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How is RNG tested for randomness?

Started by RouletteVixen, Apr 03, 12:16 PM 2013

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RouletteVixen

I am new here, but have studied RNG roulette using stats and math combined with probability etc extensively.

My question is, does anyone here REALLY know how a Random Number Generator is tested for randomness?

If someone out there has factual evidence of how it is truly tested, please be so kind as to share it with us. I am not referring to what they say on the Casino pages, I need someone who has had actual dealings with Randomness testing to answer this if possible.

Looking forward to any replies
Pure mathematics is, in its way, the poetry of logical ideas. ( Albert Einstein )

Ralph

There are testing methods for randomness, easy to use Google.  The way it is tested differ a bit, as it is not easy to determinate a random process. Any short outcome can be random even if it looks in order. Anyhow a large sample showing the expected statistical outcome is regarded random. Some roulette software has test for randomness.

Some outcomes as from a computer is regarded random, even if it is not, the main thing is the "hacker" should not get the  information we need to predict it.  The same goes for a BM roulette, if a player can get information during the spin so it is possible to predict better than the expected, the process is not random for the player which can gather the information.

How ever the random is generated, it is random if it is not possible to predict.  So many methods used by roulette players as the really think we can predict, has the meaning they do not think the process is random. "Reading" random  (with some success) is not possible
if we have information which gives an edge the process is not random for us.

Casinos use to get theire numbers from tested third parties. Few will license a casino which not has a high standard and audit for the randomness.

In some games the numbers are drawn before the player pick, it is still random as the player do not know the outcome.
At slots there you can double or fourfold the winnings by pick a card, the outcome is often decided beforehand, at the proper odds, so it does not matter which card you pick, it will be the same card showing, whatever you chose.

The question of random at a casino has not very much to do with if it should cheat, it is possible to send  "random" strings and still against the play, and very hard to proof from the numbers. We can be quite sure that is very rare, as the casinos maximise the profit using  the expected odds.

Casinos using TRNG are "true" random in that sense, there is no information available to break it, it is more sure than a real wheel.
At for example BV, they use TRNG and gives the number before decoded to proof for the randomness. It is true random, but should it by any method be possible to crack the code, it becomes not random for the hacker.  So the randomness has also to do with the information of it, any true random stream from a casino tested against a method, and selected because of a good outcome to show its strength is not random at the moment it is used, even if it was random at the casino when it was played there.
The best way to fail, is not to try!

Ralph

A simple way to check for randomness is to compress the file, If the file has order (entropy) it will compress more than a random stream of bits.  We can try using zip, make a file of 100000 numbers which one has some order or bias and not the other.
The best way to fail, is not to try!

RouletteVixen

Ok, thanks Ralph.

I am aware of the facts you stated.

In the case on BetVoyager you have 10 -60 numbers drawn in advance, they use Quantum Physics to generate those numbers, it is very much different from RNG that is coded using algorithms such as Mersenne or RANLUX.

It is the testing of algorythmic RNG in which I am interested, I know RNG has to be tested for Statistical randomness, that to me means that if you draw out of a pool of 37 numbers 1 000 000 times, all the numbers should have been drawn +- the same statistical percentage, am I right?

Pure mathematics is, in its way, the poetry of logical ideas. ( Albert Einstein )

Turner

In rx...you can run a chi square test. It has to be a fair few numbers like 10k.. The only numbers i ever had a fail with are excel numbers..
As for the other thing you said...maths and probability is the same. Only works over large number sets. Varience rules for short periods


RouletteVixen

That is my point exactly, over 50 000 spins the variance should be closer than over 500 or 1000, and from what I have seen this is true.

My point is, if it is always true, then why look any further, you have the answer.






Pure mathematics is, in its way, the poetry of logical ideas. ( Albert Einstein )

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