Re: Programming for roulette

[VLS]

Topic split from Jordan's [urllink:://rouletteforum.cc/the-notepad/a-question-for-the-members-that-are-coding-systems/]A question for the members that are coding systems.[/url]

Jordan, I'm afraid the coders around aren't too much on the free-to-code side.

Thomas is recovering and I'm busy with other projects.

At this particular moment in time, my advice is: learning to program isn't that hard

[ThomasGrant]

Jordan, I'm afraid the coders around aren't too much on the free-to-code side.

Thomas is recovering and I'm busy with other projects.

At this particular moment in time, my advice is: learning to program isn't that hard

Yep, I'd have to agree with that statement.
If I can learn to code in pascal.
Then anyone can.

Of course pascal is not the only coding language.
There is basic, c++ and others.

Coding for roulette is limited to a few individuals.
It is a very small, small % of people that can code for roulette.
That is why there isn't much software out there that can play roulette.
You may find a few in clickbank market place.
Or have a look in youtube.

So far, there is only one person that can code any system.
Get his software to play on any casino.
And that person is Tiago.

Putting Roulette and coding together.
You really have to be commended for your passion.

I try to put the two together.
But I am just a beginner.

Victor would be my next choice.

[VLS]

Yep, I'd have to agree with that statement.
If I can learn to code in pascal.
Then anyone can.

Absolutely.

Programming with the right language is easy... but just like everything, it takes practice.

I commend you for sticking to PASCAL, you wouldn't like to start with WIN32 Assembler just to create a textbox that displays roulette numbers.

Of course pascal is not the only coding language.
There is basic, c++ and others.

For beginners there's nothing better than BASIC. (the "B" from basic means that: Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instruction Code.

The learning curve from zero to making your first useful program is faster in BASIC than with any other programming I know of. This motivates learners to continue; seeing results.

If you have to spend too much time to make even the smallest window proggie, then chances are you will not get motivated.

Instant gratification is a powerful motivator. It is exciting to jam some simpler lines of code and getting your first results delivered

Putting Roulette and coding together.
You really have to be commended for your passion.

Become a programmer and understand the conceptsof programming  first, then once you are a programmer you can take on programming for roulette

What you need is to focus in a multi-purpose programming language. It pays.

For instance, PASCAL and BASIC are the first choice for someone who wants to learn about programming, BASIC is powerful enough (in its .NET version) to be head-to-head with the big guys. Visual Basic.NET *is* a "Big guy" itself and Microsoft wouldn't cut support for it, despite of the stigma attached to "BASIC programmers".

Why the stigma? just because BASIC offers a lot of "shortcuts" in exchange of giving up on a layer of control to the compiler and hence it sounds like BASIC programmers have no level. Imagine a language named "CRAPPY", then all of its users would be "Crappy programmers" sort of like that.

Some C# (C-sharp) guy told once: what would you like to be know as, as a BASIC programmer or as a SHARP programmer. The all-time "my penis is bigger than yours" complex!

There are bad programmers using very bad programming practices even in the most elitist of the languages, and very good and proficient programmers in the "worst" ones. This is more related to the human aspect than anything.

...the next language from microsoft could as well be named "ELITE" so all the users (even the worst ones) are "ELITE programmers"



Ok, rant over!

The gist you have to take from this post is this: for becoming a roulette programmer you must become a PROGRAMMER first, and then you can do roulette programs. Stick to a language offering multi-purpose syntax and don't limit yourself to just "roulette"... have roulette programing just as another one of your programming skills  

Regards.

[A3on]

Hello Victor

I want to learn coding for so long, but never knew where to start
Can you please indicate me some program to start and some tutorials?
Thanks in advance

Regards,
Afonso

[VLS]

Hello dear Alfonso, what are your coding goals?

Do you want to make your own roulette testers or do you want to become a multi-purpose programmer? (This makes a big difference in choosing where to start!)

[Bayes]

Yes, you're better off learning a general purpose programming language rather than something like RX. BASIC is a good choice for a beginner, and there are some quite powerful ones around available free.

But it's important that there's good documentation and tutorials, so I would avoid anything that's too "esoteric", even if it happens to be a good programming language. Something that's been around for a while and has a large user base means that if you get stuck, there are more people to help.

[Bayes]

A list of the most popular programming languages can be found here.

Interesting to see that C is still way up there. I remember 15 years ago when I was looking for some advice on which programming language to learn, I was told that C is "dead". 

Even though it's a great language and very powerful, I wouldn't recommend it for a beginner (nor Java or C++).

[VLS]

[...]it's important that there's good documentation and tutorials, so I would avoid anything that's too "esoteric", even if it happens to be a good programming language. Something that's been around for a while and has a large user base means that if you get stuck, there are more people to help.

BASIC's core syntax has been around since May 1, 1964.

If it has stuck for more than 4 and a half decades there must be something to it

Of course, as with any other programming language it comes in "flavors" (i.e. c/c++/c# or Pascal/Delphi... in BASIC's's case you have legacy BASIC, Visual Basic and Visual Basic.NET -among others).

If you want to develop GUI (Graphical User Interface) programs -i.e. everything as seen in windows- your best bet for a flavor of basic in 2010 is to go Visual Basic.NET

You can have the express version for free directly from Microsoft.

link:://:.microsoft.com/express/windows/ (free LIVE id required to validate your copy)

[VLS]

As for tutorials, you best bet is to start googling consice, precise questions.

For instance, if you want to display a message in Visua Basic .NET (VB.NET for short), you google:

"how to show a message in VB.NET"

if you want to read a file, you ask

"how to read a file in VB.NET"

and so on.

Of course, you must have a starting point!

For a great tutorial Mr. Google advices:

link:://:.homeandlearn.co.uk/net/vbnet.html

and certainly the official guide from Microsoft:

link:://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/vbasic/ms789086.aspx

Happy coding! (Even if it's just a message box )

[mr.ore]

It does not matter what you start with, it might be C/C++, Visual Basic (it has nothing in common with a BASIC from old days, just a name), C#, Java, VBA, maybe HTML+PHP+javascript for web applications.

C/C++:
Fast code, good when you need some fast computations, like neural networks, used for programming operating systems, computer games and libraries (.dll, .so) which are then used by other applications. C is available on any platform, including embedded devices or even chips. If you learned C, you can do anything. It is not that difficult, most of it is no different from other languages. If you ever want to create a roulette computer, you should learn this (and assembler later). You can buy ATMega8 chip for say 4$/3EUR, solder it's pins with wires to parallel port, connect it to computer and load a program written in C into it. You have to buy suitable version which have embedded programming chip. This is very cheap, and you do not have to buy anything else. All it needs is a 5V battery, you have to force it to be stable, so a converter from 9V battery is needed, but it is simple, cost is cheap, just little soldering. I have played with that a few years back, I have been trying to make a simple robot, I did not make it though. I believe that roulette computer would be more simple and cheaper, when it comes to an interface, just some buttons and signals. C++ is like an extension to C, you do not have to use objects and difficult stuff, but STL containers come handy. There is a catch with pointers and memory allocation. Compiler is free, use gcc, in Windows you might use mingw, or several free compilers. It is little more difficult, but if you want to start simple, download Dev-CPP.

JAVA: at first sight the code looks like that of C++ or C#, the advantage is it is multiplatform, the applications run in Windows, MAC OS X, Linux, FreeBSD, Solaris. You can program applications for cell phones in Java, so if you plan to program your system into a phone, then it is the best language, even better than C, because not every phone would allow you to install compiled executable, but you can send java application with bluetooth into it. It would work also on Android and iPad/iPod and tablets with Windows. Java is slower when it comes to computations, but today computers are so fast that it does not matter. You can also create java applet. Tools for programming are free, you can download IDE (integrated development environment) like NetBeans or Eclipse.

Visual Basic .NET and C#:
It does not matter which one you choose, C# is better if you do not like writing, the code is more compact. .NET libraries are same for both. It is not much different from Java, but it is better integrated with MS Windows and MS Office. If you don't use some special gui or functions, C# is also multiplatform, can be run with Mono in other systems. If you ever wanted to sell your applications, you have to buy MS Visual Studio, but you can also use free and lightweight Sharp Develop, if you use some unix system then Mono Develop.

VBA - Visual Basic for Applications: it is embedded in MS Office / Excel for writing macros, and for needs of roulette programming it should be enough, Excel have also some advantage for this type of task. Disadvantage - not multipurpose language, just for Excel. If you don't have MS Office, you can download Go Open Office from Novell, it is said it have quite good support for VB macros.

HTML+PHP+javascipt - you can create your own web page, the computation can be either java applet or javascript, if it is simple than you can do that even in PHP. If you want to create an application which can be simply put on internet, this is the way to go. You get all the tools for free - Apache, PHP, text editor (kate, Windows users might use PSPad), maybe MySQL to have all what is needed. The advantage in learning this is obvious - you can make simply application for several users, include phpbb forum and there is a lot of free stuff. Then you copy your page to some free webhosting, and it is done.

For normal users who do not compute some algorithms for Markov decisions problems, neural networks and such, any language will do the job.

[atlantis]

Hi,

I agree with Victor's remarks about BASIC.
I can recommend a VERY GOOD and *free* BASIC language called:

thinBASIC : the automation script language.

link:://:.thinbasic.com/

Comes complete with many demos and a help file, and they have an excellent forum and user group.

It's only about 11mb download.

A.

[mr.ore]

Is Thinbasic some favor VB .NET? The only reason why to choose VB .NET is .NET, a lot of libraries with many thing already done, ready to be used. Why not rather go with mainstream and use C#?

link:://:.icsharpcode.net/opensource/sd/

It is also small, and powerful enough.

[mr.ore]

Well, that Thinbasic is not just an IDE for VB .NET like Sharp Develop is for C#, they have their own Basic, hmm, I can't say it would be good or bad, bad that is not definitely mainstream.

[atlantis]

Hi Mr Ore,

Some more info here:

link:://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ThinBasic

A.

[A3on]

Hello dear Alfonso, what are your coding goals?

Do you want to make your own roulette testers or do you want to become a multi-purpose programmer? (This makes a big difference in choosing where to start!)

I want to code just for roulette propose
For making tests and stuff like that.

After that, maybe later, making my own bot for casino

What program you advice me?

Best regards,
Afonso