two lettered word.
Its the main method I will attack the casinos with, its simplicity, and easy memorizing of results makes it the one to stay under the radar with.
Question For U John Legend (Second time of posting)
Are the Rules for this Game play, exactly the same at the Rules posted up on
the first page of this Topic, or, have they Morphed into other additional Ones?
Chris
John,
You state:
"I can walk into a casino check the history marker and play a game straight."
To me that is dangerous. Consider yourself lucky if you do it this way. I will explain. I was playing the other night and twice the croupier said "no spin" put the ball back into the same slot. Now the history marker listed the number again, so it looked like a repeat. this happened twice in a half hour. So two numbers repeated when they really didn't. Plus they are not that consistent sometimes depending where you go. We have new history markers where I go and give all the stats. I don't trust history markers and prefer to see for myself what nine spins come up unless someone is already tracking on a card. Thanks again! I'll be returning tonight.
CD
Quote from: chrisbis on May 29, 09:44 AM 2011
Question For you John Legend (Second time of posting)
Are the Rules for this Game play, exactly the same at the Rules posted up on
the first page of this Topic, or, have they Morphed into other additional Ones?
Chris
Chris, they were re-written a page or so ago at my request so ppl could keep updated :thumbsup:
Quote from: clothdog on May 29, 10:00 AM 2011
John,
You state:
"I can walk into a casino check the history marker and play a game straight."
To me that is dangerous. Consider yourself lucky if you do it this way. I will explain. I was playing the other night and twice the croupier said "no spin" put the ball back into the same slot. Now the history marker listed the number again, so it looked like a repeat. this happened twice in a half hour. So two numbers repeated when they really didn't. Plus they are not that consistent sometimes depending where you go. We have new history markers where I go and give all the stats. I don't trust history markers and prefer to see for myself what nine spins come up unless someone is already tracking on a card. Thanks again! I'll be returning tonight.
CD
makes no diffence it is all random and an illusion ,you can still bet, what you don't no wont hurt, its all in the MIND. MY STRIKE RATE 15 TO 1
Quote from: warrior on May 29, 10:12 AM 2011
makes no diffence it is all random and an illusion ,you can still bet, what you don't no wont hurt, its all in the MIND. MY STRIKE RATE 15 TO 1
I like the sound of ure words ;D
Quote from: Twisteruk on May 29, 10:30 AM 2011
I like the sound of your words ;D
THANK YOU, but more so than words let the LIGHT shine upon your darkness that you have in your body.
Quote from: warrior on May 29, 10:41 AM 2011
THANK YOU, but more so than words let the LIGHT shine upon you darkness that you have in your body.
Thank you friend :)
i was playing online when i lost, on real wheels online i have won but i did loose to rng.
Good system if you have massive patience which i don't have. :-\
Quote from: warrior on May 29, 10:41 AM 2011
THANK YOU, but more so than words let the LIGHT shine upon your darkness that you have in your body.
Warrior you are one of a kind. Im glad your tweak on the method is working well. 15/1
is a great strikrate im holding 12/1 and doing very well with that.
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 29, 04:41 PM 2011
Warrior you are one of a kind. I'm glad your tweak on the method is working well. 15/1
is a great strikrate I'm holding 12/1 and doing very well with that.
What was the Tweak ? I guess I missed it :-\
Quote from: Kingspin on May 29, 04:20 PM 2011
I was playing online when I lost, on real wheels online I have won but I did lose to rng.
Good system if you have massive patience which I don't have. :-\
Kingspin if you cant wait 6 spins to get a game you have no patience at all. I really never get people like you. You can go out to work spend time travelling there do an 8 hour day or whatever hours, spend time travelling home.
Yet waiting a while for a game that over time will surpass what you earn in your day job is too much trouble. Little wonder why this game isnt even challenged by 10% of players.
hi Warrior, what was the tweak you are using? :)
Quote from: warrior on May 23, 09:54 AM 2011
While playing P4 the last 12 trips at BM,were very good while waiting for the 20 spins to take its coarse, I was paying attention to the gaps, what I mean by that is what happens at a 10 spin interval betting the pattern wont repeat,then 9 spins and so on ,very good results ,so I began to play in this fashion.the gaps were as follows
we always begin with P4 on a win we let one spin pass this will be our next number to track For the next10 spins and you do this for the next 54 spins a total of 9 bets will be placed .
now for the code, you starT P4 we win, next let 1 spin go by we wait for 10 spins lets say its 5 12 36 3 25 13 12 35 23 10 ,we bet against the 5 12 36 ok.i will write down the numbers that I use,
P4
10 SPINS
9
8
7
6
5
4
3 HERE WE STOP we bet we win, immediatly we look at 9 spins back and start to bet at P4 AGAIN. progression same as John LEVEL1- 1 2 4
LEVEL 2 - 3 6 12
a-7 will come when your betting like this because your betting 9 times in 54 spins verses every 20 spins that's normal, 2 in row is rare have not seen yet played real 11 games results were really nice this is still new have no clue as far as many spin trial as playing was done in real mode in BM.everyone s thoughts are welcome WARRIOR.
one more thing,if you lose to a -7 let 1 spin go by a continue to the the next number and wait for your next betting oppurtunity ,if you incounter a any 0 is ingnored ,when your on the attack its considered a loss.
twister this is what johns talking about I still treat this as a hit and run some times I don't go all the way to the end.
I once predicted 6 staight number hits in a row without ever opening my eyes. 8)
I'm the most interesting gambler in the world....Stay thirsty my friends.
cd
Quote from: clothdog on May 29, 08:24 PM 2011
I once predicted 6 staight number hits in a row without ever opening my eyes. 8)
I'm the most interesting gambler in the world....Stay thirsty my friends.
cd
When U woke up from this 'Dream' did u notice Ur pillow had gone?
(Oh no, that's the re-occurring dream about eating too many Marshmallows, isn't it!!)
Come-on, tell us more. :o
Sorry, wrong post here. :-X just joking on the 6 but I developed a method for picking one number straight and I once did it 3x within 5 spins and picked up over $1700. Everybody on the table collected. I'll never forget it was 19-31-35. 19 and 31 hit back to back and then 35 came within 3 spins. I called out the numbers, my friend was there to verify and he won. After the 3rd pick people were going nuts at the table and the Pit boss came over and I left. I also have done it 2x in 3 spins and picked up some very nice change. I don't press my luck and leave. It's very hard to explain. My friend is a heavy hitter and has seen me do it more often than not. I'm not claiming anything.
Nothing to do with sectors. did it the other night at the table played one number hit in 6 spins. there was only one player at the table and I told him 27 would hit. He ignored me and it hit in 6 spins. the dealer said "how about that?" I said yeah, collected and left. Guarantees? Nope. Luck ? I'm sure. But i"ve done it a lot more than once. not betting the rent on it and never severely tested it over the long run but when I do see it, and when I think I have a shot I go for it. it pays well. just having fun. :) Now back to PB4!
cd
JohnLegend and Gordonline,
From your stats have you seen 5 LOST games which all had less than 4 wins between them?
Example: L W W W L W W L W W W L W W W L W W W W
JohnLegend you mentioned that from time to time you would see 2 loses within 6 games so I would assume this scenario is very very rare considering the strike rate...
Does anybody else have any experience with such a L and W streak?
Quote from: amk on May 30, 11:07 AM 2011
JohnLegend and Gordonline,
From your stats have you seen 5 LOST games which all had less than 4 wins between them?
Example: L W W W L W W L W W W L W W W L W W W W
JohnLegend you mentioned that from time to time you would see 2 loses within 6 games so I would assume this scenario is very very rare considering the strike rate...
Does anybody else have any experience with such a L and W streak?
AMK played consecutively you will get those kind of patterns from time to time. That is WHY I don't. Played HIT AND RUN here is an example of what you will get.
w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,L,w,w,w,Lw,w,w,w,L,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,L,L,w,w,w,w,w,L,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,w,L
Do you see what I am saying here? Your streaks will DEFY what the law of averages dictates will be your average win to loss ratio. Because more often than NOT you will be ENTERING THE CYCLE ****BETWEEN LOSING GAMES****. GETTING THIS THROUGH TO SOME PEOPLE IS NEAR IMPOSSIBLE. I ASSURE YOU OF ONE THING. Those who take it onboard. HAVE THIS GAME beaten FOR THE REST OF THEIR LIVES. BUT OBVIOUSLY HUMAN NATURE BEING WHAT IT IS, THAT WILL ALWAYS BE THE MINORITY. ;D ;D ;D ;D
Amk I feel that is the average Distribution.
Howewer JL your answer overcomes the question made by amk
??? ??? ???
more Propaganda? you sound like a politician... :xd:
Quote from: albertojonas on May 30, 11:26 AM 2011
That overcomes the question made by amk
??? ??? ???
more Propaganda?
Propaganda? Albertojonas I really don't understand the point of you posting on these threads, you are negative from start to finish. If you don't believe the game can be beaten then leave it alone. You are the kind of person who I have no time for. Your mind is already defeated and you hang too much on what the maths boys say is and isn't possible. Negative thinking gets nowhere.
Thanks JohnLegend!
I have of course not seen the L W scenario I described but wanted to receive your insights.
Albertojonas, everyone on the forum is very much enjoying PATTERN 4. JohnLegend has proved himself over and over again with beautiful methods. We thank him for his help and posts.
It might be an idea for you to play say 200 games and see what happens. Or review say 8000 spins of live wheel data. Twisteruk has even proven that PATTERN 4 works on RNG. (hope you are feeling somewhat better mate)
Keep rollin along JL
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 30, 11:31 AM 2011
Propaganda? Albertojonas I really don't understand the point of you posting on these threads, you are negative from start to finish. If you don't believe the game can be beaten then leave it alone. You are the kind of person who I have no time for. Your mind is already defeated and you hang too much on what the maths boys say is and isn't possible. Negative thinking gets nowhere.
i am sorry if you feel that way on my words. i am not intending to start any kind of verbal war here.
Let's maintain this discussion objective.
If you dare take this chalenge.
play some Virtual session everyday on wiesbaden Table 2 Results
always start of the first permanencies.
And post the sessions in the testing zone. Create a thread 4 it.
That would be a real proofing ground, not empty (private) stats.
stick with the rulles and make it happen.
:love:
Quote from: amk on May 30, 11:47 AM 2011
Thanks JohnLegend!
I have of course not seen the L W scenario I described but wanted to receive your insights.
Albertojonas, everyone on the forum is very much enjoying PATTERN 4. JohnLegend has proved himself over and over again with beautiful methods. We thank him for his help and posts.
It might be an idea for you to play say 200 games and see what happens. Or review say 8000 spins of live wheel data. Twisteruk has even proven that PATTERN 4 works on RNG. (hope you are feeling somewhat better mate)
Keep rollin along JL
You are welcome AMK, thankyou for the positive remarks. We are on a journey here, your objective is to build a big powerful BANKROLL. Once YOU HAVE ONE THAT IS 25-40 TIMES THE SIZE OF YOUR level 1 stakes. You are in a position of extreme power. From that point you move forward. The VALUE of your units rises until 5-10 games a day is netting you more than your day job does. You now have CHOICES.
That is where I would like to see all of you playing this method a year or less down the road. And its very achievable if you can stay with it. Set yourself goals and go after them. Dont just play robotically. This game is more beatable than poker to me. And if you ask the average Joe on the street what is more beatable Roulette or Poker, how many will say ROULETTE?
Not many right? That is why I want to illustrate in no uncertain terms next year that people have been believing in too many myths about this game for far too long. Its time to rattle the cage, long overdue time.
Quote from: albertojonas on May 30, 11:54 AM 2011
i am sorry if you feel that way on my words. I am not intending to start any kind of verbal war here.
Let's maintain this discussion objective.
If you dare take this chalenge.
play some Virtual session everyday on wiesbaden Table 2 Results
always start of the first permanencies.
And post the sessions in the testing zone. Create a thread 4 it.
That would be a real proofing ground, not empty (private) stats.
stick with the rulles and make it happen.
:love:
What is this love?. I don't need to prove anything to you personaly. I will be proving it to the people who deserve to see it next year in person. I will tell you what I find with negative people they are often too lazy to test anything for themselves. And at the same time have not been able to beat this game consistently. Therefore they harbour the belief if they can't do it IT CANNOT BE DONE.
I believe that's the school you are coming from. The people who have put the time in and executed the method at least close to my playing style are getting the expected results. Some are even exceeding the expected results. So you are saying we are all making up our results here? I would expect no other assumption from your mindset. This will be the last time I will respond to any negativity from you. I have better things to do with my time, enough talk.
Thats right John!
I am reminded of a quote from Stuart Chase years ago.
“For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.â€
How many times do you have to explain yourself or this system to the knuckleheads out there? If they don't believe it works, then don't do it! It's their loss. let them go to weisbaden or charlies casino and test it themselves . If you don't like the program you're watching, switch the channel and stop complaining! :thumbsup:
CD
178 won 16 loss 1 double loss
228 pts won 89 points lost
I think that mean i'm up !!
Quote from: strato1985 on May 30, 01:00 PM 2011
178 won 16 loss 1 double loss
228 pts won 89 points lost
I think that mean i'm up !!
Yeah nice stats strato1985 I see you finally met a double loss. That was still some run without one. I have three after 460 ga ::) ::)mes played. Stay on this and build that bankroll How many units did you start off with?
Well i've got 132 pounds in the bank
just playing with low stakes to get me used to things.. been recording results for at least a month now. that double loss I never totally got caught by , some lady got kicked of the wheel half way though cause she kept messing up the spins, an that's when it hit so I pulled off. funny how them things make a difference to randoms order.
made a couple of mistakes along the way either distraction or mis-placing a bet , but that's why I stated with low stakes.
I say start low build confidence and bankroll. (I've made that mistake before). its not so damaging if you make silly mistake while learning.. playing for real is totally different to just writing it down I find anyway.
The other thing when I'm looking at whether to play or not I look at things like the zones you designed , I find quite often if low doz is due in the zones and my P4 bet is LLL I treat that as more favorable rather than one that looks like this
HHH
HLL
LLL
LLL would be P4 bet I treat this as unfavorable because low had 5 streak, quite often I pick the losses and win by doing this ( that don't make complete sense!!) hopeful you get my idea
may mean nothing but we all got to decide when we enter the game somehow
I also playing pattern 4 filler style at the same time ( far less games though) with good results.
Next week i'm thinking of adding more of my own cash to the bankroll
Not sure how much I can afford maybe make it up to 600 pounds
Quote from: strato1985 on May 30, 04:35 PM 2011
Well i've got 132 pounds in the bank
just playing with low stakes to get me used to things.. been recording results for at least a month now. that double loss I never totally got caught by , some lady got kicked of the wheel half way though cause she kept messing up the spins, an that's when it hit so I pulled off. funny how them things make a difference to randoms order.
made a couple of mistakes along the way either distraction or mis-placing a bet , but that's why I stated with low stakes.
I say start low build confidence and bankroll. (I've made that mistake before). its not so damaging if you make silly mistake while learning.. playing for real is totally different to just writing it down I find anyway.
The other thing when I'm looking at whether to play or not I look at things like the zones you designed , I find quite often if low doz is due in the zones and my P4 bet is LLL I treat that as more favorable rather than one that looks like this
O
HHH
HLL
LLL
LLL would be P4 bet I treat this as unfavorable because low had 5 streak, quite often I pick the losses and win by doing this ( that don't make complete sense!!) hopeful you get my idea
may mean nothing but we all got to decide when we enter the game somehow
I also playing pattern 4 filler style at the same time ( far less games though) with good results.
Next week i'm thinking of adding more of my own cash to the bankroll
Not sure how much I can afford maybe make it up to 600 pounds
Excellent Strato1985 you are reading the game not just playing it robotically. I like that. Yes often in a live casino you get some annoying patrons. Ive had chips stolen. And even somone claiming my chips were theirs when I won of course. I often chose times when there arent too many people on one table. A game is a game. It will win anywhere anytime if its a good method.
I would suggest something like a 600 pound BR and use 2,4,8=14 units as your level 1 stakes and 4,8,16=28 units as your level 2. When you get to double that, you double your stakes. You always want a minumum of around 15 times your total risk. Once you have 1,200 units in your bankroll forget it. You have pulled clear and will never look back. Once you have 3,000 you have reached a level where a daily gain comparable to a living wage is a reality. Keep that bankroll growing there are no surprises with this method it will deliver over and over. Take advantage of it.
Cheers john
Dodgy casino tactics .That just sums up some people of this life up !!!
I was thinking about what level of stakes to play at that point. It was my next question
How recording my results has changed my mindset for whatever reason that is.. I dodged quite a lot of losses by predicting streaking etc. also missed some wins but the next opportunity is just round the corner.
I always remember long time ago you said its easier to walk a way from a bet, an wait for next opportunity than rush in. Think it went like,,, i'm in no rush to win money an i'm in even less a rush to lose it.. LoL so true
There is a lot of skill in this game for sure
Guitarists , we try stray from robotic scale bashing. creative thinking
I should also add that i'm playing the original method . Twister picked up in between visits.. . I've not had chance to test warriors tweak . I'm sort of sticking to what I know to build my BR
If warriors works then this time next year rodney!!
Quote from: strato1985 on May 30, 05:46 PM 2011
Cheers john
Dodgy casino tactics .That just sums up some people of this life up !!!
I was thinking about what level of stakes to play at that point. It was my next question
How recording my results has changed my mindset for whatever reason that is.. I dodged quite a lot of losses by predicting streaking etc. also missed some wins but the next opportunity is just round the corner.
I always remember long time ago you said its easier to walk a way from a bet, an wait for next opportunity than rush in. Think it went like,,, i'm in no rush to win money an i'm in Ieven less a rush to lose it.. LoL so true
There is a lot of skill in this game for sure
Guitarists , we try stray from robotic scale bashing. creative thinking
I should also add that i'm playing the original method . Twister picked up in between visits.. . I've not had chance to test warriors tweak . I'm sort of sticking to what I know to build my BR
If warriors works then this time next year rodney!!
Exactly, I have a lot of confidence in this method. But still show random a degree of respect BUT NOT TOO MUCH. Like a maths head or you will be a Mr WHAT IF. And get nowhere.
As a player you are building and defending your powerbase (BANKROLL) Ever seen a poker player with a huge pot of chips, see how confident theyre. And that's where you want to be. But remember ROULETTE IS EASIER to beat than POKER. I'm serious, a poker player depends on bluffing half the time. Theres no bluffing in roulette. YOUR METHOD EITHER WORKS or it doesn't.
Yes 2,000 units or more and you can sustain a living if you want to. That should be the first objective of anyone playing this game. Its something to work towards.
“For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.†that's a good one clothdog!
I know that even if you will hang a method on the nose of most members they will forget it tomorrow that it exists. They are so negative that they deny even the best systems.
I don't put any strategy on forums anymore because I am sick and tired to argue with those closed minds. I think most of them do it only because of envy. >:(
Hermes
I told my mate about this an he tried it an failed . he's never really played .
Low bank roll/ no idea about MM/ an stayed to long
I'm happy with P4 an P filler as I'm consistently winning .
I see stackbundles about . i'm surprised he's not all over these methods?? he aint said a peep..
anyway I'll see what the next week days bring (one week at a time)
I played on Friday evening Baccarat with Bermuda strategy. I took from one shoe $150. Is it not enough? I needed to bet maximum 3 chips! Look the beauty, enjoy the free ride.
BPB
PPB
PPB
-----
BBP
PPB
PBB
BPB
BBB
BBP
BPP
PBB
BPB
PPB
PPP
PPP
BBB
PBP
PPB
PPB
BBB
PBP
PBP
PPB
PBP
BPP
BP
1 TO 81 hands, I stopped at 75. :)
Hermes
Well, my winning streak stopped at 7 games. I had :
HLL
XXX
XXX
0LL
I won the next game though. So overall 2-1 for the day. My column method hit nine in a row, had a few singes straight up and went home. It's my B-day.
CD :thumbsup:
Seeing that everyone is sharing, let me give my 2c.
My currency is much weaker than the euro,pound,dollar, so I couldn't really afford to start big.
Anyway, I put a deposit in of U$20, didn't play Pattern 4 correct, and went down to 12U$. After some guidance from JohnLegend, I manage to get it up to U$30 again.
Like I said, it's not a lot, but what it comes down to is that I managed to get back up from 12 - 30. So that's +18 units in 3 days.
I truly do think, that if played correctly, not getting greedy and with patience, these methods can become your daily bread winner. ( with a big enough bankroll....not my U$30 :wink: )
I'm going to carry on, and report back as I go, just to see, even with a small BR, if you can make something of it.
Regards,
Mauricio
Quote from: Hermes on May 30, 06:42 PM 2011
I played on Friday evening Baccarat with Bermuda strategy. I took from one shoe $150. Is it not enough? I needed to bet maximum 3 chips! Look the beauty, enjoy the free ride.
BPB
PPB
PPB
-----
BBP
PPB
PBB
BPB
BBB
BBP
BPP
PBB
BPB
PPB
PPP
PPP
BBB
PBP
PPB
PPB
BBB
PBP
PBP
PPB
PBP
BPP
BP
1 TO 81 hands, I stopped at 75. :)
Hermes
Beautiful isnt it ?
No Zero and a Push (money back) on a Tie ;D
A true 50/50 :xd: :twisted: :lol:
You pay 5% commission on banker win but I do it gladly with no fear of the dreadful zeros.
Baccarat the best game in the house, yep.
I tried it on craps Pass Line /Don't pass I won but was not that happy because went up to 5 chips. Bankroll needed $150 plus.
Hermes
Hi John & All
Tonight I played my fastest session yet, 10mins online with +9 units
Tracked 9 spins down on paper and started the first betting sequence on H/L as follows
HHL
HHH
LHH
HLH 2nd Bet Won +3 (L2 Prog 3,6,12)
At the same time I started to monitor O/E from spin 4 as follows
EEO
OOO
EEO
OEO 1st Bet Won +3 (L2 Prog as above)
And monitored R/B from spin 7 as follows
RRR
RRB
RBB
BBB 1st Bet Won +3 (L2 Prog as above)
For reference here are the actual numbers (There were only 18)
26,35,15,28,24,27,3,19,23,30,12,13,19,6,33,24,33,4
I only placed 4 bets so I think you would agree that this is (HIT & RUN at its finest) ;D ;D ;D
This is just a slightly different approach, just going for the one win on each but staggering the betting to prevent betting on more than one even chance at a time
Gordon ;D
I like the 'Overlap' approach Gordon.
Very interesting.
Might/May have implications for other such bets, that at first will not seem so apparent.
The 'Overlap' or 'Staggering' effect could be one of the most significant elements to come
from the Matrix Sequencer this year.
Overlap value could be varied according to the Loss/Win Factor in play during a session.
What a find eh Gordon. >:D (with good intentions!)
Hi Chrisbis
Thanks for your positive comments, thats what this forum is all about.........sharing different ideas and fine tuning what is already a great strategy from JL.
You could say that I was lucky tonight but when I did my tests on 3300+ spins of mine, I noticed that all 3 E/C's gave good results with the H/L for some reason slightly better.
At the end of the day we are always going to have a 7/1 chance of a win in our favour for the pattern we're betting on, which are good odds, and betting on just the one sequence as JL does takes advantage of this powerful strategy :thumbsup:
I like it..............alot ;D
Gordon
Quote from: Gordonline on May 31, 06:01 PM 2011
HHL
HHH
LHH
HLH 2nd Bet Won +3 (L2 Prog 3,6,12)
At the same time I started to monitor O/E from spin 4 as follows
EEO
OOO
EEO
OEO 1st Bet Won +3 (L2 Prog as above)
And monitored R/B from spin 7 as follows
RRR
RRB
RBB
BBB 1st Bet Won +3 (L2 Prog as above)
It would be really awesome, if someone could create a little track/and bet utility for all three the EC's... tracking with pen & paper, or even excel spreadsheet is a bit cumbersome. :yawn: REALLY nice to have would be to enable/disable H/L , O/E , R/B :xd:
Regards,
Mauricio
Quote from: Maui13 on Jun 01, 02:01 AM 2011
It would be really awesome, if someone could create a little track/and bet utility for all three the EC's... tracking with pen & paper, or even excel spreadsheet is a bit cumbersome. :yawn: REALLY nice to have would be to enable/disable H/L , O/E , R/B :xd:
Regards,
Mauricio
Check this:
Quote from: ophis on Apr 30, 11:51 AM 2011
TRACKER:
link:://rouletteforum.cc/coding-for-roulette/(release)-patterns-tracker/ (link:://rouletteforum.cc/coding-for-roulette/(release)-patterns-tracker/)
Thanks Marivo :thumbsup:
and thank you to Ophis!!!
Very cool tool!!!
Regards,
Mauricio
Just played a Session of P4 on Baccarat
+13 Units for one Shoe !
I played 1-2-4
And after a loss 8-16-32
BUT the first game I play 8-16-32
Here are the results ;D
BPB
PBB
PPP
PBP +8 (this line now becomes the new line 1)
PBB
PBB
PPB +1
PPB
BPB
PBP +1
BPB
BBP
PBB +1
BPP
PBB
PBP +1
PPB
PPB
PPP +1
Gordonline,
From your stats have you seen 6 LOST games which all had less than 4 wins between them?
Example: L W W W L W W L W W W L W W W L W W W L
You already informed me once that most of the time after a loss you would have at least 4 wins.
It might be an interesting stat for everybody to keep track of... how many wins between loses.
What was your way that is better?
CD
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 01, 02:22 PM 2011
What was your way that is better?
CD
Well that is my opinion and i dont want to steel antention from this topic.
I will post a new topic and name it advance gambling
Hello Gordonline,
Your approach to tracking all 3 EC's is really nice.
It's PATTERN 4 as it should be played but then for all 3 EC's.
Twisteruk I believe played them as well but then at the same time. (Is this correct Twisteruk?)
JohnLegends advise is ofcourse to stick with HL.
Your research can contribute, perhaps greatly.
JohnLegend you mentioned that you were going to play EO aswell.
Any stats yet?
PATTERN 4 stays amazing!!!
hi. this is the most promising system on roulette forum. still going strong.
Quote from: amk on Jun 01, 05:17 PM 2011
Hello Gordonline,
Your approach to tracking all 3 EC's is really nice.
It's PATTERN 4 as it should be played but then for all 3 EC's.
Twisteruk I believe played them as well but then at the same time. (Is this correct Twisteruk?)
JohnLegends advise is ofcourse to stick with HL.
Your research can contribute, perhaps greatly.
JohnLegend you mentioned that you were going to play EO as well.
Any stats yet?
PATTERN 4 stays amazing!!!
Yes Amk, Ive played 45 games for ODD AND EVEN. At the moment im 43 wins 2 losses. The exciting part is im criss crossing games with HIGH AND LOW. And in doing so have enjoyed a combined winning streak of 32 games. I like this cross play alot. Im happy to leave RED AND BLACK out. High and Low and Odd and Even are working really well.
Hi John & All
Tonight I played the same method again +9 units 5 bets in total (10 Mins Play) ;D
Tracked 9 spins down on paper and started the first betting sequence on H/L as follows
LLH
LLL
HHL
HHL 1st Bet Won +3 (L2 Prog 3,6,12)
Monitored O/E from spin 4 as follows
OOE
EOO
EEE
OEO 2nd Bet Won +3
And monitored R/B from spin 7 as follows
BRR
BBB
RBB
BBR 2nd Bet Won +3..........Game over and Log out !!!!!!
I'm sure I'm not unique but made a mistake with betting on the R/B by writing the wrong sequence down, I wrote down in advance (R,R,B) instead of (R,B,B) but I also made a slight error on the 3rd bet by betting on Red which inadvertently was the correct bet and it came in phew !!!!!
Note to self.........(100% concentration at all times)
Hi AMK
I will try and get some stats for you reference the win/loss ratio's, but to be honest this stategy seems to hold up so well especially with good MM as laid out by the "Legend"
The only reason I'm splitting all 3 E/C's is to prevent too much betting going on at once and as you read above mistakes are easily made just betting on one sequence
Gordon ;D
hello all. tested it out on eurogrand today. just used simply Odds/even, R/B, and H/L. about 75-80% strike rate imo. but the losers will kill it, because 1 losing progression is -11 units.
however, because of 80% strike rate, you can increase bet progression x3times after a loss. so next gain will cover that loss.
e. g. i got these losers:
LHH
LHH
LHL , bet on H,L,L
LHH
so it repeated itself again, we bet on it not repeating, so lots -11 units.
again i got this one:
LLL
HHH
HHH bet on H,H,H
LLL (again lost)
can you please recommend me a casino that you guys have tested it on. i won't try it on eurogrand.
Quote from: Johnlegend link=topic=4697. msg54691#msg54691 date=1306966139
Yes Amk, I've played 45 games for ODD AND EVEN. At the moment I'm 43 wins 2 losses. The exciting part is I'm criss crossing games with HIGH AND LOW. And in doing so have enjoyed a combined winning streak of 32 games. I like this cross play a lot. I'm happy to leave RED AND BLACK out. High and Low and Odd and Even are working really well.
hi thanks mate, let us know whereabouts (online casino) you played. I think it makes a difference, not only the system, but also the location, for control testing purposes.
Quote from: Twisteruk link=topic=4697. msg54622#msg54622 date=1306944960
Just played a Session of P4 on Baccarat
+13 Units for one Shoe !
I played 1-2-4
And after a loss 8-16-32
BUT the first game I play 8-16-32
Here are the results ;D
BPB
PBB
PPP
PBP +8 (this line now becomes the new line 1)
PBB
PBB
PPB +1
PPB
BPB
PBP +1
BPB
BBP
PBB +1
BPP
PBB
PBP +1
PPB
PPB
PPP +1
hi please let me know which casino you play bacca at thanks. I got 1 loss in about 5-6, 80-85% strike rate. i played on william hill RNG. after 1 loss i doubled my progression, so was overall up. again it is better for bacca, no zero in bacca
Quote from: ego on Jun 01, 02:25 PM 2011
Well that is my opinion and I don't want to steel antention from this topic.
I will post a new topic and name it advance gambling
loolking forward to it.
Twisteruk I made 15 units on that shoe but live baccarat no RNGs! Never RNGs. RNGs are for losers.
Hermes
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 01, 08:28 PM 2011
hi thanks mate, let us know whereabouts (online casino) you played. I think it makes a difference, not only the system, but also the location, for control testing purposes.
Hi mate. I am sure JL never playes on RNG :) Just friendly advice, don't play or test anything on RNG
NEVER that is not roulette
Hi. but rng is so much quicker. its 7x quicker. I hear people got results from it. any live casino recommendations anyway.
anyway I tried the strategy on baccarat at william hill RNG.
i got 5 w in a row, 1 unit each = 3 pounds.
my stake plan in pounds:
3,6,9
12,24,48[P2 to recover most of the loss, -6 units it will be]
if P1 P2 fail in a row, that's 100 loss maximum
ties = i don't count them in row or column at all.
here was my session:
BBP
PBP
PBB BET P NOW(1ST ROW)
PBP win, becomes new row
BBP
BPP
BBP win, bet on B
BBP
PPP
BPB win 2nd bet
PPB
PPP
BBP win 2nd bet
i'm not even getting to 2nd progression, which is a safety net. 100 loss maximum.
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 02, 02:43 AM 2011
but rng is so much quicker. its 7x quicker.
Impatience in this game can cut off your head. My humble opinion. And I play only in land casinos. But I am sure someone can maybe recommend some good on line live casinos. But feeling when playing in land casino for me is priceless :love: It is not enough to play even with good knowledge, you have to enjoy in your game even when you are sometimes maybe losing. If you can understand.
Regards
Hi totally agree. but you can always lose more in live, as you need a higher chip size.
if RNG is truly random, then it should give results. i notice lot of people have gotten results using RNG(e.g. Twister is one)
Just thought I would share this. Last night playing, I used Ophis app, and look at the run of H & L I had....crazy!!! :xd: 4 times in a row the exact same pattern!
Regards,
Mauricio
yes maui that counts as a loss. so u upped the progression?
Quote from: Gordonline on Jun 01, 07:07 PM 2011
Hi John & All
Tonight I played the same method again +9 units 5 bets in total (10 Mins Play) ;D
Tracked 9 spins down on paper and started the first betting sequence on H/L as follows
LLH
LLL
HHL
HHL 1st Bet Won +3 (L2 Prog 3,6,12)
Monitored O/E from spin 4 as follows
OOE
EOO
EEE
OEO 2nd Bet Won +3
And monitored R/B from spin 7 as follows
BRR
BBB
RBB
BBR 2nd Bet Won +3..........Game over and Log out !!!!!!
I'm sure I'm not unique but made a mistake with betting on the R/B by writing the wrong sequence down, I wrote down in advance (R,R,B) instead of (R,B,B) but I also made a slight error on the 3rd bet by betting on Red which inadvertently was the correct bet and it came in phew !!!!!
Note to self.........(100% concentration at all times)
Hi AMK
I will try and get some stats for you reference the win/loss ratio's, but to be honest this stategy seems to hold up so well especially with good MM as laid out by the "Legend"
The only reason I'm splitting all 3 E/C's is to prevent too much betting going on at once and as you read above mistakes are easily made just betting on one sequence
Gordon ;D
Nice to read ure updates Gordon :thumbsup:
Just one thing, can you explain why you track each E/C from the point that you do ? Spin 4 Spin 7 etc
Thanx bud :)
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 01, 08:39 PM 2011
hi please let me know which casino you play bacca at thanks. I got 1 loss in about 5-6, 80-85% strike rate. I played on william hill RNG. after 1 loss I doubled my progression, so was overall up. again it is better for bacca, no zero in bacca
NO RNG. PERIOD.
Thats me from now on
I just prefer Live Wheel now
The Casino I use for Baccarat is Paddypower VIP Table (LIVE)
Quote from: Hermes on Jun 01, 11:47 PM 2011
Twisteruk I made 15 units on that shoe but live baccarat no RNGs! Never RNGs. RNGs are for losers.
Hermes
Yes Live for sure :thumbsup:
What site do you use mate ?
Hi All
Just played a morning session on Dublinbet
+9 units 10mins Game Over (How much patience do you need to do that)
I would agree that R/B may not be everyone's favourite and earlier I was betting for RBR and the dreaded "Zero" appeared.......not once......but twice so the 3rd bet was 14 Red.... ;D
I'm only playing small units but lets assume the Unit Value is a moderate £10, thats £90 in 10mins.........who wouldn't mind earning that once a day ??? ??? ???
Never play RNG theres no need to, as all you're doing is trying to beat software, and software will always win in the end
A Live Wheel is the only way to play online, if its spinning in front of a camera like Dublinbet its REAL what more do you need !!!!
Thats my tuppence worth ;D
Gordon
Quote from: Twisteruk on Jun 02, 06:17 AM 2011
NO RNG. PERIOD.
that's me from now on
I just prefer Live Wheel now
The Casino I use for Baccarat is Paddypower VIP Table (LIVE)
hi thanks. i'll look into a good live table. Any reason you don't like RNG. also which roulette live you prefer. thanks. would you use this system for roulette or baccarat.
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 02, 06:49 AM 2011
hi thanks. i'll look into a good live table. Any reason you don't like RNG. also which roulette live you prefer. thanks. would you use this system for roulette or baccarat.
You will never trully know if RNG is cheating you or not. I prefer Live now
I use Paddypower only at this time. Reason being they have a great Live feed, Live real time chat with dealers, live chat with pittboss and/or customer services and very prompt payout. Ive no reason to go anywhere else ;D
You can use either but Baccarat makes more sense, for obvious reasons :)
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 02, 04:19 AM 2011
Hi totally agree. but you can always lose more in live, as you need a higher chip size.
That is not true. That is way you should watching several systems at the same time, not to let you raise to much chips in some system when it doesn't go so well. Better to be wounded then killed. This thing also saved me today. I had rough session, but ended in plus just because of this. don't be fooled about this game, it is not easy at all, even if you have big knowledge and great systems that doesn't guarantee you to win. YOU are the most important factor when you are sitting at the board.
Regards
Drazen
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 01, 08:07 PM 2011
Hello all. tested it out on eurogrand today. just used simply Odds/even, R/B, and H/L. about 75-80% strike rate in my opinion. but the losers will kill it, because 1 losing progression is -11 units.
however, because of 80% strike rate, you can increase bet progression x3times after a loss. so next gain will cover that loss.
e. g. I got these losers:
LHH
LHH
LHL , bet on H,L,L
LHH
so it repeated itself again, we bet on it not repeating, so lots -11 units.
again I got this one:
LLL
HHH
HHH bet on H,H,H
LLL (again lost)
can you please recommend me a casino that you guys have tested it on. I won't try it on eurogrand.
Eurogrand what is it? Betfreds and Paddypower are good. Play this method HIT AND RUN. Do not play consecutively. Im currently playing one game hi lo then one game odd and even. Shut it down on to another wheel or come back later and its working well. I just had a 32 game winning streak between the two. PLAY LIVE ONLY.
RNGS are a manmade scam. There is no chance to beat a computer a live wheel yes.
John,
what is your feeling on airball? Safe to play the system? Going to vegas in a couple of weeks. Do you think it is rigged?
CD
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 02, 10:05 AM 2011
John,
what is your feeling on airball? Safe to play the system? Going to vegas in a couple of weeks. Do you think it is rigged?
CD
No. And it doesnt need to be ;D
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 02, 10:05 AM 2011
John,
what is your feeling on airball? Safe to play the system? Going to vegas in a couple of weeks. Do you think it is rigged?
CD
I trust Airball Clothdog, I've played it and beat it just like a wheel with a groupier. Its strictly RNGS that must be avoided. Heres my take on RNGS. Play them in pratice mode and Ill beat it everytime it behaves just like a live wheel.
BUT! Once you are on for real the cheating begins. And you get ridiculous results. Live or Airball live, only people. ;D
JohnLegend!!
I have been doing some research on playing PATTERN 4 with dozens. You mentioned before that it would be worth testing. I feel it is....
Although this is just a beginning I feel that it perhaps reflects the overall picture...
Tested on 2000 live spins Spielbank
64 GAMES WON
ONE LOSS
ACTUAL PLAY, 41 WINS followed by ONE LOSS followed by 23 WINS (I RAN OUT OF SPIN DATA )
43 wins on first bet
12 wins on second bet
7 wins on 3rd bet
Due to the high strike rate a progression in which the second level takes 5 or even 8 wins to break even again would make playing on the dozens possible...
What are your thoughts
Does anyone know where I can get more live spin data?? Gordonline Twistteruk???
This system in now coded in to Multi System Tracker.
for further details please visit:
link:://rouletteforum.cc/mst-project/ (link:://rouletteforum.cc/mst-project/)
Hi All
Another session tonight 10 mins +9 Game over
Also played one this morning with the same result +9 in 10 mins........Awesome ;D
About time I statrted playing Live Baccarat using the same method
Gordon
PS Thanks Ophis for the tracker :thumbsup:
Quote from: drazen_cro on Jun 02, 08:17 AM 2011
That is not true. That is way you should watching several systems at the same time, not to let you raise to much chips in some system when it doesn't go so well. Better to be wounded then killed. This thing also saved me today. I had rough session, but ended in plus just because of this. don't be fooled about this game, it is not easy at all, even if you have big knowledge and great systems that doesn't guarantee you to win. YOU are the most important factor when you are sitting at the board.
Regards
Drazen
thanks for your comments. i'll just proceed with live first.
i report absolutely phenomenal results using pattern 4, on dozens only. you could also do columns at same time.
streak - 8 in a row on william hill. no loss.
e.g. no. = dozen no.
312
313
310 now bet against 3,1,2
332 bet succeeded 2nd bet
112 bet against 3, bet succeeded 1st bet
Well, I have a little different picture. I was at the casino tonight and got murdered.
here was the pattern:
LLL
LHL
LHH
0LL...So this is the second time in a row I've lost my first game because of 0.
HHL
HHH
LLH
HHL LOST 2ND GAME IN A ROW.
I played another game after 9 spins and finally won. But I lost the next game. I couldn't push it anymore. one win and 3 losses and left. So far after starting with 6 wins last week, I have now 9 wins and 4 losses. hardly earth shattering. :-\ There were only 2 tables open and I was switching. And yes I play hit and run. But I think that the running now will be far away from the casino. :(
cd
Clothdog
All you have to do is cover zero.
That can so easily be done. Even 0=00. What is the difficulty in that?
Then whenever the zero family turn up - it is time to celebrate!
This need require some pre-planning but will result in only a small deduction on net profit for the principal bet.
Please reflect on this and I cannot understand why more people do not consider this.
XXVV
yes, a 1 unit bet on the zero would be a good idea.
Quote from: XXVV on Jun 03, 02:56 AM 2011
Clothdog
All you have to do is cover zero.
That can so easily be done. Even 0=00. What is the difficulty in that?
Then whenever the zero family turn up - it is time to celebrate!
Please reflect on this and I cannot understand why more people do not consider this.
XXVV
Could Spawn a whole new phrase eh!
The following COULD be a conversation from the future................................. ::)
"Sir, have U been involved in an accident recently?"- "
Yes Mate"
"Are U covered with Insurance Sir?"......... "
Yes Mate!"
"What type of Insurance is that?" (says the Solicitor/Salesman, now rubbing his hands)........ >:D
"
Oh, I have Double Zero Insurance....................Mate!!!!"
Quote from: chrisbis on Jun 03, 03:30 AM 2011
Could Spawn a whole new phrase eh!
The following COULD be a conversation from the future................................. ::)
"Sir, have you been involved in an accident recently?"- "Yes Mate"
"Are you covered with Insurance Sir?"......... "Yes Mate!"
"What type of Insurance is that?" (says the Solicitor/Salesman, now rubbing his hands)........ >:D
"Oh, I have Double Zero Insurance....................Mate!!!!"
Thanks again Chris. These your funny comments always improve my mood! :thumbsup:
Regards
Play it on Baccarat ppl !
I have a Thread running in Off-Topic ;D
X
I have 0/00 and will do and I will seriously consider that Bacarrat Twister. :-[
-7 units down from last night($175). So I switched to to the column method and dropped another 4 units. Total $275. :o I'm not going to chase that hoping it will turn around. Sometimes it's not your night. Even the Beatles had a bad tune once in awhile. :ooh:
CD
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 03, 07:24 AM 2011
X
I have 0/00 and will do and I will seriously consider that Bacarrat Twister. :-[
-7 units down from last night($175). So I switched to to the column method and dropped another 4 units. Total $275. :o I'm not going to chase that hoping it will turn around. Sometimes it's not your night. Even the Beatles had a bad tune once in awhile. :ooh:
CD
jee whereabouts you playin. maybe you should change the casino or play baccarat.
leaks a logic a bit, but truly random O0
playing in niagara falls. only live dealers.
cd
Quote from: chrisbis on Jun 03, 03:30 AM 2011
Could Spawn a whole new phrase eh!
The following COULD be a conversation from the future................................. ::)
"Sir, have you been involved in an accident recently?"- "Yes Mate"
"Are you covered with Insurance Sir?"......... "Yes Mate!"
"What type of Insurance is that?" (says the Solicitor/Salesman, now rubbing his hands)........ >:D
"Oh, I have Double Zero Insurance....................Mate!!!!"
Clothdog was unfortunate he entered the cycle at the point of the worst case scenario for this method. Although I don't cover the Zero at present. When I'm playing for serious money next year I will.
The other point I made about having a BR 25-40 times your level 1 progression is That double loss. I am fortunate to have met only three of them in 485 games. The next time I do, I will risk enough on the THIRD GAME to recover most of the double loss.
We have to accept if several people are playing this method, someone is going to get a double loss or three or four losses close together at some point. Its havong the BANKROLL to get over those times that's the big point.
My worst losing streak playing hit and run has been this.
L L W W L W W W W W W W W W W W W W L
As you can see a double loss followed by two wins then another loss then a nice run of winners. I had recovered the losses and moved into profit by the the time I met that loss at the end.
That THIRD GAME. I believe is the golden nugget of the method. But you need the powerful BR to take it on. I wouldnt play this method with less than 200 units to start with. I advised one member to use a losing game as a trigger while building up their Bank. That may be an idea for those of you that have less than 200 units. When you have over 300 you can really play it properly.
My betting has been going really well lately, will give an update over the weekend.
Betting unit is minimum $15. I play with $25.
cd
This i posted also on other thread on baccarat with pb4 by twister.
I thought it could be of use...
8 different combinations is true
but...
4 of those put you on the 2nd step
ie
play against
111
you have
222
212
211
221
could take you on the 3rd step
222
221
and finally you only lose your progression on 1/8
222
====
so if you play 1-2-4
and lose 1/8
you get even
you may use hit & run and leave as soon as you hit +7 on a positive Ecart
or
you can play it other ways
i would try at least 4 diff progressions before that one
1st
1-1-1
2-2-2
3-3-3
4-4-4
etc
2nd
regression
7-3-1
3rd
longest fibbo
1-1-1-2-3-5-8-13...
4th
modified D'Alembert (in which you win as soon as W and L balance out and then reset)
ie.
start with 20units bet
increase +3 on a Loss
decrease -4 on a Win
=====================================================
Also if you apply a little mod to your PB4 you will gain even more odds in your favor....
this is obtained applying the following rule:
you have your matrix
122
211
211-now instead of betting against your first outcome (1)
you wait for the 10th outcome
if it is the Same as the first you play the next two against until a win, ie. (1) bet 1- bet 1
if it is Opposite to the first you play the next to repeat until a win, ie. (2) bet bet 2 - bet 2
I do not intend to change J.Legend system. Just to give you my thoughts on how to improve it,
concerning your worries...
You may consider this a mod.
try it if you like it, then compare it to the original version.
paddypower was awful yesterday john
i lost 40 units not killer but the worst i've seen the method play in over a month of testing.. when i was in it , i knew it was happening, just didn't respond..
with hind sight, knowing it was happening which is more frustrating i stayed.
walk away for many hours, not just one or two
or wait for a single loss trigger which wasn't taking long
Simple in hind sight
Strato
You might consider a 'reverse' strategy when experiencing the 'inevitable' as you have. Recall the ideas in D+C. They might be applied to the other matrix bets when they turn 'adverse'.
Quote from: strato1985 on Jun 03, 12:03 PM 2011
Paddypower was awful yesterday john
i lost 40 units not killer but the worst i've seen the method play in over a month of testing.. when I was in it , I knew it was happening, just didn't respond..
with hind sight, knowing it was happening which is more frustrating I stayed.
walk away for many hours, not just one or two
or wait for a single loss trigger which wasn't taking long
Simple in hind sight
Strato1985 they happen. But its how you deal with a bad session that matters. Remember the overiding factor is that third game. Care to elaborate on your session?
I say this again the HUMAN MIND is the weakest link. Stay focused at all times I know you can be suckered in making irrational judgements. keep focused. Hit and run has no set play mode. I may play a game then wait TWO SPINS and play another as you thrown things out of sequence.
I may play a game then go to another wheel. Or play one game for H L the one for O E and shut it down for an hour. You play as random as the game. I feel since you are finding losses now and are nowhere near the level required to take on that third game.
The one loss trigger may be your prescription to grow that BR. A heavy dosage of PATIENCE. Stay on track overcome setbacks and move forward.
Hey JohnLegend,
Might I receive your thoughts about my post into PATTERN 4 on dozens?
I also took a quick look at playing PATTERN 4 on dozens playing continually with six spins inbetween starting a new game, just to see...
36 WIN STREAK BEFORE A LOSS.
Dozens have power, but how to apply further..?
Any thoughts would be great...
great system!
my tweek to pattern 4 would be this,
record patters for all EC bets...
wait until you have something like this...
1.HHL
2.LHL
3.LLH
4.HHL
5.LHL
as you can see pattern 4 is the same as 1
along with pattern 5 being the same as 2
so now we would bet line 6 is not the same as 3
this way could take longer,.. but i think w/ writing
down all ECs it might go quicker?
Quote from: incekt on Jun 03, 01:26 PM 2011
Great system!
my tweek to pattern 4 would be this,
record patters for all EC bets...
wait until you have something like this...
1.HHL
2.LHL
3.LLH
4.HHL
5.LHL
as you can see pattern 4 is the same as 1
along with pattern 5 being the same as 2
so now we would bet line 6 is not the same as 3
this way could take longer,.. but I think w/ writing
down all ECs it might go quicker?
i think it will be the opposite. it will be even more difficult to get the trigger.
just my 2cents
I agree. it's bad enough some of us don't have the patience after a loss. That could take hours if at all depending on the crowd conditions.
CD
Hey guys,
I know that this is going to sound like I'm being negative. I just can't help it. I don't see how waiting for certain patterns and then betting for or against increases our odds or strike rate.
All we're doing is finding a rare situation and betting that a pattern of 3 won't form. The problem is that we bet so rarely that it takes a long time to realize that we're really getting the same odds as if we bet against or for that pattern every three spins.
Am I missing something here. Someone please enlighten me again.
GLC
Hello GLC,
JohnLegend would have the best insight.....
My feeling is that we are stepping outside of certain scenarios occuring and thus maintaining an overall picture which will keep repeating itself.....
Its is not forinstance the same as the scenario of H or L repeating 12 times. When you play H and L strategy continually this will occur, just a matter of time. However, if you play HIT AND RUN a different picture manifests. We can be confident that the results we have found will be the overall picture. Perhaps a triple loss will occur but this as we have seen has not happened yet. Even if it does your bankroll will be high enough to absorb this slight loss.
As JohnLegend says "I can now loss 20 times in a row and still be well in the plus....
We just have to build our BR, this is the only time we are slightly vulnerable, once we have built up our BR we keep rolling along............
I feel PATTERN 4 will keep yielding the same pattern.........
Quote from: GLC on Jun 03, 02:44 PM 2011
Hey guys,
I know that this is going to sound like I'm being negative. I just can't help it. I don't see how waiting for certain patterns and then betting for or against increases our odds or strike rate.
All we're doing is finding a rare situation and betting that a pattern of 3 won't form. The problem is that we bet so rarely that it takes a long time to realize that we're really getting the same odds as if we bet against or for that pattern every three spins.
Am I missing something here. Someone please enlighten me again.
GLC
i get your point G. (hihihi)
and it is true. the way the system is designed is the same as betting against Black with a 1-2-4 progression. At least same odds. Gambler's Fallacy strikes again...
however scenario changes if you design your bet and progression accordingly.
please recheck my post on this thread to see what i mean or at twister's playing bac with pattern 4 for a full insight on it.
link:://rouletteforum.cc/off-topic/baccarat-thread-usin-p4/msg55136/#msg55136 (link:://rouletteforum.cc/off-topic/baccarat-thread-usin-p4/msg55136/#msg55136)
reply #16
Cheers G.
O0
Quote from: amk on Jun 03, 03:05 PM 2011
Hello GLC,
JohnLegend would have the best insight.....
My feeling is that we are stepping outside of certain scenarios occuring and thus maintaining an overall picture which will keep repeating itself.....
Its is not forinstance the same as the scenario of H or L repeating 12 times. When you play H and L strategy continually this will occur, just a matter of time. However, if you play HIT AND RUN a different picture manifests. We can be confident that the results we have found will be the overall picture. Perhaps a triple loss will occur but this as we have seen has not happened yet. Even if it does your bankroll will be high enough to absorb this slight loss.
As JohnLegend says "I can now loss 20 times in a row and still be well in the plus....
We just have to build our BR, this is the only time we are slightly vulnerable, once we have built up our BR we keep rolling along............
I feel PATTERN 4 will keep yielding the same pattern.........
Amk you have really learnt something, I know its disheartenning to suffer a bad session when you haven't gone clear yet with your bankroll. But you have to try and realize this is the mental test. If you pass it you will push on to greater things.
Think for a moment does a champion poker player always win. You pick yourself up dust yourself down and push on with the task at hand. I think one of the reasons this game is still largely thought of as unbeatable is because the average player thinks a good method should never lose or have a negative day.
Again if your BANKROLL were strong enough you would recover so fast youd have no time to sulk mull over the bad session. I will never mislead you I said you should play this method with at least 200 units for a reason. TIME/INVINCIBILITY is always the trade. If you could sit around and wait for a double loss. You may have a strikerate that rivals or even surpasses MATRIX VERTICAL 5. But why isnt every member on this forum playing MATRIX VERTICAL 5?
They lack the patience that why. When it will destroy Roulette until the end of time but hardly anyone can wait to win. So we have to make a compromise. Bring a method to you that can produce decent winning streaks and solid limits to consecutive losses. But it requires a pretty solid bankroll to run it.
If Clothdog were playing with a 5,000 unit BR at his current level for example. His third game would have repaired most of the damage. And he will push back on course in the coming days. You have to stick with something long enough to build the confidence I have. If you keep chopping and changing you will never really learn the strengths and weakness of anything and thus never really progress.
I know this method OVERALL is a certain winner if you can stay with it. I have had a few bad days. But BECAUSE I have the BANKROLL behind me I know its always coming back. Its one step backwards and three steps forward. Stay mentally strong people and in time you will fully understand all I have just typed. :o
As everyone says
Bankroll
MM
Method
and the mind all need to be conquered
today is great on paddypower..
I let myself get sucked in when the wheel was not playing this method well, xxvv is a good idea I think, experience will teach me that.
or should have switched to pattern breaker
I was just testing on off for about 8 hours (mainly for record) and the streaking of high/low was causing the problems about 8 hours this went on for .. I knew it too but still played it , the mind an obstacle, and experience.
my new rule if I get two close losses wait for a trigger/ walk away or switch strategy for rest of day
my results john.. I was just watching many games and I don't think I recorded everything I watched . but its went over 8 hour period both sessions.
intermitten sessions about an hour apart . I was recording just to see the end result. I was -40 points an left for the day
19 wins 7 losses
but recordings today
18 wins 2 losses
no double losses
last night the wheel was fine again
I was using the superb orphis tracker yesterday at an online casino real wheel I was feeding lots of live spin data in to the tracker , the new multi system tracker is a good idea to monitor how the systems are playing . I did notice how pattern 4 was performing , the true facts are on some sessions it was at say plus 50 maybe a bit more on some long sessions, on other sessions I so minus 80 , from what I see the balance rises then falls off , worst case scenario is a falling balance from the start. Having to have very big bankrolls to win for me is a bad idea. On real play I would be surprised to make more than 50 chips before losing the lot . 50 chips would be a really good out come some sessions can go to plus 18 or less then drop of to say minus 60 or more.
Hi All
2 sessions today first one the H/L lost on the first bet session (This is the first time I have seen it whilst playing and only the 3rd time if you include my 3300 Live Spins data) but as JL says you play L3 for 2 more games and turned the -21 into +3 (Thats what I like to see) ;D The O/E & R/B both won on their first bet sequence so ended with +9 :thumbsup:
This evenings session was the normal +9, apprx 10mins, H/L came in on 3rd bet with O/E & R/B both hitting on the first bets
With regards to the zero debate, at present I'm not covering it but when I start to bet with higher units I will cover it, and the way I look at the zero in the matrix is as follows
H/L = Zero is High as it sits between 26 & 32
O/E = Zero is Even as it sits between 2 even's
R/B = Zero will be treated as the colour before
Thats how I will treat it when I'm tracking back to place my future bets
Gordon
I was watching the live roulette wheel on smartonline casino friday. I watched 11 blacks come in amongst 1 red. The dealer commented that earlier today that he had spun 16 blacks in a row!! the most he has ever seen on that. It's funny, when things are on a trend you hate to bet against it when PB4 says to. I lost a game when I was betting against color last night.
RRR
BRB
RRR
RRR...lost
I hate bucking the trend especially colors.
cd
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 04, 12:58 AM 2011
I was watching the live roulette wheel on smartonline casino friday. I watched 11 blacks come in amongst 1 red. The dealer commented that earlier today that he had spun 16 blacks in a row!! the most he has ever seen on that. It's funny, when things are on a trend you hate to bet against it when PB4 says to. I lost a game when I was betting against color last night.
RRR
BRB
RRR
RRR...lost
I hate bucking the trend especially colors.
cd
Clothdog I dont play RED OR BLACK, as in my experience they tend to chain longer runs of one colour or another. People will argue an even chance is an even chance. But you dont get the same breakdown of results with HIGH AN LOW and RED and BLACK. And most E/C players pile their chips on RED AND BLACK. Ive been in a casino where there were stacks and stacks on RED AND BLACK. And just a few on HIGH AND LOW.
And I am sure this something to take note of, so I am playing HIGH, LOW----ODD, EVEN only
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 04, 12:58 AM 2011
I was watching the live roulette wheel on smartonline casino friday. I watched 11 blacks come in amongst 1 red. The dealer commented that earlier today that he had spun 16 blacks in a row!! the most he has ever seen on that. It's funny, when things are on a trend you hate to bet against it when PB4 says to. I lost a game when I was betting against color last night.
RRR
BRB
RRR
RRR...lost
I hate bucking the trend especially colors.
cd
hi cloth. plz just do o/e, or ignore R/B when such situation occurs. qualify the rule, not bet, when one colour is 'streaking'
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 04, 02:57 AM 2011
hi cloth. plz just do o/e, or ignore R/B when such situation occurs. qualify the rule, not bet, when one colour is 'streaking'
Good advice Halba1 remember 12 blacks or reds can easily happen. You don't see too many runs of 12 highs or lows. I know the wheel would appear to offer no advantage to any one even chance. But this is the way it pans out in REALITY. Odds and Evens are somewhere in the middle. But they are still behaving themselves within the parameters of PATTERN 4/BREAKER. And they offer a more attractive betting turnover when combined with HIGH AND LOW. There is no need to get greedy. I know Gordonline is doing well combining all three Even chances. And I hope he will continue to profit.
Personally I am more comfortable with the two aforementioned plays. Besides we arent putting all our eggs in one basket. We have PATTERN BREAKER, DIVIDE AND CONQUER AND MATRIX VERTICAL 5 HIGH AND LOW. To hit the casinos with too. And that's plenty.
Quote from: strato1985 on Jun 03, 05:08 PM 2011
As everyone says
Bankroll
MM
Method
and the mind all need to be conquered
today is great on paddypower..
I let myself get sucked in when the wheel was not playing this method well, xxvv is a good idea I think, experience will teach me that.
or should have switched to pattern breaker
I was just testing on off for about 8 hours (mainly for record) and the streaking of high/low was causing the problems about 8 hours this went on for .. I knew it too but still played it , the mind an obstacle, and experience.
my new rule if I get two close losses wait for a trigger/ walk away or switch strategy for rest of day
my results john.. I was just watching many games and I don't think I recorded everything I watched . but its went over 8 hour period both sessions.
intermitten sessions about an hour apart . I was recording just to see the end result. I was -40 points an left for the day
19 wins 7 losses
but recordings today
18 wins 2 losses
no double losses
last night the wheel was fine again
Strato1985 YES mix it up, Even when I have days where PATTERN 4 didn't perform as well as others. I am winning on three other methods. MATRIX VERTICAL 5 is a certainty. Pattern Breaker is a strange but wonderful beast. EXAMPLE. You might lose a game and then play a back to back game and get 10 or more games before the forces of random pull that final pattern into line I am learning to read this more and more and let it ride. KNOW YOUR GAME. Then there are no surprises, when you lose you know how to deal with it.You don't go into meltdown with that feeling in your gut that you are losing. that's for gamblers. We are not gambling here we know ULTIMATELY we are going to be moving in positive figures. Gamblers have no control of themselves or the outcomes.
They have prepared to fail because they FAILED to PREPARE. No discipline, no method NO HOPE.
It always comes down to your BANKROLL, you wont give recovering at least half of a double loss for pattern 4 a second thought for example once you BR is 50 times your level one stakes. Your progress is always at odds with the demons in yourself telling you to hurry up and get rich play all night and don't stick to the rules. I've made all these mistakes in my time, I lost for 4 years playing this game until I realized WHAT was required to master it.
And from that point the only way is up. If you want a method that will never lose or at worst lose so seldom its of little significance to your BR 125 units will buy that for you. With MATRIX VERTICAL 5 HIGH AND LOW. But you will require you know what...
I will lay it out for you in plain English always, you will grow old and die before you will ever find a fast paced method that never loses. Random will always figure out the code at some point. A slower paced Method with a trigger is something else altogether. Its the price you pay to beat this game.
Hello John & halba1,
thanks for the well timed advice and will heed it. I kept thinking about what you posted, because as I sat there I noticed the dealer would spin 4-5 red or black in a row come back with a red or black and then string 4-6 of one color again. So playing color is off my playlist.
Also, with O/E what about using 0 for even? On second thought I'll just use X's advice and split the 0/00.
Cd
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 04, 10:16 AM 2011
Hello John & halba1,
thanks for the well timed advice and will heed it. I kept thinking about what you posted, because as I sat there I noticed the dealer would spin 4-5 red or black in a row come back with a red or black and then string 4-6 of one color again. So playing color is off my playlist.
Also, with O/E what about using 0 for even? On second thought I'll just use X's advice and split the 0/00.
Cd
Clothdog, if you are feeling vunerable at the moment play the losing game trigger. I don't care if it takes you longer. Get yourself to safer ground Bankroll wise. I know its easier for me to sound off about bankrolls. I didn't get safe overnight it took me years. So you need to take your time. And say aim to be invincible by years end. If I played PATTERN 4 with a losing game trigger but layed on heavy stakes I would actually make more money and so will you. We are all fighting our lack of patience. We really are, but even with a losing game trigger this method is faster than MATRIX VERTICAL 5. And the strikerate would become closer to MV5 with a trigger. So until you are powerful that would be my advice to newbies.
Hello albertojonas,
If we are living in an illusion then it is a great one and please let us stay in it...
We will report back to you when the method fails...
deal?
Quote from: albertojonas on Jun 04, 11:15 AM 2011
This system the way it is designed is doomed to lose. it is a petty that you J.Legend delete my posts.
if the only true is your true why do you even post?
i didn't promisse to post nothing but good results in your thread.
the claim that color strikes more than any other even chance is complete nonsense.
man up and accept the facts.
>:D
There was another guy who deletes posts here. It was James Wendel.
I don't like your negativity fullstop. And I don't want someone who has nothing but negative jibes to offer littering my thread. If you don't like it start your own thread. And sound off about how you cannot beat the game, so therefore nobody else can beat the game. I will keep winning as will others who play the methods properly.
You are a mathematicians lapdog, who thinks whatever they say is the end of it. I know different as a fact. There will always be people who can't understand a different way of looking at things. I cannot change that flaw but it doesn't mean I have to put up with you constantly making snide remarks towards me and my methods. Start your own thread of negativity and stay off mine. Until you open your mind.
albertojonas
JL has requested that you leave negative jibes out of his Thread, please do so.
Thank you
ADMIN
That's interesting a neg. trigger. that means you rule out much possibility of 2 neg in 1 session but it will take some time to achieve that.
maybe just do it normally, and have P1 and P2. I don't know what albert jonas is suggesting regarding his progressions. He is against martingale, and says you can achieve same result with other progressions. but the other progressions don't recover losses. his techniques are like flat betting, where if you have a few negative, you need same amount of positive to recover. you'll probably end up neutral in the session like that though.
its a bit waste of time doing flat bet, as roulette is a time consuming 1hr session esp. if live.
well said Twister if he's not interested leave the others who are alone !!
Is that to much to ask for from the forum
you don't watch eastenders if you hate it do you
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 04, 04:21 PM 2011
That's interesting a neg. trigger. that means you rule out much possibility of 2 neg in 1 session but it will take some time to achieve that.
maybe just do it normally, and have P1 and P2. I don't know what albert jonas is suggesting regarding his progressions. He is against martingale, and says you can achieve same result with other progressions. but the other progressions don't recover losses. his techniques are like flat betting, where if you have a few negative, you need same amount of positive to recover. you'll probably end up neutral in the session like that though.
its a bit waste of time doing flat bet, as roulette is a time consuming 1hr session especially. if live.
Flat betting plays into the hands of everything the maths boys believe in. House edge etc. At the same time I don't recommend suicidal progressions that put 100s of units at risk and try to outlive a losing streak. That is where the confusion comes from by critics who can't see a half way point.
Good Money management is ABSOLUTELY CRUCIAL. To be successful in roulette we are risking money to win money. We need to manage that very smartly that's a given. The most important thing to master with your method is its weak points. What negative people cannot understand is I never intended P4 to be invincible. If you want that you have MATRIX VERTICAL 5 with its price for that super strikerate.
I wanted a method that had a decent turnover for real casino play. And at the same time a barrier it has no intention of passing too often. And that barrier is three consecutive losing games. In fact 4 consecutive losing games may be impossible or super rare. Here we enter MV5 territory. With a shorter waiting time.
If you want to play this method consecutively I recommend strongly implementing a losing game trigger. I have discussed this with another member and intend to post up another thread with this in mind. I recommend this is the best way forward for newbies. When you have several thousand units its easier to go straight in I do realize that. I play pattern breaker consecutively because its a different animal. And P4 will perform on the same level with a trigger. This will be food for thought over the coming days and weeks.
JohnLegend this is an excellent system. Well done. :thumbsup:
271 wins 28 losses 1 double loss
355pts won 137 points lost
thats my full recordings to date
i just record on one long note pad document , updating a win loss total every 10 or so games .
just an idea for easy recording
Quote from: Proofreaders2000 on Jun 04, 09:35 PM 2011
JohnLegend this is an excellent system. Well done. :thumbsup:
Thankyou Proof...
Quote from: strato1985 on Jun 05, 07:59 AM 2011
271 wins 28 losses 1 double loss
355pts won 137 points lost
that's my full recordings to date
i just record on one long note pad document , updating a win loss total every 10 or so games .
just an idea for easy recording
Nice results Strato1985, you have done better than me on double losses only one in 301 games. That to me is the value of this method. Not that it produces earth shattering winning streaks like MV5 because it doesn't. But the consistency of its losing limits.
No one has ever reported a TRIPPLE LOSS. And I think a QUAD LOSS would be rarer than 5 FIVE POINTERS for MV5 if not impossible for random to produce. that's where my enthusiasm for the method stems from. When you can identify within a playable method a virtual limit. You really can systematically beat the game day in day out.
People who use methods that fail them badly in the end suffer because they never identified the losing limit of the method. Like the guy in the book who would wait for Red or black to not show for 3 spins, then commence betting it couldn't possibly show 15 in a row of one or the other. He won a bundle. Then one day he had 18 reds staring at him and no bankroll left.
Those are the types of straight play methods that are doomed longterm. They play straight off the layout. They are the types of methods that perpetuate Roulettes lie. That its a game nobody can conquer in the longterm.
Casinos welcome you through the doors, come play our games some will get lucky most will not and at the end of the night theyve made a tidy little profit, house edge and house limits have done their job. Do you think if everybody went to the casino tonight and played PATTERN 4 the casino would make a tidy profit?
No, theyd be shell shocked, and that night if repeated over and over would really get something started. Obviously that can never happen on that scale because even if you gave this method to every player on earth. Not even 1 in a 100 would use it. Especially as its simplicity deceives its potential. But if 3 or 4 players hit a casino for a week and play big enough. Some damage will get done. And more importantly MUCH MORE IMPORTANTLY. The seeds of doubt will have been planted.
Because casinos have a titanium belief the only way someone could beat them OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN. Is by cheating. Biased wheels and such. As done by the Palaya family some years ago. When they come to realize they were beaten fair and square by a SIMPLE mechanical method like PATTERN 4 or DIVIDE AND CONQUER. They will have more than a little concern. Their biggest concern would be the knowledge of such methods spreading to the mainstream. That is what will be visited upon them from March next year.
Without doubt the strongest results I had from roulette
ALTHOUGH i've not tested many games of the other strong methods on here.
i've had one dyer day with this where I just could not win for toffee , I lost 40 units, and my test results showed many more losses for that one day. I think I measured it at one point 3-1, but since that day it just can't't lose again..
So a valuable lesson for me is if I lose two games close together I walk away for the day with the method.. Because the losing streak took 8 hours to pass until it returned to norm 12-1 which is where i've been at for over a month!!
changing wheel, playing to lose is also an option to consider or play mv5
just my own strategy moving forward to consistent winning, i'm still a newbie playing low stakes
Hello strato1985,
May I ask how many consecutive games you won after your double loss?
Might it be possible for everyone with double loss data to post this?
Would be interesting to see....
JohnLegend I believe mentioned that he has not seen a double loss followed by less then two consecutive wins..
Quote from: strato1985 on Jun 05, 11:26 AM 2011
Without doubt the strongest results I had from roulette
ALTHOUGH i've not tested many games of the other strong methods on here.
i've had one dyer day with this where I just could not win for toffee , I lost 40 units, and my test results showed many more losses for that one day. I think I measured it at one point 3-1, but since that day it just can't't lose again..
So a valuable lesson for me is if I lose two games close together I walk away for the day with the method.. Because the losing streak took 8 hours to pass until it returned to norm 12-1 which is where i've been at for over a month!!
changing wheel, playing to lose is also an option to consider or play mv5
just my own strategy moving forward to consistent winning, i'm still a newbie playing low stakes
Yes Strato1985, But if you had the power behind you. You could have turned even that day into a winning day. Every losing game would have been cancelled out with the next game.
You will eventually arrive at that point and never fear the game again. Also to anwser AMK Double losses for High and low are infrequent. I've had 4 in over 500 games now. And you usually get a run of winners after them.
Theres a point you reach with this method where you know you are going to show positive numbers. You can enter the cycle at the wrong time and lose your first game of the day. Or even 4 games out of 10 which again if you have the bankroll will still result in profit.
Or you could enter the cycle at the right time and watch 7-16 wins reel off consecutively.
What matters is that the majority of losing games are singular. If you have a 1,000 units and you play the game properly you are set for life. You simply grow and grow. If you have a 1000 units and you play 7,14,28 for 7 units a win. that's the right balance. When you have 2,000 units you are playing for 14 units a game. 5 wins a day is 70 units. And you are aiming to grow your bankroll by 2--5% a day. You are never going to look back, so strive to reach that 1,000 unit BANKROLL. That is the point of no return for you as a losing player and a cut in the casinos daily bread becomes your right.
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 03, 11:13 AM 2011
Betting unit is minimum $15. I play with $25.
cd
Clothdog hi, something I wanted to ask you. You are playing a minumum of 15$
a game. How does this breakdown. Is it 15,30,60 ? Unless your BANKROLL is at least 2000 units. That is too much. Or am I wrong?
Quote from: amk on Jun 05, 11:54 AM 2011
Hello strato1985,
May I ask how many consecutive games you won after your double loss?
Might it be possible for everyone with double loss data to post this?
Would be interesting to see....
JohnLegend I believe mentioned that he has not seen a double loss followed by less then two consecutive wins..
AMK dont get too hung up on double losses. One they dont happen often and two its that THIRD game thats important. You can recover a healthy portion of the loss right there. I will give examples to illustrate this over the coming days.
RESULTS UPDATE FOR PATTERN 4
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 510
TOTAL GAMES WON 471
TOTAL GAMES LOST 39
STRIKERATE APPROX 12/1
BALANCE 442 POINTS PLUS
DOUBLE LOSSES 4
LONGEST WINNING STREAK 37
FIRST GAME WINNING STREAK 35
Cross playing HIGH and LOW and ODD and EVEN. HIGH and LOW is still performing slightly better recent double loss was on ODD and EVEN. Two things have come to my attention of late most losses are caused when betting against three of the same such as H H H. Or by the zero. Most of the success comes from betting against mixed patterns.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 04, 04:04 PM 2011
I don't like your negativity fullstop. And I don't want someone who has nothing but negative jibes to offer littering my thread. If you don't like it start your own thread. And sound off about how you cannot beat the game, so therefore nobody else can beat the game. I will keep winning as will others who play the methods properly.
You are a mathematicians lapdog, who thinks whatever they say is the end of it. I know different as a fact. There will always be people who can't understand a different way of looking at things. I cannot change that flaw but it doesn't mean I have to put up with you constantly making snide remarks towards me and my methods. Start your own thread of negativity and stay off mine. Until you open your mind.
you are not being faithful to the truth.
I made some quality remarks to this system. You just knocked that off. I sincerely wish you do good with any system you design, but we live in a free world and so i have the possibility of expressing my own thoughts.
It's healthy to the community that we all share different opinions.
I just feel it is not fair to delete my posts because they criticize nor swear my person with curses of negativity and small intelligence. -Notice that i never said that you were a "stupid" believer. nothing like that.
Also if you pay attention i made constructive criticism to your system. If you reread my posts you will observe that i question most is your posted results:
No one here have tried it and has only 4 double losses as you claim.
And something you would never forget is that you are just another brick in the wall.
Not any kind of god, neither some roulette guru who claims color strikes more than any even chance...
humble up.
respect
AL
Quote from: albertojonas on Jun 05, 03:28 PM 2011
you are not being faithful to the truth.
I made some quality remarks to this system. You just knocked that off. I sincerely wish you do good with any system you design, but we live in a free world and so I have the possibility of expressing my own thoughts.
It's healthy to the community that we all share different opinions.
I just feel it is not fair to delete my posts because they criticize nor swear my person with curses of negativity and small intelligence. -Notice that I never said that you were a "regular" believer. nothing like that.
Also if you pay attention I made constructive criticism to your system. If you reread my posts you will observe that I question most is your posted results:
No one here have tried it and has only 4 double losses as you claim.
And something you would never forget is that you are just another brick in the wall.
Not any kind of God, neither some roulette guru who claims color strikes more than any even chance...
humble up.
respect
AL
Albertojonas, do you question Strato1985 or Gordonline? Their results are better than mine. I think you have a self esteem problem. And because I am getting a degree of attention on here you resent this. What I say to you is we already know you dont like the method/s or me. There is no need to keep going on with it. You have said your piece so move on. I am never going to convince you I have this game beaten theres nothing more to be said on the issue.
Regards JL
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 05, 03:39 PM 2011
Albertojonas, do you question Strato1985 or Gordonline? Their results are better than mine. I think you have a self esteem problem. And because I am getting a degree of attention on here you resent this. What I say to you is we already know you don't like the method/s or me. There is no need to keep going on with it. You have said your piece so move on. I am never going to convince you I have this game beaten theres nothing more to be said on the issue.
Regards JL
this kind of sh** i can not accept from you. i did not gave you the intimacy to those kind of words.
If you can not understand what i write here, it's ok for me, just do not continue on gratuity curse and do not distort the meaning of my words.Notice also that you never answer straight to my replies... I reinstate that i have nothing against your person. We are all here discussing ideas, separate waters. You may also regard with curiosity that along almost a year in this forum i never made any "negative" intended reply in any thread. Go search for them...
Respect
Al
Guys let's get along. Alberto is not an ass-hole and has no self esteem problem, he is just pursuing beating roulette and probably upset that the method did not work with him. He is a good guy, John Legend u may misunderstand what he means.
so let's calm down folks and get down to beating roulette, not each other
Thanks JohnLegend for discussing the double loses...
Really enjoy discovering, playing and researching your methods....
From what I have seen of the roulette world you are a breath of fresh air...
Always some scam or losing system being sold....
You just present your results and help people..
Ignore the small stuff.......
Hi JL,
Since there has been a little 'heat' in this thread I decided to calculate just how likely your results are, according to probability theory. Now I know that you are contemptuous of mathematics, but that's ok, the maths doesn't care; it is what it is. ;)
Your results are:
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 510
TOTAL GAMES WON 471
TOTAL GAMES LOST 39
I haven't actually tested your system, but I understand that the chance of a loss is approx 1/8 (ignoring the zero effect).
Now the chance that you will get more than this number of losses is 99.97%, and that's relatively conservative because I haven't taken into account the zero.
I have to say, these results are so impressive that I'm tempted to give your system a trial. What's your secret?
Quote from: Bayes on Jun 05, 05:37 PM 2011
I have to say, these results are so impressive that I'm tempted to give your system a trial.
If U do try it out ayes, U could no worse than play a few games through Ophis's MST, and select some or ALL of John's handy work.
They are all in the tracker/clicker.
It's quite interesting. :-\ :-\
Have you been getting similar results Chris? I must admit I haven't been following the thread so I've no idea if JL's results are typical.
Ok lets move on Alberto i'm not slating you but your not interested in this really so please leave us to find out in peace . if we fail then i'm a man of the nothing ventured nothing gained view.
If your not interested then why waste your time here. (that not a question i want you to answer).
John that was just one day in over a month now, i've been there an come out the other side stronger. I had no double loss that day, even though i recorded 26 games for that day (just for experiance purposes) next time i'll handle it like a baby
On that day it was streaking high low for 8 hours, I read this at the time, but didn't react, I should have played any combination other than HHH LLL to slightly increase my chances.. experience..
Please not in my results i had 19 wins and 7 losses for that day, I've still included these in my overall stats even though i would never have played them, so my own personal strike rate is higher.
As long as you don't get past the double loss, that's the killer
P3 is a nasty escalation, and will risk the bank in my opinion especially if playing with more than 1pounds. no difference to standard martingale which can threaten table limit. also the P3 progression is simply to recover ,and gain a net 1 unit. so it makes no sense to risk hundreds of pounds for 1 unit .
e.g.
1,2,4 - not too bad here eh!
8,16,32 >> still okay!
48,96,192 >> yikes...its getting hot in here!
nabos
Mixed for me at the moment, since I play at BV RNG, which is supposed to be just NOT suitable at all, but what I like, is to run ALL the MST tracker elements at the same time ("auto- experimental") and I watch how the trending goes on all johns work.
Could be a really good test, if JUST JL's Matrix bets were selected in the MST tracker/clicker, and we do a thorough "inspection" with agreed terms, stake, BR, No. of spins and other such criteria, to fully evaluate the best places for the Matrix bets to be used.
I for one will be doing such analysis over the coming weeks, and will post up exacting specifications, as to how I intend to "gauge" the results.
In essence, as U know, they all need to be in the same formate from all the testers who post up their results, for Us ALL to truly- evaluate.
Thanks Chris, so I take it that your results haven't been as good as JLs. I saw that at least 2 others have done at least as well, any more? don't be shy!
QuoteCould be a really good test, if JUST JL's Matrix bets were selected in the MST tracker/clicker, and we do a thorough "inspection" with agreed terms, stake, BR, No. of spins and other such criteria, to fully evaluate the best places for the Matrix bets to be used.
That's a good idea.
you may want to wait till tomorrow because i will release updated version.
this one is bugged on win7.
bayes could you do a calculation on hitting a treble loss please?
btw bayes how you would calculate zscore of PB4.
add bets,wins form all EC, add it up and then calculate zscore
or
calculate zscore separately for each EC and then take average of them 3.
"Two things have come to my attention of late most losses are caused when betting against three of the same such as H H H. Or by the zero. Most of the success comes from betting against mixed patterns"
There is a solution for it, ignore a triple with the same like HHH/LLL, OOO/EEE and bet the next row if not HHH.
But always bet Ha, Ha, Ha... ???
Hermes
P.S. albertojonas it is an excellent strategy. I won all sessions on baccarat. Test it and you will accept it because of the results you get. But still the Marty progression is the weakest link on that strategy.
Quote from: Bayes on Jun 05, 06:00 PM 2011
Thanks Chris, so I take it that your results haven't been as good as JLs. I saw that at least 2 others have done at least as well, any more? don't be shy!
That's a good idea.
Some of the results are very good.
And double losses are common at BV, but progression soon sorts them out!!
Others Matix bets, bring the Casino wall bearing down on Ur BR like Godzilla!!
But that will be because of the Heavy Heavy repeater nature of BV, it likes to repeat, which IS like random want to repeat itself exactly! ::)
Of them all PB4 seems to do the best because it plays across the three EC's (type wise I mean)
and so, there's a greater "Natural" chance for things to go well.
Forcing Random to do the same as a time before, IS a very clever move, and to be applauded, tho it still remains an Illusion bet for the many who try it.
Where we can continue with this work, is if somehow, we could force the INSIDE results to do the same!!
Now there's a story for another day!
Try out the MST tracker Jules, U will like it.
ESP the upward and downward indicators of Z-score/Trending. Great stuff.
Quote from: chrisbis on Jun 05, 05:53 PM 2011
Mixed for me at the moment, since I play at BV RNG, which is supposed to be just NOT suitable at all, but what I like, is to run ALL the MST tracker elements at the same time ("auto- experimental") and I watch how the trending goes on all johns work.
Could be a really good test, if JUST JL's Matrix bets were selected in the MST tracker/clicker, and we do a thorough "inspection" with agreed terms, stake, BR, No. of spins and other such criteria, to fully evaluate the best places for the Matrix bets to be used.
I for one will be doing such analysis over the coming weeks, and will post up exacting specifications, as to how I intend to "gauge" the results.
In essence, as you know, they all need to be in the same formate from all the testers who post up their results, for Us ALL to truly- evaluate.
hi, I don't like BV RNG interface. how do you get a free spin there. but yes I also have mixed results on RNGs, especially with the even chance bets, they repeat frequently. but no double loss and overall never lost a session.
re: inside betting system. i'd avoid it entirely. its impossible to predict single areas. outside bets is easier.
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 05, 06:09 PM 2011
re: inside betting system. i'd avoid it entirely. its impossible to predict single areas. outside bets is easier.
Oh no is isn't!
Esp at Bv No Zero.!! ;)
I have it cracked >:D
Quote from: chrisbis on Jun 05, 06:16 PM 2011
Oh no is isn't!
especially at Bv No Zero.!! ;)
I have it cracked >:D
we'll be in touch =). u must have mastered BV.
Quote from: chrisbis on Jun 05, 06:16 PM 2011
Oh no is isn't!
especially at Bv No Zero.!! ;)
I have it cracked >:D
what do u mean "cracked"?
I don't understand how much it takes to persuasive a loser?
Guys remember: your bankroll will be always mixed for rest of your lives if you start to play RNGs for real! Scientists call it earthquakes.
You even shouldn't mention RNGs on the forum because it is like bad omen on craps tables when you say SEVEN!
Hermes
Quote from: Hermes on Jun 05, 06:23 PM 2011
I don't................. when you say SEVEN!
Hermes
Ha Ha. Good one!! :)
And Seven is my favourite number too!!
I'll try not mention the R word again, in these parts.
Quote from: iggiv on Jun 05, 06:22 PM 2011
what do u mean "cracked"?
Winning.
Daily.
2 different ways.
3rd on its way.
"Cracked" ..............I think that covers it.
More to come.
Amazing to see Bayes, Chrisbis, Ophis and Hermes on PATTERN 4 forum.....
Hope Scoobydoo might join us...
PATTERN 4 is amazing but it is ofcourse the combination of playing PATTERN 4, DIVIDE AND CONQUER, PATTERN BREAKER, MATRIX VERTICAL H&L AND MATRIX VERTICAL 5 all in the same hour our two.
Online you have two wheels available.....
yes, using different methods can be the answer
Hi John & All
Still playing all 3 E/C's (Not at the same time) and tonight acheived my +9 Units and although I had a single loss on my 1st O/E sequence it recovered back to +3 after 2 more winning sequences
My summary is as follows since playing for real money
Games Played = 33
Games Won = 30
Single Losses = 3
Double Losses = 0
Profit/Loss = +81 Units
Not alot, but I have the patience to slowly build my BR before increasing my unit bets ;)
This is an excellent strategy and so easy to play, well done JL :thumbsup:
Gordon
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 05, 05:52 PM 2011
As long as you don't get past the double loss, that's the killer
P3 is a nasty escalation, and will risk the bank in my opinion especially if playing with more than 1pounds. no difference to standard martingale which can threaten table limit. also the P3 progression is simply to recover ,and gain a net 1 unit. so it makes no sense to risk hundreds of pounds for 1 unit .
e.g.
1,2,4 - not too bad here eh!
8,16,32 >> still okay!
48,96,192 >> yikes...its getting hot in here!
Halba1 you don't try to recover the whole stake in one game that's the classic mistake. You recover 3/7 or there abouts so you would stake something like this
1,2,4
3,6,12
12,24,48
that's what I do but I have the bankroll. Remember the first game of each day I play at level 2 for both Hi lo and od ev so you are pinching extra units on these first games before dropping down to level 1. And when you hit a double figured streak for that first game which you will often. This is where one of your advantages is gained. So when I get a losing game which is nearly always later pulling back the loss is much easier.
And when hit and run works its magic that's when you really go ahead. One step backwards three steps forward is the name of the game. ALWAYS playing with a BR at least 20 times bigger than your level one stakes. Preferably 40 times bigger. I kid you not.
The persom who has a 1,000 unit BR and plays for 5-7 max units per game as I do is set for life. I make no bones about that.
Quote from: Bayes on Jun 05, 05:37 PM 2011
Hi JL,
Since there has been a little 'heat' in this thread I decided to calculate just how likely your results are, according to probability theory. Now I know that you are contemptuous of mathematics, but that's ok, the maths doesn't care; it is what it is. ;)
Your results are:
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 510
TOTAL GAMES WON 471
TOTAL GAMES LOST 39
I haven't actually tested your system, but I understand that the chance of a loss is approx 1/8 (ignoring the zero effect).
Now the chance that you will get more than this number of losses is 99.97%, and that's relatively conservative because I haven't taken into account the zero.
I have to say, these results are so impressive that I'm tempted to give your system a trial. What's your secret?
Hi Bayes, there is no secret but an understanding of what this method delivers most of the time played hit and run. That it seldom produces double losses and will be rare to show you a treble loss AGAIN played HIT AND RUN.
Ad to this money management that takes advantage of the impressive winning streaks the first game of the day can deliver. And the results speak for themselves.
Now on paper you are right play this method consecutively with a one level progression and you can't win. Do as the casinos want you to do you are toast.
BUT, we arent playing the way nature intended. We are organising our campaign around the strengths of the method. And its not just working how I play it. Both Strato1985 and Gordonline are outdoing me. Warrior too has taken this to a level I Cannot believe.
It basically works Bayes applied in the right way. So your test will only tell me what I already know. But I and others will still be building BANKROLLS. Maths can't explain everything it really can't. MATRIX VERTICAL 5 totaly defies math.
My arguments have always been simple and successful overall. Random has things it doesn't do very well. Once you identify them you are on the right track. You can't beat random straight off the layout.
I saw someone learn that the hard way the other night playing against six of the same dozen forming. Covering the two other dozens. They had won 120 times in a row. When random decided no only was it going to deliver 6 dozen 1s but throw a zero smack in the middle. He waved 242 units goodbye. Hed have been a lot safer putting that on MV5 but people can't wait to win. that's why casinos never have to worry.
What all the methods I play have in common is they take random away from the layout break up its flow and affect its performance. They ask random to do things over and over again that go against what random is all about.
They set it codes to figure out. And it has a limit to how often its interested in solving the code. The price to the player is time. But the reward is certain. NEVER BE IN A HURRY to beat this game just BEAT IT.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 05, 07:11 PM 2011
Halba1 you don't try to recover the whole stake in one game that's the classic mistake. You recover 3/7 or there abouts so you would stake something like this
1,2,4
3,6,12
12,24,48
that's what I do but I have the bankroll. Remember the first game of each day I play at level 2 for both Hi lo and od ev so you are pinching extra units on these first games before dropping down to level 1. And when you hit a double figured streak for that first game which you will often. This is where one of your advantages is gained. So when I get a losing game which is nearly always later pulling back the loss is much easier.
And when hit and run works its magic that's when you really go ahead. One step backwards three steps forward is the name of the game. ALWAYS playing with a BR at least 20 times bigger than your level one stakes. Preferably 40 times bigger. I kid you not.
The persom who has a 1,000 unit BR and plays for 5-7 max units per game as I do is set for life. I make no bones about that.
i confirm the above strategy is fine. P3 even looks safe there. you'll recover 3/7 or so. the rest of the sessions - normal profit will compensate. Just need to play more sessions. maybe a robot can help as it can play more and never gets tired.
bankroll 1000 units is fine.
re: Bayes Now the chance that you will get more than this number of losses is 99.97%, and that's relatively conservative because I haven't taken into account the zero.
where did you get that figure bayes? assuming independent events, it stays at 12.5% chance of loss. but its less than that because john is taking the 4th pattern so it mucks up the random of it.
in my opinion getting 2 losses in a row(i.e. P1>>P2) is prolly around 1% chance of loss I reckon. chance of a pattern repeating is 0125*0.125 but thats on the line above and line below. but taking 4th pattern impossible to calculate odds.
all i know it confuses random, thats why it works
Quote from: Bayes on Jun 05, 06:00 PM 2011
Thanks Chris, so I take it that your results haven't been as good as JLs. I saw that at least 2 others have done at least as well, any more? don't be shy!
That's a good idea.
I gave it a whirl over the last few weeks off and on playing at lucky live.
Here are my stats.
total games: 42
total games won:31
total games lost:11
double losses:3
Quote from: Hermes on Jun 05, 06:08 PM 2011
"Two things have come to my attention of late most losses are caused when betting against three of the same such as H H H. Or by the zero. Most of the success comes from betting against mixed patterns"
There is a solution for it, ignore a triple with the same like HHH/LLL, OOO/EEE and bet the next row if not HHH.
But always bet Ha, Ha, Ha... ???
Hermes
P.S. albertojonas it is an excellent strategy. I won all sessions on baccarat. Test it and you will accept it because of the results you get. But still the Marty progression is the weakest link on that strategy.
Hermes,
i know we interacted much before in an excellent (by the way) system of yours on streets.
i saw the way you played it bermuda triangle style. very cool. more bets, no sleep.
i also did my twist (we all do) to adequate it to my playing style.
if you notice my posts on twister's thread playing bac with p4, i said precisely that the progression was the weakest link on this one.
[reveal]8 different combinations is true
but...
4 of those put you on the 2nd step
ie
play against
111
you have
222
212
211
221
could take you on the 3rd step
222
221
and finally you only lose your progression on 1/8
222
====
so if you play 1-2-4
and lose 1/8
you get even
you may use hit & run and leave as soon as you hit +7 on a positive Ecart
or
you can play it other ways
i would try at least 4 diff progressions before that one
1st
1-1-1
2-2-2
3-3-3
4-4-4
etc
2nd
regression
7-3-1
3rd
longest fibbo
1-1-1-2-3-5-8-13...
4th
modified D'Alembert (in which you win as soon as W and L balance out and then reset)
ie.
start with 20units bet
increase +3 on a Loss
decrease -4 on a Win
=====================================================[/reveal]
also posted this remark in that thread
[reveal]
1-2-4= 7units
8-16-32 = 56units
16-32-64 = 112units
175units if you lose 3 times in a row
LLLLLLLLL scenario
wow that is quite a risk isn't it?
per example:
you would lose 42 in the same scenario if using 7-3-1
it is a bit more than 4 times less
[/reveal]
so i do not deny it is a good idea and since the very start of the thread i was saying nothing but that it could be improved.
apart from that, what i can not cope with is the following:
1. the belief that color strikes more than any other even chance.
2. that the odds 1:8 are not given by the progression. odds remain 1:2 apart from the progression.
3. play the first game risking more units is better.
4. hit & run style vs continuous play makes a real measurable difference in long term.
5. results exposed are set in stone (even if hit rate is against all odds) we all must have different results but the norm should be around average.
Cheers,
Al
how is Canada this time of year? Cold?
Quote from: Gordonline on Jun 05, 07:00 PM 2011
Profit/Loss = +81 Units
Not alot, but I have the patience to slowly build my BR before increasing my unit bets
Gordon
Hi Gordon, nice Gin BTW!.
Could I ask U, since I personally think it affects the "Psych" of how one plays,
how much IS ur base unit bet?
At the moment, my min. unit base bet is 0.10 cents
At this level, even when the progression level lifts somewhat, its nearly always less than 1.00
cheers.
Quote from: strato1985 on Jun 05, 06:03 PM 2011
Bayes could you do a calculation on hitting a treble loss please?
Approximately 1/8
3 or 1 in 512.
Quote from: ophis on Jun 05, 06:06 PM 2011
By the way bayes how you would calculate zscore of PB4.
add bets,wins form all EC, add it up and then calculate zscore
or
calculate zscore separately for each EC and then take average of them 3.
It shouldn't make any difference. You can use the formula for z-score using p = 1/8 and that will be close enough. :thumbsup:
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 05, 07:41 PM 2011
where did you get that figure bayes? assuming independent events, it stays at 12.5% chance of loss. but its less than that because john is taking the 4th pattern so it mucks up the random of it.
in my opinion getting 2 losses in a row(i.e. P1>>P2) is prolly around 1% chance of loss I reckon. chance of a pattern repeating is 0125*0.125 but that's on the line above and line below. but taking 4th pattern impossible to calculate odds. all I know it confuses random, that's why it works
No, it's not impossible. Here is the proof:
Since each pattern of the 8 available (ignoring zero for simplicity) is equally likely, and using the 'master formula' for probability:
P = number of 'favourable' outcomes / number of equally likely outcomesWhat is the number of favourable outcomes? since you're betting that the 4th pattern will not be a repeat of the first, the first 3 can be any of the 8 available but the 4th can only be one of 7 if your bet is to be successful (ie; all patterns but the first). For the first pattern, there are 8 possibilities, and for each of these, there are 8 for the 2nd pattern, then for each of these 64 ways, there are 8 possibilities for the 3rd, and finally only 7 for the 4th pattern. So the number of favourable outcomes is -
8✕8✕8✕7
Now the number of equally likely outcomes is just
8✕8✕8✕8
So now if you divide the first number by the second, 3 of the 8's cancel out and you're left with a probability of 7/8, which is just what you would intuitively expect without having done all the maths. Also, you can see that it wouldn't matter whether you chose the first pattern to
not occur anywhere you like (for example, instead of betting that the 4th pattern won't be a repeat of the 1st, you could require that the 6th, 27th, or 393rd pattern won't be a repeat of the 1st, and you would still get the same result, because the favourable outcomes would consist of a row of 8's multiplied together with one 7 in them, and it doesn't matter where the 7 is in the line, because the equally likely outcomes would be a row of 8's multiplied and there would always be one more 8 in the bottom than the top, so the cancellation would always result in 7/8. See what I mean?
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 05, 07:40 PM 2011
Maths can't explain everything it really can't.
No, of course not. If I believed that I wouldn't be here, but it's useful if only to tell you when your results are deviating from expectation. I know the system uses a progression, but the fact is that your losses are significantly less than probability predicts. The numbers always come out the way probability says they will if you're betting randomly (and to my knowledge, no-one has come up with a bet selection which does better than random), so there must be something in the way you're choosing when to bet which explains the results.
Hi, I just thought I would pop in here with a comment on perhaps why H L O E seem to perform better than Red and Black.
Could it have something to do with the wheel layout.
0-32-15-19-4-21-2-25-17-34-6-27-13-36-11-30-8-23-10-5-24-16-33-1-20-14-31 -9-22-18-29-7-28-12-35-3-26
If you notice, red and black are alternate on the wheel, but odd/even, high/low are not quite and there are mini groups that could just tip the balance.
For instance 10-5-24-16 you have 3 low numbers out of 4 also 3 even numbers out of the same 4
another example 15-19-4-21 here we have 3 odd numbers in a sector of 4
Hello by the way.
Arthur
Quote from: Bayes on Jun 06, 03:11 AM 2011
It shouldn't make any difference. You can use the formula for z-score using p = 1/8 and that will be close enough. :thumbsup:
Why 1/8 and not 16/37. Should I reread your zscore thread?
this is how zscore is calculated in MST:
//check zscore of the last N amount bets
n:=MaxBetsAmmount;
//check how many wins there is in the last N bets
t_win:=0;
for i:=1 to n do
if win_pb4.Items[win_pb4.Items.Count-i]='1' then inc(t_win);
//calculation
m:=t_win;
p:=16/37;
t:=(m-n*p);
s:=sqrt(n*p*(1-p));
pb4_zscore:=RoundD(t/s,2);
is here something wrong?
Welcome, Arthur!
A good first post. The point you make is interesting. :thumbsup:
Hopefully, others will pick up on it.
Quote from: ophis on Jun 06, 06:16 AM 2011
Why 1/8 and not 16/37. Should I reread your zscore thread?
this is how zscore is calculated in MST:
//check zscore of the last N amount bets
n:=MaxBetsAmmount;
//check how many wins there is in the last N bets
t_win:=0;
for i:=1 to n do
if win_pb4.Items[win_pb4.Items.Count-i]='1' then inc(t_win);
//calculation
m:=t_win;
p:=16/37;
t:=(m-n*p);
s:=sqrt(n*p*(1-p));
pb4_zscore:=RoundD(t/s,2);
is here something wrong?
Not sure why you're using 16/37, but then I don't know how you're counting the successes for the P4 system. All I'm saying is that if I were tracking it, I would take 3 at a time from the stream of R/B (because the P4 is based on 3 spin patterns) and ignore the zero. Then if there was an exact match I would take that as a loss, the probability of which is 1/8 because there are 8 equally likely patterns. It doesn't matter that it's a 'compound' event (ie; made of 3 spins) as long as you're consistent in how you use the z-score formula. Don't forget though that 'n' in this case is only incremented after 3 spins, not 1 (because you've defined an 'event' in this case to consist of 3 spins). That's what I mean about being consistent.
Quote from: Bayes on Jun 06, 07:17 AM 2011
Not sure why you're using 16/37, but then I don't know how you're counting the successes for the P4 system. All I'm saying is that if I were tracking it, I would take 3 at a time from the stream of R/B (because the P4 is based on 3 spin patterns) and ignore the zero. Then if there was an exact match I would take that as a loss, the probability of which is 1/8 because there are 8 equally likely patterns. It doesn't matter that it's a 'compound' event (ie; made of 3 spins) as long as you're consistent in how you use the z-score formula. Don't forget though that 'n' in this case is only incremented after 3 spins, not 1 (because you've defined an 'event' in this case to consist of 3 spins). That's what I mean about being consistent.
oh no i'm calculating it every time it bets.
each row contains 3 bets.
HLH
LLL
HHH
HHL = 3 bets (each of probability of hit 16/37 - betting 16 numbers out of 37) 2 losses 1 win
with progression this would mean we have won because progression would bring us in profit
but with flat bet it would mean you have lost.
that's why we have to count all of them bets so progression will be irrelevant and zscore correct. Is this wrong?
I need to have it sorted so I can release corrected version in case this is wrong.
how is success rate calculated?well quite strait forward.
you have 2 lists. one with BETS second one with LW
if System have encounter L or W then to the list with BETS is added 1 and to the list with LW is added 1 or 0.
then if I want to calculate zscore of last 12 BETS. then I'm calculating how many "1" there were in last 12 entries of list with LW.
so zscore of those 3 BETS would be:
2,99 .....
well either way I'm doing it like this because I am caluclating zsore of many systems and it need to based on the same amount of bets for each system. if not then comparison would be false.
even if lets say numerology had 35 bets already and pattern breaker 4 had only 6
then MST will show zsore of the last 6BETS for each of this system.
you can setup min and max ammount of bets MST is looking at. if 12 is max then even after 3000 spins Zscore will be shown of the last 12 bets.
This is what this thread was about:
link:://rouletteforum.cc/math-reference/zscore-comparsion/ (link:://rouletteforum.cc/math-reference/zscore-comparsion/)
because at beginning i wanted to compare zscores basing on spins...
zscore of last 100 spins of each system
or
zscore of last 100 bets of each system
mmm is this right?
Quote from: artattack on Jun 06, 06:12 AM 2011
Hi, I just thought I would pop in here with a comment on perhaps why H L O E seem to perform better than Red and Black.
Could it have something to do with the wheel layout.
0-32-15-19-4-21-2-25-17-34-6-27-13-36-11-30-8-23-10-5-24-16-33-1-20-14-31 -9-22-18-29-7-28-12-35-3-26
If you notice, red and black are alternate on the wheel, but odd/even, high/low are not quite and there are mini groups that could just tip the balance.
For instance 10-5-24-16 you have 3 low numbers out of 4 also 3 even numbers out of the same 4
another example 15-19-4-21 here we have 3 odd numbers in a sector of 4
Hello by the way.
Arthur
I think you have a good point there Arthur well done.
Hello CHRISBIS,
I was very interested in your playing at BV...
How long have you played P4 on BV?
After a double loss how many wins on average have you seen?
You have not seen a triple loss?
You mention that there are many many repeaters at BV, meaning inside numbers I assume.
Could you say that within every 10 to 15 spins you see a repeater, if so I think you already found your entrance to pushing random into a corner.... I think I have a great method which can take advantage of this....
Any stats you have and playing approach info would be great....
@AMK
no stats as yet, I was playing P4 as part of the overall package within the MST tracker by Ophis.
I was Rouletting ALL the possible systems, but I notice and watch for which system is trending, and note the bet attached to that trend.
What i will do, is run a 120 or so spin function on BV NZ, using the MST tracker, and only select P4, so that will produce stats, and a nice graph (going uphill hopefully!!)
Yes, BV is a big hitter on the Repeat circuit, and I have three systems that I play, to take advantage of it.
I would be interested in Ur thoughts too, and maybe we can share them?
I can them show U the bot that takes advantage, and wins daily. (Bis101)
Look forward to meeting up with U. :thumbsup:
[reveal=Answer to Ur question] It can repeat within 2-19 spins, though the average is 8spins we have found[reveal]So hence we have a bot that plays 17 levels till it wins or loss of required BR[reveal]Though NO-BODY will agree with me, BV NZ, also results in repeater Sectors(wheel sectors), but it an RNG right? So it should not in anyway be a sector wheel spin result- but it is.[reveal]So we made Bis-Cending to play that routine, and....[reveal]....that wins hourly. (but it shouldn't- right?) :)[/reveal][/reveal][/reveal][/reveal][/reveal]
Thanks Chrisbis! I will be in touch...
Aurthor, really profound insight into R/B, H/L and O/E....
It sparked my interest into the dozens and columns....
They are really scrambled all around the wheel...
Wouldn't this force random into a greater corner JohnLegend?
Quote from: amk on Jun 06, 11:47 AM 2011
Thanks Chrisbis! I will be in touch...
Aurthor, really profound insight into R/B, H/L and O/E....
It sparked my interest into the dozens and columns....
They are really scrambled all around the wheel...
Wouldn't this force random into a greater corner JohnLegend?
Elaborate on your thoughts Amk with a proposed Staking plan.
Quote from: ophis on Jun 06, 07:42 AM 2011
oh no i'm calculating it every time it bets.
each row contains 3 bets.
HLH
LLL
HHH
HHL = 3 bets (each of probability of hit 16/37 - betting 16 numbers out of 37) 2 losses 1 win
with progression this would mean we have won because progression would bring us in profit
but with flat bet it would mean you have lost.
that's why we have to count all of them bets so progression will be irrelevant and zscore correct. Is this wrong?
I need to have it sorted so I can release corrected version in case this is wrong.
how is success rate calculated?
well quite strait forward.
you have 2 lists. one with BETS second one with LW
if System have encounter L or W then to the list with BETS is added 1 and to the list with LW is added 1 or 0.
then if I want to calculate zscore of last 12 BETS. then I'm calculating how many "1" there were in last 12 entries of list with LW.
so zscore of those 3 BETS would be:
2,99 .....
well either way I'm doing it like this because I am caluclating zsore of many systems and it need to based on the same amount of bets for each system. if not then comparison would be false.
even if lets say numerology had 35 bets already and pattern breaker 4 had only 6
then MST will show zsore of the last 6BETS for each of this system.
you can setup min and max ammount of bets MST is looking at. if 12 is max then even after 3000 spins Zscore will be shown of the last 12 bets.
This is what this thread was about:
link:://rouletteforum.cc/math-reference/zscore-comparsion/ (link:://rouletteforum.cc/math-reference/zscore-comparsion/)
because at beginning I wanted to compare zscores basing on spins...
zscore of last 100 spins of each system
or
zscore of last 100 bets of each system
mmm is this right?
Ophis, the z-score is 'standardised' which means it's designed to compare different kinds of bets no matter what the probabilities or number of bets over which it's used. So for example, if the score is 2.5 for a an EC bet over the last 10 spins and the same for a single number bet over 200 spins then it means both systems are doing equally well, but naturally the more bets you've made, the better, so far as 'weight of evidence' goes.
If you use the formula correctly (
z = (w - np)/sqrt(np(1 - p))) you can't go wrong, as long as it's used separately for each system. Make sure n is the number of actual placed bets (not just spins), so for example in P4 you're only betting for 3 spins out of 12.
The reason I think it's easier to take 3 spins at a time when measuring the z-score for P4 is because that's the way wins are defined. I suppose you could calculate the score on a spin-by-spin basis but the progression complicates things - z-score doesn't take them into account.
Hello everyone,
Inspired by JL's PATTERN 4 method and Arthurs wheel observation I looked into combining dozens and columns but going four wide and betting ofcourse that the fourth pattern was different from the first. I played consecutively so that we get and indication of how HIT AND RUN will look........
Example: numbers 1,2,3 are dozens, letters A,B,C are columns
2B1C
3C2A
2C3A
1B2B......... fourth pattern
From 541 live Spielbank spins I won 135 STRAIGHT GAMES. One loss but recovered on 5th progression.
Currently I just have a simple but somewhat "dangerous" six stage progression to play with. However 101 games were won on the first bet, 19 on the second bet, 7 on the third, 1 on the fourth and 1 on the fifth.
I think if we feel that this method has potential it will have to be played HIT AND RUN. It will take all of us to come up with a good staking plan.
Due to the high strikerate on the first and second wins I felt that perhaps a staking plan of 1/1 and 3/3 would be safe.
If we have a rare case on which we do not win on the first or second bet we just continue to play with 1/1 3/3 or move up to 4/4 12/12 for two wins to break even again....
The more knowledgeable players can best determine if this HIT AND RUN method has merit and what the best staking plan would be....... Perhaps in the trend of DIVIDE AND CONQUER
Quote from: amk on Jun 06, 02:19 PM 2011
Hello everyone,
Inspired by JL's PATTERN 4 method and Arthurs wheel observation I looked into combining dozens and columns but going four wide and betting ofcourse that the fourth pattern was different from the first. I played consecutively so that we get and indication of how HIT AND RUN will look........
Example: numbers 1,2,3 are dozens, letters A,B,C are columns
2B1C
3C2A
2C3A
1B2B......... fourth pattern
From 541 live Spielbank spins I won 135 STRAIGHT GAMES. One loss but recovered on 5th progression.
Currently I just have a simple but somewhat "dangerous" six stage progression to play with. However 101 games were won on the first bet, 19 on the second bet, 7 on the third, 1 on the fourth and 1 on the fifth.
I think if we feel that this method has potential it will have to be played HIT AND RUN. It will take all of us to come up with a good staking plan.
Due to the high strikerate on the first and second wins I felt that perhaps a staking plan of 1/1 and 3/3 would be safe.
If we have a rare case on which we do not win on the first or second bet we just continue to play with 1/1 3/3 or move up to 4/4 12/12 for two wins to break even again....
The more knowledgeable players can best determine if this HIT AND RUN method has merit and what the best staking plan would be....... Perhaps in the trend of DIVIDE AND CONQUER
I like this alot AMK it needs some work on staking Im think we play it six wide but only bet the first three spins, the other threes job is to create the break between bets. Give it a name and put it in the testing zone we can forge it there. Then bring it back over here. It looks to have awesome potential excellent work AMK.
Thanks JohnLegend!
I have called the method DOZUMNS and it can be found in the Testing Zone....
See you all there......
Quote from: amk on Jun 06, 03:23 PM 2011
Thanks JohnLegend!
I have called the method DOZUMNS and it can be found in the Testing Zone....
See you all there......
hello amk. it works because there are more possible combinations. you could even do it just on dozens, or columns and still have a lot of combinations. chances of same combination are minimal.
there are only 8 combination in R/B
27
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 06, 04:07 PM 2011
hello amk. it works because there are more possible combinations. you could even do it just on dozens, or columns and still have a lot of combinations. chances of same combination are minimal.
there are only 8 combination in R/B
Its limitless played hit and run. CODE 4 literally on random. Where is AMK? I've played 16 games tonight 13 of them won on the first bet 3 won on the second. This is possibly going to be the Holy Grail to end them all played Hit and Run. AMK took my concept for PATTERN 4 and married it to Arthurs observation. And he has delivered a system that can be played in a real casino. With a strikerate that will be ridiculous when it goes hot. No casino will be safe now with the firepower we have to take them.
Quote from: chrisbis on Jun 06, 03:07 AM 2011
Hi Gordon, nice Gin by the way!.
Could I ask U, since I personally think it affects the "Psych" of how one plays,
how much IS your base unit bet?
At the moment, my min. unit base bet is 0.10 cents
At this level, even when the progression level lifts somewhat, its nearly always less than 1.00
cheers.
Hi Chrisbis
For your info I'm playing with £1 units starting at L2 with £3,£6,£12.
Last night I played a cuple of games with £5 units on L1, 1,2,4 but to play consistently need to work up to a bigger BR
My goal is £25 units, thats a little wwy off yet but I do beleive that P4 can be successful for the long term
Gordon ;D
Quote from: Gordonline on Jun 06, 07:26 PM 2011
It will be for a 7 unit buy in its tough to beat, but AMK has come up with something excellent today. I am playing it side by side P4
lets be honest to all. this system cannot break down the casinos. the reason is simple. progression. even with the supposed doz/col holy grail, it is a matrix of 4. so its 1/1, 3/3
at those unit sizes casinos cannot go broke. but we stay under the radar.
assuming you don't want to risk higher units, because if one of those matches, you'll have to triple the bet. so having $10=1 unit is a risky play, strike rate aside.
Quote from: amk on Jun 06, 02:19 PM 2011
Currently I just have a simple but somewhat "dangerous" six stage progression to play with. However 101 games were won on the first bet, 19 on the second bet, 7 on the third, 1 on the fourth and 1 on the fifth.
I think if we feel that this method has potential it will have to be played HIT AND RUN. It will take all of us to come up with a good staking plan.
Due to the high strikerate on the first and second wins I felt that perhaps a staking plan of 1/1 and 3/3 would be safe.
If we have a rare case on which we do not win on the first or second bet we just continue to play with 1/1 3/3 or move up to 4/4 12/12 for two wins to break even again....
the first part - dangerous. 2nd part qualification, is ok, not too high units still.
Hi everybody. . . i am new at this fantastic forum, and my question is how many times can you play this system in a row, in one sesion? ex. You win after 12 spins at fourth pattern. . . can you start again forming new 3x3 paterns of HL and waitin fourth pattern to come again immediately after you win??? Thanks
@ airvucko
Each and every system has key points you need to adhere to for maximum "impact"
This once is a hit and run, and you would be aiming for +5 units at the end of a session.
Do that every night, build a nice big bankroll, increase unit sizes as you go, and VOILA!
Regards,
Mauricio
Quote from: airvucko on Jun 07, 11:49 AM 2011
Hi everybody. . . I am new at this fantastic forum, and my question is how many times can you play this system in a row, in one sesion? ex. You win after 12 spins at fourth pattern. . . can you start again forming new 3x3 paterns of HL and waitin fourth pattern to come again immediately after you win??? Thanks
Hello Airvaco, and welcome. You could do this but youd lose alot more frequently. Let me try an explain to you why hit and run is superior to playing consecutively. The maths boys cant get or accept what im saying here because the have to have numbers, reasons for everything rigid logic outcomes..
One player plays the method consecutively he wins something like this example.
WWWWWWWLWWLLWWWWWWLWWWWWWWWWWLWLWWWWLWWLWWWWWWLWWWWWWW
As you can see a mix of winning streaks but overall you cannot break out of the cage the law of averages has built for you. You are destined to lose overall. Playing robotically. Now here is a real example of what HIT AND RUN can deliver.
WWWWLWWWWWWWWWWWWWLWLWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWLLWWWWWWWWWWWWLWWWWWWWWLWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
So how are these superior runs possible? They are possible simply because you are randomly entering the cycle when you play HIT and RUN. What will happen is you will find yourself entering in between losing games more often than entering ON A LOSING GAME. Its that simple no mystery, no magic formula.
Your reward is you Cheat the law of averages and get a bigger slice of the winning pie. I have a winning streak of 37 winning games playing this way.
You will never win anywhere near that many games playing consecutively. Ad to that the raising and lowering of stakes and very consistent losing streaks. And positive results are coming.
OK. . . thanks once again for explanation. . .
So how much units you recommend to start each session if you play P4 and Grand Martingale considering time you play TIME/UNITS. . . my intend is to play at Live casinos on electronic roulette. . . ???
Hello JohnLegend,
I wanted to change the new method name to FANTASTIC 4 but do not know how, might you be able to do this. So that at the Testing Zone is has this as title. Someone already changed it to Dozens...
I am running the test over 1000 spins and is really looking good so far....
Quote from: airvucko on Jun 07, 01:47 PM 2011
OK. . . thanks once again for explanation. . .
So how much units you recommend to start each session if you play P4 and Grand Martingale considering time you play TIME/UNITS. . . my intend is to play at Live casinos on electronic roulette. . . ???
What size BANKROLL you have determines this Airvucko. If you had 200 units minumum recommended. I would play at two levels as follows
level 1 =1,2,4
level 2 =2,4,8
The golden rule is your bankroll should be 25--40 times the size of your level 1 stakes.
I use three levels but thats for when you have 1,000 units or more. Play hit and run style you will find you win that first game more than you will ever win playing consecutively. If you lose a game move up to level two stakes. All the best
I am not sure you can AMK bring it onto the sysyems its ready I think CODE 4 or SQUARE 4 are good names if you think Fantastic 4 is a little ott. The mix of Dozens and Columns take on some divinci code/codebreaker type of thing. I think its ready to come overhere now AMK I've played a total of 50 games already and I want to post the results up. I think its out of this world so don't waste time people need to see and test this method.
I agree with the name Square4 it best suits the system. AMK had a fortunate hand with the tweak.
I played years ago dozens against columns but not squares of 3 or 4. That's why not satisfying results and abandoned. But now I dusted it up and tested many variations of it like:
3111
AAAC
3213
CABC
------- now bet 1/2 dozen - won, wait for next row to bet
now bet B/C column and so on.
But astonishing results I got with a new combination of alternating D/C in rows.
That's a Random Carousel (could be the name of the system?).
3B2C
A3A1
2A2A
C3C1
------- now bet 1/2 D if lost bet A/C column as 1/A, 2/B, 3/C are equivalent. Long streaks of
wins on 1st spin!
But be careful because it is a physical law that when something goes too good it will build a pressure and will strike a big blow to ventilate (balance) off the pressure. You can expect even 6 or 7 lost spins once in the blue moon. Be ready for it and have a stop-loss bankroll.
I see it on craps tables after a shooter repeats many points (3-4) next 2-3 shooters throw quick 7 outs!
This could be played FLAT and you will still win!
Best results on square 4 like showed above, not on square 3. Bet against the 16th result.
Cheers Hermes
Oceans 4 ? :)
Quote from: Hermes on Jun 07, 06:39 PM 2011
I agree with the name Square4 it best suits the system. AMK had a fortunate hand with the tweak.
I played years ago dozens against columns but not squares of 3 or 4. That's why not satisfying results and abandoned. But now I dusted it up and tested many variations of it like:
3111
AAAC
3213
CABC
------- now bet 1/2 dozen - won, wait for next row to bet
now bet B/C column and so on.
But astonishing results I got with a new combination of alternating D/C in rows.
That's a Random Carousel (could be the name of the system?).
3B2C
A3A1
2A2A
C3C1
------- now bet 1/2 D if lost bet A/C column as 1/A, 2/B, 3/C are equivalent. Long streaks of
wins on 1st spin!
But be careful because it is a physical law that when something goes too good it will build a pressure and will strike a big blow to ventilate (balance) off the pressure. You can expect even 6 or 7 lost spins once in the blue moon. Be ready for it and have a stop-loss bankroll.
I see it on craps tables after a shooter repeats many points (3-4) next 2-3 shooters throw quick 7 outs!
This could be played FLAT and you will still win!
Best results on square 4 like showed above, not on square 3. Bet against the 16th result.
Cheers Hermes
there is a very cool system with the name carrousel from the author of a very innovative spanish book "jaque a la ruleta y al bingo".
Does anyone has this book?
Cheers
AL
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 07, 12:47 PM 2011
Hello Airvaco, and welcome. You could do this but youd lose a lot more frequently. Let me try an explain to you why hit and run is superior to playing consecutively. The maths boys can't get or accept what I'm saying here because the have to have numbers, reasons for everything rigid logic outcomes..
One player plays the method consecutively he wins something like this example.
WWWWWWWLWWLLWWWWWWLWWWWWWWWWWLWLWWWWLWWLWWWWWWLWWWWWWW
As you can see a mix of winning streaks but overall you cannot break out of the cage the law of averages has built for you. You are destined to lose overall. Playing robotically. Now here is a real example of what HIT AND RUN can deliver.
WWWWLWWWWWWWWWWWWWLWLWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWLLWWWWWWWWWWWWLWWWWWWWWLWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
So how are these superior runs possible? They are possible simply because you are randomly entering the cycle when you play HIT and RUN. What will happen is you will find yourself entering in between losing games more often than entering ON A LOSING GAME. Its that simple no mystery, no magic formula.
Your reward is you Cheat the law of averages and get a bigger slice of the winning pie. I have a winning streak of 37 winning games playing this way.
You will never win anywhere near that many games playing consecutively. Ad to that the raising and lowering of stakes and very consistent losing streaks. And positive results are coming.
hi JL. i disagree. there is no difference in playing "hit and runs" and the "long term". You can even get worse results from hit and run in fact. this is because you could get into the curve at a bad spin cycle(for you), rather than at the good. Also many hits and runs constitute long term play. theres an argument for that.
yes in the long term if you play, you would get a big triple loss. that will wipe out sessions of profit. also stopping progression doesn't make sense, cause it takes too long to recover the units. even a 99% system isn't good i think, because if the 1% loses your bankroll......
we will have to see.........
This progression played on pattern4 rips the casino a new @$$#*!!.
link:://rouletteforum.cc/money-management/even-chance-progression/ (link:://rouletteforum.cc/money-management/even-chance-progression/)
:lol:
You can mix the random even more by implementing double streets with columns or dozens.
Example:
1333 dozens
AABC columns
aacc double streets
where a=1/4 street, b=2/5 street, c=3/6 street.
Phantasy has no boundary.
Have a fun
Hermes
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 07, 08:03 PM 2011
hi JL. I disagree. there is no difference in Pplaying "hit and runs" and the "long term". You can even get worse results from hit and run in fact. this is because you could get into the curve at a bad spin cycle(for you), rather than at the good. Also many hits and runs constitute long term play. theres an argument for that.
yes in the long term if you play, you would get a big triple loss. that will wipe out sessions of profit. also stopping progression doesn't make sense, cause it takes too long to recover the units. even a 99% system isn't good I think, because if the 1% loses your bankroll......
Halba1, my results over several years show that hit and run is superior. You dont ever get winning streaks over 25 playing consecutively. And a tripple loss may be so rare your chances of meeting one are far less lightly. Im currently on a winning streak of 19 games. Play consecutively and see how often you win 19 times in a row. You wont.
Hi, J.L.
thank you for the excellent "Pattern systems", they are the BEST SYSTEMS
I ve ever read (since 40 years of searching a constant winning roulette system).
I play this way:
4 wide matrix eg.
HLLH
LHLH
etc.
witha progression of 1,2,4,8,16,32,
then waiting for a vertical 5 pointer as a signal to start at the next 4 vertical pointer against getting a 5 pointer, after a loss I wait for the next 4 pointer at the next progression.
I play this consequently at 1 session
How do you play this?
Do you end the game par ex. at one loss and begin later with another game?
What do you mean with a triple loss?
Do you mean loss 1 unit at session 1, finish begin session 2 loss 2units end the game , begin session 3 loss 4units end the game begin session 4 with 8 units?
Do you wait for a 5 pointer and then start or do you begin to play after a 4 pointer immediately?
With best regards
kawa47111
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 08, 12:48 AM 2011
Halba1, my results over several years show that hit and run is superior. You don't ever get winning streaks over 25 playing consecutively. And a tripple loss may be so rare your chances of meeting one are far less lightly. I'm currently on a winning streak of 19 games. Play consecutively and see how often you win 19 times in a row. You wont.
hi JL. I will start shortly. do you play pattern 4 just H/L, O/E, with 3 wide matrix?
e.g. HLH
the results are good enough for me to do it, maybe with the modified system combining H,O,R/B by AMK or so. they seem even better as more combinations. the extra strike rate can help, and still only 2x the bet.
i prefer keeping pattern 4 to the even chances this is because we only need to 2x the bet. with D/C we need to 3x the bet.
Hello all...
I have finished the tests for combing dozens and columns in a 4 by 4 matrix played PATTERN 4 style over 1600 live Spielbank spins, funny thing is I can't figure out what to call the method :) I think JohnLegend should have the final say...
385 games played, 279 wins on bet 1, 65 on bet 2, 24 on bet 3, 5 on bet 4, 5 total loses...
I have also run tests on combing E/O H/L in a 4 by 4 matrix played PATTERN 4 style over 1067 live Spielbank spins. Atlantis made this adaptation.... I think we just got a two for one deal JohnLegend.... What should the name be for this method :)
240 games played, 123 wins on bet 1, 64 wins on bet 2, 26 wins on bet 3, 14 wins on bet 4, total loses 13.
Interesting fact is that twice a triple loss occurred. The rest of the loses spread out nicely...
I played all these games consecutively so that we get a indication of what HIT AND RUN will look like. These methods should ofcourse only be played HIT AND RUN.
METHOD DESCRIPTION:
Inspired by JL's PATTERN 4 method and Arthurs wheel observation I looked into combining dozens and columns but going four wide and betting ofcourse that the fourth pattern was different from the first. I played consecutively so that we get and indication of how HIT AND RUN will look........
Example: numbers 1,2,3 are dozens, letters A,B,C are columns
2B1C
3C2A
2C3A
1B2B......... fourth pattern
Due to the high strikerate on the first and second wins I felt that perhaps a staking plan of 1/1 and 3/3 would be safe.
If we have a rare case on which we do not win on the first or second bet we just continue to play with 1/1 3/3 or move up to 4/4 12/12 for two wins to break even again....
JohnLegend how do you think we can best play these two methods...........
Hermes, add double streets in the mix looks great to.....
I'm not a "Math" guy, but I do have a question about "random". What is the difference between waiting for 3 HL/EO/RB triple patterns, then betting that the 4th sequence won't match the 1st one, and betting that the 2ND sequence won't be the same as the first?? Reason I say this is that you're still betting after the SAME amount of sequences. Thus, it becomes mechanical in a way, instead of dynamic. Essentially it's the same concept, and should yield the same results with less spins. Think about this. . . Even if you always waited EXACTLY 15,000 spins, then bet that the last XXX pattern won't be the same as the first XXX pattern, there will be no difference since it doesn't change the fact that you will win 7/8 times.
Now I have an idea that I think is TRULY fighting random with random. Matter of fact, this wouldn't require ANY free-spins on the wheel. Simply flip a coin three times, and bet in that sequence (Heads=H/O/B Tails=L/E/R). As long as the first three spins of the wheel aren't the exact opposite of your coin tosses, you will win. To take in even further, you can randomize what the Heads and Tails represent. Flip one more coin to determine if Heads is H/O/B or L/E/R. HAHAHAHA =P
The above concept is the reason why I think Pattern Breaker works so well, because it isn't mechanical in the sense that you never know which of the 8 patterns you will end up having to bet on or against. Whereas, with Pattern 4, you will know instantly WHICH pattern you'll be betting against, AND WHERE you will be betting it. Think about it, It's only half way random.
Now if I'm wrong, please elaborate. Thank you guys!
Hit and run is superior only if you have a good karma! Can happen that the big disaster comes before or after you play but never during your play. If you have a bad karma the disaster comes always during your play. Do you know Murphy's Law? You can count on it. Ask Buddha he will tell you?
During playing craps I developed a warning system with my subconsciousness who warns me before 7 outs. It tells me to take my bets down immediately and if I negotiate with SC for one more throw in 99% of the time next throw is 7 out and I lose. 2 days ago it happened 3 times and because of my greed I lost at least $50!
Hermes
Amk make the name barracuda! It is funny you cannot sleep because of the name and others because of the performances.
This strategy performs soooooooooooo good that you can play it HIT and STAY. No reason for hurry.
I don't understand why do you struggle with the loser Marty when Leveller would win you even 6 losing spins. On ECs you can bet flat I guarantee you.
ian you are in clouds. The numbers on roulette or on any other game don't fall randomly. For every number to fall is a reason which your coin will never know! Eg. if number 32 came 3 times in row that's because was sleeping for 500 spins before. The numbers which fall cannot be replaced by coin divination, except - voodoo magic!
Hermes
hermes your last two posts are both very spirituous amd insightfull.
nice to have you here often
Cheers
AL
albertos you are also welcome.
We use the word random when we don't understand why things happen. When we understand why thing happened random is replaced by order or law. Everything in universe moves by order, the is no chaos, and the only constant in universe is CHANGE!
Therefore, change the way you think and stay flexible to all challenges. Be like water.
Hermes
Quote from: kawa4711 on Jun 08, 05:19 AM 2011
Hi, J.L.
thank you for the excellent "Pattern systems", they are the BEST SYSTEMS
I ve ever read (since 40 years of searching a constant winning roulette system).
I play this way:
4 wide matrix e.g..
HLLH
LHLH
etc.
witha progression of 1,2,4,8,16,32,
then waiting for a vertical 5 pointer as a signal to start at the next 4 vertical pointer against getting a 5 pointer, after a loss I wait for the next 4 pointer at the next progression.
I play this consequently at 1 session
How do you play this?
Do you end the game par ex. at one loss and begin later with another game?
What do you mean with a triple loss?
Do you mean loss 1 unit at session 1, finish begin session 2 loss 2units end the game , begin session 3 loss 4units end the game begin session 4 with 8 units?
Do you wait for a 5 pointer and then start or do you begin to play after a 4 pointer immediately?
With best regards
kawa47111
Kawa47111 thankyou for your kind remarks. They get the job done somewhere out there someone may have a method much better than these but they arent sharing that's for sure.
No. A lost game is your entire 3 step progression example LEVEL 1---1,2,4 GAME 1
Then this is the ONLY TIME I recommend playing consecutively because two losses in a row don't happen often. A tripple loss would be 3 consecutive losing games such as the following example
H H H--PATTERN 1
L H L
H L H
H H H--LOST GAME 1
L L L
L H L
H H H--LOST GAME 2
H L H
L H L
H H H--LOST GAME 3
No one has seen a tripple loss as yet let alone lost one in real play. The way I play I may never encounter one. that's the value of HIT AND RUN. As I type this post, I have a winning streak of 24 consecutive games over the last 3 days. And a winning streak of 13 consecutive games for the first games of the day. Which I play at LEVEL 2 stakes. This creates an advantage as HIT AND RUN can string first game streaks in excess of 12 together very frequently. I then play the remaining 8 games of the day at LEVEL 1 stakes for a total of 5 for HIGH LOW and 5 for ODD EVEN.
No matter what the people steeped in math say. My 15 years experience with this game has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt. A good method played hit and run becomes a great one. Your overall strikerate will definately be at least 50% greater than it would playing drawn out consecutive sessions. No one playing consecutively will ever report a winning streak over 25 for this method. I have several playing HIT AND RUN. that's all the proof I need that its a superior application.
To concrete that idea is the fact that although my game is over I often continue to record spins until a losing game occurs. Just to prove that had I played on a loss was only 3--5 games away on average. HIT AND RUN will be the way you get the most out of this and other methods I play.
PATIENCE will be rewarded. FIND IT, if you are serious about making this game your major breadwinner.
Quote from: amk on Jun 08, 09:45 AM 2011
Hello all...
I have finished the tests for combing dozens and columns in a 4 by 4 matrix played PATTERN 4 style over 1600 live Spielbank spins, funny thing is I can't figure out what to call the method :) I think JohnLegend should have the final say...
385 games played, 279 wins on bet 1, 65 on bet 2, 24 on bet 3, 5 on bet 4, 5 total loses...
I have also run tests on combing E/O H/L in a 4 by 4 matrix played PATTERN 4 style over 1067 live Spielbank spins. Atlantis made this adaptation.... I think we just got a two for one deal JohnLegend.... What should the name be for this method :)
240 games played, 123 wins on bet 1, 64 wins on bet 2, 26 wins on bet 3, 14 wins on bet 4, total loses 13.
Interesting fact is that twice a triple loss occurred. The rest of the loses spread out nicely...
I played all these games consecutively so that we get a indication of what HIT AND RUN will look like. These methods should ofcourse only be played HIT AND RUN.
METHOD DESCRIPTION:
Inspired by JL's PATTERN 4 method and Arthurs wheel observation I looked into combining dozens and columns but going four wide and betting ofcourse that the fourth pattern was different from the first. I played consecutively so that we get and indication of how HIT AND RUN will look........
Example: numbers 1,2,3 are dozens, letters A,B,C are columns
2B1C
3C2A
2C3A
1B2B......... fourth pattern
Due to the high strikerate on the first and second wins I felt that perhaps a staking plan of 1/1 and 3/3 would be safe.
If we have a rare case on which we do not win on the first or second bet we just continue to play with 1/1 3/3 or move up to 4/4 12/12 for two wins to break even again....
JohnLegend how do you think we can best play these two methods...........
Hermes, add double streets in the mix looks great to.....
AMK I think ***CODE 4**** is the name. It sounds like it means business. And anyone who plays it HIT ND RUN will do the business. Its 80 units well invest. Post it up AMK, the clocks ticking...
WE are now official JohnLegend.... "CODE 4" has been posted under full systems.....
Look forward to everybody's input...
Hello Hermes!
Could you please elaborate on your comment below on the official "CODE 4" post.....
"I don't understand why do you struggle with the loser Marty when Leveller would win you even 6 losing spins. On ECs you can bet flat I guarantee you."
Quote from: amk on Jun 08, 03:18 PM 2011
WE are now official JohnLegend.... "CODE 4" has been posted under full systems.....
Look forward to everybody's input...
Excellent I have 80 results to report fitting as that is how many units required to cover a progression see you there... ;D
Ok, now I will give you actual spins from the tote and thank God I didn't play what I observed.
HHH
HHH
HLH.
HHH..Lost
HHH..Lost
HHL...won 2nd spin...but I would have been inclined to bet H because of rhe ridiculous run.
18 spins and only 2 low numbers!
CD
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 08, 04:26 PM 2011
Ok, now I will give you actual spins from the tote and thank God I didn't play what I observed.
HHH
HHH
HLH.
HHH..Lost
HHH..Lost
HHL...won 2nd spin...but I would have been inclined to bet H because of rhe ridiculous run.
18 spins and only 2 low numbers!
CD
Clothdog that isn't a double loss in the context of how PATTERN 4 is played. Those type of losses happen frequently. Hence why I don't play consecutively I will give a results update tomorrow.
CD it doesn't happens every day but it happens. Good precaution would be skip a row where all 3 are the same like HHH. Bet only if both are involved. When you see 2 rows of the same think earthquake and skip bets until you see the partner too!
What do you think?
Hermes
yes Hermes. I think you are right. I will wait till John posts results. i am off to casino tomorrow.
cd
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 08, 04:49 PM 2011
Clothdog that isn't a double loss in the context of how PATTERN 4 is played. Those type of losses happen frequently. Hence why I don't play consecutively I will give a results update tomorrow.
definitely one must avoid the tote. the tote is not the ideal casino to play it. try another reputable live one or BV NZ.
halba1,
What do you mean "the tote is not the ideal casino to play it."? I only go to the casino and play with live dealers. the tote boards that they have in Niagara Falls where I play, are the newest.
Cd
@Gordonline , hi there, very interested in your results here (along with every one elses of course), can you just clear a couple of things up for me about the way that you do it?
you use a slightly different progression to johnlegend i think.. you use (if i am correct)
Level 1 - 1,2,4
Level 2 - 3,6,12
Level 3 - 6,12,24
whereas Johnlegend uses
Level 3 - 12,24,48
so if you lost on your first Level 2 bets (losing 21 units), would you try to win at Level 3 3 times? regaining 18 units?
thanks
Bill
Quote from: monaco on Jun 09, 09:47 AM 2011
@Gordonline , hi there, very interested in your results here (along with every one elses of course), can you just clear a couple of things up for me about the way that you do it?
you use a slightly different progression to johnlegend I think.. you use (if I am correct)
Level 1 - 1,2,4
Level 2 - 3,6,12
Level 3 - 6,12,24
whereas Johnlegend uses
Level 3 - 12,24,48
so if you lost on your first Level 2 bets (losing 21 units), would you try to win at Level 3 3 times? regaining 18 units?
thanks
Bill
Hi Monaco
My Levels are the same as John's L3, 12,24,48, sorry if there is a mistake on one of my previous posts, and yes if I lose at the first game (Not happened yet in the last couple of weeks) I would play L3 for 2 games to end with +3
I only play 1 game for each E/C for +9 units
Hope that helps
Gordon
ah ok, thanks for that.
hypothetically, if you lost your 1st bets at Level 2, won at Level 3, but then lost at Level 3 in your second game, would you take that as a loss? i can see that that has happened yet, i dont want to jinx anything :ooh: but have you considered what you would do?
cheers & good luck!!
@ CD
I think JL means you play your first 3 bets @ level one after waiting for 9 spins. If you lose those first 3 bets, then retrack another 9 spins and then play at level 2 progression. You should never place more than 3 bets consecutively playing this system.
Woods.
*hasn't happened yet
Quote from: monaco on Jun 09, 11:47 AM 2011
*hasn't happened yet
Hi Woods101
It depends on your Bankroll whether you start at L1 or L2 (Look at having 15 to 20 times your L1 progression, 20 x 7 = 140) as an estimate,
I started with about 160 units and have increased it in 2 weeks to 250 playing just 3 games in apprx 10mins and stopping
You are right about waiting another 9 spins (Actually its 6 spins as the losing sequence counts as spins 1,2,3,) after a losing sequence of 3 bets, but thats only if you lose your 1st 3 bets
Hope that helps
Gordon
Thanks Gordon. Yeh I was wanting to make it clear to CD that you must retrack for a further 9 or 6 spins before rebetting. I'm interested in your latest progression though. I know you start at level two. Could you clarify how you play a session?
Thanks in advance,
Woods
Hi Woods
I track the last 9 spins on the Marquee and start at L2 for Hi/L for 3 bets and if I win I bet on spins 13,14,15 for O/E and then spins 16,17,18 for R/B, all being well +9 units and then quit
Been 100% successful so far but only played 9 times over the last 2 weeks, still good results though, I would advise to have a seperate BR for each E/C to prevent cross playing the progression,
If you prefer you could play a flat level progression of 2,5,10 and if you encounter a loss so be it, my testing still shows good results wiyh this method
Good luck
Gordon ;D
Hi Gordon,
Thanks for that. I like the appeal of the second betting option also. Just out of interest when would you use your level 1 stakes playing the way you do?
Thanks
Woods
Quote from: woods101 on Jun 10, 04:47 AM 2011
Hi Gordon,
Thanks for that. I like the appeal of the second betting option also. Just out of interest when would you use your level 1 stakes playing the way you do?
Thanks
Woods
Hi Woods
Good question......... L1 & L3 stakes are there if you want to play for 5 seperate games as JL does, which is L2 for 1st game and then 4 seperate games at L1 for a total of +7
Originally I thought John was playing 5 consecutive games but he plays his games Hit & Run by playing at different times during the day and only playing consecutive if encountering a loss on his first game which of course is rare
BTW John mainly plays H/L and O/E, doesn't bother with R/B as it seems to produce more losses, this might be due to the layout on the wheel as posted by another member
Every time you play your first game the odds are 7/1 in your favour,
Hope that makes sense
Gordon ;D
Quote from: Gordonline on Jun 10, 05:24 AM 2011
Hi Woods
Good question......... L1 & L3 stakes are there if you want to play for 5 separate games as JL does, which is L2 for 1st game and then 4 separate games at L1 for a total of +7
Originally I thought John was playing 5 consecutive games but he plays his games Hit & Run by playing at different times during the day and only playing consecutive if encountering a loss on his first game which of course is rare
by the way John mainly plays H/L and O/E, doesn't bother with R/B as it seems to produce more losses, this might be due to the layout on the wheel as posted by another member
Every time you play your first game the odds are 7/1 in your favour,
Hope that makes sense
Gordon ;D
Yes Gordon that first game is seriously in your favour I have another impressive winning streak forming straight after another good one. That is why I exploit it with the LEVEL 2 play. And I've never lost the first two games of the day. All these phenomena are there to be exploited. You have to take on board that good decision making adds a dynamic angle to a good method. THINK about what you are doing, look at what stages produce impressive occurances RECORD EVERTHING. Thats how I learn what works and what doesnt. Results update tonight.
Hi All
Played my 1st game for a couple of nights due to work, usual outcome all 3 bet sequences won on the 1st game for H/L,O/E, & R/B +9 units (5 Bets 10min)
I then continued to record the spins for Pattern Breaker and won on that as well
John, these strategies are awesome I'm +90 units and building
Gordon ;D
yep. but its only solid cash gordon. it won't make you rich at those levels - 9 units, you can't go to higher $1 sizes due to progression.
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 10, 05:49 PM 2011
Yep. but its only solid cash gordon. it won't make you rich at those levels - 9 units, you can't go to higher $1 sizes due to progression.
Hi Halba1
Not sure I understand what you mean, my unit size is already £1 and you can make it whatever you like providing you stay within the table limits
+90 units = £900 if I use £10 units but my BR is not there yet and I have the patience to build it slowly..........I'm not in a rush ;D
Gordon ;D
Okay its time for a PATTERN 4 update.
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 560
TOTAL GAMES WON 517
TOTAL GAMES LOST 43
STRIKERATE APPROX 12/1
BALANCE 525 UNITS PLUS
DOUBLE LOSSES 4
LONGEST WINNING STREAK 37
LONGEST GAME 1 WINNING STREAK 35
A good on going run at present, I now have a winning streak of 24 in a row for the first games of the day combining HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN together. I had two close losses recently but no more double losses since my last update. HIGH and LOW still have the edge over ODD and EVEN. Three of my last 4 losses came from ODD and EVEN.
I like how Gordonline executes his play on the three even chances one after the other. And may try it for HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN. One thing I am purposely doing now is avoiding betting against three of a kind like HHH or EEE. And its working, when I look back on my results. Several losing games have come as a result of opposing them. And when you think about it, it makes sense. Because its possible for an even chance to get hot and dominate a 30 spin patch. You don't want to be caught up in that.
John,
so if you see
HHH
LHL
LLH
You won't bet L? Or are you waiting for the next 3 spins?
CD
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 11, 06:29 PM 2011
John,
so if you see
HHH
LHL
LLH
You won't bet L? Or are you waiting for the next 3 spins?
CD
Correct Clothdog, its easier for random to run off a string of HHH OR LLL that LHL so in your example I would take the second line as my starting point. Nearly half of my losing results have occured playing against LLL or HHH. I believe my strikerate will now improve.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 12, 02:35 AM 2011
Correct Clothdog, its easier for random to run off a string of HHH OR LLL that LHL so in your example I would take the second line as my starting point. Nearly half of my losing results have occured playing against LLL or HHH. I believe my strikerate will now improve.
by maths is the same. it was a correct statement if you were considering series vs singles.
interesting to see you are leaning towards Random. ;-)
just my approach, it is worth what it is worth.
Keep up the good work,
AL
Definitely makes sense John. Because if you have LHL or HHL etc. you are not playing all HHH or LLL and chances are you'll probably hit H or L instead of concentrating on just playing all LLL or HHH.
CD
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 12, 02:47 PM 2011
Definitely makes sense John. Because if you have LHL or HHL etc. you are not playing all HHH or LLL and chances are you'll probably hit H or L instead of concentrating on just playing all LLL or HHH.
CD
Yes Clothdog. I avoided a loss today by skipping a line with Three lows and playing the line under it. Its kept my winning streak of 28 alive.
Hi JL, just a thought, if one was to only play three bets i.e level one, say1,2,4 would the win/loss strike rate still be 12/1?
So the total unit loss would be 1+2+4+ 7 units and if the strike rate was 8/1 then there would still be a profit margin of 8 x 1 unit = 8 - 7 = 1 unit profit? So if one was to play 9 games a day, with high chip values taking advantage of the maximum table bet one could still profit well?
cheers
I like this system. Im just trying it out now on the real wheel at super casino. Only using a small bankroll and I was wondering if rather than the steep progression, is there anyway to stretch it over the the fulll 9 numbers?
Surely the chances of the full set repeating must be incredibly low? Anyway just a thought!
How about stretching it with a fibonacci?
hey birdhands. .
I dont know that system although ive heard of it, is it easy to pick up?
Quote from: LuckyLucy on Jun 12, 05:13 PM 2011
Hey birdhands. .
I don't know that system although I've heard of it, is it easy to pick up?
yes its very easy to understand just read the first page
Thank you Shakeel I will do :)
Quote from: shakeel link=topic=4697. msg57114#msg57114 date=1307915094
yes its very easy to understand just read the first page
I think he means a fibonacci progression.
1,1,2,3,5,8,13,21,34. . .
Hey who gave me that avatar? Is it automatic? Fancy. . .
lol yes its very clever and fancy, I didnt choose a pic at first but put the word lucky, next thing I have a four leaf clover! Good job I diodnt pick anything rude, not that I would of course! :ooh:
Hmm I like this system vbery much..Ive been playing it on Super Casino real wheel and have breezed to 20+, and not gone beyond the second progression, obviously not much data to go on and I realise it could all go a bit Pete tong, but so far very impressive and easy to follow. ;)
Quote from: LuckyLucy on Jun 12, 05:01 PM 2011
I like this system. I'm just trying it out now on the real wheel at super casino. Only using a small bankroll and I was wondering if rather than the steep progression, is there anyway to stretch it over the the fulll 9 numbers?
Surely the chances of the full set repeating must be incredibly low? Anyway just a thought!
LL, follow the link below and consider this even chance progression. I have tested it for a few hundred spins and have had excellent results. It is very stable, incorporates a lot of concepts and allows for a lot of options and safety brakes.
This progression is fairly advanced and may be more complicated than you're interested in learning but I think it can take a lot of the volatility out of the system.
If you're interested and have any questions, just post them. I'm on vacation at the moment, but I still check out the forum every evening.
GLC
link:://rouletteforum.cc/money-management/even-chance-progression/ (link:://rouletteforum.cc/money-management/even-chance-progression/)
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jun 12, 04:56 PM 2011
Hi JL, just a thought, if one was to only play three bets i.e level one, say1,2,4 would the win/loss strike rate still be 12/1?
So the total unit loss would be 1+2+4+ 7 units and if the strike rate was 8/1 then there would still be a profit margin of 8 x 1 unit = 8 - 7 = 1 unit profit? So if one was to play 9 games a day, with high chip values taking advantage of the maximum table bet one could still profit well?
cheers
Hi Midnight played hit and run you will definately overcome the 7/1 odds the law of averages dictates is your slice of the win loss pie. I am currently on a winning streak of 24 for both HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN. This would never happen if you played long drawn out sessions.
The first game of the day too is special. I play the first game of the day for both HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN at level 2 stakes. I currently have a winning streak of 28 for the first games.
So yes even played at one level you should show a profit. The multi levels just speed your progress more.
Quote from: LuckyLucy on Jun 12, 05:01 PM 2011
I like this system. I'm just trying it out now on the real wheel at super casino. Only using a small bankroll and I was wondering if rather than the steep progression, is there anyway to stretch it over the the fulll 9 numbers?
Surely the chances of the full set repeating must be incredibly low? Anyway just a thought!
Hi Luckylucy, no theres a reason I settled on the four line format. Its not too long a wait to get a decent turnover in a real casino. And its a point where RANDOMS powers of repeat lose there grip enough to profit from.
I have several thousand spins recorded over the last three years for THE PATTERN BREAKER. These type of formations are common.
HLH
HLH
HLH
HLL
HLH
LLL
HLH
LHL
L L L
L L L
HLH
LHL
As you can see random can repeat a pattern two or three times in the first nine spins. Its usually lost interest by the time it reaches the FOURTH PATTERN. that's why this method works. Played HIT AND RUN, it definately works. And you will defy random and the law of averages.
Thank you GLC and JohnLegend, I appreciate your advice and help!
Thanks JL much appreciated...
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jun 13, 12:14 PM 2011
Thanks JL much appreciated...
You are all welcome, I recommend you learn and play AMKs CODE 4 when you have the BR. Ive seen nothing quite like it Im 150 an 0 already.
Thanks JL that's good to know...
Good Morning/Afternoon/Eveninig
Ok i've been giving it some more thought and as has rightly been pointed out to me, doing a progression that lasts for the whole pattern as set out by JL, is too long and not feasable,.
So then I had a thought. How about if we wait for the wheel to spin the first 6 numbers of the pattern, then work against the rest of the pattern forming? Or possibly start part way through a line? So for example:
HLH
LHL comes up giving us our trigger, to bet:
HHL
LLH
Or:
HLH
LHL comes up and we wait one more spin and if
H spins, we then use that trigger
HL
LLH
I was thinking this could also be incorporated with the excellent Code 4 system too.
What do you think fellow random busters?
lucy x
Okay update time for PATTERN 4
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 600
TOTAL GAMES WON 553
TOTAL GAMES LOST 47
STRIKERATE APPROX 12/1
BALANCE 561 UNITS PLUS
DOUBLE LOSSES 4
LONGEST WINNING STREAK 37
LONGEST FIRST GAME WINNING STREAK 35
The method played hit snd run is producing very solid results. I currently have a winning streak of 32 for the first games of the day for HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN. If I can win the next two days I will break the current record of 35, next update sunday.
Looking good JL!!!
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jun 16, 08:26 AM 2011
Looking good JL!!!
Its solid midnight, its simply the hit and run play that advances the winning. I will have 36 winning games in a row if I win my openning games tomorrow. Longrest winning streak I ever recorded with consecutive games was 21. So it makes a difference it really does.
Hi JL, last night I went to my local casino and decided to play Pattern 4 hit and run style, not playing any patterns that were HHH or LLL and as I only had small change I played one level progression of 1;2;4 taking any loss on the chin. This was to get my feet wet so to speak and although I will soon be playing with much higher unit value chips where I would also cover the zero every time, last night I did not concern myself with the zero, I simply wanted to start experiencing the style of play as recommended. I played the minimum chip allowed on the table, covering 3 double lines instead of the EC 1-18; 19-36 bet boxes. There were 4 tables open and I rotated between all 4 tables and also taking a break in order to allow a minimum of 20 spins between sessions.
I won the first 9 sessions in a row, lost the 10th session, then lost the 11th session to a zero on the first spin bet, decided to play through and lost that session (it would have been a win if the zero was covered making it 10/1) then won the next two making it 12/1 then on the same table later I again hit a zero on the first bet spin, (crazy) from which I walked away. Played another one or two winning sessions resulting in a perfect BR break even scenario with a strike rate of at least 14/1
I did not write anything down, simply looked at the marque board, counted backwards to the 1st pattern spin and bet the opposite. I did not select tables where there was a zero in the 9 spins, either going to another table or waited patiently with a complimentary drink until the ideal conditions presented themselves.
If I had used the maximum bet allowed on the table and covered the zero's I would have profited hansomely :)
Nice one Midnight, good to see you winnig well!
Thanks Luckylucy :)
Good luck to you too
I will post my results as the sessions unfold, it is quite interesting how the hit and run method is so successful... makes one think how the nature of randomness works and if there are other secrets to discover about it's nature...
Many experiments have been done around the world where Random Number Generators have been used to connect machines to human consciousness and there is certainly a connection there to be used.
cheers
Hi JL, I was wondering what the strike rate is if one only bets a single double up on the first stage bet. for example 1;2 end of progression. A loss results in -3 units. Therefore a 4/1 strike rate overall would result in a steady profit of 1 unit. Since we can then increase our two bets substantially, taking advantage of the table maximum bet table limit it may be a viable bet option. Since a three stage progression results in a 12/1 strike ratio, then perhaps a 2 stage progression may result in 2/3 of this ratio, making the strike rate for this to be 8/1? If you get the time, could you check what your data shows for B&M strike rate for this scenario?
cheers
Hi Midnight,
Went to the casino myself last night. Won my first session on the first bet. Second session was a loss. I hit zero on the first bet and lost the next two. So I was 1-1. Played a third game and won on the first bet. I started back at my base bet because I didn't want to chase. Wasn't thinking in my fourth game and instead of playing H, I played 3rd dozen and it hit! I lucked out. Played another session and won that and one more and won. So I was 6-1. Won 3 units for the night with PB but I actually stayed at one table because it was too crowded to move and I played my straight number system in between PB4 and cashed out with almost $800. :thumbsup:
CD
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jun 17, 07:17 AM 2011
Thanks Luckylucy :)
Good luck to you too
I will post my results as the sessions unfold, it is quite interesting how the hit and run method is so successful... makes one think how the nature of randomness works and if there are other secrets to discover about it's nature...
Many experiments have been done around the world where Random Number Generators have been used to connect machines to human consciousness and there is certainly a connection there to be used.
cheers
Yes Midnight I dont currently cover Zero I take the loss, but if I did my profit margin would be considerably greater. As one zero is like 15 wins. One thing I want to say about HIT AND RUN is this. You dont have to wait a specific number of spins. You become as random as the game itself. Example. I play five sessions of two a day for PATTERN 4 Here is how I played for HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN to
day.
(SESSION 1, 6.15 AM) Won both games played simultaneously. LEVEL 2 stakes
(SESSION 2) Started *FIVE SPINS LATER* Won both games played HIGH LOW first then ODD EVEN the next line. LEVEL ONE STAKES
(SESSION 3, 8,00 AM) Won both games played simultaneously. LEVEL ONE STAKES.
(SESSION 4, 9.30 AM) Won HIGH and LOW lost ODD EVEN. Played a consecutive game for ODD EVEN at LEVEL THREE STAKES and won.
(SESSION 5) STARTED 13 spins later WON BOTH games simultaneously. Days play over. Nine wins and one loss. And a new record of 36 consecutive wins for the first games of the day.
Notice When playing close sessions I start on a spin that throws the previous one out of sequence.
JL
Could you please explain starting on a spin that throws the previous one out of sequence
thanks
Nice one Clothdog, a good session indeed :D
Thanks JL, that would speed up things indeed! Are you playing live wheel online? I have to go to my B&M so playing H/L and Odd/Even would shorten my stay there. Any thoughts on my other question as posted earlier regarding the strike rate on a double up and not a 3 stage progression.
cheers
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jun 17, 12:03 PM 2011
Thanks JL, that would speed up things indeed! Are you playing live wheel online? I have to go to my B&M so playing H/L and Odd/Even would shorten my stay there. Any thoughts on my other question as posted earlier regarding the strike rate on a double up and not a 3 stage progression.
cheers
Yes Midnight online live. Not quite sure what you mean by double up. If you are referring to doubling your progression after a loss. The strikerate played HIT and RUN is excellent. I have played over 600 games and only suffered 4 double losses.
Remember I start every NEW DAY. With LEVEL 2 stakes for the first game for HIGH AND LOW AND ODD AND EVEN. There is a distinct advantage to doing this. I am currently on a winning streak of 36 games and counting. How you manage your money is equally if not MORE important than the method itself. But of course you must have enough confidence in your method to raise and lower stakes as I do. Aswell as the powerbase behind you.
Well done Clothdog, back to winning ways.
Hello everyone,
Below you can read about the beginnings of PATTERN 4.....
I thought it was interesting to read if you haven't read it before....
(strange how "read" can have different meanings...
Johnlegend
1000+ posts member!
Topic starter
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Re: *MATRIX VERTICAL 5* (Randoms BLACKHOLE)
« Reply #43 on: March 30, 2011, 04:34:36 am »
ReplyReply Reply with quoteQuote
Quote:
Sent by atlantis on March 30, 2011, 02:56:11 am
JohnL,
Are you still going to release PATTERN BREAKER as stated on the 1st April?
Or is that just an April Fool windup? Twisted
Cheers,
A.
Yes Atlantis, its the last gem I have to give. And believe me its no April fool with a 14 point buy in, to make 2pts a win for starters and an impressive strike rate. It will compliment the Matrices perfectly. And I MAY as well let the cat out of the bag while I'm at it. SCOOBY has something special up his sleeve too. So you lot are getting spoilt over the next few weeks. After that my time will be spent helping newbies perfect the methods and reporting my results. You will have some serious firepower on this forum to beat roulette with..
Hi JL, your first game winning streak is extraordinary!
Regarding the earlier question, what I mean is I wonder what the strike rate is if one only bets on two spins, i.e. spin 10 and 11, with a 1;2 bet if it loses write it off. A loss is -3units so a strike rate of 4/1 will result in a profit and then the table limit can be used to generate good profits, here in SA a typical table minimum bet on the EC is R100 and max is R4000 so one could bet R2000 first bet then double up to R4000 on a loss. A strike rate of 4/1 would net R2000 profit. If 12 sessions were played a day then 3 wins would result in R6000 profit a day which is almost $900 profit a day...
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jun 17, 03:17 PM 2011
Hi JL, your first game winning streak is extraordinary!
Regarding the earlier question, what I mean is I wonder what the strike rate is if one only bets on two spins, i.e. spin 10 and 11, with a 1;2 bet if it loses write it off. A loss is -3units so a strike rate of 4/1 will result in a profit and then the table limit can be used to generate good profits, here in SA a typical table minimum bet on the EC is R100 and max is R4000 so one could bet R2000 first bet then double up to R4000 on a loss. A strike rate of 4/1 would net R2000 profit. If 12 sessions were played a day then 3 wins would result in R6000 profit a day which is almost $900 profit a day...
Ill have to wade through my 620 results Midnight most wins do come in the first two steps of the progression. I say to all playing any method, dont try to raise your stakes too quickly. I play for five to 20 units a game depending on the method. And I have a very big BR. Well over 200 times my risk.
You are all in a hurry to make the cash I realize that. But a steady rise is better than a sudden crash. I have seen many a player get too c***y once they made some money only to give it all back.
Their mistake? They started risking too high a percentage of their bankroll on A SINGLE GAME. when that string of losses hit they panic and lose their nerve along with their BR. The casinos love these type of players.
Then the smart player walks in. He has 2,000 units at his disposal. And is playing for 10 units Max A GAME. He has a good arsenal of methods and plays hit and run. Aiming for no more than a 10% increase of what he arrived with. He never leaves with less than he came with. Disciplined mindset. It doesnt matter what method you use, if you dont manage your bankroll and self discipline properly you will fail in the longrun.
I found a simple way to play these methods, and with much less exposure
since most of the time is at 1st or 2nd step. limit exposure to the next steps, and only concentrate on those 2 steps. it is similar to flat bet.
e.g.
1,1.5,2 progression A
4,8,12 progression B for a few games if lose.
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 17, 05:36 PM 2011
I found a simple way to play these methods, and with much less exposure
since most of the time is at 1st or 2nd step. limit exposure to the next steps, and only concentrate on those 2 steps. it is similar to flat bet.
e.g.
1,1.5,2 progression A
4,8,12 progression B for a few games if lose.
LIVE CASIONS don't 1.5 in denomanation, oh ya I forgot your AN RNG PLAYER .
The correct word is C A S I N O S. Did your spell checker not work? ;)
ADMIN
re. 1.5 unit, ppl sayin,.
i am assuming people arent using $1. units. so if they are using $10 units, it is $15 accepted by casino.
i wont play rng, only BV, rest mostly will be done live. all other rngs have been tested cheating bets after 1-2mins
Thanks JL, I do believe that this is the way to go. Thanks for the guidance, my game is going to improve for sure
cheers
Quote from: Robeenhuut on Jun 17, 11:20 AM 2011
JL
Could you please explain starting on a spin that throws the previous one out of sequence
thanks
Hi Robeenhuut I believe JL means that he starts the next session that is closer than say 20 spins on a spin interval different to sets of 3 so instead of 9 or 12 spins later he selects 7 or maybe 11. @JL is that correct?
JL,
had a reverse of fortunes tonight. I don't know how you win 36 games in a row first game. At Casino tonight. Bad start with a loss. I hate that because now it's catch up time. I've already had a couple opening losses. The second game the zero came up first spin but I won on the second. Lost 3 units won 4. +1 for the night, but takes too long because of crowded conditions. I only play $25 units and to hang around for a couple of hours to get +1 is a waste of time. I make alot of money in my professional field and $25 is peanuts. :yawn: Unless I win at least $500 in a night it's a waste of time. But I'm not a big gambler. It's only for fun.
CD
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jun 17, 03:17 PM 2011
Hi JL, your first game winning streak is extraordinary!
Regarding the earlier question, what I mean is I wonder what the strike rate is if one only bets on two spins, i.e. spin 10 and 11, with a 1;2 bet if it loses write it off. A loss is -3units so a strike rate of 4/1 will result in a profit and then the table limit can be used to generate good profits, here in SA a typical table minimum bet on the EC is R100 and max is R4000 so one could bet R2000 first bet then double up to R4000 on a loss. A strike rate of 4/1 would net R2000 profit. If 12 sessions were played a day then 3 wins would result in R6000 profit a day which is almost $900 profit a day...
hi midnight player. no, sometimes it takes up to a few levels 2 to make profit. this is because the 3rd letter can provide crucial outcome.
my first session on pattern 4.
almost had a single loss, and didn't go the full way. backed out, got a bit hesitant and turned flat betting(chicken!!)
then eventually i ground myself out of a mini hole and ended up a positive session
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jun 17, 03:17 PM 2011
Hi JL, your first game winning streak is extraordinary!
Regarding the earlier question, what I mean is I wonder what the strike rate is if one only bets on two spins, i.e. spin 10 and 11, with a 1;2 bet if it loses write it off. A loss is -3units so a strike rate of 4/1 will result in a profit and then the table limit can be used to generate good profits, here in SA a typical table minimum bet on the EC is R100 and max is R4000 so one could bet R2000 first bet then double up to R4000 on a loss. A strike rate of 4/1 would net R2000 profit. If 12 sessions were played a day then 3 wins would result in R6000 profit a day which is almost $900 profit a day...
Okay I looked over my now 630 real play results for Pattern 4 Midnight. Of the 581 wins here is the breakdown
STEP 1 WINS 343
STEP 2 WINS 140
STEP 3 WINS 98
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jun 18, 01:13 AM 2011
Hi Robeenhuut I believe JL means that he starts the next session that is closer than say 20 spins on a spin interval different to sets of 3 so instead of 9 or 12 spins later he selects 7 or maybe 11. @JL is that correct?
Correct Midnight...
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 18, 01:33 AM 2011
JL,
had a reverse of fortunes tonight. I don't know how you win 36 games in a row first game. At Casino tonight. Bad start with a loss. I hate that because now it's catch up time. I've already had a couple opening losses. The second game the zero came up first spin but I won on the second. Lost 3 units won 4. +1 for the night, but takes too long because of crowded conditions. I only play $25 units and to hang around for a couple of hours to get +1 is a waste of time. I make a lot of money in my professional field and $25 is peanuts. :yawn: Unless I win at least $500 in a night it's a waste of time. But I'm not a big gambler. It's only for fun.
CD
Clothdog youre looking at the picture wrong. I dont know if you are aware of this but you arent supposed to be beating this game period. Whether you leave the casino with $25 or $2500 you left A WINNER.
Do that enough times and it can be your JOB. If you can do something 99% of players cant you should be happy.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 18, 05:49 AM 2011
Okay I looked over my now 630 real play results for Pattern 4 Midnight. Of the 581 wins here is the breakdown
STEP 1 WINS 343
STEP 2 WINS 140
STEP 3 WINS 98
Many thanks JL for taking the time to go through all your data!! ;D
So a summary would go like this:
Games won: STEP 1 + STEP 2 = 343 + 140 = 483 games won
Games lost : 630 - 483 = 147 games lost
Strike rate = 483/147 = 3,29/1
If playing a two part progression of R2000; R4000 then a win nets R2000 and a loss results in R2000 + R4000 = R6000
Therefore 3.29 x R2000/ 1 x R6000 = R6580 - R6000 = R580 profit average over 4 games and R580 x 3 sets of 4 games = R1740 over 12 games give or take...
The strike rate is far below the 11.86/1 (581/49) and in my opinion a 3 part progression of 1;2;4 would net more profit instead of a two part progression of 1;2
11,86 x R1000/1 x R7000 = R11860-R7000 = R4860 for 12 games played as opposed to R580 x 3 = R1740 (also 12 games) profit
By using a One stage, 3 part progression of 1;2;4 one achieves the standard strike rate of 12/1 as discovered by JohnLegend
This Level one progression is how I am playing Pattern 4 and is different to JL's three stage progression
Hope I have not made a mistake in my thinking and calculations...
cheers
You're right John! Thanks for the kick in the ass and so noted. Need to focus on the big picture. :-[ I remember being at the racetrack when my friend hit a big one and I only had a few $$ on it and complained I should have bet more. He said "at least your ticket isn't on the floor like the other 95% of the bettors"
CD :thumbsup:
Jl,
I looked at my cards from the last 2 nights. I would have played 51 games if I bet just the next line and split 0/00 as an insurance bet .
45 wins 1 loss and 5 0/00 wins.
First spin wins=23
second spin wins=12
third spin wins =10
So wagering $35 to win $25 because $ 10 goes on 0/00 split.
45x$35=$1575
$10x 51=$510 (wagered on 0/00)
$1575-$510=$1065
$85x5=$425(won on 0/00 split
$1065+$425=$1490
$1490-$210(only loss using 1-2-4 prog)= $1280
So unless my calcs on wrong this is not a bad session.
JL, I know your record speaks for itself and I know what the rules are but I was just wondering your take and I'm sure you looked at it betting from line to line. 1/8 is still 1/8.
Although, If I had LLL or HHH I would'nt bet next line. Your thoughts Please. thanks!
CD :thumbsup:
People with small bankrolls can play it hunter strategy - wait for trigger. Bet after virtually losing 2 spins. With small progression you overcome the rest of trouble (1-3-7-15 on ECs)
Hermes
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 18, 11:45 AM 2011
Jl,
I looked at my cards from the last 2 nights. I would have played 51 games if I bet just the next line and split 0/00 as an insurance bet .
45 wins 1 loss and 5 0/00 wins.
First spin wins=23
second spin wins=12
third spin wins =10
So wagering $35 to win $25 because $ 10 goes on 0/00 split.
45x$35=$1575
$10x 51=$510 (wagered on 0/00)
$1575-$510=$1065
$85x5=$425(won on 0/00 split
$1065+$425=$1490
$1490-$210(only loss using 1-2-4 prog)= $1280
So unless my calcs on wrong this is not a bad session.
JL, I know your record speaks for itself and I know what the rules are but I was just wondering your take and I'm sure you looked at it betting from line to line. 1/8 is still 1/8.
Although, If I had LLL or HHH I would'nt bet next line. Your thoughts Please. thanks!
CD :thumbsup:
This is true Clothdog. But I am not kidding with what I am about to show you. Three of my losses out of my 49 to date were as follows.
HLH
HLH
HLH
HLH
LLH
LLH
LLH
LLH
HLL
HLL
HLL
HLL
Yes I couldnt believe it either. Random was stuck in repeat mode. It would have been a treat if I had been playing MATRIX VERTICAL 5 because the wins would have come thick and fast. But those examples are the reason I advocate that 6 spin virtual wait. You will get stung alot less longterm I ASSURE YOU.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 18, 01:28 PM 2011
This is true Clothdog. But I am not kidding with what I am about to show you. Three of my losses out of my 49 to date were as follows.
HLH
HLH
HLH
HLH
LLH
LLH
LLH
LLH
HLL
HLL
HLL
HLL
Yes I couldnt believe it either. Random was stuck in repeat mode. It would have been a treat if I had been playing MATRIX VERTICAL 5 because the wins would have come thick and fast. But those examples are the reason I advocate that 6 spin virtual wait. You will get stung a lot less longterm I ASSURE YOU.
Jl, So are you using a 6 spin wait now instead of 9?
CD
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 18, 05:31 PM 2011
Jl, So are you using a 6 spin wait now instead of 9?
CD
Well no the six spins are the ones between PATTERN 1 and PATTERN 4 thats what I mean I chose that gap for the reason I just explained. Wading through thousands of spins for PATTERN BREAKER. I notice several repeated patterns in the 1--9 spin range and less on that pattern 4. It could work fot PATTERN 5,6 and so forth but 4 was the right range to get that live casino turnover. So I chose that range.
Hi John
Been really busy last week with work and family commitments, played P4 tonight along with PAttern Breaker and Filler +24 units and was hit by Zero on 3 bet sequences
All 3 of these are truly awesome, and when my BR has grown a bit more I will be covering Zero and turning it into my friend ;D
Thanks JL
Gordon
pattern 4 session on betvoyager.
bermuda triangle turbo mode. H/L only
+10 units.
its not working well at all on betvoyager
here are my latest results
LLH
LLH
LLH
LLH
all appeared in a row. 4 quadruple loss .
I hear you Halba. I'm taking a break. Went to the casino tonite and got toasted by 0/00 3 games. it was all over the place at just the wrong time Only won one tonite and ended negatively. took a hit. My fault for not covering 0/00 all the time. The one game I covered the zero and won. the other games I didn't because it hit previously and 00 came in twice. I need to find a single zero wheel. they just won't open it up in the casino I go to for whatever reason. It's in the high limit room and they don't use it. :(
CD
hi clothdog. remain persistent. these strategies all work, its just the cheating RNG got me this time. it was a non-zero, yet i still lost a bit. so it means the RNG software reads your bets after placement. This i didn't know.
I suggest you go to try supercasino or smartlive/dublin as they have single zero. or try live baccarat at supercasino.
RNGs win even if they would change the rules that 0 and 00 are winners for gamblers,
not for casino! No zero roulette is catch 22 for retarded but there is a cure! If you lose so many times that you get sick and tired of losing you will get it and finally understand.
Hermes
Hello hermes. I tested the system at live casino today. funny why are the results a lot betteR????\
i think i'll have to stop playing at betvoyager now
Quote from: Hermes on Jun 19, 12:34 AM 2011
RNGs win even if they would change the rules that 0 and 00 are winners for gamblers,
not for casino! No zero roulette is catch 22 for retarded but there is a cure! If you lose so many times that you get sick and tired of losing you will get it and finally understand.
Hermes
Hermes speaks the truth. Why does a casino need the ZERO when they are cheating anyway? Ever asked yourself that question. Better still why havent they offered us A LIVE WHEEL with NO ZERO?
They know what would happen, thats why. PLAY LIVE.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 19, 01:15 AM 2011
Hermes speaks the truth. Why does a casino need the ZERO when they are cheating anyway? Ever asked yourself that question. Better still why haven't they offered us A LIVE WHEEL with NO ZERO?
They know what would happen, that's why. PLAY LIVE.
hello johnlegend. i tried out live play today. there is a significant difference in results. mainly because there is no 'cheating' of my bet.
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 19, 12:18 AM 2011
yet I still lost a bit. so it means the RNG software reads your bets after placement. This I didn't know.
If you're referring to BV there's no way they can read your bets after placement. See here (link:://rouletteforum.cc/online-gaming/betvoyager%27s-randomness-control-feature/).
Anyway it is just pseudo RNG. Word RNG makes me creepy. Brrr :lol:
Regards
Drazen
Quote from: Hermes on Jun 19, 12:34 AM 2011
RNGs win even if they would change the rules that 0 and 00 are winners for gamblers,
not for casino! No zero roulette is catch 22 for retarded but there is a cure! If you lose so many times that you get sick and tired of losing you will get it and finally understand.
Hermes
<sigh>
Hermes, quite a few members play at BV (including me) and I don't think they would be impressed at being referred to as 'retarded'. I understand you're predjudiced against all online casinos but they really can't all be tarred with the same brush. Either give some concrete evidence that the casino in question is cheating or keep your opinions to yourself. Thanks.
Quote from: Halba1 on Jun 19, 01:29 AM 2011
hello johnlegend. I tried out live play today. there is a significant difference in results. mainly because there is no 'cheating' of my bet.
I am glad you finally realized Halba. The things I have seen an RNG do would happen on a live wheel period. Theyre simply a manmade scam to rip off the unsuspecting. Their lure, SPEED. And we all know what the word speed rhymes with.
Do yourself a favour, leave the virtual crap alone and get real. You will be playing TRUE RANDOM with a live wheel. And with the right method, money management and self discipline. You wil come out a winner. SLOWLY BUT SURELY. Dont expect to get rich overnight.
That is the lie that has kept casinos in business for ever. Your first task is to build a BANKROLL over 50 times the size of your minumum progression. Once you have that you have gone clear. And so long as you continue to play with the three tenets of success. Overall you will never finish a week with less bankroll than you started with. THINK LONGTERM.
This isnt a race. When you eventually reach a level where you are matching or surpassing your day job. You are in life changing territory. You are your own man. But get there sensibly. Dont try to get there too fast or the chances are you will get to the poor house instead.
Remember your most precious thing is your BANKROLL, you are risking money to win money. Be tight and disciplined. If you even win just 5 points a day. Thats 150 points in a month. Then you aim to win 7 points a day thats 210 units the next month and so forth. Before you know it you are winning 20 units a day without even testing you BR.
Slowly but surely.
Quote from: Bayes on Jun 19, 02:05 AM 2011
If you're referring to BV there's no way they can read your bets after placement. See here (link:://rouletteforum.cc/online-gaming/betvoyager%27s-randomness-control-feature/).
Bayes you should know better. RNGS cheat period. they are designed to make sure they make a profit overall before they payout. They are no different from slot machines. Their draw on the gullible is FAST TURNOVER. They pray on the very thing that keeps casinos in business to start with HUMAN GREED and LACK OF PATIENCE.
Do you really think a casino is going to offer you a NO ZERO option if they think they will be fleeced? Let them offer a LIVE WHEEL with no ZERO. I will be the first one there.
JL, unfortunately there's no way to convince someone who won't listen to reason because they've closed their mind to the evidence. To dismiss ALL RNGs as cheating is absurd. Read the actual link I posted and then tell me how BV can cheat in the way you think they are. And please don't misrepresent my view; undoubtedly some RNG do cheat, but all? How can you possibly know that? ???
And why are you so sure that live wheels NEVER cheat? I can think of several ways in which they can, but this possibility is hardly ever considered because 'seeing is believing', except these days, it isn't.
The system BV has in place is a far better safeguard against cheating than anything you can merely see with your own eyes, it's just that probably most people won't understand how it works or just dismiss it without even attempting to understand it, like yourself.
This debate will go on and on. If you don't trust RNG then don't play them, but it irritates the hell out of me that people casually trash them all as cheating without a shred of proof in any individual case. I get so tired of reading: 'I lost, therefore the casino was cheating'. :yawn:
Quote from: Bayes on Jun 19, 02:37 AM 2011
JL, unfortunately there's no way to convince someone who won't listen to reason because they've closed their mind to the evidence. To dismiss ALL RNGs as cheating is absurd. Read the actual link I posted and then tell me how BV can cheat in the way you think they are. And please don't misrepresent my view; undoubtedly some RNG do cheat, but all? How can you possibly know that? ???
And why are you so sure that live wheels NEVER cheat? I can think of several ways in which they can, but this possibility is hardly ever considered because 'seeing is believing', except these days, it isn't.
The system BV has in place is a far better safeguard against cheating than anything you can merely see with your own eyes, it's just that probably most people won't understand how it works or just dismiss it without even attempting to understand it, like yourself.
Bayes you know a live wheel itself is hard enough to beat longterm. BUT, it can and is being beaten by a small minority all the time. An RNG simply isnt going to lose to any method. Twister took a method to BV that will take any live wheel down longterm if played correctly. He got read like the financial times. It produces freakish unatural results that you simpy will not see on a live wheel.
I will take live anyday of the week over software. The physics of a real ball spinning around a real wheel are far harder to tamper with. Especially as the casino would have no idea what they are trying to oppose. If you were a sector player targetting a certain part of the wheel all the time YES, YES, YES. They could interfere with your play. But a method like PATTERN 4 or CODE 4 forget it. They are over. If the player has the three essentials of success in his grasp.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 19, 02:48 AM 2011
An RNG simply isnt going to lose to any method.
Implying that ALL RNG's wait until your bet is placed before 'choosing' the next number. BV doesn't work like this and you can prove it for yourself. Read the thread. :thumbsup:
QuoteTwister took a method to BV that will take any live wheel down longterm if played correctly.
That's sheer speculation, your method may have 'worked' so far for you and some others, but that in no way proves it's a long term winner.
QuoteHe got read like the financial times. It produces freakish unatural results that you simpy will not see on a live wheel.
One losing streak does not prove that he was 'read'. What was this 'freakish unnatural result'? don't forget we're talking about random numbers here - anything can happen in the short term; there aren't 'natural' random numbers and 'unnatural' ones, there are just random numbers!
i can confirm bayes is right. my techniques, impatience and strategy were wrong. it wasn't the RNG.
have a look at my latest system posted. I tested it in real mode +9 units. There is no way BV is reading my bets. that was flat betting also. if they were reading bets i'd be down. case closed. bayes you are correct.
hi Johnlegend, can i ask what units you use in each level? from what i can gather is it:
Level 1 - 1,2,4
Level 2 - 3,6,12
Level 3 - 6,12,24?
in losing scenarios, after a Level 2 loss (rare though they are!), do you do 2 at Level 3 for a 9 unit loss?
& after a Level 1 loss, 1 at Level 3, for a 1 unit loss?
cheers & continued propsperity!
monaco play at L2 for 2 games, so to build a cushion, then drop to L1.
Tested P4 on betvoyager non zero. still getting double losses. very immediate. no longer playing P4 over there.
I believe its only for Live tables Nihal.
Not RNG at all.
Quote from: chrisbis on Jun 20, 04:18 AM 2011
I believe its only for Live tables Nihal.
Not RNG at all.
i also tested on live table. almost sameish results. you can get repeaters because it is only a combination of 8 - e.g. HHH LLL HLH etc, chances are 1/8 of getting the same.
hello johnlegend.
re: live online roulette. Do we start tracking the spins as soon as we enter table, or can we use scoreboard to record the previous 9 spins and start betting immediately? thanks. how many wins do you do before quitting.
Quote from: monaco on Jun 19, 04:55 PM 2011
Hi Johnlegend, can I ask what units you use in each level? from what I can gather is it:
Level 1 - 1,2,4
Level 2 - 3,6,12
Level 3 - 6,12,24?
in losing scenarios, after a Level 2 loss (rare though they are!), do you do 2 at Level 3 for a 9 unit loss?
& after a Level 1 loss, 1 at Level 3, for a 1 unit loss?
cheers & continued propsperity!
Hi Monaco I don't recommend those progressions to newbies. I was a bit premature in introducing them. Let me be Frank. Everyone on this forum is looking for a betting miracle. But they don't understand it comes at a price they aren't willing to pay. The price is TIME. Pattern BREAKER is a much better method than PATTERN 4. Doubles losses? I've never had one. But you have to wait for random to select your bet for you. And this could take anything from 21-81 spins. So the average Joe isnt prepared to wait. Even though by doing so he is certain to hit a strikerate of at least 13/1 longterm without ever having to go beyond level one. Profit is assured.
So we bring a compromise. PATTERN 4. Much faster turnover with a set betting frequency. THE PRICE? You will be hit by double losses from time to time. And you HAVE TO PLAY IT HIT AND RUN. This is the only way you can challenge the strikerate of PATTERN BREAKER.
So you the player must decide which one is for you. Once you reach a level where a single game is worth the wait. Id choose PATTERN BREAKER everytime. Hit and RUN I own a winning streak of 112 with that method. And to speed turnover you could play three simultaneous games for all three even chances. THE TRADE IS AND ALWAYS WILL BE TIME VS INVINCIBILITY. The faster the method the more you will lose for a modest risk.
If you play methods like CODE 4 and the soon to be introduced PHASE 3. You will get impressive strikerates. BUT you are risking 10 times as much. Keep these things in mind.
Thanks for your reply Johnlegend.. I really just wanted to clarify exactly what was entailed re. recoveries etc before trying this - (I have no problem with patience â€" I’ve tried some pretty slow grinds in my time!)
cheers again
hi JL. i played live and notice quite a few double losses on PAttern 4, even playing 'hit and run' as you say. This is because only 8 possible combinations, and of course the zero
Thanks JL for this really helpful and updated overview.
I cant wait to get back into PatternBreaker again and overview the P4 and the other variations, then link/ run parallel to D+C.
You sure are correct with regard to the patience requirement. It is my hope that the key characteristics and qualities of these various systems can be understood, thanks to a lot of effort you and Scooby Doo, and others have gone to, and then be able for all of us to pick and choose and utilise these excellent tools to take steady, realistic and achievable consistent profit.
As you rightly say, there are many looking for easy fast answers, and it just doesn't work like that. The 'negative expectation' of the theoretical probability based mathematics that some apply to roulette seems in many cases to be mirrored by a 'negative expectation' attitude.
This needs to be shattered and replaced with an understanding, earned by right of hard work, that consistent and realistic profit is, and can be earned, with a professional attitude and wise use of clever methods and a further understanding that it is the mathematics of 'the game' we need to be looking at.
In such short cycles we can overturn the so called negative expectation, and by trial and error application of key triggers and stops, and an understandings of timing, and the forces at work in roulette, just below the surface, we can succeed.
Really looking forward to a phase in the coming 4-6 weeks endeavouring to explore and develop these ideas and offer at least a few further specific pointers to help us all.
I like the suggestion of JL that we can accelerate some methods by running a few EC bets for example simultaneously, and that in itself will necessitate careful and skillful management.
Thanks to JohnLegend for his tireless efforts to assist everyone.
Just a thought, I intend to cover the Zero (I play on a single zero table, B&M) and since the zero is situated between two High numbers on the wheel, perhaps the Zero could be considered a Low number, so when betting for a Low result (against a High in the P4 pattern) place a small wager on the Zero as it may hit since its a "Low" number...
And to add to that, perhaps one could consider any Zero in the first 9 spins as being a "Low" number instead of not playing that session due to the zero...
I agree John is the most helpfull members on this forum ( john must be consistently winning he got lots of free time to talk!!)
The positive and constructive attitude of its members that makes this forum the best of its kind
I am winning consistently but very small amounts with p4 and pattern filler . i use the tracker to wait for losses as trigger if i play more than one hit an run game. I feel a lot safer this way
also never seen double loss for pattern filler! h/l.. I have for o/e though
if i can keep it up for another month i will invest my own hard earned money and increase my BR
Quote from: XXVV on Jun 20, 04:40 PM 2011
Thanks JL for this really helpful and updated overview.u
I can't wait to get back into PatternBreaker again and overview the P4 and the other variations, then link/ run parallel to D+C.
You sure are correct with regard to the patience requirement. It is my hope that the key characteristics and qualities of these various systems can be understood, thanks to a lot of effort you and Scooby Doo, and others have gone to, and then be able for all of us to pick and choose and utilise these excellent tools to take steady, realistic and achievable consistent profit.
As you rightly say, there are many looking for easy fast answers, and it just doesn't work like that. The 'negative expectation' of the theoretical probability based mathematics that some apply to roulette seems in many cases to be mirrored by a 'negative expectation' attitude.
This needs to be shattered and replaced with an understanding, earned by right of hard work, that consistent and realistic profit is, and can be earned, with a professional attitude and wise use of clever methods and a further understanding that it is the mathematics of 'the game' we need to be looking at.
In such short cycles we can overturn the so called negative expectation, and by trial and error application of key triggers and stops, and an understandings of timing, and the forces at work in roulette, just below the surface, we can succeed.
Really looking forward to a phase in the coming 4-6 weeks endeavouring to explore and develop these ideas and offer at least a few further specific pointers to help us all.
I like the suggestion of JL that we can accelerate some methods by running a few EC bets for example simultaneously, and that in itself will necessitate careful and skillful management.
Thanks to JohnLegend for his tireless efforts to assist everyone.
Exactly XXVV,you have the perfect way of expressing things. What I am currently doing is analyzing the breakdown of PATTERN BREAKER once 5 of the 8 possible patterns have been formed.
Here is what I've learnt so far. When you have three patterns remaining. You cannot say with any accuracy how long theyll take to show. But, you will seldom have to bet more than three times to nail one. EXAMPLE, Lets say these are our last three remaining patterns.
HLH
LLL
LHH
From what my analysis is showing me, if you were to wait until the first two parts of one of those patterns have formed. It rarely takes more than three attempts to nail it. So if we had this
HL.. You are very lightly to hit H in no more than three attempts most of the time. The reason I have taken it upon myself to explore the breakdown of a game more thoroughly. Is to make the most of the time invested in a game. There are now four oppurtunities to exploit, the sixth pattern, the seventh pattern and then finally the eigth both against and for. I have already played 20 games in this fashion seeking and achieving four wins per game.
Never being pressed beyond three attempts to nail the third part of a pattern. This now makes the time invested more worthwhile I believe. And with PATTERN BREAKER, you are allowing random to work for you. As XXVV would say, its truly fascinating watching the forces pull those final patterns into place. You flow down the stream of random instead of against it.
I'm sorry, but what is PATTERN BREAKER? I know PB4, Code 4, D&C.Thanks!
CD
Quote from: clothdog on Jun 21, 10:40 AM 2011
I'm sorry, but what is PATTERN BREAKER? I know PB4, Code 4, D&C.Thanks!
CD
CD If you want to find anything go under search .
JohnLegend,
Just as a quick brainstorm...
From your data how often have you seen the following pattern repeat itself consecutively.....
HLH
HLH
HLH
or any other combination except HHH and LLL
This would be interesting to note, if it is not more than 5 I would be willing to wait for a trigger and use a six step progression...
There are no pattern which repeats more or less. The differences are only temporary. You can use them only in the same game. Next game will have different favorites.
I wrote 37 spins of ECs and then bet next 37 spins against the appearance but sometimes I would win if I would bet the same.
Hermes
Quote from: amk on Jun 21, 10:52 AM 2011
JohnLegend,
Just as a quick brainstorm...
From your data how often have you seen the following pattern repeat itself consecutively.....
HLH
HLH
HLH
Por any other combination except HHH and LLL
This would be interesting to note, if it is not more than 5 I would be willing to wait for a Ptrigger and use a six step progression...
I've never seen more than five of any pattern AMK. Thats another virtual limit I believe and its part and parcel of the reason MV5 E/C works.
five is my limit too
but I have seen 11 vertical hits in a row, example
HLH
H
H
H
H
H
H
H
H
H
H
O MY HAT TWISTER!!!
That would ruin anyone's day if it were played!!!
Quote from: Maui13 on Jun 21, 11:49 AM 2011
O MY HAT TWISTER!!!
That would ruin anyone's day if it were played!!!
Yes Twisters example isnt unique. While playing PATTERN BREAKER AND MV5 Ive seen 14 Highs and 12 lows in a VERTICAL LINE. That said MOST dont live beyond 7 so even that could be forged into something profitable.
PATTERN 4 RESULTS UPDATE FOR 01/07/2011
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 750
TOTAL GAMES WON 694
TOTAL GAMES LOST 56
STRIKERATE APPROX 12/1
BALANCE 708 UNITS PLUS
DOUBLE LOSSES 6
LONGEST WINNING STREAK 35
LONGEST FIRST GAME WINNING STREAK 41
This method played in conjunction with PATTERN BREAKER, is performing very solidly. I am playing both HIGH and LOW and ODD and EVEN. There is little between them for performance.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jul 01, 07:02 PM 2011
PATTERN 4 RESULTS UPDATE FOR 01/07/2011
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 750
TOTAL GAMES WON 694
TOTAL GAMES LOST 56
STRIKERATE APPROX 12/1
BALANCE 708 UNITS PLUS
DOUBLE LOSSES 6
LONGEST WINNING STREAK 35
LONGEST FIRST GAME WINNING STREAK 41
This method played in conjunction with PATTERN BREAKER, is performing very solidly. I am playing both HIGH and LOW and ODD and EVEN. There is little between them for performance.
Many thanks for the update JL, I will be focusing on this method of play in the very near future and will post my results. Checking on my data I have a 12/1 strike rate on H and L and maybe 11/1 on Odd and Evens, but Red and Black seem to be at 9/1 or worse, very strange indeed, possibly just my particular unique set of random selections... I will Play only H and L and Odd and Evens... I will also only play a level 1 progression of 1;2;4 and increase my chip value as my BR grows...
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jul 02, 02:48 AM 2011
Many thanks for the update JL, I will be focusing on this method of play in the very near future and will post my results. Checking on my data I have a 12/1 strike rate on H and L and maybe 11/1 on Odd and Evens, but Red and Black seem to be at 9/1 or worse, very strange indeed, possibly just my particular unique set of random selections... I will Play only H and L and Odd and Evens... I will also only play a level 1 progression of 1;2;4 and increase my chip value as my BR grows...
Look at the wheel Midnight another member commented on the difference of layout between red and black and the other two even chances. Now considering that is the medium the ball is spinning around. There could be something to it, why Red and black doesn't par with the other two. And where do people PILE THEIR CHIPS?
Hi Midnight, this is what John is referring to for the European wheel layout.
I also feel that these mini groups can also be used to our advantage in other areas, but perhaps that advantage is really too small to be of much use.
Quote from: artattack on Jun 06, 06:12 AM 2011
Hi, I just thought I would pop in here with a comment on perhaps why H L O E seem to perform better than Red and Black.
Could it have something to do with the wheel layout.
0-32-15-19-4-21-2-25-17-34-6-27-13-36-11-30-8-23-10-5-24-16-33-1-20-14-31 -9-22-18-29-7-28-12-35-3-26
If you notice, red and black are alternate on the wheel, but odd/even, high/low are not quite and there are mini groups that could just tip the balance.
For instance 10-5-24-16 you have 3 low numbers out of 4 also 3 even numbers out of the same 4
another example 15-19-4-21 here we have 3 odd numbers in a sector of 4
Hello by the way.
Arthur
hello Artattack and JL,
Thank you for your interesting reply on the Red Black question...
I am still rather puzzled by this phenomenon of the color EC not doing as well, also interesting that the numbers are displayed that way on the marque board and not in High Low splits or Odd Even splits? Not sure what to make of it, one would think that the EC colors would do as well, it does not make immediate sense at all...
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jul 02, 06:01 PM 2011
Look at the wheel Midnight another member commented on the difference of layout between red and black and the other two even chances. Now considering that is the medium the ball is spinning around. There could be something to it, why Red and black doesn't par with the other two. And where do people PILE THEIR CHIPS?
Interesting, people pile their chips mostly on the color EC's.... everyone's focus is on this, and the marque board too..... I wonder if this is deliberate, drawing the players attention away from roulettes Achilles heel?
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jul 03, 08:22 AM 2011
Interesting, people pile their chips mostly on the color ECs.... everyone's focus is on this, and the marquee board too..... I wonder if this is deliberate, drawing the players attention away from roulettes Achilles heel?
---------------
i always thought that it was because
visually it’s easier to see if we've won or not ???
vundarosa
I thought John said he was posting his 1000/1? Wasn't he supposed to do that last sunday?
Just curious.
CD
Hello Clothdog,
I think JohnLgend will reveal his new method RANDOMLY :)..........
see this is true for me too midnight player,,, i put orphis tracker on to just monitor things
So how are the maths explaining that ?
Like xxvv said betting against it could be a good way possibly even with a trigger
R/B consistently does rubbish on p4 why is that ?
Hi JL & All
Still playing P4 with excellent results on all 3 E/C's and tonight the Zero popped up when playing my 3rd game on R/B nice little bonus, I then continued tracking numbers for PB without betting and the following sequence came up
17
34
17
34
17
17
17
The odds for that must be astronomical and added to that there was a dealer change as always after 30mins which finished on 17,34,17 and then 34,17 was spun from the new dealer so she spun a slow one and 17 landed again and again.........Roulette its a funny old gqme ;D
Thanks John for this method as its enabled me to start playing with their money, although it helps to be seriously disciplined and not be greedy
Gordon :thumbsup:
Almost unbelievable! I would get an heart attack or check for magnet in the ball but it is true, never underestimate roulette. When you feel like hero it slathers you down like monkey from the tree.
Hermes
gordonline,
Say what you will but there is order in the universe and this is more than coincidence and nothing happens by accident, game of chance or not. What is interesting is that I would have cleaned up on that with a method I posted a few years ago and still use to this day. Too bad other members at that time scoffed at me regarding it's validity. One thing I will say check out 8-17-26-35. When one of them hits one of the others is sure to follow within 5 spins. the other night I cleaned up when 17 hit then 35 hit 3 times within 4 spins. There is more to it than that though. But check your numbers.
CD :thumbsup:
Quote from: strato1985 on Jul 04, 06:56 PM 2011
see this is true for me too midnight player,,, I put orphis tracker on to just monitor things
So how are the maths explaining that ?
Like xxvv said betting against it could be a good way possibly even with a trigger
R/B consistently does nonsense on p4 why is that ?
Hi Strato1985 and JohnLegend, I was at casino last night and out of the 3 tables open two of them had marque boards that were faulty (only recording spins occasionally) so I guessed the possible pattern and won the first 18 games in a row playing first H/L on all three hit and run then Odd/Even on all then again H/L etc for 30 games, no waiting, took two hours, ended up with 28/2 (14/1 strike rate) I believe that if its kept random even with incorrect pattern this method wins...
Games played to date: 78
Games won: 72
Lost: 6
Strike rate: 12/1
Units won: 72- (6 x 7units = 42) = +30
I only play one level progression:1;2;4 and take the loss
Quote from: clothdog on Jul 04, 11:19 PM 2011
What is interesting is that I would have cleaned up on that with a method I posted a few years ago and still use to this day.
Can it still be checked somewhere maybe?
Possibly.I modified the original a little bit. It was posted I think in 2007 on another forum. There were a few astute people who liked it and did well and some said it would never holdup long term.I hate to say this but I took a $1000 br yesterday and rolled it into $5400. I had to leave because I had family plans. I took an $800 br and rolled it into $4600 on airball. Again, I'm not saying this is the holy grail but it works for me and my friend who uses it. if I could play this online so you could see me do it I would.
CD :thumbsup:
Quote from: Midnight Player on Jul 05, 02:07 AM 2011
Hi Strato1985 and JohnLegend, I was at casino last night and out of the 3 tables open two of them had marquee boards that were faulty (only recording spins occasionally) so I guessed the possible pattern and won the first 18 games in a row playing first H/L on all three hit and run then Odd/Even on all then again H/L etc for 30 games, no waiting, took two hours, ended up with 28/2 (14/1 strike rate) I believe that if its kept random even with incorrect pattern this method wins...
Games played to date: 78
Games won: 72
Lost: 6
Strike rate: 12/1
Units won: 72- (6 x 7units = 42) = +30
I only play one level progression:1;2;4 and take the loss
Yes Midnight RED AND BLACK. Can produce some scary patterns. With the PATTERN BREAKER. They behave themselves better though. I have taken a page out of Gordonlines book.
I am now playing 3 simultaneous games for PATTERN BREAKER on all three even chances to improve turnover and see if they maintain the strikerate around 14/1. And after 51 games like this they are behaving very similar which is great because. I can now get 15 games in the time I would normally get 5.
hi clothdog why not give us the basics of what you are playing so it can be tested plenty interested people here i can assure you
J
Quote from: clothdog on Jul 05, 05:58 PM 2011
Possibly.I modified the original a little bit. It was posted I think in 2007 on another forum. There were a few astute people who liked it and did well and some said it would never holdup long term.I hate to say this but I took a $1000 br yesterday and rolled it into $5400. I had to leave because I had family plans. I took an $800 br and rolled it into $4600 on airball. Again, I'm not saying this is the holy grail but it works for me and my friend who uses it. if I could play this online so you could see me do it I would.
CD :thumbsup:
I hope you understand what joiner29 wanted to say. The worst thing you can do on any forum is to say how you are winning good amounts of money in short time, without revealing method. So, or you gonna give us that method whatever it is to examine, or dont ever mention things like that, otherwise you are gonna start losing your credit here. I hope you understand.
Regards
Drazen
Quote from: drazen_cro on Jul 06, 06:29 AM 2011
So, or you gonna give us that method whatever it is to examine, or don't ever mention things like that, otherwise you are gonna start losing your credit here. I hope you understand.
Regards
Drazen
What??? ??? "So, or you gonna give us that method whatever it is to examine " Give us?
Who are you to demand??? That's the problem with people like like you..Gimme, gimme, gimme. What have you got for me today? I'm surprised people like john, who has given so much and continues even survives on these boards with all the leeches and condescending people who criticize and don't contribute anything. Am I pissed? You bet I am. >:( Listen,my friend, before you open your big mouth, Do you want to know something Drazen? I posted one of my methods (which I use and have done very well with) here not too long ago. Got ZERO, did you here me? ZERO replies.No one was interested. :o Obviously it had no merit to warrant even a reply. But I got NONE. Go look at it if you want to. I was hoping to get feedback. I put alot of my ideas on VLS years ago and they were willing to offer suggestions and test . Most people here are too interested in what JL, Scooby, X has to say and not some other guy who might have a little something. They are great contributors, and I applaud them and everyone here and their contributions but don't go off on me when I already posted some of my work and no one cared or thought it was worth two shits. I am more than happy and looking for improvements in my stuff and not to hide from anyone who will help. maybe I will try one more time with my changes to see if anybody will even test it. :yawn: I hope YOU understand. See you later.
CD
Quote from: clothdog on Jul 06, 08:33 AM 2011
What??? "give us that method whatever it is to examine " "Give us?" Who are you to demand??? Listen,my friend, before you open your big mouth, Do you want to know something Drazen? I posted one of my methods (which I use and have done very well with) here not too long ago. Got ZERO, did you here me? ZERO replies.No one was interested. :o Go look at it if you want to. I was hoping to get feedback. But I got NONE. People are too interested in what JL, Scooby, X has to say and not some other guy who might have a little something. They are great contributors, and I applaud them and everyone here and their contributions but don't go off on me when I already posted some of my work and no one cared or thought it was worth two shits. I am more than happy and looking for improvements in my stuff and not to hide from anyone who will help. maybe I will try one more time with my changes to see if anybody will even test it. :yawn: I hope YOU understand. See you later.
CD
the intersting thing is even though there are no replies,i myself will always search old system and see if they can be tweaked there so much here so to no be offended ,there will be someone that will be itnerested.
Quote from: clothdog on Jul 06, 08:33 AM 2011
What??? "give us that method whatever it is to examine " "Give us?" Who are you to demand??? That's the problem with people like like you..Gimme, gimme, gimme. What have you got for me today? I'm surprised people like john, who has given so much and continues even survive on these boards with all the leeches and condescending people who criticize and don't contribute anything. Am I pissed? You bet I am. >:( Listen,my friend, before you open your big mouth, Do you want to know something Drazen? I posted one of my methods (which I use and have done very well with) here not too long ago. Got ZERO, did you here me? ZERO replies.No one was interested. :o Go look at it if you want to. I was hoping to get feedback. But I got NONE. People are too interested in what JL, Scooby, X has to say and not some other guy who might have a little something. They are great contributors, and I applaud them and everyone here and their contributions but don't go off on me when I already posted some of my work and no one cared or thought it was worth two shits. I am more than happy and looking for improvements in my stuff and not to hide from anyone who will help. maybe I will try one more time with my changes to see if anybody will even test it. :yawn: I hope YOU understand. See you later.
CD
I am realy sorry you got pissed. That wasnt my intention at all. I apologize. And now yes, i saw you posted method with no replis, and honestly, first time i see this. Somehow it skipped me.
You got it too much serious, i wasnt demanding strictly anything, just trying to get a point...
I ll test your method and get you feedback, you deserve it. And i agree with you that most of guys here want HG or whatever they call, method which they will use wtithout thinking, and get rich overnight... I am not one of them. And i respect you same as Jl, or scooby or anyone else here. Number of posts doesnt have to mean too much..
Best to you
Drazen
Thanks Drazen. I appreciate the help.
CD :thumbsup:
My results so far from papertesting Smartlivecasino, live dealer or airball:
Total games played: 89
Total games won: 79
Total games lost: 10
Strikerate: approx. 8 to 1
Balance: -10units
Double losses: 2
Longest winning streak: 30
Longest 1st game winning streak: 14
Played H/L only, hit and run, no game within 20 games of the previous.
Will carry on testing to see if reaches higher strikerate.
Ok.
I propose a variation on this method.
You list results in matrix of 3 as before - HLH etc..
You look for a repeat of a pattern:
HLH
HHL
LHL
HLH..
You bet against the repeat of this pattern after the same interval of spins so...
HLH
HHL
LHL
HLH
HHH
LLH
-Bet here against HLH. If you lose then bet against the same pattern again after the same spin interval, so...
HLH
HHL
LHL
HLH
HHH
LLH
HLH - loss.
LH0
HHL
LHH - win.
All the while you are looking out for other patterns forming to bet on.
HLH
HHL
LHL
HLH
HHH
LLH
HLH - loss.
LH0
HHL
LHH - win.
HHL...
I propose a 6 stage martingale - 1,2,4,8,16,32. 63 units in total.
For better peace of mind or a larger bet look for 3 patterns equally spaced and bet against the fourth one forming.
Woods
Tell me what the difference is between this type of matrix bet, and just making a pure guess on High/Low, and Marty out when U get it wrong?
U see, when U think Random can't possibly do the think your betting against,
is has a horrible habit of doing exactly that.
That 'moment' has now past, and unless u make a Time-Machine, can not be altered and played again.
The next "Moment-of-Opportunity" is still just a 50:50 chance of happening.
The 'Past' moment, bears no reflection of the next occurrance, and so,
your left in exactly the same position as U would be,
if u just guess the outcome, and as I say, Marty out your MM depletion.
So, since its getting darker all the time in the Uk Winter...........what's the difference Mr Dark Oak?
[reveal=Here's a Reveal, for the Reveal Watchers!]
Oak is my favourite Wood.
[/reveal]
Quote from: Chrisbis on Nov 17, 02:57 AM 2011
Tell me what the difference is between this type of matrix bet, and just making a pure guess on High/Low, and Marty out when U get it wrong?
U see, when U think Random can't possibly do the think your betting against,
is has a horrible habit of doing exactly that.
That 'moment' has now past, and unless u make a Time-Machine, can not be altered and played again.
The next "Moment-of-Opportunity" is still just a 50:50 chance of happening.
The 'Past' moment, bears no reflection of the next occurrance, and so,
your left in exactly the same position as U would be,
if u just guess the outcome, and as I say, Marty out your MM depletion.
So, since its getting darker all the time in the Uk Winter...........what's the difference Mr Dark Oak?
[reveal=Here's a Reveal, for the Reveal Watchers!]
Oak is my favourite Wood.
[/reveal]
Old and what the point with a roulette board and experiment when it is 50/50 no matter what you do.
Let them have fun and find some-thing they like and can relax with - that is all.
I would say there is only three ways.
Repeats and no repeats or favorites or no favorites or balance or imbalance.
If you would pick one it would be the same if you know how to capture the momentum.
Its all about to relax and feel good about a bet selection and feel that you have control about what you are up against and in the same time being realistic - that sound like a human roulette system player.
Anything you do is gonna be 50/50 so whatever you do to make up your mind is as good as choosing one straight off the top of your head right?
but why is it your more likely or appears to be that you will get it correct
i bet that this pattern will not come next RBRB i feel whenever i place a bet like this i seem to do better than the following
i bet that this pattern will come next BBRR i find that this is harder to get right
your views...?
Do U think, that your two chosen patterns are a little 'Linear' in dimension?
(just sticking to one third of the possible EC's available)
By that I mean, wouldn't this next pattern, be as good, if not better, to break?.....
I bet that, this will not occur again..... B, H, O, O, H, B.... and equally followed by... R, H, L, R, O, L, H, R.
U see what I mean?
Chose the a 'Tool' and ask randoms 'nuts' to fit your multipurpose Spanner!
Just as good, as formulating, an illusion matrix,
not matter how much U may find them pleasing to the eye.
I agree. A more complex pattern the better to a degree. But the question is the bet, how large it is and also how easy it is to place if time is a problem.
See my next post in notepad b4 I hijack this one totally. ' 4 X 9' ....
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 30, 05:02 PM 2011
Excellent Strato1985 you are reading the game not just playing it robotically. I like that. Yes often in a live casino you get some annoying patrons. I've had chips stolen. And even somone claiming my chips were theirs when I won of course. I often chose times when there aren't too many people on one table. A game is a game. It will win anywhere anytime if its a good method.
I would suggest something like a 600 pound BR and use 2,4,8=14 units as your level 1 stakes and 4,8,16=28 units as your level 2. When you get to double that, you double your stakes. You always want a minumum of around 15 times your total risk. Once you have 1,200 units in your bankroll forget it. You have pulled clear and will never look back. Once you have 3,000 you have reached a level where a daily gain comparable to a living wage is a reality. Keep that bankroll growing there are no surprises with this method it will deliver over and over. Take advantage of it.
Do you win say bankroll(3000) + 1000 then take out the 1000 to get you back to your bankroll of 3000? Do you use more than one casino or land based casinos? I'm scared that if I'm taking out £1k every couple of months with no real losses that I'll get barred and they will keep my bankroll or something :/
Dying to try this hit and run method when pay day comes. Perhaps a £100 initial BR with 1, 2, 4 betting tier one. Would that be a feasible option for me? Perhaps playing 9am, 5pm and 11pm for one win at a time = 3 wins a day( £3 winnings per day until bankroll is higher)
Quote from: Gordonline on Jun 18, 07:39 PM 2011
I will be covering Zero and turning it into my friend ;D
Thanks JL
Gordon
Hello, can you tell me % of my bets I should stick on zero to cover it? Do I also need to put same amount also on my bets for example.
I'm betting £1.00 on 1st dozen and £1.00 on 3rd dozen....Do I need to do that bet and as a side bet put £0.10 on green zero...
OR...do I do the two x £1.00 bet...put £0.10 on green zero and then add a single £0.10 chip on
to the £1.00 bets to make it - £1.10 on 1st dozen and £1.10 on 3rd dozen and £0.10 on green?
Hope you're still on the forum to answer lol...if anyone else has any info/help then please jump in. Thanks
Sub
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 14, 03:48 PM 2011
HLH-PATTERN 1
LLL
HLL--NINE SPINS NO ZERO.
2, You now bet against the FIRST PATTERN forming as the FOURTH PATTERN (SPINS 10-12)
Welcome to *PATTERN 4*
Why does waiting 9 spins then betting that the first 3 spins don't appear in that order for spins 10-12 increase your chance of winning .The odds are still 50/50 :-\
Any random choice gives you the same chance.
Quote from: moles40 on Mar 13, 08:22 AM 2012
Why does waiting 9 spins then betting that the first 3 spins don't appear in that order for spins 10-12 increase your chance of winning .The odds are still 50/50 :-\
Any random choice gives you the same chance.
You are absolutely right. Choosing a sophisticated pattern to bet against like variety of matrixes or waiting some extra number of spins gives you a false illusion of having a better chance of beating random. It really does not matter if you wait certain number of spins to place a bet. It might only slow a inevitability of encountering some losses. There is nothing magical in these patterns. If you bet against repeat of certain pattern of ECs for example your chance of winning a bet are always 50% no matter how deep you are in your progression. Of course im not talking about extremes like betting on R if you saw B hit like 20 times and you know that world record is 25 or 26.
You can be successful for long period of time playing for example Pattern 4 but sooner or later loses are going to catch up with you. You are expected to lose once in 8 times and believe me that after few hundred games your strike rate are going to be in that range. Some people report 12 to 1 strike rate but in the long run is impossible to sustain it.
The sooner you realize that the better for your wallet.
Regards
Quote from: Robeenhuut on Mar 13, 10:37 AM 2012
You are absolutely right. Choosing a sophisticated pattern to bet against like variety of matrixes or waiting some extra number of spins gives you a false illusion of having a better chance of beating random. It really does not matter if you wait certain number of spins to place a bet. It might only slow a inevitability of encountering some losses. There is nothing magical in these patterns. If you bet against repeat of certain pattern of ECs for example your chance of winning a bet are always 50% no matter how deep you are in your progression. Of course I'm not talking about extremes like betting on R if you saw B hit like 20 times and you know that world record is 25 or 26.
You can be successful for long period of time playing for example Pattern 4 but sooner or later loses are going to catch up with you. You are expected to lose once in 8 times and believe me that after few hundred games your strike rate are going to be in that range. Some people report 12 to 1 strike rate but in the long run is impossible to sustain it.
The sooner you realize that the better for your wallet.
Regards
you contradict yourself in the above statement, so its always 50% chance and patterns dont matter, but 20 reds in a row means black is due? -___- ... but i do agree that betting EOO wont come back to back or 9 spins later makes no difference.
It is so boring to read about pepole who say nothing is due to happen - who cares as it does not effect some one who know how to play the game.
Then that even money bets is 50/50 is only true if you play red and black as they come - but there exist other solutionts with change the math and probability - but i recon not many know that ...
By the way - did some one have succes using PATTERN 4 ?
Quote from: ANONYMOUS on Mar 13, 12:32 PM 2012
you contradict yourself in the above statement, so its always 50% chance and patterns don't matter, but 20 reds in a row means black is due? -___- ... but i do agree that betting EOO won't come back to back or 9 spins later makes no difference.
I meant that if nobody saw R hit more than 26 times that you can risk betting on it. You always have the same chance of course.
Regards
Quote from: Robeenhuut on Mar 13, 02:07 PM 2012
I meant that if nobody saw R hit more than 26 times that you can risk betting on it. You always have the same chance of course.
Regards
1. Follow the wheel or follow how the distribution unfold.
2. Bet against the wheel or the how the distribution unfold.
Is it the same thing or is one option better then the other?
That is the question.
I would never use point 2 and allways follow as point 1.
Now some one clever say they start and end with same probability and are based upon the same math - well then some one should get deeper into study randomness.
The "math" guys always come up with the trump card of "it's always the same chance on every spin", but that's only half the story. In statistics there are TWO parameters of interest which describe a population: The average, and the standard deviation. Yes, the same chance is there on every spin (0.5), that's the average. But everyone knows you can't rely on the average in the short term, if you could, it would be easy to beat roulette. You also need to look at dispersion, regression to the mean etc (this is the deeper study of randomness).
I do agree about the patterns though. The key doesn't involve finding some "rare" pattern (they are all equally likely so nothing is rare), but studying how the distribution unfolds (as Ego eloquently describes it).
Gah I made a mistake today playing Pattern 4 on 0.10 single units
I lost a level 3 sequence 12, 14, 48 and instead of walking away I got too impatient and bet 100 units on the next spin...and it lost surprise surprise... :'(
I feel a complete idiot for rushing to get back my losses. I'll know for next time and be more patient. :-[
AND...I didn't let it spin out another 9 spins before betting...that is what is galling. Stupidity :/
Need to recover my BR again.....I'll learn the hard way
Quote from: Robeenhuut on Mar 13, 10:37 AM 2012
You are absolutely right. Choosing a sophisticated pattern to bet against like variety of matrixes or waiting some extra number of spins gives you a false illusion of having a better chance of beating random. It really does not matter if you wait certain number of spins to place a bet. It might only slow a inevitability of encountering some losses. There is nothing magical in these patterns. If you bet against repeat of certain pattern of ECs for example your chance of winning a bet are always 50% no matter how deep you are in your progression. Of course I'm not talking about extremes like betting on R if you saw B hit like 20 times and you know that world record is 25 or 26.
You can be successful for long period of time playing for example Pattern 4 but sooner or later loses are going to catch up with you. You are expected to lose once in 8 times and believe me that after few hundred games your strike rate are going to be in that range. Some people report 12 to 1 strike rate but in the long run is impossible to sustain it.
The sooner you realize that the better for your wallet.
This is not true. In betting against the ninth number last drawn as oppossed to the sixth or seventh number last drawn you are reducing the percentage risk of a repeat. There is a lot of importance in selecting which past result(s) you choose to bet against if you are intending to play 'in the long term', even if only playing even chances.
Quote from: woods101 on Mar 17, 04:07 AM 2012
This is not true. In betting against the ninth number last drawn as oppossed to the sixth or seventh number last drawn you are reducing the percentage risk of a repeat. There is a lot of importance in selecting which past result(s) you choose to bet against if you are intending to play 'in the long term', even if only playing even chances.
So you have a better chance if you bet against EC which hit 9 spins before than 6 or 7 spins?
Regards
You have less chance of it being a repeat....
link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=933.0 (link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=933.0)
Quote from: woods101 on Mar 17, 04:58 AM 2012
You have less chance of it being a repeat....
link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=933.0 (link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=933.0)
Hello Woods
It applies to numbers and not Ec's. Its Roulette 101
Regards
Hi Rob,
If you accept that the argument is relevant to individual numbers then by default it is naturally relevant to ECs also. Obviously it will be a fractional difference when applied to ECs but there will be a difference none the less. There are some methods based on ECs combined with streets/lines/dozens that are based on law of the third that take this all into account floating around somewhere on the net (turbogenius maybe??).
The main point I was making is that playing against certain past results or more importantly waiting to play against certain past results does have a certain mathematical validity depending on what those events were and when they happened in relation to your next bet. Therefore, to say that there is no point in whether you bet against the last number drawn or you wait to bet against the ninth number drawn is not actually correct.
There is a difference, whatever bet(s) you choose to play.
I know this point could be viewed as pedantic. Apologies for this but I do feel it's a relevant point to make in relation to roulette generally.
I'm not sure what you mean about roulette101- what does this mean?
Thanks
Woods
...and to quote Moles as well:
"Why does waiting 9 spins then betting that the first 3 spins don't appear in that order for spins 10-12 increase your chance of winning .The odds are still 50/50 (link:://rouletteforum.cc/Smileys/default/undecided.gif)
Any random choice gives you the same chance."
Again, in relation to this system, this is also wrong.
Woods
Quote from: woods101 on Mar 17, 09:30 AM 2012
...and to quote Moles as well:
"Why does waiting 9 spins then betting that the first 3 spins don't appear in that order for spins 10-12 increase your chance of winning .The odds are still 50/50 (link:://rouletteforum.cc/Smileys/default/undecided.gif)
Any random choice gives you the same chance."
Again, in relation to this system, this is also wrong.
Woods
Hello Woods
Roulette 101 means just a name of a course. 101 its just the name of introductory course at the university. Im just tired of arguing about principles. Everybody knows that previous spins dont affect the following spins in roulette. The chance is always 50%.
But iit is only an academic discussion - you can come up with a perfect roulette system not having clue about basic things. Im not here to prove that im right. We are here to come up together with some new ideas or to improve on old ones.
Regards
"Why does waiting 9 spins then betting that the first 3 spins don't appear in that order for spins 10-12 increase your chance of winning .The odds are still 50/50."
The odds are 12.5%, ignoring the zeros. But the odds for that exact order of sequence are far less during that exact window of chance. If you add conditional probability of a continuing state of a characteristic then you increase the chance of avoiding the killer sequence even more.
If you plan on beating Roulette you must first understand it.
Thank you for this is a most interesting statement.
I have considerable evidence, given my viewpoint bias, that prior spins indeed do influence subsequent outcomes. I refer to it as thread, or string theory characteristic.
The influence can run in short cycles in my view, and can range from a few spins so several cycles of 37 spins.
That is my observation and practical advantage can be taken of this phenomenon. I find it most useful though to note the individual number outcomes and then schedule their various links/ characteristics.
More specifically, and as a small example I can group numbers into sets of nine ( allowing always for an exclusion) and then seek relationships/ triggers/ clusters among these sets.
I have developed several bets this way.
There may not necessarily be a long term edge but there may temporarily be offered a small window of opportunity ( as the writer has mentioned) from which considerable opportunity may arise.
Best XXVV
Quote from: woods101 on Mar 17, 04:58 AM 2012
You have less chance of it being a repeat....
link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=933.0 (link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=933.0)
Hello Woods
This link deals with repeaters of numbers not Ec's.
Regards
Quote from: Gizmotron on Mar 17, 12:44 PM 2012
"Why does waiting 9 spins then betting that the first 3 spins don't appear in that order for spins 10-12 increase your chance of winning .The odds are still 50/50."
The odds are 12.5%, ignoring the zeros. But the odds for that exact order of sequence are far less during that exact window of chance. If you add conditional probability of a continuing state of a characteristic then you increase the chance of avoiding the killer sequence even more.
If you plan on beating Roulette you must first understand it.
Hello Gizmotron
If you get RBR then your probability of getting a win betting immediately or waiting 9 spins like in Pattern 4 are the same. Now we are talking about chances of getting a win. Its a different story
So you bet against RRRRBRRRBR for example (you have 8 R's and 2 B's) and the betting history shows you 65 R's and 35 B's then based on deviation factor your chances of getting few more B's
in the next spins and getting a win increase. You just expect the ratio of ECs to reverse slightly towards 50 and 50 territory.
There are few systems based on deviation factor but typically you would need much bigger sample to capitalize on fluctuation in distribution.
That's my take on always popular question of if previous spins affect current spins.
Regards
Robeenhuut - " If you get RBR then your probability of getting a win betting immediately or waiting 9 spins like in Pattern 4 are the same."
The math is very simple. You lose one out of eight tries. But you must use statistics for how often you lose on the first try of the grand martingale. What are the odds for times lost after after waiting 20 spins? Randomness characteristics change completely after 29 spins. If you factor in change you gain two options. You can bet for it to fail the original premise.
Quote from: Gizmotron on Mar 20, 11:52 PM 2012
Robeenhuut - " If you get RBR then your probability of getting a win betting immediately or waiting 9 spins like in Pattern 4 are the same."
The math is very simple. You lose one out of eight tries. But you must use statistics for how often you lose on the first try of the grand martingale. What are the odds for times lost after after waiting 20 spins? Randomness characteristics change completely after 29 spins. If you factor in change you gain two options. You can bet for it to fail the original premise.
I don quite understand what you mean. We can argue here for a very long time but its not the point. What is relevant is that in all systems like Pattern 4 or Breaker or all Matrix systems unless you incorporate somehow deviation factor as i explained in previous post the number of spins you wait to start betting wont affect your chances of winning. You can take advantage if you observe some patterns but Pattern 4 is not better then Pattern 0 if you just play it blindly.
Regards
Look at it this way. You should lose the grand martingale every eight tries on average. Only in large number does that average out. That statistic must perform to the normal characteristics of randomness. There must be swarms of losses and periods of sleepers, where you don't lose for long stretches. I just don't see it ever being 50/50.
Quote from: Gizmotron on Mar 21, 11:55 AM 2012
Look at it this way. You should lose the grand martingale every eight tries on average. Only in large number does that average out. That statistic must perform to the normal characteristics of randomness. There must be swarms of losses and periods of sleepers, where you don't lose for long stretches. I just don't see it ever being 50/50.
Hello
At least we agree that you lose 1 time in 8 games on average. I still just dont see the logic in waiting
9 spins to start betting. How about if we wait 6 spins only?. Unless i see an evidence that proves that waiting extra number of spins increases your chances im not convinced.
Regards
Quote from: Robeenhuut on Mar 21, 12:46 PM 2012
I still just don't see the logic in waiting 9 spins to start betting.
I'm not advocating this system. I'm just saying that targeting the characteristics of randomness improves this system.
Quote from: Robeenhuut on Mar 20, 10:02 PM 2012
Hello Woods
This link deals with repeaters of numbers not ECs.
Regards
@ Rob- I'm not advocating this system any more than any other also, but i am confused. Are you saying that the law of the third is only applicable to single number bets and not ECs or any other type of bet?
Woods
Is it worth playing pattern breaker 4 AND pattern breaker at the same time?
I see they , along with another one, are in the Patterns tracker RC1 software
I keep hearing EC, what is that ? i know ---now!
Quote from: subby on Apr 05, 03:05 PM 2012
Is it worth playing pattern breaker 4 AND pattern breaker at the same time?
I see they , along with another one, are in the Patterns tracker RC1 software
Yes you can Subby especially for one a day. You will often get winning streaks that stretch way beyond 7/1 I currently have a streak of 53 for the first game of the day for PATTERN BREAKER.
Can we use 9 spins from the board? Or do we have to wait for 9 spins?
Does this make any difference?
Quote from: ego on Mar 13, 02:33 PM 2012
1. Follow the wheel or follow how the distribution unfold.
2. Bet against the wheel or the how the distribution unfold.
Is it the same thing or is one option better then the other?
That is the question.
I would never use point 2 and allways follow as point 1.
Now some one clever say they start and end with same probability and are based upon the same math - well then some one should get deeper into study randomness.
This guy, (with all due respect) also mentioned the following several times, and i learned a lot from him and i share many opinions about roulette...
Lets say we clustering patterns of three RBB wish can come in 8 combinations.
Now if we play the same as the previous 3 then we have 1 in 8 to fail - pretty simple math and odds.
Now if we play the opposite as the previous 3 then we have 1 in 8 to fail - pretty simple math and odds.
Due to the small size equilibrium will create some heavy fluctuation and string of losses.
Then we can delay equilibrium and fluctuation.
Once in 1 million do we get 1 pattern out of 8 repeating 8 times in a row.
Now if we see the previous three as i mention above and the first colour of our previous three is the same as our first future outcome we play opposite.
Now if we see the previous three as i mention above and the first colour of our previous three is the opposite as our first future outcome we play same.
Then we have 2 in 8 wish appears to repeat once in 500.000 and we only have to place two single bets.
I don't be live any other patterns become much better then that - no matter if you play with or against or trending.
That would at least delay long strings wish would make staking in different levels make you take andvantage out of periodic distribution.
... To make things real and not just empty talk i decided to post a test of 100.000 placed bets on the above, so people get a clear idea of what they are up against with this. I used TRNG from Random.org, from the 1st of june until today. in batches of variable size. So the thing is the personal permanence and not the Hit & Run, skipping tables, etc...
This is Flat Bet.
there you go. For anyone interested i post pdf bet by bet.
cheers
[attachimg=1]
Just to give some sweet >:D
So if one makes this as a lifetime hobby, and plays this every time he goes to casino, he would take 3 and something years to accomplish this. 300k spins. :wink: (1000 days, 300 spins a day)
Anyway, If one attacks after LL and let it ride once,
this would be the graphic, with only 24926 placed bets and 376 units won. Z-scor(ish) 2,3 or so.
[attach=1]
soo you are saying the graph goes up and down but overall will be up? :question:
Quote from: unre4lbg on Jul 08, 05:26 AM 2012
soo you are saying the graph goes up and down but overall will be up? :question:
I am saying that this is what i consider to be what may be expected playing it this way. Many things have been written about Pattern 4, but little have been backed up with an open test.
There you go.
Cheers
I will continue to elaborate on this on another thread. You can erase this from here, please. O0
link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=9809.0 (link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=9809.0)
Is the ORIGINAL system still working? on betvoyager casino or playtech casino?
can you explain the betting outcome with this sample of spins?
Thank you
3
5
23
6
32
1
5
15
33
22
22
9
8
8
12
9
11
7
20
31
27
12
Anybody use this method in a real life casino? I think would do ok over short periods.
What kind of progressions would you use? d'alembert or maybe some sort of modified oscars grind?
MM
Quote from: MuppetMan on Aug 19, 08:22 PM 2012
Anybody use this method in a real life casino? I think would do ok over short periods.
What kind of progressions would you use? d'alembert or maybe some sort of modified oscars grind?
MM
Hi MuppetMan - I am from the USA and so I can only play live at a casiono. I will post my results for you to see in the next day or so. All the results are solid. Good luck!
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 14, 03:48 PM 2011
*PATTERN 4*
Here are the rules for this new idea of mine. Could this simple method be a Holy Grail?
I don't know, it has true random beaten I know that. And Twister is killing BV RNG with it. So lets see what the future brings us.
THE RULES...
1, Record spins in rows of three for one or more of the EVEN CHANCES until you have 9 spins. There must be NO ZERO in these nine. Example...
HLH-PATTERN 1
LLL
HLL--NINE SPINS NO ZERO.
2, You now bet against the FIRST PATTERN forming as the FOURTH PATTERN (SPINS 10-12)
3, Using the grand martingale over a three step progression as follows 1,3,7
4, You play for ONE WIN from one to three steps, then STOP. don't play continuosly, allow at least 20 spins to pass before commencing a NEW GAME.
5, My records show a phenomenal strikerate for this simple even chance system. *PATTERN 4* shows a lot of potential for both LIVE AND RNG play. Although I've proofed it on HIGH and LOW. It seems to be even more powerful combined with RED and BLACK , ODD and EVEN. I will champion LIVE PLAY results for now.
And TWISTER WILL ATTEMPT TO DO THE IMPOSSIBLE. Take several thousand units off an RNG at BV.
Welcome to *PATTERN 4*
By Jove!!
Hard-and-fast rules. No human factor. I might just walk this puppy around the block!
Sam
Welcome to the forum MuppetMan,
When I started researching roulette PATTERN 4 was I think one if not the first method I gave serious contemplation. It lead to CODE 4. My feeling is that JohnLegend has paved the way to many effective methods if played correctly..... Chauncy47 could confirm this.
Hello Chauncy47,
It would be great if we could hear about your success over the last several months. Could you give us a somewhat long summary :)
Quote from: amk on Aug 22, 04:57 PM 2012
Welcome to the forum MuppetMan,
When I started researching roulette PATTERN 4 was I think one if not the first method I gave serious contemplation. It lead to CODE 4. My feeling is that JohnLegend has paved the way to many effective methods if played correctly..... Chauncy47 could confirm this.
Hello Chauncy47,
It would be great if we could hear about your success over the last several months. Could you give us a somewhat long summary :)
Hi AMK ... Absolutely (I will try and do that over the next day or so). JL has recommended that I send you some of the tweaks I have made to his/yours methods and get your feedback. I will do that in PM. Good to finally connect with you.
Tweaks? Why tweaks? Won't it work just as John wrote it?
" if played correctly."......wiggle words.
"Well, if you can't make money with it, you're just not playing it correctly." Heard that fifteen years ago from horse race geniuses.
Will it work as outline in post one or not?
(Don't throw things!)
Sam
Perhaps we could call these tweaks advancements 2Cat.......
PATTERN 4 as explained by JL can be very effective. It is already good as is but could always be made more effective. Although I believe JL does not play it any longer.
AMK
I think I'll try it in conjunction to the other stuff. Won't take any longer to wait for the matrix to form.
Sam
Quote from: unre4lbg on Jul 08, 05:26 AM 2012
soo you are saying the graph goes up and down but overall will be up? :question:
That is not good enough!
OK, I tried it for a few spins. It worked. Peaked my interest enough to try it more.
As I see it, you win either one, two or three units per try OR you lose eleven. So you'd have to win eleven coups to make up for one loss.
That doesn't sound do-able, but I'll try it.
Sam
Quote from: amk on Aug 22, 06:12 PM 2012
Perhaps we could call these tweaks advancements 2Cat.......
PATTERN 4 as explained by JL can be very effective. It is already good as is but could always be made more effective. Although I believe JL does not play it any longer.
AMK ... will PM you the tweaks that I have made and as you said, maybe we can make it even better ... I will get that off to yout today and look forward to your feedback.
Quote from: amk on Aug 22, 06:12 PM 2012
Perhaps we could call these tweaks advancements 2Cat.......
PATTERN 4 as explained by JL can be very effective. It is already good as is but could always be made more effective. Although I believe JL does not play it any longer.
Do you mean he got drawdown with this method...... is anybody still using this method..... john if you are reading this plz reply are you still using this method .... its awsome random vs random.... :twisted:
Quote from: ashwinsinha on Oct 13, 04:12 AM 2012
Do you mean he got drawdown with this method...... is anybody still using this method..... john if you are reading this plz reply are you still using this method .... its awsome random vs random.... :twisted:
Yes Ash I used it from time to time. Its not as solid as PATTERN BREAKER. But for picking up pockets of profit its effective.
hi there,
would like to say :thumbsup: to JL TWISTER ,ZIG!!
i have tried this online and was up 40 units :) but then lost it :(
playing no zero on betfair using the tracker. i know i am playing for to long.
if i log out after a win and then back in the game still remembers the numbers from the last game. takeing the edge off random??
could u suggest where 2 play??
thanks for your great work!!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
I might chip in here. Only play real wheel spins, not RNG if you are playing RNG.
5 units a day is plenty until you have grown your bankroll
where are you from?
Quote from: dtr2012 on Nov 03, 05:39 PM 2012
hi there,
would like to say :thumbsup: to JL TWISTER ,ZIG!!
i have tried this online and was up 40 units :) but then lost it :(
playing no zero on betfair using the tracker. i know i am playing for to long.
if i log out after a win and then back in the game still remembers the numbers from the last game. takeing the edge off random??
could u suggest where 2 play??
thanks for your great work!!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
FOR THE 100th time RNG is not roulette its it is completely SLOTS and there is one reason why you can never ever find a live wheel without zero because it would put them in LOSS because they cannot control the live wheel....... they can only program RNG to give only certain % of payouts per day so if you are lucky the system will favour you and go against other or vice versa
i have played pattern 4 like this
i record 4 current spins that come without any zero
FOR EX:
LHHL
now i wait for 2 virtual losses if the next 2 spins was like this
HH i dont bet since i didnt get 2 virtual loss
now lets say my next 2 spins was LH since there are 2 virtual losses since it followed the 2 pattern
now i will bet hit n run style 8 units if lost the 16 units then i quit for the day since my winning target is 8 units per day or stop loss 24 units....... since i played hit n run i never lost any game....... but now i have been diverted towards flat's latest 2 uncles correcting system trying to understand it still not understanding :-\
another looser ...
[reveal]
system "pattern four"
{
}
method "main"
begin
While Starting a New Session
begin
//Add initialize logic here
//when a new session is started
put 1 record "progl" data
end
While on Each Spin
begin
add 1 record "count" data
add 1 record "count2" data
track last low-high for 1 spin record "lastl" layout
copy record "lastl" layout record "pattl" layout
add 1 record "pattl" layout index
if any low-high bet lost each begin
multiply 2 record "progl" data
add 1 record "progl" data
//if record "progl" data > 200 begin put 50 record "progl" data end
end
if record "p" data = 3 begin
put 1 record "progl" data
clear record "p" data
clear record "d" data
clear record "counterl" data
clear record "countl1" data
clear record "countl2" data
clear record "countl3" data
clear record "countl4" data
clear record "countl5" data
clear record "countl6" data
clear record "countl7" data
clear record "countl8" data
end
if any low-high bet won each begin
put 1 record "progl" data
clear record "p" data
clear record "d" data
clear record "counterl" data
clear record "countl1" data
clear record "countl2" data
clear record "countl3" data
clear record "countl4" data
clear record "countl5" data
clear record "countl6" data
clear record "countl7" data
clear record "countl8" data
end
if List [low, low, high] has a pattern match to Record "pattl" layout
begin
if record "countl1" data = 0 begin
add 1 record "countl1" data add 1 record "counterl" data end
if record "count2" data <4 begin
put 1 record "d" data end
end
If List [low, high, high] has a pattern match to Record "pattl" layout
begin
if record "countl2" data = 0 begin
add 1 record "countl2" data add 1 record "counterl" data end
if record "count2" data <4 begin
put 2 record "d" data end
end
If List [high, low, low] has a pattern match to Record "pattl" layout
begin
if record "countl3" data = 0 begin
add 1 record "countl3" data add 1 record "counterl" data end
if record "count2" data <4 begin
put 3 record "d" data end
end
If List [high, high,low] has a pattern match to Record "pattl" layout
begin
if record "countl4" data = 0 begin
add 1 record "countl4" data add 1 record "counterl" data end
if record "count2" data <4 begin
put 4 record "d" data end
end
if List [low, low, low] has a pattern match to Record "pattl" layout
begin
if record "countl5" data = 0 begin
add 1 record "countl5" data add 1 record "counterl" data end
if record "count2" data <4 begin
put 5 record "d" data end
end
If List [high, high, high] has a pattern match to Record "pattl" layout
begin
if record "countl6" data = 0 begin
add 1 record "countl6" data add 1 record "counterl" data end
if record "count2" data <4 begin
put 6 record "d" data end
end
If List [high, low, high] has a pattern match to Record "pattl" layout
begin
if record "countl7" data = 0 begin
add 1 record "countl7" data add 1 record "counterl" data end
if record "count2" data <4 begin
put 7 record "d" data end
end
If List [low, high,low] has a pattern match to Record "pattl" layout
begin
if record "countl8" data = 0 begin
add 1 record "countl8" data add 1 record "counterl" data end
if record "count2" data <4 begin
put 8 record "d" data end
end
if record "count" data = 3 begin clear record "pattl" layout clear record "count" data end
if record "count2" data <10 begin
if record "counterl" data =3 begin
add 1 record "p" data
if record "countl1" data =1 and record "d" data = 1 begin
if record "p" data = 1 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
if record "p" data = 2 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
if record "p" data = 3 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
end
if record "countl2" data =1 and record "d" data = 2 begin
if record "p" data = 1 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
if record "p" data = 2 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
if record "p" data = 3 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
end
if record "countl3" data =1 and record "d" data = 3 begin
if record "p" data = 1 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
if record "p" data = 2 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
if record "p" data = 3 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
end
if record "countl4" data =1 and record "d" data = 4 begin
if record "p" data = 1 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
if record "p" data = 2 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
if record "p" data = 3 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
end
if record "countl5" data =1 and record "d" data = 5 begin
if record "p" data = 1 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
if record "p" data = 2 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
if record "p" data = 3 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
end
if record "countl6" data =1 and record "d" data = 6 begin
if record "p" data = 1 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
if record "p" data = 2 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
if record "p" data = 3 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
end
if record "countl7" data =1 and record "d" data = 7 begin
if record "p" data = 1 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
if record "p" data = 2 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
if record "p" data = 3 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
end
if record "countl8" data =1 and record "d" data = 8 begin
if record "p" data = 1 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
if record "p" data = 2 begin put 100% record "progl" data low end
if record "p" data = 3 begin put 100% record "progl" data high end
end
end
end
if record "count2" data >=10 begin put 0 record "count2" data
//put 50 record "progl" data
clear record "p" data
clear record "d" data
clear record "counterl" data
clear record "countl1" data
clear record "countl2" data
clear record "countl3" data
clear record "countl4" data
clear record "countl5" data
clear record "countl6" data
clear record "countl7" data
clear record "countl8" data
end
end
end
[/reveal]
Quote from: boatran8 on Mar 20, 07:03 PM 2013
another looser ...
LoL....this made me smile.
Botran, you are Johnlegends worst nightmare...a competant system programmer!
Those who know him will know exactly what I mean.
Nice work boatran8, but when are you going to give us a winner?
Quote from: Johnlegend on Oct 13, 05:20 AM 2012
Yes Ash I used it from time to time. Its not as solid as PATTERN BREAKER. But for picking up pockets of profit its effective.
Reading through this thread,you said it was unbeatable,and you were going to hit the casinos hard with it.Did any of that ever happen