I am starting this thread to save confusion with the other one which is for DOZENS AND COLUMNS. This thread is dedicated to playing HIGH AND LOW. In a FOUR WIDE MATRIX.
THE RULES
1, Record spins four wide for hi and lo until there is a VERTICAL TREBLE of one of them example.
HLHL
LHLH
HLLL
LLLH-TRIGGER LOW COLUMN 3
HHHL-BET 1 won as didn't become a QUAD
LHLL
LLLL
HLLH-TRIGGER LOW COLUMN 3
LLLH-BET 1 LOST
LHHH-BET 2 WON as didn't become a 5 pointer.
2, We now bet that the trip wont become a FIVE POINTER. Using a multi level TWO STEP PROGRESSION. 1,2 LEVEL 1--4,8 LEVEL 2 Total risk 15 points. Play for *FIVE WINS MAX* a session.
3, If a double 5 pointer occurs you remain at level 2 for 3 games. The idea is TRIPS AND QUADS outnumber FIVE POINTERS enough to make this a go.
4, Under no circumstances play RNGS, Twisters sudden change in fortune in 24hrs deems them totally untrustworthy. This method is totally playable on LIVE WHEELS.
5, Most of the time your sessions will be a breeze. Especially if you enter the cycle at the right time and play for 3-5 wins MAX. WHY? I have already seen the pattern you get usually a maximum of FIVE TRIPS AND QUADS, before a FIVE POINTER occurs. Read what's going on.
And RESPOND TO IT. No skill in playing ROULETTE? of course there is, the skill is in reading what's gone before and reacting to it. If for example I trace the history bar and have FOUR TRIPS AND QUADS already sitting there. A FIVE POINTERS COMING SOON. This is the judgement that separates the real winners from the nearly men. That said this is my main method as of now. I will start posting my results in sets of 50 to show you how I get on.
Awesome JL :twisted:
Ive been playin this most of the Day at PaddyPower :xd:
Maybe you could state your rule for Zero, so everyone knows what to do in that respect :thumbsup:
Ive been playing most of the day and am up +56 Units ;D
Im using a 2 5 11 23 47 Unit progression :twisted: :lol:
Nice one John :)
I am testing :)
Cheers
Jon
Brilliant John.
I can comfirm that its right about the 5 pointers not appearing as much as you think even on a HL matrix. I was playing just against 5 pointers on the HL over the last few days and its can take quite a while to get a trigger, so this is much more playable :thumbsup:
Intersting stakeplan you got. I like the use of 2 different levels.
Now if you lost on level 1 do you start a new session at level 2 or continue on the same session.
I have other 2 level staking ideas also which may string it out more, but for now i will test at your recommended progression. ;)
This is brilliant guys, very playable and fast profitable...now we just need a good (safe) progression to go with it
vundarosa
Just played another 2 sessions. 1 session live dealer and the other on slingshot
4 wins each @ + 8 :thumbsup:
Maybe we can have a quad as a trigger (virtual)
I had situation like this tonight
LLHH
HHLH
HHLL
HHHL Now 2 trips together on same line. So i waited to see if one of them would lose
HLHL and saved me from an wasted bet. Like you said sometimes you gotta see whats
happening
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 17, 08:38 PM 2011
Just played another 2 sessions. 1 session live dealer and the other on slingshot
4 wins each @ + 8 :thumbsup:
Maybe we can have a quad as a trigger (virtual)
I had situation like this tonight
LLHH
HHLH
HHLL
HHHL Now 2 trips together on same line. So I waited to see if one of them would lose
HLHL and saved me from an wasted bet. Like you said sometimes you gotta see what's
happening
Exactly Zig, although remember we are betting against FIVE POINTERS, so a quad isnt a loss. Staking will always be a personal choice. How I see it is, 15 units isnt a lot to recover and as your bank grows you double, treble, quadrupple and so forth.
So you can go from 15 to 30 to 45 to 60 for 1--4 points a win eventually.So level 1 covers you against the first FIVE POINTER. And level 2 against the second. I've only lost my 15 points once in 65 games.
And its simply looking like open season on roulette at a very functional pace now.
Maybe we can bet against 4 5pointers in a row ?
Quote from: Post on Apr 18, 05:39 AM 2011
Maybe we can bet against 4 5pointers in a row ?
4 x 5 pointers in a row works great also. John suprised me playing this way, but i have to say its working great with plenty of action for live wheels :smile:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 06:06 AM 2011
4 x 5 pointers in a row works great also. John suprised me playing this way, but I have to say its working great with plenty of action for live wheels :smile:
ZigZag
Can you explain how we play this with the staking?
Cheers
Jon
Hi John
I'm Currently doing a 4 step 1-2-4-8
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 06:34 AM 2011
Hi John
I'm Currently doing a 4 step 1-2-4-8
So we do it just like the MV5?
Bet against 5 pointers?
Thanks
Jon
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 06:34 AM 2011
Hi John
I'm Currently doing a 4 step 1-2-4-8
Thats fine Zig, the reason ive focused on playing hi and lo for trips to five pointers is it makes land casino play a reality, online live play a dream. And it comes down to one thing guys. THAT FOUR WIDE MATRIX. Its really holding random in, to our benefit. Its just the perfect MATRIX. ;D
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 06:44 AM 2011
That's fine Zig, the reason I've focused on playing hi and lo for trips to five pointers is it makes land casino play a reality, online live play a dream. And it comes down to one thing guys. THAT FOUR WIDE MATRIX. Its really holding random in, to our benefit. Its just the perfect MATRIX. ;D
John still working like a charm on live wheel
Did 2 more sessions this morning. I now stop after 3 wins per sesssion.
+ 6 Highiest step was 4 units
Jon86 Only thing that can kill you is two 5 pointers in a row or zero on last step
2, We now bet that the trip wont become a FIVE POINTER. Using a multi level TWO STEP PROGRESSION. 1,2 LEVEL 1--4,8 LEVEL 2 Total risk 15 points. Play for *FIVE WINS MAX* a session.
Its this part of the staking that i dont understand?
Do we bet triple not to become a 4 quad and if lose we vet on the same line next that it doesnt become a 5 pointer. Is this right?
Its not the same as MV5 orginal.
Jon
Let me try :)
The way i see it. Its just a 1 2 4 8 marty.
Yes you bet the trip not to become a quad. if you lose, than you bet the quad you lost on against forming a 5 pointer
2 x 5 pointers in a row you lose a 4 step
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 07:09 AM 2011
John still working like a charm on live wheel
Did 2 more sessions this morning. I now stop after 3 wins per sesssion.
+ 6 Highiest step was 4 units
Jon86 Only thing that can kill you is two 5 pointers in a row or zero on last step
So we first bet when we have a triple not to become a 4 quad and if lose we bet it not to become a 5 pointer right?
And if lose we do the same one more time next triple we get.
Am i right?
Jon
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 07:17 AM 2011
The way I see it. Its just a 1 2 4 8 marty.
Yes you bet the trip not to become a quad. if you lose, than you bet the quad you lost on against forming a 5 pointer
2 x 5 pointers in a row you lose a 4 step
Thanks i understand now :)
Jon
Jon
Regarding playing on slingshot. Im undecided about waiting for quad to form and use as trigger as quads seem to form very quickly on the slingshot, but at the moment i'm winning without.
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 07:09 AM 2011
John still working like a charm on live wheel
Did 2 more sessions this morning. I now stop after 3 wins per sesssion.
+ 6 Highiest step was 4 units
Jon86 Only thing that can kill you is two 5 pointers in a row or zero on last step
Three wins per session is PERFECTION Zig, ive never seen random leave such a readable pattern trail, its remarkable three to five TRIPS AND QUADS followed by one or two FIVE POINTERS. Dozens and Columns are too broken disparate to read it like this.
HIGH LOW MV5 =Casinos less Profit margin ;D ;D
Another 2 sessions won for me :smile:
Yes lots of trips and quads follow after the 5 pointers
So that you can be more sure to enter the game at best time.....
Maybe we can wait to see our first 5 pointer then start the betting for 3 to 5 wins :smile:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 08:24 AM 2011
Another 2 sessions won for me :smile:
Yes lots of trips and quads follow after the 5 pointers
So that you can be more sure to enter the game at best time.....
Maybe we can wait to see our first 5 pointer then start the betting for 3 to 5 wins :smile:
That's an option Zig, the turnover makes waiting far less of a chore, and as the saying goes prevention is better than cure. I'm now 87/1 full report later when I hit 100. All I'm playing until GOOD FRIDAY is this. 8) 8)
Why we dont play H and L just like the orginale MV5 and bet against 5 pointers?
Cheers
Jon :)
JL
I just had a session where I didn't bet, I will explain why !
You said about reading Random, so I tried.
I logged onto PP and I used the history bar (i always do) and wait a few spins and it was littered with 3 winning trips and 2 winning Quads
I knew straight away I had joined the game at the "wrong time"
I watched and yep sure enough along came three 5 Pointers !!
I joke not as I see it with my own peepers :twisted: :LoL:
There is a lesson there for sure :wink:
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 18, 09:34 AM 2011
Why we don't play H and L just like the orginale MV5 and bet against 5 pointers?
Cheers
Jon :)
You could Jon but there is a definate pattern that shows fields of TRIPS and QUADS in between FIVE POINTERS, we can slip in steal our profit and be gone my friend. And then simply observe those five pointers THEN GO AGAIN. Thats what ive been doing all day. Now 92/1. ;D ;D
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 09:55 AM 2011
You could Jon but there is a definate pattern that shows fields of TRIPS and QUADS in between FIVE POINTERS, we can slip in steal our profit and be gone my friend. And then simply observe those five pointers THEN GO AGAIN. that's what I've been doing all day. Now 92/1. ;D ;D
I see ;D
Jon
Slingshot eating quads for breakfast :o
Doing well on live dealer wheel, takes much longer to form quads/5pointers
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 18, 09:49 AM 2011
JL
I just had a session where I didn't bet, I will explain why !
You said about reading Random, so I tried.
I logged onto PP and I used the history bar (i always do) and wait a few spins and it was littered with 3 winning trips and 2 winning Quads
I knew straight away I had joined the game at the "wrong time"
I watched and yep sure enough along came three 5 Pointers !!
I joke not as I see it with my own peepers :twisted: :LoL:
There is a lesson there for sure :wink:
Yes Twister the fields can vary in depth the most I've counted so far between FIVE POINTERS is 9 trips and quads. But the average is about FIVE. what's surprised me the most is the lack of FIVE POINTERS, they usually come in pairs and can be anything from 5-11 deep so far. I'm sure This FOUR WIDE MATRIX is having a dramatic impact on randoms behaviour.
I've never felt more sure about what to expect.. >:( >:( ;D >:(
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 10:40 AM 2011
Yes Twister the fields can vary in depth the most I've counted so far between FIVE POINTERS is 9 trips and quads. But the average is about FIVE. what's surprised me the most is the lack of FIVE POINTERS, they usually come in pairs and can be anything from 5-11 deep so far. I'm sure This FOUR WIDE MATRIX is having a dramatic impact on randoms behaviour.
I've never felt more sure about what to expect.. >:( >:( ;D >:(
JL
I edit my post after you had already quoted me
I meant three 5 pointers came along after all those winning trips and quads !!!
Yep ive seen them 11 deep too :wink:
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 18, 10:42 AM 2011
JL
I edit my post after you had already quoted me
I meant three 5 pointers came along after all those winning trips and quads !!!
Yep I've seen them 11 deep too :wink:
Right, never has a history bar been more USEFUL LoL!! You see the naysayers have always had the view Roulette is a game of no SKILL. I have never subscribed to that point of view. The skill is learning to read randoms behaviour as best we can. And the FOUR WIDE MATRIX makes it more readable than ever.
More than a few members on a forum should get hold of this. THIS IS VERY POWERFUL.
john what happened to matrix 10 on the h L.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 11:00 AM 2011
Right, never has a history bar been more USEFUL LoL!! You see the naysayers have always had the view Roulette is a game of no SKILL. I have never subscribed to that point of view. The skill is learning to read randoms behaviour as best we can. And the FOUR WIDE MATRIX makes it more readable than ever.
More than a few members on a forum should get hold of this. THIS IS VERY POWERFUL.
Can we more accurately determine when to get in the game and when to quit? Should we wait for a trigger?
this high low all started because I was testing it a couple of days ago betting against 5 pointers i was up 32 continious play just play non stop ;D glad it turned out in his own thread thought it would do so though ;)
Quote from: Post on Apr 18, 12:56 PM 2011
This high low all started because I was testing it a couple of days ago betting against 5 pointers I was up 32 continious play just play non stop ;D glad it turned out in his own thread thought it would do so though ;)
Post.
Didnt you say that you was up 32 units and suddently it bust ?
Cheers
Jon
yes then it did bust but that was continious play ;)
Here's an idea for MV5 Hi/Lo. Why not a sliding window.
Start at triples up to 5 pointers, if all three miss, start again at quads and got to six pointers, if all three miss again, start at 5 pointers, go to 8 pointers.
Quote from: Post on Apr 18, 01:04 PM 2011
Yes then it did bust but that was continious play ;)
I forgot ;D
Jon
Maybe a good idea to play trips against becoming 5 pointers if lost 1-2
play against quads becoming six pointers 4-8 if lost -15
somthing like proofreader said ;)
Quote from: Proofreaders2000 on Apr 18, 01:07 PM 2011
Here's an idea for MV5 Hi/Lo. Why not a sliding window.
Start at triples up to 5 pointers, if all three miss, start again at quads and got to six pointers, if all three miss again, start at 5 pointers, go to 8 pointers.
Fellas I'm surprised none of you have stated the obvious and ULTIMATE way to benefit from what random is showing us here. Atlantis was the first person to speak of AC/DC play within the MATRIX VERTICAL concept.
Well it just became a go for me with HIGH AND LOW. When we have gathered our 3-5 wins. what's NEXT. *WE GO AC/DC* And bet FOR A FIVE POINTER. The relatively small outlay allows us to do this. THE BUDGET WAS TIGHT with dozens. Not so here. I've already nailed two five pointers today.
Report 1 for MATRIX VERTICAL 5 E/C
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 100
TOTAL GAMES WON 99
TOTAL GAMES LOST 1
BALANCE=340 UNITS PLUS
STRIKERATE 99/1
STEP 1, LEVEL 1 WINS 48
STEP 2, LEVEL 1 WINS 37
STEP 1, LEVEL 2 WINS 9
STEP 2, LEVEL 2 WINS 5--LOSSES 1
INTERESTING DATA
LONGEST WINNING STREAK OF TRIPS AND QUADS 11
LONGEST LOSING STREAK OF FIVE POINTERS 3
Longest vertical column 11 LOWS
Average gap between FIVE POINTERS 5
Longest wait for a Trip or longer 22 spins.
so you didnt even saw 4 5 pointers in a row ! and how mutch quads ?
Quote from: Post on Apr 18, 02:14 PM 2011
So you didn't even saw 4 5 pointers in a row ! and how mutch quads ?
Not in this sample Post 3 Five pointers is the longest Ive recorded. Quads are wins Post we are betting on TRIPS AND QUADS to not become FIVE POINTERS.
Quads tend to be sporadic separated by TRIPS in my 100 game sample. There is seldom more than two or three in a row.
i know we bet against triples to become 5 pointers ;) 1-2
but to add to the mix after 1 loss we can bet quads from becoming 6 pointers ? 4-8
Nice one John. Excellent strike rate :thumbsup:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 02:33 PM 2011
Nice one John. Excellent strike rate :thumbsup:
If I had bet straight without thinking about what was developing in the matrix Zig I would have lost four times. This is the skill in the game. Even if you miss one five pointer the odds are strong you will win the two level progression. I did this 14 times out of 99 won games. Only loss came as a result of three consecutive FIVE POINTERS.
Quote from: Post on Apr 18, 02:31 PM 2011
I know we bet against triples to become 5 pointers ;) 1-2
but to add to the mix after 1 loss we can bet quads from becoming 6 pointers ? 4-8
That would be dangerous Post, of the 37 FIVE POINTERS in my 100 game sample 14 of them were 7 or longer. Including 9,9,9,10,11
I dont think its wise to try and outlive a single VERTICAL FORMATION. Im sure 11 wont be the longest I see as time goes by. If RANDOM was able to form a 12 for the dozens. HI LO? ??? ???
No don't try to out live a single vertical not on HL or even Doz or Cols
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 03:13 PM 2011
No don't try to out live a single vertical not on HL or even Doz or Cols
Wise words from Zig. Spread your attack around. Ive never seen anything so readable as this four wide Matrix, It has random behaving itself like a school kid in detention. DOING LINES... ;D ;D
i think you are right i will stay betting against 4 5 pointers in a row ;)
Quote from: Post on Apr 18, 03:20 PM 2011
I think you are right I will stay betting against 4 5 pointers in a row ;)
Post I want to thank you and Zig for putting the spotlight on EVEN CHANCES in the FOUR WIDE MATRIX. don't think I'm not aware of that. I didn't want to let this one slip by.
Sometimes it takes an objective observer to see the value of something. Without Twister and Atlantis for example Id never have fully realized the potential of the Matrix vertical concept. Without Scooby Doo, id never have got down to a more playable format Live. And you and Zig have both contributed to where we stand today. Make no mistake about it. This is the most playable and REAL threat to live casinos ever. Its simply a question of how wide spread this becomes over the coming years.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 03:30 PM 2011
Post I want to thank you and Zig for putting the spotlight on EVEN CHANCES in the FOUR WIDE MATRIX. don't think I'm not aware of that. I didn't want to let this one slip by.
Sometimes it takes and objective observer to see the value of something. Without Twister and Atlantis for example Id never have fully realized the potential of the Matrix vertical concept. Without Scooby Doo, id never have got down to a more playable format Live. And you and Zig have both contributed to where we stand today. Make no mistake about it. This is the most playable and REAL threat to live casinos ever. Its simply a question of how wide spread this becomes over the coming years.
Its been Funn thats for sure :wink: !
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 18, 03:32 PM 2011
Its been Funn that's for sure :wink: !
Lol yup! The profits not bad either.. ;D ;D
Its always fun when your making some penny's :wink:
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 03:40 PM 2011
Its always fun when your making some penny's :wink:
Yeah, it is and from little acorns GROW .......Keep it coming guys post up your results. This will inspire others to get onboard. Im done testing apart from one thing D & C. Im going to play this and REMEMBER VEGAS LOL! Well theres no question this would take their casinos apart. I will give it a test run in Monte Carlo this summer. :thumbsup:
For those of you interested, this method works on Craps.....Using the Pass and Don't Pass lines.
I would imagine that it works for Baccarat or any game with a 50/50 chance.
Scooby Doo
i was busy and did not have time to read but see that there is new beast born so jon please can you tell me how are we betting in matrix hi.lo and how wide matrix is..keep wins cooming
isnt baccarat to slow to play matrix on ?
Quote from: Post on Apr 18, 06:02 PM 2011
Isnt baccarat to slow to play matrix on ?
Baccarat is much faster game :)
ok nice to know havent seen it here in the local casino ;)
Quote from: Post on Apr 18, 06:06 PM 2011
Ok nice to know haven't seen it here in the local casino ;)
Not all have baccarat table :)
Jon
I play 5 session tonight and all won ;D
Good work again boys :)
Cheers
Jon
what were you playing and nice to hear you won ;)
4 6 pointers in a row thats not good lost some money .
Quote from: Post on Apr 18, 06:27 PM 2011
What were you playing and nice to hear you won ;)
Paddy Power slingshot :)
Jon
Quote from: warrior on Apr 18, 06:27 PM 2011
4 6 pointers in a row that's not good lost some money .
What do you mean Warrior?
Cheers Jon
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 18, 06:35 PM 2011
What do you mean Warrior?
Cheers Jon
jon my first trip bet for a quad not to come in well it went to 6 no problem not once but 4 times ,this is at my local casino.
I took one loss on slingshot but recoverd on the live dealer within a few spins :thumbsup:
Quote from: warrior on Apr 18, 06:41 PM 2011
jon my first trip bet for a quad not to come in well itwent to 6 no problem not once but 4 times ,this is at my local casino.
4 Times ? Thats bad.
Im back to MV5 :D
Cheers
Jon
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 06:44 PM 2011
I took one loss on slingshot but recoverd on the live dealer within a few spins :thumbsup:
I notice playing Slingshot now 2-3 days its repeat a lot.
Example 22.22.22.12.13.13.4.13.13.
Jon
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 18, 06:47 PM 2011
I notice playing Slingshot now 2-3 days its repeat a lot.
Example 22.22.22.12.13.13.4.13.13.
Jon
Yup lots of repeaters on slingshot. Maybe because it is spun from excat last number.
Maybe ???
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 18, 06:53 PM 2011
Yup lots of repeaters on slingshot. Maybe because it is spun from excat last number.
Maybe ???
Maiby :)
Jon
Quote from: jon86 on Apr 18, 06:47 PM 2011
I notice playing Slingshot now 2-3 days its repeat a lot.
Example 22.22.22.12.13.13.4.13.13.
Jon
play the last number to have hit again and you would have made a fortune.No problem at all ;D
Tested MV5 4wide betting H/L against trips becoming 5pts on Smartlive live.
116 spins. Immediately after first won progression 2 side by side 5pts.
LLLH
LLLH
HLLH
LHLH
HHLH ouch -15u
Won 3 sessions at level 2 and 5 at level 1. Again 1 loss , recovery at level 2
and 1 win.
Total +5u.
We need to follow the pattern to use it. And of course hit and run after a few wins.
From my observation playing it with dozens or columns is safer option but requires
more patience and br. During my tracking of dz i had 3trips,1quad and 1 5pts. :) ;)
i was betting against 5 pointers in a row with trigger and was up 32 when i first lost my 15 progression that means i was working on my third bank in al my dozen testing i did not ever came to the third bank ( this was testing continious spins no money management )
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 03:01 PM 2011
If I had bet straight without thinking about what was developing in the matrix Zig I would have lost four times. This is the skill in the game. Even if you miss one five pointer the odds are strong you will win the two level progression. I did this 14 times out of 99 won games. Only loss came as a result of three consecutive FIVE POINTERS.
Can you John if possible show examples of your games so we get some idea of when to
start betting and when to wait
Thanks
to play matrix 4 against 4 and 5 pointers you need 3 events not only 2,remember dozens and colums on matrix 4,you got doz1,doz2,doz3(3 events) just my opinion
Quote from: maestro on Apr 19, 04:51 AM 2011
To play matrix 4 against 4 and 5 pointers you need 3 events not only 2,remember dozens and columns on matrix 4,you got doz1,doz2,doz3(3 events) just my opinion
Agree ;D
Warrior lost 4 times in a row last night in B&M.
Cheers
Jon
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 03:09 PM 2011
That would be dangerous Post, of the 37 FIVE POINTERS in my 100 game sample 14 of them were 7 or longer. Including 9,9,9,10,11
I don't think its wise to try and outlive a single VERTICAL FORMATION. I'm sure 11 wont be the longest I see as time goes by. If RANDOM was able to form a 12 for the dozens. HI LO? ??? ???
--------------------
Ok, this is stuff we need to be reading, as guys come accross them....
So, so far it seems that we shouldn't:
*Try to outlive a vertical formation (which I was trying to do);
*Bet
every trip not to become a five pointer, (which I was trying to do)--so, how to decide which ones to bet and which ones not to? It seems that four or more consecutive 5 pointers are possible within the matrix (and maybe not so rare).
what other pitfalls you've found (general "you", not just JL) others may not yet be aware of?!
vundarosa
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 01:56 PM 2011
Average gap between FIVE POINTERS 5
And minimum gap between FIVE POINTERS? One?
How about a trigger like that one in MV5? (Wait for a five pointer, then wait for triple...)
Quote from: vundarosa on Apr 19, 05:15 AM 2011
--------------------
Ok, this is stuff we need to be reading, as guys come accross them....
So, so far it seems that we shouldn't:
*Try to outlive a vertical formation (which I was trying to do);
*Bet every trip not to become a five pointer, (which I was trying to do)--so, how to decide which ones to bet and which ones not to? It seems that four or more consecutive 5 pointers are possible within the matrix (and maybe not so rare).
what other pitfalls you've found (general "you", not just JL) others may not yet be aware of?!
vundarosa
If I enter the game and there are three or more TRIPS, QUADS already formed Im betting FOR FIVE POINTERS, If there are one or more five pointers im betting for TRIPS AND QUADS. AC/DC PLAY CONCEPT CURTESY ATLANTIS.
There is no need to fear FIVE POINTERS, make them work for us. I will give 25 games played this way later. And full and FINAL REVISION of this method. You really cant lose playing this way, its a win, WIN situation. :o
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 19, 06:35 AM 2011
If I enter the game and there are three or more TRIPS, QUADS already formed I'm betting FOR FIVE POINTERS, If there are one or more five pointers I'm betting for TRIPS AND QUADS. AC/DC PLAY CONCEPT CURTESY ATLANTIS.
There is no need to fear FIVE POINTERS, make them work for us. I will give 25 games played this way later. And full and FINAL REVISION of this method. You really can't lose playing this way, its a win, WIN situation. :o
john there going to 6 and 7 pointers on more then just one line.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 19, 06:35 AM 2011
If I enter the game and there are three or more TRIPS, QUADS already formed I'm betting FOR FIVE POINTERS, If there are one or more five pointers I'm betting for TRIPS AND QUADS. AC/DC PLAY CONCEPT CURTESY ATLANTIS.
There is no need to fear FIVE POINTERS, make them work for us. I will give 25 games played this way later. And full and FINAL REVISION of this method. You really can't lose playing this way, its a win, WIN situation. :o
:thumbsup:
:) It seems that 5pts come in series now. In dublinbet in 80 spins session i had 7 5pts
in all EC events. 4 some reason the best results always come playing H/L. Still ahead.
I think i will stay away from RB and OE. So far the best results come when i
play MV5 4wide betting against DZ trips becoming 5pts.
I play it playing also against Dz repeating itself in series of 4 spins.
Dozens not repeating always worked 4 me.
;D
Quote from: Robeenhuut on Apr 19, 07:42 AM 2011
:) It seems that 5pts come in series now. In dublinbet in 80 spins session I had 7 5pts
in all EC events. 4 some reason the best results always come playing H/L. Still ahead.
I think I will stay away from RB and OE. So far the best results come when i
play MV5 4wide betting against DZ trips becoming 5pts.
I play it playing also against Dz repeating itself in series of 4 spins.
Dozens not repeating always worked 4 me.
;D
The orginale MV5 playing with dozen works like allways ;D
jon
Quote from: warrior on Apr 19, 07:41 AM 2011
john there going to 6 and 7 pointers on more then just one line.
Warrior are you sure they arent selling snake oil in that casino you're using? If you are meeting so many five pointers my advice is to gauge the average gap between them and BET FOR THEM. You have a turnover here that makes it ALL POSSIBLE. I have a definate pattern going on, online live. I have yet to see more than 3 FIVE POINTERS in a row in 120 games played. that's happenned five times but with the AC/DC play. They become winners. FULL EXPLANATION LATER out to enjoy this weather... >:( >:(
Quote from: Robeenhuut on Apr 19, 07:42 AM 2011
:) It seems that 5pts come in series now. In dublinbet in 80 spins session I had 7 5pts
in all EC events. 4 some reason the best results always come playing H/L. Still ahead.
I think I will stay away from RB and OE. So far the best results come when i
play MV5 4wide betting against DZ trips becoming 5pts.
I play it playing also against Dz repeating itself in series of 4 spins.
Dozens not repeating always worked 4 me.
;D
Chose hi and low for a reason Robeenhuut, it behaves more consistently.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 19, 09:16 AM 2011
Warrior are you sure they arent selling snake oil in that casino you're using? If you are meeting so many five pointers my advice is to gauge the average gap between them and BET FOR THEM. You have a turnover here that makes it ALL POSSIBLE. I have a definate pattern going on, online live. I have yet to see more than 3 FIVE POINTERS in a row in 120 games played. that's happenned five times but with the AC/DC play. They becomes winners. FULL EXPLANATION LATER out to enjoy this weather... >:( >:(
what are you going to do that's roulette throws up thing that you dont expect.
Quote from: warrior on Apr 19, 09:27 AM 2011
what are you going to do that's roulette throws up thing that you don't expect.
Warrior record enough spins to get an idea of what randoms doing. Ive never found it easier to read. How many spins have you recorded once you have a couple of thousand you will see a clearer picture.
Here is exactly how im play MV5 E/C
1, When I COMMENCE playing I bactrack the history bar and record the previous 24 spins.
2, If there is three or more TRIPS and QUADS in those 24 spins, I bet that the next QUAD WILL BECOME A FIVE POINTER. Let me tell you this might be the ultimate bet ever. Ive never gone more than 4 bets without a win. If there is A FIVE POINTER with no QUADS after it. I bet for a QUAD
3,This is done both ways for ONE WIN. Before I close out the session. And its working beautifully. AC/DC BETTING CONCEPT. You play both sides of the fence. For one win a piece. Once I have 50 games played this way I will post up the step by step movements to show it in action. ;D ;) ;D
Well I played it all today
PB
P4
MV 5 (HI&LO)
And it was trully amazin
At the start of my session there were no trips or Quads in the data, so I started off there
then towards the end of my session there had been no 5 Pointers so I bet them
And then right at the end I notice there had not benn a H H H H or a L L L L
Waited for a H H H and bet H and waited for a L L L and bet L
I LOST EVERY BET
Im now -200 Units
HA HA !
Got ya :wink:
Seriously though it was a dame fine session :xd: :xd: :lol:
Only went step 2 twice and won both my PB bets :lol:
Now off for Burgers at TGI Fridays :)
Hasta La Vista Baby !
Tested MV5 4wide betting H/L against trips becoming 5pts on Smartlive live.
135 spins.
Just recorded the numbers. Results: 8 5+pts and 6trips or quads. Evenly spread.
Glad i didnt play. Honestly i cant see that u can use any tactic against such result.
I still believe that we can make it work somehow but use some caution.
:)
Maybe a bad day in office. I think we need more testing. In my case it represents
2 sessions aiming 4 5wins like in my previous post. But the ratio of 5pts and 3,4pts
doesnt look good. No matter where u start betting in this case u will get hit badly.
On a positive note MV5 behaved much better when playing Dz/Col.
Just a question anyone ever saw 6 wins in a row betting 4 wide against 5pointers playing dozens can sombody check it ?
HAHA Twister that really got me as i was reading your post on my little notebook :xd:
Okay I don't know how results vary from casino to casino. It could be possible that a land casino will give an overall different result to an online casino. All I can state is what I observe in the contraints of that FOUR WIDE MATRIX. At Betfreds, and Ladbrokes TRIPS ARE KING. They form more than QUADS AND FIVE POINTERS PUT TOGETHER. Therefore cannot be ignored here is a session I just finished.
HLHL
HLHL
H0HH
LLHH
HHHL--FIVE POINTER COL 3 MY TRIGGER TO BET FOR A TRIP OR QUAD
HLLL
LLLL
LHLH--WIN BET ONE COL 4 AS TRIP DID NOT BECOME A QUAD
LLHL
HHHH
LLHH
LLLH--FIVE TRIPS SINCE THE LAST FIVE POINTER BET FOR A FIVE POINTER
HLLL
LLLH--TRIGGER COL 2 BET IT WILL BECOME A FIVE POINTER
HLHL--WIN BET ONE AS IT BECAME A FIVE POINTER SESSION OVER
This represents a typical session for me. Sometimes there will be two five pointers. But here is the thing TRIPS RULE and FIVE POINTERS COME SECOND, QUADS are the least likely to form of the three. I think what everyone must do is study the behaviour of your SOURCE and respond to it. :o
Good question Post. I think i know what you have in mind :wink:
I don't think i have seen more than 4 wins in a row on either doz or cols. I need to find some of my old data though to make sure
Quote from: ZigZag on Apr 19, 02:42 PM 2011
Good question Post. I think I know what you have in mind :wink:
I don't think I have seen more than 4 wins in a row on either doz or cols. I need to find some of my old data though to make sure
Yes its a Method cruisin Baccarat Land at this time
Watch a player who has had 5 wins in a row and bet opposite
If ure bettin large stakes its ok as the wait is endless at times :yawn:
I need to learn how to play bac. I will have a little play in fun mode soon :smile:
With betting FOR an event maybe this can work well on a 2 or 3 wide ???
2 wide doz/cols
3 wide for HL
testing it on 4 wide zig zag ;)
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 19, 11:22 AM 2011
Warrior record enough spins to get an idea of what randoms doing. I've never found it easier to read. How many spins have you recorded once you have a couple of thousand you will see a clearer picture.
Here is exactly how I'm play MV5 E/C
1, When I COMMENCE playing I bactrack the history bar and record the previous 24 spins.
2, If there is three or more TRIPS and QUADS in those 24 spins, I bet that the next QUAD WILL BECOME A FIVE POINTER. Let me tell you this might be the ultimate bet ever. I've never gone more than 4 bets without a win. If there is A FIVE POINTER with no QUADS after it. I bet for a QUAD
3,This is done both ways for ONE WIN. Before I close out the session. And its working beautifully. AC/DC BETTING CONCEPT. You play both sides of the fence. For one win a piece. Once I have 50 games played this way I will post up the step by step movements to show it in action. ;D ;) ;D
Do u play this way also MV5 4wide for DZ/Col?
:)
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 19, 02:27 PM 2011
Okay I don't know how results vary from casino to casino. It could be possible that a land casino will give an overall different result to an online casino. All I can state is what I observe in the contraints of that FOUR WIDE MATRIX. At Betfreds, and Ladbrokes TRIPS ARE KING. They form more than QUADS AND FIVE POINTERS PUT TOGETHER. Therefore cannot be ignored here is a session I just finished.
HLHL
HLHL
H0HH
LLHH
HHHL--FIVE POINTER COL 3 MY TRIGGER TO BET FOR A TRIP OR QUAD
HLLL
LLLL
LHLH--WIN BET ONE COL 4 AS TRIP DID NOT BECOME A QUAD
LLHL
HHHH
LLHH
LLLH--FIVE TRIPS SINCE THE LAST FIVE POINTER BET FOR A FIVE POINTER
HLLL
LLLH--TRIGGER COL 2 BET IT WILL BECOME A FIVE POINTER
HLHL--WIN BET ONE AS IT BECAME A FIVE POINTER SESSION OVER
This represents a typical session for me. Sometimes there will be two five pointers. But here is the thing TRIPS RULE and FIVE POINTERS COME SECOND, QUADS are the least likely to form of the three. I think what everyone must do is study the behaviour of your SOURCE and respond to it. :o
---------------------
John, thx for explainning this. Its much clearer now. I've gonne back to my section and can see exactly what you mean...thx for decoding it for me...
....off to another 5u now :twisted: :twisted:
vundarosa
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 19, 11:22 AM 2011
Warrior record enough spins to get an idea of what randoms doing. I've never found it easier to read. How many spins have you recorded once you have a couple of thousand you will see a clearer picture.
Here is exactly how I'm play MV5 E/C
1, When I COMMENCE playing I bactrack the history bar and record the previous 24 spins.
2, If there is three or more TRIPS and QUADS in those 24 spins, I bet that the next QUAD WILL BECOME A FIVE POINTER. Let me tell you this might be the ultimate bet ever. I've never gone more than 4 bets without a win. If there is A FIVE POINTER with no QUADS after it. I bet for a QUAD
3,This is done both ways for ONE WIN. Before I close out the session. And its working beautifully. AC/DC BETTING CONCEPT. You play both sides of the fence. For one win a piece. Once I have 50 games played this way I will post up the step by step movements to show it in action. ;D ;) ;D
What happens if we do not get the above outcome
do we keep tracking until the above happens in 24 spin blocks
Thanks
Quote from: Robeenhuut on Apr 20, 01:36 AM 2011
Do you play this way also MV5 4wide for DZ/Col?
:)
No Dozens and Columns have a much slower turnover, I play a three step progression against five pointers. Im currently 280/1 for the original MV5. It the best method ever but it requires patience that most dont have.
Thats why ive pushed for a more casino friendly version with HI and LO. Now the turnovers THERE, but of course its less invincible. THAT WILL ALWAYS BE THE TRADE OFF.
That said because qualifiers are so close a readable pattern developes. And most of the time it delivers as you expect. I dont have one 60 spin sample for example without at least TWO TRIPS. These are things we can take advantage of. Dont just go through the motions, look at whats unfolding before you.
Quote from: vundarosa on Apr 20, 01:46 AM 2011
---------------------
John, thanks for explainning this. Its much clearer now. I've gonne back to my section and can see exactly what you mean...thanks for decoding it for me...
....off to another 5u now :twisted: :twisted:
vundarosa
Decoding is the word Vundarosa, I feel thats exactly what the four wide matrix is doing, Im experimenting with Lines in that format too the possibilities it offers are many. Its the perfect MATRIX.
how can you see that somthing is unfolding in front of you what do you bet ?
Quote from: Post on Apr 20, 09:10 AM 2011
How can you see that somthing is unfolding in front of you what do you bet ?
When I say unfolding Post I refer to the footprint random is leaving for hi and lo. I have 140 games recorded and its ridiculous how similar the pattern is throughout. 3-6 TRIPS AND QUADS. 1-3 FIVE POINTERS. That is the dominant result throughout my 140 games.
Quote from: ScoobyDoo link=topic=4737. msg48278#msg48278 date=1303161954
For those of you interested, this method works on Craps. . . . . Using the Pass and Don't Pass lines.
I would imagine that it works for Baccarat or any game with a 50/50 chance.
Scooby Doo
Have you really done any testing on craps with it?
I did some very limited testing on craps and It failed badly. If you have tested it some maybe it warrents some more testing by me on craps.
I just tested this system at a land casino in australia. The results r nowhere near wat i expected. Lots of trips, quads and five pointers. The system is completely killed by the dealers. however, the results for doz r pretty stable when i use mv3 against trips with triggers
It seems matrix systems r still not good for even chance
Quote from: kiamessi on Apr 21, 09:22 AM 2011
the results for doz are pretty stable when I use mv3 against trips with triggers
You should play against trips after trigger on a 5 wide. 3 wide bust too much :wink:
Quote from: kiamessi on Apr 21, 09:22 AM 2011
I just tested this system at a land casino in australia. The results are nowhere near wat I expected. Lots of trips, quads and five pointers. The system is completely killed by the dealers. however, the results for doz are pretty stable when I use mv3 against trips with triggers
It seems matrix systems are still not good for even chance
What did you expect exactly. Trips, quads and five pointers are exactly what we want. Im not sure many are grasping this method. And maybe its just too straightforward. And people cannot believe winning can be this easy. The only difference I have found playing High and Low instead of dozens, is a vastly improved betting frequency.
The breakdown for me has never been easier to read. And the clincher is the outlay. Half the bankroll at risk. Adapt to what your source is delivering. If the general concensus is land casinos are spinning more FIVE POINTERS. BET FIVE POINTERS.
I can and will beat any REAL WHEEL on the planet with this method. There are no excuses, its too easy now.
what do you mean JL bet five pointers ?
JL
I think a few ppl dont have this nailed down ???
Maybe a rule revision clarification etc ?
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 21, 12:26 PM 2011
JL
I think a few people don't have this nailed down ???
Maybe a rule revision clarification etc ?
Twister I dont know what more I can say. Its as easy as noughts and crosses. What I need from these people who are struggling with this is some results. I dont know how land casinos are so different from online Twister.
I need to know what 100 spins in a land casino is showing people before I can show how id deal with it.
Ill show some results to prove wat i said. Not only trips,squads or 5 points, there r also 6,7 points coming out easily.
another thing is that i dont know if this happens to online casinos or not that i have to start over writing again when a new dealer comes to the table, coz they have a big affects to the games, so its pretty scary to keep playing.
i play airball so no new dealers and lots of quads five pointers and trips ;)
Quote from: kiamessi on Apr 21, 01:41 PM 2011
Ill show some results to prove wat I said. Not only trips,squads or 5 points, there are also 6,7 points coming out easily.
another thing is that I don't know if this happens to online casinos or not that I have to start over writing again when a new dealer comes to the table, because they have a big affects to the games, so its pretty scary to keep playing.
Once you hit a five pointer that's it, how long it goes on from there makes no difference. Can you please post A sample of 100 spins twice for two different dealers. I am pretty sure you don't understand this.
I went to a real casino in the west end of London last night and walked in with 1000 units and walked out with nearly 1300 just playing this. And the results were very similar to what I get online. Thats why I need to see exactly what youre getting.
what did you bet on then JL just curious ;)
Quote from: Post on Apr 21, 02:44 PM 2011
What did you bet on then JL just curious ;)
High and Low in the four wide MATRIX. I dont touch Red or Black, odd or even. They are different animals and complicate things.
KEEP IT SIMPLE PEOPLE. High and Low in the four wide Matrix decodes roulette. The turnover is there you need NOTHING ELSE. 8)
ok i know high low is real good but what exactly did you bet 5 pointers ? or everything and just bet what you think is forming ?
Quote from: Post on Apr 21, 03:14 PM 2011
Ok I know high low is real good but what exactly did you bet 5 pointers ? or everything and just bet what you think is forming ?
The first thing I did was make a note of the history marker on three tables. I never just start playing Post, I take stock until I see the trigger. Wiithin an hour oppurtunities developed. One table had three trips and quads. I bet for a FIVE POINTER but lost as it stayed a QUAD. 40 UNITS DOWN. Another table had a FIVE POINTER. I waited and bet on the next TRIP 60 UNITS, won. Now 20 in profit. Another Quad developed I bet 60 units it would be a FIVE it was now 80 units up.
This hunting and betting continued through the evening. Until I cashed in for 270 units profit. And even more importantly. Firm belief that HIGH AND LOW in the FOUR WIDE MATRIX OWNS THIS GAME LIVE...
yestrday i was testing with using everything as trigger when i see a triple bet that a quad or 5pointer is next if lose wait new trigger say 5 pointer as trigger we bet next that a quads or triple is going to form ;) like this
Quote from: Post on Apr 21, 03:43 PM 2011
Yestrday I was testing with using everything as trigger when I see a triple bet that a quad or 5pointer is next if lose wait new trigger say 5 pointer as trigger we bet next that a quads or triple is going to form ;) like this
This is how I see it Post, we All know dozens and columns offer more invincibility than HIGH and LOW. But the trade for this is RISK AND *TIME*.
I come from a real casino background, the ultimate for me is a method that offers an acceptable BALANCE. I believe HI AND LO in a FOUR WIDE MATRIX is that method. Ive read some report seeing 5-6 FIVE POINTERS for high and low.
Now start thinking about this. Is that really so bad? If it were DOZENS and COLUMNS, it would be. But with the turnover we get from HIGH and LOW, NADA. If I were to to play purely against FIVE POINTERS. I would wait for a trigger then commence betting with this progression.
2,4,8,16,32,64=126 points risk
It would take 7 consecutive FIVE POINTERS to take my progression. And the way I play that might never happen. You see there are benefits to taking a bit more risk. IMPROVED BETTING FREQUENCY,and OUTLAY. It would take 742 units to cover the same progression for DOZENS. And 742 wins to match a progression VS 63 to match a progression for HIGH and LOW. All these things must be considered.
JL i think you also need to give a try on my methode it fools random quitte good ust everything as a trigger if you see a trip formed bet next for a quad or 5 pointer to FORM max loss 1-2-4-8
15=total last 2 sessions i was up 19 each thata bank every session ;)
Quote from: Post on Apr 23, 11:22 AM 2011
JL I think you also need to give a try on my methode it fools random quitte good ust everything as a trigger if you see a trip formed bet next for a quad or 5 pointer to FORM max rloss 1-2-4-8
15=total last 2 sessions I was up 19 each thata bank every session ;)
Right Post you get it now, those Quads and five pointers cant be stopped MAKE THEM PAY.
what do you reccomend to bet on JL after all your games ?
Quote from: Post on Apr 24, 10:45 AM 2011
What do you reccomend to bet on JL after all your games ?
You have it nailed Post, looking back on the 500 games ive now played theres rarely more than three trips before a QUAD OR FIVE POINTER. You know theyre coming. So betting for them makes PERFECT SENSE. Well done for spotting this. As a side bet I would bet AGAINST FIVE POINTERS if three in a row form. This is a roulette killer Post with a very low risk...
maybe play like this wait for a loss i mean a trip that DID NOT become a quad and bet the next 4 trips to BECOME one just thinking out loud
Quote from: Post on Apr 24, 01:47 PM 2011
Maybe play like this wait for a loss I mean a trip that DID NOT become a quad and bet the next 4 trips to BECOME one just thinking out loud
Post, what it *Always* comes down to is PATIENCE,PATIENCE,PATIENCE. One trip trigger you have a GREAT SYSTEM. TWO, you have a HOLY GRAIL, just think that over POST and everyone else who may read this.
YOU ARE TWO TRIP TRIGGERS AWAY FROM A HOLY GRAIL. The only thing that can deny you this is your LACK OF PATIENCE.
But even with a one TRIP trigger Post you will have an INCREDIBLE SYSTEM that can be used ANYWHERE.
and always the max loss is 15 units so worth the try :o
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 24, 02:08 PM 2011
Post, what it *Always* comes down to is PATIENCE,PATIENCE,PATIENCE. One trip trigger you have a GREAT SYSTEM. TWO, you have a HOLY GRAIL, just think that over POST and everyone else who may read this.
YOU ARE TWO TRIP TRIGGERS AWAY FROM A HOLY GRAIL. The only thing that can deny you this is your LACK OF PATIENCE.
But even with a one TRIP trigger Post you will have an INCREDIBLE SYSTEM that can be used ANYWHERE.
What do you mean by this John ?
Jon
Are we betting for or against quads?
Why not wait for a trip, then bet that it will become a quad.
If u lose, wait for a quad then bet that it will not become a five.
Quote from: Post on Apr 24, 02:10 PM 2011
And always the max loss is 15 units so worth the try :o
Worth the wait. I think one TRIP TRIGGER will do nicely.
Quote from: The_Force on Apr 24, 02:47 PM 2011
Are we betting for or against quads?
Why not wait for a trip, then bet that it will become a quad.
If you lose, wait for a quad then bet that it will not become a five.
-----------
how about, after 3 trips, bet the next trip will become a quad?! if lose wait for next trip and bet it will become a quad?!
w/1-2-4-8 ?!
---------
ALSO, when tracking for trips, if the trip becomes a quad and/or beyond, do count it as one of your 3 trips... and when the 4th trip forms, bet it will become a quad
vundarosa
hi guys, seems to me that a lot of people( me too!!) seem confused.
COuld we have the system method on one thread(purely for JL's tweaks) and comments on it in another?
cheers
hamsup
Quote from: hamsup_sotong on Apr 24, 09:19 PM 2011
Hi guys, seems to me that a lot of people( me too!!) seem confused.
COuld we have the system method on one thread(purely for JL's tweaks) and comments on it in another?
cheers
hamsup
---------------
not really mate, just fine tuning. This method as a lot of ways one could profit from it, depending of what you're getting on the wheel...if you read it well and adapt accordingly, you could have a long term winner on your hands.....and the only way to do that is to practice, practice and exchange ideas and practice some more
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Apr 24, 09:38 PM 2011
---------------
not really mate, just fine tuning. This method as a lot of ways one could profit from it, depending of what you're getting on the wheel...if you read it well and adapt accordingly, you could have a long term winner on your hands.....and the only way to do that is to practice, practice and exchange ideas and practice some more
vundarosa
Well said Vundarosa, but for hamsup's benefit and because im going on holiday this Tuesday for 10 days. I will post here exactly how I intend to play it from now on.
1, Record spins for HIGH and LOW in a FOUR WIDE MATRIX, until you get a VERTICAL TREBLE of one of them. This becomes your TRIGGER, I.E
HLHL
HLHL
0HLL--TRIGGER LOW COL 4
2, You now continue to record spins until you have another vertical TREBLE. You now bet this TRIP becomes a QUAD.
3, You use a five step progression as follows 2,4,8,16,32. More than five trips for HI and LO is rare before a QUAD or FIVE POINTER forms.
4, If you have a situation where THREE Quads or longer form, you can now REVERSE the process and bet for a TRIP. Using the same staking plan. Its a win win situation. And very effective live. Thats how im playing it Hamsup.
anyone still playing/ testing this ?
Quote from: Post on May 23, 01:41 PM 2011
Anyone still playing/ testing this ?
Everyday Post, its long overdue an update coming later. As far as im concerned along with PATTERN 4 and DIVIDE AND CONQUER. Its a roulette killer. There ought to be 100s of members all over these methods but there you go.
i have been using this method on all even chance bets. except my twist is that
i wait for a double vertical trigger... then bet that the next double WILL become a triple..
using a marty $2 4 8 16 32 ... it has not failed yet :xd:
JL how about playing like this first play 1-2-4-8 betting against 5 pointers and if loss use 2-4-8-16 playing for 8 wins so you are back +1 and continue on level 1
With MATRIX VERTICAL 5 (HIGH AN LOW) ive settled on the following play method.
1, Record spins in a four wide matrix for HIGH AN LOW until you have one FIVE POINTER example below. This becomes your TRIGGER.
H L H L
H H L L
H H L L
L H H L
L L H L--Trigger COL 4 LOW
2, Using a 5 Step progression you now commence betting against SIX CONSECUTIVE FIVE POINTERS forming.
PROGRESSION 1,2,4,8,16=TOTAL RISK 31 PTS
My results so far.
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 120
TOTAL GAMES WON 119
TOTAL GAMES LOST 1
STRIKERATE 119/1
BALANCE 89 POINTS PLUS
LONGEST WINNING STREAK 74
This is how I will be playing MATRIX VERTICAL 5 for the even chances from now on, even with the TRIGGER it has a faster turnover than MATRIX 5 DOZENS and COLUMNS. And probably a better strikerate. SIX FIVE POINTERS isnt going to happen too often.
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 30, 07:08 AM 2011
With MATRIX VERTICAL 5 (HIGH AN LOW) I've settled on the following play method.
1, Record spins in a four wide matrix for HIGH AN LOW until you have one FIVE POINTER example below. This becomes your TRIGGER.
H L H L
H H L L
H H L L
L H H L
L L H L--Trigger COL 4 LOW
2, Using a 5 Step progression you now commence betting against SIX CONSECUTIVE FIVE POINTERS forming.
PROGRESSION 1,2,4,8,16=TOTAL RISK 31 PTS
My results so far.
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 120
TOTAL GAMES WON 119
TOTAL GAMES LOST 1
STRIKERATE 119/1
BALANCE 89 POINTS PLUS
LONGEST WINNING STREAK 74
This is how I will be playing MATRIX VERTICAL 5 for the even chances from now on, even with the TRIGGER it has a faster turnover than MATRIX 5 DOZENS and COLUMNS. And probably a better strikerate. SIX FIVE POINTERS isnt going to happen too often.
Thanx JL for the update :thumbsup:
I see you lost a game ? So you saw six 5 pointers at some point I guess :o
Quote from: Twisteruk on May 30, 07:44 AM 2011
thanks JL for the update :thumbsup:
I see you lost a game ? So you saw six 5 pointers at some point I guess :o
Yes my friend they can happen. Itll be interesting to see if a seven or eigth FIVE POINTER EVER FORM. I think SEVEN may be randoms limit for the EVEN CHANCES. If it pans out that way after say 5,000 games we will know we have another HOLY GRAIL HERE.
When you think about it even PATTERN 4 or DIVIDE and CONQUER. Could become near invincible. with triggers added. But once again we come down to our little friend PATIENCE. The most important human attribute required to conquer this game. And of course the most deficient attribute in the vast majority who play it.
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 30, 10:26 AM 2011
Yes my friend they can happen. Itll be interesting to see if a seven or eigth FIVE POINTER EVER FORM. I think SEVEN may be randoms limit for the EVEN CHANCES. If it pans out that way after say 5,000 games we will know we have another HOLY GRAIL HERE.
When you think about it even PATTERN 4 or DIVIDE and CONQUER. Could become near invincible. with triggers added. But once again we come down to our little friend PATIENCE. The most important human attribute required to conquer this game. And of course the most deficient attribute in the vast majority who play it.
no matter what the trigger is the longer you wait the largest is the spread of the results. You only can hope you're in the up curve and set some kind of brake.
The Random affects all events the same way.
Cheers
Quote from: albertojonas on May 30, 10:35 AM 2011
no matter what the trigger is the longer you wait the largest is the spread of the results. You only can hope you're in the up curve and set some kind of brake.
The Random affects all events the same way.
Cheers
And how are you so sure of that Albertojonas? Have you ever seen 7 FIVE POINTERS? Random indeed has limits. The problem is the human being playing this game cant stick around long enough to find them. I already know a few thats why I know this game is well and truly beaten. AS LONG AS YOU HAVE PATIENCE. And follow the guidelines. If you are an erratic player who expects to get rich overnight forget it. And play the lottery. There is no easy path to beating this game long term BUT, THERE IS A PATH/S. Know that much for certain... 8)
It is Maths.
I have seen a 7 pointer several times
just as anyone had seen 15Reds in a row....
But there are paths indeed, or else I would't play it. Just try to improve it.
:thumbsup:
8)
Quote from: albertojonas on May 30, 11:15 AM 2011
It is Maths.
I have seen a 7 pointer several times
just as anyone had seen 15Reds in a row....
But there are paths indeed, or else I would't play it. Just try to improve it.
:thumbsup:
8)
What do you mean by 7 pointer. I said 7 consecutive 5 pointers. I doubt very much you have seen that much if ever.
yes you are wright i did not see any of those. my mistake.
i didn' t play it long enough to wait for a trigger like that...
Quote from: albertojonas on May 30, 11:41 AM 2011
Yes you are write I did not see any of those. my mistake.
i didn' t play it long enough to wait for a trigger like that...
Listen you can be neagtive all you want on my threads. It gets you nowhere. Or you can listen to what I am saying here and move forward. I have known absolutely for the last 7 years this game has achilles heels and is there for the taking IF you apply a good method in the right way.
That is why I come across so confident arrogant however you perceive me I KNOW ABSOLUTELY. The game isn't unbeatable. My mission on this forum is to enlighten others to that fact. And give a real serious illustration of it next year in casinos that dont expect you to leave a winner EVERYDAY.
Quote from: Johnlegend on May 30, 11:46 AM 2011
Listen you can be neagtive all you want on my threads. It gets you nowhere. Or you can listen to what I am saying here and move forward. I have known absolutely for the last 7 years this game has achilles heels and is there for the taking IF you apply a good method in the right way.
That is why I come across so confident arrogant however you perceive me I KNOW ABSOLUTELY. The game isn't unbeatable. My mission on this forum is to enlighten others to that fact. And give a real serious illustration of it next year in casinos that don't expect you to leave a winner EVERYDAY.
I believe it can be beaten or else i wouldn't play it.
as for all that matters already gave you the answer on the other thread.
Same applies here.
Love
JL from now on i am going to test randoms limit i play this methode wait for 1 five pointer as trigger and the bet against 6 more 5 pointers with 1-2-4-8-16-32 total risk = 63 units
need 7 five pointers in a row to beat me ;)
Quote from: Post on May 30, 01:11 PM 2011
JL from now on I am going to test randoms limit I play this methode wait for 1 five pointer as trigger and the bet against 6 more 5 pointers with 1-2-4-8-16-32 total risk = 63 units
need 7 five pointers in a row to beat me ;)
Yes Post you have the patience. I got one six 5 pointers in 120 games so its solid my friend go for it and report every 30-50 games or so. I think its safer than three 5 POINTERS for the DOZENS and COLUMNS. And the wait for a TRIGGER is less time consuming than waiting for a QUAD for DOZENS and COLUMNS alot of the time. Im staying on this Post.
Hello Johnlegend !
I find your work on this forum really impressive. But a very important question for me is still open and it would be very nice if you could answer it.
You play a progression. But how you handle the Zero?
Especially in a progression that is a crucial matter. You now have already made ​​hundreds of bets and thereby gotten many zeros, it is for the reader to know a good idea for how you manage the Zero.
Thank You!
Defense (hxxp:%20img851.%20imageshack.%20us/img851/8230/testu.%20gif)
Quote from: Post on May 30, 01:11 PM 2011
JL from now on I am going to test randoms limit I play this methode wait for 1 five pointer as trigger and the bet against 6 more 5 pointers with 1-2-4-8-16-32 total risk = 63 units
need 7 five pointers in a row to beat me ;)
-----------------------
will be posting my results too at every 50 games, with 1-2-4-8-16-32 total risk = 63 units
vundarosa
Quote from: Defense on Jun 01, 06:45 AM 2011
Hello Johnlegend !
I find your work on this forum really impressive. But a very important question for me is still open and it would be very nice if you could answer it.
You play a progression. But how you handle the Zero?
Especially in a progression that is a crucial matter. You now have already made ​​hundreds of bets and thereby gotten many zeros, it is for the reader to know a good idea for how you manage the Zero.
Thank You!
Defense (link:://hxxp:%20img851.%20imageshack.%20us/img851/8230/testu.%20gif)
Defense hello and thankyou for your interest. I accept the Zero, strangely enough playing hit and run I don't run into many during my bets. With a method like PATTERN 4 I will count zero as HIGH. So for example say PATTERN 1 was as follows
H 0 H-PATTERN 1
L H L
L H L
I'm now betting on three lows for the FOURTH PATTERN. I don't fear the ZERO at all Defense. All the methods I use perform well in spite of the zeros existence. The strategies deliver good profit margins. In fact Pattern 4 will even defeat the American wheel played HIT AND RUN. Of the 36 losses I have suffered in 465 games the zero was only responsible for 4 of them.
This is the bottom line defense, play as the casinos wants you to, I.E continuosly over long periods. The zero WOULD be a major factor and become a problem. Played hit and run its hold on your profit margin is weakened.
Remember ZERO'has as much chance of showing and SLEEPING as anyother number on the wheel. A mistake some players make is to bet on ZERO as a straight, they figure its a sure bet. Three to five appearances every hundred spins.
Someone on Betfreds came unstuck believing Zero is always due at least 3 times per hundred spins. The green goblin went on a cruise of parts unknown. And didn't re-enter the stratosphere until some 224 spins later. By that point they were broken both emotlonally and financially. Cursing the Latvian girls and how fixed the wheel was.
No single number is EVER DUE. That is one of the true fallacies of roulette. So I never fear the Zero I've gone days without being hit by a zero in my betting campaigns.
I have the experience with this game to know what works and what doesn't. Hope that anwsers your question. Play the game HIT AND RUN. And you will not even worry about the Zero.
The weak link isnt Zero or house limits. Its the human mind. Right now I can visualize several people watching this thread without passing comment.
They are waiting for this method to fall. Then theyll wade in with their two cents about how they always knew a method this simplistic could never break the unbreakable one.
Well I've got news for them, theyre in for one helluva wait. Played HIT AND RUN and managed with disciplined BR execution. PATTERN 4 Is one of ROULETTES achilles heels. Play on people. Build a powerful BR. 8)
Wtf ?
ignore me lol
edit lol wrong thread :-[
JL how about playing 7 wide and bet against 5 quads with 1 quad trigger ?
high low
well i have been testing 7 wide with a quad as trigger and i still have an average of 1 unit every 40 spins continue testing already have couple banks if you play for 5-10 a session you can stretch the win streak even further i guess needs testing
novaproof system with 1-2-4-8 15 max risk
Quote from: Post on Jun 02, 05:50 PM 2011
Well I have been testing 7 wide with a quad as trigger and I still have an average of 1 unit every 40 spins continue testing already have couple banks if you play for 5-10 a session you can stretch the win streak even further I guess needs testing
novaproof system with 1-2-4-8 15 max risk
Yes Post it may work well. You know what's strange about QUADS with HIGH AND LOW? They seem to happen less than QUADS with the DOZENS. You tend to get more TRIPS or FIVE POINTERS with HIGH AND LOW. I've seen five QUADS so infrequently I think it would work on a FOUR WIDE MATRIX anyhow Post even a THREE WIDE MATRIX. While playing PATTERN 4/BREAKER. I seldom even see THREE QUADS. So you may have something of great worth here. Either way QUADS/FIVE POINTERS. Its a win, win method. ;D
Quote from: hamsup_sotong on Apr 24, 09:19 PM 2011
Hi guys, seems to me that a lot of people( me too!!) seem confused.
COuld we have the system method on one thread(purely for JL's tweaks) and comments on it in another?
cheers
hamsup
Hamsup do you know the basics of the method?
1, We use a FOUR WIDE GRID and record spins for high and low until we have a vertical column of five HIGHS or five LOWS. Example
H H H L
L H H L
H H L H
0 H L L
L H L H---TRIGGER COL 2 HIGH
2, We now bet that there will not be 6 of these IN A ROW using the following progression
1,2,4,8,16=31 units risk
I have recorded several 3 and 4 FIVE POINTERS, but random seems to lose interest beyond that.
My results UPDATE
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 150
TOTAL GAMES WON 149
TOTAL GAMES LOST 1
STRIKERATE 149/1
BALANCE 119 POINTS PLUS
LONGEST WINNING STREAK 75
This is a method which simply put DESTROYS ROULETTE. The requirement as always to beat this game for as long as you play it PATIENCE. Since the single loss my progression has never been under threat. To give you some idea how solid MATRIX VERTICAL 5 is, here is the breakdown of that 75 game winning streak. The numbers represent the number of FIVE POINTERS including the TRIGGER before a win.
1,1,1,2,1,4,3,2,1,1,2,1,4,3,1,2,3,3,2,2,2,1,2,1,2
3,2,1,1,1,2,4,2,3,1,3,1,2,1,4,2,2,3,1,4,2,2,1,1,1
3,3,1,1,2,3,4,1,2,1,1,2,2,2,2,1,3,4,2,1,2,3,2,1,2
Seven 4 FIVE POINTERS in that winning streak. ;D ;D ;D ;D
JL if you say you mostly only see max 4 five pointers not even 5 in a row why dont just use the 1-2-4-8 only 15 risk with trigger ofcourse ;)
Quote from: Post on Jun 04, 06:41 AM 2011
JL if you say you mostly only see max 4 five pointers not even 5 in a row why don't just use the 1-2-4-8 only 15 risk with trigger ofcourse ;)
Good point Post but that extra bet is insurance. When you think about it Post there is no way you can lose with this method. If you have 125 units and wait for a Trigger you can cover.
1,2,4,8,16,32,64. Thats 125 units to say to random You are never going to be showing me *****8 consecutive 5 pointers*****. Basically 125 units buys into an ABSOLUTE HOLY GRAIL. Losing simply isnt an option. PATIENCE is lol. But as I keep saying, Roulettes never been unbeatable, the human mind has just never been up to the task.
UNTIL NOW....
JL i think it does happen 8 five pointers but it is so unlikly that you will be there if it does thats why its a grail ;)
anyone still playing thi having mutch succes with this playing for 5 wins progression1-2-4-8 so good and still the thread is dead dont undrstand ???
Quote from: Post on Jun 16, 01:37 PM 2011
Anyone still playing thi having mutch success with this playing for 5 wins progression1-2-4-8 so good and still the thread is dead don't undrstand ???
I'm PLAYING IT POST. Yes its great isnt it. This lot are spoilt they have too many strong methods on here now. THIS ONE IS INVINCIBLE. Problem is my friend people can't wait to win I WILL UPDATE TOMORROW. ;D
Hello to John Legend and all members. I've just moved from that desert of hopelessness that is VLS, where pattern 4, introduced by Kingspin and tweaked by Hermes, is currently ranked 2 stars!
Been reading about the myriad new strong systems available here since at least March. Have read most of the threads on the main new systems and tried my hand with this one, MV5 HL. Unfortunately, I've been doing it wrong: went for trips not turning into 5 pointers with very uneven results ( Playtech live) lots of trips and quads, (more than 5 average, actually), but with periods of multiple five pointers in rapid succession.
Have recovered nicely with GLC's D/C Cleanup system, but want to get good at a number of systems. I'll try to contribute and keep the debate constructive.
My intuition has always pushed me away from all proofs of roulette's unbreakable nature. I have seen some strange things on casinos and a few people confidently walking out winners consistently. So I knew there had to be a way out. Glad to finally see the light!
Jeromin
Quote from: Jeromin on Jun 16, 06:30 PM 2011
Hello to John Legend and all members. I've just moved from that desert of hopelessness that is VLS, where pattern 4, introduced by Kingspin and tweaked by Hermes, is currently ranked 2 stars!
Been reading about the myriad new strong systems available here since at least March. Have read most of the threads on the main new systems and tried my hand with this one, MV5 HL. Unfortunately, I've been doing it wrong: went for trips not turning into 5 pointers with very uneven results ( Playtech live) lots of trips and quads, (more than 5 average, actually), but with periods of multiple five pointers in rapid succession.
Have recovered nicely with GLC's D/C Cleanup system, but want to get good at a number of systems. I'll try to contribute and keep the debate constructive.
My intuition has always pushed me away from all proofs of roulette's unbreakable nature. I have seen some strange things on casinos and a few people confidently walking out winners consistently. So I knew there had to be a way out. Glad to finally see the light!
Jeromin
Welcome to the best roulette forum in the universe. Here we don't deal in negativity. I know this games beatable. Have done for many years. Once you pull the three essential elements of success together.
GOOD METHOD
SOLID MONEY MANAGEMENT
DISCIPLINED MINDSET.
You will never look back. So you landed on the right thread here. The optimum way to play MV5 E/C is to bet againt FIVE POINTERS using one as your trigger. Its a near invincible method played that way.
I'm betting against six five pointers using one as a trigger 8 consecutive five pointers will be very rare. I have a results update coming tonight. Feel free to ask questions until you grasp the method.
MATRIX VERTICAL 5 E/C RESULTS UPDATE
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 300
TOTAL GAMES WON 297
TOTAL GAMES LOST 3
STRIKERATE 99/1
BALANCE 222 UNITS PLUS
I am now playing this method with both HIGH AND LOW AND ODD AND EVEN. For faster turnover. ODD AND EVEN. Produces plenty of triggers. And so is a nice addition. I have suffered two more losses since my last update. I am betting against 6 FIVE POINTERS forming. I have now seen 3 of them BUT, never beyond 6. I haven't seen a 7 or more. The reason I settled on 6 is RECOVERY. I only have 31 points at risk. And played HIT AND RUN. You are going to profit no question.
thaats on hell of a strike rate ;)
Quote from: Post on Jun 17, 09:01 PM 2011
Thaats on hell of a strike rate ;)
Yes Post and if I had been playing against 7 FIVE POINTERS my strikerate would still be 100%. I have yet to meet more than 6 FIVE POINTERS in real play. I am playing this method for both HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN. And that's a good idea Post. As it cuts waiting time down a lot. Next update at 400 games played. Keep it going Post. This is a virtual grail. Its a shame more people haven't the patience to stay with it.
i would like to try this system im looking for tracker for this
@sarif
Look on the Home page and locate the MST Project.
There is a tracker/clicker in there for U, designed and coded by member Ophis. :thumbsup:
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 18, 05:40 AM 2011
Yes Post and if I had been playing against 7 FIVE POINTERS my strikerate would still be 100%. I have yet to meet more than 6 FIVE POINTERS in real play. I am playing this method for both HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN. And that's a good idea Post. As it cuts waiting time down a lot. Next update at 400 games played. Keep it going Post. This is a virtual grail. Its a shame more people haven't the patience to stay with it.
------------------
JL & Post,
Are you guys playing in 5 wide matrix?! In 100 spins all i get is a trigger and a bunch of trips
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Jun 18, 05:05 PM 2011
------------------
JL & Post,
Are you guys playing in 5 wide matrix?! In 100 spins all I get is a trigger and a bunch of trips
vundarosa
No I am playing four wide Vundarosa. You could even play this 3 wide. If you are playing against SIX FIVE POINTERS with one as your trigger. And play both HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN. You will get a better turnover. I would even say bring RED AND BLACK into this one then you get a very respectable turnover.
I believe if you were to bet against 8 FIVE POINTERS for a 125 unit risk. You have the most solid method ever. Even more solid than CODE 4. Random has limits that it struggles to go beyond. 8 FIVE POINTERS is such a limit. I know its always about the wait with you guys. PATTERN BREAKER should be alot more popular than it is. But it takes anything from 30-80 spins to get a game. But it will NEVER PUT YOU IN NEGATIVE FIGURES. That is your reward for the wait.
MATRIX VERTICAL 5 E/C is the same. Its a no-brainer. You can wait? You shall win absolutely.
Hello, my name is Alex and i am from romania, is my first time when i am posting here, and what i see is unbeliveble. I have a request tho' if is possible, can anyone be more specific on the system of play, my english is not so good and i am not understanding properly from the 1 post. I will apreciate your kindness.
Thank you very much, Alex
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jun 18, 05:11 PM 2011
No I am playing four wide Vundarosa. You could even play this 3 wide. If you are playing against SIX FIVE POINTERS with one as your trigger. And play both HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN. You will get a better turnover. I would even say bring RED AND BLACK into this one then you get a very respectable turnover.
I believe if you were to bet against 8 FIVE POINTERS for a 125 unit risk. You have the most solid method ever. Even more solid than CODE 4. Random has limits that it struggles to go beyond. 8 FIVE POINTERS is such a limit. I know its always about the wait with you guys. PATTERN BREAKER should be a lot more popular than it is. But it takes anything from 30-80 spins to get a game. But it will NEVER PUT YOU IN NEGATIVE FIGURES. That is your reward for the wait.
MATRIX VERTICAL 5 E/C is the same. Its a no-brainer. You can wait? You shall win absolutely.
-------------------
JL,
Are you playing with a trigger or just betting every quad?!
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Jun 20, 06:35 PM 2011
-------------------
JL,
Are you playing with a trigger or just betting every quad?!
vundarosa
One trigger Vundarosa, then I bet there wont be SIX FIVE POINTERS using this progression 1,2,4,8,16=31 units risk. Ive now played 330 games and lost 3. Ive never met 7 or more.
Since i am an new member, can someone explain MV5 once again in steps, thanks! cheers
Playing this for real now...(as a companion to code4)
Playing all 3 EC against quads on a 4wide matrix with 1-2-4-8-16-32...63u risk.
Games played: 20
Losses:0
Profit:+ 234u
vundarosa
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 17, 02:39 PM 2011
I am starting this thread to save confusion with the other one which is for DOZENS AND COLUMNS. This IS FOR THE EVEN CHANCES..
THE RULES
1, RECORD SPINS IN A 4 WIDE MATRIX until you have a vertical column of 4 (QUAD) for an even chance EXAMPLE.
HLLL
LHLH
HLLL
LLLH-TRIGGER LOW COLUMN 3
LLHL--BET 1 WON HIGH ENDS RUN
2, We now bet that the quad won't become a FIVE POINTER. Using a 6 step progression 1,2,4,8,16,32=63 units risk.
3, We stop at a win and retrack until we have another even chance QUAD. I recommend 5 game sessions.
4, Under no circumstances play RNGS, Twisters sudden change in fortune in 24hrs deems them totally untrustworthy. This method is totally playable on LIVE WHEELS.
5, Most of the time your sessions will be a breeze. Especially if you enter the cycle at the right time.
My appologies to members for the false alarm yesterday. with MV6. Please concentrate on this thread. This is the ultimate way to play this method. Results update tomorrow
RESULTS UPDATE FOR MATRIX VERTICAL 5 FOR 11/7/11
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 420
TOTAL GAMES WON 417
TOTAL GAMES LOST 3
STRIKERATE 139/1
BALANCE 342 POINTS PLUS
LONGEST WINNING STREAK (CURRENT) 163 GAMES
I have decided the strikerate on this method is good enough to lose THE TRIGGER. And risk an extra step (1,2,4,8,16,32=63 units risk) so I go straight in now and bet against Any vertical quad that forms for HIGH LOW or ODD EVEN. For 5 singular games a day played randomly HIT AND RUN STYLE.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jul 11, 05:22 PM 2011
RESULTS UPDATE FOR MATRIX VERTICAL 5 FOR 11/7/11
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 420
TOTAL GAMES WON 417
TOTAL GAMES LOST 3
STRIKERATE 139/1
BALANCE 342 POINTS PLUS
LONGEST WINNING STREAK (CURRENT) 163 GAMES
I have decided the strikerate on this method is good enough to lose THE TRIGGER. And risk an extra step (1,2,4,8,16,32=63 units risk) so I go straight in now and bet against Any vertical quad that forms for HIGH LOW or ODD EVEN. For 5 singular games a day played randomly HIT AND RUN STYLE.
-----------------------
Yes it is, i play without a trigger too.
One thing John, if I have a col with
H
H
H
L (win)
L
L
x <---I usually don't bet here. I wait for a new trip to form on that col.
Can you check on you 3 lost sections if this would have made a difference or if it would change the outcome of your any of your won sections?
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Jul 12, 05:50 AM 2011
-----------------------
Yes it is, I play without a trigger too.
One thing John, if I have a col with
H
H
H
L (win)
L
L
x <---I usually don't bet here. I wait for a new trip to form on that col.
Can you check on you 3 lost sections if this would have made a difference or if it would change the outcome of your any of your won sections?
vundarosa
---------
dang! it seems you're playing against 5 pointers and i'm playing against quads
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Jul 12, 08:19 AM 2011
---------
dang! it seems you're playing against 5 pointers and i'm playing against quads
vundarosa
Yes Vundarosa. Yesterday was pretty amazing. Whenever I play a session. I record at least 100 spins. Last night there was FIVE QUADS before A FIVE POINTER FORMED. Had an easy days play without the wait for a trigger.
Interestingly there were no trips when random was in QUADVILLE. Im getting excited about the upcoming MV ZONE. It looks amazing. The number of VERTICAL FORMATIONS that come to rest bwtween 5-8 is staggering. It is my phoenix that will rise from the ashes of the white elephant that was MV6.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jul 12, 09:22 AM 2011
Yes Vundarosa. Yesterday was pretty amazing. Whenever I play a session. I record at least 100 spins. Last night there was FIVE QUADS before A FIVE POINTER FORMED. Had an easy days play without the wait for a trigger.
Interestingly there were no trips when random was in QUADVILLE. I'm getting excited about the upcoming MV ZONE. It looks amazing. The number of VERTICAL FORMATIONS that come to rest bwtween 5-8 is staggering. It is my phoenix that will rise from the ashes of the white elephant that was MV6.
--------------------
One other thing i've noticed is that when you have one EC forming vertical 7-11 your going to have one other doing the same with one more or one less vertical; say you have 9Hs there will be nearly at the same time a col with 6-10RBs or 6-10EOs...
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Jul 12, 09:49 AM 2011
--------------------
One other thing i've noticed is that when you have one EC forming vertical 7-11 your going to have one other doing the same with one more or one less vertical; say you have 9Hs there will be nearly at the same time a col with 6-10RBs or 6-10EOs...
vundarosa
I've seen 14 highs and a couple of 11s Vundarosa. But in comparison to how many 5-8s you get. Its nothing. Especially with my playing style. I can count over 40 between NINE POINTERS several times across my results. The AVERAGE STRIKERATE is looking to be somewhere between 25--30/1 And with 15 units required to cover a progression that's a GO for me.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jul 12, 10:24 AM 2011
I've seen 14 highs and a couple of 11s Vundarosa. But in comparison to how many 5-8s you get. Its nothing. Especially with my playing style. I can count over 40 between NINE POINTERS several times across my results. The AVERAGE STRIKERATE is looking to be somewhere between 25--30/1 And with 15 units required to cover a progression that's a GO for me.
-----------------
So, what you're thinking about is trying to outlive a vertical formation once it gets to 8 with a 1-2-4-8?!
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Jul 12, 10:44 AM 2011
-----------------
So, what you're thinking about is trying to outlive a vertical formation once it gets to 8 with a 1-2-4-8?!
vundarosa
No Vundarosa you never try to outlive random. Thats the BIGGEST MISTAKE in the history of this game. Im setting a ZONE, FIVE POINTER TO EIGHT POINTER. If a VERTICAL makes it past that ZONE. You let it go. But I already know for every one that makes it out of the MV ZONE. 25--30 wont. THATS THE METHOD in a nutshell...
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jul 12, 12:16 PM 2011
No Vundarosa you never try to outlive random. that's the BIGGEST MISTAKE in the history of this game. I'm setting a ZONE, FIVE POINTER TO EIGHT POINTER. If a VERTICAL makes it past that ZONE. You let it go. But I already know for every one that makes it out of the MV ZONE. 25--30 won't. that's THE METHOD in a nutshell...
---------
yes, that's more sensible...i never try to outlive a vertical formation. u might have (again)something great brewing here!
vundarosa
So john I'm getting a little confused with the lingo here.
HLLL
LHLH
HLLL
HHLH......
LLLH.........Now we bet here. if lose continue to bet H until we reach the 8th level? Example
LHLL...LOSE
HHLH...LOSE
LLHL..WIN...IF WE LOSE ON THIS 8 POINTER WE STOP?
Thanks.
CD
Quote from: clothdog on Jul 13, 09:09 AM 2011
So john I'm getting a little confused with the lingo here.
HLLL
LHLH
HLLL
HHLH......
LLLH.........Now we bet here. if lose continue to bet H until we reach the 8th level? Example
LHLL...LOSE
HHLH...LOSE
LLHL..WIN...IF WE LOSE ON THIS 8 POINTER WE STOP?
Thanks.
CD
--------------
Yep, that's pretty much how to play it. 1-2-4-8 total risk 15u
vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Jul 13, 09:37 AM 2011
--------------
Yep, that's pretty much how to play it. 1-2-4-8 total risk 15u
vundarosa
but that then doesnt make sense? Do you just carry on betting the same quad that is Low/High? and after 8units you stop?
I thought if you dont win on one you wait for the next quad to form and then bet 2u if lost you wait for the next quad and bet 4u?
Or do you just bet the same quad 4 times?
yes juiced, that is where I'm confused. Maybe vunda is playing different than JL. Also,
it sounds like JL who waited for 100 spins plus all the games he is playing and other methods he is using is in the casino for quite some time.
cd
Quote from: Juiced91 on Jul 13, 10:10 AM 2011
but that then doesn't make sense? Do you just carry on betting the same quad that is Low/High? and after 8units you stop?
I thought if you don't win on one you wait for the next quad to form and then bet 2u if lost you wait for the next quad and bet 4u?
Or do you just bet the same quad 4 times?
-------------------
Juiced,
You can play anyway that fits your style. I was playing against quads forming after a trip had formed (and was quite sucessfull with it). John was playing against 5 pointers. The initial progression was 1-2-4-8-16-(32)
Now JL pointed out that most groups that go over 5 pointers stay in the 5-8 pointers range. I looked at my records I saw this to be quite consistent with a group here and there going further than an 8 pointer. JL from his records found this to be 1 in about 25-30.....
So it made more sense to play against those since the BR requirement was much less and much easier to recoup...so its 1-2-4-8 total of 15u......for a fair enough strike rate if playing hit-and-run
vundarosa
Oh okay now makes sense. So you betting four times that the quad will either become a 5-8 pointer hence the Progession on the same coloumn.
Thanks
:girl_to:
Quote from: Juiced91 on Jul 13, 12:01 PM 2011
Oh okay now makes sense. So you betting four times that the quad will either become a 5-8 pointer hence the Progession on the same coloumn.
Thanks
-------------
no, betting that the 5 pointer formed will not go beyond an 8 pointer....
maybe worth a look how the other way around behaves...but the odds should be the same vundarosa
Quote from: vundarosa on Jul 13, 12:26 PM 2011
:girl_to:
-------------
no, betting that the 5 pointer formed will not go beyond an 8 pointer....
maybe worth a look how the other way around behaves...but the odds should be the same
vundarosa
Hi Guys I am really liking this, I played two 5 game sessions today between HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN. The breakdown of all 10 winners.
FIVE POINTERS (STEP 1 WINS) 5----LOW--LOW--ODD--EVEN--HIGH
SIX POINTERS (STEP 2 WINS) 4----HIGH--LOW--ODD--ODD
SEVEN POINTER (STEP 3 WIN) 1----EVEN
These 10 games took a total of 216 spins...
That looks goods JL. I keep playing this and pattern 5 and both are holding up brilliantly!
Quote from: LuckyLucy on Jul 13, 04:07 PM 2011
That looks goods JL. I keep playing this and pattern 5 and both are holding up brilliantly!
Pattern 5??? Do you mean PATTERN BREAKER. You must have lost a few by now Lucy. You're looking for an overall strike rate between 12/1----15/1.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jul 13, 03:50 PM 2011
Hi Guys I am really liking this, I played two 5 game sessions today between HIGH LOW and ODD EVEN. The breakdown of all 10 winners.
FIVE POINTERS (STEP 1 WINS) 5----LOW--LOW--ODD--EVEN--HIGH
SIX POINTERS (STEP 2 WINS) 4----HIGH--LOW--ODD--ODD
SEVEN POINTER (STEP 3 WIN) 1----EVEN
These 10 games took a total of 216 spins...
-------------
gr8 results...i'm playing the 3 ECs. They all seem to perform the same... John, in your records, did you see RB performing somehow differently than the other 2 ECs?
vundarosa
f
Quote from: vundarosa on Jul 14, 04:30 AM 2011
-------------
gr8 results...i'm playing the 3 ECs. They all seem to perform the same... John, in your records, did you see RB performing somehow differently than the other 2 ECs?
vundarosa
Yes Vundarosa, they take you to the edge a bit more. You will get more 7s and 8s. When I saw a 14 pointer it was RED. Ive never seen HIGH OR LOW, ODD OR EVEN go beyond 11. Be nice to parlay one of these 7 plus pointers. There is hardly a 100 spin sample without one. We need to become MATRIX VERTICAL READERS. Theres alot of gold in this mine.
lol, yes sorry JL I meant pattern breaker!
Quote from: LuckyLucy on Jul 14, 07:16 AM 2011
LoL, yes sorry JL I meant pattern breaker!
No problen Lucy please PM me your numbers. And are you tracking the breakdown of the seventh and eigth patterns? I'm seeing some very readable consistency here.
Quote from: Johnlegend on Jul 14, 08:48 AM 2011
No problen Lucy please PM me your numbers. And are you tracking the breakdown of the seventh and eigth patterns? I'm seeing some very readable consistency here.
JohnLegend, are you referring to watching until the 7th and 8th pattern are left and then forming a betting sequence for one win. If the 7th pattern lands bet that the 8th does not directly land after it..
Quote from: amk on Jul 14, 09:55 AM 2011
JohnLegend, are you referring to watching until the 7th and 8th pattern are left and then forming a betting sequence for one win. If the 7th pattern lands bet that the 8th does not directly land after it..nm
No Amk that is how wed play PATTERN BREAKER anyway. I'm talking about when you have PATTERN 7 and 8 left. There will be 1--4 oppurtunities to close each one.
By that I mean random will form the first two parts of one of the last two patterns up to 4 times before it closes it. It doesn't matter whether you reached the last two in 18 spins or 80. Random doesn't seem able to present you with the first two parts of PATTERN 7 or PATTERN 8 more than *4* TIMES before it has to close the door.
This is another virtual limit I think I've identified here. As XXVV said a while back the elastic forces are working to close that pattern. REFERRING TO PATTERN 8.
Well I believe theyre working to close pattern 7 too. And two is the number. Anymore and the effectiveness will be diluted. As you will have too many targets to pursue.
Now my interest is always directed toward identifying natural occurances that happen a lot more than they don't. I've just found another one that turns PATTERN BREAKER into a very affordable roulette killer.
I wont say Holy one just yet. But for a 15 unit investment. This is worth the wait. I will come back with some numbers on the weekend.
Just to wet the appetite I've counted 132 wins so far where your 15 unit risk is intact. If that doesn't get most at least curious. You are in the wrong game you really are.
Quote from: vundarosa on Jul 13, 12:26 PM 2011
no, betting that the 5 pointer formed will not go beyond an 8 pointer....
maybe worth a look how the other way around behaves...but the odds should be the same
vundarosa
Test on January 2010 data from table 7 (below) using progression 1, 2, 4 for a loss of -7 on H/L matrix (4 wide)
link:://:.westspiel.de/permanenz/Default.aspx (link:://:.westspiel.de/permanenz/Default.aspx)
Date Spins Hours Units
02-Jan 282 4.70 11
04-Jan 205 3.42 6
06-Jan 158 2.63 -3
07-Jan 247 4.12 9
10-Jan 133 2.22 11
11-Jan 264 4.40 7
12-Jan 290 4.83 -11
13-Jan 225 3.75 7
14-Jan 301 5.02 7
15-Jan 315 5.25 -9
16-Jan 233 3.88 -3
17-Jan 174 2.90 2
18-Jan 312 5.20 -4
19-Jan 306 5.10 -1
20-Jan 265 4.42 2
21-Jan 339 5.65 4
22-Jan 323 5.38 -1
23-Jan 339 5.65 0
24-Jan 244 4.07 4
25-Jan 331 5.52 -11
26-Jan 322 5.37 -5
29-Jan 240 4.00 -10
30-Jan 258 4.30 -11
Result = 1 unit after 6,106 spins or 101 hours of play!I take it this method doesn't work playing consecutively?
Quote from: Bettor 27 on Jul 17, 08:34 AM 2011
Test on January 2010 data from table 7 (below) using progression 1, 2, 4 for a loss of -7 on H/L matrix (4 wide)
link:://:.westspiel.de/permanenz/Default.aspx (link:://:.westspiel.de/permanenz/Default.aspx)
Date Spins Hours Units
02-Jan 282 4.70 11
04-Jan 205 3.42 6
06-Jan 158 2.63 -3
07-Jan 247 4.12 9
10-Jan 133 2.22 11
11-Jan 264 4.40 7
12-Jan 290 4.83 -11
13-Jan 225 3.75 7
14-Jan 301 5.02 7
15-Jan 315 5.25 -9
16-Jan 233 3.88 -3
17-Jan 174 2.90 2
18-Jan 312 5.20 -4
19-Jan 306 5.10 -1
20-Jan 265 4.42 2
21-Jan 339 5.65 4
22-Jan 323 5.38 -1
23-Jan 339 5.65 0
24-Jan 244 4.07 4
25-Jan 331 5.52 -11
26-Jan 322 5.37 -5
29-Jan 240 4.00 -10
30-Jan 258 4.30 -11
Result = 1 unit after 6,106 spins or 101 hours of play!
I take it this method doesn't work playing consecutively?
But its perfect for hit n run........... ;D
Hi Bettor27,
That is not the way you play MV5 for H/L...
You do not wait for a 5 pointer and bet that it will not form an 8-pointer!
Your results clearly show that it will not work.
A.
Quote from: viclimks on Jul 17, 11:26 AM 2011
But its perfect for hit n run........... ;D
Hello all Ive been working on something over the last four days I believe will overshadow ALL that came before.
Its my final method. And it has taken THE MATRIX to another level literally. The buy in is 8 units like Scoobies D&C. But the strikerate played hit and run is beyond that 8 unit risk by some margin. I will post up THE MATRIX SLIDE tomorrow. Its good very GOOD....
8 units!!
now your talking my language!!
Show me the money!!
Hope you'll post it soon JohnLegend :)
QuoteI believe will overshadow ALL that came before
QuoteI will post up THE MATRIX SLIDE tomorrow. Its good very GOOD
No dis-respect mate but, here we go again, hype, launch dates, where's that yawn smily when you need it. in your opinion ALL the methods you have launched have been the best thing since sliced bread, I like your enthusiasm but are you denouncing all past methods, or aren't you getting enough attention on your other threads, seems everyone is still searching, morphing after losses etc, you said the last one, that kept getting postponed, was the dogs dangly bits, it wasn't, it failed at the expected rate so morphing set in, now you have another, better than the last one that was already the best, Can't wait.
Again, no mallice or dis-respect intended at all, it's just getting a bit long in the tooth, my opinion only of course.
Hello Superman.......
I have to say that JohnLegends methods are very unique......
From all that I have seen they speak the clearest.....
With roulette everyone will have their personal favorites.......
JohnLegend is only trying his best and his results speak for themselves.....
Catch you later superman...... :)
Quote from: amk on Jul 20, 05:28 PM 2011
Hello Superman.......
I have to say that JohnLegends methods are very unique......
From all that I have seen they speak the clearest.....
With roulette everyone will have their personal favorites.......
JohnLegend is only trying his best and his results speak for themselves.....
Catch you later superman...... :)
They just do not deserve the hype as they are very primary in its fundaments...
Whats wrong with a little hype?
Just because a method is simple doesn't mean it is not good......
I for one am very thankful JohnLegend has taken the time to post his methods and answer questions.
CODE 4 would never have been without JohnLegends PATTERN 4.....
Why don't we hold off for a moment and not pass judgement yet for JL's new method....
All his methods, perhaps not MV6, have been great methods and his results speak for themselves...
JohnLegend has only contributed to this forum in a positive way and he has been very generous by sharing his knowledge which if applied correctly will yield winning results...
Alright guys, hope we can stay positive and look at the bright side of things.
Quote from: amk on Jul 21, 09:27 AM 2011
what's wrong with a little hype?
Just because a method is simple doesn't mean it is not good......
I for one am very thankful JohnLegend has taken the time to post his methods and answer questions.
CODE 4 would never have been without JohnLegends PATTERN 4.....
Why don't we hold off for a moment and not pass judgement yet for JL's new method....
All his methods, perhaps not MV6, have been great methods and his results speak for themselves...
JohnLegend has only contributed to this forum in a positive way and he has been very generous by sharing his knowledge which if applied correctly will yield winning results...
Alright guys, hope we can stay positive and look at the bright side of things.
[/quote).......u r right amk......total agree.
Quote from: amk on Jul 21, 09:27 AM 2011
what's wrong with a little hype?
Just because a method is simple doesn't mean it is not good......
I for one am very thankful JohnLegend has taken the time to post his methods and answer questions.
CODE 4 would never have been without JohnLegends PATTERN 4.....
Why don't we hold off for a moment and not pass judgement yet for JL's new method....
All his methods, perhaps not MV6, have been great methods and his results speak for themselves...
JohnLegend has only contributed to this forum in a positive way and he has been very generous by sharing his knowledge which if applied correctly will yield winning results...
Alright guys, hope we can stay positive and look at the bright side of things.
--------------
dito! :thumbsup:
vundarosa
Quote from: amk on Jul 21, 09:27 AM 2011
what's wrong with a little hype?
Just because a method is simple doesn't mean it is not good......
I for one am very thankful JohnLegend has taken the time to post his methods and answer questions.
CODE 4 would never have been without JohnLegends PATTERN 4.....
Why don't we hold off for a moment and not pass judgement yet for JL's new method....
All his methods, perhaps not MV6, have been great methods and his results speak for themselves...
JohnLegend has only contributed to this forum in a positive way and he has been very generous by sharing his knowledge which if applied correctly will yield winning results...
Alright guys, hope we can stay positive and look at the bright side of things.
Thanks for the positive comments Amk, that's all I've tried to do, is inspire others to look at different ways of taking on a game nobody is supposed to beat longterm.
THE MATRIX SLIDE is coming tonight. I think its very good. That doesn't mean PATTERN BREAKER, CODE 4 (UPDATE TONIGHT), MATRIX VERTICAL 5, DIVIDE & CONQUER, and PHASE 3 aren't good methods. THEY ARE! I profit daily from them.
What I strive to do is try and find methods that make consistent winning possible for newbies who don't have a lot of BANKROLL to throw around.
The balance is always TIME/INVINCIBILITY.
Amks CODE 4 is a masterpiece, I STILL haven't LOST. But I appreciate most cannot risk 80 units on a game. PATTERN BREAKER works, with only a 7 unit risk. So does DIVIDE AND CONQUER with an 8 unit risk.
But still you want more. As soon as a method falls on random.org or A bot. It is deemed worthless. When on the only medium that really matters, it may often be profittable.
THE MATRIX SLIDE is my last effort for certain. From here on I will only pop on the forum two or three times a week, to update the methods I play, and anwser any questions other members may have....
Its people like john who have helped breath new life into what was before old thinking
appreciated
ok i have been playing this now for a while and have lots of succes playing like this you wait for 2 trips that come after each other( no quads in the middle ) or 2 quads after each other and then bet like this
with the trips bet FOR a quad there need to be 6 trips in a row to beat me
with the quads bet for a 5 pointer there need to be 6 quads to beat me
playing like this you have several triggers speeds it up a little and still verry safe ;)
Quote from: Post on Jul 24, 05:20 PM 2011
ok I have been playing this now for a while and have lots of success playing like this you wait for 2 trips that come after each other( no quads in the middle ) or 2 quads after each other and then bet like this
with the trips bet FOR a quad there need to be 6 trips in a row to beat me
with the quads bet for a 5 pointer there need to be 6 quads to beat me
playing like this you have several triggers speeds it up a little and still verry safe ;)
Good work Post, I like the way you have stuck with this, that is the only way a player will ever move forward. The ideas a winner I see what you are saying everyday. RANDOM HAS LIMITS, FIND THEM THE GAMES BEATEN. Its not rocket science. But most players are fickle beings, they can't stay with anything long enough to realize its POWER.
There is now 6 methods on this forum that will beat roulette for ALLTIME. The problem is there are probably LESS players on this forum who wil ever have what it takes to realize this to their full potential. THE HUMAN FACTOR, always has been, and always will be the weak link in the chain...
Quote from: Post on Jul 24, 05:20 PM 2011
ok I have been playing this now for a while and have lots of success playing like this you wait for 2 trips that come after each other( no quads in the middle ) or 2 quads after each other and then bet like this
with the trips bet FOR a quad there need to be 6 trips in a row to beat me
with the quads bet for a 5 pointer there need to be 6 quads to beat me
playing like this you have several triggers speeds it up a little and still verry safe ;)
-------------------
hi Post, how many times have you lost your progression with this...i assume you're playing it with 1-2-4, 7points risk, no?! I used to play waiting for 5 trips or quads without a 5 pointer then betting for a 5 pointer but your way seems to be much safer...
vundarosa
welll i was playing 1-2-4-8 and i use a red marker and only indicate quads and trips to keep organized and to see whats happening and then wait for 2 quads or trips in a row and bet against 6 in a row if i win i just keep playing and ignore the winning formation and just stay at at hunting for the trigger ;)
:girl_to:
Quote from: Post on Jul 25, 05:16 AM 2011
welll I was playing 1-2-4-8 and I use a red marker and only indicate quads and trips to keep organized and to see what's happening and then wait for 2 quads or trips in a row and bet against 6 in a row if I win I just keep playing and ignore the winning formation and just stay at at hunting for the trigger ;)
--------------
@post say you have 2quads then a trip would you still wait for another quad then bet that it becomes a 5 pointer or would the trip after the 2 quads cancel/reset the game?
and how to you count the zero, a trip + zero or a quad +zero...does the zero cancel/reset the game?
vundarosa
then ignore everything else if you have a trigger 2 quads then wait for next quad and bet it becomes a 5 pointer the same for trips that become quads
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 17, 02:39 PM 2011
I am starting this thread to save confusion with the other one which is for DOZENS AND COLUMNS. This thread is dedicated to playing HIGH AND LOW. In a FOUR WIDE MATRIX.
THE RULES
1, Record spins four wide for hi and lo until there is a VERTICAL TREBLE of one of them example.
HLHL
LHLH
HLLL
LLLH-TRIGGER LOW COLUMN 3
HHHL-BET 1 won as didn't become a QUAD
LHLL
LLLL
HLLH-TRIGGER LOW COLUMN 3
LLLH-BET 1 LOST
LHHH-BET 2 WON as didn't become a 5 pointer.
2, We now bet that the trip won't become a FIVE POINTER. Using a multi level TWO STEP PROGRESSION. 1,2 LEVEL 1--4,8 LEVEL 2 Total risk 15 points. Play for *FIVE WINS MAX* a session.
3, If a double 5 pointer occurs you remain at level 2 for 3 games. The idea is TRIPS AND QUADS outnumber FIVE POINTERS enough to make this a go.
4, Under no circumstances play RNGS, Twisters sudden change in fortune in 24hrs deems them totally untrustworthy. This method is totally playable on LIVE WHEELS.
5, Most of the time your sessions will be a breeze. Especially if you enter the cycle at the right time and play for 3-5 wins MAX. WHY? I have already seen the pattern you get usually a maximum of FIVE TRIPS AND QUADS, before a FIVE POINTER occurs. Read what's going on.
And RESPOND TO IT. No skill in playing ROULETTE? of course there is, the skill is in reading what's gone before and reacting to it. If for example I trace the history bar and have FOUR TRIPS AND QUADS already sitting there. A FIVE POINTERS COMING SOON. This is the judgement that separates the real winners from the nearly men. That said this is my main method as of now. I will start posting my results in sets of 50 to show you how I get on.
this post makes no sense and why should it since you are in denial that roulette is a game of luck!
Quote from: qwerty on Jul 29, 10:33 AM 2011
this post makes no sense and why should it since you are in denial that roulette is a game of luck!
Theres no such thing as luck Qwerty, theres good methods and bad ones. Theres GOOD JUDGEMENT AND POOR JUDGEMENT.
I used to believe all that luck baloney when I ran with the pack years ago and played like a fool. OF COURSE, I LOST LIKE ONE TOO, THOUSANDS.
Since I learnt what it TAKES to be a winner in this game. I have never concluded a calendar week without a profit. that's over seven years now. LUCK doesn't EVEN ENTER THE EQUATION.
Its a feeble excuse employed by those who lack the most essential human attribute required to best the game. CAST IRON PATIENCE...
Quote from: qwerty on Jul 29, 06:46 PM 2011
how can you get a 5 pointer when you only write down 4 in a row? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? /
Because you record it 4 wide but a million deep.
HLHL
HHLL
HLHL
LLLL
LHLH
HHLL
LHHL
So you are looking for the 5 pointer going down Vertically. Hence the name matrix VERTICAL. Take the time to read the method before attacking members and posting NONSENSE!
Hey guys.........
Sometimes there are comments that we don't like........
We have to many GREAT methods to lets us get distracted..........
Carry on........
Quote from: amk on Jul 29, 07:33 PM 2011
Hey guys.........
Sometimes there are comments that we don't like........
We have to many GREAT methods to lets us get distracted..........
Carry on........
Completely agree with this statement.
DO not let the Direct action detractors, spoil these magnificent threads.
(signed....chrisbis, under new entrance conditions) :-X
:)
Quote from: Juiced91 on Jul 29, 06:54 PM 2011
Because you record it 4 wide but a million deep.
HLHL
HHLL
HLHL
LLLL
LHLH
HHLL
LHHL
So you are looking for the 5 pointer going down Vertically. Hence the name matrix VERTICAL. Take the time to read the method before attacking members and posting NONSENSE!
U r right......i think that guy or gal doesnt understand english ;D
Quote from: Juiced91 on Jul 29, 06:54 PM 2011
Because you record it 4 wide but a million deep.
HLHL
HHLL
HLHL
LLLL
LHLH
HHLL
LHHL
So you are looking for the 5 pointer going down Vertically. Hence the name matrix VERTICAL. Take the time to read the method before attacking members and posting NONSENSE!
are 5 pointers supposed to be rare or somthing cos i did this system before and i got an 8 pointer before along with a few 4's, and you tell me this isnt nonsense?
5 pointers are not rare mate butsix of them after each other is another world and the same with quads and trips ;)
this is a great method. I been using it to recover from a lose. I have few questions. So only e/o h/l are playble? Are there any other rare patterns that we can look for? Anyone saw a 8 or more pointers playing the 2 ecs?
got something to report guys, Just had a session from hell and pretty much got wiped out. Don't worry, its RNG but still, it CAN happen on live wheel as well. Was playing on Bet Voyager btw. Here are my recordings:
HLHH
LHHH
LHHH
HHLH
LHHH
HLHH
LHHH
LLLH
LHHH
HHHH
LLLH
HLHH
LLHL (Finally it stopped)
because I was so confident in the method, I was betting big. Oh well. I was experimenting so I listed that out in a three wide matrix to see if it would make any difference:
HLH
HLH
HHL
HHH
HHL
HLH
HHH
LHH
LHH
HLL
LHL
HHH
HHH
HLL
HHL
HHL
LHL
I'm not particularly good at maths, but does a wider matrix mean less chance of a long pointer building up? According to my record, it might be better to wait for a repeat in pattern in a 3 wide matrix and bet again that it won't repeat again. Not on HHH or LLL.
Quoteits RNG but still, it CAN happen on live wheel as well
Yes it can, when these matrix methods first came around I tested them against ALL types of random, RNG playtech, BV, and live wheel data, it/they ALL failed long term.
Now we will here all about hit n
hoperun again, that's after he tells you about the pitfalls of RNG lol. And there is still nobody else who can replicate his winning runs, makes you think doesn't it.
QuoteI'm not particularly good at maths, but does a wider matrix mean less chance of a long pointer building up? According to my record, it might be better to wait for a repeat in pattern in a 3 wide matrix and bet again that it won't repeat again. Not on HHH or LLL
As far as I am concerned there will be no difference, that inevitable bankroll cleaning run will happen.
Quote from: superman on Mar 27, 05:20 AM 2012
Yes it can, when these matrix methods first came around I tested them against ALL types of random, RNG playtech, BV, and live wheel data, it/they ALL failed long term.
Now we will here all about hit n hoperun again, that's after he tells you about the pitfalls of RNG LoL. And there is still nobody else who can replicate his winning runs, makes you think doesn't it.
As far as I am concerned there will be no difference, that inevitable bankroll cleaning run will happen.
I totally agree. Im tired of hearing about limits of random and how particular pattern can "confuse" it and degrees of patience required to play these systems.
I think they only appeal to rookie players here.
Regards
QuoteI think they only appeal to rookie players here
I wouldn't go as far as to say "rookie" players, but to those that are encouraged by hyped posts, we must remember as robeenhuut says, there are no limits to what can be spat out at any given time, we have debated hit n run and found no conclusion, what works for one person has not been reproduced by anyone else so far, that one person is very very lucky IF he has had the good run he has so far, we must remember, without calling anyone a liar, the results posted are just that, posted results, wether they are accurate or not we have no way of verifying.
I've been playing this on paddypower using £0.50 units with a progression of 1, 2, 4, 8 using a quad as a trigger and the last 3 nights have gone well
Wed - £10 BR and cashed out £18
Thu - £10 BR and cashed out £15
Fri tonight - £10 BR and cashed out £15
Can someone explain the 2 tier 2 step betting as I don't get it hence me reverting to a simple progressive bet.
Sat 15th - deposited £10 and cashed out £18.50 O0
This system has overtaken code4 for me as a bread and butter system for getting units. It is brilliant. Small enough bankroll needed yet you can grind out 10 units winnings before logging out in less than an hour.
For me it is 1 loss so far and as I've actually lost track of what I've won I can't give a 100% accurate but it is definitely over 90:1.
Given I play £0.50 units I'm up over £70(140 units) in the last fortnight already.
Cheers John L for showing me this and if I can just now get my head around 5 then I'll be the happiest boy about lol :wink:
QuoteCan someone explain the 2 tier 2 step betting
I 'think' they mean
bet 1,2,4,8 until you lose the full progression
then
2,4,8,16 until you get back ahead if you win/loss is good enough, 90/1 sounds good enough to me
Quote from: subby on Oct 05, 03:23 AM 2012
This system has overtaken code4 for me as a bread and butter system for getting units. It is brilliant. Small enough bankroll needed yet you can grind out 10 units winnings before logging out in less than an hour.
For me it is 1 loss so far and as I've actually lost track of what I've won I can't give a 100% accurate but it is definitely over 90:1.
Given I play £0.50 units I'm up over £70(140 units) in the last fortnight already.
Cheers John L for showing me this and if I can just now get my head around 5 then I'll be the happiest boy about LoL :wink:
You are welcome Subby. It was a joint effort this Matrix idea between Twister, Atlantis and myself. Its good and I'm glad you are findng it useful. Ask any questions you need to. To get a better understanding of FIVE. Because its on another level.
Quote from: Twisteruk on Apr 17, 03:02 PM 2011
Awesome JL :twisted:
I've been playing this most of the Day at PaddyPower :xd:
Maybe you could state your rule for Zero, so everyone knows what to do in that respect :thumbsup:
twister please explain to me in dummy form right from start to end this method..... plz i tried reading it twice thrice not even 0.01% i understood except that we are betting hi lo patterns...... plz be as helpfull as possible..... i am begenining to love this forum..... always trying new methods from here always staying ahead.....
Quote from: Johnlegend on Apr 18, 11:00 AM 2011
Right, never has a history bar been more USEFUL LoL!! You see the naysayers have always had the view Roulette is a game of no SKILL. I have never subscribed to that point of view. The skill is learning to read randoms behaviour as best we can. And the FOUR WIDE MATRIX makes it more readable than ever.
More than a few members on a forum should get hold of this. THIS IS VERY POWERFUL.
please john if you are reading this plz comment a detailed guide for dummies like me :question:..... not getting anything .....quad.... wide matrix...... all bouncing over my head :ooh:.... i know only one thing that you are betting high low after getting some pattern :thumbsup:..... but what that pattern is just not understanding even 0.01% of it :question: :( :embarrassed:.... plz be as detailed as possible..... plz waiting for reply......
ok I'll try
you pick either HIGH/LOW or EVEN/ODD or RED/BLACK as your "method"
I'll use high low as an example (using H for high and L for Low)
start recording the spins in 4 rows until you have something like this
H L H H - after 4 spins make a new line like so and record another 4 spins underneath the first 4
you should have something similar to
H L H H
L L L H - after 4 spins make a new line like so and record another 4 spins underneath the first two sets of 4
then again until you have a grid of 4 x4 something like so....like
H L H H
L L L H
H L H H
L L L L
^^^
What you are looking for is a line going down the grid with 4 of the same. You can see from my grid in the 2nd row down we have 4 Lows...this is our trigger to bet the next time we are due to put a spin there. We are betting AGAINST the 4 row becoming a row of 5 Lows
If we take the next spin and put it under row 1 we have something like this...
H L H H
L L L H
H L H H
L L L L
H
*AT THIS POINT WE BET HIGH* i.e. against the 4 sets of L's down becoming a 5 set of L's going down the grid
If it wins then great, mark it off as a win and keep tracking until you get another set of 4 H or L's going down the grid
If it DOESN'T win then I personally mark it with a "l" to indicate a loss and record more spins until it gets around again to the row of L's reading down the grid, we are now trying to bet that the 5 sets of L's doesn't become a 6 set down like so....
H L H H
L L L H
H L H H
L L L L
H Ll H L We bet 1 unit at the first try
H ^^^(bet here) We bet 2 units at the second try etc....
Betting sequence I use is 1, 2, 4, 8, 16 then stop
You might end up with something like
H L H H
L L L H
H L H H
L L L L
H Ll H L
H Ll L L
L Ll H L
H Hw ^^^ the Hw is me showing a High spin and therefore a win(w)
Also note now we have another betting chance on the 4th column where we have a trigger of another 4 L's reading down as shown by the ^^^ You can then start to bet again on it NOT becoming a set of 5 L's reading down the grid in the 4th column
And so on
I'd recommend you play about in practice mode and get happy with the bets then play with real money.
After you have mastered this you an then move on to recording for all 3 types of even money bets so you are updating 3 grids at the same time. Please be careful of losing track though as trying to keep 3 grids updated is tricky
HIGH/LOW grid
H L H H
L H H L
H L H L
H L H L
L L L H
H
EVEN/ODD grid
e o e o
o e e o
o e o e
o e o e
o
RED/BLACK grid
r b b b
r b r r
b b r r
b r b r
r r
etc....
Does that help?
Quote from: subby on Oct 07, 09:13 AM 2012
ok I'll try
you pick either HIGH/LOW or EVEN/ODD or RED/BLACK as your "method"
I'll use high low as an example (using H for high and L for Low)
start recording the spins in 4 rows until you have something like this
H L H H - after 4 spins make a new line like so and record another 4 spins underneath the first 4
you should have something similar to
H L H H
L L L H - after 4 spins make a new line like so and record another 4 spins underneath the first two sets of 4
then again until you have a grid of 4 x4 something like so....like
H L H H
L L L H - after 4 spins make a new line like so and record another 4 spins underneath the first two sets of 4
H L H H
L L L H
H L H H
L L L L
^^^
What you are looking for is a line going down the grid with 4 of the same. You can see from my grid in the 2nd row down we have 4 Lows...this is our trigger to bet the next time we are due to put a spin there. We are betting AGAINST the 4 row becoming a row of 5 Lows
If we take the next spin and put it under row 1 we have something like this...
H L H H
L L L H
H L H H
L L L L
H
*AT THIS POINT WE BET HIGH* i.e. against the 4 sets of L's down becoming a 5 set of L's going down the grid
If it wins then great, mark it off as a win and keep tracking until you get another set of 4 H or L's going down the grid
If it DOESN'T win then I personally mark it with a "l" to indicate a loss and record more spins until it gets around again to the row of L's reading down the grid, we are now trying to bet that the 5 sets of L's doesn't become a 6 set down like so....
H L H H
L L L H
H L H H
L L L L
H Ll H L We bet 1 unit at the first try
H ^^^(bet here) We bet 2 units at the second try etc....
Betting sequence I use is 1, 2, 4, 8, 16 then stop
You might end up with something like
H L H H
L L L H
H L H H
L L L L
H Ll H L
H Ll L L
L Ll H L
H Hw ^^^ the Hw is me showing a High spin and therefore a win(w)
Also note now we have another betting chance on the 4th column where we have a trigger of another 4 L's reading down as shown by the ^^^ You can then start to bet again on it NOT becoming a set of 5 L's reading down the grid in the 4th column
And so on
I'd recommend you play about in practice mode and get happy with the bets then play with real money.
After you have mastered this you an then move on to recording for all 3 types of even money bets so you are updating 3 grids at the same time. Please be careful of losing track though as trying to keep 3 grids updated is tricky
HIGH/LOW grid
H L H H
L H H L
H L H L
H L H L
L L L H
H
EVEN/ODD grid
e o e o
o e e o
o e o e
o e o e
o
RED/BLACK grid
r b b b
r b r r
b b r r
b r b r
r r
etc....
Does that help?
hi subby
i understood is fully.... you taught it like a professor man thanks alot "master of roulette"..... these days i am playing vile's rolling lines method wait for 4 uniques and then attack the last 3..... always in + till now..... i know someday some hell will drop on the wheel and go against me but i am prepared for this with a stop loss..... or pocket ur wins quickly aim for $10-$20 per day..... just my share...... when i first started 1 year ago playing roulette i used to play the suicide martingale on R/B always tanked and serious loss..... when i entered this forum i never knew roulette could actually played in so many ways like RANDOM vs RANDOM..... :twisted: love this forum..... thnx guyz
no worries :thumbsup:
hello.
ive read this thread from back to front multiple times. and the question of how to play zero is asked a few time. and sure i understand that you can cover zero through a betting progression that is fine. but what I would really like to know is how zero is tracked/recorded prior to the betting.
is zero just written down and tracked with in the grid?
count it as a high number?
or completely ignored?
thanks
Quote from: Bcboilermaker on Oct 28, 02:35 AM 2012
hello.
I've read this thread from back to front multiple times. and the question of how to play zero is asked a few time. and sure i understand that you can cover zero through a betting progression that is fine. but what I would really like to know is how zero is tracked/recorded prior to the betting.
is zero just written down and tracked with in the grid?
count it as a high number?
or completely ignored?
thanks
You accept the zero is part of the challenge and play on. If it makes up a quad that quad is VOID. But if it gives you a loss by coming in one of your betting steps. You accept it. All my methods are designed to survive and prospur in spite of the Zeros existence. Its never going to stop me winning overall.
Thanks John.
ok simpel question , anyone still playing this ? I know i am and have some real good profits to show for it . still the most succsesfull system on the forum for sure.
Yes I still play, and probably my best method too.
Although I wait for 5 before I play!
Nick
Quote from: KCIN012 on Feb 11, 10:10 AM 2014
Yes I still play, and probably my best method too.
Although I wait for 5 before I play!
Nick
live or RNG ? because i play live and if you have to wait for a 5 pointer you can wait whole night without betting at all ;D so i wait for 2 trip/ quads in a row and bet agains 6 of it forming after eacht other. progression 1-2-4-8
I play RNG
As you say live, you might not get a bet all night.
Nick
Quote from: KCIN012 on Feb 11, 02:39 PM 2014
I play RNG
As you say live, you might not get a bet all night.
Nick
thats why i bet AGAINST 5 pointers live ;)
Hi post, i got to reread this thread, but was wondering about ashwinsha his explanation on previous page 17. Could you please verify, it seems they were doing it wrong since not only they bet against a five pointer, but continue bettin against a six, seven, eight pointer and so on.
I thought after a five pointer miss, we need to track a quad again and bet against a five pointer a second time in progression and so on, hoping for a first win after a quad has formed.
Could you confirm or correct me?
Thanks,
Bob
Quote from: KCIN012 on Feb 11, 02:39 PM 2014
I play RNG
As you say live, you might not get a bet all night.
Nick
--Not only all night but the next night also.....Ridiculous kind of method...unless you have
a method that you could win night session playing each spin then you have no chance playing it in casino.RNG ?????better give to the charity.....
My honest opinion, I am not to sold on this method.
Reason being, it is a martingale progression. 1,3,9,27.
Martingale's give an illusion of winning. 99% of the time you win small, but that 1% loss will eliminate all your wins and more...
To add more illusion to this effect, you only get to bet so rarely and its encouraged to play this method live (like someone said you could sit for 200 spins and not even bet once). Give a noob gambler a martingale system which makes you place a bet every spin. Even then, he could go on winning for days, or weeks before hitting the bad streak. Give someone this matrix martingale system where you only bet once or twice every day, and the "winnings" could stretch for months or even years before the bad streak hits you...Notice, your "winnings" a year doesn't mean anything, what matters more is the bet frequency.
Five 5 pointers in this case would mean a dozen appearing 5 times in a row before you lose the progression. this happens (1/3)^5 which is 1/243 times.
So yes, if you play this method every day and place a bet once every day, you will "win" all the days until the 243rd day when your progression goes bust. Of course, 243rd day is the mathematical expectation if you bet once a day. But you could bust on the first day or go bust on the 1000th day, you never know.
Just my honest opinion, I know there are supporters of this method but im just speaking my mind don't bash me too hard... :wink:
I won't bash you at all. I argued the same points with John Legend and he told me he'd show me how to put my Grandson through college! Don't get me wrong--I like John, but all his "hit and run" and wait "darn near forever" is just a lot of hooey.
I played his Code Something or Some Number for a few days and it lost. As I told the group, I would pay to have the darn thing botted because I've got better things to do that sit for an hour waiting to lose.
Just my opinion. Anyone disagree, let's bot the son-of-a-gun and see!!
Sam
Quote from: TwoCatSam on Feb 16, 01:03 PM 2014
I won't bash you at all. I argued the same points with John Legend and he told me he'd show me how to put my Grandson through college! Don't get me wrong--I like John, but all his "hit and run" and wait "darn near forever" is just a lot of hooey.
I played his Code Something or Some Number for a few days and it lost. As I told the group, I would pay to have the darn thing botted because I've got better things to do that sit for an hour waiting to lose.
Just my opinion. Anyone disagree, let's bot the son-of-a-gun and see!!
Sam
Sam, I don't want to sit and read. Can you brief this method/system.
I will code it out for bet voyager.
Azim
I will tell you with brevity..............
This is a "triad" as I call it: HLH For each EC there are eight possible triads. For H/L they are:
HLH
HLL
HHH
HHL
LLH
LLL
LHL
LHH
Those are in no particular order as they don't need to be.
The system: Begin tracking triads. Each triad that is an exact repeat of one that has already occurred is a non-event. Scratch through it and move on. When you have seven of the eight unique triads, you bet the eighth will NOT appear.
Example:
HLH
HLL
HHH
HHL
LLH
LLL
LHL............the last triad in my above example is missing: LHH Your bet is then for HLL to appear in three bets. You bet a martingale: 1 2 4. In the rare event you lose, you just chalk up the loss and move on.
John allowed as how you would always have a win rate that was more than the 7 you occasionally lost. He claimed a loss of about 1 in 10, giving you a three-unit profit for that run.
See how incredibly slow this could be EVEN if you did win 3 for every 10??
Unclear? Just ask...
Sam
An aside: Ophis included this in his MST tracker and one can see it does play very evenly; perhaps more so than anything I've seen. No big swings one way or the other. That was my finding; you may find different.
Thanks Sam,
HHH
HHL
HLH
HLL
LLL
LLH
LHL
LHH
What if I have
HLH
HLL
HLH <- Repeat
Can I do this ignore the repeat and spins before it?
HLL
HLH
LLL
HHH
HHL
LLH
LLL <-Repeat
Wait for next spin to track
HLH
HLL
HLH <- Repeat
Strike it out! It did not happen. Move on.
By the way............
I know this is not what was posted in the original by JL. This is what I tested myself. This is what I would faint if worked. John says "hit and run" makes it work and he advances a good case for it. I still think about it a lot.
Sam
I play this method quite often
in a 4 wide matrix
Only on hi-lo, and wait for 5 vertical matches
then bet against it becoming 6. and only up to 5 steps marty.
HLLH
LLHH
HLHL
LLHL
HLLH
L.................BET HERE 5 STEPS
But only play for =+5 units then stop
And play again after a break..
And there you have it........
It could be horizontal, vertical or even diagonal. It does not matter. Yes, it's rare to see these things lose, but like it has been pointed out above, when they do lose, they lose it all and then some.
I have to see it work to believe it.
Sm
I did the 2 cat shuffle with all of Legends stuff.
John was weak on progression...which is a bummer when all your ideas may of been much better if you just wernt so weak on progression.
I didnt see any logic in the bet selections either. They were just plastic leather or fake fur.....looked real from a distance...but when you get up close...you realise its an illusion.
Quote from: Turner on Feb 19, 01:26 PM 2014
I did the 2 cat shuffle with all of Legends stuff.
John was weak on progression...which is a bummer when all your ideas may of been much better if you just wernt so weak on progression.
I didn't see any logic in the bet selections either. They were just plastic leather or fake fur.....looked real from a distance...but when you get up close...you realise its an illusion.
:ooh: In other words you saying this is a waste of time!!!! :question:
:sad2: Every system/method is a waste of time. In the long run. :yawn:
Yes....over complex and deadly boring
So, Azim, will you code it anyway?
Quote from: Azim on Feb 19, 01:40 PM 2014
:ooh: In other words you saying this is a waste of time!!!! :question:
:sad2: Every system/method is a waste of time. In the long run. :yawn:
Does that mean you have given up on the GUT Azim ?
O0
Would be great if you could code it Azim
With the option to change from say 4 down then bet, and 5 down then bet, or even up to 6 down
Before betting.
In a 4 wide matrix.
Nickx
Quote from: TwoCatSam on Feb 19, 02:36 PM 2014
So, Azim, will you code it anyway?
Yes Sam. I will code this.. Just trying to make it dynamic if someone wants to try 3 , 4 or 5 or 10, be it either vertical, horizontal or both.
Their choice.
Quote from: ddarko on Feb 19, 02:46 PM 2014
Does that mean you have given up on the GUT Azim ?
O0
I will never give up on GUT. GUT is where my mouth and money go. It is the system/method that will consistently win, no luck required, if you can master it. If you are down, it is a grind to make it back to even or make a profit. It does come back. It's flat bet so no major impact on bankroll.
I am currently on a hunt for an even chance bet that I can make the bot play while waiting for GUT numbers. In order to avoid been disconnected due to inactivity. This or the stupid Invisible method might do the trick.
The reason why I say the invisible, I can download fresh data from random.org and use it to play. Make it very real dynamic, win 3-4 and change the look up numbers.(I also don't have to use the dozens, I can pattern match even/odd, high/low or red/black. Play against it or play for it to form the way i have it in file, less bankroll with even chance).
I am hoping you know what I mean.
@ Azim
ok, that's fair enough :thumbsup:
The only reason I asked was because that quote I posted in my previous reply implied that you may have "given up the chase" period.
Glad to see you are flat betting 8) the best Money Management ANYBODY could play IMHO
O0
Play PB after a virtual loss Azim, or as JL used to say make your next 3 step progession count after a loss.
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 5,500
TOTAL GAMES WON 5,013
TOTAL GAMES LOST 487
STRIKERATE APPROX 10/1
BALANCE 5,237 POINTS PLUS
DOUBLE LOSSES 5
Remember we discussed this way back Sam? I can't find the thread though, would be interesting to see again.
AMK
Yes, I recall.
Now, let me ask a couple of questions. There are so many of these matrix ideas floating about, I get confused. Are we talking about the following, as I posted to Azim:
Azim
I will tell you with brevity..............
This is a "triad" as I call it: HLH For each EC there are eight possible triads. For H/L they are:
HLH
HLL
HHH
HHL
LLH
LLL
LHL
LHH
Those are in no particular order as they don't need to be.
The system: Begin tracking triads. Each triad that is an exact repeat of one that has already occurred is a non-event. Scratch through it and move on. When you have seven of the eight unique triads, you bet the eighth will NOT appear.
Example:
HLH
HLL
HHH
HHL
LLH
LLL
LHL............the last triad in my above example is missing: LHH Your bet is then for HLL to appear in three bets. You bet a martingale: 1 2 4. In the rare event you lose, you just chalk up the loss and move on.
John allowed as how you would always have a win rate that was more than the 7 you occasionally lost. He claimed a loss of about 1 in 10, giving you a three-unit profit for that run.
See how incredibly slow this could be EVEN if you did win 3 for every 10??
Unclear? Just ask...
If that is the correct one, are you saying to skip the first possible bet and then do what? Bet three times? One of them would be directly below where you skipped:
HLH
XHL
?
Sam
Quote from: amk on Feb 19, 05:18 PM 2014
Play PB after a virtual loss Azim, or as JL used to say make your next 3 step progession count after a loss.
TOTAL GAMES PLAYED 5,500
TOTAL GAMES WON 5,013
TOTAL GAMES LOST 487
STRIKERATE APPROX 10/1
BALANCE 5,237 POINTS PLUS
DOUBLE LOSSES 5
Remember we discussed this way back Sam? I can't find the thread though, would be interesting to see again.
ok let me get this right...
I will start with vertical -> the options will be minimum 3 Columns to as many as you want.
I am taking 4 Column example and trigger count of 3 or 4 for this example(it will be left as 1 option of either 3 to as many as you want to wait for your trigger.
LHLH
HLLH
HHLL<- for those that want 3 as a trigger here is 3 in column 3.
LLLL<- for those that want 4 as a trigger here is 4 in column 3. Playing 3 your first loss.
LLHL <- fot hose waiting for 5 and more missed i have to re count, 3 and 4 win.
Is this correct for vertical?
For horizontal, I have to create all the possible combinations.
When the last one is missing in the spin sequence, that will be the trigger?
I can already see people using horizontal will be waiting for hours before they can place a bet..
:question: Is that what everyone want's or forget the horizontal?
Hello Sam,
Based on JLs live stats, which I believe to be honest, the rare event of a double loss should be acknowledged.
You have the concept right Sam.
After 7 patterns have appeared (including repeats) we bet against the 8th missing/unhit pattern to land directly.
Granted, all methods will fail "longterm"
However, my feeling is that the double loss win to loss average can be consistent in PB "longterm".
Either way, double losses are rare. JL exploited the double loss factor and was able to generate +5000 units with only a 10/1 strikerate.
I dont think JL made these stats up. He played (plays?) his hit and run and records (recorded) the results.
I am referring to PATTERN BREAKER Azim.
Which can be played with a bot live online, or you could pay some one to play for you in a real casino : )
Quote from: amk on Feb 19, 06:28 PM 2014
I am referring to PATTERN BREAKER Azim.
Which can be played with a bot live online, or you could pay some one to play for you in a real casino : )
Ok. Sam,
8 patterns.
They can be in any order as long as I have any 7 in any order within spin count of 7 for it to be considered as a trigger, am i right?
You have 8 patterns Azim
1 HHH
2 HHL
3 etc.
4
5
6
7
8
Cross them off one by one until one is left.
Azim
Not within seven spins, no. It can take 50 or more to find the missing triad. That was the problem I had with it; I would not live long enough to test it! Don't know how else to explain it.
AMK
Are you saying bet for the missing triad and if you lose all three bets, immediately bet for it again? A six step Marty? 1 2 4 8 16 32?
Sam
Quote from: amk on Feb 19, 07:04 PM 2014
You have 8 patterns Azim
1 HHH
2 HHL
3 etc.
4
5
6
7
8
Cross them off one by one until one is left.
Ok. I think I got it.. Keep tracking them as long as at the end of 20th spin there is 1 left. That becomes the trigger?
Excuse me for asking but why has the "Matrix Vertical 5" thread
Changed to "Pattern Breaker"
Im sure any new members looking,wont have a clue whats going on.
Nick x
Azim
Ok. I think I got it.. Keep tracking them as long as at the end of 20th spin there is 1 left. That becomes the trigger?
Somehow, what I'm saying is getting lost in cyberspace! There is no limit on spins. You could get a trigger in a minimum of 21 spins (3 x 7) or a hundred or more.
Let me try again:
HLH
HLH
HHL
HHH
HHL
HHL
LLH
LLL
LLL
LHL
LHL
Look at the above seven triads. One is missing; the one below.
LHH
Look at the red ones. They are ones that repeated. You will see this a lot and that is why it takes so long. In the above example, you would bet for LHH NOT to appear. Your bet would be HLL. If LHH does appear on the final three spins, you have a perfect set of 8 triads, all that are possible. JL says that is very, very rare. No, it isn't.
KC
Sorry, ol' Bean. I did that. It makes no difference as there are a dozen variations of John's work. All ask you to do basically the same thing: Wait until a matrix nearly forms and then bet that it won't. Same as waiting for four reds and betting a fifty won't appear.
Sam
Quote from: TwoCatSam on Feb 20, 10:01 AM 2014
Azim
Ok. I think I got it.. Keep tracking them as long as at the end of 20th spin there is 1 left. That becomes the trigger?
Somehow, what I'm saying is getting lost in cyberspace! There is no limit on spins. You could get a trigger in a minimum of 21 spins (3 x 7) or a hundred or more.
Let me try again:
HLH
HLH
HHL
HHH
HHL
HHL
LLH
LLL
LLL
LHL
LHL
Look at the above seven triads. One is missing; the one below.
LHH
Look at the red ones. They are ones that repeated. You will see this a lot and that is why it takes so long. In the above example, you would bet for LHH NOT to appear. Your bet would be HLL. If LHH does appear on the final three spins, you have a perfect set of 8 triads, all that are possible. JL says that is very, very rare. No, it isn't.
KC
Sorry, ol' Bean. I did that. It makes no difference as there are a dozen variations of John's work. All ask you to do basically the same thing: Wait until a matrix nearly forms and then bet that it won't. Same as waiting for four reds and betting a fifty won't appear.
Sam
Ok.. I got it. I will have the tracker for you all
Here is the tracker for the Pattern Breaker.
Load the file using the button.
Step will take you one spin at a time.
Run will do a match on all 7 patterns when 1 is left it will tell you which one to bet on.
Click on step to check your numbers. Once you happy click run again and it will stop once 7 patterns are found.
This is just a tracker to check the method/system.
Good luck to you all.
By the way.. if i have LL0(zero) I am ignoring it. As a matter of fact any pattern with 0 is being ignored.
Azim
I have a file of 10,000+ spins on my desktop. I loaded them and began testing. As I expected, the win/loss rate prevents any profits from accruing.
As I also said, this thing plays very evenly. Seems there are no wild downward spirals. I plan to do a manual test of the whole 10,000+ and see what kind of outside progression could be applied to create a CWB. A profitable excursion through the Land of Random. Maybe we can beat the one-eyed monster together.
Thanks for your work.
TwoCat
Would it not make sense to track all three e/c's if you are playing pattern breaker.
The actual bet is a 7/1 chance meaning you will get long absences and then a flurry of the missing patterns hitting one after the other. So why not track all three e/c's and play the one where the missing pattern has went AWOL the longest.
I have seen 5 successive hits of the missing pattern on a few occasions during my testing. But I have also seen long runs (25+) of absence. A six line can go missing for 20+ and that's only a 5/1 payout so it stands to reason a 7/1 chance can go on a long run without appearing.
Tracking all three e/c's and sticking to betting against the pattern with the longest absence would allow you to catch that long run. It's especially important if you are trying to recover from some losses.
Bob the Ugly
I've give a lot of thought to your last post. Please excuse me if this sounds blunt.
Basically, what you are saying is that if one EC by itself won't work, three will--or at least, have a better chance of working. That's like saying Sam can't fly the plane, but find a couple of numb nuts like Sam and the three of them can. Nope! Not gettin' on the plane!
I do think there is a possibility that this method reduces volatility and that's all we need.
Sam
Quote from: TwoCatSam on Feb 21, 12:22 PM 2014
Basically, what you are saying is that if one EC by itself won't work, three will--or at least, have a better chance of working.
Sam, that's not the point I was trying to make.
What I am saying is that the variance of the wins will differ between long spells and short spells.
So it makes sense (to me at least) to ride with the longest winning run until it stops.
I will make up a sheet and show you what I mean. Maybe I didn't explain it the way I was intending for it to come out.
cheers
8 3 3
2 6 4
5 4 2
7 5 6
1 2 8
7 7 7
4 1 2
1 2 5
1 5 8
8 4 2
8 6 3
4 1 4
6 4 5 (3 column1)
5 5 1
4 4 4
4 7 3
1 1 1
1 7 2
4 4 6
1 8 5
4 5 6
1 4 5
7 4 2
2 7 2
3 8 7 (3 in column 1..run of 12) (8 column1)
3 4 2
8 1 8 (8 in column 1..run of 2) (6 column1)
5 3 4
1 7 6
6 5 4 (6 in column 1..run of 3)
I downloaded these numbers ranging from 1-8 from random.org
The 1-8 represents the 8 patterns. RRR..RRB..RBB..RBR..BBB..BBR..BRR..BRB.
You can see that the 3 (RBB) is the first missing pattern in column 1. So you bet BRR.
You would win 11 bets before the 3 (RBB) appears. Now the new missing pattern is the 8 (BRB)
You would only win 1 bet before the 8 (BRB) appears. Now the missing pattern is the 6 (BBR)
You would only win 2 bets before the 6 (BBR) appears.
So the 'skips' in column 1 are 12, 2, 3.
So you would have won/lost +4, -6, -5.
Some of the columns will produce short skips like 2 and 3 above in clusters.
Other columns will produce clusters of longer skips. It's just the way variance works.
So my suggestion is to track all three columns and just play the one producing the longest skips at the time.
Of course there are no guarantees. But I tested this Pattern Breaker idea many years ago and you will get eaten alive by the column that is producing short skips. Tracking all three gives you a better chance to win in my opinion.
cheers
Sam
Looking at your Triad idea in conjunction with Ugly Bob's 3 EC's ....
You play each EC in rotation. So 1 bet would be R/B the following bet would be E/O and the next bet H/L...
All clear so far ?
Keeping track of the Triads like UB tracks them ... So when it's the R/B bet you look at column 1 and check what the first and second outcomes of the current Triad is and bet FOR or AGAINST the third outcome.
Looking at the columns I noticed that they're pretty much 50/50 whether you play for or against the outcome. ( For being SAL and against being DFL ).
But there is always that column that has the out of sync effect in it and if you follow the higher outcome for that column ( and every column for that matter ) would you not get better results on your bets.
I know this sounds confusing...but it's really all clear in my head .... :lol: :o
Need a better explanation ... just ask and I'll try to cough one up.
B
Sam
Been tracking my above method manually on only 1 EC .... Gets complicated to track and follow on one EC so on all three EC ... WHEW !!!
But just with the one EC using a 1,2,4 progression in case of a loss, and betting only on every third spin to complete the Triad ... I use a last three decision to determine whether I go FOR or AGAINST the Triad.
Things are looking VERY interesting.
Keep ya posted
B
:thumbsup:
Sample manual session:
108 Spins -36 Virtual Spins
Bet on 72 spins ( 5 Zeros included )
Using 1,2,4,8,16
+ 38 units
:thumbsup:
B
Gentlemen
I am a bit of a stickler for testing a thing just the way the author wrote it. I spoke with John at length about this and I feel I know what he thought the system would do.
I have a personal belief--voodoo aside; that is a different world--that spins are independent events in the universe. Waiting for 7 triads to form and betting the eighth is no different that just jumping in and betting any EC you choose.
Let me paraphrase THE EAGLES:
Well, I'm-a runnin' down the road tryin' to loosen my load....
I got fifty systems on my mind....
I am going to work with this idea using Azim's program. Shame if he wrote it and no one used it. I will see if, in 10,000+ spins, I can see the consistency I need.
Later.......
Sam
Quote from: TwoCatSam on Feb 21, 08:50 PM 2014
Gentlemen
I am a bit of a stickler for testing a thing just the way the author wrote it. I spoke with John at length about this and I feel I know what he thought the system would do.
I have a personal belief--voodoo aside; that is a different world--that spins are independent events in the universe. Waiting for 7 triads to form and betting the eighth is no different that just jumping in and betting any EC you choose.
Let me paraphrase THE EAGLES:
Well, I'm-a runnin' down the road trying' to loosen my load....
I got fifty systems on my mind....
I am going to work with this idea using Azim's program. Shame if he wrote it and no one used it. I will see if, in 10,000+ spins, I can see the consistency I need.
Later.......
Sam
"TwoCatSam" possibly the most valuable member of this forum!
Quote from: Nathanael on Feb 21, 10:30 PM 2014
"TwoCatSam" possibly the most valuable member of this forum!
Amen to that
Quote from: Nathanael on Feb 21, 10:30 PM 2014
"TwoCatSam" possibly the most valuable member of this forum!
I totally agree with this.
Hi guys,
Long time no see. Ive been busy with work.
This Pattern Breaker shows a negative trend.
HHH
HHL
HLH
LHH
LHL
LLL
HLL
LLH
wait until all the combinations appear
then bet opposite of the un shown combination
Simulated on random numbers
System fails big time.
See for yourself. (press f5 or insert your numbers in the left column.
FREE TRACKER AS ALWAYS
Regards
Alex
Tracker
Could someone explain me the merit of this system/method?
I mean why is it harder for this event to occure than any other event?
Asextos
We are trying to determine that right now. Stay tuned.
OK, here is the study on my 10,000+. As you can see, it won on that trot---no guarantee that will continue on the next one.
I will study it more.
Sam
Good results then Sam
Played "Hit and Run" for 5+ units
You may have missed those nasty Red Ls.
Also if after a loss you bet 2,4,8 at the next betting opportunity would have been another +20 units up
as there were no double losses.
Nick
KC
You're right.
I am having Nick write a sheet for this so I can test it thouroughly. It will be a week or so before I report.
Sam
2 many awesome posts.
What are the opinions on the double loss ratio?.....
amk
Due you your work and the tracker by Azim, I have decided to put this to the ultimate test. I am having Nick write the sheet so I can test it several ways: vanilla and several flavors!!
So we will learn what we learn. There will be no fudging like John did. We will stick to the program until an outcome is decided.
Sam
Quote from: TwoCatSam on Feb 21, 08:50 PM 2014
Waiting for 7 triads to form and betting the eighth is no different that just jumping in and betting any EC you choose.
There are two kind of players. Some believe it absolutely doesn't matter where you place your bet, because the next outcome will always be 50/50. And some believe that the more reds you see in a row, the better chance you have to hit a black. I understand that random has no memory and it can do anything, but it won't. You can have a billion spins, and I'm sure you will never ever see 40-50 of the same EC in a row. Most people won't even see 30 in their lifetime, and rarely over 20.
"""Waiting for 7 triads to form and betting the eighth is no different that just jumping in and betting any EC you choose."""
In fact this is my opinion too.
And this is why I asked above , what is the merit of this system.
In my opinion , if there exists something that can win more and lose less , then it must have a reason.
a and A
You guys don't know me, I guess. I do things that I enjoy. Not looking to get rich. If I find something that interests me, I'll spend a little time and money to check it out.
This JL thing has been kicking around--in one form or another--for years. It has legs. Hundreds of systems are posted and are never heard from in a week. This makes me curious.
So I will investigate!! No harm in looking under the rock.
Sam
OK, first look under the rock...........
Nick finished the sheet perfectly the first time. I have checked the sheet for accuracy and it is good.
I have run it many ways. Here is a shot of the bot face with the sheet running like this: 1 2 4 and no recovery.
More later...
Sam
Alright, I have changed the settings. I am not going up win on a win OR a loss and cutting off when even or ahead. Note the good results.
Quote from: ati on Feb 23, 04:21 AM 2014
There are two kind of players. Some believe it absolutely doesn't matter where you place your bet, because the next outcome will always be 50/50. And some believe that the more reds you see in a row, the better chance you have to hit a black.
And then there is me...on the outside looking in again
Who would go with the unclassified play of... wait for the first black to hit after that long run of reds and then bet red once...and then go black for a series of spins either flat or with a very mild progression under the assumption that the universe wants to balance things out and hopefully it will do it in the next x amount of spins while I have money riding on that premise.
OK, this has really hit the wall. Lost 100 two times in a row and that's enough for me. Will try different settings.
Quote from: TwoCatSam on Feb 25, 09:23 PM 2014
OK, this has really hit the wall. Lost 100 two times in a row and that's enough for me. Will try different settings.
Sam,
if LHL is missing.
Are you betting LHL or HLH for the next 3 spins? using 1,2,4?
Azim
The bot bets against the unhitted triad. If it's LLL, the bot bets HHH.
Nick sent me an "open" sheet where I could monitor the bets and it is betting according to J L.
Sam
By the by......I'd love to see this work. Will keep trying.
Quote from: TwoCatSam on Feb 25, 10:25 PM 2014
Azim
The bot bets against the unhitted triad. If it's LLL, the bot bets HHH.
Nick sent me an "open" sheet where I could monitor the bets and it is betting according to J L.
Sam
By the by......I'd love to see this work. Will keep trying.
Sam,
The bot is betting 3 spins to get HHH using 1,2,4?
Sam,
You should test with the double loss stat....
If after two tests consisting of 500 triggers each (a loss on PB) you do not have a strikerate of around 50/1 then the double loss stat is not stable "longterm".
Azim
Yes. Whatever triad is missing, the bot bets it won't hit. If LLL is missing, bot bets HHH.
Amk
I am trying to do that, but it must be done manually and it's hard to do. I cannot set the bot to record whether or not there were two losses in a row. Working on it........
Sam
UPDATE
The 100,000 is in the can and there are 2,795 trots. This is going to take some some!! I must look at each manually. What I will do is write like this:
6
L
3
L
5
L
L
The numbers are wins between Ls and the multiple Ls are Ls in a row before a win. I did a check on 10,000 spins and it seems that it does NOT lose two in a row as often as it should.
Where have I heard that: It should lose more often, but it doesn't.
Sam
Hi Sam
Anymore updates on this? Is the testing still holding up.
Regards Nick
Nick
I have run hundreds of thousands of spins. I cannot get a profit, no matter what I do.
Sam
Thanks for the testing Sam
So maybe hit and run as your first paper test showed
With "luck"! and we all need that,if its on our side
we may win
What were your stats Sam?
How many double losses?
How many wins?
Thanks Sam.
amk
I only did a few thousand spins as I could see exactly where it was going. There were 7 double losses. There were three in a low. There were only 12 single loses before a double loss. Nothing close to what John predicted.
Sorry.........
Sam
Where there less then 49 single losses Sam? 7 x 7 = -49
Then the average says you should have tested around 350 sessions of PB. 49 x 7 = -343
Can you see how many sessions you tested?
amk
There is a slim possibility I did the last study wrong. I am going to run another 100,000 spins and do a quick check. I think I have found a way to cut and paste them into the forum so you can see for yourself.
Back as soon as possible.
Sam
amk
Here are over 45,000 spins. This is set with a progression of 1 2 4 and stop. In those spins, the bot lost 67 cents. So it plays very evenly.
When you open the .rar file. the top session should be the newest. If not, simply re-orgainze with the heading above.
You can see how many two in arow losses occur.
Sam
Consider this: You lose the first try; you are down 7 units. Let's be bold and raise our bet to 8 16 32. Will win back our seven plus one.
What if we lose two in a row? 7+8+16+32=65. If you lost two in a row, you would have to win 65 in a row to break even. Not one more loss during that 65 spin trot. In my searches through the file, you just don't find a 65 win trot before the loss--with enough frequency to show a profit.
I'm pressed for time and can't do any more at this time. If anyone is interested, tell me the settings you want for the bot and I'll set it over night.
Sam
Here is the way I'm going to set the bot for the next 100,000 spins. On each loss, the bet increases by 7. It does not go back to one until a new high is reached.
Sam
That does not work at all. Down over $500.00 playing pennies.
Hey Sam,
I cant figure out too much info from your file concerning the single and double losses. Would you mind showing how many single and double losses, if you can see them, as I cant figure out how to.
Its a shame you cant get the bot to only play after a single loss.
A single loss would be the trigger.
In order for this to fail longterm it would mean that a double loss happens once every 7 single losses. This would be the same as a single loss happening every 7 games which all stat tests show to be the case.
My feeling is that this 1 loss in every 7 games cannot be the same for single losses, double losses and triple losses etc.
For example, our trigger is a double loss. Will a triple loss also occur once after every 7 double losses seen?
A triple loss is extremely rare and my logic says it can therefor not appear enough times to create an average that is the same as a single loss followed by a double loss.
Amk,
Can you explain?..
This is what I understood:
We have 8-9 patterns. We track them all and when we have 1 left example:
LHL. For the next 3 spins we bet HLH using a 1,2,4 progression.
If I did my first bet, at spin 25,26,27 and lost. I am re-tracking this starting from spin 28->
now we have LLH, we bet 1,2,4 again. We win, we only won 1 unit.
If we had lost that would be your second loss in a row.
Now, from what I understand in what you asking Sam to do is to track this for you..
25->26->27-> We lost.
45->46->47-> We won.
66->67->68->We won.
Which is how many times we lost in row, or singles. How many times we won once or in row and for how long before a loss, is that right?
amk
Here is the worksheet for several hundred spins. Start at column one. The "22" means it went 22 wins before the first loss. Then it went 7 wins before the second loss. And so on........
Double losses are highlighted.
I will ask Nick if he can modify the sheet to where it waits until the first loss and only bets after that. What would be the progression? 1 2 4?
Please understand this is the bot's RNG and not BV or Dublin spins. However, I can run real spins from a .txt file if you have several thousand (anyone?) that you'd like me to run
Sam
Sorry for not replying sooner Sam and Azmin,
Yes the prog is just 1-2-4 Sam and thanks for taking the time to explain the file data!
Azmin, you have a good point. A double loss in my interpretation of JLs stats is actually the following.
A session of PB is played and lost.
Now a completely new game is started not taking into account the last games spin results. I will have to double check if I can find the info but JL did not backtrack with PB play. He played +-5 games per day. Not back to back but randomly, one at 9am, the second at 10am etc.
This is how his double loss stat was filed. So he lost a 9am and then again at 10am, a double loss.
I guess backtracking is in essence the same but is by actual playing definition (how JL played) different.
Well, I've tried everything. The double losses come as frequently as the sunrise--just as most folks predicted. I have set the bot and run it many thousands of spins--no, hundreds of thousands. There is nothing here.
I can sometimes see JL's thinking process as it "seems" unlikely that eight of eight would form. But if you think about it long enough, you will begin to ask why? Why is is strange? Actually, it's not.
As to his "Hit and Run" theory--every time you play you have the same negative expectation. So every time you jump in to play, it is exactly the same as any other time. He stated you would have to hit dead-center on the spin that would make you lose. Yes!! And it's very easy to do that!
So I'm done. Enough time and effort for this puppy.
Next..............
Sam
Your making me believe there is no way to win at roulette Sam : )
Glad we both thought this might have a chance.
Who knows what would happen if you tried your luck for just 1000 games.
You have to start somewhere!
What is, is.
I think John was so self-deluded he truly believed this.
One can always ask, "What would have happened?" if only............
My answer is this goes against math and we just can't make water run uphill.
Sam
Hey...speak for yourself Sam...I do make water run uphill occassionally when the situation allows for it... and I pump it uphill all the time...but then again maybe that's not such a big deal for me since it's kinda what I do for a living
It is the falling water that makes everybody ooh and aah though...at least we can count on gravity
KEY
Bully for you!
amk
I am not saying the game is unbeatable. In fact, I think I found the KEY! (Snicker Snicker)
Go to Stef's new forum and look in my blog "The TwoCat Cafe" at a thread that starts...."Something I've noticed"... or some such. I think this goes hand-in-hand with my idea that one must determine which way the wind is blowing.
Have a look.
Sam
Heres a excellent thread
You beauty
Is anyone using this system?