Where are Forum's most experienced members?

[RouletteGhost]

I disagree with mr j and steve on this

While yes it is correct that betting 30 numbers is 30 independent bets with own variance the roulette wheel still has limits

If you wait for an extreme then go in to bet you have better chances

Hypothetically speaking : say dozen 123 321 231 sequence was only observed twice in 100 thousand spins, and then you happen to see  123 321 the next day then you should know to bet against 231

It is random but theres limits. Just like a color wont streak over 30 times

I don't think turbo, buff, or mr Js method are any different then some others. Its still gambling and can still lose. Mind you lots of turbos methods are similar to others here..and thats not an insult at all. Im just saying roulette is roulette. .....and we are all playing it.....

If you saw 25 reds in a row would you not start betting black?  We know the answer

[soggett]

Since I was mentioned ( I am honored to be amongst the best in your list ), I will reply.

I have a habit to take time away from the wheel to clear my head. I stop thinking about roulette, systems, progressions, and then suddenly the good stuff comes to mind. I then come back and see things with "fresh eyes". I see things that I have missed, understand what I did not and so on. Lot's of "ooooohhhh thats what he meant" moments, hope you get what I mean.
I am still here, learning after 5+ years.

What I see now is what was said while I was a newbie - same old same old. Ideas that have been tried and still come up because everybody wants it easy, a system to make 10000 a day with 100 BR.
I believe most older members don't respond anymore cause they are tired with explaining things over and over. I feel them. Its just how most of us humans are, we want it all here and now. A person with 2 days of roulette experience will come and present a moneymaker - bet on red and double till win. You will tell him it is not good and after some time he will realize you were right. Now he demands you give him your system or the HG, you say no, argue, etc.  He leaves, stays, doesn't matter because tomorrow another comes and its rinse and repeat.

Well that is maybe not a good example but just to get a good idea about how it is.

RouletteGhost - 123 123 xxx  - xxx can be 123 the same way it can be 111 it does not matter, the ball doesn't know if it lands in dozen 1 or 2, the chances are the same. Couple of years ago I did something similar, I took a 10 spin sequence of R/B and bet against it happening right next - so that spins 11-20 would not be the same as 1-10 (don't know the odds but they should be similar as your example). Guess what happened next? On my very first test I got the same sequence to repeat... I was shocked, disappointed but I learned from it.

The thing is, you need to learn from your own mistakes - that is the only way.
And the older members mean well, they want to stop you from making the same mistakes as they did (how many people tried roulette with the double up system first - like 90% of us).
But not everybody can take critic, and most have to go through it to see for themselves.

Anyway, not to go too much off topic.

I am alive and well   

Still reading up, still learning from the "veterans", still testing, still playing...
Still having ooohhh moments even now (rarer and rarer but still).

Currently on my "to do" list is GUT, I am reading it again (for the fourth time I think) and ti's starting to make sense a little, but the first few times it didn't, I couldn't understand anything. Proof that with experience, time, you get to see differently, you grow. As will you all. I have looked back on systems that i tried when I was new, that I tested and now I can only laugh, I wouldn't bother with them now. But I learned from them and I grew.

Anyway, sorry for the long post. Everybody have a beer and let's all work toghether 

[RouletteGhost]

If anyone can show evidence of a marquee showing dozen formation 123123123 i will digress

Exactly the ball doesnt know where it landed. Its very hard for the wheel to spit out fixed pattern like 123123123 or 221221221

We can capitalize on it. Better then betting blindly

[soggett]

If anyone can show evidence of a marquee showing dozen formation 123123123 i will digress

Exactly the ball doesnt know where it landed. Its very hard for the wheel to spit out fixed pattern like 123123123 or 221221221

We can capitalize on it. Better then betting blindly

What is the difference between 123123123 and  322231121? there is none. What we call a "pattern" is just how our brain works, 123123 is a pattern but 213323 is not - and that is wrong. It is the same thing and it has the same chance of showing. You maybe wont see it today or tomorrow but next week you will hit it 10 times and bust.
If a dozen can sleep for 30+ spins then it has the same chance of going 1212121212121212121... for 30+spins as it has 2323232323232323... and 1313131313131...
That is something you have to learn, not only you. And it doesn't matter if it's dozens, EC, streets... it is all the same.

[RouletteGhost]

I understand

So

123211 just occurred

Will it happen again right after as
123211123211? It can but unlikely

[soggett]

I understand

So

123211 just occurred

Will it happen again right after as
123211123211? It can but unlikely

it is likely to appear as any other combination - that is what I am trying to tell you. The odds are the same.
You asked if we see 25 reds won't we back black? Ask the guy that saw 34 reds that question. I believe it was Albalaha or Ego (can't remember) that said they saw over 40 in a row.
A 100 Reds in a row has the same chance of hitting as 100 Black or RBRBRBR... or what ever comes, you are not getting an edge by waiting - that is the point.

I know you can't see it now but you will. There was a time when I didn't see it either.

But that are extremes, I will try to explain it easier. lets simplify, not taking zero in account for ease of example
you wait for 123123 and then you bet against 123 right?
now, not to mention the time spent waiting and getting 123122 and such. All betting opportunities you will have will be after 123123 - correct?
so you would bet max three times after that pattern with the 139 marty, ok.

All possible outcomes are
123123 and
2 - win
3 - win
11 - win
13 - win
121 - win
122 - win
123 - lose

you have 6 wins per 1 loss
the same thing if u would have not waited and bet against 123 from the start.
do you see now?
Maybe I suck at explaining, maybe language barrier but I am trying to save you money

[RouletteGhost]

I know exactly what you are saying

Im saying we can bet against those extremes

If we saw an extreme like 25 blacks i would do something i normally wouldnt. Marty on red.

Btw i enjoy your post's

[NextYear]

Respect to all of You, that find time and good will to give us few (or more) words of wisdom.
Somehow you are like old philosophers which should be read and quoted.
Somehow like parents (of the Forum), that will sometimes give a helping hand even if we don't deserve it.

Thank you. This is the List of Legends (sounds sentimental, as it should be):

@ Chris555p
@ TurboGenius
@ Azim
@ Sogget
@ Colbster
@ Turner
@ Iggiv
@ MrJ
@ GLC
@ TwoCatSam
@ Proofreaders2000
@ Ignatus
@

I would like to invite everyone from the old times, even if I forgot to put them on the first Invitation list.
Please, come in and say Hello, tell us something from your experience!

Mods, I would like to keep updated this list in future, if possible, as Members are coming on the scene!

[TurboGenius]

Somehow you are like old philosophers which should be read and quoted.
Somehow like parents (of the Forum), that will sometimes give a helping hand even if we don't deserve it.

The only problem with that, in some cases - is that newer people have ideas and post them, then someone like me (or others) reply back with their own experiences and facts.. but the new person won't take that advice. It's hard to listen to someone else telling you that you are wrong (lol).
I remember one of my biggest "rivals" at GG in the old days was Mark (a few others also) - and as I showed up posting my ideas they would point out what was wrong with it.
I didn't want to listen to what they said, I was sure that I was right - somehow.
Like my "basics that no one wants to hear" thread - basically the same thing.
Those are facts of the game, but we could go all day arguing about it, and it won't matter to someone who swears they are right. And I used to be that way also.
It takes a long time to get to the point where things are clearer - maybe it's just a road that people have to take.
Also - seeing the same kinds of methods over and over through time is tough.
Most of what people are posting/coming up with today has been done before - in some cases
many times. (There's only so many ways to do the same thing).
You can go back to the old GG forum archives and read - you'll see everything that's being posted today (but this was over a decade ago). So people can always use the past data as a reference for learning before they jump on a topic and post it (thinking that it's something they just thought up).
I think I'm old enough now to see it like a parent (lol) - You can tell your kid something, they won't listen - they think they're right, eventually they find out that you were right. It's a process that has to happen I suppose.
Thanks for the kind words.

[NextYear]

When I was a boy of 14, my father was so ignorant I could hardly stand to have the old man around.
But when I got to be 21, I was astonished at how much the old man had learned in seven years.

[TurboGenius]

I used the wrong analogy lol.
Math and facts don't change due to someone age, experience, etc.
It's always what it is. Math is something that can't be argued over and is the foundation of
this game.
So it's either that someone can learn from experience (or the experience of others) or they can learn on their own... The end result is the same

"Teaching an old dog new tricks" doesn't apply in this case.

[TurboGenius]

it is likely to appear as any other combination - that is what I am trying to tell you. The odds are the same.
...
But that are extremes, I will try to explain it easier. lets simplify, not taking zero in account for ease of example

This is true. 123123123 showing up is the exact same odds and probability as 12312312X where X is 1,2 or 3 equally. (past spins can't be used in a game like this).
As for the 0 or 0 and 00 - Big difference when it comes to working this out.
It's those zeros that come into play and kill a method like this.
Simpler to explain without using them, but the math completely changes and makes it worse for the player as well.

[NextYear]

So Turbo, what do you think, is Gutway the only way?

What would you recommend to some of us willing to earn serious money (still thinking it is possible), from Roulette and ready to learn whatever it takes (although short in time).
What to read from this Forum, who's posts will help most?

Just your opinion, how would you start if you were starting today?

Thanks

[TurboGenius]

So Turbo, what do you think, is Gutway the only way?

What would you recommend to some of us willing to earn serious money (still thinking it is possible), from Roulette and ready to learn whatever it takes (although short in time).
What to read from this Forum, who's posts will help most?

Just your opinion, how would you start if you were starting today?

Thanks

That's a good question. If I were starting out today - knowing everything that I do now...
My first thought would be to avoid systems/methods all together. (Not because they are bad or
can't work, I'm not anti-systems at all).
I would certainly explore Dealer Signature more. I always thought it was a meaningless way
to approach the game. I can dig up my old posts from GG and other places where I pointed out
how it was simply impossible... A wheel spinning one way, the ball spinning the other way - the bounce and scatter - all these telling me how impossible it was that this could be a legitimate way to predict winning numbers. (laughs.)
I was wrong of course and had to do my own research - I have to admit that I was shocked.
It's not even difficult to do.
I would also spend much of my time playing a system or two (or three).
It would have to not go against any of my "rules" - past spins, triggers, start points-stop points, negative progression, etc. Which would narrow it down to playing numbers on the table
and adding to the winners while removing the ones that don't show up.
The way to win of course is to play the numbers that show up (having the bet on them when they do show up of course, not betting them after it has happened).... and by not playing the numbers that don't show up. It seems impossible but it's not.
Remember - the casino wins because long term random creates a balance (more or less).
In a Perfect World (for the casino) 38 numbers would show up in 38 spins - they would be almost
certain to always have their edge constantly - but they don't. It never happens that way.
#10 could show up 5 times in 38 spins - I want to have been on it at least 4 of those wins.
#9 could not show up at all - I don't want to be betting on it.
And no one can predict the future but in a way we can.... that's probably best for another thread though.

So Turbo, what do you think, is Gutway the only way?

I couldn't answer that without all of the specifics on it, which I don't know at this time.
There are certainly good and bad ways to play, even though the math stays the same - not all systems/methods win or lose equally

[TurboGenius]

I left out "computers" purposely because unless something can be exposed and used for what it is - I don't see it as a option...
I can say to the casino "I'm using a system I came up and I'm going to win" and they can laugh.
I can't say "I'm using a hidden device in your casino to win" because if I'm lucky I'll get booted out-the-door. lol. I don't want to think of the worst case scenario either.
I'm not saying that they don't work - I'm simply saying that it's not an option that I could use
for myself personally.