Simple Trend Catcher

[hanshuckebein]

hi folks

this is a test session of 3000 playtech rng spins. zero hit 78 times.

I just played the bet selection given in the first post mechanically. so none of the extra rules were involved.

malcop, thanks a lot for sharing. 

cheers

hans

[ego]

Is that with or with out progression?
250 units peak is not bad :-)
I do the same thing trending - but flat betting with a peak around 55 units for 3000 spins or 1000 placed bets :-(

[malcop]

hi folks

this is a test session of 3000 playtech rng spins. zero hit 78 times.

I just played the bet selection given in the first post mechanically. so none of the extra rules were involved.

malcop, thanks a lot for sharing. 

cheers

hans

Hi hanshuckebein,


Thanks for the information, I did quite well using just the N and K modes in the past, the I and D mode are new but they seem to be working most of the time, but you can get sessions where they just  seem to fail more than they hit.

Also I think it is good to try and go for the 2-2 pattern with the D modes.

I think the most consistant interrupt is the one used for a streak of three or more that is by far the best Interrupt.

I may extend the chop and 2-2 interrupts to 3 or more.

Thanks


malcop

[hanshuckebein]

@ego

it's all flat betting.

starting bankroll was 200. so I guess we both had a peak of around 50 units plus?

you said you had a session of 3000 spins but only 1000 played spins. so did you only play every fourth spin? I played continiously. only after zeroes I had 3 spins without betting just to get my next trigger. so I actually played 2783 spins.

cheers

hans

[ego]

@ego

it's all flat betting.

starting bankroll was 200. so I guess we both had a peak of around 50 units plus?

you said you had a session of 3000 spins but only 1000 played spins. so did you only play every fourth spin? I played continiously. only after zeroes I had 3 spins without betting just to get my next trigger. so I actually played 2783 spins.

cheers

hans

That is nice - notice the waves has a bumpy ride up and down - my chart is a littel bit more steady.
I don't want to steel attention from this topic - but if you like me are interesting in flat betting and even money bet you can take a look at my topic.
link:://rouletteforum.cc/index.php?topic=9195.0

cherrs

EDIT

Suggestion if you run BR using 0 you get a more clear chart using RX.
1000 placed bets with a net gain of 100 units flat betting is the bench mark having a good strategy.
Around 2.5 STD.

[GLC]

Sorry to clutter up this bet selection method with bet progressions, but here's one that


resulted from testing my question in Reply #28.


We will be betting 1 unit as our base bet.  After losing a pre-determined number of bets, we


will risk the total of those bets on 1  recovery bet.


We start with 1 bet of 1 unit.  Continue to bet 1 unit as long as you win.


As soon as you lose, write 1 down.  This is the 1st level.  We total up all the base units lost


here and bet that amount.  In this case it's just 1 unit.


If we win, we are even and start over betting 1 unit until we lose.


If we lose the second 1 unit bet we will have lost 2 units and move to the next level which


is 2.
.
Our line looks like this
-1
-1
-------


We are now in the 2nd level so we bet 1 unit.  If we lose we bet 1 unit again.  If we lose


that bet we will have lost the number of 1 base unit bets equal to the level we are at and it is


time to sum up the lost bets of this level and try to recover everything with 1 more bet.  We lost 2 units at this level because it's the 2nd level so we now bet 2 units.  If we win we have cleared this level.


Since we already have unrecovered lost units at level 1 we can start level 2 over again.


If we lose level two's recovery bet, our line will look like this:


-1
-1
----------
-1
-1
-2
---------- 


I'll continue with the progression line


-1
-1
-1
-3
----------
-1
-1
-1
-1
-4
----------
-1
-1
-1
-1
-1
-5
----------
-2
-2
----------
-2
-2
-4
----------
-2
-2
-2
-6
----------
-2
-2
-2
-2
-8
----------
-2
-2
-2
-2
-2
-10
----------
-3
-3
----------
-3
-3
-6
----------
-3
-3
-3
-9
----------
-3
-3
-3
-3
-12
----------
-3
-3
-3
-3
-3
-15
----------


I don't know if we will ever have to go past this point.


We could play it like Hermes' leveler bet and stay at 3 basic bet until we recover completely.


In case it ever gets so bogged down that we feel like we're never going to recover, we can just take the loss and start over.


But think about this.  All taking a loss and starting over does is move you back to a smaller bet.  There is not such thing as starting over because you're still in the hole the number of units you set as a stop-loss.  Before you can ever feel like a winner again you have to win back all those lost units.  So don't lose track of them, rather keep track of them until you finally win them back.


How do you work you way down the progression line?  Of course by losing.


Let's continue with the explanation about how we play.  If we have lost 3 bets in a row our recovery line looks like this:


-1
-1
----
-1


That means we have lost our 1st 1 base unit bet and our recovery bet in the 1st level resulting in a -1; -1.  We also lost our 1st 1 unit base bet in the 2nd level.  What if we win the next bet. 


Anytime we win a bet while betting a 1 unit base bet we cross off the upmost lost unit on the whole line.  So our line would look like this:


-1
-1
----
-1


If we now lose the next bet which is again a 1 unit base bet our line looks like this:


-1
-1
----
-1
-1


Since this is the 2nd level and we've lost 2 base bets of 1 unit, we are ready to risk a recovery bet equal to the number of units in this level or 2.  If we lose this 2 unit bet our line looks like this:


-1
-1
----
-1
-1
-2
----


If we win our next bet we again cross off the uppermost lost unit like this:


-1
-1
----
-1
-1
-2


But what if we had won the 2 unit recovery bet, our line would look like this:


-1
-1
----
-1
-1
-2
----


We still have a -1 in the 1st level so we move to the next level that has nothing in it which in this case is level 2 again.


Any time we have recovered all lost units, we continue to bet 1 unit until we lose again at which time we start our line all over.


Let's say we have the following:


-1
-1
----
-1
-1
-2
----
-1
-1
-1
-3
----
-1
-1
-1
-1


Our next bet is a 4 unit recovery bet which is the sum of base units at the 4th level.  If we win at that level we will recover all the lost units in the 4th level.  We look to see what the lowest level is with no lost units in it.  In this case it's level 1 so we start our next bet back at level 1.


Had there been unrecovered units in level 1, (that would mean that there are unrecovered units in levels 2 and 3 because we can't recover units in a lower level until they are recovered in the upper levels) we would have started at level 4 again since it would be the lowest level without any units to be recovered in it.


As you can see, you can play at the 1 unit base level for quite a while because every time you win, except for a risk bet where you're trying to recover all lost units at that level, you will cross off the uppermost lost unit.  Remember this uppermost lost unit is uppermost in the whole line, not just at the level you're on.  This is always the 1st 1 in the 1st level, then the 2nd 1 in the 1st level. 


Let's say you have recovered the 2 lost base unit bets in level 2, the next number to cross off is the -2, so, you bet 2 units.  If you win you cross it off.  If you lose you replace the 2 units you had recovered above the -2 and you must start over trying to recover the 4 lost units of level 2.


Okay, I'm tired of explaining.  I think this covers the basics of the bet method.  It can be a real grind at times, but it is very safe and I think, if you have patience, you can win some chips without going too deep in the hole.


Give it a look and see what you think.


I know there are a lot of situations that I haven't covered.  You can ask me what I would do or you can just decide for yourself.  No matter what you decide to do in a given situation, you won't be wrong.  There is no "wrong" just different.


Cheers,


George

P.S.  Sorry about the complicated explanation.  If you're interested, read thru it slowly understanding each statement and comparing with the examples and you'll see that it's really fairly easy to play.

[malcop]

Hi GLC,


I've only just started to play Ambidex, but I will take a look at your progression with Simple Trend Catcher.


Thanks


malcop

[GLC]

Hi GLC,


I've only just started to play Ambidex, but I will take a look at your progression with Simple Trend Catcher.


Thanks


malcop

Phil,  Sorry to throw so much stuff at you all at once.  Ambidex is a strong progression in that it uses won units to reach you goal quicker.


This new method is strong because it keeps most of your bets at the 1 unit level.


My explanation may be a little garbled but basically what you're doing is betting 1 and recover with a 1 bet


If lose go to level 2 and bet 1 twice and then try to recover with a 2 bet.


At 3 level bet 1 unit 3 times and try to recover with a 3 unit bet.


If we are betting on say the 3 level and we get a win while betting a 1 unit base bet, we check up the line to see if there are any 1 unit losses to be recovered and we cross them off 1st.


Every time we win a 1 unit bet, we write it down at the level we're on and if we win a 1 unit bet we look up above and cross off from top to bottom.


What this does is it keeps us from finding ourselves at say level 10 which we could be at for a very long time just flat betting.  When we recover a level from above and we either win or lose the level we're on, we check to see if there are any levels above that have been recovered while we were on our current level.  If so that's where our next level is.


So we could have this sequence of levels: 1    2     3    1    4   1   2    etc...  because while we're working on level 3, we could recover level 1.  Then when we lose level 1 there could still be units lost and not recovered on levels 2 and 3 so we have to go to level 4.  while playing on level 4 we might recover all of level 1 and 2.  If we won on level 4 and went up to level 1 and lost and then to level 2 and recovered 1 then won level 2 we would only have what's left in level 3 to fully recover.


Our line would then look like 1   2    3     1    4    1    2.


I don't know how to turn off this stupid strikethru fundtion.

Anyway, you get the point.  It keeps us at lower levels.

I know there's a streak from hell.  There is with every system.

[GLC]

I'll continue my thoughts.  I've noticed that this method can generate 5 to 10 units without going that far in the hole so we could have a very reasonable buy-in.


I've just been playing on betvoyager single zero demo mode but not keeping track of spins.  Just to see how it feels.  It feels very solid.  Somewhat of a grinder at times but not as bad as a 1 unit flat bet.


I don't think I've been -20 units yet.  Mostly max's out at less than -15.


I've never reached the 2 unit base bet level.


Early goings I know.


If this stays this solid, Tom can play it on his $50 minimum baccarat tables and it'll be a little easier on his heart.


(Get well soon, buddy.  I know modern medicine is amazing, but slow as she goes.)


GLC

[malcop]

Hi GLC,


I think I understand your new progression, but maybe a play by play example of say 10-20 bets with markings for the levels and exponentiation what you should do next would be very helpful, maybe something along the lines of your example of 1 2 3 1 4 1 2 ect.


I know it's a lot of work but it would be very useful for myself and other forum members that may be interested in your new progression idea.

I'm not a big progression person, but if I do use them I prefer ones like yours, because you do not have to complete your progression all in one session so you could start the progression in Roulette then for example you could move over to the Baccarat table and continue where you left off.

Thanks


malcop

[Tomla021]

Its just funny with ambi---when I got it I liked,,,one of my first tests I tried and got flustered....Bam a couple of months later I am thinking of using. Same with trend catcher-I liked it even played it with GR* player progression. Now after a month or two Im back and testing it before actual play..
See sometimes something just needs another thing........

[GLC]

I will do a sample run that, I hope has most of the rules to be learned incorporated in it.


First I want to discuss the 5 boxes.


Each level of the progression can be thought of as a box.


As long as all the boxes are empty we bet 1 unit at a time and we play outside of the boxes.


We enter the first box on the 1st loss.  We bet our 1 unit base bet as many times as the number of the box.  So, the 1st box on has 1 base bet that happens to be lost.  Then we bet the total of all the lost base bets in our box trying to recover that boxes contents with 1 bet.


In the 1st box all we have is 1 base bet and 1 recovery bet.  If the recovery bet loses we will have -1;-1 in our 1st box and we go to the 2nd box.  This box represents 2 lost base bets followed by a 2 unit bet to recover.


The 3rd box has 3 base bets that have been lost followed by a 3 unit recovery bet.


Same idea for boxes 4 and 5.


The main rule is that you can't have more than 5 boxes in play at a time unless all the boxes are full.  If all the boxes are full, you will be down 2+4+6+8+10= -30 units*.  At this point you can open a 6th box which will be the 1st box at the 2 unit base bet level which is identical to the 1st 5 boxes except they are twice as large.


If you want to, you can stay at the 1 unit base bet level and open boxes 6-10 and they will be identical to the 1st 5 boxes.  Before you can open a 6th box all of the 1st 5 boxes must be full*, meaning you will be at -30.


We can empty boxes above the one we're working on by crossing off lost units for every win while trying to fill up the current box, so to speak.


So if you are playing in box 3 and you lose 1 bet, you will have a -1 in the box.  If you win the next 1 unit base bet, you will not cross off the -1 in the 3rd box, you will cross off the -1 in the 1st box.


This brings us to another rule.  After you have crossed off all the lost base bet units, you immediately bet the sum of all those units.  In our example we just crossed off the 1st -1 in the 1st box which is the only base bet in that box.  The next -1 in the 1st box was our recovery bet that lost.  Since that's the last number in the box we immediately bet it in hopes of emptying the 1st box.


If we win, our 1st box is empty and our 2nd box has -1;-1;-2 in it.  We bet 1 base unit next.  If we lose, that lost unit goes down in our 3rd box which is the box we're playing at the time.  That means we will have -1;-1 in the 3rd box. 


Again we bet a 1 unit base bet and if we win, we cross off the uppermost unit in our line which is the 1st -1 in the 2nd box.


Let's say we lose the next 1 unit bet, we put it in box 3 and we have -1;-1;-1.  This represents all the base bets in box 3 so we immediately bet 3 units trying to recover those lost units.  Let's say we win.  That empties box 3.  Now we have to open a new box.  The new box must be empty.  Our empty boxes are 1, 3,4,5.  We always open the smaller number box.  So we open the 1 box and our next 1 unit bet is won.  We now cross off the uppermost -1 in our overall line which happens to be in box 2.  This crosses off the 2nd -1 in box 2 which leaves the recovery bet of 2 units which we make immediately.  If we win this bet, we will have recovered all lost units and will be back at our previous highest bankroll amount.  Now we continue to bet 1 unit until we lose.


*If we are playing in box 5 and we lose it but we have a couple or more units in box 4 that haven't been recovered, this is the only case when we can open a 6th box without being -30.


Zero is just another loss.


This is another verbal description.  I have to take a break of a couple of hours and then I'll give you an example of a short session.


Cheers,


George

[GLC]

R   No bet
R   No bet  Next spin bet 1 for R
R   Win +1  Next spin bet 1 for R
B   Lose -1  This is the first base bet in box 1.  Next bet is a recovery bet of -1 for B
R   Lose -1  This fills box 1.  Next bet 1 base bet on B to start box 2
R   Lose -1  This is the 1st loss of box 2.  Next bet is 1 for R
B   Lose -1  This is the 2nd loss of box 2.  Next bet is the sum of the 2 losses, or 2, for B
B   Win +2   This recovers the last 2 lost base bets and empties box 2.  Since box 1 is already in use, we start box 2 again with a 1 unit base bet on B
R   Lose -1  Now 1 unit bet on R
R   Win +1  Since we have lost units above box 2 in box 1, we cross off the uppermost -1 in box 1.  This leaves us with -1 in box 1 and -1 in box 2.  Now the rule says that when we come to the last bet of a box which is the number of units equal the number of the box, we immediately bet that last number of units in the box.  In this case it's 1 since it's the first box.  We bet 1 on R
B   Lose -1 since we lost the recovery bet, we don't cross anything off, we re-instate the number of units we tried to recover.  So now box 1 again has -1 & -1.  Our next bet is 1 for B
R   Lose -1  This is the 2nd loss of box 2 and brings us immediately to a recovery bet of 2 units on B
R   Lose -2  We now have -1;-1;-2 in box 2 and since we have something in Box 1 we go to our next box, box 3.  We bet 1 base unit on R
R   Win +1.  We go all the way up to box 1 and cross off the first -1.  Which leads us to the recovery bet of box 1 with a 1 unit bet on R
R   Win +1.  We now have recovered all units in box 1.  We bet 1 base unit for R
R   Win +1.  The uppermost unit to cross off is the 1st -1 in box 2 leaving -1 & -2 in box 2


This is the way we play until we empty all the boxes which will leave us at exactly where we were before we lost the bet that started this recovery attack.


Questions Welcome,


GLC

[malcop]

GLC,


Thank you for the update that should make it easer to understand your new progression idea.


malcop

[GLC]

As I think about this new progression, I realize that I can't come up with a valid explanation as to why it should win.  All we're doing is betting 1 unit per bet until we lose different times and then we take a shot at recovering all of the single unit losses since we started our new box.  We have just as much of a chance to lose the recovery bet as we do to win them.


There is an element of random in that we start with losing 1 then bet to recover.  Lose 2 then bet to recover.  Lose 3 then bet to recover.  Along the way, with some wins we might sneak in a recovery bet for 2.  And at any time we win a couple in a row on box 2,3,4 or 5, when we lose say the recovery bet for the 3 box instead of going on to the 4 box, we jump back up to the 1 box.  So we don't always follow the same sequence of boxes.


Most of the time we're just losing 1 unit when we're having a really bad run which is nice.


I know that there will be a time when we will lose a bunch of those recovery bets ad drop deep into the hole.  I just haven't seen one yet.


I'm hoping someone will finally have a really bad test session so we know what a losing session looks like.  It will help us decide where to set things like buy-in amount, win target and stop-loss.


GLC