What I'm about to exlain is a system that has remained flawless for the last 6 months I've been using it. First of all, THIS SYSTEM WORKS FOR REAL MANUAL ROULETTE, so for all online/electronic roulette players, don't even bother criticizing. Second of all, I want to thank guys like JohnLegend, iggiv and many others that have contributed a lot to this roulette player community, which I've been reading a lot recently and I feel like I want to contribute to the community too.
Facts about my system:
It's effectiveness is based on the 111 Law, which says that in 3 rounds of 37 spins all numbers should have appeared similar ammount of times.
How the system works:
1. You write down a small chart with numbers 1-9 / 10-18 / 19-27 / 28-36.
2. You have to wait for the first 37 spins and start counting how many numbers appear within the range of the four groups of numbers aforementioned. In other words, you count how many numbers from 1-9, 10-18, 19-27, 28-36 have appeared. In 99% of times, these numbers WON'T appear equally, so, for example you will have:
Numbers from 1 to 9: a total of 12 times
Numbers from 10 to 18: a total of 9 times
Numbers from 19 to 27: a total of 8 times
Numbers from 28-36: a total of 5 times
0/00: 3 times.
3. IF and ONLY IF we have a group of numbers that have appeared 5 times or less, we start betting to those numbers. NOTE: this is a very important part of the session because it depends on the player's budget, some will want to play every single number, some will play streets, etc.
How I play it, i bet on streets. On our example:
28 - 29 - 30 (1 chip)
31 - 32 - 33 (1 chip)
34 - 35 - 36 (1 chip)
4. THE PROGRESSION: The FOLLOWING PROGRESSION MUST BE played NECESSARILY after our first lost, until our balance is positive again:
28 - 29 - 30 (2 chips)
31 - 32 - 33 (1 chip)
34 - 35 - 36 (1 chip)
28 - 29 - 30 (2 chips)
31 - 32 - 33 (2 chips)
34 - 35 - 36 (1 chip)
28 - 29 - 30 (2 chips)
31 - 32 - 33 (2 chips)
34 - 35 - 36 (2 chips)
28 - 29 - 30 (3 chips)
31 - 32 - 33 (2 chips)
34 - 35 - 36 (2 chips)
And so on until we have a positive balance.
5. You must be wondering what to do if after the first 37 spins we dont have a group of numbers with 5 or less hits, so here's what needs to be done. We have to wait for another 37 spins and keep adding to our chart the ammount of times numbers from each group keep appearing.
After spin # 74, our chart should be something like this:
Numbers from 1 to 9: a total of 22 times
Numbers from 10 to 18: a total of 15 times
Numbers from 19 to 27: a total of 19 times
Numbers from 28-36: a total of 14 times
0/00: 4 times.
As one can see, numbers from 1-9 won't appear more than 5-6 times in the next 37 spins (it would be VERY rare), and numbers from 10 to 18 and from 28 to 36 will have a higher appearance rate, so we CHOOSE on of those groups and start our bets as explained before.
5. CASH MANAGEMENT: I play this system until i earn 20 chips (5$ each), which most of the times happens within 3-4 hours of play. It is VERY, VERY IMPORTANT that you don't set a high ammount of chips to win and try to become "rich" in only one session, as we all experienced gamblers know, the longer we play, the higher the chance to lose to the Casino's odds.
6. To all those who might say "oh, this system takes a long while to be played, how boring, etc.", well, if you are (or want to be) a professional roulette player, you can't expect to win ALWAYS within first 1 or 2 hours of play. If you're willing to be a professional player, you have TO SPEND TIME until certain circumstances for you to have a better chance of winning. If these circumstances aren't given, you will have wasted TIME BUT NOT MONEY.
7. If someone will try to test my system in some kind of software, I will just care less about it's results. If you want to test this system, USE ONLY REAL ROULETTE NUMBERS.
It's only because of my most sincere intention to contribute to this community that I decided to share this.
Miguel
can you please explain the second part of the system (next 37 spins) i wasn't sure what to bet on in the second part. also, in your progression i see you bet more chips on a certain street and I wasn't why you did that.
thank you in advance
Thank you tonynewlife for your reply, which will allow me to give more details about my system in case there's other members who didn't understand it properly.
The second part of the system:
We wait for the first cycle of 37 spins. If our chart doesn't show a group that has had 5 or less hits, we wait for another cycle of 37 spins (this will make a total of 74 spins). If our chart shows after spin # 74 that one group has had the lowest appearance rate compared to the other three groups (for example, group of 1-9 has appeared 8 times and the other three groups has appeared 20 or more times each) we bet on the group with the lowest appearance rate. If after 74 spins our chart shows that two groups have had a lower appearance rate compared to the other two groups (this is the scenario which happens more often), we choose one of the two groups with the lower appearance rate and bet on it.
According to the 111 Law, in 3 cycles of 37 spins all numbers should appear at least 1 time (except 1 or 2 numbers that may be "asleep" for a longer period) and most of them will have appeared in similar ammout of times. Being that so, no matter which of the two groups with the lower appearance we choose, as long as our group appears at least 20% of times within the next 37 spin cycle we will win.
The progression:
The progression i've exposed is an alternative to the old, classic and condemned to fail Martingale / D'Alambert progression. It's effectiveness consist that we make our bankroll last much longer since we won't double our bets after each spin on our desperate desire of getting back to a positive balance with just 1 hit. This progression lets our bankroll last long enough for us to catch the appearance of our group of numbers in case they take a bit long to appear.
You add +1 chip to one of the streets after each spin, until our balance is positive again. Which of the strees we choose to add the +1 chip first, depends on us. There's not any reason why to add the +1 chip on a definite street first, the idea is to make our gameplay simple.
More facts about my system:
After studying and testing a bulk of systems throughout the years, I arrived to the conclusion that the only key that can help us "control" random and can give us hope to beat the roulette's odd advantange (plus the dealer's training to control the spins within certain sectors of the wheel) is the Law of the Third and the Law of the 111 spins (which is also based on the law of the third).
I figured out that no matter which numbers we choose to play, with a proper progression we will always win as long as our numbers get hit at least 6 or 7 times within any 37 spin cycle. But there's a risk: if our numbers appear 5 or less times in a 37 spin cycle, our cash exposure will be too high and we may even lose our bankroll. So, in order to counter that risk and to play in a "safer" way, after many many months (and years) of study, I came to this. It took me a lot of time of thought and testing until I decided to try it out in real. I haven't lost a single session ever since. NOTE: as explained before, we need to set a certain ammount of chips we want to win. Knowing when to stop is the key to ANY system.
thank for the explanation. you said: "if our numbers appear 5 or less times in a 37 spin cycle, our cash exposure will be too high and we may even lose our bankroll. So, in order to counter that risk and to play in a "safer" way, after many many months (and years) of study, I came to this. It took me a lot of time of thought and testing until I decided to try it out in real. I haven't lost a single session ever since."
what is that safer way u are referring to? the system u have just explained? or is there more to it we should know about?
Also, what's you winning goal for each session?
thank you
Thats verry interesting system! Thanks for sharing!
Can i ask, what was you longest loosing streak and how often does it occur?
Thanks
Hello IronSteel,
Welcome to the forum!
I'm lucky to have found your thread. Thank you for sharing this great method and for taking the time to help. This method along with Katillas, Omniwiz's and VLS's latest are the best I have seen in while.
Inspiring method.
IronSteel,
I like your grit.
I like your system.
I like your willingness to share.
I like your .....
You get the message. :thumbsup:
GLC
It does seem like the purest way to play the system is to bet on straight up numbers.
Playing on a real wheel in a live casino could get pretty spendy. But if you play a live wheel on the internet with some of the low minimums you should be okay.
Let's see. If I play on my quarter airball machine. That's 9 quarters distributed 1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1. If I lose I go to 2-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1. If I lose again I go to 2-2-1-1-1-1-1-1-1 etc... Since I can bet up to 100 quarters or $25. I can go all the way to 11-11-11-11-11-11-11-11-11. That's 99 quarters. I would say that should give me a pretty wide range for having some hits.
Is my reasoning correct?
GLC
P.S. I would say that this has a pretty good chance to win since it is based on the same idea as Flatino's "Promised Constant Winning Bet" which has proven to be one of the best systems ever.
IronSteel, sounds very good! bravo! i am impressed
Quote from: GLC on Jan 30, 11:08 PM 2012
It does seem like the purest way to play the system is to bet on straight up numbers.
Playing on a real wheel in a live casino could get pretty spendy. But if you play a live wheel on the internet with some of the low minimums you should be okay.
Let's see. If I play on my quarter airball machine. That's 9 quarters distributed 1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1. If I lose I go to 2-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1. If I lose again I go to 2-2-1-1-1-1-1-1-1 etc... Since I can bet up to 100 quarters or $25. I can go all the way to 11-11-11-11-11-11-11-11-11. That's 99 quarters. I would say that should give me a pretty wide range for having some hits.
Is my reasoning correct?
GLC
P.S. I would say that this has a pretty good chance to win since it is based on the same idea as F_LAT_INO's "Promised Constant Winning Bet" which has proven to be one of the best systems ever.
Question for you......we have the same game here as well. We only get a few seconds (I think 40 seconds?) between spins. Will you have enough time to KNOW your bets and keep track of what's what and place bets? I usually find, the more numbers involved, the greater the chance for mistakes OR not enough time. Will this be another method that only looks good on paper? Turbo had a TON of methods like that.
Ken
hey TS what is the bankroll required for this?
sorry but I read your thread again.
| 1-9: 12 | 22 | 10 |
| 10-18 9 | 15 | 6 |
| 19-26 8 | 19 | 11 |
| 27-36 5 | 14 | 9 |
what do you mean by 1-9 appeared 8 times isnt it 10 times and where did you get 20times for the other groups? I see 6,11,9.
ok so im trying this system now and i have some questions.. so :
When i loose and go 2-1-1 , 2-2-1. 2-2-2. 3-2-2 etc. and then, when i win i dont recover my whole loss. For example -> from 10 Euro i would have recovered 7. So when that happens, do you continue your progression till the next win ( You win at 3-3-2, recover 7 Euros out of 10 total, you go on with 3-3-3) OR you stop and start at the beginning with 1-1-1 ?
And when u have a group that occured 5 ot less times, after u start betting and after u win, how many times do u bet that group again or u start to record another 36 spins?
I hope u understand my questions, in not native speaker :).
Thanx for sharing the system again! It looks promising!
Quote from: MrJ on Jan 31, 12:45 AM 2012
Question for you......we have the same game here as well. We only get a few seconds (I think 40 seconds?) between spins. Will you have enough time to KNOW your bets and keep track of what's what and place bets? I usually find, the more numbers involved, the greater the chance for mistakes OR not enough time. Will this be another method that only looks good on paper? Turbo had a TON of methods like that.
Ken
You're probably right Ken. I was just thinking of a way to play it optimally.
Of course we could break it down like Flatino did into 9 each 4 number groups. Then all we have to do is bet 4 numbers. If it works for 9 number groups why won't it work for 4 number groups?
Heck, why not break it down to 2 number groups? Maybe too much tracking deciding what to bet?
Actually, if it works on 4 each 9 number groups, why won't it work on 3 each 12 number groups or even 2 each 18 number groups. This is the question I always ask myself with any system. "If it works on a certain group of numbers, why won't it work on any group of numbers?" All we have to do is adapt the number of spins for tracking and adjust the trigger for betting etc...
I often try to adapt a system to other locations on the table or wheel to see if I like playing the idea on a different bet location.
But it's a point well taken. Getting too complicated and trying to play in a real casino is a recipe for making big mistakes that just frustrate you. Any you know what can happen if you get frustrated. :'(
LOL,
GlC
To tonynewlife:
The complete quote you made should be “I figured out that no matter which numbers we choose to play, with a proper progression we will always win as long as our numbers get hit at least 6 or 7 times within any 37 spin cycle. But there's a risk: if our numbers appear 5 or less times in a 37 spin cycle, our cash exposure will be too high and we may even lose our bankroll. So, in order to counter that risk and to play in a "safer" way, after many many months (and years) of study, I came to thisâ€. So the answer to your question is yes, I designed my system in order to eliminate the chance that we choose the “wrong†group (lower than 5 appearances). Also, like explained above, I play to win 20 chips of 5$ value.
To unre4lbg:
I can’t remember exactly how much was my highest losing streak before my number’s got hit, but I’ve never been close to lose my bankroll (200 chips).
To AMK:
Thank you for the welcome :)
To GLC:
You’re reasoning is correct. Betting on straight up numbers is also a great way of playing the system. I used to play like that (1$ chip value) for a while but I, personally, have trouble setting my winning amount of chips when they’re of low value, so if I played straight up numbers at 1$ value I would want to win 100 chips, which is very greedy. But of course, you can play straight up numbers and set a lower winning top.
Myself, I haven’t tested my system in online roulettes, of course you can try that and it’ll be great if it helps you, but as explained on my first post I designed this to work in real live wheels.
To Iggiv:
Thank you. Although, what makes a system good is that it works not only for one player but for all of us :)
To MrJ:
Since I bet on streets, it takes me less than 10 seconds to place my bets once the dealer started to spin. Also, placing bets on straight up numbers won’t take you less than 40 seconds since numbers are all next to each other in the board. To make it easier you can keep track of your current balance by writing (-3, -4, -5 …) on your sheet so you will always know what your next bet should be.
This method doesn’t look good only on paper. If you ever decide to play it, you will see it for yourself.
To Weddings:
I use a bankroll of 200 chips 5$ value. I don’t think there’s a definite bankroll to play this system, the idea is that it lasts long enough for you to get your numbers hit. Like explained to unre4lbg, I’ve never been close to lose my bankroll.
To your second post,
"1-9: 12 22
10-18 9 15
19-26 8 19
27-36 5 14"
This is the track of how many hits each group has had in my example on my first post (you’re forgetting to add the 0/00 appearance, that would complete 37 spins in the first round and 74 spins in the second round).
On your question “what do you mean by 1-9 appeared 8 times isnt it 10 times and where did you get 20times for the other groups?†This was another example in order to explain my system with more details to tonynewlife. It has nothing to do with my example on the first post.
To unre4lbg:
I play the progression until my balance is positive again. But, for example if you’re only -2 or -3 in your balance and you would have to place bet 4-4-4 on the next one, you can choose to start over with 1-1-1. Depends on you.
I’ve never thought of re-playing my system once I’ve won my 20 chips. But if I would want to, I would start all over in a different wheel, if you know what I mean.
To GLC:
So, why 9 numbers and not 12, 18, 4, 6, etc?
The reason I chose 4 groups of 9 numbers each, is that choosing larger or smaller groups would make it much harder to find which one has the lower appearance rate. You can sure try to play with larger or shorter groups of numbers, but my system is designed to be played with 9 numbers as they represent the 25% of numbers on the wheel (forgetting the 0) and it’s easier to spot the lower appearance group like this than with a larger or shorter group. Certainly, when i did my initial testings, i also thought of catching larger -up to 12 numbers -or shorter groups -6 numbers-, but it didn't work as i would want to.
To everyone:
I’m glad people are trying to think of different ways of playing my system and testing it on their own, that’s the reason why I brought it to this forums. As explained before, this system is mainly designed and has only been tested by me in real wheels, but i’d be glad to know that it works for all of you in the online roulettes as well. Feel free to keep asking me anything you’d like, I will keep sneaking the forums every now and then.
Good luck to all
Very comprehensive and understandable!
Hi IronSteel,
Thanks for posting the system. I have a question:
Quote from: IronSteel on Jan 24, 09:23 PM 2012
If our chart doesn't show a group that has had 5 or less hits, we wait for another cycle of 37 spins (this will make a total of 74 spins). If our chart shows after spin # 74 that one group has had the lowest appearance rate compared to the other three groups (for example, group of 1-9 has appeared 8 times and the other three groups has appeared 20 or more times each) we bet on the group with the lowest appearance rate. If after 74 spins our chart shows that two groups have had a lower appearance rate compared to the other two groups (this is the scenario which happens more often), we choose one of the two groups with the lower appearance rate and bet on it.
Is there any maximum number of times a group needs to hit after spin #74 in order for it to qualify?
Suppose after spin #74 there isn't much difference in the appearances of the 4 groups, do you still choose the group with the lowest appearance, even though it may not have hit much less than the other groups?
Also, you say you've been playing this for 6 months - approximately how many bets have you made in this period?
Cheers.
IronSteel,
Thanks for you courteous responses to our questions.
GLC
Ironsteel, as an expansion of your system please follow this link and your analysis of my additions will be much appreciated:
link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=9062.new#new (link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=9062.new#new)
I posted this under a new topic to keep this topic from getting too cluttered.
I don't mean to take anything away from Ironsteel's topic, just adding some extra ideas.
I have acknowledged Ironsteel as the author of the system and once again want to thank him for his willingness to share with us.
GLC
Hello again to everyone, I'm really glad to see how people are approaching my system under an analyst perspective, I'm sure you guys will find the way to adapt this system to your own comfort and optimize your results.
Now, to the new posts.
To marivo:
Thank you, I try to be as clear as I can on my explanations.
To Bayes:
"Is there any maximum number of times a group needs to hit after spin #74 in order for it to qualify?
Suppose after spin #74 there isn't much difference in the appearances of the 4 groups, do you still choose the group with the lowest appearance, even though it may not have hit much less than the other groups?"
From my records, I haven't seen this happen (yet). Most of the times there's at least one group that gets more hits compared to the other three groups or two groups with a higher appearance compared to the other two groups. (Even if you divide 74 in 4, it doesn't give you round up numbers, now add the zero and you will notice how hard it is to happen that the 4 groups appear similar amount of times). So the answer to your question would be, if a scenario like that is given, I would still bet on the lowest appearance group, even if the difference is 3 or 4 hits less.
"Also, you say you've been playing this for 6 months - approximately how many bets have you made in this period?"
I play about an average of 20 sessions a month (in different days, of course). My sessions end as soon as I get my winnings (sometimes i choose to finish my session if I'm already +19 chips, other times i finish my session with more than 20 chips when my numbers get hit when i'm only +14 or +15 chips ahead).
To GLC:
It's great that you made an expansion of my system, I will check to it right away and give you my thoughts.
Hello Ironsteel,
Great system, very interesting. I'd be careful on trying to improve too much on a system if it already works. Roulette is a tricky balancing act, too much tinkering may carry hidden costs.
Quote from: IronSteel on Jan 24, 09:23 PM 2012
After studying and testing a bulk of systems throughout the years, I arrived to the conclusion that the only key that can help us "control" random and can give us hope to beat the roulette's odd advantange (plus the dealer's training to control the spins within certain sectors of the wheel) is the Law of the Third and the Law of the 111 spins (which is also based on the law of the third).
I agree. The Law of the Third is the clearest route to success. The only short term regularity in this game is that numbers wake up at a certain rate.
A couple of questions: If after 37 spins no group qualifies, is it necessary to wait another 37 spins? Why not simply keep adding new numbers and crossing off the furthest back ones, so that a qualifying group of 37 shows up is maybe 40 or 50 spins? It would then be as if we had arrived at the table 20 minutes later, and that new set of 37 spins, containing most of the numbers in the initial 37 but not all, counted as a valid betting group. I don't mind waiting, but only when there's a reason for it.
Also, have you tested it on isolated streets? I know different betting groups have been proposed, but streets seems like a natural one. I remember a system based on 6 sleeper streets that was surprisingly effective. Its downfal was its agressive progression, but it showed promisse. This could be a profitable variation.
I'm thinking that maybe a productive aproach would involve multimple betting options, so that at any time, on any given 37 spin set, a very attractive, sub five bet appears.
Time for testing.
Jeromin
Also, how about spreading the 1/3 increse in progression evenly? Increasing by one unit on one street risks it not being the street that hits next. How about starting with 3 units on all 3 streets and adding one unit every step?
so instead of:
1 1 1;
2 1 1;
2 2 1;
etc ( total 12u)
we have:
3 3 3;
4 4 4;
5 5 5;
etc. (total 36u=12x3)
This can be a problem if one is playing the minimum as basic unit, but as has been mentioned already, in online live dealer casinos and automatic wheels it is possible to find .25 basic units.
Jeromin
Quote from: GLC on Jan 30, 11:08 PM 2012
Let's see. If I play on my quarter airball machine. That's 9 quarters distributed 1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1. If I lose I go to 2-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1. If I lose again I go to 2-2-1-1-1-1-1-1-1 etc... Since I can bet up to 100 quarters or $25. I can go all the way to 11-11-11-11-11-11-11-11-11. That's 99 quarters. I would say that should give me a pretty wide range for having some hits.
The above progression is incorrect. After losing on 1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1 the next bet should bet 2-2-2-1-1-1-1-1-1 and then 2-2-2-2-2-2-1-1-1 and then 2-2-2-2-2-2-2-2-2 and then 3-3-3-2-2-2-2-2-2 etc... Increasing bets on 1 number each loss is too slow.
GLC
Interesting!! ;D
I've been working on a system which is kinda similar for awhile now but this one could surpass it as it has the hallmarks of something special.
I've done a quick test of 2000 'spins' with pure random numbers and have modified the system a touch.
In 137 qualifiers, one of the nine numbers has appeared in the following 'spin', 28% of the time. If it keeps trending like it is, that could be a system in itself.
On the downside, it took 19 'spins' for one of the numbers to appear, on one occasion.
A proper test of a few thousand qualifiers needs to be done though.
Thanks for sharing, Iron Steel.
Hello to everyone.
I have been away from the forums for the past few days so I want to apologize to the people who I haven't replied to yet.
To Jeromin:
After 37 spins if no group qualifies, you have to wait for the next 37 spins and not just keep adding the numbers to your chart and pick your group by spin 40 or 50. The reason is because the chance to pick the "wrong" group in this case will be higher, and this is exactly why I wait for a complete 37 spin cycle: because waiting for the second 37 spin cycle to end will show to us with more clearance which is the group with the lower appearance rate. So if we spot a group with the lowest appearance rate by spin 50, chances are that this WILL be the group that won't appear much within the follwing 24 spins, therefore this WILL be the group we will start betting AFTER spin #74. Remember that we seek to play a group with a clear delay in it's appearances after a certain ammount of spins, so if we spot a group with few hits early, why bet on it quickly if we are actually expecting it to have only a few more appearances within the next spins?
About the progression (this is for GLC as well) you can sure play it that way, as explained above my progression has only one purpose which is to make our bankroll last long enough to catch our numbers in the 37 spin cycle. In my case, my progression is very conservative because I play US$ 5 chip value, but with lower values and betting on straight up numbers playing as you guys are explaining it's the way to go.
To Nasio:
Thank you for the testing, I hope the results are as good to you as they are for me.
To everyone:
I know there is no such thing as "holy grail" roulette system or anything alike. Whoever says that he (or she) has designed an unbeatable system, that would just be an obscene lie.
I'm not saying and will never say that my system is unbeatable. Of course, someday I will lose with it or somebody else will show up saying he lost playing my system. I know this can happen.
I know that there's a big bulk of systems out there that look so good or promising, so the question is why should my system be more "special" than the others?. The answer is that there's no reason to it. My system is just as good or just as bad as any other system out there.
From all my experience, after all the systems I've played, thought about, tested on live wheels and on paper, all I can say is that the BEST system is the one that makes us win more times than the ones we lose IN THE LONG RUN, the one that MAKES US FEEL COMFORTABLE while playing it and the one WE TRUST and won't make us fall in desperation, making us play illogical progressions or change the rules of the system.
I've shared my system to give you one more tool to forge YOUR OWN BEST system. Good luck to all and please let me know if your doubts are clear now.
@IronSteel
I tested the system on xxxxxxxxxxxx ( first legal casino on line for roulette in Belgium, Casino de Spa) bet 0,1 EURO to 10 EURO max)
I was playing 3 games
first on 37 spins : Stopped winning after min 20 spin: +24
Second I must playing 74 spins and I won also 27 spin in less than 7 spins after starting.
The 3th game also 74 spins and +27 and stopped I was bringing my saldo from +38 to 43,30 EUR
So , my opinion: nice game.
:)
Ludo8400
:D
@IRONSTEEL
777 units capital you need for your game for 37 SPINS;
But STOP WHEN you are WINNING 20 UNITS WAS YOUR DEVICE
:D
ludo 8400
@ every body
BET TABLE FOR 37 SPINS
ludo8400
Quote from: ludo8400 on Feb 17, 04:36 PM 2012
@ every body
BET TABLE FOR 37 SPINS
ludo8400
Ludo,
Thanks for the chart. These charts people contribute help others a lot. It saves all of us having to compute it for ourselves and it helps correct some peoples understanding of the bet method in case they were confused. :thumbsup:
GLC
@ every body
Bring your spin in and look if you have a 5 between K and N position 38 Than you can start the game.
other wait to position B76.
Good luck
Ludo8400
MAKE THE GAME MORE CONFIDENT AND TEST RANDOM
LOOK AT POSITION 42 Y, Z, AA, AB after 37 SPINS
43 after 74 SPINS
44 after 111 SPINS
EXCEL 2007OPEN EXCEL and push on your DELETE button;
each push you have new results in POSITION 42,43 and 44
ludo8400
:D
Thank you for your analysis Ludo, which im sure will be of use for other community members.
I'm also glad to know that you're getting positive results with my system in the online roulettes (although I designed it for real live wheels).
I hope more members share their experiencies playing my system and I hope they have positive results as well.
I'll be always around to answer any question or doubt about my system.
Best of luck to everyone
Quote from: ludo8400 on Feb 18, 05:34 AM 2012
@ every body
Bring your spin in and look if you have a 5 between K and N position 38 Than you can start the game.
other wait to position B76.
Good luck
Ludo8400
Quote from: ludo8400 on Feb 18, 06:05 AM 2012
MAKE THE GAME MORE CONFIDENT AND TEST RANDOM
LOOK AT POSITION 42 Y, Z, AA, AB after 37 SPINS
43 after 74 SPINS
44 after 111 SPINS
EXCEL 2007OPEN EXCEL and push on your DELETE button;
each push you have new results in POSITION 42,43 and 44
ludo8400
:D
I am lost. Can you explain this a little bit more? Thx.
Hello Ironsteel
What is the longest number of spins you waited for first hit?
Regards
To answer Robeenhuut :
Correct me if i'm wrong, it should be after the #74 spin. :)
Hi,
Please could you clarify when you say you 'play the progression until my balance is positive again,'
do you play your session using the same streets you selected from your 37 spins until you reach your 20 chips target?
So you are betting on the same streets for your target, not starting again and recording another 37 spins? Hope this makes sense?
Also, in your 6 months of playing, what is the highest amount of progressions you have gone to?
This is quite interesting. betting 37 spins could be good
I have not fully digested this yet, but I would wonder why you would
not actually have a running tally of number groups?
Then you would not have to wait a full 37 spins for another test
for betting numbers....
Hi all,
I am new to this forum. Since 1998 I'm looking for the safest (=best) strategy for Roulette. As a non-gambler, I am looking for a no-risk system. I've tested 100's of systems, and, to be honest, I learned that all systems fail in the long run. I also learned that betting on dozens and double dozens are a waste of time, ok for short run, but fatal for long run. Always. Even the 'safest' systems failed.
For me, a system is foolproof if it reach 1000 units, using a betting unit of 1. I am looking twelve years for such a system, sometimes I reach 600-700 but there is ALWAYS the well-known 'killer'.
A week ago I was reading some some topics in this very nice forum. One title got my attention: 'Your Roulette System Search is Over'. I thought: just another 13-in-a-dozen system. But I tried it online, you never know.
After a few hours of testing, I was surprised. No losses. Hm...ok, huge drawdowns, but I recovered every time. But I expected the famous killing session soon, like a always do.
The strange thing is, it's seven days ago, and I am still 'alive'. Better: I am virtually past 1000 units!!!! That's amazing! The first time in twelve years, unbelievable. What is happening??
Is this strategy THE one? It looks like it is, but I am very careful. To be safer, without making huge losses, I adjusted the system as follows:
stop-loss = 200 units from the start.
Stop betting at + 100 units.
Continue betting if recovery is not less than 20 units and go back to 1-1-1 if it recovers within the range of 20 units. For example: you have + 70 units. The next 8 bets are losing ones. The 9th is a winner and it takes you to 52 (=within the range of 20). So next bet 1-1-1. If more than 20, continue to bet until you reach the stop-loss limit or reach the 20-range.
That's just a personal touch. Maybe it needs more or different fine-tuning, but anyway, this system feels comfortable for non-gamblers like me.
All credits to IronSteel. I am very impressed.
To be continued...
Hi Everyone, I want to apologize to you guys because it's been a while since I've posted again in the forums and I haven't answered your questions in time.
To Marivo:
The coordinates ludo refers to are the ones according to the Excel sheet.
To robeenhut:
If by "hit" you mean my first winning shot, it has never exceeded 12 spins. You should get at least 1 or 2 hits (winning spins) within the first 15 spins of the 37 spin cycle you're starting to bet in.
To up338:
Your answer to robeenhut is correct if he means by "hit" when we should start playing.
Remember that ee start splaying after spin #74 only if we didn't get a group with 5 or less hits in the first #37 spin cycle.
To shazwad:
I play the progression until i recover all my loses and I get to a positive balance. For example: if I'm losing first 5 spins (that'd be -25 chips) and then win in the next spin in a street with 3 chips on it(you will place 8 more chips getting your balance to - 33) but since you win +36, your balance would now be +3 hence you stop playing progessions, so you're back to 1-1-1 bet).
Yes, I bet on the same streets until i get my +20 chips.
After 6 months (now 8 months) of playing this system over and over again, the highest exposure was about half my bankroll. This hasn't happened more than 2 or 3 times in more than 150 live sessions that i've been playing so far.
To nayan:
Let me know if you decide to play the system and if you have any more doubts about it.
To mogul:
There's a fundamental reason why not start playing after any number of spins that show us a group with few hits. We SEEK to play the GROUP WITH THE LESS HITS, right? So, in order for us to have a group with few hits after spin #74, this means that during spin #38 and spin # 74, THAT group had few hits, right?. So if you start playing after spin # 45 to THAT SAME GROUP WE'RE EXPECTING TO HAVE ONLY A FEW HITS DURING THAT CYCLE, you're up for a heavy loss, because you will most likely bet on 25-30 spins to a group that may not have more than 2 or 3 appearances, leading you to a high chip exposure. Betting after any number of spins is playing this system in the opposite way to which it was designed.
To HP:
I'm glad to know you've decided to try my system and got optimal results. Keep sharing your experience with more members, maybe we will have more people trying the system and seeing the positive results for themselves. I'm even more glad to know that you had positive results in the online roulette, even though I play this mainly in live wheels. This may mean that we're close on developing a safe and profitable strategy.
To Everyone:
Feel free to keep asking any mroe questions, I'll try to answer you faster from now on.
Best of luck to all.
I'm not sure if you understood my point. My point was that if you keep tracking
numbers in a sequential fashion, then at some point you will come to the setup to begin betting.
What difference does it make where you start to count your sequence?
So why waste an entire 37 spins to contrive a new sequence? Just begin
wherever it works.
Hello IronSteel,
Thank you very much for your system. Your explanation is very clear. I understand very well regarding your entry and your stop on a profit of 20 units. If we have a qualified entry point after 37 spins we will start betting from spin 38. If our target of plus 20 units is not achieve,we will continue betting on the same street irrespective of number of hit. What happen if we reach spin 111 and we are still short of our target or perhaps still loosing. Do we stop after spin 111 and start all over again or do we continue betting beyond spin 111?
Regards
Quote from: IronSteel on Mar 13, 12:54 PM 2012
Hi Everyone, I want to apologize to you guys because it's been a while since I've posted again in the forums and I haven't answered your questions in time.
To Marivo:
The coordinates ludo refers to are the ones according to the Excel sheet.
To robeenhut:
If by "hit" you mean my first winning shot, it has never exceeded 12 spins. You should get at least 1 or 2 hits (winning spins) within the first 15 spins of the 37 spin cycle you're starting to bet in.
To up338:
Your answer to robeenhut is correct if he means by "hit" when we should start playing.
Remember that ee start splaying after spin #74 only if we didn't get a group with 5 or less hits in the first #37 spin cycle.
To shazwad:
I play the progression until i recover all my loses and I get to a positive balance. For example: if I'm losing first 5 spins (that'd be -25 chips) and then win in the next spin in a street with 3 chips on it(you will place 8 more chips getting your balance to - 33) but since you win +36, your balance would now be +3 hence you stop playing progessions, so you're back to 1-1-1 bet).
Yes, I bet on the same streets until i get my +20 chips.
After 6 months (now 8 months) of playing this system over and over again, the highest exposure was about half my bankroll. This hasn't happened more than 2 or 3 times in more than 150 live sessions that i've been playing so far.
To nayan:
Let me know if you decide to play the system and if you have any more doubts about it.
To mogul:
There's a fundamental reason why not start playing after any number of spins that show us a group with few hits. We SEEK to play the GROUP WITH THE LESS HITS, right? So, in order for us to have a group with few hits after spin #74, this means that during spin #38 and spin # 74, THAT group had few hits, right?. So if you start playing after spin # 45 to THAT SAME GROUP WE'RE EXPECTING TO HAVE ONLY A FEW HITS DURING THAT CYCLE, you're up for a heavy loss, because you will most likely bet on 25-30 spins to a group that may not have more than 2 or 3 appearances, leading you to a high chip exposure. Betting after any number of spins is playing this system in the opposite way to which it was designed.
To HP:
I'm glad to know you've decided to try my system and got optimal results. Keep sharing your experience with more members, maybe we will have more people trying the system and seeing the positive results for themselves. I'm even more glad to know that you had positive results in the online roulette, even though I play this mainly in live wheels. This may mean that we're close on developing a safe and profitable strategy.
To Everyone:
Feel free to keep asking any mroe questions, I'll try to answer you faster from now on.
Best of luck to all.
Hello Ironsteel
I tested your system on around 5000 live spins from Smartlive. I saw once a sequence without a hit for 25 spins. You should go over 15 few times. Its not unusual. 1 Dz can sleep for 30+ spins and its 12 numbers. I saw Dz sleep for more 20 spins few times. So better put a stop-loss on it or extend your progression. The problem here is that you just don't need a single win but at least 2 wins and pretty close to each other. I tested similiar system of sleepers and in just around 1000 spins 6 numbers slept for 30 spins. To put things in perspective 9 numbers sleeping for 25 spins is equivalent of EC sleeping for 11 spins which is quite common.
You must have been extremely lucky if you always got a first hit within 12 spins.
Regards
Ironsteel, Have you tried this way of increasing your progression?
1-1-1
1-1-1
1-1-1
2-2-2
2-2-2
2-2-2
3-3-3
3-3-3
3-3-3
4-4-4
4-4-4
4-4-4
5-5-5
etc...
Another week of testing this system.
I reached my stop limit several times and after all, I broke even.
So far, no profits.
I have been trialling this system for the past couple of weeks and with 50p stakes and with a profit target of £10 I am now showing a very healthy balance and I would like to thank Ironsides for posting this system. However sometimes your progression can get very high and I once saw one group sleeping for 32 spins so you need quite a big bankroll until your numbers eventually hit.
Sorry for typo, Ironsteel.!
Is anyone else playing this and getting good results like me?
Quote from: HP on Mar 18, 09:58 AM 2012
Another week of testing this system.
I reached my stop limit several times and after all, I broke even.
So far, no profits.
I think this is the summation of all roulette systems. They're all based on the same odds so if you play long enough.....
Some move at a fast pace and others at a slower pace, but eventually they confirm the above statement.
Here's how every system works. If you flat bet, you will move up and down with a gradual drift downwards.
If you use a progression with no stop loss, you will win a ton of small wins but eventually you will hit the table limits and have to give it back.
If you use a progression with a large stop loss you will mirror the last statement except that you will give it back at your stop loss which you will eventually hit often enough to wipe out your winnings.
If you use a short progression you will mirror the last statement except that your stop loss will be reached much quicker and more often but with the same results of giving all winnings back.
Etc...
No matter how complicated you make your system it makes no difference. It's just a matter of time.
The reality is that not only will you give all your winnings back, but most will give more than you won back.
Some will be lucky and always be a winner. Most will win and lose but gradually lose more and more. A few will be unlucky and lose from the beginning.
Maybe there's no reason for the 2,000th post.
I have gone to the dark side.
Peace to all and enjoy the friendships. In the end, that may be all you have left.
GLC
"...... i have gone to the dark side....."
I heard they have some cookies there..hope you enjoy it.
Regards
Max
I went to the darks side along time ago,but i like the adrenalin rush from time to time.
Quote from: GLC on Apr 01, 01:26 PM 2012
I have gone to the dark side.
Peace to all and enjoy the friendships. In the end, that may be all you have left.
GLC
This is one the best statements on the forum lately.
I am so happy for you in a way...
Me trying do to do same thing. Main problem here is that actualy road to the dark side is very long labyrinth in darkest darkness, so if you don't have iron will and torchbearer to help you, it is almost impossible to pass the labyrinth.
Also these torchbearers are very unusual and at the first sight "strange" guys, not much interested in money, because they have it enough, so finding one and the reason why he would navigate you is totaly another fairy tale with happy end. I hope and envy you if you found one. >:D
Anyway, still here on this side, MM and good long lasting progression (doesn't have to be agressive necessary) is the key., and when our minister of progressions, after so many years and almost 2000 posts on this forum said he checked his ticket for the dark side, that tells all...
Regards
Drazen
Hello to everyone, first of all I want to apologize (again) for being away for quite long since my last post.
During these last weeks I experienced some hard sessions, from which I ended up losing a couple (didn't lose my whole bankroll though) but my final monthly balance is positive still.
To robeenhut:
Extremely lucky or not, I've had and I'm still having positive results with this system. This system needs to be played with extreme caution, as 1 or 2 numbers written "wrongfully" can change this systems result's drastically. You said you've tested this with 5k live spins, how much time did this take you, as counting the numbers and playing this demands focusing and a decent ammount of time?. When I started testing my system in permanences, It took me around 2 hours per 111 spins, even using an Excel sheet.
My system is not just about sleepers, it's also about combining a winning and safe progression that will guarantee you a positive result at last in most oportunities. As I've already stated, there's no system which is 100% effective, and there will never be one (I even had a couple of negative sessions during these past weeks). The only effective system is the one you trust and which rules you will follow to the very end. I invite you to sit in a live wheel for 3-4 hours, test my system, and come back saying it doesn't work.
To HP:
Sorry to hear you had a bad turn playing my system. You said you added some personal touches, will results had changed if you would've followed the initial rules? Also, did you play it on online roulette or live wheel?
I hope to get an answer from you.
To schzwad:
Glad to know you're having positive results.
To GLC:
I already said, in an older post, that such thing as a "holy grail" system doesn't exist and NEVER will. Sorry to see you just realized this after 2k posts. Experienced gamblers know that losing sessions happen, and will always keep happening. The key is to persevere, have a cold mind and keep going on playing the system you believe it works. This is the system I trust even if I had a couple of losing sessions, and a ton of gamblers I know in real play their own system, everyone with positive balance after many, many sessions.
Again, if you browsed these forums since your post # 1 expecting to find a "miraculous" system, I'm sorry to say you were never going to find it and never will. In fact, nobody ever has, otherwise Casino's (or roulette wheels at least) wouldn't exist at all.
Take some time off roulette, and come back after some months with a clean mentality and start all over again starting from the fact that there is no such thing as a 100% winner system. I'm sure your approach to roulette and the systems exposed in these forums will change.
To Drazen:
I got your pm several months ago and replied to you. I know you're a young and keen roulette student. I hope to hear from you when you start hitting the tables and start winning, either playing this system or the one's you have developed. As said to GLC, just don't seek what doesn't exist, and you will do just fine.
Im really sorry if I have been a little harsh on my replies, but I was clear since the beginning: I will just take critics as valid if they come from someone who has sat in a live wheel table for 3-4 hours, played the system strictly as I've exposed, and lost. States as "I've tested this system in 10000000 spins from some website" mean nothing to me. I trust this system, it has worked for me as I've exposed it, and I've shared it to be used as I've brought it (or adapted to anyone's likings).
Good luck to all
Quote from: IronSteel on Apr 25, 06:34 PM 2012
The key is to persevere, have a cold mind and keep going on playing the system you believe it works.
That's how beliefs become reality.
Quote from: IronSteel on Apr 25, 06:34 PM 2012
The key is to persevere, have a cold mind and keep going on playing the system you believe it works.
In my experience this is the worst thing you can do. Believing a system works doesn't make it work. Persevering is fine when the system is working, but if it isn't, that's when you get into trouble. You need to be flexible and have several strategies (a "portfolio" if you like); knowing when to abandon a method and start a different one is the hardest thing to learn, it's more of an art than a science.
Every time I read discussions about any method that loses, always
just leads me to wondering why not just bet the opposite.
And win.
I relalize that some methods do not allow this to happen logically
because of the betting scheme, but most do.
Quote from: IronSteel on Apr 25, 06:34 PM 2012
Hello to everyone, first of all I want to apologize (again) for being away for quite long since my last post.
During these last weeks I experienced some hard sessions, from which I ended up losing a couple (didn't lose my whole bankroll though) but my final monthly balance is positive still.
To robeenhut:
Extremely lucky or not, I've had and I'm still having positive results with this system. This system needs to be played with extreme caution, as 1 or 2 numbers written "wrongfully" can change this systems result's drastically. You said you've tested this with 5k live spins, how much time did this take you, as counting the numbers and playing this demands focusing and a decent ammount of time?. When I started testing my system in permanences, It took me around 2 hours per 111 spins, even using an Excel sheet.
My system is not just about sleepers, it's also about combining a winning and safe progression that will guarantee you a positive result at last in most oportunities. As I've already stated, there's no system which is 100% effective, and there will never be one (I even had a couple of negative sessions during these past weeks). The only effective system is the one you trust and which rules you will follow to the very end. I invite you to sit in a live wheel for 3-4 hours, test my system, and come back saying it doesn't work.
To HP:
Sorry to hear you had a bad turn playing my system. You said you added some personal touches, will results had changed if you would've followed the initial rules? Also, did you play it on online roulette or live wheel?
I hope to get an answer from you.
To schzwad:
Glad to know you're having positive results.
To GLC:
I already said, in an older post, that such thing as a "holy grail" system doesn't exist and NEVER will. Sorry to see you just realized this after 2k posts. Experienced gamblers know that losing sessions happen, and will always keep happening. The key is to persevere, have a cold mind and keep going on playing the system you believe it works. This is the system I trust even if I had a couple of losing sessions, and a ton of gamblers I know in real play their own system, everyone with positive balance after many, many sessions.
Again, if you browsed these forums since your post # 1 expecting to find a "miraculous" system, I'm sorry to say you were never going to find it and never will. In fact, nobody ever has, otherwise Casino's (or roulette wheels at least) wouldn't exist at all.
Take some time off roulette, and come back after some months with a clean mentality and start all over again starting from the fact that there is no such thing as a 100% winner system. I'm sure your approach to roulette and the systems exposed in these forums will change.
To Drazen:
I got your pm several months ago and replied to you. I know you're a young and keen roulette student. I hope to hear from you when you start hitting the tables and start winning, either playing this system or the one's you have developed. As said to GLC, just don't seek what doesn't exist, and you will do just fine.
I'm really sorry if I have been a little harsh on my replies, but I was clear since the beginning: I will just take critics as valid if they come from someone who has sat in a live wheel table for 3-4 hours, played the system strictly as I've exposed, and lost. States as "I've tested this system in 10000000 spins from some website" mean nothing to me. I trust this system, it has worked for me as I've exposed it, and I've shared it to be used as I've brought it (or adapted to anyone's likings).
Good luck to all
Hola Ironsteel
I have 38 sets of live wheel spins from SM - about 7k. I went quickly through few sets and noticed gaps of over 20 between hits in section with with least amount of hits (5 or less). Without any tests i know from probability charts that 9 numbers can sleep easily over 20 spins. Just do your math. I see dozen sleep over 20 quite often. I'm not sure here that you can risk your BR waiting for first hit and you need more than one hit usually to be in profit. Only some stop-loss might help. You don't work on large sample of spins to except different results. From our friend Bayes charts you will see that you will get 25 spins without hit as often as any EC repeat for 10 spins.
Use any probability calculator.
Regards
Quote from: GLC on Apr 01, 01:26 PM 2012
I think this is the summation of all roulette systems. They're all based on the same odds so if you play long enough.....
Some move at a fast pace and others at a slower pace, but eventually they confirm the above statement.
Here's how every system works. If you flat bet, you will move up and down with a gradual drift downwards.
If you use a progression with no stop-loss, you will win a ton of small wins but eventually you will hit the table limits and have to give it back.
If you use a progression with a large stop-loss you will mirror the last statement except that you will give it back at your stop-loss which you will eventually hit often enough to wipe out your winnings.
If you use a short progression you will mirror the last statement except that your stop-loss will be reached much quicker and more often but with the same results of giving all winnings back.
Etc...
No matter how complicated you make your system it makes no difference. It's just a matter of time.
The reality is that not only will you give all your winnings back, but most will give more than you won back.
Some will be lucky and always be a winner. Most will win and lose but gradually lose more and more. A few will be unlucky and lose from the beginning.
Maybe there's no reason for the 2,000th post.
I have gone to the dark side.
Peace to all and enjoy the friendships. In the end, that may be all you have left.
GLC
brilliant post, players who win actually win
in spite of their systems rather than because of it, they are simply lucky!!
To Bayes and GARNabby:
By "persevere" I don't mean that you should keep playing the same day when you're actually noticing that you're in a bad losing streak. What I mean by "persevere" is to know when to cut the bad streak, and come back the next day or the next few days and try it again. But, of course, if you're a casual gambler, it would best suit you to play a system for 1 or 2 sessions, and if it doesn't work simply switch to another one, and so on.
Perseverance means to play the system in a decent ammount of sessions, from which you should finally determine if it works or not, and it definately doesn't mean to continue digging the hole when you're already inside it.
To Robeenhut,
Like you said yourself, you havent even tested the system. I just hope, whatever analysis you're making about this system, you're doing it correctly. I don't have the time nor the will to discuss about the math basis of my system with you, though what you say is right (simple law of the third math).
I really don't want to continue arguing with anyone here anymore. I brought my system here to share it with the community and to discuss about it if necessary, for whoever feels like giving it a shot. This system has brought me optimal results, and it's my most sincere desire that everyone else can have this positive results as well. Perhaps at some point I'll lose all the profits I've made so far? Anything can happen, this is what roulette is about, isn't it?
I'll begone from the forums for good now, wishing the best of lucky to all of you.
Best regards,
Miguel
Quote from: GLC on Apr 01, 01:26 PM 2012
I think this is the summation of all roulette systems. They're all based on the same odds so if you play long enough.....
Some move at a fast pace and others at a slower pace, but eventually they confirm the above statement.
Here's how every system works. If you flat bet, you will move up and down with a gradual drift downwards.
If you use a progression with no stop loss, you will win a ton of small wins but eventually you will hit the table limits and have to give it back.
If you use a progression with a large stop loss you will mirror the last statement except that you will give it back at your stop loss which you will eventually hit often enough to wipe out your winnings.
If you use a short progression you will mirror the last statement except that your stop loss will be reached much quicker and more often but with the same results of giving all winnings back.
Etc...
No matter how complicated you make your system it makes no difference. It's just a matter of time.
The reality is that not only will you give all your winnings back, but most will give more than you won back.
Some will be lucky and always be a winner. Most will win and lose but gradually lose more and more. A few will be unlucky and lose from the beginning.
Maybe there's no reason for the 2,000th post.
I have gone to the dark side.
Peace to all and enjoy the friendships. In the end, that may be all you have left.
GLC
That about sums it up.
Couldn't resist reading the thread with a title like that. But GLC nailed it . This should be shown next to the warning stuff. Pure gold.
This being said. .... how many % posted threads on all the forums lose eventually?
You should take a look at Priyanka's teachings though... she not only limits the combinations that roulette can throw at us, but she creates a biased game, eradicating variance. I'm sure that's a first in history - yet I am the only one testing it at the moment it seems.
GLC ypu basically said you need to increase accuracy of predictions. Not sure where Ive heard that before... You might be onto something.
QuoteI have gone to the dark side.
.. or maybe you just want the cookies
Quote from: Steve on Jul 07, 08:27 AM 2016
GLC ypu basically said you need to increase accuracy of predictions. Not sure where Ive heard that before... You might be onto something.
Well I came to that conclusion too. Well at least I've found that out fast enough so I not need to play ec's or 1e and 3e doz crap after 20 years. You was right all along. So does recruit. But he is a douchebag.
Did you read TG's post on Gamblers Forum ? How he talk about overcome the small HE ? Still no idea what to think about that. It's called. ... is roulette really random
Whats the one thing you need to KNOW
THE DISTRIBUTION OF NON-HITS
Study that and you'll have a chance
You will get the same distribution of non hits with either rng or real spins. But you can only beat real spins, and it's not with statistics. You cannot beat roulette with statistics.
Knowing the number of pockets and basic average amount of occurrences tells you nothing useful about the next spin. Nothing that changes the odds. Any proper testing proves it.
Quote from: Steve on Jul 07, 05:25 PM 2016
You will get the same distribution of non hits with either rng or real spins. But you can only beat real spins, and it's not with statistics. You cannot beat roulette with statistics.
Knowing the number of pockets and basic average amount of occurrences tells you nothing useful about the next spin. Nothing that changes the odds. Any proper testing proves it.
So....of course you can decline to answer, but does TG have a winning maths method that has an edge, not involving AP.
AP just means "strategies that work". It doesn't necessarily mean vb etc. Math is used in AP, but not in a way like RRRR is rare so B is due next.
I know nothing about Turbos method so can't comment. Where can I learn more?
Quote from: Steve on Jul 07, 06:38 PM 2016Where can I learn more?
Well his statement on his profile...maths beats a maths game....for starters
Playing his personal numbers not past
Betting a set amount and adding to them as they win ....described as a mild positive progression...and taking off what isnt hitting each 37 cycle over a few cycles of 37
Law of the third really (my words)
But he calls it betting on numbers that hit above average and removing numbers that dont.
An example would be to play all 12 of a doz.and add as they win and at 37...take 1 chip off all 12.
Same for next cycle.
Quote from: Steve on Jul 07, 05:25 PM 2016You will get the same distribution of non hits with either rng or real spins. But you can only beat real spins,
Look how many don´t understand that virgin crossing of 19vs18, or how you get there
It isnt enough information to go on. Below are comments in blue:
Quote from: Turner on Jul 07, 06:56 PM 2016Well his statement on his profile...maths beats a maths game.
Math is used everywhere, but needs to be used in the right way to increase accuracy of predictions. Without knowing HOW he uses maths, I couldnt know if his approaches are valid.
Playing his personal numbers not past
Maybe he uses a valid bet selection method but only bets when predictions are his personal numbers. That would still be valid.
Betting a set amount and adding to them as they win and taking off what isnt hitting each 37 cycle over a few cycles of 37
Money management helps only when the bet selection produces an edge (better than random accuracy)
Law of the third really (my words)
This law is no different to saying "the more spins there are, the more even the distribution". It doesnt at all help to win roulette, because you have no idea what numbers will spin next (no idea with any increase in accuracy.)
But he calls it betting on numbers that hit above average and removing numbers that dont.
That approach doesn't work. Each number has its own independent odds. Its the same approach as thinking something is "due". If you consider the bets made on just ONE number, the illusion fades.
I'm only judging based on what you have said. If you have anything he or anyone has said, I explain whether or not its valid theory, and why.
Also I'm aware some people think I have some hidden agenda to deceptively censor the holy grail. It is just a dumb thing to say. I'll make this very clear:
If anyone posts something that works, I will say it works. And if its better than that I have, I will start using it myself. There is no agenda to censor anything here. The only moderation done is explained in the forum rules. I do not care if anyone says something opposing AP. All Im saying with beating roulette is you need to change the odds. You cant do that with statistics, at least in the way most people try.
Some people that were banned in the past are claiming BS that i banned them because they had a winning system. You'd have to really be dim to think that. If someone tries selling a system outside the sames area, or they try to lure people to PM where they cant be criticized by experienced members, then they will probably be banned. Unless they broke other rules that apply to everyone, those are the only circumstances where a "seller" would be banned. If anyone wants to test that theory, go ahead and sell something in the matter permitted.
Quote from: nottophammer on Jul 07, 07:00 PM 2016Look how many don´t understand that virgin crossing of 19vs18, or how you get there
Please explain it to me then.
I tried this system a while back. It's not consistent lost money. :q :q
Quote from: Steve on Jul 07, 07:12 PM 2016Also I'm aware some people think I have some hidden agenda to deceptively censor the holy grail.
Lol....I was asked in pm if if I was hired by you to block HG.
"Would you like to mod the forum...you seem fair and are here a lot"
That was my secret task, should I wish to take it
Thats it lol.
Proper CIA/MI5 stuff this.
BTW....I am getting flashes of adverts on android phone as I change pages
That reminds me, are you still ok with 35% commission on sales, and $500 per HG you censor?
Btw its not flashes of ads. It's the new image background. Its cool.
Quote from: Proofreaders2000 on Jul 08, 01:48 AM 2016
I tried this system a while back. It's not consistent lost money. :q :q
Hey Proof,
How did you play?
Quote from: Steve on Jul 08, 04:11 AM 2016
That reminds me, are you still ok with 35% commission on sales, and $500 per HG you censor?
perfect.... :thumbsup:
:o can I be a Mod too ? I'm happy with 25%
Quote from: nottophammer on Jul 07, 11:32 AM 2016
Whats the one thing you need to KNOW
THE DISTRIBUTION OF NON-HITS
Study that and you'll have a chance
I think notto might be onto something here... I am noticing some patterns here that there might be something significant about the non-hits in both cycles and VdW. Perhaps we need to erase any repeats from our data and concentrate on the non-repeating data.
He has not only proven he is onto something
He has proven it WORKS regardless of what people think
KTF wins overcome the losing sessions by a long shot
It is not RRRR now bet B.........
Falkor, be specific. What patterns?
With my software I've tested many billions of rng spins, and millions of real spins, and never found any patterns related to sleepers or repeaters except in cases attributed to wheel bias. But bias doesn't cause repeats like your probably referring to. It just changes odds slightly.
Rg what do you consider proof?
Quote from: Steve on Jul 08, 08:31 AM 2016
Falkor, be specific. What patterns?
With my software I've tested many billions of rng spins, and millions of real spins, and never found any patterns related to sleepers or repeaters except in cases attributed to wheel bias. But bias doesn't cause repeats like your probably referring to. It just changes odds slightly.
Rg what do you consider proof?
I've only started to join these dots very recently. Building layers of repeats can tell us about potential future events and build a nice game - but all this information that is used to construct the multi-layered repeats game is contained entirely in the non-hits stream akin to a DNA sequence. I'm starting to see this pattern in many contexts now. It's like the Fibonacci sequence in nature - everything is pointing to the non-hits. But this is still a very fresh realization, so I have a lot more testing to do to see if my hypothesis is correct.
Quote from: RouletteGhost on Jul 08, 08:30 AM 2016
KTF wins overcome the losing sessions by a long shot
It does ?
Falkor, if you or anyone specify a clear algoritm or theory that appears to be new, i can have it coded for proper testing. It's not realistic to manually test most approaches because the results are still within normal random expectation
Steve, hopefully I can come up with something soon and will post it in the Random Throughts thread. I wouldn't want to waste your time unless I had something concrete. I already glimpsed the power of non-hits via VdW, and I liked what I saw; now I might be seeing the same with cycles. This weekend will be the cycles tests and the last week of July will be VdW. Will keep you posted innit! :thumbsup:
Quote from: Steve on Jul 08, 08:31 AM 2016
Falkor, be specific. What patterns?
With my software I've tested many billions of rng spins, and millions of real spins, and never found any patterns related to sleepers or repeaters except in cases attributed to wheel bias. But bias doesn't cause repeats like your probably referring to. It just changes odds slightly.
Rg what do you consider proof?
I dont need harcore solid math proof
Because i know the math and odds never change
Im talking about the hundreds of sessions notto posted on this forum
Thats all i need to consider it a decent method
The losses always recoup and fast.
Dont agree? Thats fine
rg I can easily profit in thousands of spins with rng making random bets, at least some of the time. The results are meaningless. We go in circles with this stuff.
You say you get it all, but then make incorrect statements, but also that you dont care because youre a hobby player. Dont get me wrong, I dont care what you do with your money. I just dont want people to be misled and harmed by dangerously inaccurate advice. But If the losses recoup as you say, go make your fortune.
Quote from: Steve on Jul 08, 10:36 AM 2016
rg I can easily profit in thousands of spins with rng making random bets, at least some of the time. The results are meaningless. We go in circles with this stuff.
You say you get it all, but then make incorrect statements, but also that you dont care because youre a hobby player. Dont get me wrong, I dont care what you do with your money. I just dont want people to be misled and harmed by dangerously inaccurate advice. But If the losses recoup as you say, go make your fortune.
Ok
QuoteI dont need harcore solid math proof
::) ::) ::)
QuoteIm talking about the hundreds of sessions notto posted on this forum
QuoteHe has not only proven he is onto something
He has proven it WORKS regardless of what people think
KTF wins overcome the losing sessions by a long shot
The sessions are statistically insignificant. I know you probably don't realize, but your post above, is what's wrong with many roulette forums.
Quoterg I can easily profit in thousands of spins with rng making random bets, at least some of the time. The results are meaningless.
Steve,
Bingo. There's one of the big problems. There's the gap. They don't understand why.
Quote from: shazwad on Mar 27, 01:52 PM 2012However sometimes your progression can get very high and I once saw one group sleeping for 32 spins
I see a group of 9#'s on the mat sleep for 34 spins, whilst using grandpaa way, worst still, times a dozen slept for 34 spins.
Is this a case of not using the wheel layout, whats the part on the mat that has part of the wheels layout,but saying this i have seen #'s 32 to 13 miss for 24 spins.
If you're clocking the wheel dont you need to be using whats trending,not waiting for something to catch up
General, the casinos are stupid. They know nothing about math and statistics. Players know better. Thats why casinos lose billions to system players. I dont undrstand the fuss about maths and statistics. Its all meaningless, right? I dont need to win over 1m spins, only 10 spins. If play 10 spins, long term statistics dont count.
(wtf??)
Quote from: The General on Jul 08, 10:54 PM 2016
::) ::) ::)
The sessions are statistically insignificant. I know you probably don't realize, but your post above, is what's wrong with many roulette forums.
Steve,
Bingo. There's one of the big problems. There's the gap. They don't understand why.
Dont need your input. Never did. Never will.
Your theory is if someone wins it is meaningless because they aren't playing your way. Its funny.
Your one of those life long parasites that stay with the shark forever
There are winners and losers. Most are loser. The winners think they have the hg, until they play more. The losers see reality earlier.
QuoteKTF wins overcome the losing sessions by a long shot
The math only matters if it supports their latest system when it's winning. Once it's losing, the math mysteriously doesn't matter any longer. ::)
Quote"Im talking about the hundreds of sessions ..."
(link:://:.reactiongifs.us/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/shaking_head_breaking_bad.gif)
Hundreds. Wow then, that must be prove. ::)
I will let you be. Bye
You are the biggest time waster
You neeeeed a hobby
RouletteGhost,
Sorry, but this isn't just about YOU. ::)
(link:://:.reactiongifs.us/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/shaking_head_breaking_bad.gif)
It's a much larger systemic problem.
Quote from: The General on Jul 09, 02:42 PM 2016
RouletteGhost,
Sorry, but this isn't just about YOU. ::)
(link:://:.reactiongifs.us/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/shaking_head_breaking_bad.gif)
It's a much larger systemic problem.
Nah. People win using systems. Accept that cowboy
Stop wastin your timeeee
(link:://:.gamblinghelper.com/files/images/teenage-gambling-addiction.preview.png)
Unfortunately, the cartoon describes many of the people on this forum, not just Ghost.
Quote from: The General on Jul 09, 03:37 PM 2016
(link:://:.gamblinghelper.com/files/images/teenage-gambling-addiction.preview.png)
Unfortunately, the cartoon describes many of the people on this forum, not just Ghost.
You can leave anytime cowboy
Ten four over and out
(link:://:.reactiongifs.us/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/shaking_head_breaking_bad.gif)
Quote from: The General on Jul 09, 03:44 PM 2016
(link:://:.reactiongifs.us/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/shaking_head_breaking_bad.gif)
(link:://:.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/hate-it-when-it-does-that.gif)
(link:://:.plannedscape.net/Fiala/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Ignorance_NotAVirtue_-942x758.png)
Quote from: The General on Jul 09, 09:20 PM 2016
(link:://:.plannedscape.net/Fiala/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Ignorance_NotAVirtue_-942x758.png)
By definition you would be the ignorant one. The forum you are on combined with what you believe is ignorance. You wouldn't be here, you would be on WOV, thats ignorant.
COWBOY.
Another post ruined with Caleb and RGs love affair graffiti :question:
Quote from: IronSteel on Apr 25, 06:34 PM 2012
During these last weeks I experienced some hard sessions, from which I ended up losing a couple (didn't lose my whole bankroll though) but my final monthly balance is positive still.
This system needs to be played with extreme caution
Take some time off roulette, and come back after some months with a clean mentality and start all over again starting from the fact that there is no such thing as a 100%
Good luck to all
Good luck to you :lol: