Dealer Signature (DS) - Let Us Have a General Discussion about it !

[Twisteruk]

Hello Fellow Forum Members and Guests  

I would like very much to hear your view on DS


Recently I had to have an Op and I've been confined to my bed and chair, so I've had plenty of time to think and look at this subject.


First let me say IF you don't belive in DS, that's fine but please keep your posts on this Thread positive, helpful and constructive !

Ok DS, I've long held the thought that this does exsist

Maybe some Dealers are not aware of it


Let me tell you "my version of DS"


Its a Dealer hittin a zone over and above average

Example

He/She is spinnin the wheel, not really taking much notice of what they are doin. looking bored/tired and just goin through the motions

I look at their Stats (recent events) and notice that a certain event should be happening, on average, around 33% of the time. This Dealer was makin this event (either known or unknown to themselves) 55% of the time

I followed this Dealer for the last 2 weeks. They average 50% on a 33% chance

It totally obliterates the House Edge

And if I'm honest I don't even think the Dealer and too many of the other Players noticed this happening
I watched other Players bets and none were inline with following the Dealer

Also the Dealer was "just goin through the motions". They were not even looking at what they were doin. It was just happening.


It was just happening.



That is MY version of DS !




Now over this 2 week period I also watched over 100 other Dealers (yes, I really had that much time on my hand LoL)
ONLY around 5-7% of Dealers hit the same average

Just 30 minutes ago Dealer "X" sat down and started spinning. I knew their average was 48% (on a 33% outcome)
I started to bet straight away

11 Spins and 6 wins was the outcome. A nice result I'm sure you would agree.




So, what are your opinions AND experiences with regard to DS ?



Do you even look for it ?


Do you just assume that it doesn't exsist because if it does the Casino would stop it ?



Please, tell me your thoughts  

[MM]

Ok.
You asked about DS and you will have your answer.
Just be patient and I will compose a post that will make you understand everything about DS.

[MM]

In order to understand why and how DS is working (or NOT working) you have to know about the phisics of the game of Roulette.     
 Even if you don't know anything about the phisics of the g ame I will make you understand everything by simple examplesâ€Ã,¦If you just know a little Maths you will understand everything that you need to know.     

In order to take advantage of DS we must have some factors.     Without those factors the DS can NOT exist.     

1)Dominiand Drop Point(HARD)
2)Same Rotor speed in all the spins(IMPOSSIBLE!!!!)
3)Same Ball speed in all the spins(IMPOSSIBLE!!!)
4)A nice average scatter of the ball(HARD)
If even 1 of the above factors is missing, the DS will not be accurate at all !
Its all about phisicsâ€Ã,¦its NOT magic.     

Let me tell you that IF a wheel is OK for DS , then its also OK for VB.     (Both need conditions of the wheel â€Ã...“DDâ€Ã, and â€Ã...“nice managable scatterâ€Ã,

Deferences between VB and DS (This will make you underatand WHY DS can t work)

If we have playable conditions of the wheel then we can procced(after having collecting at leat 300 spins data) in playing DS or VB.     
With VB we DO NOT care IF dealer will through  the ball with the same speed in all spins and we also DO NOT care IF he/she will spin the Rotor will same speed in all spinsâ€Ã,¦
Simply because with VB we can measure the Rotor speed and act accordingly(set different ofset) and we can identify the same ball speen in almost all spins , because we are looking for a ball speed that is late during the spinâ€Ã,¦so even if dealer will spin the ball with 20 revs to the end or with 10 revs to the end , in VB it doesn't matter at all ! (wile later you will see that with DS it’s a HUGE factor)Simply because with VB we don't care about the amount of revs from the start of the spin till the endâ€Ã,¦.     we just care about the same revs moment from the endâ€Ã,¦.     
As you may know even a VB expert nowdays can not make easy money â€Ã,¦simply because casinos are aware of the VB method and they are having Leveled wheels with light balls and low frets(in order to make a NON magagable scatter)

Now that you have a little taste of VB( I hope) let me explain you about DSâ€Ã,¦

IF we are SO LUCKY to find a Tilted wheel with a managable scatter(veryyyyyyyyy hard task nowdays)  and you are ready to play DS listen what are the odds to winâ€Ã,¦.     

Dealer MUST spin the Rotor and the Ball with the SAME speed in order for the distances-calculations to match. 

Let me explain to you by simple maths what will happen IF dealer will spin the Rotor with JUST 1 pocket/sec  faster or slowerâ€Ã,¦.     

Duration of ball from start of the spin till drop on DD=15 secs
BUT because dealer spoon the Rotor with JUST 1 pocket faster(impossible to detect that with the eyes) the final outcome(IF we have the same scetter LoL) will be 15 pockets FAR from the predictionâ€Ã,¦.     simply because 15 secs duration of spin X 1 Rotor Pocket faster per spin = 15 pockets FAR from Prediction !!!!!

Now who told you that the ball will always have the same duration???  :)
So the same thing will happen IF dealer will spin the Rotor with the same speed,but spin the ball with different speed. 

Final conclusionâ€Ã,¦.     
In order to have DS we must have a VERY trainned dealer that is capable to spin the Rotor and the ball with the same speed in all the spinsâ€Ã,¦.     .     and also a Wheel with perfet conditions in Tilt and scatterâ€Ã,¦.     

Those things belong only in our wild imagination and in Hollywood movies!
I hope you got the pointâ€Ã,¦.     .     

What you saw in you observations was just coicidenses.   .   .   and as you know coincidesces are happening all the time in roulette outcomes even with Math systems.   .   .   .   

I just tryed to help.   

[iggiv]

DS happens all the time. I know one guy who wins with it consistently. but experience is needed. he is able to do it after many years.

but of course some professional gamblers deny its existence.  There are "pro" and "contra".
"Pro" win with it. "Contra" win with something else, so they don't even wanna see it.

[MM]

Ok Iggiv I hear you.   But If you don't have a clue about the Phisics of the game its not my fault .   :)

I just explained the factors that is needed in order to win with DS.  .  . 
If you find those Infos that I gave irrelative then its not my fault. 
Any person with simple Maths education can understand everything by reading my above post.  .  .  . 

Ps.  A lot of ppl are claimming that they are winning with Maths systems. . . . Do you beliave them too?

[Twisteruk]

Thank you MM for your version of DS

Im sure we have met before under different names, maybe 



I was clear to point out the example I gave was "my version of DS"


It just happens. It trully does


Its not coincidence. Not the example I was talking about. I knew that Dealer was gonna hit the 50% mark for a 33% event even before they started spinning.

I chose not to bet the previous Dealer as they were around the 30-35%

Im not a big believer in coincidence. Even more so when Im expecting it to happen and it does - bang on the 50% I was expecting !


Dont forget you are talking about your version of DS, and Im sure you know everything there is to know about it. Thank you 


Please dont use this Thread to start your preaching 

[MM]

No don t be afraid. . . I will not spoil your Thread.
I will just say 1 last thing and then i will post no more in this Thread as it is uselles. . .

There is NO   MY version of DS or YOURS version of DS. . . . .
The DS is ONE.

And yes. . . if you weren t watching in the wheel at the time of your bettings to see if the ball hit the dd and 1st hit the strike point prediction(that is the only stable valieu that we can have) then it was coincedence,,,,

thanks.

Bye Bye.

[iggiv]

MM, why you try to accuse me of not knowing physics?

i did not argue with you about physics. Your extrapolation  of physics to DS phenomena is
the only in the world? You are the only one knowing physics and everything about roulette?

Winning in roulette is not all about physics and maths. That's a fact. many peope (not too
many of course) win in roulette, and without physics knowledge.

(as for my knowing or not knowing of physics -- I did study them in university, not only in high school. but that doesn't matter in our discussion)

[Twisteruk]

No don't be afraid. . . I will not spoil your Thread.
I will just say 1 last thing and then I will post no more in this Thread as it is uselles. . .

There is NO   MY version of DS or YOURS version of DS. . . . .
The DS is ONE.
And yes. . . if you weren t watching in the wheel at the time of your bettings to see if the ball hit the dd and 1st hit the strike point prediction(that is the only stable valieu that we can have) then it was coincedence,,,,

thanks.

Bye Bye.

Yes there is 2 versions.

Your version that relies on all of the criteria that you laid out

And another version. One that just happens 


As I said the Dealer didnt even know they were even doin it

I knew thay would do it before they spun, based on their previous results.


Blind Luck ?? Pure Chance ??


NADA my friend.




Ok Jordan lets leave it at that, you have ure pov I have mine.


I accept yours and I accept mine. The universe is big enough for them both to be able to happen 

[Twisteruk]

DS happens all the time. I know one guy who wins with it consistently. but experience is needed. he is able to do it after many years.

but of course some professional gamblers deny its existence.  There are "pro" and "contra".
"Pro" win with it. "Contra" win with something else, so they don't even wanna see it.

iggiv do you ever notice DS while playin ?

Do you ever take advantage of it ?

[iggiv]

I am not experienced enough to take advantage on it. But i know too many people do use it.
Also many professional gambler book authors find it strategy number 1. As Brett Morton (GLC reccomended his book). People which mastered DS actually win mostly with it.

of course there are some roulette professional who deny its existence. There are always "pro" and "contra". But to accuse anyone (who either denies or argues for its existence) of lack of knowledge is funny. It is just a matter of point of view. A glass can be half empty or half full.
No doubt that if u stand whole day at the wheel and do all the same movements all the time (trying to catch DS) -- u gonna fail. It is a skill, as one guy put it, u have to have a gut feeling about it.

[Twisteruk]

I am not experienced enough to take advantage on it. But I know too many people do use it.
Also many professional gambler book authors find it strategy number 1. As Brett Morton (GLC reccomended his book). People which mastered DS actually win mostly with it.

of course there are some roulette professional who deny its existence. There are always "pro" and "contra". But to accuse anyone (who either denies or argues for its existence) of lack of knowledge is funny. It is just a matter of point of view. A glass can be half empty or half full.
No doubt that if you stand whole day at the wheel and do all the same movements all the time (trying to catch DS) -- you gonna fail. It is a skill, as one guy put it, you have to have a gut feeling about it.

Ah ok mate 

But do you ever see it ? Or dont you look for it ?

Im ALWAYS lookin for it !

If I see a Dealer spinnin around the 50% mark for a 33% event I follow that until DC 

[iggiv]

Ah ok mate  

But do you ever see it ? Or don't you look for it ?

I'm ALWAYS looking for it !

If I see a Dealer spinnin around the 50% mark for a 33% event I follow that until DC  

can you please translate into plain English? thanks
i studied some german spins and found out that sometimes they are so scary of DS players, that they may replace dealers after 10-12 spins at certain wheels at certain times.
yes, I think sometimes I can see  DS patterns...not so sure to play it yet...

[iggiv]

there was a good DS softare somewhere, remember?

[Twisteruk]

There was a good DS softare somewhere, remember?

No I dont mate 

What was it ?