Smart live air ball rigged ?

[ugly bob]

ausguy

If you go to the smartlive homepage, click on the mini social roulette. You get a different view where you can see the dealer and wheel constantly in shot. This makes me think the live wheel is straight.

[ADulay]

Any thoughts on the matter that the air ball is rigged.

I haven't noticed anyobdy who wins that says the air ball machines are rigged.   Coincidence?

I think they could perhaps blow a little extra air into a betted pocket just enough to stop a ball landing there.

Yep, most probably they have a floor person watching your wagers and then they just push the button to make sure the ball just flops out of the Red and into the Black. 

Get serious.

AD

[Kingspin]

But there are thousands playing the same wheel. How could they rig it so you and everyone lose.

Super casino i do trust 100 per cent.  Adulay can say what he likes but i am telling you that low stakes air ball
at smart live is fishy. My own personal opinion by the way,  and i don't need believers , i stand by what i say.

[Kingspin]

Adulay what do you know about the technical way this air ball works , besides even presuming you are right and the air
ball wheel is legit the video feed could be rigged in some way.  End of thread i am saying nothing else on this matter.
Happy christmas adulay, and merry x mas to all forum members. Time to rest!

[Turner]

My own personal opinion by the way,  and i don't need believers , i stand by what i say.

I so like this

[Kingspin]

Well you would like it , it's a post from heaven sent 

[ADulay]

Adulay what do you know about the technical way this air ball works , besides even presuming you are right and the air
ball wheel is legit the video feed could be rigged in some way.  End of thread i am saying nothing else on this matter.
Happy christmas adulay, and merry x mas to all forum members. Time to rest!

Kingspin,

  I'm basing my validation by watching and playing on several "air ball" machines in real B&M casinos, not online.  I've looked for most of the odd behavior that several have mentioned and have not seen it to date on the Interblock Organic machines that we have locally.

  With regards to online, live air ball (or live dealer) roulette wheels, I've taken the time to visually verify that what I'm seeing on the screen is, in fact, a true game and NOT a video display sent out.

  How?  Well, as I can see the roulette dealer in the background of the baccarat game that I'm playing, when it comes time for a shuffle, I've jumped over to the roulette game (same studio) and seen the same girl on the wheel who was on it on the first screen and the baccarat table (now in the background) was being shuffled!

  And to add to this, I've run multiple computers to the individual games (roulette and baccarat) to confirm that both were running at the same time and it was most definitely live, not a video to cheat the dollar bettor on the wheel.

  So, as I've "proved" it to my own personal satifaction AT THIS ONE CASINO, I believe that the game is legitimate, as is the air ball machine at my local B&M.

  To anyone else reading this.    Do not take anyone's word on this stuff.  Check it out yourself, verify it and once YOU are convinced that it's legitimate, play it.   If not, just walk away and try to document why you believe it's "rigged" against you.

End of thread i am saying nothing else on this matter.

Which really means "I have no valid data to substantiate my position on this."
Not the best way to continue with a rational discussion, eh?

  AD

[ausguy]

AD - Regarding your verification of airball at your chosen B & M casino I'm wondering how you do that?

Like speed changes to wheel & ball only need to be small to place the drop some distance from where it would land on a "naturally spun" wheel & ball. So unless you have a high speed camera with inbuilt accurate timing it's not humanly possible to detect micro speed changes?

Let me give an example using hypothetical speeds. The wheel is set spinning at 30 rpm & the ball is sent spinning in the opposite direction at 40 rpm. With the bets placed and locked the micro processor in the machine determines that the least bet area is 7 numbers centered around zero.

At nano second speeds the program tracks the wheel & ball speed via electronic switching and finely increases the wheel speed to 33.4 rpm while undetectable air holes in the ball track allow very small ball speed reductions. The physics of this are built into the program so once the speeds are co-ordinated it's a 100% certainty that it can hit a small zone on the table.
The manufacturers would have tested all this extensively. It's even possible that the program has "learn" capabilities so that each sited machine can eventually hit any chosen number most of the time?

Wheel manufacturer Cammergh features all this on their promo. site, so check that out.
The designs are becoming very sophisticated now in that the electronics are now hidden and the air wheels look identical to a live dealer wheel.

The Interblock wheel you mention, is that the model with the 18 oversize "diamonds" ball guides ? The gaps between the diamonds only cover 2 pockets ? There is a bracket with sensor above the ball track to allow the ball speed to be measured. The wheel is larger than standard with deep pockets to trap the ball as it quickly ramps down a steep apron. Very little ball bounce ?

I ask you if all they want is fair spins why do they have all these add ons that alter the results in the venues favour?

It would not suprise me if the ball had metal within it so it could be influenced by elecro magnets?

All this comes about because the air ball wheels are classed as ELECTRONIC GAMING MACHINES and are set up to give the venue a guaranteed % return. They are NOT automatic random spinning roulette wheels (wade through a gaming authorities rules sometime & you'll see what's what with all that). Just like slots that legally cheat you so do these air ball machines. They win your mind and then your money by making you think the wheels are the real deal. Granted not everybody loses but the majority will just like on live dealer games ?

It makes you wonder why they need to bother ?

I agree with you on the live dealer wheels.  I have reservations about on line air ball as most only show the wheel & there's no way to varify that the spin image is true live. Even if it was, the speeds can be modded as already mentioned.

We on the forums are just a small minority that try and examine aspects that most players don't worry about. The vast majority just want to have fun and put their trust in Lady Luck.

My local casino made $2 billion profit last year. As in tennis for them it's game, set & match.

[Gordonline]

Hi All


I mainly play on SL but always the Live Wheel, and occasionally I might email a presenter live on air and straight away it's mentioned live on air, that proves there's no video running


When people are losing or they see the ball bounce in the winning pocket and drop in the pocket next door, they think its rigged, that's life and physics, get over it, I'm always moaning when the ball drops nowhere near my winning number and then drops in for the win lol


Casinos don't need to rig the wheels when the gullible human gambler will eventually lose their money


Merry Xmas


Gordon

[Chrisbis]

A most informative Topic.

Thank you gents. 

[Darkplayer]

Is airball rigged or not?

[Ralph]

On a live or multiuser game, how do you think they adjust the outcome just for you? Probably is the whole table covered. If 1000 bets on the table (which is normal). It does not matter where the ball falls for the casino profit. 

[ausguy]

Dark - Yes I think they are rigged.  What's your MO with roulette ?

The post before yours from Gordonline is misleading as he's talking about Smart Live = SL - Real dealer, where as this thread is specific to the air ball auto wheel.

We have 2 different animals here & 2 different classes given by  GA = gaming authorities. Live dealer is random spun result roulette wheel, so all betting results are accepted as they fall. Sometimes the casino may lose money due to big player wins & other times it's the reverse. Over time the house advantage will always see the casino in profit due to the zero & 35 : 1 payout instead of the true odds of 36 : 1. So every wheel cheats every player all the time on payouts.
The USA with twin zero wheels is worse because they still only pay 35 : 1 off 38 numbers.

Air ball wheels are actually classed EGMs electronic gaming machines. by GAs. This is because the results are manipulated by software & hardware. Player payout % is audited. Poker/slot machines are similar and are also EGMs. That in itself says a lot.

The SL air ball machines are made by the Cammergh roulette wheel co.  If you go to their site you can see the same wheels that SL has.

While on the site look up their product > wheels & check out their RRS 360 model. RRS = random rotor speed. Another feature is air jet holes in the ball track.
They even openly state as an example that the RRS makes the ball drop in another part of the wheel.  I quote " 20 dropped with RRS active instead of 4" (if non active).
Thats 1/2 the wheel away.

Not everybody loses on airball as on poker/slot machines, it's just that a hell of a lot more players lose than win.

Just as I was about to post this Ralphs comment came in. My view is that the whole table may be covered  with bets but the game programs high speed processor will, at micro second speed, assess all the bet positions & choose a number or zone that gives them the best profit return. It would in this way avoid many higher bet payouts.
If they did it any other way they would go broke. I Differ with Ralphs view and maintain that it does matter where the ball falls otherwise they wouldn't rig the results.

I again remind you EGM wheels not true random hand spun wheels.

[Steve]

Almost every modern auto wheel uses some sort of ball or rotor manipulation, so they are not natural spins like you'd get with a normal wheel.

[iggiv]

i cant see difference between dealer and slingshot in playtech