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#### MoneyT101

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##### Re: VdW
May 07, 12:51 PM 2017
so why are you not all rich from exploiting this on baccarat?

there is more to it

I had my own system before all this came together for me.... can I win now? Yes!

Do I have the money to invest into it right this minute? NO!

At the same time I am learning and trying new things and applying my original method with this...  I've tested live at casino and it's doing fine.  This week Monday I should start testing with chino change

Simple once you get it!  Chased all the pigeons away and they were already in their hole

#### RouletteGhost

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##### Re: VdW
May 07, 12:54 PM 2017
to me it seems if the VDW arithmetic progression could help with gambling then it should be a cash cow for baccart

the problem is the amount of possible APs
the key to winning with systems : play for a statistically irrelevant number of spins

#### RouletteGhost

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##### Re: VdW
May 07, 01:04 PM 2017
Quote
It's easy to make mistakes when first looking at this. Here is a little chart which tells you what AP combinations can appear during the 9 spins.

Spin 3 = 123
Spin 4 = 234
Spin 5 = 345, 135
Spin 6 = 456, 246
Spin 7 = 567, 357, 147
Spin 8 = 678, 468, 258
Spin 9 = 789, 579, 369, 159

16 AP combinations in total.

after spin 5 a progression wont help because you do not know WHICH AP it will be

so on spin 7 do you bet for 567, 357, or 147

how to know!?!?!?!?!
the key to winning with systems : play for a statistically irrelevant number of spins

#### MoneyT101

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##### Re: VdW
May 07, 01:30 PM 2017
after spin 5 a progression wont help because you do not know WHICH AP it will be

so on spin 7 do you bet for 567, 357, or 147

how to know!?!?!?!?!

I will say it one more time very clear.....

Normal vdw wont work!! Will be 50/50.  Need to play it against an IMBALANCED game.
Simple once you get it!  Chased all the pigeons away and they were already in their hole

#### RouletteGhost

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##### Re: VdW
May 07, 01:44 PM 2017
What game is imbalanced
the key to winning with systems : play for a statistically irrelevant number of spins

#### winkel

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##### Re: VdW
May 07, 01:55 PM 2017
I try to explain my idea with this baccarat-results in attachement:

B
B bet B 1unit
P lost
P bet P 3units
B lost there is no chance to find an AP up to draw 6 so restart

B
B bet B 7units
B won -11+14=3units restart

B
P
P bet P 1unit
T no result/no loss restart

B
P
B
B bet B 1unit
P lost
P don´t beet because there are 2 results for an AP 1 4 7 on B, 5 6 7 on P!

B
P
P bet on P 3units
B lost
B bet 7units on B
P lost and restart

B
B bet 15 units on B
P lost
B
B bet 31 units on B
P lost restart

B
B bet 63 units on B
B won -120+126=+6+4=10units

P
T (nonP)
P
P bet P 1 unit
B lost no chance to finish an AP in 6 draws so restart

P
P bet 3units on P
P won -4+6=+2+10=12 units

B
B

There is always a game

#### atlantis

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##### Re: VdW
May 07, 02:41 PM 2017
Tried it recording results into 2 columns.

"-"  = no bet

PP
BB
PB
PB  - w
PB  w -

BP
PP
BP  - w
PB
BB  w -

BP
BB
PP
BB
PB  - L
BP  w -

BP
PP
PB  - L
PB  w -

PB
BB
BP  - L
BP  w -

BP
BB
PB  L -
PB  - w

A.
Thru the darkness of Future Past the magician longs to see. One chants out between two worlds:
"Fire -- Walk with me!"

#### ozon

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##### Re: VdW
May 07, 02:41 PM 2017
We know for Vdw, that is stable selection and the variance is much milder, there is no extreme deviation in long run. But using an aggressive short term progression is pointless.
With all due respect, why playing such a progression would make sense?

#### MoneyT101

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##### Re: VdW
May 07, 03:01 PM 2017
What game is imbalanced

The game I created in the 'making random betselection non random' is very imbalanced!
Simple once you get it!  Chased all the pigeons away and they were already in their hole

#### Scarface

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##### Re: VdW
May 07, 06:43 PM 2017
This is a very risky progression...the example goes from 1 unit to 63 units!  And this isn't even worse case scenerio.

#### Kattila

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##### Re: VdW
May 08, 06:04 AM 2017

This are(again) few from my non random examples, now depending
what bet selection you choose to bet, will have different
LW registrys ( like LWLWLW....OR  LLWWLLWW....or
many others).  And yes it s about balance and imbalance ,
i would say *forced/pushed* balance or imbalance.
Put some order into random and will find good things.
Use numbers or splits, streets...

NR

12      a           a
4        b           a
23      a           b
7        b           b
34      a           a
4        b           a
18      a           b
9        b           b
28      a           a
3        b           a
5        a           b
29      b           b
33      a           a
1        b           a
17      a           b
15      b           b

----------------------------------------------

Nr

11      a           a
14      b           a
25      c           b
7        a           b
34      b           c
24      c           c
11      a           a
13      b           a
28      c           b
36      a           b
5        b           c
29      c           c
31      a           a
19      b           a
27      c           b
30      a           b
4        b           c
8        c           c

#### winkel

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##### Re: VdW
May 08, 11:24 AM 2017
This is a very risky progression...the example goes from 1 unit to 63 units!  And this isn't even worse case scenerio.

I presume, you only bet if there is a worse case scenario to proof, that all bets and progressions will lose.

What about the many occasions you would win this way?
And if a bet of 63 units with a total risc of 120 units is to big for your bankroll: don´t play roulette at all!

The bank holds 100000 units to win over you. and you start with 10 units to beat them?
David vs. Goliath is a nice but very rare event to happen!
There is always a game

#### cht

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##### Re: VdW
May 08, 02:58 PM 2017
I read alot of strats that require huge bankroll with long progression betting.

For B&M casino starting with min. at \$25 a 150units bankroll is large imo.

I'll only be interested in systems with flat bet of 10-12 units br. Start min. then compound the wins.

That's just me how I read the risk of the bet. Am I alone on this, what about others?
You will only be as clever and as stupid as the roulette "experts" on forum.

#### ozon

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##### Re: VdW
May 08, 04:12 PM 2017
Haha 10-20 units, people really know nothing about the probability and deviations.
I recomend read some about blackjack, even as it has an advantage when counting cards, the deviation can be -250 units from top, in the worst situation.
Even if we have 10% edge over casino. We can expect drawdowns of over -50 units.

#### winkel

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##### Re: VdW
May 08, 04:48 PM 2017
I'll only be interested in systems with flat bet of 10-12 units br. Start min. then compound the wins.

And you will tell us, that you win. Give us your system and we will praise you
There is always a game

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