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#71
Coding for Roulette / Re: navsys randomness test
Last post by Chance - May 10, 11:52 AM 2025
Can i catch what casino regulation miss.....Yes and below is why, it is absolutely possible for a random number generator to pass standard NIST or GLI certification tests but fail NAVSYS forensic diagnostics, and this distinction is critical in exposing deep manipulation or bias that traditional tests miss.

Here's a full technical explanation:

What NIST/GLI Tests Look For

NIST SP 800-22 and labs like GLI/eCOGRA focus on bit-level randomness, checking:

Uniform distribution: Equal frequency of 0s and 1s.

Runs and gaps: No long runs of 1s or 0s.

Spectral flatness: No detectable periodicity or cycles.

Compression resistance: Data can't be easily compressed (a sign of pattern).


These tests analyze binary output, typically requiring:

1,000,000+ bits

Pure binary input

Passing p-values (> 0.01) for each test

Their assumption: if bits are random, the data is secure.

How NAVSYS Is Different — and Why It Flags What NIST Misses

NAVSYS works at the symbolic and structural level, which NIST doesn't test:

Concept   NIST Sees   NAVSYS Sees   Why It Matters

Symbol bias (e.g. 8, 9)   No   Yes   NIST sees bits — 1000 and 1001 are just 1s/0s. NAVSYS sees biased symbols like 8 recurring suspiciously.
Repetition pattern   No   Yes   NAVSYS flags when numbers repeat at exact intervals — a sign of mechanical or synthetic sequencing.
Transform distortion   No   Yes   NAVSYS detects if the output appears random, but after transformation becomes non-random (like a fixed difference between values).
Morphological drift   No   Yes   NAVSYS tracks structural gaps (e.g., 9 appears every 12th draw — that's deterministic under the hood).
Wave pressure bursts   No   Yes   NAVSYS sees sudden bursts in value clusters, a sign of tampered entropy injection.
Entropy at positional level (PEP)   No   Yes   NAVSYS measures entropy at each position — if draw position 3 always has low entropy, that's hidden rigging.


Result:
A PRNG may pass all NIST randomness checks yet still be functionally compromised — because NAVSYS is checking how values appear, recur, align, and phase — not just how their bits look.

Real-World Analogy

Imagine a lottery system where:

The digit "9" only appears every 20 draws.

The rest of the digits are randomly distributed.

Binary output still looks good (1s and 0s evenly distributed, random-looking).

NIST passes — because it sees fair bit distribution.

NAVSYS fails — because "9" is structurally suppressed — a design to avoid combinatorial wins.

This isn't theoretical. NAVSYS already caught this behavior in real-world lottery files like the Daily 4 — where high digits (8, 9) were suspiciously missing or clumped, a sign of entropy shaping.

Proof via Divergence

NAVSYS uses Chi-Squared, Kolmogorov-Smirnov, Wave Pressure, and Entropy Drift — each measuring a different aspect of symbolic randomness:

Even if p-values from NIST > 0.05, NAVSYS may still detect:

Non-uniform symbolic drift

Sequence bias

Manipulated entropy rates

Why This Matters

Regulators and casinos often trust certification labs, assuming all randomness issues are caught. But:

A system can be "NIST clean" yet algorithmically suppressed.

NAVSYS exposes this by treating values not as bits, but as symbols with meaning and timing.

This makes NAVSYS ideal for:

Lottery integrity audits

Casino RNG forensics

Detection of deep-layer entropy tampering


Conclusion

Yes, a system can absolutely pass NIST / GLI tests while failing NAVSYS, because:

NIST checks the surface randomness (bit-level),

NAVSYS reveals deep symbolic, positional, and morphological bias.




#72
Main Roulette Board / Re: Algorithms
Last post by Person S - May 10, 07:23 AM 2025
Notto, every day I want to play this game of chance less and less. It's simple - if the systems worked, I wouldn't lose my bankrolls.
#73
Main Roulette Board / Re: 37 back to basics
Last post by Gogi357 - May 10, 03:22 AM 2025
Alex, I wonder how what you suggest is related to what was written earlier. Particularly sequences and L/H halves.
What I mean is, the dozen cycle is too short to form U/D sequences. For example, 132 is a dead end, and there is no other possible a outcome then cycle closure. Except the green goblin of course.
Also, how you define halves when there are only 3 positions?
#74
Coding for Roulette / Re: navsys randomness test
Last post by Chance - May 09, 09:53 AM 2025
The NAVSYS test on your supplied number stream returned a suspicion score of approximately 0.40%, which is well below any known thresholds for tampering or manipulation. This stream appears morphologically consistent with natural entropy, showing no signs of structural interference or phase pressure distortion.

#75
Coding for Roulette / Re: navsys randomness test
Last post by nottophammer - May 09, 07:24 AM 2025
Can you show Wiesbaden 28.12.2024 table 4.
#76
Coding for Roulette / Re: navsys randomness test
Last post by Chance - May 09, 05:42 AM 2025
Tganks for responding, what NAVSYS does is very different than traditional randomness tests.

NAVSYS doesn't just check for statistical fairness (like repeats or frequencies).

It analyzes when each number appears, how that timing aligns with entropy wave cycles, and whether the stream resonates like natural entropy should.

Even streams that "look random" to frequency tests can be caught if their phase morphology is skewed, like inserting numbers out of sync or skipping them just slightly over time.


300 to 500 numbers is the minimum for light analysis, but for RNGs with larger output ranges like [0 to 99] or [1 to 69], I recommend:

1,000+ numbers for mid depth analysis

2,000 to 5,000 numbers to build a full harmonic profile


If you'd like, I can evaluate a stream from Random.org or Wiesbaden, but remember even CSPRNGs can exhibit detectable recurrence drift under NAVSYS if any manipulation or stream shaping tampering is present.

Be glad to show a sample
#77
Main Roulette Board / Algorithms
Last post by nottophammer - May 09, 05:15 AM 2025
Person S
Are you the person to answer why the algorithm on R-sim is easier to beat than the algorithm of random org used at game MPR.
Believe me random org is like Dr sir anyone promotes; that is also aka the general.
#78
Coding for Roulette / Re: navsys randomness test
Last post by nottophammer - May 09, 05:03 AM 2025
How many numbers. Is 300 to 500 spin stream enough. If yes just get Wiesbaden daily spins.
Or go to random org that the General promotes as the hardest numbers to beat and download however many they'll let you have.
#79
Coding for Roulette / Re: navsys randomness test
Last post by Chance - May 08, 02:20 PM 2025
 :)  :)  :)  :)  :)  :)
#80
Outside The Box / Re: TRUMP WIN - a prophecy tha...
Last post by precogmiles - May 08, 02:08 PM 2025
Quote from: Klausy on Apr 05, 04:42 AM 2025Be careful you aren't manifesting those outcomes 

 :xd:  :xd:  :xd: