Probability for 13 in a row.

[Obi Wan]

Ok odds do come into the equation of wheel bias, but only if you can find a bias that is strongly in your favour, then the odds change from being in the casinos favour to your favour. But this was not where  i was coming from. I was on the lines of the definition of wheel bias.

Saying all this, there are easier ways to beat roulette these days. Also as ausguy said, most casinos have data loggers on there wheels to alert the casino of any bias that develops, the wheel will then be subject to calibration.

[Ralph]

I wrote before it is not a chance to find a bias wheel today, expect from some  obscure places, where they may rob a winner.


A wheel  physical is never perfect, but perfect enough to keep the house advantages.


The surrender rule have less house advantages on EC, and they are not all in a sector, a wheel bias towards red is hard to think off.

[Obi Wan]

Yes true a wheel is never perfect.  The casino edge 2.7% always remains the same unless you approach with professional methods. Visual ballistics is one of them. Roulette can only be beaten by the approach of physics.

[Ralph]

How can we use physics? Using it without cheating?  If we cheat and at the same time complain a casino may be rigged?


Fair play has casino rules, win if you are lucky, casinos can never be a source of free money.


If you win a 1000, some other has lost it.

[Obi Wan]

Exploiting a physical object that is there is not cheating, its about being smart and seeing roulette for what it really is (a ball and wheel) You can use electronics to assist you that are legal in around 50% of the world.

I'm not sure i understand you comment about casino being rigged. Can you be more clear please?

[Ralph]

There are rigged casinos, but not the common we use, a big casino maximise theire profit using fairness.


I live in Europe, the casinos has one zero, do not mind computers. WHY, they do not work.


I have seen a computer(not in a shoe, open) and they casino staff told him it was not allowed to put on the table, but he could sit in the sofa, and bet as soon he want, as player standing, which is most of players. It is six or eight chairs and maybe 20 players. Some play more than one table,

[Obi Wan]

There are rigged casinos, but not the common we use, a big casino maximise theire profit using fairness.


I live in Europe, the casinos has one zero, do not mind computers. WHY, they do not work.


I have seen a computer(not in a shoe, open) and they casino staff told him it was not allowed to put on the table, but he could sit in the sofa, and bet as soon he want, as player standing, which is most of players. It is six or eight chairs and maybe 20 players. Some play more than one table,

Casinos are not rigged ralph, why would they be?

I find it hard to believe you saw some one using a computer, i don't think anybody would be that stupid enough to clock a roulette wheel in front of casino staff. Also you cannot say something does not work if you don't know what it is or does.

[Ralph]

I tell you, I have seen a guy using a computer at a casino in Hamburg, he had no problem using it a few meter from the table. I am not sure about today's rule, this was about 20 years ago.


If you clock a wheel, and win, are you sure it was helping?

[Obi Wan]

Todays rule? expect the computer to be stamped on if attempting to use it in front of casino staff. Again i don't understand how anybody could be that stupid.

[ausguy]

20 years ago 1993.  Microprocessors, mini cameras would not be up to the job needed to be effective back then to read & process information in time to get the bets down.
  1993 is 2 years before Windows 95.  Windows 95, 98, ME2000 & XP don't cut it these days. Even Vista is borderline. Windows 7 & 8 show how technology has progressed. The improvements in processing speeds (Intel etc.) and shrinking the size allows more bang for the buck.

Intergrate this into smart phones with hi res cameras, which they have with stunning success, realistically it's only in recent years that ball drop technology is viable.
Most of us should have seen Steves information on this technology.

In 2005 Hungarian Lazlo Kovacs got busted in his Sydney Australia hotel room with about $140,000 won on roulette at our local casino.
Casino pit bosses became suspicious with him constantly watching the wheel then placing late bets & mostly winning big amounts.
In the raid police found a thick pair of glasses with a mini camera fitted. A wire went to one of his shoes with a hollow heel.
In the heel was a computer with a wire connected to an earpiece. The program gave calculated numbers. This shows 8 years ago mini units were still to come.
As to 13 in a row, these days and into the future with high tech wheels & dealers combined mixing the results more consistantly I think the probability is near zero.

sorry for the italics, a keyboard fault stopped me from switching ?

[Obi Wan]

20 years ago 1993.  Microprocessors, mini cameras would not be up to the job needed to be effective back then to read & process information in time to get the bets down.
  1993 is 2 years before Windows 95.  Windows 95, 98, ME2000 & XP don't cut it these days. Even Vista is borderline. Windows 7 & 8 show how technology has progressed. The improvements in processing speeds (Intel etc.) and shrinking the size allows more bang for the buck.

Intergrate this into smart phones with hi res cameras, which they have with stunning success, realistically it's only in recent years that ball drop technology is viable.
Most of us should have seen Steves information on this technology.

In 2005 Hungarian Lazlo Kovacs got busted in his Sydney Australia hotel room with about $140,000 won on roulette at our local casino.
Casino pit bosses became suspicious with him constantly watching the wheel then placing late bets & mostly winning big amounts.
In the raid police found a thick pair of glasses with a mini camera fitted. A wire went to one of his shoes with a hollow heel.
In the heel was a computer with a wire connected to an earpiece. The program gave calculated numbers. This shows 8 years ago mini units were still to come.
As to 13 in a row, these days and into the future with high tech wheels & dealers combined mixing the results more consistantly I think the probability is near zero.

sorry for the italics, a keyboard fault stopped me from switching ?

Hungarian Lazlo Kovacs - was he the bloke involved in the ritz team who took over a mill? Was unaware of this, cheers for the info.

[ausguy]

Just did a bit of checking on Google  The Ritz team did not involve Kovacs according to the info. about the sting. The timeline was Dec 2004 and saw a 32 aged Hungarian woman & 2 Serbian men aged 32 & 38. Over 2 days they won 1.3 million GBP. Eventually they were cleared of illegal play & paid their winnings.

They got away with it because the prediction equipment did not interfer with the rotation of the wheel or the ball, thus the number outcome was not interferred with in any way by the Ritz team. At that time UK gambling laws did not factor in computerized predictions. As no laws were broken then under the gambling gaming rules the casino was obligated to pay them, which they did.

I didn't see any connection attributed to the Ritz  woman & Kovaks, both Hungarian. However the Ritz sting was only 4 months before the Kovacs episode.
Correction on my previous post on Kovacs shoe computer re : the wire to earpiece. An article said the connection was wireless.
Also mention was made that Kovacs was caught in Sydney but was thought to have visited many other Australian Casinos & winning & transferring large amounts of money overseas. Only Kovacs knows the true facts.
Plenty of info on Google etc.

[Ralph]

There are a lot of everthing on Google, but we must check it up, information is not the same as true or fact.

[ausguy]

Ralph - The reports are from media that gain open public information from decisions made by courts/police prosecutors/casino management.
AS are the media, Google too are just another messenger. They don't express any opinion.
So Ralph don't speak in riddles. Explain how you or anyone else can otherwise convieniently check up on any facts ? By deduction of what you stated if information is not the same as true or fact then the information I have given about The Ritz team & Kovacs is false ?
Do you have alternate information that refutes the media reports on this matter, as viewed on Google ?

[Ralph]

Google and Youtube are  sources with a lot of information, where all has to be checked double.

I just wrote about Google indexing everthing, and did not take any  standpoint in the case of the  Ritz team and Kovas, did I?


We can use internet as source of information, but at least not read more than there are as you may do answer my post.